# The Official Marshall Origin 20 Thread...



## Joe_Easy

Any call for an official Marshall Origin 20 Thread here? If so, I just created it! If not, I created it anyway...

Recently took delivery of one. Loved it. Replaced all stock tubes with premium Groove Tubes. Loved it even more. 

Any other recommended upgrades, Etc? I was thinking of swapping the stock Celestion for a Greenback, or maybe a Creamback. I have a 12” Creamback I used to swap into previous 12” combos I’ve owned (there’s been a few!) and I always preferred it...no experience with the 10”, though. This is actually the first 10” combo I’ve owned. Actually, that’s a lie...it’s the first 10” I’ve wanted to hang on to; I very briefly owned a Marshall Class 5, but sold it a day later!


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## tce63

I have the Origin 20C and have several posts in the Origin 50 thread.

I changed the V-speaker to a 10" Greenback and great improvment.

Now i run the amp with a 1*12 Palmer Cab with Greenback, sounds great.

Cheers and  to the forum


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## Joe_Easy

tce63 said:


> I have the Origin 20C and have several posts in the Origin 50 thread.
> 
> I changed the V-speaker to a 10" Greenback and great improvment.
> 
> Now i run the amp with a 1*12 Palmer Cab with Greenback, sounds great.
> 
> Cheers and  to the forum



Nice. I might give the Greenback a go then, it does seem to come highly recommended for this amp.

Have you experimented with the tubes at all?


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## tce63

Joe_Easy said:


> Nice. I might give the Greenback a go then, it does seem to come highly recommended for this amp.
> 
> Have you experimented with the tubes at all?



Yes,
My amp was in the first batch to come to Sweden and it had the problem with the speaker out.

I Used it for 4 about months, then the sound began to fall out, it came and disappeared and when I looked at the power tubes, they where flashing a bit.
Sent it into warranty service, and when I got back it was fixed with the speaker out, and they put in Electro Harmonix EL34 power tubes in that sounds great.

But i really Recommend the Greenbacks for this amp


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## steveb63

This work for everybody?


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## steveb63

Can I play?

I'm all for our own thread, count me in.


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## tce63

steveb63 said:


> View attachment 56264
> 
> 
> This work for everybody?



What to you have for speakers in that Cab ?


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## steveb63

You know lol.

Two old Greenbacks, when i say old I mean approx ten years. Not super-cool vintage .

Love that cab the best out of the five cabs I own .


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## tce63

steveb63 said:


> You know lol.
> 
> Two old Greenbacks, when i say old I mean approx ten years. Not super-cool vintage .
> 
> Love that cab the best out of the five cabs I own .



Greenbacks are Great !


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## steveb63

tce63 said:


> Greenbacks are Great !



No doubt. 

I think the tone- profile, voicing of this amp is tailored for that Greenback cone.

I'd like to try a Creamback, never have. But everyone that uses them just raves about them.

The Greenback has been so good to me really haven't thought of trying anything else. 

That's why I want to try out ir cabinets. Seems like a good platform for auditioning speaker- cab combos


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## K2JLX

I can't speak for the ORI-20, but I run my Ori50h through a Marshall 1960BX 4x12 cab with greenbacks, I prefer it over my 1936 Vintage cab with Marshall "Vintage" speakers. YMMV.


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## Biff Maloy

I run my 20H into my 1960AX with Greenbacks or my 2061CX with Heritage Greenbacks. A G12M20 and G12H55HZ. I mostly play an R7 Goldtop.

I've had great results using a Dunlop Echoplex and it's Preamp pushing the amp cranked up for an in the ballpark vintage sound. Also as a lot of Origin owners Klon copies work very well either boosting the amp or as a base overdrive. 
Another thing I've discovered for its pedal base abilities is MIAB pedals sound good. I've never liked those in any Marshall I've tried before. Xotic SL Drive, Catilinbread DLS, Wampler Velvet Fuzz for example have all sounded great. That's a first.


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## Mitchell Pearrow

I know it’s the 20 official thread, but I am going to play as well, I promise to keep my power switch on the low side of the coin,   Cheers Mitch


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## Jon C

I don't have any Origin Amps …… but I can chime in with useless smartass comments if you like !!!


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## steveb63

Jon C said:


> I don't have any Origin Amps …… but I can chime in with useless smartass comments if you like !!!



We wouldn't have it any other way.


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## steveb63

Come on in, your welcome to plug in man.


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## Mitchell Pearrow

Jon C said:


> I don't have any Origin Amps …… but I can chime in with useless smartass comments if you like !!!


Chime right in bro, I will take the hit , hell I have screwed up my share


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## steveb63

I've been using my new Friedman BE-OD Deluxe with my 20h, a little cleaner than edge of breakup on amp.

It certainly has it's sound, and I love it.

I know tone is subjective, but this thing is great for balls out.

Really diggin it, saturated hard rock? Best I can describe.


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## Mitchell Pearrow

steveb63 said:


> I've been using my new Friedman BE-OD Deluxe with my 20h, a little cleaner than edge of breakup on amp.
> 
> It certainly has it's sound, and I love it.
> 
> I know tone is subjective, but this thing is great for balls out.
> 
> Really diggin it, saturated hard rock? Best I can describe.


I so want to hear it! Cheers Mitch


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## steveb63

Hey Mitch

Plug in over on the left bro


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## Mitchell Pearrow

steveb63 said:


> Hey Mitch
> 
> Plug in over on the left bro


The switch is on the left, I did say I would keep it in low power


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## steveb63

Anybody out there try using the d.i. output?

Is it even usable?


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## Mitchell Pearrow

steveb63 said:


> Anybody out there try using the d.i. output?
> 
> Is it even usable?


No I have not even thought about it, I think Ken361 might have while he had the 50 combo? Cheers Mitch


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## Joe_Easy

Biff Maloy said:


> Also as a lot of Origin owners Klon copies work very well either boosting the amp or as a base overdrive.



I haven’t experimented much with overdrive pedals. I got a Maxon OD808 several years ago and have stuck with it ever since. It’s never left me feeling like I’m missing anything, it’s always just worked with any amp I’ve put it in front of and works beautifully with the Origin 20.

I’d love to hear a comparison between the OD808 and a Klon into an Origin amp.


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## SG_Lefty

Just ordered a 20H. Will be plugged into my stock PPC112 for my home rig...


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## mad5066

Thanks for starting this thread. I use my mxr sugar drive very sweet. Also takes my rat, MI crunch box and sl drive very well. I'm running it with my 2x12 v30 cab but want to get a 1x12 eventually to have the option for either a greenback or creamback, can't decide. I also changed the tubes to el34b tungsol. I love not having to worry about biasing this thing. I forget what the preamp tubes are but they aren't stock either.


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## steveb63

Glad I read your post, I definitely can help on the Greenback vs. Creamback.

Within one week to ten days purchase a reissue Greenback, play and break in.

Then immediately buy the Creamback with a new cabinet. Simple easy solution!

Seriously, I don't think speaker wise you can go wrong either way, I've heard nothing negative re: either choice.

Enjoy, these are great amps.
Steve


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## tce63

mad5066 said:


> Thanks for starting this thread. I use my mxr sugar drive very sweet. Also takes my rat, MI crunch box and sl drive very well. I'm running it with my 2x12 v30 cab but want to get a 1x12 eventually to have the option for either a greenback or creamback, can't decide. I also changed the tubes to el34b tungsol. I love not having to worry about biasing this thing. I forget what the preamp tubes are but they aren't stock either.



I have run my Origin 20C booth with 1*12 Greenback cab and a 1*12 Creamback Cab, booth well brooken in.

Booth sounds great, but i preferd the Greenback, But that´s me


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## steveb63

tce63 said:


> I have run my Origin 20C booth with 1*12 Greenback cab and a 1*12 Creamback Cab, booth well brooken in.
> 
> Booth sounds great, but i preferd the Greenback, But that´s me



My findings as well.


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## paul-e-mann

Joe_Easy said:


> Any call for an official Marshall Origin 20 Thread here? If so, I just created it! If not, I created it anyway...
> 
> Recently took delivery of one. Loved it. Replaced all stock tubes with premium Groove Tubes. Loved it even more.
> 
> Any other recommended upgrades, Etc? I was thinking of swapping the stock Celestion for a Greenback, or maybe a Creamback. I have a 12” Creamback I used to swap into previous 12” combos I’ve owned (there’s been a few!) and I always preferred it...no experience with the 10”, though. This is actually the first 10” combo I’ve owned. Actually, that’s a lie...it’s the first 10” I’ve wanted to hang on to; I very briefly owned a Marshall Class 5, but sold it a day later!


I had a ORI20H head briefly, through a pair of greenbacks of course, it was a great sounding amp, loud, my favorite setting was 1 watt mode, dime the volume and gain on 7, got the sweetest edge of breakup tone but like I said it was loud, too loud for home use so I sent it back. It would make a great gigging amp for sure.


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## steveb63

pedecamp said:


> I had a ORI20H head briefly, through a pair of greenbacks of course, it was a great sounding amp, loud, my favorite setting was 1 watt mode, dime the volume and gain on 7, got the sweetest edge of breakup tone but like I said it was loud, too loud for home use so I sent it back. It would make a great gigging amp for sure.



I remember following your posts, you really wanted to fall in love.

Totally agree, must judge the amps tone after volume hits min#7, really starts to thicken , in a good way.

@pedecamp, what direction are you headed now re: the new amp? DSL? I'm thinkin the V.M. might be good bang for the buck. Everyone's attention is focused on all the newer 20 watters.

Steve


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## MarshallDog

tce63 said:


> I have run my Origin 20C booth with 1*12 Greenback cab and a 1*12 Creamback Cab, booth well brooken in.
> 
> Booth sounds great, but i preferd the Greenback, But that´s me



Why do you prefer the Greenie over the Creamie? Just curious??


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## paul-e-mann

steveb63 said:


> I remember following your posts, you really wanted to fall in love.
> 
> Totally agree, must judge the amps tone after volume hits min#7, really starts to thicken , in a good way.
> 
> @pedecamp, what direction are you headed now re: the new amp? DSL? I'm thinkin the V.M. might be good bang for the buck. Everyone's attention is focused on all the newer 20 watters.
> 
> Steve


I might sit tight til next year and buy a SC20H, I got one when they first came out and thought the loop was wonky, hopefully they will make it better by next year. Im not a DSL fan no thanks, Ive been looking at the JVM, JTM45, 1987x too but I really need to wait for the SC20H its got everything I want once they get the loop squared away.


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## tce63

MarshallDog said:


> Why do you prefer the Greenie over the Creamie? Just curious??



To my ears the breakup point of the Greenbacks are much earlier then the Creamback.
I also found the Greenbacks a little brighter and that i like.

For sure the Creamback has a little more bottom end, but i think with the Origin 20 the Greenback is a perfect match.


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## Joe_Easy

tce63 said:


> To my ears the breakup point of the Greenbacks are much earlier then the Creamback.
> I also found the Greenbacks a little brighter and that i like.
> 
> For sure the Creamback has a little more bottom end, but i think with the Origin 20 the Greenback is a perfect match.



Have you ever recorded them, or would you be able to? I’d love to hear the difference. I’m tight for space and a separate cab isn’t an option for me, so I’ll probably swap out the stock V-type Celestion for either a Creamback or Greenback.


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## ken361

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> No I have not even thought about it, I think Ken361 might have while he had the 50 combo? Cheers Mitch


Yeah it was OK, using a Mic sounded better


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## steveb63

Everybody have a great day!

I'm off to actually use my Origin for an afternoon.

I'm stoked! We're going to be conducting scientific research on at what points a human's eardrums will bleed, I'm betting the Friedman makes that happen a little sooner than the Origin on its own.

Peace


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## Jason Fieldhouseespk

I'm here, signing in!  

https://www.instagram.com/p/Bvrorv8h0ru/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link


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## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Yes, I covered a vox cab with Marshall grill cloth... looking for the logo, working on it! :-D


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## Mitchell Pearrow

Jason Fieldhouseespk said:


> Yes, I covered a vox cab with Marshall grill cloth... looking for the logo, working on it! :-D


Looks good Jason, nice work! Cheers Mitch


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## Biff Maloy

I just spent a good part of the weekend on my Mini Jubilee 2525H and Origin 20H. Had the house to myself. Speaking of the 20H, I did post earlier about good results with MIAB pedals. Ive been using it a lot lately for a pedal base. Xotic SL Drive was the absolute best. But, i went back to my intial settings of pre and master at around 3 o'clock with no pedals and for my ears i still say this is the best tone. Crank it and just use your guitar's controls. This was into either my 2061CX with Heritage Greenbacks or my stock 1960AX 4x12 with 25 watt Greenbacks. 

I've never played the 50H but I suspect it would make the better pedal base amp. The 20 watt is just too easy to drive on its own so my thoughts are why complicate it.


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## steveb63

Well played my Origin all day Sun.

Amp performed flawlessly.

After setting up at our rehearsal space guess what I observed?

My buddy, the other guitarist, was sporting a brand new Origin 20h!

Two of the same amp? We managed to carve out our own space in the freq range- no trampling underfoot!

A great day, hope everyone else 's went just as well.

Steve


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## Mitchell Pearrow

steveb63 said:


> Well played my Origin all day Sun.
> 
> Amp performed flawlessly.
> 
> After setting up at our rehearsal space guess what I observed?
> 
> My buddy, the other guitarist, wad sporting a brand new Origin 20h!
> 
> Two of the same amp? We managed to carve out our own space in the freq rsnge- no trampling underfoot!
> 
> A great day, hope everyone else 's went just as well.
> 
> Steve


I have to say good on your buddy, they are dam fine amps, I have to keep telling myself speakers, or I am going to grab another.   And run them in dual mono, with the mxr 10 band eq


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## Biff Maloy

steveb63 said:


> Well played my Origin all day Sun.
> 
> Amp performed flawlessly.
> 
> After setting up at our rehearsal space guess what I observed?
> 
> My buddy, the other guitarist, wad sporting a brand new Origin 20h!
> 
> Two of the same amp? We managed to carve out our own space in the freq rsnge- no trampling underfoot!
> 
> A great day, hope everyone else 's went just as well.
> 
> Steve



That sounds like a cool deal. Both sporting Marshall Origins. 

What did you guys use speaker and cab wise? Pedals? Volume settings?

I've run all sorts of tests on mine. I still prefer pre and master at around 3 o'clock and mostly straight in.


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## steveb63

Our settings were very close, I think the big difference was I was going completely clean, volume at noon, or my Friedman BE-OD Deluxe. 

He was going semi dirty on amp, volume at 300, or was using his Fulltone Full drive?

Both using 2x12 closed back Greenback loaded.

Just the difference in our styles, I guess?

Steve


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## Mitchell Pearrow

steveb63 said:


> Our settings were very close, I think the big difference was I was going completely clean, volume at noon, or my Friedman BE-OD Deluxe.
> 
> He was going semi dirty on amp, volume at 300, or was using his Fulltone Full drive?
> 
> Both using 2x12 closed back Greenback loaded.
> 
> Just the difference in our styles, I guess?
> 
> Steve


Back in the early 80’s the other guitarist in the band was using a 50 watt 4 holer with a master volume mod, and I had the 50 watt MV both amps were JMP’s and we never had a problem being in the same zone, as you said Steve I believe it’s the difference in the way we played. Damm I bet you guys are sounding excellent! Cheers Mitch


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## steveb63

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> Back in the early 80’s the other guitarist in the band was using a 50 watt 4 holer with a master volume mod, and I had the 50 watt MV both amps were JMP’s and we never had a problem being in the same zone, as you said Steve I believe it’s the difference in the way we played. Damm I bet you guys are sounding excellent! Cheers Mitch



I don't know how great we were lol. But we have a helluva good time.

I was shocked when I looked over at his rig.

I told him it was like our wives showing up in the same dress.lol


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## Biff Maloy

That's the thing around my area. It's very rural so you see players using junk as much as anything. Yet this day and time you can get a great sounding Marshall for a round 500 bucks. I would prefer to play with someone using the same amp. Both can give advice and work a cool tone together.


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## steveb63

Ya, 
I'm lucky to have that dude as a partner in crime. 

He and I usually  discuss gear purchases. He wanted to throw one by me.

He will always save and pony up. He bought our stage p.a. Not wealthy individuals, we are just determined to play nice stuff. No matter how long it takes to save.

Steve


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## steveb63

Catch up with you peoples after dinner.

Peace


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## Mitchell Pearrow

steveb63 said:


> Catch up with you peoples after dinner.
> 
> Peace


Good stuff Steve, I am truly right there with ya brother! Cheers Mitch


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## assaf110

My favorite guitar player checks the Origin 20..


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## 789

Loving the Origin 20C.... finally got a Marshall again!

Previous 50W and 100W had to go (many years ago) as I could not play either in my old apartment at the "optimal" levels  .... this was before attenuators and similar devices were widely available.


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## steveb63

789 said:


> Loving the Origin 20C.... finally got a Marshall again!
> 
> Previous 50W and 100W had to go (many years ago) as I could not play either in my old apartment at the "optimal" levels  .... this was before attenuators and similar devices were widely available.



Welcome, 

You go get optimum on that amp bro.

Great amps, what are you using for speakers?


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## steveb63

Sorry
Didn't see you had the combo, still probably breaking in that new speaker?

Running any cool pedals with that amp?


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## 789

steveb63 said:


> Sorry
> Didn't see you had the combo, still probably breaking in that new speaker?
> 
> Running any cool pedals with that amp?


Thanks for the welcome steveb63!

Yep, breaking in the stock speaker, had it about a week now. Haven't tried pedals in front of it yet as I am loving both the master and gain at 10 for my lead sound and rolling down the guitar volume to dial in the right amount of "broken clean"


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## fancychords

I have the 50c I love it question about that baffle that covers the speaker. Is it on the 20c and do you guys leave them on or take them off. Do they serve a purpose thanks.


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## Msharky67

I am still torn over this vs the SV20. I was looking at some video's of the Origin and I was impressed with it actually. Here are my new points now. Somebody can chime in and offer there thoughts about it. To me the Origin is already setup like how you would use the plexi or want and half the price. 

OR20) 

1) Low wattage
2) Plexi like
3) FX Loop
4) Tilt already jumped
5) Still have to boost it with a pedal
6) Afforable

SV20

1) LOUD will have to get attenuator on top of $1200. 
2) Still have to boost with a pedal
3) Have to jump
4) Expensive plus extras needed to use it properly.


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## Joe_Easy

Msharky67 said:


> I am still torn over this vs the SV20. I was looking at some video's of the Origin and I was impressed with it actually. Here are my new points now. Somebody can chime in and offer there thoughts about it. To me the Origin is already setup like how you would use the plexi or want and half the price.
> 
> OR20)
> 
> 1) Low wattage
> 2) Plexi like
> 3) FX Loop
> 4) Tilt already jumped
> 5) Still have to boost it with a pedal
> 6) Afforable
> 
> SV20
> 
> 1) LOUD will have to get attenuator on top of $1200.
> 2) Still have to boost with a pedal
> 3) Have to jump
> 4) Expensive plus extras needed to use it properly.



Both great options, but for me it came down to flexibility and the Origin 20 wins hands down in that respect. Sound is subjective, but I felt confident I would be able to dial in a sound close to what I was looking for with the OG20C and I was right. Swapping out the stock tubes for Premium Groove Tubes got me the rest of the way and it was a relatively in-expensive upgrade.


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## Mitchell Pearrow

789 said:


> Loving the Origin 20C.... finally got a Marshall again!
> 
> Previous 50W and 100W had to go (many years ago) as I could not play either in my old apartment at the "optimal" levels  .... this was before attenuators and similar devices were widely available.


 To the best forum ever my brother, nice amp for sure, full of the Marshall tones and still with money in the pocket! Cheers to you getting back to a Marshall! Mitch


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## Biff Maloy

I'm waiting for my SV20H so all I know is comments I've read. A huge lot of owners have commented the SV20 nails a scaled down Plexi. Positive comments everywhere it seems. I have a friend with a very discerning ear go try one that hadn't planned on buying anything and walked out with the head. 
Either way, I have the Origin 20H and even though it may fall into the budget category it has a quality about it that I think will be different from the SV. It should have more clean headroom for one thing and an alternative tone. I think the SV will break up quicker. I won't be selling my 20H when I get the SV.


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## tce63

Biff Maloy said:


> I'm waiting for my SV20H so all I know is comments I've read. A huge lot of owners have commented the SV20 nails a scaled down Plexi. Positive comments everywhere it seems. I have a friend with a very discerning ear go try one that hadn't planned on buying anything and walked out with the head.
> Either way, I have the Origin 20H and even though it may fall into the budget category it has a quality about it that I think will be different from the SV. It should have more clean headroom for one thing and an alternative tone. I think the SV will break up quicker. I won't be selling my 20H when I get the SV.



The SV Definitely brake up earlier, almost on 2 at the Volume knob, after 4-5 i don´t think the Volume Increases much, just get more gain.
And the sound is fantastic, couldn´t be happier, i think Marshall did a homerun with this serie


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## 789

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> To the best forum ever my brother, nice amp for sure, full of the Marshall tones and still with money in the pocket! Cheers to you getting back to a Marshall! Mitch



Thanks for the welcome Mitch!

I think that money in the pocket may soon be gone as I am now GAS'ing for the SV20H ! 

I've got a 1x12 with a WGS ET90 that needs some attention


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## Mitchell Pearrow

789 said:


> Thanks for the welcome Mitch!
> 
> I think that money in the pocket may soon be gone as I am now GAS'ing for the SV20H !
> 
> I've got a 1x12 with a WGS ET90 that needs some attention


I know exactly what you mean brother, it just never ends.  But as we acquirer more, the want is still following us ! Cheers Mitch


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## Axis39

I'm in too.... (haven't visited the forum for a few days).

Love my 20 combo. 

Gigged it a few times, used the DI Out (and loved it, by the way) for two gigs. One an outdoor party, I ran the amp on the 3 watt mode, keeping stage volume nice and low, but used the PA to fill the entire space with my sound. it was absolutely awesome! I did the same wiht an indoor gig a week or so later, with the same results.

Just got my amp back from the speaker out repair (under warranty). Trying to decide on taking it this weekend or my '58 Twin (that's how much I think of this little Marshall!)


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## mad5066

Still can't wait to see the schematics although I know it'll be awhile. I could trace it out myself but I'm too lazy. I also want a SV20h but absolutely don't need it. I'd still keep the origin 20h because they're different animals. Origin has that vintage vibe not trying to be "exactly" a plexi like the studio.


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## 789

fancychords said:


> I have the 50c I love it question about that baffle that covers the speaker. Is it on the 20c and do you guys leave them on or take them off. Do they serve a purpose thanks.



Yes, there's a small mesh-type baffle on the 20C behind the speaker.

I removed it to take a look at the tubes.

I am not sure what it is for, but I put it back on.


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## SG_Lefty

View media item 10642


SG_Lefty said:


> Just ordered a 20H. Will be plugged into my stock PPC112 for my home rig...




It arrived today...


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## Mitchell Pearrow

SG_Lefty said:


> View media item 10642
> 
> It arrived today...


Ok I get it need time to play it a bit, but you do need to report back, with your findings! Cheers to your new amp. HNAD  Mitch


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## scozz

tce63 said:


> To my ears the breakup point of the Greenbacks are much earlier then the Creamback.



That’s makes sense, especially with the Origin20. That amp takes a bit of going to get to breakup if what Im told is correct. So a 20 or 25 or even a 30 watt Greenback would get you there sooner that a 65 watt Creamback.


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## scozz

tce63 said:


> i think Marshall did a homerun with this serie


 Typical European,......you don’t ‘do’ a home run,....you hit a home run!!




(Just having a bit of fun with you @tce63 ) 



Sorry,  carry on,....


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## Mitchell Pearrow

scozz said:


> Typical European,......you don’t ‘do’ a home run,....you hit a home run!!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (Just having a bit of fun with you @tce63 )
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry,  carry on,....


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## fancychords

789 said:


> Yes, there's a small mesh-type baffle on the 20C behind the speaker.
> 
> I removed it to take a look at the tubes.
> 
> I am not sure what it is for, but I put it back on.


I did the same thing I figured it must serve a purpose.


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## Msharky67

I am thinking of pulling the trigger on the Origin20. I wanted the SV20 but the cost is too much knowing I'd have to get some attenuator too. I am sure its good. I feel the Origin is like the Plexi but already setup the way you would use it. Master volume, tilt control and FX loop. You still have to boost either with a pedal right. So there isn't a huge difference using them two. The price of the Origin is a no brainer. Waiting til the end of the month closer to my B-Day! Can't wait.


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## tce63

You are going to like it

Cheers


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## Joe_Easy

Msharky67 said:


> I am thinking of pulling the trigger on the Origin20. I wanted the SV20 but the cost is too much knowing I'd have to get some attenuator too. I am sure its good. I feel the Origin is like the Plexi but already setup the way you would use it. Master volume, tilt control and FX loop. You still have to boost either with a pedal right. So there isn't a huge difference using them two. The price of the Origin is a no brainer. Waiting til the end of the month closer to my B-Day! Can't wait.



Good choice IMO.


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## steveb63

Msharky67 said:


> I am thinking of pulling the trigger on the Origin20. I wanted the SV20 but the cost is too much knowing I'd have to get some attenuator too. I am sure its good. I feel the Origin is like the Plexi but already setup the way you would use it. Master volume, tilt control and FX loop. You still have to boost either with a pedal right. So there isn't a huge difference using them two. The price of the Origin is a no brainer. Waiting til the end of the month closer to my B-Day! Can't wait.



What's the rig you gonna run that with?

Speakers, effects etc...

Curious also..... home player? Gigging? Recording.

Congrats, it's a smokin little box.


----------



## 789

Msharky67 said:


> I am thinking of pulling the trigger on the Origin20. I wanted the SV20 but the cost is too much knowing I'd have to get some attenuator too. I am sure its good. I feel the Origin is like the Plexi but already setup the way you would use it. Master volume, tilt control and FX loop. You still have to boost either with a pedal right. So there isn't a huge difference using them two. The price of the Origin is a no brainer. Waiting til the end of the month closer to my B-Day! Can't wait.



You may already know this, but thought I mention it since "master volume" was mentioned in your post and is possibly one of your criteria for the purchase.

If the gain is on 10 and the master is below 5, this is pretty "clean" (to me).

You need to use the Powerstem switch to have lower level "crunch", and these are preset level changes.
_ie. set gain and master for desired crunch and set the Powerstem to mid or low_

There's some talk about the gain and master volume interaction here :

http://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/146715/marshall-origin-20-no-gain-is-it-just-me

If you're going to use pedals for crunch, then no concern.

I am not trying to talk you out of buying the amp.... I love the amp, it's AWESOME and is priced right.

But if you don't have a chance to try-before-you-buy, this _may _be a surprise.

Cheers!


----------



## tce63

789 said:


> You may already know this, but thought I mention it since "master volume" was mentioned in your post and is possibly one of your criteria for the purchase.
> 
> If the gain is on 10 and the master is below 5, this is pretty "clean" (to me).
> 
> You need to use the Powerstem switch to have lower level "crunch", and these are preset level changes.
> _ie. gain=10, master=10 and Powerstem=low_
> 
> There's some talk about the gain and master volume interaction here :
> 
> http://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/146715/marshall-origin-20-no-gain-is-it-just-me
> 
> If you're going to use pedals for crunch, then no concern.
> 
> I am not trying to talk you out of the amp.... I love the amp, it's AWESOME and is priced right.
> 
> But if you don't have a chance to try-before-you-buy, this _may _be a surprise.
> 
> Cheers!



When i Use my Orgin 20 i always have the master +6 and gain to suit me, then it cames alive


----------



## 789

tce63 said:


> When i Use my Orgin 20 i always have the master +6 and gain to suit me, then it cames alive



Agreed... needs to be loud-ish!


I like to run mine with both gain and master at 10, that's why I got the 20 instead of the 50, though I really wanted a 12" speaker.

But the 10" speaker is working out. This is my first combo with a 10" speaker.


----------



## Msharky67

steveb63 said:


> What's the rig you gonna run that with?
> 
> Speakers, effects etc...
> 
> Curious also..... home player? Gigging? Recording.
> 
> Congrats, it's a smokin little box.




I'm just a home player. I will be running it with a home brew 112 cab with a G12T75 or my Egnator 4x12 with 75's. I use a few pedals chorus, delay, reverb. Boosting it will be a TS9, SD-1, DS-1 copy, EQ, and a ZOOM multi stomp for varies effects. I am hoping the Origin will be like a plexi platform but allowing me to shape the tones I want. Plexi's are too loud as is. Even the 20 watt I bet. For half the price I can have it already jumped and low wattage. No attenuator needed. I am ordering one at the end of the month. Its my B-day gift. Can't wait to get one. I have heard some good demos of it. I will post pics when I get her!


----------



## steveb63

Well, Happy Birthday to you.

I kinda knew what to expect going in, as far as volume goes. You are entirely correct on the twenty watts, loud.

I usually use the high power setting when playing with the guys. I use my attenuator at home, or the master volume. 

