I wish I never learned about guitar speakers

[paul-e-mann]

Because if you read my OP, it's clear that I just don't like the GT12T-75 for the 20CR, have moved on to the V-Type which I currently like, and my entire question was this:

Is the Neo V-Type better than the regular V-Type?

I also specifically said that I didn't want to go down the creamback/greenback road, and yet 56.7% of the replies suggest I get one of them, as if I never said a thing about how I was happy with the V-Type. But that's ok, it's common here, peeps just trying to be helpful.

But, but why?

 

[paul-e-mann]

I'm no expert by a long shot, but it would make sense to me that in a lower wattage amp, lower wattage speakers would sound better?

Yeah, like a 25w greenback. But OP Vin asked for advice but doesn't want advice. I think he's just thinking out loud...

 

[David William Reid]

See, this is what kicks me right in the ol' Chicken McNuggets:

First of all, I hate playing the "buy it to try it" game, even if there are good return polies. But I really amn't liking the Seventy/80 speaker in my DSL20CR, so something has to be done about it.

So I figure I'll stick with what I know and like, right? My 1960A cab is loaded with G12T-75's, and I've been liking them more than V30's, especially with the JCM 800 and a couple of DSL's. So I orders me up a G12T-75 from Amazon, toss it in my DSL20CR from across the room (just kidding), fire it up, and it's... ok. ...it sounds better than the 70/80 ...but it does sound a little shrill and I've been tweaking the map for a half hour and I'm like, hmm. It's just "ok". Nothing special here.

So I hop on Celestion's website and YouTube, to research other speakers. I don't want to get into greenbacks and creambacks, and be sorting out all the "G, H, K... LMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ versions, I just want to get somewhere quick. I've heard good things, good sound clips for the V-Type, and Celestion mentions them as "balanced, a mix of vinatge and modern, and being especially good for solos to cut through".

So I orders me up a V-Type from Amazon, toss in my DSL20CR from across the room (just kidding), fire it up and after about 20 minutes, I'm like YAY!!!! I really like the speaker, ya know? So then I go through the same thought patterns we all do, like "should I replace ALL of my map speakers with V-Types across the board?" - 'cause I'm pretty excited, right?

But then...

But then, I go back out to YouTube and have a few more listens, and I discover there's another version of the V-Type that's supposed to be EVEN BETTER?? It's called the "Neo V-Type", and it's got "clearer this and warmer that", blah, blah, blah. I saw what's his name demo'ing it, and it does seem to sound a little nicer. (Although that guy can get great tone from 6 slices of moldy cheese.)

This feels like when I saved up for a few years to finally buy my Gibson R9 flametop Historic, and then 6 months later, Gibson came out with the new R9 TRUE Historic, and I was like, "so what have I got now, a not-so-true inferior Historic DAMMIT?"

So NOW WTF am I supposed to do? I can't just keep buying and returning brand new speakers back and forth to Amazon and Celestion all year, it bothers my conscience, see? But I want the best.

Can any of you people console me? Tell me the "Neo" version really isn't as good as it seems to be? 'cause you know that's what I really want to hear, right? But I feel like I just gotta know so I can be done with it, and it's bugging the carp out of me already.

Thanks.

Hey, do you use an EQ on your board, and also a cheap little Radar CAB pedal you can run in your effects loops with an EQ pedal you can make some killer tones even with crap speakers. Having better speakers even improves it even more. If you don't use these, you should check them out and use them. It really makes a great difference.
The Radar CAB pedal is made by Mooer for about $150.00US, and any nice used EQ pedal will do wonders. 7 or 10 band. I use a BOSS GE-7. About $60.00 I paid for that used and near new. Just an idea if you don't.

 

[ToneSter007]

two thoughts ~ stop here and be happy "or" realize you've not even started going down the rabbit hole!

for me, I've learned first hand that the more I know in tone, "the less I know"
that said, I have thousands of hours in tone testing, just on this subject, type of speakers, cab design, type of wood, stained, tolexed ~ etc.

from what I've read you want something more modern;
Celestion K-100
most underrated speaker they sale! a few big country players even use these.
Weber FC12
this is if you want a low spl. it is like maybe on a good day 94, this will allow for bedroom volumes, this is a great speaker
"it" does NOT sound like what they state" The Pink Floyd tone.
Weber Chicago.
These speakers, have a good full EQ across the board.
if purchased new, they need approx. 40+hrs break-in, NOT at bedroom volume.

 

[Vinsanitizer]

Hey, do you use an EQ on your board, and also a cheap little Radar CAB pedal you can run in your effects loops with an EQ pedal you can make some killer tones even with crap speakers. Having better speakers even improves it even more. If you don't use these, you should check them out and use them. It really makes a great difference.
The Radar CAB pedal is made by Mooer for about $150.00US, and any nice used EQ pedal will do wonders. 7 or 10 band. I use a BOSS GE-7. About $60.00 I paid for that used and near new. Just an idea if you don't.

I have probably never played live without using EQ's both in the front-end, and fx loop, since about 1993. Your suggestion earns you the following digital currency:

 

[Frontrowme]

My wife wishes I never learned about speakers either! I’ve got 8 vintage Marshall cabs in my basement now - so I have greenback pulsonic, greenback RIC, grey back, black back and Marshall labled G12-65’s covered. We would have a lot more room if I had less cabs! But the sound - man can tell the difference instantly!