I think, very subjective, that it does a Marshall - like sound, it's in its DNA. I just can't say it's a clone of a particular model. Which works for me.

From your above post I'm thinking you're going to be a happy birthday guy!

Have fun, they take to most any pedals, lots of experimenting in the future. 

If I can answer any specifics, hit me up. 

Steve


----------



## Bobbonne

Hello everyone,

First post for me here, great forum with loads of info.

I have the 20H and I'm experiencing fizz in the highs when pushing both master and gain. I ruled out the speaker by trying a different amp and I don't think it's either coming from the preamp. I tested pushing the preamp to the max with the amp's boost and an extra boost pedal on, with master very high and on high power mode, but lowering the signal in the effects loop (to bring it to bearable volume) and it sounded great, with loads of saturation but very well defined. I even threw a big muff in it and that was fantastic.

So I'm thinking the problem is coming after the master knob. I tried different ax7 tubes in V3 (stock, tad and ehx) and that didn't change the sound. So my question is this: do you think it could be the el34s that need to be changed? Or is it a case where a I should use a 5751 or at7? Or is it maybe just the sound of these amps?

Thanks!

Pierre


----------



## Baseballhack

Bobbonne said:


> Hello everyone,
> 
> First post for me here, great forum with loads of info.
> 
> I have the 20H and I'm experiencing fizz in the highs when pushing both master and gain. I ruled out the speaker by trying a different amp and I don't think it's either coming from the preamp. I tested pushing the preamp to the max with the amp's boost and an extra boost pedal on, with master very high and on high power mode, but lowering the signal in the effects loop (to bring it to bearable volume) and it sounded great, with loads of saturation but very well defined. I even threw a big muff in it and that was fantastic.
> 
> So I'm thinking the problem is coming after the master knob. I tried different ax7 tubes in V3 (stock, tad and ehx) and that didn't change the sound. So my question is this: do you think it could be the el34s that need to be changed? Or is it a case where a I should use a 5751 or at7? Or is it maybe just the sound of these amps?
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Pierre



I had a similar issue with my 20h. This is what I did. 1st, I was running it through a 1x12 Krank cab loaded with an eminence V1216, swapped that out for a Scumback M75. This made a tremendous change in tone for me. 2nd I rolled tubes in all positions till I found a my tone for now at least. Doesn't seem a popular choice but I did end up with a 12AT7 in the PI (V3) and I am loving it. In my opinion these amps are very revealing and can pick up fret buzz maybe more so than other amps, maybe check your guitar setup.


----------



## tce63

Bobbonne said:


> Hello everyone,
> 
> First post for me here, great forum with loads of info.
> 
> I have the 20H and I'm experiencing fizz in the highs when pushing both master and gain. I ruled out the speaker by trying a different amp and I don't think it's either coming from the preamp. I tested pushing the preamp to the max with the amp's boost and an extra boost pedal on, with master very high and on high power mode, but lowering the signal in the effects loop (to bring it to bearable volume) and it sounded great, with loads of saturation but very well defined. I even threw a big muff in it and that was fantastic.
> 
> So I'm thinking the problem is coming after the master knob. I tried different ax7 tubes in V3 (stock, tad and ehx) and that didn't change the sound. So my question is this: do you think it could be the el34s that need to be changed? Or is it a case where a I should use a 5751 or at7? Or is it maybe just the sound of these amps?
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Pierre



First  to the forum

I got the Power tubes changed on warranty service at the same time they fixed the speaker out issues.
They put EHx EL34 in mine at it sounds great


----------



## Drdos

Got the 20 Head a couple days ago, and playing it through a Mojave 2x12 cab loaded with Celestion G12 M-65 creambacks. Sounds great but still tweaking...


----------



## Bobbonne

Hi,

Thanks for the welcoming and the answers! I'll try your suggestions and report if any luck.
Thanks!
Pierre.


----------



## steveb63

Hi welcome to the forum bro. 

Try playing around with the presence, imo, i think that control really interacts with the tilt and treble. You might find out you don't need new tubes?

Enjoy your journey.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Bobbonne said:


> Hello everyone,
> 
> First post for me here, great forum with loads of info.
> 
> I have the 20H and I'm experiencing fizz in the highs when pushing both master and gain. I ruled out the speaker by trying a different amp and I don't think it's either coming from the preamp. I tested pushing the preamp to the max with the amp's boost and an extra boost pedal on, with master very high and on high power mode, but lowering the signal in the effects loop (to bring it to bearable volume) and it sounded great, with loads of saturation but very well defined. I even threw a big muff in it and that was fantastic.
> 
> So I'm thinking the problem is coming after the master knob. I tried different ax7 tubes in V3 (stock, tad and ehx) and that didn't change the sound. So my question is this: do you think it could be the el34s that need to be changed? Or is it a case where a I should use a 5751 or at7? Or is it maybe just the sound of these amps?
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Pierre


Welcome to the forum new MF’r what has been said before me is quite true you do need to do a little fine tuning, and as Steve alluded to the presence and tilt, has a lot to do with it ! Cheers Mitch


----------



## Bobbonne

Thanks for the advice. Rolling off the presence, the tilt and the treble does help a bit. Rolling the guitar tone too. Though it's a fine line before the saturation losses a little of its bite.

Cheers, Pierre.


----------



## Bettyboo

Hello Everyone,

I am also new here. I had a DSL 5 combo which I liked once I changed the speaker to a greenback, but not enough to keep it. I bought an Origin 20c about a month ago and am trying to understand it - it seems to be a pretty unique amp that takes time to get to know. A lot of the time, I play at lowish volume 60-65db at home, and I struggle to get the pushed sounds that I really enjoy...

I have just started to use a volume pedal in the fx loop and that helps a lot - I can get nice tones to thrash away on powerchords at volumes that don't upset the wife... The guy I sold my DSL5c to doesn't like the greenback, he prefers the original speaker (I cannot understand that, but each to their own...), so I'm getting the 25w 16 ohm greenback from him over the next day or two which I hope will give me breakup earlier and at lower volumes. The DSL was very easy to change the speaker, a quick look at the Origin looks a more difficult job - any suggestions from folks who have changed the speaker?

I'll probably also pick up an attenuator, as it'd be nice to get the tubes cooking at the 20w setting at apartment playing levels.

Can anybody suggest anything else that may help get some punkier/driven blues sounds at lower volumes? I put a TS808 and a Catalinbread Katzinkonig in front of the amp, and I don't really like the sounds until I turn the volume up far too high for home use. I'm thinking, especially with an attenuator, that a treble booster may help?

Or perhaps even just get a DSL1 head and plug it into the Origin's speaker.

Some pics:

The DSL that I probably should have kept:




The Origin 20c


----------



## scozz

Bettyboo said:


> I'll probably also pick up an attenuator, as it'd be nice to get the tubes cooking at the 20w setting at apartment playing levels.



I think an attenuator is your best bet. I don't own an Origin, but from what I've heard these amps,(like most all tube amps), sound great/best when the power tubes are really cooking! 
I've heard and read great things about the Bugera PS1. They do the job and do it well, and for only $100!

I'm ordering one this week.


----------



## tce63

Bettyboo said:


> Hello Everyone,
> 
> I am also new here. I had a DSL 5 combo which I liked once I changed the speaker to a greenback, but not enough to keep it. I bought an Origin 20c about a month ago and am trying to understand it - it seems to be a pretty unique amp that takes time to get to know. A lot of the time, I play at lowish volume 60-65db at home, and I struggle to get the pushed sounds that I really enjoy...
> 
> I have just started to use a volume pedal in the fx loop and that helps a lot - I can get nice tones to thrash away on powerchords at volumes that don't upset the wife... The guy I sold my DSL5c to doesn't like the greenback, he prefers the original speaker (I cannot understand that, but each to their own...), so I'm getting the 25w 16 ohm greenback from him over the next day or two which I hope will give me breakup earlier and at lower volumes. The DSL was very easy to change the speaker, a quick look at the Origin looks a more difficult job - any suggestions from folks who have changed the speaker?
> 
> I'll probably also pick up an attenuator, as it'd be nice to get the tubes cooking at the 20w setting at apartment playing levels.
> 
> Can anybody suggest anything else that may help get some punkier/driven blues sounds at lower volumes? I put a TS808 and a Catalinbread Katzinkonig in front of the amp, and I don't really like the sounds until I turn the volume up far too high for home use. I'm thinking, especially with an attenuator, that a treble booster may help?
> 
> Or perhaps even just get a DSL1 head and plug it into the Origin's speaker.
> 
> Some pics:
> 
> The DSL that I probably should have kept:
> 
> View attachment 57723
> 
> 
> The Origin 20c
> 
> View attachment 57721
> 
> 
> View attachment 57722




Great amps, i used to run my Origin 20C with an attunetaror in 3w mode.
Now a friend of me has borrowed it after I received my SV20H.

AND

 to the forum

Cheers


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Bettyboo said:


> Hello Everyone,
> 
> I am also new here. I had a DSL 5 combo which I liked once I changed the speaker to a greenback, but not enough to keep it. I bought an Origin 20c about a month ago and am trying to understand it - it seems to be a pretty unique amp that takes time to get to know. A lot of the time, I play at lowish volume 60-65db at home, and I struggle to get the pushed sounds that I really enjoy...
> 
> I have just started to use a volume pedal in the fx loop and that helps a lot - I can get nice tones to thrash away on powerchords at volumes that don't upset the wife... The guy I sold my DSL5c to doesn't like the greenback, he prefers the original speaker (I cannot understand that, but each to their own...), so I'm getting the 25w 16 ohm greenback from him over the next day or two which I hope will give me breakup earlier and at lower volumes. The DSL was very easy to change the speaker, a quick look at the Origin looks a more difficult job - any suggestions from folks who have changed the speaker?
> 
> I'll probably also pick up an attenuator, as it'd be nice to get the tubes cooking at the 20w setting at apartment playing levels.
> 
> Can anybody suggest anything else that may help get some punkier/driven blues sounds at lower volumes? I put a TS808 and a Catalinbread Katzinkonig in front of the amp, and I don't really like the sounds until I turn the volume up far too high for home use. I'm thinking, especially with an attenuator, that a treble booster may help?
> 
> Or perhaps even just get a DSL1 head and plug it into the Origin's speaker.
> 
> Some pics:
> 
> The DSL that I probably should have kept:
> 
> View attachment 57723
> 
> 
> The Origin 20c
> 
> View attachment 57721
> 
> 
> View attachment 57722


First welcome to the forum, I have been saying this across the forum, try the mxr 10 band eq in front of the amp, it wakes it up and brings the tones to life. I also have clips throughout the forum as well. Mine is the 50 H but you will also get the goods on your 20C! Cheers Mitch


----------



## Bettyboo

The 30w greenback was easy to put in and made a significant improvement to my ears - lovely gain sounds at lover volume levels; thicker and fuller sounds. I liked the speaker the amp came with, so I was surprised how big an improvement the speaker change made.

Here are some pictures of the speaker swap:


----------



## Bettyboo

8 chassis screws and the four speaker screws, was very easy...
















For me, the sounds I like, I was getting them (slightly thiner and less breadth) at 80+db, but with the 30w greenback in I can now get similar, but even nicer sounds, at 70db - which I can just about get away with at my apartment... That's just with the LP special; once I plug in the SG junior I expect even more grit and bark. The greenback really works with this amp for me; takes me from 75% happy with the sound (at levels I can live with) to 95% happy with the sound (at levels I can live with).


----------



## jeffb

IME this amp is really finnicky about tubes in general but ESPECIALLY the PI and the power tubes. It gets really nasty and buzzy/harsh in the highs with more aggressive tubes and pushing the master This seems the most exaggerated in medium and low power modes- push the master high and , yuk.

An old Jan 5751 or JJ803S is a blessing in the PI along with something more compressed and creamy in the Power section. Mullard RIs for example vs the JJ EL34 varieties.

Like the Class5 , the Origins will also exaggerate your faults for all to hear. Not terribly forgiving like a DSL or such


----------



## Bettyboo

jeffb said:


> the Origins will also exaggerate your faults for all to hear



Probably the worst possible amp for my two bob playing then... 

Having said that, at the price, it's a great deal, sounds great, and just makes me feel good to have it around. If the wife goes out, and I plug the SG junior in, maybe a couple of beers, then the world is a good place.

I don't much like compressors, but I've been using it quite a lot with this amp (says much about my sloppy playing).

A weird thing happened last week: I bought this amp in a sale about a month ago (I'm working away from home in Korea, and Marshalls are expensive here), reduced from about 650 pounds to 580 pounds. The day after the sale, the shop set the 'normal price, at 485 pounds... . I was fretting away, but decided to hold my peace and just take the hit, but about a week ago, I noticed that the shop had refunded 95 pounds into my bank account without telling me, or me asking them for it. Sometimes, good things happen...


----------



## Ashish Thomas

Love this group
Got this Amp 3 weeks ago absolutely rips
Does anyone know what ehx el34 powertubes, soft medium or hard matched sets is best for the origin 20 combo?

Cheers


----------



## tce63

Ashish Thomas said:


> Love this group
> Got this Amp 3 weeks ago absolutely rips
> Does anyone know what ehx el34 powertubes, soft medium or hard matched sets is best for the origin 20 combo?
> 
> Cheers



 to the forum


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Ashish Thomas said:


> Love this group
> Got this Amp 3 weeks ago absolutely rips
> Does anyone know what ehx el34 powertubes, soft medium or hard matched sets is best for the origin 20 combo?
> 
> Cheers


 To the forum. I put ruby EL34’s in my 50 H and mullard pres, to my ears it kicks ass. Cheers Mitch


----------



## steveb63

Okay, I'm going to try to keep this thread going.

I've ditched my Boss BR-800 digital recorder, in favor of my p.c. with Reaper as a DAW.

First tried using the d.i. , no Bueno. Sounds kinda...well...sucks.

Can't live mic, so onto the next option.

Went with the line out from my Weber mini-mass attenuator, added some cabinet i.r.'s.

There's the tone! Sounded great with the Strat, no effects just amp overdrive, boost engaged.
Now for the Les Paul. Voila! Sounds just as I hoped. 

Next step is creating a drum track, and start recording. When I get something worthwhile I will post, but please don't hold your breath. I'm busy around the house, work etc..

TLDR- Origin 20H, d.i. no good, treated line out from attenuator is the ticket. Unless you're live micing.

Open to any suggestions, tips whatever, would like to hear of other's expierences.

Steve


----------



## steveb63

This cab i.r. pedal sounds pretty damn good.
Has 100 cabs, different microphones, power amp simulation (six models).

Fully able to turn on and off separately . Fairly usefull, decent sounds and many different presets.


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

steveb63 said:


> Okay, I'm going to try to keep this thread going.
> 
> I've ditched my Boss BR-800 digital recorder, in favor of my p.c. with Reaper as a DAW.
> 
> First tried using the d.i. , no Bueno. Sounds kinda...well...sucks.
> 
> Can't live mic, so onto the next option.
> 
> Went with the line out from my Weber mini-mass attenuator, added some cabinet i.r.'s.
> 
> There's the tone! Sounded great with the Strat, no effects just amp overdrive, boost engaged.
> Now for the Les Paul. Voila! Sounds just as I hoped.
> 
> Next step is creating a drum track, and start recording. When I get something worthwhile I will post, but please don't hold your breath. I'm busy around the house, work etc..
> 
> TLDR- Origin 20H, d.i. no good, treated line out from attenuator is the ticket. Unless you're live micing.
> 
> Open to any suggestions, tips whatever, would like to hear of other's expierences.
> 
> Steve



Brilliant information there man, Thank you muchos...

Just wondering, do you think the DI out is actually with or without the cabinet simulation? and if it's with, does using another, separate cabinet ir help.or hinder? 

Thanks,


----------



## Kim Lucky Day

Thought I'd post a cover of Skynyrd's "Don't Ask No Questions" here. All of the guitar parts were done through my Origin 20H into my 1966B 2x12. I'm not much of a vocalist (heck, I'm not much of a guitarist, either) but I was getting some great tones out of it for this project. Had a Tubescreamer in front of it for some of the tracks.


----------



## steveb63

Jason Fieldhouseespk said:


> Brilliant information there man, Thank you muchos...
> 
> Just wondering, do you think the DI out is actually with or without the cabinet simulation? and if it's with, does using another, separate cabinet ir help.or hinder?
> 
> Thanks,



Hi @Jason Fieldhouseespk ,

To my ears. fwiw, I hear some e.q. on the d.i. out. I'm assuming this e.q. is their version of a cab sim.

I didn't care for it. Too muddy, no definition, not my idea of great sound.

For the record, I did not play around with it too much. Perhaps a more usuable sound could be created by additional e.q.ing, compressing etc...

Now for the good news. Using my dry line out, and adding cab. i.r.'s made it sound fantastic. Not just usable, but really great tone. No effects, studio enhancement etc...

Im going to be doing the same with my JTM 45 later tonight.

Now that I think of it, I bet that new Freidman mic no mo would work great in this application.

Will post sound clips in the near future.

Steve


----------



## mad5066

Finally tried my O20h with an attenuator, all I can say is it's amazing! Wish I didn't wait this long to pick one up. Having the power tubes pushed a little harder really opens this thing up. I took a chance on the bugera ps1 and couldn't be happier. Best ancillary purchase I made in awhile, I guess it's more fun buying pedals but this was well worth it. I feel like my playing has improved because the volume isn't overbearing anymore and the tone is where I want it so I practice more.


----------



## 789

Kim Lucky Day said:


> Thought I'd post a cover of Skynyrd's "Don't Ask No Questions" here. All of the guitar parts were done through my Origin 20H into my 1966B 2x12. I'm not much of a vocalist (heck, I'm not much of a guitarist, either) but I was getting some great tones out of it for this project. Had a Tubescreamer in front of it for some of the tracks.




Great choice of cover and it sounds fantastic!
The guitar tones are great, love the tone in the opening!


----------



## 789

Jason Fieldhouseespk said:


> Brilliant information there man, Thank you muchos...
> 
> Just wondering, do you think the DI out is actually with or without the cabinet simulation? and if it's with, does using another, separate cabinet ir help.or hinder?
> 
> Thanks,



To my ears, I believe the DI output is with cab/speaker sim.

As well, the manual states the following for the DI Output:

"Connect your amplifier to an external recording device or sound desk using this output socket with added loudspeaker emulation."

I don't care for the sound though.....


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

steveb63 said:


> Hi @Jason Fieldhouseespk ,
> 
> To my ears. fwiw, I hear some e.q. on the d.i. out. I'm assuming this e.q. is their version of a cab sim.
> 
> I didn't care for it. Too muddy, no definition, not my idea of great sound.
> 
> For the record, I did not play around with it too much. Perhaps a more usuable sound could be created by additional e.q.ing, compressing etc...
> 
> Now for the good news. Using my dry line out, and adding cab. i.r.'s made it sound fantastic. Not just usable, but really great tone. No effects, studio enhancement etc...
> 
> Im going to be doing the same with my JTM 45 later tonight.
> 
> Now that I think of it, I bet that new Freidman mic no mo would work great in this application.
> 
> Will post sound clips in the near future.
> 
> Steve


Mega, great reply, Thank you very much....

In other news... can anyone describe the disgruntled complaints from some Origin haters??

Listen in guys and gals! ;-)


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

789 said:


> To my ears, I believe the DI output is with cab/speaker sim.
> 
> As well, the manual states the following for the DI Output:
> 
> "Connect your amplifier to an external recording device or sound desk using this output socket with added loudspeaker emulation."
> 
> I don't care for the sound though.....



Aye, well I read that, which is ok.... but it also said the speakers were functioning correctly. Then the Dawson's demo guy threw in a 'and there's no cab sim, allowing you to add your own IRs'

But I don't mind either way, it'll do a job with or without DI-ing, I have mics and run through various mixers and was, and have plugin stuff I can do in the DAW.....
But I just wondered if using it with another(presumably better) IR or cab sim, will help or hinder it? 

Anyway, also I have a new tonal secret weapon....


----------



## Biff Maloy

I have the 20H. For quite a while I've run mine using just the amp's breakup minus it's built in boost. Control this from my guitar. Lately I've been more exploring it's base for drive pedals. Curious as to where some of you set your pre and master for this. I'm talking at 20 watts and jam volume.


----------



## steveb63

For distortion pedals run into mostly clean amp pre=5 +/- Master 7-8

Overdrive pedals at edge of breakup, settings depend on speaker, cab etc..... usually both about 3/4 up

Tilt, slightly towards bass, about 11:00, don't like a shrill guitar.

Of course that's just me?


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Mine is the 50H I am running the boost at 7-8 and volume at 3-4 with the power scaling at the middle position, and treble at 8, mids 8, bass at 5, with a joyo ultimate drive as a clean boost, tilt at 5, and my LP Traditional sounds amazing, it’s a cross between late 70’s Priest, and Thin Lizzy, UFO, and I am truly liking what I hear. Cheers Mitch


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Finally finished the cabinet conversion.... but is it really finished?

Open back, 2x12, 16ohm, greenbacks... sounds great, buuutt.... i might be actually thinking of flipping one of the greenbacks for either an alnico blue or gold.... and maybe one day trying to fknd a vintage 70s greeny.... :-/ hmmm


https://www.instagram.com/p/Byyd9bqhSX0/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link


----------



## scozz

@mad5066, thought you might enjoy this,....


----------



## tce63

Jason Fieldhouseespk said:


> Finally finished the cabinet conversion.... but is it really finished?
> 
> Open back, 2x12, 16ohm, greenbacks... sounds great, buuutt.... i might be actually thinking of flipping one of the greenbacks for either an alnico blue or gold.... and maybe one day trying to fknd a vintage 70s greeny.... :-/ hmmm
> 
> 
> https://www.instagram.com/p/Byyd9bqhSX0/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link



Looks great


----------



## plexipaul

Origin 20 halfsnack completed : )


----------



## tce63

plexipaul said:


> Origin 20 halfsnack completed : )



Looks great, Congrats


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

tce63 said:


> Looks great, Congrats


Looks really good I like it


----------



## mad5066

the vertical half stack looks great actually! too bad I already have a 2x12 and want a 1x12 cab


----------



## plexipaul

Thx brethren. Love the looks as well, obviously.

Tonewise: first time experience with these Seventy 80 speakers.
Played 4 hours this afternoon with all EQ at noon, ending up last half hour with Classic Marshall tone with Presence 8, Treble 7, Middle 6, Bass 4, Tilt 8.
Fingers crossed once they are well broken in. Thusfar, well done Marshall.


----------



## steveb63

plexipaul said:


> Origin 20 halfsnack completed : )


Really nice.

Now that's how you decorate a wall. Some nice gits to go with those amps.


----------



## L Newman

Hi. A new member. Had my 20C for just over a month. Really like it but still working on getting the tone I want out of it. Need more time with it a gig volume. Have come back to a valve amp after 5+ years with a SS. Had a Marshall clone many years ago, but very happy to finally have the real thing.


----------



## tce63

L Newman said:


> Hi. A new member. Had my 20C for just over a month. Really like it but still working on getting the tone I want out of it. Need more time with it a gig volume. Have come back to a valve amp after 5+ years with a SS. Had a Marshall clone many years ago, but very happy to finally have the real thing.



Hi and  to the forum, a great place

Origin 20C is a great amp, when I had mine i put a Greenback in it, and that sounds great 

Cheers


----------



## L Newman

tce63 said:


> Hi and  to the forum, a great place
> 
> Origin 20C is a great amp, when I had mine i put a Greenback in it, and that sounds great
> 
> Cheers


Thanks for the welcome.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

L Newman said:


> Hi. A new member. Had my 20C for just over a month. Really like it but still working on getting the tone I want out of it. Need more time with it a gig volume. Have come back to a valve amp after 5+ years with a SS. Had a Marshall clone many years ago, but very happy to finally have the real thing.


  To the madness we like to call the Marshall Forum, I have the 50H and they are fine amps, most people complain of the lack of gain, but you would know that before you purchase it.
I love mine and I have dodgy clips of it all over the forum.
Cheers to getting your tones from your new bad ass amp.
Cheers Mitch


----------



## L Newman

Thanks. The gain is fine for me (blues/rock). Haven't had the opportunity yet to play it at 20W. Hopefully soon - booked a room.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

L Newman said:


> Thanks. The gain is fine for me (blues/rock). Haven't had the opportunity yet to play it at 20W. Hopefully soon - booked a room.


You my brother are going to love it, in recent past couple of weeks, I have only been going to the half power setting, still rocks hard , and I love the mxr 10 band eq in front of the amp.
Cheers Mitch


----------



## L Newman

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> ... I love the mxr 10 band eq in front of the amp.
> Cheers Mitch



I find I'm leaving the boost on all the time (using a Strat).

Are you using the EQ as an additional/alternative boost? Set flat? Otherwise?

L


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

L Newman said:


> I find I'm leaving the boost on all the time (using a Strat).
> 
> Are you using the EQ as an additional/alternative boost? Set flat? Otherwise?
> 
> L


I am setting it to a slight frown , my boost is always on, and as of just recently, I have pulled the clean boosts off of the chain, it will take me a minute but I will bring a pic of the. 10 band eq


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

[url=https://postimg.cc/FfQ2Sqj9]

[/URL]


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

I have not changed it since I initially found the tones I was after, and the same settings is what I use on my dsl40c’s as well.
Cheers Mitch


----------



## Graham G

does anybody know if the 20C cabinet has room to fit a 12" speaker ?


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Graham G said:


> does anybody know if the 20C cabinet has room to fit a 12" speaker ?


Not sure, it comes with a 10” correct?


----------



## Graham G

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> Not sure, it comes with a 10” correct?



yes,i suspect if it could take a 12",they would have released it with one,12" is pretty much the standard for us old fashioned guitar players.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Graham G said:


> yes,i suspect if it could take a 12",they would have released it with one,12" is pretty much the standard for us old fashioned guitar players.


I do know that Micky put a 12” in lieu of a 10” in one of his smaller combos, but I cannot remember which one, it would be pretty tight but I would not rule it out.
Cheers Mitch


----------



## L Newman

Graham G said:


> does anybody know if the 20C cabinet has room to fit a 12" speaker ?


Did you put one in? If so, what? And how did it sound?


----------



## Graham G

L Newman said:


> Did you put one in? If so, what? And how did it sound?



I took the easy way out & bought the Head.

An update to this,i've just seen a 20C on ebay with a 12"Creamback fitted,it's a brand new dealer sale,which they say they modify to take the 12" speaker,they route the opening themselves.
So it looks like it is possible.


----------



## progrockabuse

Finally got a chance to try out just running the head straight out of the DI out into my Focusrite interface and into logic on my mac. No speaker cab connected, just have to make sure the DI is connected before switching on the amp. Sounded pretty good, though sounded a little woolly with it's built-in cab sim on the DI. Bit of channel EQ to smooth it out and it was sounding pretty banging. I can crank it up to a sweet crunch/breakup and listen to it through my studio monitors. 

Marshall 1
Complaining neighbours 0


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

As always.... Johan provides the answers....

Pay attention to introduction...


----------



## L Newman

progrockabuse said:


> sounded a little woolly with it's built-in cab sim on the DI.


Agree. I recorded a rehearsal using it and the DI signal sounded nothing like what was coming out of the box.

So, you can disconnect the speaker when using the DI (simulates a load?)?


----------



## L Newman

Jason Fieldhouseespk said:


> As always.... Johan provides the answers....
> 
> Pay attention to introduction...



Surely an attenuator isn't necessary with the 20C, it's built in?


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

L Newman said:


> Surely an attenuator isn't necessary with the 20C, it's built in?



The madness actually is that even on the low setting, half a watt, people still cannot turn their amps past a squeak to get any gain out of it.... is this because they get the stink eye from the missus because they woke the baby? That's why I use modellers and computers for silent home playing, to not piss off the other half and wake the kids, and let loose when they oot of the oose! (Went Scottish there, sorry)


----------



## L Newman

Jason Fieldhouseespk said:


> The madness actually is that even on the low setting, half a watt, people still cannot turn their amps past a squeak to get any gain out of it



Yes, of course.


----------



## L Newman

I would have loved to have a switch on the amp to keep the effects loop on without the pedal.


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

I mean, I wonder how much gain Mick Ronson could get at home with his 200w Marshall Super PA? He might have a somewhat bigger house than us all like, so maybe not such a big problem....
Yeah, people used to play gigs with and stand in front of 200w tube amps...


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

L Newman said:


> I would have loved to have a switch on the amp to keep the effects loop on without the pedal.



Aye, well that would be nice yes....

Now there is a fix for that, which includes a jack plug adaptor, which means I reckon that can be easily modded without any external changes...

In fact, internally it would require a single piece of wire that's it!


----------



## L Newman

Jason Fieldhouseespk said:


> Now there is a fix for that, which includes a jack plug adaptors...


. Aye laddie ... now do you ken how to do it


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

L Newman said:


> . Aye laddie ... now do you ken how to do it



You know what, I think I will just do the mod and see... I need to find the old post about that specific issue to remember which one it was TS or TRS... I think it was TRS, so you'd have to solder tip to ground, or ring to ground... whichever one works you then just ground the same internally....

If anyone knows where that post is on the threads? It might even be on that forum tbh....?


----------



## L Newman

I wait with bated breath ...


----------



## L Newman

Jason Fieldhouseespk said:


> Yeah, people used to play gigs with and stand in front of 200w tube amps...



I started out playing standing three feet in front of a 100W tube amp


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Then I suppose if your just grounding that bit, theres no reason a switch cant be placed between it either...

Am I making promises I can't keep... well, I will take my amp to my guy, and discuss it with him. He was reluctant to install a PPIMV because he couldn't get any circuit diagrams from Marshall...


----------



## Biff Maloy

As far as the loop, on/off, pedal, switch instead thing. Yall are right. This has been discussed. It's your gear and money so do what you want so I'm only going to comment once. This has started many a debate. 

It's already "fixed" in the form of a switch pedal that comes with the amp. It seams like every other "fix" I've seen dreamed up still requires it to be plugged into the amp. Doesn't seem worth the effort but there's a lot of people that like to tinker with things. Just plug the pedal into the amp. If the cable is too long thats what zip ties are for. 

Plugging one more cable into the back of the amp being a burden when you already have to plug into the send and returns is beyond my rational thinking. But, ive read many buy the combo, wish it came with a 12, cram a 12 in there and call it good. I dont get that either. 

Ok, I'm done.


----------



## L Newman

OK, Biff. Noted.


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Cheers, fair play... but I'm on about a switch on the back that will let you leave the loop on or off, or use the foot pedal to switch it on and off, thus relieving people of the footswitch been an annoying extra thing to carry... I honestly thought the same as you Biff to begin with, but tbh, it's a ballache remembering to plug it in, I pack the amp away in it's case after every practice, so I have to unplug it all the time... its the head so I cant just throw in the cabinet, well I could, it's just I leave the cab in room for others to use.. and I use different cabs sometimes depending on which rehearsal room is available.... I'd just rather it not be there.


----------



## Axis39

L Newman said:


> Agree. I recorded a rehearsal using it and the DI signal sounded nothing like what was coming out of the box.
> 
> So, you can disconnect the speaker when using the DI (simulates a load?)?



In reverse order...

Yes, you can run the Origins without a speaker attached, as long as you disconnect the speaker while the amp is *OFF*!

Funny, that you heard something different coming out of the DI. When I used my stock 20C at a couple fo gigs and ran the DI into the PA, it sounded remarkably like the amp and stock speaker. I was super happy with it as a sound reinforcement method!


----------



## Jeff Hudson

fancychords said:


> I have the 50c I love it question about that baffle that covers the speaker. Is it on the 20c and do you guys leave them on or take them off. Do they serve a purpose thanks.


I have the 20c and it has the baffle also, I think it is there to keep someone from sticking their hands in the back of the amp. It could be a EU safety deal?


----------



## Jeff Hudson

Biff Maloy said:


> As far as the loop, on/off, pedal, switch instead thing. Yall are right. This has been discussed. It's your gear and money so do what you want so I'm only going to comment once. This has started many a debate.
> 
> It's already "fixed" in the form of a switch pedal that comes with the amp. It seams like every other "fix" I've seen dreamed up still requires it to be plugged into the amp. Doesn't seem worth the effort but there's a lot of people that like to tinker with things. Just plug the pedal into the amp. If the cable is too long thats what zip ties are for.
> 
> Plugging one more cable into the back of the amp being a burden when you already have to plug into the send and returns is beyond my rational thinking. But, ive read many buy the combo, wish it came with a 12, cram a 12 in there and call it good. I dont get that either.
> 
> Ok, I'm done.


If I need the loop I turn it on and stick the pedal behind the amp, does the trick and the price is right.


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Jeff Hudson said:


> If I need the loop I turn it on and stick the pedal behind the amp, does the trick and the price is right.



..... this is getting a little bit like Brexit.... some people do not see plugging the footswitch in and leaving it behind the amp as a 'fix'... they do not want to include the footswitch... they want the FX loop on without having the footswitch in the same room or plugged in... they want to throw the footswitch in the river and toss bricks at it! 

What I'm suggesting is... having the footswitch INSIDE the amp, with a switch on the back to either leave it on or leave it off.... thus not having to put the footswitch in a Sainsbury's bag and take it with you where ever you have the amp....


----------



## Biff Maloy

I think those of us in the other camp totally understand what the other side wants. Its just those that are accepting of the footswitch have a hard time understanding why it's so inconvenient. Id like to have both options myself but.. 

To me, the fix has always been right in front of the ones that feel the need to mod the amp. I'm not an amp tech by any means but i would just slap some velcro on the pedal and back of the amp. Zip tie the excess cable. Then you'd have the clicker there.

If a true mod is wanted. I'd take the switch out of the pedal and mount it on a small bracket. Hardwire the switch through the 1/4 jack hole and mount the whole assembly there. 

The switch needed is there. I'd find a way to use it.


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Biff Maloy said:


> I think those of us in the other camp totally understand what the other side wants. Its just those that are accepting of the footswitch have a hard time understanding why it's so inconvenient. Id like to have both options myself but..
> 
> To me, the fix has always been right in front of the ones that feel the need to mod the amp. I'm not an amp tech by any means but i would just slap some velcro on the pedal and back of the amp. Zip tie the excess cable. Then you'd have the clicker there.
> 
> If a true mod is wanted. I'd take the switch out of the pedal and mount it on a small bracket. Hardwire the switch through the 1/4 jack hole and mount the whole assembly there.
> 
> The switch needed is there. I'd find a way to use it.


Yeah, but it'd just take a couple of small wires and the switch.... I mean where's the thing gonna Velcro to on the back of the head? How will it then slide in and out of its case each time I pack it away?


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Ooo, speaking of which I'll have to get a pic of the case sometime... I went a bit overkill... as i probably did with the post last night, it was late and I think I fell asleep halfway through woke up and probably repeated myself...


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Sorry anyway for been heavy...


----------



## Axis39

I can't remember if anyone has mentioned this, or if it's been discussed, but could you do like a grounding plug and stick it into the loop jack. Seems simple enough?

Just get a plug to fit and solder a wire from tip to ground. Done deal. Or is there something special about the footswitch (that would make no sense to me)?


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Axis39 said:


> I can't remember if anyone has mentioned this, or if it's been discussed, but could you do like a grounding plug and stick it into the loop jack. Seems simple enough?
> 
> Just get a plug to fit and solder a wire from tip to ground. Done deal. Or is there something special about the footswitch (that would make no sense to me)?



Aye, well, that has been mentioned, and I tried a TS jack, which didn't operate the loop, but rendered the push pull pot for the boost useless since it deactivates that when using the footswitch (another bright idea)

So if the TRS with the tip grounded works, that's great and all, but it's not switchable, and would have a foreign object sticking out of the jack socket....

but it will confirm that at least it's operated by grounding, and there isn't a relay in there doing the switching, which would make it even more a pain in the arse...

I'm still not sure whether even just having a plug in there deactivates the boost function also... in which case you might as well have the ftswitch plugged in anyway, which renders this line of thought redundant... maybe even the mod as a whole....

I'm hopeful, as is my tech guy, that is just a grounded connection that makes the switch, and we can internally ground the tip pin, and add a simple switch..... now it's just a matter of catching him when he's free from doing installations...


----------



## WellBurnTheSky

Kinda weird question for you guys, but here it goes: does the Master Volume on the Origin work if you plug directly into the FX Return ?

Here's the thing: I'm currently using my SV20H and DSL100 in a stereo setup. What I do is use the SV in 4CM, and splitting to stereo at the delay (that's at the very end of my FX chain) to go into both amps' FX Return jacks. The DSL being a more powerful amp, I use a volume box to bring down the DSL to the same volume as the SV.
So, I'd like an amp that has a volume control, so I can balance both amps easily. Also want something lighter, as carrying around the DSL, that is very heavy compared to the SV, just to use as a glorified power amp (and backup amp) doesn't make much sense, so I'd like something lighter and less powerful.
But I still want something with a power amp that's very similar to identical to the SV. Sure, I could get another SV, but if I can get away with spending half for the 2nd amp (whose preamp I'd almost never use), I'd very much appreciate that.
Since I'll be using my Palmer 2x12 with mid-80s G12T75s, which is less efficient than my EVH 212 with G12Hs, I was thinking about the Origin 50H, as it'd theoretically tick all the boxes. Or would you use either the DSL20H or the Origin 20H ?

So, what's your take on that ?


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

WellBurnTheSky said:


> Kinda weird question for you guys, but here it goes: does the Master Volume on the Origin work if you plug directly into the FX Return ?
> 
> Here's the thing: I'm currently using my SV20H and DSL100 in a stereo setup. What I do is use the SV in 4CM, and splitting to stereo at the delay (that's at the very end of my FX chain) to go into both amps' FX Return jacks. The DSL being a more powerful amp, I use a volume box to bring down the DSL to the same volume as the SV.
> So, I'd like an amp that has a volume control, so I can balance both amps easily. Also want something lighter, as carrying around the DSL, that is very heavy compared to the SV, just to use as a glorified power amp (and backup amp) doesn't make much sense, so I'd like something lighter and less powerful.
> But I still want something with a power amp that's very similar to identical to the SV. Sure, I could get another SV, but if I can get away with spending half for the 2nd amp (whose preamp I'd almost never use), I'd very much appreciate that.
> Since I'll be using my Palmer 2x12 with mid-80s G12T75s, which is less efficient than my EVH 212 with G12Hs, I was thinking about the Origin 50H, as it'd theoretically tick all the boxes. Or would you use either the DSL20H or the Origin 20H ?
> 
> So, what's your take on that ?



I think the master volume is indeed after the fx loop, not 100% because we cannot get any circuit diagrams from Marshall, point blank refuse to to give us them, but... from looking at where all the components sit and wires go, it looks like the fx loop is after V2, before the master volume, which is before the phase inverter.... well it would have to be wouldn't it anyway, or else you could turn the master down and what ever is plugged into the return would still come through the speaker....


----------



## WellBurnTheSky

Thanks ! Looks good then. Would you go for the 20 or 50, in my situation ?


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

WellBurnTheSky said:


> Thanks ! Looks good then. Would you go for the 20 or 50, in my situation ?



Well, I reckon the 20 would probably work for your purposes, and the price difference to the 50 watt new I put down to the difference in the transformer upgrade and a couple components and little extra mark up...
But that would work perfectly well for you too I reckon...

Remember the attenuation may match up too which would be handy wouldn't it... so

Sv20 is 20w and 5w

The Ori 20 is 20w, 5w, and 0.5w

The Ori 50 is 50w, 10w, and 3w? Or 1w?


----------



## WellBurnTheSky

Okay, thanks, makes sense !


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

WellBurnTheSky said:


> Okay, thanks, makes sense !



I think you can even pick the 20s up in the used market now for £250.... absolute bargain to be had!!


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Evening all, been working on a couple of little mods, I intend to pop a PPIMV mod on this, and a little switch for the fx loop on and off... 

Here's where I am with it, if anyone knows of anything that may help me please let me know.

- The current MV is PRE Phase Inverter, meaning to drive the Phase Inverter you must turn it quite a way up, to 7 or 8... 

- I've located the Plate Resistors (in the picture I mention Cathode, I meant Cathode Follower, is this correct?) And Capacitors, though I can't see where the 82k one connects to the cap, may find out when we flip the board over next week. 

- I think we've located the Grid resistors for the power tubes, though they are definitely not 220k, they appear to be either 56 ohm or 560 ohm. Which I thought odd? Anybody able to chime in there? 

- then there's the footswitch for the fx loop, when it is disconnected the loop defaults to off, which is a pain, so I want a switch on the back to switch it on and off... 

- Everything marked with an X is sounder point also where work is to be done.

https://www.instagram.com/p/B1zI_2lB0RP/?igshid=1ubv2wf2zc3h9


----------



## Thevenin

Jason Fieldhouseespk said:


> I think you can even pick the 20s up in the used market now for £250.... absolute bargain to be had!!


Or in the "Ebay Deals" area of this forum. Cough..cough..


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Thevenin said:


> Or in the "Ebay Deals" area of this forum. Cough..cough..


Take it your selling man? ;-) 

Fair play mate....


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Jason Fieldhouseespk said:


> Evening all, been working on a couple of little mods, I intend to pop a PPIMV mod on this, and a little switch for the fx loop on and off...
> 
> Here's where I am with it, if anyone knows of anything that may help me please let me know.
> 
> - The current MV is PRE Phase Inverter, meaning to drive the Phase Inverter you must turn it quite a way up, to 7 or 8...
> 
> - I've located the Plate Resistors (in the picture I mention Cathode, I meant Cathode Follower, is this correct?) And Capacitors, though I can't see where the 82k one connects to the cap, may find out when we flip the board over next week.
> 
> - I think we've located the Grid resistors for the power tubes, though they are definitely not 220k, they appear to be either 56 ohm or 560 ohm. Which I thought odd? Anybody able to chime in there?
> 
> - then there's the footswitch for the fx loop, when it is disconnected the loop defaults to off, which is a pain, so I want a switch on the back to switch it on and off...
> 
> - Everything marked with an X is sounder point also where work is to be done.
> 
> https://www.instagram.com/p/B1zI_2lB0RP/?igshid=1ubv2wf2zc3h9




OMG..... I'm an idiot.... they're sitting under my nose the whole time... look up the schematics for converting a Marshall 50w to a 20w amp, what's the big change in the power section (aside from the 18w transformer of course), the 220k resistors are replaced wiiitthh 100k... nestled inbetween the 2 EL34s are 2 guess what's.... so, ok, there they are I think. Would anyone be able to say if they would agree with this assessment? 

Also, I think I still have to find the right caps, as I think the capacitor the 100k resistors from the PI plates are connected to is the 47pf one, not the .022n ones.... or they may be .22n or .1uf.... every circuit is different, but I'm tracing it bit by bit... 

The boss will know more, he'll probably laugh at my little diagrams, XD


----------



## L Newman

Does anyone know how many Db the boost is?


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Bit like this.....

I think the type 3 is the only pure one....


----------



## L Newman

Jason Fieldhouseespk said:


> Bit like this.....
> 
> I think the type 3 is the only pure one....



Thanks. I'll watch this. But I was particularly interested to know what the db boost is on the pull boost in the 20C.


----------



## steveb63

L Newman said:


> Thanks. I'll watch this. But I was particularly interested to know what the db boost is on the pull boost in the 20C.



Looked in my owners manual, and all the usual suspects re: online dealers, no db numbers given on the boost? 

Even the manual is lacking as far as spec.s?

Good luck


----------



## L Newman

steveb63 said:


> Looked in my owners manual, and all the usual suspects re: online dealers, no db numbers given on the boost?
> 
> Even the manual is lacking as far as spec.s?
> 
> Good luck



The manual has some/most specs ... but not this one - the one I want.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

L Newman said:


> The manual has some/most specs ... but not this one - the one I want.


I have no means of measuring this or anything remotely close to give you an answer! But it is a tiny bit louder, but not bye very much!
Cheers Mitch


----------



## steveb63

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> I have no means of measuring this or anything remotely close to give you an answer! But it is a tiny bit louder, but not bye very much!
> Cheers Mitch



Well put Mitch.
More of a thicker, rather than louder sound.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

steveb63 said:


> Well put Mitch.
> More of a thicker, rather than louder sound.


I had put a clip up awhile back 
(tone test of the joyo ultimate drive) and I didn’t turn it on till near the end, it didn’t boost the volume level, but it surely fattened it up!
Cheers Mitch


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

I'll see about measuring the level of the boost too...


----------



## Biff Maloy

Looking around during lunch the other day i was browsing some Origin 20H reviews passing time when i saw these settings a reviewer used. I thought the eq sounded odd but kept them in mind to try. Presence 2 Master 8 Treble 10 Mid 0 Bass 10 Tilt 0 Preamp 4. I ran my AVRI 59 Stratocaster into this with an open back 1x12 with a Celestion Heritage G12M20. Amp on the mid power 3 watt setting in my jam cave. I've tweaked the Tilt and Presence settings just a little but this gets a punchy clean base tone with my Strat. Very bluesy and JTM rounded kind of tone. Expanded from there pushing it with my Soul Food. Some slap back Echo and a touch of Reverb through the loop was pretty nice. Still tweaking but this is an interesting concept in dialing this amp in.


----------



## Biff Maloy

I'm sold on the setup above with this amp. I've had it a good while now and have tried quite a few. I'm not saying this is grail tone but for the price of the head it's hard to fault it.

I went with the usual suspects to push the amp a little more. But, thinking Strat blues i got out some Fuzz pedals. My Throbak Fuzz Haze is really good and I'm sticking with it. Just twist the guitar volume a little bit and it disappears and the amp is clean again. 

I did try all this though my 1960AX just for reference. Played it many times in different setups and guitars and of course a completely different vibe. More rock oriented which is fine but is not where the Origin has been leaning to. Plus, my DSL20HR and 2525H more than cover that. For me it has been it's best treated as a blues amp. I'm careful not to push the 1x12 too much with just one 20 watt Greenback but it really is the best match i have for this amp and for my Stratocaster. I had tried this speaker and guitar combination before not long after i got the amp and it impressed me right off then. 

I have the Tilt around 1. There's a sweet spot right around there. Presence around 4 but everything else is like i said above.


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

It's still getting there, one circuit diageam, kinda... its kind of a diagram/layout.

As a few may know I've been trying to trace the circuit of my amp without a schematic, because one isn't in the public domain yet, so I could look into some of the modifications I'd like to make.

PPIMV type 3
Switch for the fx loop
And I now want to change out the LED, becauee somebody else did and now it looks cooler than my amp so I want in! :-D
I may look jnto the ao called 'metal mod' or settle for the one wire mod... but, this is where im at with the diagram.... All I can say about the gap between V2 and V3 is that it somehow goes from the 330k slope resistor, down to the bottom, around the power reduction section and back in below the Phase Invertor.... if somebody want to have a go at the rest, or the reduction section, good luck to ya!
Imma getting my mods done and out of it! 

https://www.instagram.com/p/B4DT7VDBeiV/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link


----------



## progrockabuse

Biff Maloy said:


> Looking around during lunch the other day i was browsing some Origin 20H reviews passing time when i saw these settings a reviewer used. I thought the eq sounded odd but kept them in mind to try. Presence 2 Master 8 Treble 10 Mid 0 Bass 10 Tilt 0 Preamp 4. I ran my AVRI 59 Stratocaster into this with an open back 1x12 with a Celestion Heritage G12M20. Amp on the mid power 3 watt setting in my jam cave. I've tweaked the Tilt and Presence settings just a little but this gets a punchy clean base tone with my Strat. Very bluesy and JTM rounded kind of tone. Expanded from there pushing it with my Soul Food. Some slap back Echo and a touch of Reverb through the loop was pretty nice. Still tweaking but this is an interesting concept in dialing this amp in.



Might try this when i have a chance, where are you setting the gain?


----------



## Biff Maloy

progrockabuse said:


> Might try this when i have a chance, where are you setting the gain?



I've been keeping it on 4.


----------



## Biff Maloy

I think i may have mentioned somewhere MIAB pedals (Xotic SL Drive) working well with the Origin. To be honest, I have never really got on with any of them and the ones i have had migrated to the back of my pedal collection unused. Just never got any to gell with any other Marshall amp i have even though my intention was to use them in place of amp drive for when i couldn't turn the amp up to drive on its own. My 20H seems to eat them up. 

I started with a Catalinbread DLS last night on the Super Bass setting with my Stratocaster. More tweaking to do but there's a good tone in there waiting to pop out. I stacked a Naga Viper in front and that was a good combination. My favorite, because it seemed easier to get right away, was my Catalinbread RAH. I've had this pedal several years now and it is still new. It seemed to go well with my Stratocaster or Les Paul regardless. Pushing this pedal further with either my Soul Food or Naga were equally as good just both were different. 

I'm glad I've found a use for these pedals. My Wife got them for me so even though I had been disappointed in them i didn't want to get rid of them. 

I'm all for the straight in tones on most Marshalls but i have a Gilmour side in my influences and do enjoy a good pedal base setup with a cranked but clean tube amp. It has taken me longer than expected to come around to the Origin living up to it's advertised base for pedals. I had been driving the heck out of it with loud volume but for me backing the amp back a bit and using these has been a much better hit.


----------



## Biff Maloy

Wampler Velvet Fuzz was quite entertaining last night. Channelled some Jimi and just good fun in general with a Stratocaster. 

I wish somebody would try the settings i posted above. Tell me whether or not I'm crazy. Doesn't have to be exact. I tweak here and there still. Backing the mids down so much goes against everything i would normally do but keeping that in the lower register along with cranked bass and treble, presence very conservative and the tilt set almost exclusive to the bass side has given me an impression of either a Bassman tone or JTM45. I'm back to using my 1960AX. This has made these MIAB pedals seamless with the amp's clean tone.


----------



## mad5066

Biff Maloy said:


> Wampler Velvet Fuzz was quite entertaining last night. Channelled some Jimi and just good fun in general with a Stratocaster.
> 
> I wish somebody would try the settings i posted above. Tell me whether or not I'm crazy. Doesn't have to be exact. I tweak here and there still. Backing the mids down so much goes against everything i would normally do but keeping that in the lower register along with cranked bass and treble, presence very conservative and the tilt set almost exclusive to the bass side has given me an impression of either a Bassman tone or JTM45. I'm back to using my 1960AX. This has made these MIAB pedals seamless with the amp's clean tone.



I've tried the settings you have posted. I actually liked them too. Granted, this is only in a bedroom setup but with just the guitar by itself it sounds quite good. I love my rat, ethos twe-1 and sl-drive with it. I did find the settings odd but actually works, maybe because the presence and tilt feature.


----------



## Biff Maloy

mad5066 said:


> I've tried the settings you have posted. I actually liked them too. Granted, this is only in a bedroom setup but with just the guitar by itself it sounds quite good. I love my rat, ethos twe-1 and sl-drive with it. I did find the settings odd but actually works, maybe because the presence and tilt feature.



Yeah. The amp just takes on a different flavor with these settings. I did fail to mention my tweaking from those also involves balancing the pedal I'm using so that it stays on and i can still get a clean tone.

Live in a band these settings would definetly change. Especially the mids but for me this is new blueprint for this amp. For one thing, foundation pedals like I've been rolling through it lately are a lot of times created and tuned to Fender amps which are scooped. A Marshall has mids so mids on mids kind of ruins the vibe these type pedals are made for. 

I'm liking this method better than my previous experiments.


----------



## progrockabuse

Biff Maloy said:


> Wampler Velvet Fuzz was quite entertaining last night. Channelled some Jimi and just good fun in general with a Stratocaster.
> 
> I wish somebody would try the settings i posted above. Tell me whether or not I'm crazy. Doesn't have to be exact. I tweak here and there still. Backing the mids down so much goes against everything i would normally do but keeping that in the lower register along with cranked bass and treble, presence very conservative and the tilt set almost exclusive to the bass side has given me an impression of either a Bassman tone or JTM45. I'm back to using my 1960AX. This has made these MIAB pedals seamless with the amp's clean tone.



Just tried these settings myself, you're not crazy, it really really works well. Definitely works well as a base tone for pedal use. Think you've stumbled on something bloody good.


----------



## Biff Maloy

progrockabuse said:


> Just tried these settings myself, you're not crazy, it really really works well. Definitely works well as a base tone for pedal use. Think you've stumbled on something bloody good.


Awesome. Vindication and I'm glad it's working for you.


----------



## eastsidecincy

Just got an Origin 20 guys!...Great Clean sound..used for 325$....can't believe how good it sounds....now to get back to jamming....


----------



## progrockabuse

It's definitely filled the void of a much-missed JTM45........for now!!!


----------



## Buzzard

progrockabuse said:


> It's definitely filled the void of a much-missed JTM45........for now!!!


How would you compare it to the jtm45? I'm wanted a jtm 45 but don't know if I want to deal with the issues that it would present. I would have thought the 0rigin 50 woild be closer to a jtm 45 than the 20?


----------



## Biff Maloy

I'm going to assume he's talking about the ballpark settings i posted above. With the amp set this way it gives off a JTM type of tone.


----------



## Axis39

Buzzard said:


> How would you compare it to the jtm45? I'm wanted a jtm 45 but don't know if I want to deal with the issues that it would present. I would have thought the 0rigin 50 woild be closer to a jtm 45 than the 20?



Wattage wise, the 20 is closer, yeah? 30 watt JTM45... But, maybe the fixed bias, as opposed to cathode bias, brings it closer to a JTM45?

All I know is that I wanted that kinda JTM45/early Plexi vibe and my 20C does it good enough for me!


----------



## eastsidecincy

I must have 20 other great sounding amps....but the Origin20 is the only one I want to play thru now....I can get that JTM45 tone out of it..but at lower volume...I want to put the best tubes in it..but hate to mess with the ways it jams now...


----------



## L Newman

Did anyone come up with a way to turn on / keep on the fx loop without using the footswitch yet?

Also, if anyone remembers my query about the boost dB, after using another boost to compare I've figured it's about 4-5dB.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

L Newman said:


> Did anyone come up with a way to turn on / keep on the fx loop without using the footswitch yet?
> 
> Also, if anyone remembers my query about the boost dB, after using another boost to compare I've figured it's about 4-5dB.


Sorry brother but I keep mine plugged in and when I power up it’s either on or off from the last way I had left it.
Cheers


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

L Newman said:


> Did anyone come up with a way to turn on / keep on the fx loop without using the footswitch yet?
> 
> Also, if anyone remembers my query about the boost dB, after using another boost to compare I've figured it's about 4-5dB.



Yeah, I'm still working on it, my tech said on Saturday that hes seeing light at the end of the tunnel with his jobs... :-/ sorry all! I'm trying... it won't take much when he gets to it...


----------



## L Newman

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> Sorry brother but I keep mine plugged in and when I power up it’s either on or off from the last way I had left it.
> Cheers


I was thinking of doing that and dropping the footswitch inside the cabinet. What I'm really aiming for is quick/efficient set up and breakdown on gigs. I've now got a NUX Cerberus multi pedal and, while I'm using the four cable method at the moment, I might even go to one in and one out. As you can see, I'm into minimalism and as few distractions as possible from focus on playing.


----------



## L Newman

Jason Fieldhouseespk said:


> Yeah, I'm still working on it, my tech said on Saturday that hes seeing light at the end of the tunnel with his jobs... :-/ sorry all! I'm trying... it won't take much when he gets to it...


I was also thinking, why wouldn't the FX loop always be on? With it plugged in or not as you choose?


----------



## ollie_or_something

I found a way of doing the Footswitch/effects loop bypass! It's not great and the decay on my reverb seems far too long which would suggest a resistor is needed (they usually have a 1k or something I think for the LED), but by putting a jack in the footswitch input you can get it to work - just put it in one click at a time until the loop works and the boost isn't affected.


----------



## ollie_or_something

If anyone could send gut shots of the footswitch that would be a great help (I don't have one, hence the need for a bypass)


----------



## scozz

L Newman said:


> I was also thinking, why wouldn't the FX loop always be on? With it plugged in or not as you choose?


Yeah I don’t get this either. I’ve got pedals in the loop so the loop is always on! I don’t have an Origin 20, but the same principle applies. I also don’t gig, not sure if that matters in any way?


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

ollie_or_something said:


> If anyone could send gut shots of the footswitch that would be a great help (I don't have one, hence the need for a bypass)


Welcome to the forum my brother


----------



## L Newman

ollie_or_something said:


> I found a way of doing the Footswitch/effects loop bypass! ...by putting a jack in the footswitch input you can get it to work - just put it in one click at a time until the loop works and the boost isn't affected.



I tried it. It worked. FX loop is now permanently on and boost push/pull on amp works.Turned the amp on and off a few times - no change. So, no foot switch required.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

L Newman said:


> I tried it. It worked. FX loop is now permanently on and boost push/pull on amp works.Turned the amp on and off a few times - no change. So, no foot switch required.


Great to hear brother, glad you got it going in your direction.
Cheers to the tones you pull out of it.
Mitch


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

ollie_or_something said:


> I found a way of doing the Footswitch/effects loop bypass! It's not great and the decay on my reverb seems far too long which would suggest a resistor is needed (they usually have a 1k or something I think for the LED), but by putting a jack in the footswitch input you can get it to work - just put it in one click at a time until the loop works and the boost isn't affected.



Yeah, that's something I've looked into before, you need a TRS with the tip soldered to sleeve. What I'm proposing is doing that internally and making it switchable... seems like that's not going to be a problem, except for my local tech been busy as f**k.

He's doing that, a train wreck type 3 PPIMV, and changing the power indicator to the red square one as somebody else has done.
And I'm gonna add the gold piping on the front.

Somewhere down the line I may upgrade the OT too.


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Origin 20 combo in the wild!
With a JVM too.
I was doing sound for them, I did tell him he can turn it up a bit more... 