 

[Crunchifyable]

You shouldn't generalize like that, different coils and even differently tuned guitars have a lot of impact on the complete guitar signal chain. If you don't do it right in the first place, by choosing the right tuning and coils, you can't fix the sound by another speaker later on. You can't make male vocals sound like female vocals by using another speaker.

A lot of that is basically preset or defined by the genre basically. I guess you can say the same about speakers being defined by the genre too.

You can stick an EQ before an amp or use ideal pickups but there's very little you can do to correct for a speaker that is shaping what you actually hear.

The way I think about it the amp is destroying the signal by distorting it. And once you realize how bad an amp actually sounds then I think it becomes apparent how important speaker to provide a limited range and emphasis.

Or put it another way, the sounds people associate with many amps often have much to do with the speaker commonly used (such as vintage greenbacks or certain years of vintage 30s, etc).

Basically right speaker gets you in the ballpark. Wrong speaker and you're gonna think "my amp sucks.". And the amp does suck. But that's because it needs a good speaker.

 

[Seven]

Just to add gasoline to the fire, microphones are basically a speaker in reverse or a transducer. The reason I mention this is because we invest many dollars in everything but the mic and speaker, which are the two primary items that get the sound to go somewhere.

This comment probably seems mundane, but I've had a recent revelation with the symbiotic relationship of speakers and mics and how they are both from the same concept, just opposite in their purpose. This includes both live settings and for recording and most of us take for granted what the do and why.

I guess my point is this: If we don't already, we should give more attention to speakers and microphones and how they provide the conduit to making or capturing the sound in our head.

Some techie nerds and tone junkies already know this, but most of us just want things to work and sound great, right out of the box. Rarely has that ever been the case. It takes trial and error.

 

[Maxbrothman]

Captor X or equivalent IR loader has saved me money experimenting with real deal gear.

 

[MarshallDog]

Ahhh, the speaker game, been there, done that!!! Your lucky you can return them. Most pleacs wont allow speakers to be returned for obvious reasons. I ended up selling off many speakers I did not like and still have a few in stock just in case my tastes cahnge. I have sold off many Celestions, a few Eminense and all of the Scumback speakers I have tried over the years and now simply love and favor either older Greenies or the G-12M 65 watt creamback. Good luck on your speaker quest!

 

[tallcoolone]

See, this is what kicks me right in the ol' Chicken McNuggets:

First of all, I hate playing the "buy it to try it" game, even if there are good return polies. But I really amn't liking the Seventy/80 speaker in my DSL20CR, so something has to be done about it.

So I figure I'll stick with what I know and like, right? My 1960A cab is loaded with G12T-75's, and I've been liking them more than V30's, especially with the JCM 800 and a couple of DSL's. So I orders me up a G12T-75 from Amazon, toss it in my DSL20CR from across the room (just kidding), fire it up, and it's... ok. ...it sounds better than the 70/80 ...but it does sound a little shrill and I've been tweaking the map for a half hour and I'm like, hmm. It's just "ok". Nothing special here.

So I hop on Celestion's website and YouTube, to research other speakers. I don't want to get into greenbacks and creambacks, and be sorting out all the "G, H, K... LMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ versions, I just want to get somewhere quick. I've heard good things, good sound clips for the V-Type, and Celestion mentions them as "balanced, a mix of vinatge and modern, and being especially good for solos to cut through".

So I orders me up a V-Type from Amazon, toss in my DSL20CR from across the room (just kidding), fire it up and after about 20 minutes, I'm like YAY!!!! I really like the speaker, ya know? So then I go through the same thought patterns we all do, like "should I replace ALL of my map speakers with V-Types across the board?" - 'cause I'm pretty excited, right?

But then...

But then, I go back out to YouTube and have a few more listens, and I discover there's another version of the V-Type that's supposed to be EVEN BETTER?? It's called the "Neo V-Type", and it's got "clearer this and warmer that", blah, blah, blah. I saw what's his name demo'ing it, and it does seem to sound a little nicer. (Although that guy can get great tone from 6 slices of moldy cheese.)

This feels like when I saved up for a few years to finally buy my Gibson R9 flametop Historic, and then 6 months later, Gibson came out with the new R9 TRUE Historic, and I was like, "so what have I got now, a not-so-true inferior Historic DAMMIT?"

So NOW WTF am I supposed to do? I can't just keep buying and returning brand new speakers back and forth to Amazon and Celestion all year, it bothers my conscience, see? But I want the best.

Can any of you people console me? Tell me the "Neo" version really isn't as good as it seems to be? 'cause you know that's what I really want to hear, right? But I feel like I just gotta know so I can be done with it, and it's bugging the carp out of me already.

Thanks.

Back away from the computer and play yer guitar!

 

[tallcoolone]

Back away from the computer and play yer guitar!

BTW I am full of sh!t:

 

[Jimi-C]

But I want the best.

Can any of you people console me? Tell me the "Neo" version really isn't as good as it seems to be? 'cause you know that's what I really want to hear, right? But I feel like I just gotta know so I can be done with it, and it's bugging the carp out of me already.

Thanks.

The best is what ever sounds good to your ear hole , no matter who made it or what it did or did not cost. I like Celestion but I like Eminence too . The Neos ( Neodymium ) are a stronger rare earth magnet .they might be louder , go take a listen at a music store....I,,,,just want to celebrate ...haven't heard Rare earth in a while ...