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=3625508670856939&id=866143760126791


----------



## ollie_or_something

For those interested in the footswitch bypass: 
So after playing around with a multi-meter I worked out how the footswitch likely works. I've drawn a vague picture showing the input with and without the jack. Basically solder a 1k resistor (1/4W resistor is fine) across the tip and sleeve of a jack then insert it until the second click and you're pretty much good to go. The 1k value is a guess, it works without but it feels like the loop is a little overpowering without it. You could probably lower the amount of loop in the mix by lowering the resistor value too.
Note this could all be terribly wrong but it does work


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

ollie_or_something said:


> For those interested in the footswitch bypass:
> So after playing around with a multi-meter I worked out how the footswitch likely works. I've drawn a vague picture showing the input with and without the jack. Basically solder a 1k resistor (1/4W resistor is fine) across the tip and sleeve of a jack then insert it until the second click and you're pretty much good to go. The 1k value is a guess, it works without but it feels like the loop is a little overpowering without it. You could probably lower the amount of loop in the mix by lowering the resistor value too.
> Note this could all be terribly wrong but it does work
> View attachment 64633



Right, great work Ollie, thank you.

That's very similar to my observations and discussion I had with my friend Robert(elec engineer), who said he can sort that for me no problem, it wouldn't be his first time in 67 years.

And would you reckon I'd be able to put a switch in there to either ground the loop or not? 

Then I can have it on or off, with or without the ftswitch, boost on and off, with or without the ftswitch. without having an extra protruding jack plug with the potential to snap off, snap the board, damage components, ect ect...

Sound's like a plan, look fwd to it. :-D


----------



## ollie_or_something

Jason Fieldhouseespk said:


> Right, great work Ollie, thank you.
> 
> That's very similar to my observations and discussion I had with my friend Robert(elec engineer), who said he can sort that for me no problem, it wouldn't be his first time in 67 years.
> 
> And would you reckon I'd be able to put a switch in there to either ground the loop or not?
> 
> Then I can have it on or off, with or without the ftswitch, boost on and off, with or without the ftswitch. without having an extra protruding jack plug with the potential to snap off, snap the board, damage components, ect ect...
> 
> Sound's like a plan, look fwd to it. :-D



No worries, glad it helped!
I don't see why this wouldn't be possible, the only downside from what I observed is the jack has three little switches (I did my best to draw them) - when you plug a jack in they become open. The FX loop one is normally grounded and needs to not be directly grounded in order for the FX loop to be on. In other words you would probably have to twist the middle bit of the FS jack input to no longer be normally closed and this may damage it - it's quite hard to explain but hopefully makes more sense when you see the inside of the amp and plug something in to this input.


----------



## L Newman

L Newman said:


> I tried it. It worked. FX loop is now permanently on and boost push/pull on amp works.Turned the amp on and off a few times - no change. So, no foot switch required.


Nope. Just turned it on. Had to plug the footswitch back in. weirdly some effects worked and some didn't.


----------



## ollie_or_something

L Newman said:


> Nope. Just turned it on. Had to plug the footswitch back in. weirdly some effects worked and some didn't.


Interesting, did the jack move at all? With the 1k resistor I've had it set up for a week or so now and noticed no issues


----------



## L Newman

[QUOTE="ollie_or_something, post: 1902223, member: 57471" did the jack move at all? With the 1k resistor I've had it set up for a week or so now and noticed no issues[/QUOTE]

After "setting" it. I took the jack out. Hmm


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

L Newman said:


> [QUOTE="ollie_or_something, post: 1902223, member: 57471" did the jack move at all? With the 1k resistor I've had it set up for a week or so now and noticed no issues



After "setting" it. I took the jack out. Hmm[/QUOTE]

Yeah, but that's the problem isn't it? You plug it in, set it then when you remove the jack it defaults to off.

I think the point is to leave the jack plug in and don't move it.

I'm not keen on that idea, I'd like it all tucked away inside.


----------



## L Newman

Jason Fieldhouseespk said:


> After "setting" it. I took the jack out. Hmm


...Yeah, but that's the problem isn't it? You plug it in, set it then when you remove the jack it defaults to off.

I think the point is to leave the jack plug in and don't move it.

I'm not keen on that idea, I'd like it all tucked away inside.[/QUOTE]


Agree. 

I'm currently reverting to two cable method (ie. no FX loop) for simplicity and using boost on Cerberus to negate the need for the amp's boost (which adds colour anyway). So, I now have four (gain stages I suppose they are), the amp settings then from the NUX Cerberus boost, drive, distortion plus, of course, vol on guitars. This should see me right. find out next rehearsal in the new year - with new band.


----------



## Biff Maloy

I just picked up a used Lovepedal JTM. It's turning out to be a good combination with my 20H which i suspected it would be with using my R7 and 1960AX. Master volume on 7, pre 4, tilt 2 and everything else 4 to 6. Pedal is cranked at 8. Nasty but a good nasty.


----------



## ichocobo

Hi everyone! I've just opened my ORI20H and I'm curious because it has the sticker of the faulty speaker jack fix on it. Someone with a brand new head can tell me if theirs has the sticker on it or it has the back panel with the correct 8Ohm indicators painted directly?
I want to know if Thomann sold me a B-stock as new...

Killer tone anyway, I don't get the bad (express) reviews from some youtubers. Looks like you have to spend some time tinkering with knobs and throw a good overdrive at least to get all the juice from it, but definitely it's worth the time. I'm even getting better metal tones than with the orange dark terror...


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

ichocobo said:


> Hi everyone! I've just opened my ORI20H and I'm curious because it has the sticker of the faulty speaker jack fix on it. Someone with a brand new head can tell me if theirs has the sticker on it or it has the back panel with the correct 8Ohm indicators painted directly?
> I want to know if Thomann sold me a B-stock as new...
> 
> Killer tone anyway, I don't get the bad (express) reviews from some youtubers. Looks like you have to spend some time tinkering with knobs and throw a good overdrive at least to get all the juice from it, but definitely it's worth the time. I'm even getting better metal tones than with the orange dark terror...



You've looked into the speaker jack issue then?

Yeah the sticker is probably as good as your gonna get now, unfortunately I think the all encompassing advertising of the studio series, and its subsequent success, has put paid to the idea of more of these Origins been made... the bad press for all the niggles didn't help either!! :-(


----------



## ichocobo

I see... Well, nevermind, I´m really happy with this head as it can do everything the dark terror can't, so it was the perfect dual amp candidate. It won't surprise me at all than in a few years this amps will keep their value as rare budget "gems"...


----------



## RCM 800

Howdy everyone,
Picked up a 20h about a year ago. Its my current favorite amp. It comes alive at volumes that are not ear wrecking. It is very sensitive to the type of guitar used with it. With a LP type I can go from Page to Gibbons to Dicky and Dwayne just with pickup selection and attack. Plug a strat in and I get that neck pickup wood sound that I love from Hendrix. Plug in my tele and I can channel some Keef Richards and roll off the volume a little and Im twanging away with Merle Haggard. I mainly play thru a home made open back 1x12 with a 16ohm Hellatone 60. Ive played it a good bit thru my 1960BV. Also recently picked up a orange 1x12 with a V30. Sounds great out of all of them. 

With a soft hitting drummer Ive played out with it on the 5 watt setting. I set the EQ pretty flat with a little bump in mids. Gain dimed but no boost ( I have a GE7 on my board I use when I want boost). Volume usually around 3 or 4. Presence and Tilt in the middle. With these settings it is clean right on the edge of breakup but if I thwack the guitar it gives a nice distortion. If I boost it from the pedal board it moves into AC/DC territory. If I hit it with a TS9 it can go pretty heavy. I usually have a little slap from a delay going but dont really use many other effects much.

Ive been reading that these amps arent selling so well and that really saddens me cause I think they are the best value bang for buck in a guitar amp I have come across. I actually bought another a couple weeks ago to have as a backup and because if they do go the way of the dodo I want to make sure Im covered lol.


----------



## BanditPanda

Good to hear RCM and  to the Marshall Forum.
BP


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

RCM 800 said:


> Howdy everyone,
> Picked up a 20h about a year ago. Its my current favorite amp. It comes alive at volumes that are not ear wrecking. It is very sensitive to the type of guitar used with it. With a LP type I can go from Page to Gibbons to Dicky and Dwayne just with pickup selection and attack. Plug a strat in and I get that neck pickup wood sound that I love from Hendrix. Plug in my tele and I can channel some Keef Richards and roll off the volume a little and Im twanging away with Merle Haggard. I mainly play thru a home made open back 1x12 with a 16ohm Hellatone 60. Ive played it a good bit thru my 1960BV. Also recently picked up a orange 1x12 with a V30. Sounds great out of all of them.
> 
> With a soft hitting drummer Ive played out with it on the 5 watt setting. I set the EQ pretty flat with a little bump in mids. Gain dimed but no boost ( I have a GE7 on my board I use when I want boost). Volume usually around 3 or 4. Presence and Tilt in the middle. With these settings it is clean right on the edge of breakup but if I thwack the guitar it gives a nice distortion. If I boost it from the pedal board it moves into AC/DC territory. If I hit it with a TS9 it can go pretty heavy. I usually have a little slap from a delay going but dont really use many other effects much.
> 
> Ive been reading that these amps arent selling so well and that really saddens me cause I think they are the best value bang for buck in a guitar amp I have come across. I actually bought another a couple weeks ago to have as a backup and because if they do go the way of the dodo I want to make sure Im covered lol.


Glad you are digging your amp brother, I also bought a second one. Mine are the 50H and I am still really liking the tones that you can achieve from them.
And  To the forum.
Cheers Mitch


----------



## tce63

RCM 800 said:


> Howdy everyone,
> Picked up a 20h about a year ago. Its my current favorite amp. It comes alive at volumes that are not ear wrecking. It is very sensitive to the type of guitar used with it. With a LP type I can go from Page to Gibbons to Dicky and Dwayne just with pickup selection and attack. Plug a strat in and I get that neck pickup wood sound that I love from Hendrix. Plug in my tele and I can channel some Keef Richards and roll off the volume a little and Im twanging away with Merle Haggard. I mainly play thru a home made open back 1x12 with a 16ohm Hellatone 60. Ive played it a good bit thru my 1960BV. Also recently picked up a orange 1x12 with a V30. Sounds great out of all of them.
> 
> With a soft hitting drummer Ive played out with it on the 5 watt setting. I set the EQ pretty flat with a little bump in mids. Gain dimed but no boost ( I have a GE7 on my board I use when I want boost). Volume usually around 3 or 4. Presence and Tilt in the middle. With these settings it is clean right on the edge of breakup but if I thwack the guitar it gives a nice distortion. If I boost it from the pedal board it moves into AC/DC territory. If I hit it with a TS9 it can go pretty heavy. I usually have a little slap from a delay going but dont really use many other effects much.
> 
> Ive been reading that these amps arent selling so well and that really saddens me cause I think they are the best value bang for buck in a guitar amp I have come across. I actually bought another a couple weeks ago to have as a backup and because if they do go the way of the dodo I want to make sure Im covered lol.



Origin is great amps, and Welcome to the forum, a great place


----------



## Ufoscorpion

Definitely tempted for £249 new . Could be just the thing I want for vintage Marshall tones without spending a fortune . My EVH does the 70/80’s metal thing second to none so I’m covered there .


----------



## tce63

Ufoscorpion said:


> Definitely tempted for £249 new . Could be just the thing I want for vintage Marshall tones without spending a fortune . My EVH does the 70/80’s metal thing second to none so I’m covered there .



Origin is a great amp and for 249£ it is fantastic


----------



## KiwiDrew

Hey guys, new to the forum. I read through this whole thread (and ORI50 thread) over the last few nights and decided i had to go buy the ORI20 head. Got a real decent deal on a floor model. Can't wait to get it home and plug her in. 
Cheers Drew.


----------



## BftGibson

KiwiDrew said:


> Hey guys, new to the forum. I read through this whole thread (and ORI50 thread) over the last few nights and decided i had to go buy the ORI20 head. Got a real decent deal on a floor model. Can't wait to get it home and plug her in.
> Cheers Drew.


Welcome & Enjoy !!


----------



## tce63

KiwiDrew said:


> Hey guys, new to the forum. I read through this whole thread (and ORI50 thread) over the last few nights and decided i had to go buy the ORI20 head. Got a real decent deal on a floor model. Can't wait to get it home and plug her in.
> Cheers Drew.



Congrats and  to the forum


----------



## BanditPanda

KiwiDrew said:


> Hey guys, new to the forum. I read through this whole thread (and ORI50 thread) over the last few nights and decided i had to go buy the ORI20 head. Got a real decent deal on a floor model. Can't wait to get it home and plug her in.
> Cheers Drew.



Kiwi keep us informed as it plays out. 
BP


----------



## KiwiDrew

steveb63 said:


> My findings as well.[/QUOT



Thanks for the warm welcome guys. I'll definitely let Ya's know how it goes. I have an old 8412 Marshall cab I'm going to refurbish to match the new head. Cheers!


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

KiwiDrew said:


> Thanks for the warm welcome guys. I'll definitely let Ya's know how it goes. I have an old 8412 Marshall cab I'm going to refurbish to match the new head. Cheers!


Congratulations on your new amp.
And welcome to the forum.
Cheers Mitch


----------



## KiwiDrew

Was able to get her set up this morning and plugged in for 20 minutes or so. First impressions..... Love it, I'm pretty sure!?! Haha, I obviously need a lot more time with her to dial her in. Plugged it in to my 4x12 cab loaded with 2 v-30's and 2 g12h creambacks in x pattern. I loved what I heard in that short time. After getting a few hours on her, I'll starting messing around with different speaker and cabinet combos. Cheers!


----------



## KiwiDrew

Hey guys, I was going through my collection of used tubes this morning, looking for some that may work well in the OR20 head. I came across a quad of matched Mesa el34 power tubes, originally out of my royal Atlantic head. They are STR 448 tubes. I've tried a Google search and can only find info the STR 447 and 450's. Anybody have any clue what these might be? I'll definitely give them a shot either way! Thanks.


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

KiwiDrew said:


> Hey guys, new to the forum. I read through this whole thread (and ORI50 thread) over the last few nights and decided i had to go buy the ORI20 head. Got a real decent deal on a floor model. Can't wait to get it home and plug her in.
> Cheers Drew.


Congrats on the new purchase, enjoy, and as ever welcome, live life loud! XD \m/


----------



## KiwiDrew

Trying to upload some photos. Keeps saying they're too big. Any advise? I'm no good with computer/phone stuff. Cheers.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

KiwiDrew said:


> Trying to upload some photos. Keeps saying they're too big. Any advise? I'm no good with computer/phone stuff. Cheers.


I use post images. org on my phone works great for me because I am tech illiterate, ha ha 
Mitch


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

KiwiDrew said:


> Hey guys, I was going through my collection of used tubes this morning, looking for some that may work well in the OR20 head. I came across a quad of matched Mesa el34 power tubes, originally out of my royal Atlantic head. They are STR 448 tubes. I've tried a Google search and can only find info the STR 447 and 450's. Anybody have any clue what these might be? I'll definitely give them a shot either way! Thanks.


Welcome to the forum my new brother


----------



## KiwiDrew

15794809332818648633526899074953



__ KiwiDrew
__ Jan 19, 2020



Here she is with her new friends. She's made her self wire at home. Now to get some hours in her!





Here she is with her new mates. She's made her self quite at home!


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

KiwiDrew said:


> 15794809332818648633526899074953
> 
> 
> 
> __ KiwiDrew
> __ Jan 19, 2020
> 
> 
> 
> Here she is with her new friends. She's made her self wire at home. Now to get some hours in her!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here she is with her new mates. She's made her self quite at home!


Nice


----------



## jake_the_pake

Hi all,
Long time lurker here and very excited awaiting the arrival of my Origin 20 head (despite a whole drama from PMT....).

It's been a good while since I've had such a stripped back amp, so naturally I've bought a complement of pedals to go alongside it. 
I'm disappointed to see that the footswitch seems to have the cable hardwired into it - I was hoping to add the fsw cable to a snake, along with my amp lead and 2x effects loop cables, for ease of use but obviously can't if the pedal box is dangling off one end. Anyone had any luck with an alternative footswitch (assuming it's quite a basic set up with just the 2 functions)? 

Alternatively, does anyone use the method of having your FX loop pedals just sat on the amp, constantly turned on (and then just use the footswitch to turn the loop on/off)? Never done that kind of thing before but open to suggestions!


----------



## mad5066

If you're handy soldering you could mod it to have a jack so you're free to use any length stereo cable you'd like. You would also need a stereo jack and just wire it up keeping the same pin out.


----------



## scozz

KiwiDrew said:


> Hey guys, new to the forum. I read through this whole thread (and ORI50 thread) over the last few nights and decided i had to go buy the ORI20 head. Got a real decent deal on a floor model. Can't wait to get it home and plug her in.
> Cheers Drew.


Welcome to a great forum! Lots of great guys/gals here with a plethora of information about Marshall products and all gear in general!


----------



## scozz

jake_the_pake said:


> Hi all,
> Long time lurker here and very excited awaiting the arrival of my Origin 20 head (despite a whole drama from PMT....).
> 
> It's been a good while since I've had such a stripped back amp, so naturally I've bought a complement of pedals to go alongside it.
> I'm disappointed to see that the footswitch seems to have the cable hardwired into it - I was hoping to add the fsw cable to a snake, along with my amp lead and 2x effects loop cables, for ease of use but obviously can't if the pedal box is dangling off one end. Anyone had any luck with an alternative footswitch (assuming it's quite a basic set up with just the 2 functions)?
> 
> Alternatively, does anyone use the method of having your FX loop pedals just sat on the amp, constantly turned on (and then just use the footswitch to turn the loop on/off)? Never done that kind of thing before but open to suggestions!


Welcome!


----------



## Biff Maloy

jake_the_pake said:


> Alternatively, does anyone use the method of having your FX loop pedals just sat on the amp, constantly turned on (and then just use the footswitch to turn the loop on/off)? Never done that kind of thing before but open to suggestions!



I do something similar. I run a TC Electronic Hall of Fame and Flashback X4 Delay in the loop of the Origin or any of my amps that have a loop. I keep these pedals in a rack drawer that sits in a 3 space rack containing that and my power supply above the head. See my avatar picture. It's right above my 2525H. They are velcro'd in and the cables are George L and cut to length. The reverb hardly gets used and is only there if needed and i just set it and forget. The delay is MIDI controlled from my pedalboard. This all keeps the signal cables short. All this is contained in an adjustable rack that you can get from Lowe's or most hardware stores. Cheap and works. 

A lot of times on the Origin i use a Dunlop EP103 Echoplex out front. I think it fits the vibe of the amp although the X4 does sound great in the loop. Both methods work well so it's just preference.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

jake_the_pake said:


> Hi all,
> Long time lurker here and very excited awaiting the arrival of my Origin 20 head (despite a whole drama from PMT....).
> 
> It's been a good while since I've had such a stripped back amp, so naturally I've bought a complement of pedals to go alongside it.
> I'm disappointed to see that the footswitch seems to have the cable hardwired into it - I was hoping to add the fsw cable to a snake, along with my amp lead and 2x effects loop cables, for ease of use but obviously can't if the pedal box is dangling off one end. Anyone had any luck with an alternative footswitch (assuming it's quite a basic set up with just the 2 functions)?
> 
> Alternatively, does anyone use the method of having your FX loop pedals just sat on the amp, constantly turned on (and then just use the footswitch to turn the loop on/off)? Never done that kind of thing before but open to suggestions!


Welcome to the discussion of Origin amps , and to the forum, it has been a number of years since you joined, and I know I have not given you the


----------



## jake_the_pake

Ha yes it certainly as - hadn't realised actually how long! 2012 must have been my first 8080 valvestate era  
So anyone using anything but the footswitch that comes with the Origin with any success?


----------



## konrad gibson

Origin 20 C R7 Goldtop with Marshall Reflector Reverb in the loop.


----------



## KiwiDrew

Hey guys, finally finished up refurbishing my old 8412 cab to pair with the origin 20 head. Here's a couple before pics.












IMG_20200121_142627



__ KiwiDrew
__ Feb 24, 2020






Stripped her down












IMG_20200121_163307



__ KiwiDrew
__ Feb 24, 2020






Prep, primed and sprayed her with Raptor liner












IMG_20200212_154219_MP



__ KiwiDrew
__ Feb 24, 2020






Was thrilled to find out the original baffle was made out of plywood, I had planned on fabbing a new one. However, I did cut a new back panel out of Birch ply. New hardware, new vintage style grill cloth and steel side handles.












IMG_20200213_150220



__ KiwiDrew
__ Feb 24, 2020






I also made a fresh new wiring harness for her.

And the final product.












IMG_20200213_150909



__ KiwiDrew
__ Feb 24, 2020


----------



## KiwiDrew

KiwiDrew said:


> Hey guys, finally finished up refurbishing my old 8412 cab to pair with the origin 20 head. Here's a couple before pics.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IMG_20200121_142627
> 
> 
> 
> __ KiwiDrew
> __ Feb 24, 2020
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Stripped her down
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IMG_20200121_163307
> 
> 
> 
> __ KiwiDrew
> __ Feb 24, 2020
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Prep, primed and sprayed her with Raptor liner
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IMG_20200212_154219_MP
> 
> 
> 
> __ KiwiDrew
> __ Feb 24, 2020
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Was thrilled to find out the original baffle was made out of plywood, I had planned on fabbing a new one. However, I did cut a new back panel out of Birch ply. New hardware, new vintage style grill cloth and steel side handles.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IMG_20200213_150220
> 
> 
> 
> __ KiwiDrew
> __ Feb 24, 2020
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I also made a fresh new wiring harness for her.
> 
> And the final product.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IMG_20200213_150909
> 
> 
> 
> __ KiwiDrew
> __ Feb 24, 2020



Oh, and the gold badges make it sound way better


----------



## KiwiDrew

Here's a pic of the wiring harness I made and the speaker combo I finally settled on.












IMG_20200213_115656



__ KiwiDrew
__ Feb 24, 2020


----------



## KiwiDrew

jake_the_pake said:


> Hi all,
> Long time lurker here and very excited awaiting the arrival of my Origin 20 head (despite a whole drama from PMT....).
> 
> It's been a good while since I've had such a stripped back amp, so naturally I've bought a complement of pedals to go alongside it.
> I'm disappointed to see that the footswitch seems to have the cable hardwired into it - I was hoping to add the fsw cable to a snake, along with my amp lead and 2x effects loop cables, for ease of use but obviously can't if the pedal box is dangling off one end. Anyone had any luck with an alternative footswitch (assuming it's quite a basic set up with just the 2 functions)?
> 
> Alternatively, does anyone use the method of having your FX loop pedals just sat on the amp, constantly turned on (and then just use the footswitch to turn the loop on/off)? Never done that kind of thing before but open to suggestions!


----------



## KiwiDrew

Anyone running an eq through effects loop with any luck?


----------



## KiwiDrew

I run a Keely caverns reverb/delay through the loop, sitting on top of the amp. Works perfectly for me!


----------



## Papachu

KiwiDrew said:


> Anyone running an eq through effects loop with any luck?


Delay and reverb, no problem.

But since I don't want to mess with having something plugged into the footswitch jack to activate the loop, I've moved them to the front of the amp, since I'm getting most of my dirt from pedals anyway.


----------



## L Newman

I find the gain boost adds too much bottom end. 

What's the consensus on the best overdrive pedal for 20C? Ideally, transparent. Or, mid boost only.


----------



## KiwiDrew

L Newman said:


> I find the gain boost adds too much bottom end.
> 
> What's the consensus on the best overdrive pedal for 20C? Ideally, transparent. Or, mid boost only.



Of all my drive pedals, the lovepedal Kalamazoo takes the cake with the OR20.


----------



## Axis39

L Newman said:


> I find the gain boost adds too much bottom end.
> 
> What's the consensus on the best overdrive pedal for 20C? Ideally, transparent. Or, mid boost only.





KiwiDrew said:


> Of all my drive pedals, the lovepedal Kalamazoo takes the cake with the OR20.



Yeah, I haven't found one that doesn't sound good yet... Everything from Klones (Mosky Silver Horse), to Tube Screamers (LovePedal Valve Reamer) to a Rat (Mooer Black Secret) to Fuzzes (Band of Gypsys Mini, Keely Fuzz Head, etc) to Oddballs like my LovePedal Super Sic Tone (which does the Beck Page late 60's thing in spades)... Everything has sounded fantastic!


----------



## RCM 800

L Newman said:


> I find the gain boost adds too much bottom end.
> 
> What's the consensus on the best overdrive pedal for 20C? Ideally, transparent. Or, mid boost only.


I felt the same way about the boost. Ive tried TS9, GE7 (set flat with the volume boosted), Fulltone 3, and a shredmaster. They all bring a different flavor but work well.


----------



## BanditPanda

Axis39 said:


> Yeah, I haven't found one that doesn't sound good yet... Everything from Klones (Mosky Silver Horse), to Tube Screamers (LovePedal Valve Reamer) to a Rat (Mooer Black Secret) to Fuzzes (Band of Gypsys Mini, Keely Fuzz Head, etc) to Oddballs like my LovePedal Super Sic Tone (which does the Beck Page late 60's thing in spades)... Everything has sounded fantastic!




Thanks for the heads up on the LovePedal Super Sic Tone.
I'll have to research that one.
BP
p.s. Oh it's a fuzz pedal. The Mythos Chupacabra covers my needs. Thanks.


----------



## Biff Maloy

Speaking of Lovepedal, i bought a used JTM not too long ago just for my 20H. Worked very well. 

Like a few have mentioned though, every drive pedal I've run into it has sounded good. It really boils down to what you like.


----------



## Axis39

BanditPanda said:


> Thanks for the heads up on the LovePedal Super Sic Tone.
> I'll have to research that one.
> BP
> p.s. Oh it's a fuzz pedal. The Mythos Chupacabra covers my needs. Thanks.



What?!?!? You can get by with just one fuzz? 

You're a better man than I! 

I have a pile of Fuzzes. All different kinds, silicone, germanium, Fuzz Face, Octavia, Tonebender and on and on! Each has it's own thing. Each reaches into my soul in a different way! LOL

The Super Sic Tone does the Tonebender thing... somehow without being a Tonebender circuit. But, it does a bunch of other stuff too. I've become a serious fan of LovePedal.


----------



## L Newman

Axis39 ...
I'm a minimalist. I'd like to get by with just one pedal. I'm thinking maybe the Way Huge Saucy Box.


----------



## BanditPanda

Axis39 said:


> What?!?!? You can get by with just one fuzz?
> 
> You're a better man than I!
> 
> I have a pile of Fuzzes. All different kinds, silicone, germanium, Fuzz Face, Octavia, Tonebender and on and on! Each has it's own thing. Each reaches into my soul in a different way! LOL
> 
> The Super Sic Tone does the Tonebender thing... somehow without being a Tonebender circuit. But, it does a bunch of other stuff too. I've become a serious fan of LovePedal.



Lol. Yeah one pedal capable of fuzz is enuff for me.
Yes I do also appreciate the Lovepedal product. Currently on the farm is their Amp 11 and recently sold their Les Luis.
BP


----------



## RCM 800

I was messing around with the 5 watt setting last night. For giggles I dimed the master which i havent done on this amp before even though Ive had it for a year. Man these things are capable of much more distortion than I thought and it sounded really good. Rolling off the volumes cleans it up pretty nicely though there was some hum. I will try and make some sound samples soon. I think Im gonna try this with my rock band this weekend.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

RCM 800 said:


> I was messing around with the 5 watt setting last night. For giggles I dimed the master which i havent done on this amp before even though Ive had it for a year. Man these things are capable of much more distortion than I thought and it sounded really good. Rolling off the volumes cleans it up pretty nicely though there was some hum. I will try and make some sound samples soon. I think Im gonna try this with my rock band this weekend.


I have had mine for over a year and still haven’t tried this , good time to go ring my ears.


----------



## RCM 800

iPhone recordings but it gives you an idea of the distortion potential. No pedals, no boost, Gain and Master dimed. Mid boosted a little bass cut a little on the amp. Everything else pretty flat. LP copy with SH4 and SH2n. Not bedroom levels lol. First one is 5w, second is 20w.


----------



## RCM 800

forgot to mention speaker is Orange 1x12 with a V30


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

RCM 800 said:


> iPhone recordings but it gives you an idea of the distortion potential. No pedals, no boost, Gain and Master dimed. Mid boosted a little bass cut a little on the amp. Everything else pretty flat. LP copy with SH4 and SH2n. Not bedroom levels lol. First one is 5w, second is 20w.



Damm good tones right there brother, I did a couple of clips with mine but still didn’t dime it.
But I have quit using the amps boost, my clips where made in the mid power setting and I used the MXR10 band eq, and a Joyo ultimate drive set as a clean boost.
Your clips really rock bro, and your volume roll off to clean , really makes the amp shine.
Thanks for sharing your work!!
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

This is one of them.
Sorry for the thread derail ..


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## RCM 800

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> This is one of them.
> Sorry for the thread derail ..



Nice, reminds me of like early Metallica or Dio with Vivian.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

RCM 800 said:


> Nice, reminds me of like early Metallica or Dio with Vivian.


Thanks brother I for one feel very much like my attempts at my own music is getting comments from my friends here on the forum, that gives me confidence to move forward.
Thanks for the boost in confidence.
Mitch


----------



## Jasyyn

New to the forums, just got my origin 20h about 2 months ago. I love it!! Got a Boss OD-1x a couple weeks ago. I can't make that combo sound bad no matter how I turn the knobs. I currently have it going to a MC412A. I go back and forth with using all 4 speakers and switching to stereo mode using just 2 (because I'm considering downsizing the cab). 
This is the head I bought as a move to a more basic/traditional rig, I was using a POD HD500X before. I'm currently running the POD in the FX loop for eq, delay and reverb. Does anybody else do something like this? I want to move away from the POD, but it does so much (I like to set the rocker pedal to boost delay and reverb mix). I'm looking at the Keely Caverns pedal, but I have tons of options and presets now. Anybody else have a dilemma like this?


----------



## RCM 800

Hey welcome. Love my 20h so much I bought a second one. I pipe all my effects in the front but if your happy with what you have that's all that really matters.


----------



## Jasyyn

If I switch to pedals only, I'll experiment with that, but I expect to have a problem with the gain boost affecting the mix of delay and reverb. Who knows? I may not use the boost, I may not use the fx loop or footswitch either. I am looking to simplify...


----------



## Biff Maloy

I have the 20H. Dedicated pedals work better for me with any of my amps though. I have a Line 6 Helix I've tried 4 cable and using it like you with the effects solely in the loop. Pedals are more transparent to me. In a band mix it isn't as noticeable though. 

I tend to use pedals in the loop that have a MIDI control feature. For delay/echo I use a Flashback X4 Delay for example. This keeps me from having to use the extra 2 long cable runs back and forth from my pedalboard. I control it with a switch.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

RCM 800 said:


> Hey welcome. Love my 20h so much I bought a second one. I pipe all my effects in the front but if your happy with what you have that's all that really matters.


Ha ha I did the same thing with the 50’s and I do believe they rock hard.
Cheers


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Jasyyn said:


> New to the forums, just got my origin 20h about 2 months ago. I love it!! Got a Boss OD-1x a couple weeks ago. I can't make that combo sound bad no matter how I turn the knobs. I currently have it going to a MC412A. I go back and forth with using all 4 speakers and switching to stereo mode using just 2 (because I'm considering downsizing the cab).
> This is the head I bought as a move to a more basic/traditional rig, I was using a POD HD500X before. I'm currently running the POD in the FX loop for eq, delay and reverb. Does anybody else do something like this? I want to move away from the POD, but it does so much (I like to set the rocker pedal to boost delay and reverb mix). I'm looking at the Keely Caverns pedal, but I have tons of options and presets now. Anybody else have a dilemma like this?


Welcome to the forum, nice amps aren’t they ???
I like the punch they bring


----------



## primative

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> Great to hear brother, glad you got it going in your direction.
> Cheers to the tones you pull out of it.
> Mitch


All you need is a stereo jack adapter, the type that you would use for a 1/2" plug to 1/8" plug, male. Just plug it in the FS jack and your good to go.


----------



## 93studiolite

I just got my 20c yesterday. So far I’ve only been able to play it about an hour, but I’m liking what’s coming out of it. I’m using a Boss DS-1 in front of it for my humbucking guitars and a fuzz for my Strat. I’ve also only been able to use it in the LOW setting since the family is home.

I also have a DSL 1CR that I run through a 1x10 closed back cab. I really like the sounds of both of these amps.


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Ok.... Well, I need some help and tech advice now... 
So... further to my earlier posts regarding installing a PPIMV type 3, on my 20H. 

My tech has now closed for isolation, and retired for good (he is 80 yrs old), without ever doing any of the work I asked for, so I've taken it back and decided I may as well spend some of my isolation tinkering and try do it myself.... 

So, I've opened it up, flipped the board, and now I have a predicament..... 

Those traces don't go where I had thought they would.... 

(Pictures to come shortly)

If we take it from between the two power valve sockets, beneath the output tags that are at the top, are 2 solder points on their own, for the bias feed resistors, 100k, there's a gap and the other ends are the next 2 joints under those. 
Back up to the valve sockets, the smaller joint next to the bias resistors, and one over at the far end of the board, are for the grid leak resistors? 5.6k....

Now I expected those 2 to connect up going into pin 5 of each valve... but they now don't seem to. In fact if you follow the trace from the 5.6k resistors, the thin line goes along and down the board towards (I'ill get a fuller picture next time) the master volume insert... This would appear to be a PPIMV amp... :-O 

Would others tend to agree? 

This would mean that my prognosis of how that master is operating is all wrong, and the problem isn't the result of it's place in the circuit, but I am now wondering about the type of pot it's self... 

What do we think of the idea this pot could be linear taper instead of audio taper? 

Could it be that simple?

https://www.instagram.com/p/B-WJ5tbhkeC/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

https://www.instagram.com/p/B1zI_2lB0RP/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

https://www.instagram.com/p/B-WMIR-BHD1/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link


----------



## L Newman

I'm still hoping for a solution to keep the effects loop on without needing to use the footswitch. Any luck anyone?


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

L Newman said:


> I'm still hoping for a solution to keep the effects loop on without needing to use the footswitch. Any luck anyone?


I know, I'm sorry, I think it can still be done, and think I know how to go about it. If I didn't have so much going on at home I'd be able to spend some time with it, but its locked away in our practice room at the moment.... 

Struggling to get any real answers from any techs here or elsewhere, just spinning me the usual lines of 'don't bother with pcb amps, build your own...' err... no... -_- and 'the NFB loop with be impaired'... so the presence knob won't work so well, negligible.... 

I've just asked them if drawing a line on the front with a metallic gold marker pen will result in more Fender like cleans.... -_- 

I'm going to buy the parts, get a solding iron our and get to work sometime now, I'm sat at my laptop, waiting for the missus to get back from walking the pooch, so I'm ordering...


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

If I get any backlash from that I can always throw in that those new Studio, British made 20w amps have some shocking component choices, and are built just as cheaply, on the same type of machines, as the Origin series... But they had to pay their staff more. That'd right piss purists off..


----------



## Biff Maloy

Just found a new pedal combination i like with the 20H. 1959 Fender AVRI Stratocaster or my R7 Les Paul into a Whirlwind Gold Box (vintage spec mxr D+) into a Lovepedal JTM (stays on) into a Dunlop EP103 Echoplex. I'm using a Celestion Heritage G12M20 Greenback in an open back Marshall 1x12. Amp is at 20 watts set left to right: P3 M8 B6 M4 T6 Tilt0 Pre3. Nice bluesy tone. Strat is the best here. 

I've thought of selling the Origin when i get the SV20H. I don't think it's a totally fair comparison between them but i don't think i can let the Origin go. All of my amps are Marshalls but the Origin is the only one i have ever had success with using these MIAB pedals like this Lovepedal. Xotic SL Drive sounds great as well as the Catalinbread DLS and RAH and others i have. Fun amp to tinker with.


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Biff Maloy said:


> Just found a new pedal combination i like with the 20H. 1959 Fender AVRI Stratocaster or my R7 Les Paul into a Whirlwind Gold Box (vintage spec mxr D+) into a Lovepedal JTM (stays on) into a Dunlop EP103 Echoplex. I'm using a Celestion Heritage G12M20 Greenback in an open back Marshall 1x12. Amp is at 20 watts set left to right: P3 M8 B6 M4 T6 Tilt0 Pre3. Nice bluesy tone. Strat is the best here.
> 
> I've thought of selling the Origin when i get the SV20H. I don't think it's a totally fair comparison between them but i don't think i can let the Origin go. All of my amps are Marshalls but the Origin is the only one i have ever had success with using these MIAB pedals like this Lovepedal. Xotic SL Drive sounds great as well as the Catalinbread DLS and RAH and others i have. Fun amp to tinker with.


Well... I've counted that they've spent an extra £30 worth of caps maybe, but they've saved some pennies on the pots, and probably made the rest back with the lack of components compared to the Origin series.. but, same resistors, IC chips, transistors ect ect.... 
Honestly, in the end, I bet those studios were made just as cheaply as the Orgins and DSL lines... just in England, where the wages are considerably higher.... And they may have remembered to solder everything properly.


----------



## Biff Maloy

Jason Fieldhouseespk said:


> Well... I've counted that they've spent an extra £30 worth of caps maybe, but they've saved some pennies on the pots, and probably made the rest back with the lack of components compared to the Origin series.. but, same resistors, IC chips, transistors ect ect....
> Honestly, in the end, I bet those studios were made just as cheaply as the Orgins and DSL lines... just in England, where the wages are considerably higher.... And they may have remembered to solder everything properly.



Two different conversations. I have no idea why you felt the need to quote me. I get paid well with what i do for a living so if a product I'm interested in is overpriced i really don't give a shit. I was going to post my findings last night but i saw you were on the mod subject again and figured i might as well keep it to myself because nothing ever gets going conversation wise on this particular model without that footswitch or whatever is the latest that bothers you and some about this cheap little amp coming up. 

You come across as knowing a lot about components, traces or builds yet i find you not being able to figure out how to mod/connect a switch, that is already there in front of you, on the back of this amp odd. It's odd enough to me that the design actually produces the endless conversations that it has. I think what your doing is a complete waste of time and i feel bad for that poor 80 year old f..ker that had to listen to it. 

My last comment on the Origin. This has played out exactly like i thought it would. 

Mod away brother. Hope you figure it out.


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Biff Maloy said:


> Two different conversations. I have no idea why you felt the need to quote me. I get paid well with what i do for a living so if a product I'm interested in is overpriced i really don't give a shit. I was going to post my findings last night but i saw you were on the mod subject again and figured i might as well keep it to myself because nothing ever gets going conversation wise on this particular model without that footswitch or whatever is the latest that bothers you and some about this cheap little amp coming up.
> 
> You come across as knowing a lot about components, traces or builds yet i find you not being able to figure out how to mod/connect a switch, that is already there in front of you, on the back of this amp odd. It's odd enough to me that the design actually produces the endless conversations that it has. I think what your doing is a complete waste of time and i feel bad for that poor 80 year old f..ker that had to listen to it.
> 
> My last comment on the Origin. This has played out exactly like i thought it would.
> 
> Mod away brother. Hope you figure it out.


You ought to listen to him man... you've got to cut him off before you spend 80 years in the shop... bloody nice, knowledgeable bloke though, and a friend.

Listen, there isn't a button on the back to fix the fx loop issue... I'm just researching as much as I can to work it as others on here have asked questions I'm working on... 

Now, do I go into in depth study, yep, I scour and research like mad to work things out, but when I come up against things I cant figure out, I ask questions, and get shit all answers from the negatives trying to put me off doing anything, grief..... I just wanted to find answers for people on here to help out.
so, back to the drawing board, having to teach myself something else new then....

With regards to the costs of everything... this is all easily searchable... search for the components, weigh up the costs... labour is the biggest bill in any business.... look at the pots, you'll see them on the DSLs, look up those caps, about £1.90 a time, £30 to swap them. The PCB is a PCB... the resistors are the same... it's not like it's made of magic dust... 

With regards fitting the switch for the FX loop, I am confident I can do that. With regards the MV, I am confident I can do that, though I think it's already done, but the pot may be of a certain taper... Trying to confirm that... no luck...

I only quoted you with regards your decision to weigh the SV to the Origin, just putting across my thoughts on that. Though I think there's something to be said for the SV been a simpler design.

And glad to hear your enjoying your pedals with it man,  

Thanks for your thoughts


----------



## 93studiolite

Just purchased a 10” Greenback to put in my 20c. I like it as is, but I’m curious to see how it sounds with the greenback in it.


----------



## tce63

93studiolite said:


> Just purchased a 10” Greenback to put in my 20c. I like it as is, but I’m curious to see how it sounds with the greenback in it.



You will love it


----------



## 93studiolite

I’ve read a lot of good things about the greenbacks in these Origins. I’m sure I’ll enjoy it.


----------



## L Newman

Question about the FX Loop. I am using a simple pedal set up - OD, Reverb, Delay. Now, I like an efficient set up. So I'm thinking of a rechargeable board with all pedals on it, going into the amp input. One lead to the pedals, one to the amp. No pedal power cables. No footswitch fiddle.That is, ignoring the FX loop altogether. Does by passing it really make any difference? I mean, I've used and bypassed the FX loop on gigs and don't think I can tell the difference. Comments?


----------



## noxover

I just picked up one of these heads, got it because my Class 5 is so dark. I'm running it through a 12" Blackstar Cabinet with a Celestion Seventy. Even with the different power options it's still loud in the house. I've got new tubes coming because it's got some noise that I think are from the power tubes. I play a Les Paul and sometime a Tele, not a big pedals guy but am running it through a weber mini mass to get breakup at more civil levels since we're all home. Honestly I'm not in love with it yet.


----------



## Msharky67

noxover said:


> I just picked up one of these heads, got it because my Class 5 is so dark. I'm running it through a 12" Blackstar Cabinet with a Celestion Seventy. Even with the different power options it's still loud in the house. I've got new tubes coming because it's got some noise that I think are from the power tubes. I play a Les Paul and sometime a Tele, not a big pedals guy but am running it through a weber mini mass to get breakup at more civil levels since we're all home. Honestly I'm not in love with it yet.



I am curious how the amp responds with an attenuator! Do you think its still loud using the attenuator too?


----------



## noxover

The Weber is adjustable so it's more trying to find the sweet spot. I think I'll get there, and it's definitely brighter than the Class 5, it's just the Class 5 broke up nicely a little above 1/2 volume. I've never been a fan of master volume amps, played with a guy who had one installed in a late 70s 50 Watt Head and that amp was never the same. More experimenting needed with this one.


----------



## jeffb

I don't find the O20 reacts to an attenuator well- at least my RockCrusher. It gets very dull/bland.

I also don't find it sounds very good on the medium or low power settings. I went through gobs of tubes, speakers, and trying different combos of speakers for 8 or 16 ohms., boost on/boost off, Run as a pedal platform for MIAB pedals. No workie.

I barely play mine anymore, except when I can crank it up in full power, which sadly defeats the purpose of why I bought it. I'm thinking of picking up another Orange. My OR15s sounded fantastic in starved voltage and low volumes and are very dynamic in feel. O20 feels and sounds like cardboard, same same. So disappointing.

O20 Sounds absolutely brilliant though all jacked up. If I could run it like that day and night, I'd not complain a wink.


----------



## noxover

Cardboard is a good description, hope I won't end up there. When I was playing in the 80s, I had a Ampeg V4 and a 4-12 Cabinet, SG Special and Teles, used an old Altair Attenuator to tame it, that thing was so versatile. I had VT-40 for a while but way to loud for home use. I've got one of the Monoprice 5-watts that my kids bought me. That thing sounds great through the 12", so if I can't get the 20 to work, I may sell it and move up to their 15 watt just to have a little more than a single volume and tone control.


----------



## jeffb

noxover said:


> Cardboard is a good description, hope I won't end up there.



I think these amps respond much better to heavy magnet speakers at low volume (well, all H magnet speakers seem better at low volume IME compared to M magnets). But Moreso than other Marshalls I think the Origins do. I've got an extremely well broken in V30 sitting around and while I can't gel with the V30 sound in my old age, the Origin seems to like it better than my G12Ms.

You might wish to grab a H30 of some sort- Creamback, 70th Anniversary, Heritage series 55hz, etc. IF I were to build a dedicated rig out of the Origin, I'd go with the 55hz H30s.


----------



## noxover

Yeah, not sure I want to start swapping speakers and I like the 5-watt through the seventy. I've heard the 5-watt is basically a Laney cub. I also like the Class 5, but it's basically a one trick pony, I was just hoping the Origin 20 would be a bit more versatile. Oh well, first world quarantine problems, could be a lot worse.


----------



## noxover

Ok, new tubes, JJs in the preamp and a set of Electro-Harmonix NOS power. Much quieter, sounds better I suppose and running it through a carls attenuator is better than the Weber but.. still not impressed. I think it's going back on Reverb. Not that it sounds bad, it just doesn't seem to have any character. I'm playing my R8 through it with a set of Rewind PAF-1S. Damn, I was hoping to fall in love with this thing.


----------



## jeffb

noxover said:


> Ok, new tubes, JJs in the preamp and a set of Electro-Harmonix NOS power. Much quieter, sounds better I suppose and running it through a carls attenuator is better than the Weber but.. still not impressed. I think it's going back on Reverb. Not that it sounds bad, it just doesn't seem to have any character. I'm playing my R8 through it with a set of Rewind PAF-1S. Damn, I was hoping to fall in love with this thing.



Sorry to hear that. But I get it. I was jerking around with mine on Sunday with the JJ E34Ls, various preamp tubes and my 335S (coincidentally-loaded with a slightly overwound T top from James @ Rewind ) and I couldn't get mine in the zone either- Until I jacked up to full power, cranked the master to 3 oclock, and put the gain and boost on around 2 oclock. For my tastes the amp needs to run flat out and pushing speakers. It's not a great bedroom/living room/Don't piss off the wife and kids amp


----------



## rolijen

Noxover, are you cranking the master up to 6 or higher? Then use Gain for volume. It works backward from most MV amps. Without the master cranked, these amps sound bad.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

noxover said:


> Ok, new tubes, JJs in the preamp and a set of Electro-Harmonix NOS power. Much quieter, sounds better I suppose and running it through a carls attenuator is better than the Weber but.. still not impressed. I think it's going back on Reverb. Not that it sounds bad, it just doesn't seem to have any character. I'm playing my R8 through it with a set of Rewind PAF-1S. Damn, I was hoping to fall in love with this thing.


That is a bummer, I concur with JeffB’s post if you are only playing through the Origin on it’s own, you have to get it to paint peeling volumes, but I have been running mine out of the Dsl40c’s FX send into the front of the Origin, and can now play it at lower volume.
But it slays when you can open it up. mine are the 50H’s by the way.
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## noxover

rolijen said:


> Noxover, are you cranking the master up to 6 or higher? Then use Gain for volume. It works backward from most MV amps. Without the master cranked, these amps sound bad.


Yes, Master past 6, etc. tried it multiple ways. Like I said, it doesn't sound bad and I can get passable sounds out of it. It's just not what I was hoping for. I can get satisfying crunch out of the Class 5 if I crank it. It's not that it's bad, it just doesn't blow me away.


----------



## scozz

noxover said:


> Ok, new tubes, JJs in the preamp and a set of Electro-Harmonix NOS power. Much quieter, sounds better I suppose and running it through a carls attenuator is better than the Weber but.. still not impressed......



What is 'carls attenuator'?


----------



## tce63

scozz said:


> What is 'carls attenuator'?



I think it is this

https://carlscustomguitars.com/Speaker-Soak-Power-Tube-Attenuators_c6.htm

TC


----------



## scozz

tce63 said:


> I think it is this
> 
> https://carlscustomguitars.com/Speaker-Soak-Power-Tube-Attenuators_c6.htm
> 
> TC


Thanks TC!


----------



## noxover

scozz said:


> Thanks TC!


Yep, that's it.


----------



## KiwiDrew

Jasyyn said:


> New to the forums, just got my origin 20h about 2 months ago. I love it!! Got a Boss OD-1x a couple weeks ago. I can't make that combo sound bad no matter how I turn the knobs. I currently have it going to a MC412A. I go back and forth with using all 4 speakers and switching to stereo mode using just 2 (because I'm considering downsizing the cab).
> This is the head I bought as a move to a more basic/traditional rig, I was using a POD HD500X before. I'm currently running the POD in the FX loop for eq, delay and reverb. Does anybody else do something like this? I want to move away from the POD, but it does so much (I like to set the rocker pedal to boost delay and reverb mix). I'm looking at the Keely Caverns pedal, but I have tons of options and presets now. Anybody else have a dilemma like this?


That's exactly what I use, and it works perfectly for me. Rock on brother?


----------



## ST035

Hi to all  I am in a dilemma - I have been saving up money, and I finally have enough cash to buy the proper amp... my current budget puts me between Marshall DSL 5 CR and Marshall Origin 20 combo. At the moment, I play only at my bedroom but maybe if find some guys maybe we could jam or something.

I love the sound of a natural mild overdrive, which could then be boosted (for more sustain) with SD-1 or Dod-250. Basically, I am after the early Yngwie Malmsteen tone, you know - not very heavy or dirty but singing.

I've seen countless videos on YT and demos of both DSL 5 cr and Origin 20 - and nobody tried doing the following, regarding Origin 20, cranking the gain and the master and then adding an overdrive pedal.

My question is - can Origin 20 produce reasonable crunch (with gain and master on full) on low-mid mode? 

I know this amp takes pedals well, that's why I am considering it.

I could go and buy DSL 5 Cr and then use its Ultra Gain channel (set to 9 o'clock let's say) and then boost it with a pedal, but one guy who did this -didn't get very good results

thanks


----------



## RCM 800

ST035 said:


> Hi to all  I am in a dilemma - I have been saving up money, and I finally have enough cash to buy the proper amp... my current budget puts me between Marshall DSL 5 CR and Marshall Origin 20 combo. At the moment, I play only at my bedroom but maybe if find some guys maybe we could jam or something.
> 
> I love the sound of a natural mild overdrive, which could then be boosted (for more sustain) with SD-1 or Dod-250. Basically, I am after the early Yngwie Malmsteen tone, you know - not very heavy or dirty but singing.
> 
> I've seen countless videos on YT and demos of both DSL 5 cr and Origin 20 - and nobody tried doing the following, regarding Origin 20, cranking the gain and the master and then adding an overdrive pedal.
> 
> My question is - can Origin 20 produce reasonable crunch (with gain and master on full) on low-mid mode?
> 
> I know this amp takes pedals well, that's why I am considering it.
> 
> I could go and buy DSL 5 Cr and then use its Ultra Gain channel (set to 9 o'clock let's say) and then boost it with a pedal, but one guy who did this -didn't get very good results
> 
> thanks


I posted a couple sound samples of mine with the gain and master dimed a few posts back. Mines the head and I was playing thru a 1x12 but I think it should be similar to the combo.
http://www.marshallforum.com/thread...-origin-20-thread.106789/page-14#post-1936222


----------



## mad5066

I think for you're purposes you'll like the dsl5cr better. I had an origin 20H and I no longer have it and it may be too loud for your purposes, you really have to crank it for the best tones - the power scaling in it is meh. The dsl5cr takes pedals well on the clean channel too.


----------



## Biff Maloy

ST035 said:


> Hi to all  I am in a dilemma - I have been saving up money, and I finally have enough cash to buy the proper amp... my current budget puts me between Marshall DSL 5 CR and Marshall Origin 20 combo. At the moment, I play only at my bedroom but maybe if find some guys maybe we could jam or something.
> 
> I love the sound of a natural mild overdrive, which could then be boosted (for more sustain) with SD-1 or Dod-250. Basically, I am after the early Yngwie Malmsteen tone, you know - not very heavy or dirty but singing.
> 
> I've seen countless videos on YT and demos of both DSL 5 cr and Origin 20 - and nobody tried doing the following, regarding Origin 20, cranking the gain and the master and then adding an overdrive pedal.
> 
> My question is - can Origin 20 produce reasonable crunch (with gain and master on full) on low-mid mode?
> 
> I know this amp takes pedals well, that's why I am considering it.
> 
> I could go and buy DSL 5 Cr and then use its Ultra Gain channel (set to 9 o'clock let's say) and then boost it with a pedal, but one guy who did this -didn't get very good results
> 
> thanks



I have the 20H. It checks every box you asked. 

20 3 .5 watts covers your volume needs. 

It's made for boost pedals. It needs to be cranked to get it driving. Its not high gain. But you want that so it soaks up a pedal better. 

I also have the DSL20HR. Great amp also but that Rising Force album or at least that 80s era i remember is more Origin. 

Load up an HS Stratocaster, boost it, delay reverb in the loop.


----------



## ST035

thank you very much, this is exactly the answer I needed  thanks again


----------



## Biff Maloy

Clarify, Dimarzio HS pickups


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

ST035 said:


> Hi to all  I am in a dilemma - I have been saving up money, and I finally have enough cash to buy the proper amp... my current budget puts me between Marshall DSL 5 CR and Marshall Origin 20 combo. At the moment, I play only at my bedroom but maybe if find some guys maybe we could jam or something.
> 
> I love the sound of a natural mild overdrive, which could then be boosted (for more sustain) with SD-1 or Dod-250. Basically, I am after the early Yngwie Malmsteen tone, you know - not very heavy or dirty but singing.
> 
> I've seen countless videos on YT and demos of both DSL 5 cr and Origin 20 - and nobody tried doing the following, regarding Origin 20, cranking the gain and the master and then adding an overdrive pedal.
> 
> My question is - can Origin 20 produce reasonable crunch (with gain and master on full) on low-mid mode?
> 
> I know this amp takes pedals well, that's why I am considering it.
> 
> I could go and buy DSL 5 Cr and then use its Ultra Gain channel (set to 9 o'clock let's say) and then boost it with a pedal, but one guy who did this -didn't get very good results
> 
> thanks


Welcome to the forum and yes you can


----------



## ST035

thanks Mitch, thanks Bill (yeah, I know, I already have hs-3s in the neck and bridge of my Strat)


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Wow, I just got my Origin 20 today. Amazing price $300 for a open box but never used. I am really impressed. I like to play clean a-lot and I lost myself for a full hour after I plugged in to this wonderful amp. Exactly what I was hoping for. I ordered some 6CA7 tubes, but what is in it sounds great already. Really poweful and the headroom is great. I just think for the price these things are an amazing value. I also have a DSL1H (vietnam) and I like that a great deal, but this thing is completely different. I can't wait for the neighbors to go to work so I can stretch this bad boys legs a bit. I can just hear it wants to be at 11.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

KiwiDrew said:


> That's exactly what I use, and it works perfectly for me. Rock on brother?


I have one of those coming as well. How does it work for you? I find this Origin 20 really would require an attenuator. I have the F/X loop style but I wanted to try the proper type. I am a bit worried on how these things work and if they are hard on the tubes or the OT. Carl's speaker soak is loads less than other brands, but I suppose he has less overhead there too. I am giddy with excitement as I have yet another valve amp. You really can never have too many. They all are so different. And so far so good. I dig this beast. Much bigger than I expected! And I think it is looking at me, it is intimidating.


----------



## Buzzard

An origin 20 large and intimidating lol. Sorry but you may have wandered into the wrong forum. If you walked into my amp room you’d be curled up in the corner sucking on your thumb. Welcome. You may be younger than most here.


----------



## Biff Maloy

Congrats on the Origin. 

Why do you need an attenuator? It attenuates down to .5 watt on its own.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Buzzard said:


> An origin 20 large and intimidating lol. Sorry but you may have wandered into the wrong forum. If you walked into my amp room you’d be curled up in the corner sucking on your thumb. Welcome. You may be younger than most here.


45 and no i was being coy


----------



## Buzzard

oh ok lol !


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> 45 and no i was being coy


Welcome to the forum and congratulations on your new amp.
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Biff Maloy said:


> Congrats on the Origin.
> 
> Why do you need an attenuator? It attenuates down to .5 watt on its own.


I want to see how the power tubes sound wide open without going more deaf than I am. I dunno. Just want to hear it at 20w with the attenuator and without. To see if I can get that wonderful output tube crunch.


----------



## RCM 800

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> Wow, I just got my Origin 20 today. Amazing price $300 for a open box but never used. I am really impressed. I like to play clean a-lot and I lost myself for a full hour after I plugged in to this wonderful amp. Exactly what I was hoping for. I ordered some 6CA7 tubes, but what is in it sounds great already. Really poweful and the headroom is great. I just think for the price these things are an amazing value. I also have a DSL1H (vietnam) and I like that a great deal, but this thing is completely different. I can't wait for the neighbors to go to work so I can stretch this bad boys legs a bit. I can just hear it wants to be at 11.


grats man, I think these amps are a terrific bargain. Liked mine so much I bought a second one.


----------



## tce63

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> Wow, I just got my Origin 20 today. Amazing price $300 for a open box but never used. I am really impressed. I like to play clean a-lot and I lost myself for a full hour after I plugged in to this wonderful amp. Exactly what I was hoping for. I ordered some 6CA7 tubes, but what is in it sounds great already. Really poweful and the headroom is great. I just think for the price these things are an amazing value. I also have a DSL1H (vietnam) and I like that a great deal, but this thing is completely different. I can't wait for the neighbors to go to work so I can stretch this bad boys legs a bit. I can just hear it wants to be at 11.



HNAD, Origin are great amps and  to the forum.

Cheers


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

RCM 800 said:


> grats man, I think these amps are a terrific bargain. Liked mine so much I bought a second one.


So did I Ha Ha
Cheers


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

tce63 said:


> HNAD, Origin are great amps and  to the forum.
> 
> Cheers


Thanks! Yea I dig this thing. I am a non traditional player. I finger pick and do oddball stuff. But this amp is a perfect addition to my stable. Very good at volume with my style. It really is like another instrument. You can kinda ride it. I dig it. I love my DSL1h too, but It is way way different. For my original work this amp is perfect. Heh (original) I just am dumbfounded I got mine just over 300$ basically new in the box with the speaker jack fix already done. Marmalade USA was the seller on Amazon. Took 4 days to get to me and it was just 319$ I am glad I got a EL34 amp again. There just isn't any substitute for the big glass. But I did order some EH 6CA7 tubes because they were like 29$ for a pair. Sounded really cheap so I thought I would try that type. Some people really dig them in these amps, but I found the stock tubes half way decent. I am usually not a JJ man, but in the V1 of this it was fine. I had a Brimar tho and since rolled that in to V1 left the Shaugang in V2 and put a Tung-Sol in the V3 And I am not sure about the Tung-Sol in the V3 just dunno yet. A NOS Tung-Sol that is. Anyone have any tubes in groups that they like in this amp? Maybe its been answered, but if not I would be curious what people have liked for rolling tubes in this. I just like to have tons of tubes and change them in and out because I am addicted. heh. I was also wondering where do you guys go to buy and sell amps? Reverb? Because I have this DSL1h and I dig it but I really need the 20 now. The 1 is quite loud but I think I need to get a bigger one. I got it on Amazon for a ridiculous price. They had it listed as a DSL1CR combo for 209$ Used, Like new. Ok cool. I bought it and when it came it was just the head. I was like hmmmm. Ok screw it ill keep it. But just for giggles I called Amazon and kinda half complained and they gave me a 50$ credit! So I got it for 160$ Crazy. I put some old glass in it and yea I was thinking of selling it. Just dunno what is the best place to list it. I was going to ask like 200$ With the old glass included. Box and everything it came with.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> So did I Ha Ha
> Cheers


Yea, I was just on Amazon and they have a Amazon Warehouse Origin 20 Like new for 313$ now. I should pull the trigger for my other guitar player. He does not have a valve amp. Yea he is one of those guys. So the tubes do what? Isn't solid state better man? ugh he just does not compute. My little Origin 20 will murder his 100W solid state. Well it does, I just rehearsed yesterday after I got this and it really wasn't even close for volume or tone. He really liked what he heard from mine, but he gets caught up in more watts = better. Ugh Lead guys, I'll tell ya. I am curious to see if we could find space with 2 of these amps. I think we could. I did a-lot of reading on this, but I found it really did not translate well to what it really does for ME. Basically people were saying the DSL can do Origin tone but not the other way around etc... I dunno I found this to be very pleasing to play on. I played a bunch of stuff at GC and really decided on this one or the 50 then. I already have the VOX and a 6V6 Fenderish amp and the DSL, so this rounded it all out for me. The one thing the reviews said I agree with is it makes a poor player sound even worse. Now that I agree with! I just found that people were basing stuff on, "well i wanna sound like this guy or in this band" I wanna sound like me. I don't care about replicating someones guitar tone. I am one of those guys that wants to find his own.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

tce63 said:


> HNAD, Origin are great amps and  to the forum.
> 
> Cheers


Thanks, I've been lurking for a while. I got good info on the DSL1h 16ohm only dilemma. And I got mine modded so it will do 16 or 8 now from someone on this forum. It was really good info I couldn't find anywhere else. And now that I have a couple of Marshall's I wanted to join up. Good info usually and I could talk about tubes and amps for days. I must say tho I am a little leary about using the Attenuator. I got one of those from Carl's custom guitars. It is not here yet. He says it wont hurt it. I dunno why I am scared ill torch the OT or something. I liked the middle setting but not the lower wattage setting. Maybe its the speakers I am using I dunno, but I didn't care for it. For me I either have to play pretty quiet or when we rehearse I can be as loud as needed. What I really am hoping for is that sound you can achieve when the amp is really working hard. Not just on the preamp side, but on the power tube side. I like that breakup on the big glass. I like to play somewhat clean for a good deal of my stuff, but its really not Fender clean its the touch sensitive breakup type stuff. I like that a-lot and last night we had a good time playing loud. It really is amazing how loud it gets for 20W. I have the Vox AC15 and I felt this was in a different league of loud. I think I coulda got the 50, but the 20 is plenty for the people I play with. What do you like for a single 12" with the Origin 20? Right now I have a 20 something year old Eminence that does sound pretty good. It was out of an old Blues Deluxe. I think it is similar to a 1258, but 50 watts instead of 75. Well broken in and I like the sound of it. I also have a twin 10" cab I built myself with 2 of the el-cheapo ten-30 celestions. I actually quite like how they sound, especially for the price. Built the whole thing for like 45$ 2 16ohm Ten-30s I got from Amazon warehouse for like 20 each and some 3/4 inch plywood my father had laying around. What I am worried about is in the past (mid 90s) I had some 2x12 and 4x12 cabs. peavy stuff and cheap minimum wage gear and I just could never get a good sound out of my 12's then. But that was then. I was looking at those 16 ohm Celestion Golds. Because I can get them for like 130-140$ now. They are supposed to be pretty good. Anyone got one or some?


----------



## Biff Maloy

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> He does not have a valve amp. Yea he is one of those guys. So the tubes do what? Isn't solid state better man? ugh he just does not compute. My little Origin 20 will murder his 100W solid state. Well it does, I just rehearsed yesterday after I got this and it really wasn't even close for volume or tone. He really liked what he heard from mine, but he gets caught up in more watts = better.



Reminds me of the jam i was invited to a couple years ago. Went to check it out up front. One guy was going to use some outdated megawatt modeling amp. He asked me about it and I told him he might have trouble being heard. He explained like your guy. The rest of us were on tube amps and i had my 2525H. We buried him. I later overheard him agitated and telling somebody that it was because all those tube amps sucked up all the electricity. Ha!


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Biff Maloy said:


> Reminds me of the jam i was invited to a couple years ago. Went to check it out up front. One guy was going to use some outdated megawatt modeling amp. He asked me about it and I told him he might have trouble being heard. He explained like your guy. The rest of us were on tube amps and i had my 2525H. We buried him. I later overheard him agitated and telling somebody that it was because all those tube amps sucked up all the electricity. Ha!


Oh that's classic. You stole his electricity from his amp!! HAHA Yea I don't get the Modeling guys. It just does not do it for me. Hell, 2 weeks ago I brought my Sawtooth 5w (6V6) and it was easily at amplitude with his 100w silly fender digital amp. His would get loud, but that little 5w would cut thru somehow. To me they sound like playing thru a hifi stereo reciever. Just no soul. I don't even like them for practise. Thats what the 1W and 5W are for. Yea it is funny tho, my guy has a big ole Digitech RP-300 going in the front of this Fender with 8 bazillion effects one over the other and its just a wall of un-refined ass sounding noise(plus pink floyd delay,of course) usually. He can't figure out why he sounds ok by himself, but it doesn't work in a rehearsal. I mean hes everywhere on the frequency. Can't be in a mix that way. Ah, the kid is really young and really talented for his age, he just needs to simplify a bit. It seems that every time we play together he says something like, man I love that tone, or that guitar you brought is killer. Well I usually use pretty inexpensive guitars that I just build up and put decent parts in and run a simple reveb, green pedal(sometimes) and a dyna comp clone. With the valve amps I have I can get just about any tone I am looking for with just simplicity. I have always liked how my Marshall amps that I have had and have are fun to play just plugging a guitar in the front and nothing else. I like that in an amp.


----------



## Kinkless Tetrode

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> What do you like for a single 12" with the Origin 20? Right now I have a 20 something year old Eminence that does sound pretty good. It was out of an old Blues Deluxe. I think it is similar to a 1258, but 50 watts instead of 75. Well broken in and I like the sound of it.



If you have a well broke in speaker that you like the sound of , there you go.

If you feel that you want to see if there's something British voiced out there that might work better with your amp then the sky's the limit.

Depending on how much you want to spend:

S(c)umback pre rola H and M clones (these come pre broke in)
Tone Tubby hemp cone
Creamback H and M
G12-65 Heritage
Vintage 30
Various V30 clones: WGS Veteran 30, CV75, Governor....
Warehouse ET65
Eminence Red Coat series


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Grote Tele



__ bradley Thomas Wilson
__ May 7, 2020



I just love this thing with my new Origin




For some reason the Alnico 2 pups in my Grote neck thru just love the Origin. My favorite Chinese guitar for sure. Sounds Les Paul like with the Origin. Nice and full. Wish I woulda got the purple one too.....


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Kinkless Tetrode said:


> If you have a well broke in speaker that you like the sound of , there you go.
> 
> If you feel that you want to see if there's something British out there that might work better with your amp then the sky's the limit.
> 
> Depending on how much you want to spend:
> 
> Sumback pre rola H and M clones (these come pre broke in)
> Tone Tubby hemp cone
> Creamback H and M
> G12-65 Heritage
> Vintage 30
> Various V30 clones: WGS Veteran 30, CV75, Governor....
> Warehouse ET65
> Eminence Red Coat series


I see a vintage 30 in a 10" for 46$, hmmm. I've heard thats decent. I have a 10" baffle I could use in my 12" hmmm As far as cost. Well I am not rich, but I like what I like no matter what the cost I usually get it. That goes for cheap too. heh. I use my ears not the price tag on stuff. I have heard the Creamback is good a few times too. I just kinda wanted to get into an Alnico, because I don't have one of those. Just for variety ya know. Have you heard a Celestion Gold? Because the 16 ohm is like 140$ and the 8 is 300$ so I mean I'd drop 140 no prob on a speaker. I just don't know anyone who has one, altho Ive heard its pretty decent. That first one is that scumback? or sumback? I like the pre broken in option. I really dig that


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## bradley Thomas Wilson

Kinkless Tetrode said:


> If you have a well broke in speaker that you like the sound of , there you go.
> 
> If you feel that you want to see if there's something British voiced out there that might work better with your amp then the sky's the limit.
> 
> Depending on how much you want to spend:
> 
> Sumback pre rola H and M clones (these come pre broke in)
> Tone Tubby hemp cone
> Creamback H and M
> G12-65 Heritage
> Vintage 30
> Various V30 clones: WGS Veteran 30, CV75, Governor....
> Warehouse ET65
> Eminence Red Coat series


Now, that Eminence 1258 that is considered American correct?


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

I mean, I built a twin 10" with those cheap Ten-30s and I think it sounds pretty darn good for 45$ cost. I actually was really pleased with that. Most folks seem to poo poo that speaker because its dirt cheap. I found it nice to my ear. AFTER I broke it in tho. At first yea it was pretty harsh.


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## Kinkless Tetrode

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> I see a vintage 30 in a 10" for 46$, hmmm. I've heard thats decent. I have a 10" baffle I could use in my 12" hmmm As far as cost. Well I am not rich, but I like what I like no matter what the cost I usually get it. That goes for cheap too. heh. I use my ears not the price tag on stuff. I have heard the Creamback is good a few times too. I just kinda wanted to get into an Alnico, because I don't have one of those. Just for variety ya know. Have you heard a Celestion Gold? Because the 16 ohm is like 140$ and the 8 is 300$ so I mean I'd drop 140 no prob on a speaker. I just don't know anyone who has one, altho Ive heard its pretty decent. That first one is that scumback? or sumback? I like the pre broken in option. I really dig that



Well yeah alnico is a great option. Alnico usually brings out more bell ringing chime. If the amp is bright it might be extra bright, though.

Is that the 10" Gold for $140?

It's Scumback. The also have an alnico called the Scuminco. 

I'd think most Eminence OEM in a Fender amp will be more American voiced.


----------



## Kinkless Tetrode

Probably the go to 12" speaker for quality/cost ratio is the ET65.


----------



## Kinkless Tetrode

Avatar speakers offers a pre broke in Vintage 30 at lower cost. They put a Hellatone 60 sticker over the Celestion sticker.


----------



## jeffb

I think If I was going to do the 1x12 thing for the 20w, I'd look at a 16 ohm G12H30 55hz (bass cone) first. Yeah it's expensive but I think EQ wise it should match up really well with the Origin- adding some lows, girth, and a little sustain and aggression to it to drag it a little closer to 1970. I'm debating on grabbing a couple 8 ohm myself to put into my 2x12. I'm thinking it will be instant ZZ Top's first Album/Zeppelin 2 kinda tonality.

If sticking with G12Ms, I'd probably go Creamback over Greenback in a 1x12, just for little extra low mids/low end the Creamback 65 has. For a 10" speaker in the combo, I'd definitely try the new creamback 10" first and see what happens.


----------



## Biff Maloy

I've used a Heritage G12H55hz with my 20H. I thought it sounded great myself with my Les Paul.


----------



## Rickfox

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> Thanks! Yea I dig this thing. I am a non traditional player. I finger pick and do oddball stuff. But this amp is a perfect addition to my stable. Very good at volume with my style. It really is like another instrument. You can kinda ride it. I dig it. I love my DSL1h too, but It is way way different. For my original work this amp is perfect. Heh (original) I just am dumbfounded I got mine just over 300$ basically new in the box with the speaker jack fix already done. Marmalade USA was the seller on Amazon. Took 4 days to get to me and it was just 319$ I am glad I got a EL34 amp again. There just isn't any substitute for the big glass. But I did order some EH 6CA7 tubes because they were like 29$ for a pair. Sounded really cheap so I thought I would try that type. Some people really dig them in these amps, but I found the stock tubes half way decent. I am usually not a JJ man, but in the V1 of this it was fine. I had a Brimar tho and since rolled that in to V1 left the Shaugang in V2 and put a Tung-Sol in the V3 And I am not sure about the Tung-Sol in the V3 just dunno yet. A NOS Tung-Sol that is. Anyone have any tubes in groups that they like in this amp? Maybe its been answered, but if not I would be curious what people have liked for rolling tubes in this. I just like to have tons of tubes and change them in and out because I am addicted. heh. I was also wondering where do you guys go to buy and sell amps? Reverb? Because I have this DSL1h and I dig it but I really need the 20 now. The 1 is quite loud but I think I need to get a bigger one. I got it on Amazon for a ridiculous price. They had it listed as a DSL1CR combo for 209$ Used, Like new. Ok cool. I bought it and when it came it was just the head. I was like hmmmm. Ok screw it ill keep it. But just for giggles I called Amazon and kinda half complained and they gave me a 50$ credit! So I got it for 160$ Crazy. I put some old glass in it and yea I was thinking of selling it. Just dunno what is the best place to list it. I was going to ask like 200$ With the old glass included. Box and everything it came with.


Hello! Since you brought it up, currently I have Mullard in V1, RFT in V2, and balanced Mullard in V3, all NOS. Oh, I put GE 6CA7's in aa well. They are old pull-outs from a p.a.
Old glass, what an amazing difference!!
Hope I don't sound too braggy!!


----------



## scozz

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> Yea, I was just on Amazon and they have a Amazon Warehouse Origin 20 Like new for 313$ now. I should pull the trigger for my other guitar player. He does not have a valve amp. Yea he is one of those guys. So the tubes do what? Isn't solid state better man? ugh he just does not compute. My little Origin 20 will murder his 100W solid state. Well it does, I just rehearsed yesterday after I got this and it really wasn't even close for volume or tone. He really liked what he heard from mine, but he gets caught up in more watts = better. Ugh Lead guys, I'll tell ya. I am curious to see if we could find space with 2 of these amps. I think we could. I did a-lot of reading on this, but I found it really did not translate well to what it really does for ME. Basically people were saying the DSL can do Origin tone but not the other way around etc... I dunno I found this to be very pleasing to play on. I played a bunch of stuff at GC and really decided on this one or the 50 then. I already have the VOX and a 6V6 Fenderish amp and the DSL, so this rounded it all out for me. The one thing the reviews said I agree with is it makes a poor player sound even worse. Now that I agree with! I just found that pdple were basing stuff on, "well i wanna sound like this guy or in this band" I wanna sound like me. I don't care about replicating someones guitar tone. I am one of those guys that wants to find his own.


You should give your friend a free one years subscription to The Marshall Forum.

What better place to learn about great tube amplifiers?!?!


----------



## Biff Maloy

I would like to add more of my thoughts on using Heritage Celestions and the 20H. Both versions i have were tested in an open back 1x12. Les Paul and a Stratocaster.

The 30 watt G12H55hz is always described as having more bass because of its base cone design but in all honesty the G12M20 feels like it has more. This is because the 20 compresses nicely when pushed whereas the 55 doesn't. It just holds its own and just gets more aggressive.

From a pure tone standpoint I prefer the 20. It so acts like an extension of the amp. It really is a great match with a vintage spec Stratocaster like my 59. Makes the 20H a respectable low cost blues rig and takes the amp up a notch to me. The problem is for single speaker duty it is a bit of a risk if pushing it too much. I tended to keep the amp fairly clean and use a pedal. Clean is really good though. You could get away with it in a reasonable 3 piece group with the volume loss associated with it but a busy loud band the added db's of the 55hz is definitely noticeable volume wise and will cut through better. The 55hz is safer with its 30 watt rating and with its added cut it has this is why i liked it more with my R7.

Both are great but i still would give the nod to the 20 for best all around for me. G12M20 (or 2) for blues/blues rock style, G12H55HZ for more rock/heavy rock/higher gain type of thing is the way i interpret them.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Kinkless Tetrode said:


> Well yeah alnico is a great option. Alnico usually brings out more bell ringing chime. If the amp is bright it might be extra bright, though.
> 
> Is that the 10" Gold for $140?
> 
> It's Scumback. The also have an alnico called the Scuminco.
> 
> I'd think most Eminence OEM in a Fender amp will be more American voiced.


Yea unfortunately it was the 10". Bummer there , woulda been a hell of a deal for a 12" gold I'd say


Biff Maloy said:


> I would like to add more of my thoughts on using Heritage Celestions and the 20H. Both versions i have were tested in an open back 1x12. Les Paul and a Stratocaster.
> 
> The 30 watt G12H55hz is always described as having more bass because of its base cone design but in all honesty the G12M20 feels like it has more. This is because the 20 compresses nicely when pushed whereas the 55 doesn't. It just holds its own and just gets more aggressive.
> 
> From a pure tone standpoint I prefer the 20. It so acts like an extension of the amp. It really is a great match with a vintage spec Stratocaster like my 59. Makes the 20H a respectable low cost blues rig and takes the amp up a notch to me. The problem is for single speaker duty it is a bit of a risk if pushing it too much. I tended to keep the amp fairly clean and use a pedal. Clean is really good though. You could get away with it in a reasonable 3 piece group with the volume loss associated with it but a busy loud band the added db's of the 55hz is definitely noticeable volume wise and will cut through better. The 55hz is safer with its 30 watt rating and with its added cut it has this is why i liked it more with my R7.
> 
> Both are great but i still would give the nod to the 20 for best all around for me. G12M20 (or 2) for blues/blues rock style, G12H55HZ for more rock/heavy rock/higher gain type of thing is the way i interpret them.


This is great feedback. I really am a gear junkie, but only in the last year have I had the means to get what I want. I got a decent promotion from just a production worker to a salary supervisor. And since then I have been on a spree of gear buying. I am surrounded by guitars and amps and its literally like heaven to me. I am kinda leaning towards that G12M20 X2. I am going to look but I bet if I buy them in 16 ohm they are cheaper. I like getting the 16ohm because I can wire them easily down to 2 at 8 or 4 at 16. And then I can run them single too on my 16 ohm only amps. I have a Weber Z matcher coming, but it is taking forever. Didn't really need it now, but I figured I would run in to a need for it eventually. Thanks all for the suggestions. And I would agree. I like the low wattage speakers at the edge. They do seem to come alive when driven right.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

scozz said:


> You should give your friend a free one years subscription to The Marshall Forum.
> 
> What better place to learn about great tube amplifiers?!?!


Yea, I just do not understand him. at 23 he is loaded with raw talent. But he can't do much other than string a guitar. So all of his guitars and gear need to be serviced(by me) constantly. So I'm like hey bro, why don't you learn how to do some of this work? Made me a way better player and it gets you a better understanding of your guitars and gear. I dunno, I am twice his age and things do not seem to translate well to that generation. He is a new age hippie. don't eat meat, can't have a leather strap, vegan etc... makes me Ill just listening to the diatribe of nonsense. It is funny tho, I loaned him a guitar and he said man I love that strap(Walker and Williams) I need to get one. I am like yea its decent quality leather for only 30$ or so. He's like oh well I can't use leather can I get it in fake leather? eek. He will figure out a Prius don't haul gear for nothing. Haha


Rickfox said:


> Hello! Since you brought it up, currently I have Mullard in V1, RFT in V2, and balanced Mullard in V3, all NOS. Oh, I put GE 6CA7's in aa well. They are old pull-outs from a p.a.
> Old glass, what an amazing difference!!
> Hope I don't sound too braggy!!


Yea that is killer. I love the old glass. I like the way you think there. I haven't tried the RFT, but I like the old glass Mullards for sure. The new ones just sound so so to my ears. I was really surprised how some of the old glass really can change a boring ho hum rig in to something useable. Such as my kinda vanilla Sawtooth tube 5. I put a black plate RCA from the 40s (6V6) in there and it just oozes cool tones. And the neat harmonics on the chords are just ethereal. I am very curious and can't wait to get my 6CA7's They are new glass, but I think I will try some old glass if I like the general flavor. I think I will tho. And not braggy at all. I have a grand in tubes just sitting in boxes easy. I like to get extra stuff I will need later in my life when I can get it cheaper. I have some NOS 7025 RCA I am going to try in the Origin 20 today. I only have 2, but I'll put a Brimar in the PI slot. I think, or hope that will sound as good as I think it will. Actually got them for cheap. They were never used. Tested in the 1500's. And they were about 25$ each. I have some Tesla E83CC tubes in my cart, but haven't pulled the trigger yet. They are the frame grid style. Has anyone here tried the JJE83CC Frame Grid tube? I want to see if they are as good as some other old glass frame grids, but jeez they are 25$ each. That's more than I like to spend for new glass.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Kinkless Tetrode said:


> Probably the go to 12" speaker for quality/cost ratio is the ET65.


I'll have to check that out. I like to kinda stockpile or hoard gear, so having extra stuff is what I do!! Looks like about 100$ for the 12" in that. I can handle that. 


Kinkless Tetrode said:


> Avatar speakers offers a pre broke in Vintage 30 at lower cost. They put a Hellatone 60 sticker over the Celestion sticker.


Nice, the breaking in I have found is super super important. Makes a hell of a difference for sure. It is probly why I like the old Fender 12" Eminence I have. I found it at the dump in a Blues Deluxe stripped cabinet. I am thinking about restoring it, but it would be pricey. Fun tho. I have a relative that works at the dump and I have 2 guitars that I just love that came from the dump. Someone threw away a 90s MIM fender player Strat that had some damage. The electronics were just jacked, but who cares? To throw away a guitar for that is insane. But my gain. hehe I also got a Marshall Guvnor pedal and a MXR black chorus from the dump and they both worked.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Kinkless Tetrode said:


> Avatar speakers offers a pre broke in Vintage 30 at lower cost. They put a Hellatone 60 sticker over the Celestion sticker.


I am liking that Avatar site. Right up my alley. Exactly what I am trolling for. nice I had never heard of it?!


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

I ordered my friend a Origin 20 just a few mins ago. I just couldn't let him pass on it for the price. Even tho I am paying I am just sick to death of his solid state nonsense. It really is a pain for me to try to fit in a mix with that wretched gear. I really dislike how his amplifiers sound. Hopefully now that he will have one in house he will come to appreciate the difference. I almost got him the 50, but I really like my 20 and how it sounds/reacts so I got that for him. He does however have one amp that isn't horrible for some things. He has a solid state Orange that is semi useable, but I never would have paid what he paid for it. It does have clean headroom for what it is, but jeez its bland like all other solid state. I was going to say too I have so many tubes (new glass) that I really don't need if anyone needs some El34's (JJ) or some of the chinese 12AX7's let me know. I'd give them away at basically shipping cost. I won't use a couple of flavors because to me they don't suit my style. And I have a large enough hoard I could get rid of a few. I have 4 of the EL34's JJ and at least 4 of the chinese ones I would basically gift away for shipping. If anyone could use that style.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Biff Maloy said:


> I've used a Heritage G12H55hz with my 20H. I thought it sounded great myself with my Les Paul.


My 12 year old is a new bass player. This speaker your talking about, that is a bass speaker? Because that would kill 2 birds with one stone. If I could use it for her bass too that would be slick. Yea, that's got me thinking. That may be the way to go. I do a good deal of clean and I LOVE the low end when I can get it. I play finger style a great deal and It is like playing bass notes with melody so that would suit my style well I think. And hey while I am thinking. While I am searching for a nice valve bass head for her, can she use a head of mine even tho its for guitar without damaging it? I mean I would think so, but I am really not sure. Probly wouldn't sound great but shes just learning.


----------



## Biff Maloy

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> My 12 year old is a new bass player. This speaker your talking about, that is a bass speaker? Because that would kill 2 birds with one stone. If I could use it for her bass too that would be slick. Yea, that's got me thinking. That may be the way to go. I do a good deal of clean and I LOVE the low end when I can get it. I play finger style a great deal and It is like playing bass notes with melody so that would suit my style well I think. And hey while I am thinking. While I am searching for a nice valve bass head for her, can she use a head of mine even tho its for guitar without damaging it? I mean I would think so, but I am really not sure. Probly wouldn't sound great but shes just learning.


A G12H55hz like the G12M20 is an old design. My understanding is it was created for bass but guitarists liked it and......some speaker experts may come fill in the blanks. 

Lot of experiments back then plus rock was growing louder, speakers were blowing and the race was on.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Biff Maloy said:


> A G12H55hz like the G12M20 is an old design. My understanding is it was created for bass but guitarists liked it and......some speaker experts may come fill in the blanks.
> 
> Lot of experiments back then plus rock was growing louder, speakers were blowing and the race was on.


I listened to some demos of it on youtube and some on that Avatar site. I must say I really liked it. I do tend to be a bit darker and I like to roll off the high end. MAinly because I usually am a rythm guy. I would really like to try it because the Origin is 20w and the speaker is rated at 20w so theoretically it should sing real good with the amp. I have a hunch it will. And really sub $200 is my price point. I don't mind spending a couple of hundred on a key piece of gear. I am just ultra curious on those Alnico variants. I have heard the blue in a Vox and I liked it. I really liked the Cream Alnico x2 in a AC30, But that would be 600$ for 2 speakers. Yeesh. And I am on a Marshall kick or have been for some time right now. I find the Marshall's to be very versatile and This is really the first time in my life I have had pretty good gear instead of garbage. So ya I really appreciate the help on the speakers. It really has me excited. I only got the Ten-30s cause they were like under 20$ each from amazon warehouse and I figured I could replace them later, however I dunno if they deserve the bad rap. They are way better than anything I had at 20 years old. I am just really curious also on letting my girl run her bass thru my little DSL or the 20, I know it'll make sound, but will it be overly hard on the amp? I mean I suppose at low volume it would be fine until I can source her a decent valve head for bass. I am very glad I finally signed up here instead of just lurking like a pervert in a van down by the river. heh


----------



## RCM 800

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> I am liking that Avatar site. Right up my alley. Exactly what I am trolling for. nice I had never heard of it?!


I have a hellatone 60 in a home built cab and a orange cab with a V30. I like them both but Ive been using V30s for 20 years and to me the V30 is just the way speakers are supposed to sound lol.


----------



## scozz

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> ......I am just really curious also on letting my girl run her bass thru my little DSL or the 20, I know it'll make sound, but will it be overly hard on the amp? I mean I suppose at low volume it would be fine until I can source her a decent valve head for bass. I am very glad I finally signed up here instead of just lurking like a pervert in a van down by the river. heh


You can get a really nice ss bass combo and bass head ,(that sound great), and cab for not a lot of $. Imo, ss bass rigs sound just as good as tube bass amps. Here’s some nice options from MF,....

https://www.musiciansfriend.com/bass-amplifiers/acoustic


----------



## Rickfox

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> Yea, I just do not understand him. at 23 he is loaded with raw talent. But he can't do much other than string a guitar. So all of his guitars and gear need to be serviced(by me) constantly. So I'm like hey bro, why don't you learn how to do some of this work? Made me a way better player and it gets you a better understanding of your guitars and gear. I dunno, I am twice his age and things do not seem to translate well to that generation. He is a new age hippie. don't eat meat, can't have a leather strap, vegan etc... makes me Ill just listening to the diatribe of nonsense. It is funny tho, I loaned him a guitar and he said man I love that strap(Walker and Williams) I need to get one. I am like yea its decent quality leather for only 30$ or so. He's like oh well I can't use leather can I get it in fake leather? eek. He will figure out a Prius don't haul gear for nothing. Haha
> 
> Yea that is killer. I love the old glass. I like the way you think there. I haven't tried the RFT, but I like the old glass Mullards for sure. The new ones just sound so so to my ears. I was really surprised how some of the old glass really can change a boring ho hum rig in to something useable. Such as my kinda vanilla Sawtooth tube 5. I put a black plate RCA from the 40s (6V6) in there and it just oozes cool tones. And the neat harmonics on the chords are just ethereal. I am very curious and can't wait to get my 6CA7's They are new glass, but I think I will try some old glass if I like the general flavor. I think I will tho. And not braggy at all. I have a grand in tubes just sitting in boxes easy. I like to get extra stuff I will need later in my life when I can get it cheaper. I have some NOS 7025 RCA I am going to try in the Origin 20 today. I only have 2, but I'll put a Brimar in the PI slot. I think, or hope that will sound as good as I think it will. Actually got them for cheap. They were never used. Tested in the 1500's. And they were about 25$ each. I have some Tesla E83CC tubes in my cart, but haven't pulled the trigger yet. They are the frame grid style. Has anyone here tried the JJE83CC Frame Grid tube? I want to see if they are as good as some other old glass frame grids, but jeez they are 25$ each. That's more than I like to spend for new glass.


 Hello again!! You might really want to try some RFT's. They seem to brraak up sooner and are very warm sounding. Very good for an overly bright amp. Some Telefunkens were really RFT's. Had a couple of them. Some of the tube sellers have them, but are relabeled. They are way less expensive than
NOS Mullards. Some fill a Super Lead with them, really kills the edgyness.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

scozz said:


> You can get a really nice ss bass combo and bass head ,(that sound great), and cab for not a lot of $. Imo, ss bass rigs sound just as good as tube bass amps. Here’s some nice options from MF,....
> 
> https://www.musiciansfriend.com/bass-amplifiers/acoustic


Nice, I really dig that some of them are wedged. Damn that isn't costly at all $200 for a 50w that should be all she needs for now. Certainly less costly than I thought for sure. I really really like the wedge so I can have the speaker pointed up at me. That's slick. Thanks man..


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

RCM 800 said:


> I have a hellatone 60 in a home built cab and a orange cab with a V30. I like them both but Ive been using V30s for 20 years and to me the V30 is just the way speakers are supposed to sound lol.


I love to build cabs. I am no expert at how they are supposed to be built. I just wing it. I have decent woodworking skills and kinda just eyeball what I want and make it. I am really happy with my 2x10. I am going to get one of those Hellatone's just for giggles. Right now I am on a single cab kick. I want to build the best 12" and 10" cab for a really nice speaker. I am thinking for the portability. I have a few gigs where I just play alone and I really hate carrying gear these days.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Rickfox said:


> Hello again!! You might really want to try some RFT's. They seem to brraak up sooner and are very warm sounding. Very good for an overly bright amp. Some Telefunkens were really RFT's. Had a couple of them. Some of the tube sellers have them, but are relabeled. They are way less expensive than
> NOS Mullards. Some fill a Super Lead with them, really kills the edgyness.


The Upscale audio guy has some of those that aren't ridiculous in price. I might give that a try. I really want to try the Frame grid new productions tho too. For some reason I have no problem spending a lot on old glass, but when it comes to new glass I am a cheap ass. I really like that suggestion tho it's not the first time someone has said RFT's are great for the bright amps. Now, you are just talking in V1, V2 right? or does that logic apply to the PI slot too? I guess what I am asking is does the PI tube have as much control over the tone as the other tubes? Or to what end?


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

And as a side, I haven't found a Tung-Sol I've liked in my 20h. I have about 10 12AX7,12AT7 in old glass Tung-Sol ( which I usually like) and none of them sound good in this Origin at all. I swap them up and put 2 Brimar 12AX7 in V1,V2 and its nice again. Oh well, The Tung-Sol does sound nice in my 6v6 stuff. I was also going to put it out there and ask. Has anyone used that Yellow Jacket converter for EL84's on this Origin? I was thinking I really dig the sound of some of those EL84's and It would reduce the headroom and volume, but I was curious if any of you have run those in the O20h? I have some outstanding EL84 tubes that I got from Upcale Audio that I use in the Monoprice 15w. Probly the best tubes I have. They are the Tunsgram El84 and man they are sweet tubes. Just outstanding. and really aren't that bad at 80$ each and they will last a lifetime. I love to experiment with stuff and Wanted to try some of the tube converters just to see what I can get out of it. I have a adapter for the DSL1h that I can use a 12SN7 as the output tube. Kinda neat because old glass in that type is cheap. I just wish I could find a higher gain version of that 12SN7 that is pinned the same or close with a Mu of at least 60-70. The 12SN7 is more like a 12AU7 for gain ... Jeez I ramble don't I my god.


----------



## Rickfox

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> The Upscale audio guy has some of those that aren't ridiculous in price. I might give that a try. I really want to try the Frame grid new productions tho too. For some reason I have no problem spending a lot on old glass, but when it comes to new glass I am a cheap ass. I really like that suggestion tho it's not the first time someone has said RFT's are great for the bright amps. Now, you are just talking in V1, V2 right? or does that logic apply to the PI slot too? I guess what I am asking is does the PI tube have as much control over the tone as the other tubes? Or to what end?


Yes, V1 and V2. You can try it there, but I never put an RFT there. My understanding is the PI simply drives the power section. I use a strong Mullard that's balanced (even output on both sides) right now. I 've been told to try a Sovtek 12AX7 LPS in the PI, haven't yet. I really don't care much for new tubes. Old ones even pull-outs from salvage, kill the new stuff. I must say, I had a great TAD 7025 that was good, but it didn't last very long.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Rickfox said:


> Yes, V1 and V2. You can try it there, but I never put an RFT there. My understanding is the PI simply drives the power section. I use a strong Mullard that's balanced (even output on both sides) right now. I 've been told to try a Sovtek 12AX7 LPS in the PI, haven't yet. I really don't care much for new tubes. Old ones even pull-outs from salvage, kill the new stuff. I must say, I had a great TAD 7025 that was good, but it didn't last very long.


Yea, I agree the old stuff does murder the new stuff. The TAD stuff is way too much and I have no idea what kind of tube it is?!?! Like who actually made it. I don't like that. Now I know there are only a few factories left but I just like to know what kind i I am putting where. Lots of places tell me to put a Sovtek in the Pi as well, but I am going to reach for old glass first if I have it for sure. I am thinking the RCA 7025 maybe, I have 2 of them. Now can the Pi tube be a lesser gain therefore bringing the volume down a touch or should I stick with the 12AX7 series? I've really loved the RCA tubes a great deal. They seem to always suit my needs. I have a great deal of variety in them and I like them all. I have a brand spanking new old Raytheon made in the USA from 1958 I might toss in that Pi, but I don't have a tester and I can't remember how tight it was.  I guess I'll have to wing it. Are those TAD tubes just stuff they are testing from different brands of new stock? And relabeling? I dunno why, but I just need to know at least what brand they are even if it is new stock. Because all the new stuff can sound and act totally different even tho New Sensor makes 90% of them. The only tubes I have had die on me are the new production too. I had a Mullard new production long plate version and it lasted 3 weeks. Then one day I turn on the 6V6 amp and nothing, zero. Just killed it by having it off!!! what?!! But the place I get new stuff was good and sent me another one. I have a good time dealing with Vivatubes. Those guys have been good to me and are a bit smaller of an outfit. The old glass I have gotten from them is the best stuff I have. I like I can get a real nice tube with a bit less life left for a decent price. I have a killer 6V6 VT-107 RCA that normally is nuts expensive, but I got it for 20$ cause it was about 90% Still sounds crazy good. Biggest impact I've heard is going from the Ruby 6V6 to the RCA old glass. You'd swear its a different amp. And the RCA takes 5 seconds longer to warm up too.


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## bradley Thomas Wilson

I was going to ask all of you here a question. I have recently started a small operation to do custom wiring harness for guitars. Is there a forum for that here? I have been just doing word of mouth and FB, and have gotten some gigs. Basically I just do it cheaper than the next guy with whatever components people want. Usually use Bourns or CTS if they request it, good cloth wire, good shielded cloth wire, Oak switches, Switchcraft switches. Also found some real good import switches that are half the price and are great. Just a hobby of mine that has becoming more...


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## bradley Thomas Wilson

My gawd. I got my Electro Harmonix 6CA7's about a hour ago. So I decided to roll a few tubes. I put them in with my EL34 setup I liked and I hated it. I was like WTF. The Tung-Sol I hated in the EL34 configuration suddenly became absolute magic. Wow. The PI slot in this is actually very important in the amps voice on this. I could not use a JJ ecc83 in it. It just sounded like ass with it in V3. Tried the Shaugang which is what it came with and it was way better. And I thought for giggles I'd try the Ruby 12AX7 I have. Bingo. They might be made in the same factory I dunno. They do look totally different construction tho. So I have a Tung-Sol 1958 12AX7 in V1, A long plate new prod Mullard in V2 and the Ruby in V3 and it feels like magic with these 6CA7s. Now I know what the folks talk about with the large soundstage and 3d. I thought I knew. But now I think I have a way better Idea. The 6CA7 sounds totally different in this Origin 20. And for me its what I wanted. Hard to explain, but it was like the top 3 and bottom 3 strings were on separate amps. And now the presence control actually does something! Interesting. I tried in V1 a Brimar Nos, Mullard cv4004 NOS, the Shaugang, the JJ ecc83 and the Tung sol. Like I said I hated it before and now its perfect. I tried the same ones in V2 and the order seemed to matter a great deal. If I put the Tung-Sol in V2 it got too chippy. Strange. I love rolling tubes. The 6CA7's are huge. Massive glass. They don't sound compressed at all, and I did not think the 34's sounded too compressed either, but the lows are sooo much cleaner now. Defined and not flubby. Not at all. And I was looking for that because of my style. I dunno, the day is early but I think out of all my tubes I found a roll that really really works. I got 2 of these 6CA7's for 32$ on vivatubes. I dunno why they are so cheap on there, but I really like the difference. It seems to suit this amp, at least for me. weeeeee...... I also got my 6v6 tubes today. Woot. I got a RCA coke bottle tube from the 40's and its minty fresh. But holy hell is it huge. Its like a gigantic lightbulb. Probly 2x the size of the other RCA 6v6 I have in there. Just immense. Even bigger than the 6CA7's I wish I could find that quality for that price all the time. Somehow I got lucky and got a pretty expensive tube for 15$ and I got a New in the box 1938 vintage 6v6 for 10$. Heh good times.


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## bradley Thomas Wilson

Hey guys I got my Speaker Soak from Carl's Custom Guitars! Very cool gear. Does exactly what I wanted. It DOES sound different than the attenuation on the front panel switch. I was able to get that nice power tube crunch at a small volume. Although not quite as fun at low volume I was hoping it would do that. Kinda neat. Good quality little unit for what he charges. Heavy and feels nice. I ran it about at 7 with the gain all the way up and the boost out. And was able to sit in front of speaker?! neat. neat.


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## bradley Thomas Wilson

scozz said:


> You can get a really nice ss bass combo and bass head ,(that sound great), and cab for not a lot of $. Imo, ss bass rigs sound just as good as tube bass amps. Here’s some nice options from MF,....
> 
> https://www.musiciansfriend.com/bass-amplifiers/acoustic


I ordered that 50w $199 wedged bass amp. My kid is so stoked. Things have great reviews for sure. Can't believe the price. Thanks for the tip on that one. Made my kids day today when daddy said he could get that for her!. I just love that it is wedged. Hell I could use it as a monitor too if I wanted to I suppose.


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## jeffb

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> The PI slot in this is actually very important in the amps voice on this.



I've been saying this since day one. It totally makes or breaks the Origin series amps.


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## bradley Thomas Wilson

jeffb said:


> I've been saying this since day one. It totally makes or breaks the Origin series amps.


Yea your exactly right on. I just ordered a few more just to try a few more options. I got a Sylvania from the 60s in the box and a GE 3 mica 5 star also new but old. I was totally unimpressed with some of the stuff I have. The Ruby and the Shaugang where the only ones I could tolerate so far with the V1 and V2 im running so I need to get some more variety just to be sure. I put a JJ in the PI and it literally did sound like someone threw that wet blanket over it. I've hear people say that but now I have heard it. Really some of the best advice I have gotten. I never would have thought that based on previous amps I have had or have. How close do you like your triodes matched? 10% 7%? OR is that less important than the type? People want nuts money for tight NOS stuff. Although the Sylvania I got coming is about 7%. Also, maybe a stupid question. But putting in a lesser gain value would reduce the overall output right? Or does it not work like that. Reason I ask is that the 12AT7 stuff is 10% the cost for the same stuff as the 12AX7. I do that for V1 and V2 sometimes and at my bedroom level its no biggie. I have never tried it in the PI because I am worried its not good for it. Never have figured out of it is harmful or not. Are you still using the original glass in the output tubes?


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## jeffb

I've no idea how well matched the matched PI's I buy are- I leave that to the expert sellers of tubes. 

While the JJECC83S is warm/dark/what have you, the 803S is completely the opposite, and one of my favorites in V1 and the PI in the Origin as well as several other amps. I have both matched and unmatched versions. Frankly I cannot say there is a difference having done numerous "shootouts" in my amps- and I've lost track of which is matched and which is not as only the boxes were marked, not the tube itself, so.

My Origin is mostly retired, but I prefer JJ EL34IIs and MUllard RIs for the power section.


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## scozz

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> I ordered that 50w $199 wedged bass amp. My kid is so stoked. Things have great reviews for sure. Can't believe the price. Thanks for the tip on that one. Made my kids day today when daddy said he could get that for her!. I just love that it is wedged. Hell I could use it as a monitor too if I wanted to I suppose.


Wow great! Happy I could help!

Back in the day when I was gigging, (70s), Acoustic was the brand of bass amp everyone wanted. If you had an Acoustic Bass amp your were the man. I remember the bass player in my band had an Acoustic 360, I think, bass amp head and it sounded great. That was the Bass amp to have in the 1970s. Back then they were made in the USA,...who knows where they're made today, certainly overseas. 

I'm happy your daughter is happy!


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## bradley Thomas Wilson

jeffb said:


> I've no idea how well matched the matched PI's I buy are- I leave that to the expert sellers of tubes.
> 
> While the JJECC83S is warm/dark/what have you, the 803S is completely the opposite, and one of my favorites in V1 and the PI in the Origin as well as several other amps. I have both matched and unmatched versions. Frankly I cannot say there is a difference having done numerous "shootouts" in my amps- and I've lost track of which is matched and which is not as only the boxes were marked, not the tube itself, so.
> 
> My Origin is mostly retired, but I prefer JJ EL34IIs and MUllard RIs for the power section.


YOu like the 803? hmm. I don't have one of those yet. Have you tried the E83CC then too? Might have asked that already. It is the Frame grid tube by JJ. I'll order some 803s just to try them because opposite of the regular does sound good to me. Right now I just put in the short plate new issue Mullard 4004 for the PI and well I dunno its totally different. Gonna play it a while because I have so many tubes on the way. DId I mention I love to hoard tubes?


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## bradley Thomas Wilson

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> YOu like the 803? hmm. I don't have one of those yet. Have you tried the E83CC then too? Might have asked that already. It is the Frame grid tube by JJ. I'll order some 803s just to try them because opposite of the regular does sound good to me. Right now I just put in the short plate new issue Mullard 4004 for the PI and well I dunno its totally different. Gonna play it a while because I have so many tubes on the way. DId I mention I love to hoard tubes?


And about the matching. I too have had same experience with the matched vs unmatched. The most favorite tube I have is really not matched at all. It is a RCA cleartop black plate 12AU7 for the drive tube of the DSL1Hr. It makes that amp totally great. Without it its not that great. I really cant tell the difference either. And I think its because most are just within 20%. And who knows if they really are. You have to trust the person selling. I trust Vivatubes, but when I ebay I just look for a good return policy. Or a seller that says they will return no prob within x days. Really gotta be careful on there because people are selling bad tubes. And they say ya this tube is bad. but its a holy grail nos blah blah blah but bad. ugh. I really wanna find someone who has tried the E83CC because its like 25$ and I love tubes, but I don't wanna drop 50 on 2 that sound like a regular JJ 83... Vivatubes gave me a set of 6CA7 that were dead on identical. And they were burned in so they shouldn't move too much. I really dig those fat bottles. Kinda like a 6L6 with the elements of a EL34. Just barley fit in the rig. They got a killer price on a pair of them $33 I think for 2 EH6CA7. I can't wait for the Sylvanias. I got a steal on a couple of long black plates. And the GE 5 stars. Hopefully Saturday. No one was around today finally and I got to play alone at volume and it was glorious. I usually have to wait to go to my guitar players place to get loud. Kinda cool to stand outside with the wireless and walk around outside hehe.


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## jeffb

The new JJ pre and the new EHX 7025 are on the list for my next purchase. But not sure when that's going to be. New pickups for one of my Les Pauls are first in line.


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## Rickfox

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> And about the matching. I too have had same experience with the matched vs unmatched. The most favorite tube I have is really not matched at all. It is a RCA cleartop black plate 12AU7 for the drive tube of the DSL1Hr. It makes that amp totally great. Without it its not that great. I really cant tell the difference either. And I think its because most are just within 20%. And who knows if they really are. You have to trust the person selling. I trust Vivatubes, but when I ebay I just look for a good return policy. Or a seller that says they will return no prob within x days. Really gotta be careful on there because people are selling bad tubes. And they say ya this tube is bad. but its a holy grail nos blah blah blah but bad. ugh. I really wanna find someone who has tried the E83CC because its like 25$ and I love tubes, but I don't wanna drop 50 on 2 that sound like a regular JJ 83... Vivatubes gave me a set of 6CA7 that were dead on identical. And they were burned in so they shouldn't move too much. I really dig those fat bottles. Kinda like a 6L6 with the elements of a EL34. Just barley fit in the rig. They got a killer price on a pair of them $33 I think for 2 EH6CA7. I can't wait for the Sylvanias. I got a steal on a couple of long black plates. And the GE 5 stars. Hopefully Saturday. No one was around today finally and I got to play alone at volume and it was glorious. I usually have to wait to go to my guitar players place to get loud. Kinda cool to stand outside with the wireless and walk around outside hehe.


Hello Again!!! Okay...Whose got the Sylvania 6CA7's?? Is it Vivatubes? Those tubes are exactly as you describe. Absolutely kill in every Marshall I've owned, especially the Jube!!


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## Buzzard

Oh boy the 6ca7 tube debates are a rabbit hole that even the knowledgeable can't agree on ...which I am not.Specifically on the question of how accurate in construction they are to the vintage ones.I'd like to know too.


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## Bryan

So I'm on the fence about a 50 or 20. I play in a wedding band type situation. I use pedals for most of my gain. We mic the amps and we all use in ears.

What is the consensus? Should I get a 50 or 20?


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## Mitchell Pearrow

Bryan said:


> So I'm on the fence about a 50 or 20. I play in a wedding band type situation. I use pedals for most of my gain. We mic the amps and we all use in ears.
> 
> What is the consensus? Should I get a 50 or 20?


I am sure the 20H would be just fine, they are plenty loud.
Cheers 
Mitch


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## tce63

Bryan said:


> So I'm on the fence about a 50 or 20. I play in a wedding band type situation. I use pedals for most of my gain. We mic the amps and we all use in ears.
> 
> What is the consensus? Should I get a 50 or 20?



I think you will be happy with the 20H


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## Bryan

Awesome! I almost bought one when they were announced but I got the EVH LBX II instead. But now I'm thinkiing the Origin probably suits my needs better.


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## TXOldRedRocker

New to the forum, and a new Origin 20H owner, connected to an EVH 1x12. Classic rock and blues fan, so I love the combination. When the amp gets some age on it, I'll be curious to upgrade the tubes.


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## tce63

TXOldRedRocker said:


> New to the forum, and a new Origin 20H owner, connected to an EVH 1x12. Classic rock and blues fan, so I love the combination. When the amp gets some age on it, I'll be curious to upgrade the tubes.



HNAD, Congrats and  to the forum, a great place


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## Mitchell Pearrow

TXOldRedRocker said:


> New to the forum, and a new Origin 20H owner, connected to an EVH 1x12. Classic rock and blues fan, so I love the combination. When the amp gets some age on it, I'll be curious to upgrade the tubes.


Congratulations on your new amp, they can do what ever you want them to do.
Welcome to the forum 
Cheers 
Mitch


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## bradley Thomas Wilson

Rickfox said:


> Hello Again!!! Okay...Whose got the Sylvania 6CA7's?? Is it Vivatubes? Those tubes are exactly as you describe. Absolutely kill in every Marshall I've owned, especially the Jube!!


Well, they are new production Electro Harmonics 6CA7's for a pair they are 33$ They are large bottles. I liked the sound of them over the stock JJ EL34's. The JJ34's werent that bad tho I just like to have lots of options.


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## bradley Thomas Wilson

jeffb said:


> The new JJ pre and the new EHX 7025 are on the list for my next purchase. But not sure when that's going to be. New pickups for one of my Les Pauls are first in line.


I have a JJ ECC803 and a JJE83CC coming from Amplified parts. I'll let ya know how that E83CC is. If it is even close to the Frame grid tubes I have it'll be a steal at 22$. I also got a pair of Ken-Rad 12Ax7 tubes from 1948. As far as I can tell they might be one of the original designs of that tube. I am totally stoked. If anyone else is interested I got them for 20$ each and the guy has like 10 more pairs. They have that big fat 45 degree angled U getter. Which I think is the original design. 72 year old tubes. I love it!


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## bradley Thomas Wilson

TXOldRedRocker said:


> New to the forum, and a new Origin 20H owner, connected to an EVH 1x12. Classic rock and blues fan, so I love the combination. When the amp gets some age on it, I'll be curious to upgrade the tubes.


Congrats on the 20H. A great amp for lots of styles. I am currently going thru a variety of tube rolls to find the magic set. By the time I am done I'll have more in tubes for this amp than I paid for the amp! But hey I am a tube nut and you can really never have too many. I'd like to get to the point where I have enough for all my amps for a lifetime of use. I currently have about 30 various new and old glass preamp tubes and 3 sets of power tubes for it. Been extremely lucky lately finding good deals on tubes. Probly cause of the covid nonsense. But hey Contrats. Awesome place to get info here.


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## bradley Thomas Wilson

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> I am sure the 20H would be just fine, they are plenty loud.
> Cheers
> Mitch


I would agree, and the cops will verify that. They were here today complaining they could hear it from the street. Heh.


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## bradley Thomas Wilson

Buzzard said:


> Oh boy the 6ca7 tube debates are a rabbit hole that even the knowledgeable can't agree on ...which I am not.Specifically on the question of how accurate in construction they are to the vintage ones.I'd like to know too.


I like to have variety. I dunno that one is better than the other, but they certainly do sound different than the JJ 34's. I read about them and the are claiming they are the more American design. I guess I would have to agree they sound more like a 6L6 than a EL34. Or maybe it would be better to say they are less mid focused. I will say tho they barley fit in the O20H there isn't much clearance at all with these in it. I just thought it was a great deal on Vivatubes for a set of 6CA7. They are almost half what others are selling them for. Not sure why. That's really the reason I got them is they were so damn cheap. The readings on the pair I got were less than 5% I dunno how much that matters. I could take a couple of good pictures of these so you could compare them to like an RCA 6CA7 or something like that. I am pretty sure the old RCA's are the American designed plates and stuff.


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## bradley Thomas Wilson

Rickfox said:


> Hello Again!!! Okay...Whose got the Sylvania 6CA7's?? Is it Vivatubes? Those tubes are exactly as you describe. Absolutely kill in every Marshall I've owned, especially the Jube!!


I ramble a-lot I also ordered some Sylvania 12ax7s at the same time and can't wait for them. But hey I think its worth while to check out those EH 6CA7's just because of the price alone. They are as big as my coke bottle 6V6 RCA's! Kinda off topic, but does anyone know of anyone who wants to part with a decent tube tester? Or does anyone have a thought on what tester is legit for doing the octals and the 9 pin preamp tubes? There are so many to choose from and I just am lost in which one I should get. I have so many tubes now that I really need to invest in a decent tester.


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## Msharky67

I know my gut feeling but I can't stop looking at this model. I could afford one now but am still saving for the SV20. It just seems so tempting to get this too. If I could afford it I would get both. There is just something cool about it anyway. I do fear many saying how loud the SV is and I am slightly worried about that but I did get another PS1 to use with it when I do get something. I keep watching on reverb and have made a couple offers but nobody wants to give one up for a fair price. Nobody should pay $1299 for it really. My fingers are bleeding from biting my nails. I don't know how much longer I can wait.


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## bradley Thomas Wilson

Msharky67 said:


> I know my gut feeling but I can't stop looking at this model. I could afford one now but am still saving for the SV20. It just seems so tempting to get this too. If I could afford it I would get both. There is just something cool about it anyway. I do fear many saying how loud the SV is and I am slightly worried about that but I did get another PS1 to use with it when I do get something. I keep watching on reverb and have made a couple offers but nobody wants to give one up for a fair price. Nobody should pay $1299 for it really. My fingers are bleeding from biting my nails. I don't know how much longer I can wait.


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## bradley Thomas Wilson

I agree 1200$ is way too much and ya no one is giving deals.. I've played one and I am not sure its 1200$ good. I really did love it tho. Then again I love all my valve amps. I'm using that Speaker Soak from Carl's Custom its 44$ and it works fine. I think I coulda built one tho looking at the guts its pretty simple piece of gear. I got my Origin 20h for just over 300$ on Amazon used (like new) and it really was like new. For 300$ you can get both! It is just such a steal for what it is. Some people think its silly for them to use the big bottle EL34's in the 20 because they could have easily went with EL84s, but I like the big glass. And I really did not have a big glass amp. I also have that Monoprice 15w with EL84s and its a fantastic value for how good it sounds. Real spring reverb, but its not a Marshall no matter how hard it tries to be. I like the voicings these Origins have. I love the Cleans a great deal. I played outside with just my acoustic and a 12" and a bit of reverb and it was sublime. A-lot of amps don't sound good with a acoustic, but this sure does. I dunno, maybe just save 200$ a paycheck man. A SV20 is a noble goal for sure and a really nice tool for studio/band work. I thought about it before I got this, but I decided on more guitars and less money went to amps, but I am truly happy with the O20H.


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## TXOldRedRocker

TXOldRedRocker said:


> New to the forum, and a new Origin 20H owner, connected to an EVH 1x12. Classic rock and blues fan, so I love the combination. When the amp gets some age on it, I'll be curious to upgrade the tubes.



Thanks to those that welcomed me. I got my new pedalboard in and it built. Here's my main setup with the 20H, EVH, and pedals.


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## bradley Thomas Wilson

TXOldRedRocker said:


> Thanks to those that welcomed me. I got my new pedalboard in and it built. Here's my main setup with the 20H, EVH, and pedals.
> View attachment 73232


Sweet little setup man. With that many pedals are you running a buffer in there?


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## bradley Thomas Wilson

Msharky67 said:


> I know my gut feeling but I can't stop looking at this model. I could afford one now but am still saving for the SV20. It just seems so tempting to get this too. If I could afford it I would get both. There is just something cool about it anyway. I do fear many saying how loud the SV is and I am slightly worried about that but I did get another PS1 to use with it when I do get something. I keep watching on reverb and have made a couple offers but nobody wants to give one up for a fair price. Nobody should pay $1299 for it really. My fingers are bleeding from biting my nails. I don't know how much longer I can wait.


Hey, Amazon has a used Studio Vingate 20/5 for 900$ free shipping right now! Ships from Amazon. Cheapest I've seen with free shipping.


----------



## TXOldRedRocker

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> Sweet little setup man. With that many pedals are you running a buffer in there?



Thanks for the compliment! I haven't added a buffer to the board. The wah pedal and the bottom row all go into the preamp. The top row, not in exact right to left order, but close, all go through the FX loop. I've got super short cables connecting the pedals, with one a little longer for the signal chain I want. I'm able to get the sounds I want pretty well. Usually, I am copying the tone of the artist I am playing. I've got a Les Paul and 2 Strats to go with the sound setup. No complaints with any setup and any combination, but maybe my ear isn't as good as some others. (If I add any more pedals, I'll need a bigger board.)

Edit: Additionally, another reason for no buffer is the EQ is the last pedal, not including the sound gate, before the preamp. So I can tweak the sound coming through the gain influencing pedals before it heads to the amp.


----------



## steveb63

TXOldRedRocker said:


> Thanks to those that welcomed me. I got my new pedalboard in and it built. Here's my main setup with the 20H, EVH, and pedals.
> View attachment 73232


First off welcome bro.

Second, how are you liking the EVH cab? I've seen that online and thought abought purchasing many times.

Appears to be an outstanding deal for what you get. Is it mdf or ply?

Nice gear mang.


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## TXOldRedRocker

steveb63 said:


> First off welcome bro.
> 
> Second, how are you liking the EVH cab? I've seen that online and thought abought purchasing many times.
> 
> Appears to be an outstanding deal for what you get. Is it solid wood or ply?
> 
> Nice gear mang.



It's quality birch pine plywood. The Origin is a really good amp, but I certainly wouldn't get it as a combo. I wanted a good cabinet and there are lots to choose from, but the EVH is really well built with a great and unique speaker. IMHO. A little more for the EVH name, but that custom speaker and the well built cabinet seemed worth it to me. I love the sound.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

TXOldRedRocker said:


> It's quality birch pine plywood. The Origin is a really good amp, but I certainly wouldn't get it as a combo. I wanted a good cabinet and there are lots to choose from, but the EVH is really well built with a great and unique speaker. IMHO. A little more for the EVH name, but that custom speaker and the well built cabinet seemed worth it to me. I love the sound.


Excellent, clean little setup. Powerful yet somewhat compact. I love it. I find I gravitate to a single 12 as well. Just something about it seems more personal. You should take a pic over top your board so we can see it all better. Some of them I couldn't figure out what they are. I't not a pedal expert. And what pedal board did you get for that? That is the size I need as well. What are you using for power? I was thinking of getting one of those rechargable 9v bricks, but I need 18v too for my compressor. Pretty cool setup tho, I dig it.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

I can't remember who among you told me to try the JJ ECC803s. Well, I did and I absolutely love it. Jeez what a difference from their other offerings. If you told me it was a JJ I would not believe it. Fantastic new production tube. I just love it in the Pi slot. I mean I really love it. I switched back and forth between a regular JJ ecc83 and the Shaugang and back to the 803s and the 803s just is super sweet in the V3. Now maybe a bit of that is the Westinghouse Black long plate in V1 and the Sylvania Grey in V2, but still its pretty damn nice. I must say I am really impressed. I tried that E83cc in the V3 and did not like it. Sounded scooped for some reason. Missing middle mids? I dunno strange. Could be a great metal thrasher tube there tho because of the scoop. I have no evidence on that it just sounded hollow thru the middle. I have to re read thru here and see who the genius is here that told me to get it. I had seen it but really did not care for the short plate JJ at all. This 803 however is night and day different. Wow. I dig it. Great new production tube for sure. It is also physically larger bottle size too. I had to do a double take cause it looked bigger. Well it is. Obviously bigger than the 2 old glass tubes in V1 V2. Neat.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

jeffb said:


> I've no idea how well matched the matched PI's I buy are- I leave that to the expert sellers of tubes.
> 
> While the JJECC83S is warm/dark/what have you, the 803S is completely the opposite, and one of my favorites in V1 and the PI in the Origin as well as several other amps. I have both matched and unmatched versions. Frankly I cannot say there is a difference having done numerous "shootouts" in my amps- and I've lost track of which is matched and which is not as only the boxes were marked, not the tube itself, so.
> 
> My Origin is mostly retired, but I prefer JJ EL34IIs and MUllard RIs for the power section.


Ahh, thanks on the ecc803 nod. I got one and love it. You right its totally not the same as the other JJ stuff. I did put it in the Pi and I loved it. I am a nut I roll tubes all the time and just love doing it. This go I have Westinghouse long black plate V1, Sylvania grey plate V2 and that 803s in the Pi and it is my favorite roll so far. By far. I really really like that 803 in the Pi. It added sweetness. It feels great there. I literally played for a hour straight just listening to the guitar. Magical...


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

And for like 15$ its even better in my book. I should have gotten 2 or 3 so I could try V1,Pi combo with a old glass in v2. Oh well. Next weeks fun I guess.


----------



## Biff Maloy

I listened to jeffb's clip on a thread from a couple years ago showcasing that 803s tube in the PI slot. I have been using my Origin lately and it is still stock. The 803s as well as the Mullards he had for power seemed to bring out a lot more harmonics and a better gain structure from the amp. Along with those 20 watt EVH G12M for which I'm a fan of with low wattage Marshalls.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Biff Maloy said:


> I listened to jeffb's clip on a thread from a couple years ago showcasing that 803s tube in the PI slot. I have been using my Origin lately and it is still stock. The 803s as well as the Mullards he had for power seemed to bring out a lot more harmonics and a better gain structure from the amp. Along with those 20 watt EVH G12M for which I'm a fan of with low wattage Marshalls.


Yea, hes totally right man. It is killer in the Pi. It shocked me. I was just surprised as all hell. I've gotten more good info here in a month than a year of trolling around other places. The great thing is it is so damn cheap. I mean its a lower priced tube. Amazing. Not at all like their other offerings. HAS to be based on a totally different design internally.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

And I actually liked the stock config of the Origin 20. It took me a little bit to do any better for sure. I don't think they have a bad setup in that at all stock.


----------



## TXOldRedRocker

I am using two 1 Spot Pro's for power, which can power 18v as well as 9v, and a variety of amperage. The board is a Pedaltrain Classic 2. Here are pictures of the mounted power bricks and top view of my pedals. 









bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> Excellent, clean little setup. Powerful yet somewhat compact. I love it. I find I gravitate to a single 12 as well. Just something about it seems more personal. You should take a pic over top your board so we can see it all better. Some of them I couldn't figure out what they are. I't not a pedal expert. And what pedal board did you get for that? That is the size I need as well. What are you using for power? I was thinking of getting one of those rechargable 9v bricks, but I need 18v too for my compressor. Pretty cool setup tho, I dig it.


----------



## jeffb

Biff Maloy said:


> I listened to jeffb's clip on a thread from a couple years ago showcasing that 803s tube in the PI slot. I have been using my Origin lately and it is still stock. The 803s as well as the Mullards he had for power seemed to bring out a lot more harmonics and a better gain structure from the amp. Along with those 20 watt EVH G12M for which I'm a fan of with low wattage Marshalls.



I'd have to go back and check, but I think- think- I made that clip with the 803 in V1, but it may also be in the PI. 

Thanks for the listen!


----------



## jeffb

All the JJ Pre- sound very different. the 83S is warm, with pulled back mids and good tight lows. Works great for bright amps, high gain amps, and (especially) V30 speakers. It's also a great CF or PI because they are extremely robust. But they are warm/dark/muddy/whatever tone buzzword you prefer. I love them in V2 of my DSL because they tame the screechies and make the Red channel sound a bit beefier (I only use Red1) 

The 83MG has a bit less gain, more midrange, a nice edge in the top, and a bit less thump. I liked it very much when I was running H magnet speakers. Not as much with the G12Ms. Still a very nice sounding tube,

the 803 has big highs, big lows, and is very present but not heavy in the mids. It's less gainy, but BIG. Great as a CF or PI, and a gain stage if you have enough going on in the amp.

the 5751s are excellent too- great PI to get some clarity and headroom. I'm all out atm, but plan on ordering some more. It worked awesome in my OR15 as a PI, especially. I like it as much as the old JAN/GE 5751s I have laying around.


----------



## jeffb

jeffb said:


> I'd have to go back and check, but I think- think- I made that clip with the 803 in V1, but it may also be in the PI.
> 
> Thanks for the listen!



Well, IDK where I put the details about the tubes- I thought I had it on the youtube page for the clip, but it's not, so wherever @Biff Maloy found my details- I'd go with whatever he says I said 

I'm getting to that point where I can't recall what I ate for breakfast this morning.


----------



## Biff Maloy

jeffb said:


> Well, IDK where I put the details about the tubes- I thought I had it on the youtube page for the clip, but it's not, so wherever @Biff Maloy found my details- I'd go with whatever he says I said
> 
> I'm getting to that point where I can't recall what I ate for breakfast this morning.



This is the thread. 

http://www.marshallforum.com/threads/origin-20h-vid.104085/

I liked how you got a 1987X vibe. I haven't gotten that kind of cranked tone out of my stock 20H unless pushed a little by a pedal. I set mine basically the same. R7 Les Paul, G12M20, etc. I've had the amp a while now and i have others but your clip and tube rolling advice touched on my thoughts of late to see if i can nudge this amp in the same direction. 

Also, that EP103 Echoplex works well in front of the 20H. I have it and the EP101 Preamp i use with it.


----------



## jeffb

OK. Thank you @Biff Maloy . I knew I had posted the tube details somewhere. I was using the 83S in V1/2. Midrangey compressed speakers, midrangey compressed power tubes, midrangey compressed bridge pickup. Makes sense for those in V1/ 2 to keep some lows intact and the clarity of the 803 to open it up.

I know a lot of people crap on the JJECC83S tubes, but I like the fact that they make my treble and presence controls usable in my amplifiers. And in this case the Origin's Tilt control usable too. I never jumpered my 1987. I ran straight into the bright channel (and I used all JJs back then-pre and power) I like running the Origin "full tilt" (ha!) and not have to worry about it being so icepicky I can't stand it. With a lot of preamp tubes, I have to always pull back the treble, presence and tilt big time- below noon. Om my DSL I can actually run my presence and treble controls in the 1-3 oclock range and it sounds great. Not overly bright at all. Just full with some bite. 

As always, YMMV.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

jeffb said:


> All the JJ Pre- sound very different. the 83S is warm, with pulled back mids and good tight lows. Works great for bright amps, high gain amps, and (especially) V30 speakers. It's also a great CF or PI because they are extremely robust. But they are warm/dark/muddy/whatever tone buzzword you prefer. I love them in V2 of my DSL because they tame the screechies and make the Red channel sound a bit beefier (I only use Red1)
> 
> The 83MG has a bit less gain, more midrange, a nice edge in the top, and a bit less thump. I liked it very much when I was running H magnet speakers. Not as much with the G12Ms. Still a very nice sounding tube,
> 
> the 803 has big highs, big lows, and is very present but not heavy in the mids. It's less gainy, but BIG. Great as a CF or PI, and a gain stage if you have enough going on in the amp.
> 
> the 5751s are excellent too- great PI to get some clarity and headroom. I'm all out atm, but plan on ordering some more. It worked awesome in my OR15 as a PI, especially. I like it as much as the old JAN/GE 5751s I have laying around.


It is ok to use a 5751 in the Pi slot? Will it reduce volume or headroom? I just got a couple 5751's and haven't tried them in any Pi or CF slots yet....I love getting them minty fresh from the 50s and 60s in those military boxes. Gives me a rush. I dunno why. Just does. I am crazy I think.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

TXOldRedRocker said:


> I am using two 1 Spot Pro's for power, which can power 18v as well as 9v, and a variety of amperage. The board is a Pedaltrain Classic 2. Here are pictures of the mounted power bricks and top view of my pedals.
> 
> View attachment 73312
> 
> 
> View attachment 73313


That's a great board man. Classic. All the boxes checked and decent gear. I really like it. It looks like you put a-lot of thought and time in to figuring out what you needed and wanted. I like looking at others boards. Gives me new ideas to try. Good stuff. When I finish my all Chinese pedal board I gotta post that. I went on a cheap pedal spree and returned the noisy crappy ones and kept the legit ones and made a decent pedal setup for like 150$. I found a few real gems of pedals that are better than some of the high dollar ones that sell for 20$ One of my favorites is the Azor spring reverb pedal. It is really an amazing sounding pedal. And its 20$ I also like the Mosky dyna comp. It isn't as noisy as a real dyna comp, but yet it sounds near identical. Just without the noise. And I can run it at 18v. The other one I really like is the Donner Yellow Fall delay pedal. Really good pedal for the price. I want to try the Mooer Ninety Orange phaser, but its 55$ and that's too much for my Chinese board!


----------



## Biff Maloy

I'm following your advice on tubes jeffb. I already have some ecc83s but ordered an 803s and Mullard EL34 power tubes. 

This has hit at the right time because i have really been considering a 1987X lately. I still go through spells wanting one. I've got quite a few years under my belt playing and I love that bright and rich tone from that era. The problem, like most players these days, is being able to use it. The Origins are not on the level of the greats but get me in the ballpark and still be usable in a jam I think will suffice.


----------



## jeffb

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> It is ok to use a 5751 in the Pi slot? Will it reduce volume or headroom? I just got a couple 5751's and haven't tried them in any Pi or CF slots yet....I love getting them minty fresh from the 50s and 60s in those military boxes. Gives me a rush. I dunno why. Just does. I am crazy I think.



Some volume loss- seems to vary by amp as to how little or not. Also some more headroom in keeping the power tubes from getting thrashed (in the good way). This is why I liked them so much in my OR15. I used the Mullard RI 84s in that amp which really got the 70s vibe, but they didn't have any headroom and they would get oversaturated if you got the master up. 5751 was great to keep it from getting too compressed.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Biff Maloy said:


> I'm following your advice on tubes jeffb. I already have some ecc83s but ordered an 803s and Mullard EL34 power tubes.
> 
> This has hit at the right time because i have really been considering a 1987X lately. I still go through spells wanting one. I've got quite a few years under my belt playing and I love that bright and rich tone from that era. The problem, like most players these days, is being able to use it. The Origins are not on the level of the greats but get me in the ballpark and still be usable in a jam I think will suffice.


Man, I can't say enough about the 803's. They are legit. I was super impressed. I ordered another 4 straight away. Good tubes.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

jeffb said:


> Some volume loss- seems to vary by amp as to how little or not. Also some more headroom in keeping the power tubes from getting thrashed (in the good way). This is why I liked them so much in my OR15. I used the Mullard RI 84s in that amp which really got the 70s vibe, but they didn't have any headroom and they would get oversaturated if you got the master up. 5751 was great to keep it from getting too compressed.


I'm gonna try it. I have a Old glass Tung-Sol. And I think I'll try it just to mess around and have fun. I have a 5751 Military Sylvania from 1955 that is minty fresh. It'll be hard to pull that 803 out tho. That thing rules there. Damn it is good. Like a night and day thing from the Shaugang. Really impressed.


----------



## jeffb

Biff Maloy said:


> I'm following your advice on tubes jeffb. I already have some ecc83s but ordered an 803s and Mullard EL34 power tubes.
> 
> This has hit at the right time because i have really been considering a 1987X lately. I still go through spells wanting one. I've got quite a few years under my belt playing and I love that bright and rich tone from that era. The problem, like most players these days, is being able to use it. The Origins are not on the level of the greats but get me in the ballpark and still be usable in a jam I think will suffice.




Don't forget one big key- Volume. I had that thing really loud running my EVH 2x12 (16ohm load). 

The Origin is no 1987X but it is a more practical choice to get into a vintage Marshall vibe at a decent cost. At the time, had I know the Studio Vintage was coming, I would have waited for that!


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Biff Maloy said:


> I'm following your advice on tubes jeffb. I already have some ecc83s but ordered an 803s and Mullard EL34 power tubes.
> 
> This has hit at the right time because i have really been considering a 1987X lately. I still go through spells wanting one. I've got quite a few years under my belt playing and I love that bright and rich tone from that era. The problem, like most players these days, is being able to use it. The Origins are not on the level of the greats but get me in the ballpark and still be usable in a jam I think will suffice.


It's not a real Marshall, but Wangs Amplifiers has a hand wired 1987 for 600$ right now, or did last week when I checked. I thought about it.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

jeffb said:


> Don't forget one big key- Volume. I had that thing really loud running my EVH 2x12 (16ohm load).
> 
> The Origin is no 1987X but it is a more practical choice to get into a vintage Marshall vibe at a decent cost. At the time, had I know the Studio Vintage was coming, I would have waited for that!


Right. I hear ya there. If that Studio Vintage is up on Amazon Warehouse on friday for 850$ ima get it. Used like new from the warehouse. I just might pull that trigger. I need one of those.


----------



## jeffb

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> Man, I can't say enough about the 803's. They are legit. I was super impressed. I ordered another 4 straight away. Good tubes.



Try one in V1. They do have less gain, but they sound great there too. Though sometimes I feel like they make the amps play a little harder/stiffer. In V1 on the crunch channel of VSL makes the amp sound more "classic".


----------



## Biff Maloy

jeffb said:


> Don't forget one big key- Volume. I had that thing really loud running my EVH 2x12 (16ohm load).
> 
> The Origin is no 1987X but it is a more practical choice to get into a vintage Marshall vibe at a decent cost. At the time, had I know the Studio Vintage was coming, I would have waited for that!



Oh yeah. Band volume is what i want to improve. Same speakers. I have 2 in my 2061CX and a Heritage G12M20 in a closed 1x12. I stay on the mid power setting with it. 

I'm exactly in the same boat. I jumped on the 2525H as soon as it came out. Almost bought an original in 87. Then the DSL20HR and Origin 20H issued. Grabbed em. Then the SV and SC......Damn! If i had known, should have known because of the 2525H, i wouldn't have bought the Origin and DSL. No offense to them but i already have the 50th Anniversary Marshalls so I'm not looking for a 20 watt collection here. But, the SV20H is exactly my thing and my first Marshall was a JCM800. I'm going to invest a little in the 20H for a bit and see what it can do.


----------



## Bryan

20H arrived! Can't wait to plug it in when I get home and see what it's got under the hood!


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## bradley Thomas Wilson

Bryan said:


> 20H arrived! Can't wait to plug it in when I get home and see what it's got under the hood!


niiiice! You'll dig it bro. anything past 7 is lovely.


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## bradley Thomas Wilson

Bryan said:


> 20H arrived! Can't wait to plug it in when I get home and see what it's got under the hood!


I was once again impressed that the quality is there for such a inexpensive piece of gear. It does not feel or look cheaped out at all. Even tho its just PCB it is a thing of beauty. It is well designed with pretty decent components. Just like my Vietnamese DSL head the fit and finish is superb. Congrats. I have my finger on the trigger for that 850$ SV20 and I should just press BUY. Of course I will be murdered once my wife finds out, but hey. Choices ya know. I wish we could pay British price point for the higher end Marshall stuff. We get screwed here in the USA on the higher end stuff.


----------



## vtrain

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> I was once again impressed that the quality is there for such a inexpensive piece of gear. It does not feel or look cheaped out at all. Even tho its just PCB it is a thing of beauty. It is well designed with pretty decent components. Just like my Vietnamese DSL head the fit and finish is superb. Congrats. I have my finger on the trigger for that 850$ SV20 and I should just press BUY. Of course I will be murdered once my wife finds out, but hey. Choices ya know. I wish we could pay British price point for the higher end Marshall stuff. We get screwed here in the USA on the higher end stuff.



If you compare internal photos of Origin series amps with Made in England amps (SC20, for example), they look like they could have been made by the same people. Components look to be the same, quality of execution looks the same. Based on photographic comparison, I do not think the Made in Vietnam amps give up anything in terms of quality.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

The Origin series scratches my 1987 itch quite well, so much so I have 2 of the 50H’s, one has got Mullards in the preamp slots, Rubies in the power tube slots, and the other is stock, still loving what I hear.
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Bryan said:


> 20H arrived! Can't wait to plug it in when I get home and see what it's got under the hood!


Congratulations on your new amp brother, they like to be rude, loud.
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## steveb63

^^^^^^^^^^

Make sure that master is working, and twenty watts is louder than one would imagine.

Have fun!


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

vtrain said:


> If you compare internal photos of Origin series amps with Made in England amps (SC20, for example), they look like they could have been made by the same people. Components look to be the same, quality of execution looks the same. Based on photographic comparison, I do not think the Made in Vietnam amps give up anything in terms of quality.


Would have to agree. I like what I see a great deal. I mean my god I paid a touch over 300$ for a real Marshall that gets pretty close to the old stuff. I am just pleased as punch.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Jeez this Marshall MG412AG Cabinet is 300$ shipped with 4 g12 Celestions in it. Does anyone here have one? Does it sound ok on the Origin 20? Seems really cheap for a 4x12 slant cab. I can't even buy the 4 12's for 300$ , well maybe, but still I think I may get one just for giggles at that price. So if anyone has that cab shoot me a reply. Thanks!


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Bryan said:


> 20H arrived! Can't wait to plug it in when I get home and see what it's got under the hood!


Welllll.. How did it go! How did you like your new Origin 20? I know when I got mine i was very surprised at how much I liked it and how impressed I was with the entire experience. Damn thing is just a great value for what sound you get. It just sings when you get it nice and hot. And I quite like the clean on it as well.


----------



## 93studiolite

Congrats! As others have said above, anything past 6-7 on the MV is where these things sound best. Hope you enjoy it.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> Jeez this Marshall MG412AG Cabinet is 300$ shipped with 4 g12 Celestions in it. Does anyone here have one? Does it sound ok on the Origin 20? Seems really cheap for a 4x12 slant cab. I can't even buy the 4 12's for 300$ , well maybe, but still I think I may get one just for giggles at that price. So if anyone has that cab shoot me a reply. Thanks!


I have 8 of the MG cabs, but I purchased them all used at about $120.00 each, and I have started changing speakers, but I have a long way to go to load them all, they are not bad with the Origin amps at all .
But I never bought one new.
Cheers


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> I have 8 of the MG cabs, but I purchased them all used at about $120.00 each, and I have started changing speakers, but I have a long way to go to load them all, they are not bad with the Origin amps at all .
> But I never bought one new.
> Cheers


Awesome, It looks like it would be a great entry level 4x12, which I do not have. So for 300$ new shipped I'm in. You think the straight cab or the angled? I am thinking angled, but I can get either one for 300$ new.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Another oddball thing I REALLY need are some of those SM57 double mic clips for holding 2 sm57's at an angle to record. I must be looking in the wrong places because I can't seem to find them for cheap. I might just make some for the prices I am seeing. 1 straight on and one at 45 degree clip. If anyone has any I would trade you some tubes or straight up cash too. I must be using the wrong search term. ugh


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> I have 8 of the MG cabs, but I purchased them all used at about $120.00 each, and I have started changing speakers, but I have a long way to go to load them all, they are not bad with the Origin amps at all .
> But I never bought one new.
> Cheers


I live in small town part of WI and I can never find them used close enough for pickup so I will have to go new. I did find a Behringer 4x12 cab tho for 100$, but I just dunno. Won't look right.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> Awesome, It looks like it would be a great entry level 4x12, which I do not have. So for 300$ new shipped I'm in. You think the straight cab or the angled? I am thinking angled, but I can get either one for 300$ new.


I have both 2 are set up as full stacks, the rest are slants 2 of them get Dsl40c’s on top.
I do have photos in the Marshall man cave thread.
Cheers


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> I live in small town part of WI and I can never find them used close enough for pickup so I will have to go new. I did find a Behringer 4x12 cab tho for 100$, but I just dunno. Won't look right.


I found mine on GC used Marshall gear, and for $35 they will ship it where you want. Cheers


----------



## steveb63

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> I found mine on GC used Marshall gear, and for $35 they will ship it where you want. Cheers


Put some Greenies in there, and watch out!


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

steveb63 said:


> Put some Greenies in there, and watch out!


Hell yea my white one that sits under one of the Origin 50H’s has greenbacks in it...
Cheers


----------



## vtrain

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> Right. I hear ya there. If that Studio Vintage is up on Amazon Warehouse on friday for 850$ ima get it. Used like new from the warehouse. I just might pull that trigger. I need one of those.



Seems like someone else might have beat you to it.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

vtrain said:


> Seems like someone else might have beat you to it.


They did.. It is ok I would have been murdered by my wife anyway. I have the next one tho.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> I found mine on GC used Marshall gear, and for $35 they will ship it where you want. Cheers


Nice.. 35$ I can handle. I am just having a hard time deciding between a 2x12 slant and the 4x12. My gut tells me the 2x12, but I am not sure. I have to pick one because of space issues right now. I am thinking the 2x12 also because buying 2 speakers I can get more expensive stuff. Or better stuff as it were.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

vtrain said:


> Seems like someone else might have beat you to it.


Was it you?!?!?! heh


----------



## vtrain

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> Was it you?!?!?! heh



Yep! I just want to check it out, I might not keep it. Or maybe I will. But with Amazon Prime, seems like there’s nothing to lose trying it. It sounds pretty incredible in all the reviews I’ve checked out.


----------



## zucoso132

Hi guys I got an origin 20h recently and I was wondering if it's normal that Reverb and delay pedals in the effects loop get distorted and muddy the more gain is used either from the amp or pedals placed in front of the amp. I tested all my pedals and cables on my other amps Effects loop but I only have the issue with the Origin, This my first low gain, viNtage sounding amp so I am not sure if this is normal or if it’s something wrong with my amp


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Hmmmmm, I am not sure I have that issue


vtrain said:


> Yep! I just want to check it out, I might not keep it. Or maybe I will. But with Amazon Prime, seems like there’s nothing to lose trying it. It sounds pretty incredible in all the reviews I’ve checked out.


Awesome, I am glad you got it. Hell of a deal really. I really wanted it, but I am glad you got it. I have so much new gear I haven't even played with yet and I need to give that attention first anyway. Awesome!!


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

vtrain said:


> Yep! I just want to check it out, I might not keep it. Or maybe I will. But with Amazon Prime, seems like there’s nothing to lose trying it. It sounds pretty incredible in all the reviews I’ve checked out.


Yea totally nothing to loose. They have killer return policy. Basically a try before you are stuck with it. They will return anything. And it is fast to get cash back on the card. I have never been stuck with something that was broken or wrong or I didn't want. So totally no risk there at all. And you got a seriously cool rig. No way you'll get rid of it. heh


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

zucoso132 said:


> Hi guys I got an origin 20h recently and I was wondering if it's normal that Reverb and delay pedals in the effects loop get distorted and muddy the more gain is used either from the amp or pedals placed in front of the amp. I tested all my pedals and cables on my other amps Effects loop but I only have the issue with the Origin, This my first low gain, viNtage sounding amp so I am not sure if this is normal or if it’s something wrong with my amp


I am running a compressor and a Green pedal in front of it and reverb, chorus, delay in the loop and it seems to tolerate that just fine. I haven't noticed its muddy with the green pedal on. Maybe its just I haven't noticed, but it seems to sound just fine on my setup. Maybe it dosen't like the impedence of one of them pedals? You could try running a buffer at the end of your chain in the loop. See what that does. I had a buffer in my chain, but it is only 3 long right now so I took it out because its not needed on my setup. I used to get muddy on my board until I got 2 of them buffer pedals and that took care of it, but that was all non FX loop isuues. All in front of an amp.


----------



## Biff Maloy

zucoso132 said:


> Hi guys I got an origin 20h recently and I was wondering if it's normal that Reverb and delay pedals in the effects loop get distorted and muddy the more gain is used either from the amp or pedals placed in front of the amp. I tested all my pedals and cables on my other amps Effects loop but I only have the issue with the Origin, This my first low gain, viNtage sounding amp so I am not sure if this is normal or if it’s something wrong with my amp



Sounds like the levels on the reverb and delay need dialing back. I use a Flashback X4 Delay and Hall of Fame Reverb in the loop of my 20H. The louder i play the amp the more i bring the level knobs on those pedals down. It's a balance mindset. Preamp is pushing more signal so....the settings that may have sounded good with the amp dialed back are now being amplified.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Anyone try the Yellow Jackets or the Tone Bone converters in the Origin 20? I have some El84's and I just wondered if anyone had any good experiences with them. It should reduce headroom and volume which would be fine. I found a set for 50$ and I might pull the trigga.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

oooo Eminence 1028k Alnico for 85 I might I might


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Nope, I wanted a new speaker for my single end and I just snapped up the G10 Greenback for 60$ woot


----------



## tce63

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> Nope, I wanted a new speaker for my single end and I just snapped up the G10 Greenback for 60$ woot



I used to have the 10" Greenback in my Origin 20C, sounded great.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

tce63 said:


> I used to have the 10" Greenback in my Origin 20C, sounded great.


Sometimes I get them from Amazon Warehouse at crazy prices. I like their return policy. 60$ like new. 16 ohm. I wish they woulda had 2 I woulda got 2


----------



## Biff Maloy

Installed my new 803S in the PI slot along with some new Mullard EL34's in the power for my 20H. V1 and V2 stayed stock at first. 2061CX cabinet with 20 watt EVH speakers which are brand new. I'm more than sold on these 20 watt speakers. My Heritage G12M20 has always been the best performer with these 20 watt heads but i always played it with the amp's power reduced. It was nice to go to the full 20 watts finally. 

Thought the sound improved. Tamed some splat at high volumes. I got a bit of rattle/squeak which i suspected was the 803S. Moved it to V1 and put the stock PI tube back in. No issues after that and this was the best sounding. I did mean to order a balanced 803S but I'll be ordering another round anyway. I suspect that's why it didn't like that spot being unbalanced.

On my next order I'm tempted to grab some KT77 also. Anybody tried those in their Origin? It's all about getting the top end right for me at cranked volume.


----------



## bradley Thomas Wilson

Biff Maloy said:


> Installed my new 803S in the PI slot along with some new Mullard EL34's in the power for my 20H. V1 and V2 stayed stock at first. 2061CX cabinet with 20 watt EVH speakers which are brand new. I'm more than sold on these 20 watt speakers. My Heritage G12M20 has always been the best performer with these 20 watt heads but i always played it with the amp's power reduced. It was nice to go to the full 20 watts finally.
> 
> Thought the sound improved. Tamed some splat at high volumes. I got a bit of rattle/squeak which i suspected was the 803S. Moved it to V1 and put the stock PI tube back in. No issues after that and this was the best sounding. I did mean to order a balanced 803S but I'll be ordering another round anyway. I suspect that's why it didn't like that spot being unbalanced.
> 
> On my next order I'm tempted to grab some KT77 also. Anybody tried those in their Origin? It's all about getting the top end right for me at cranked volume.


I haven't tried the Kt77 yet but it did take to the 6CA7's fine. It dramatically changed its sound. I should get some KT77's as well. I might try those gold lions. Just for the hell of it. They get fantastic reviews. And they do look pretty. Not really that expensive either. I intended on getting the KT77's but the 6CA7's were 33$ for a set of 2 and I could not pass on that. Otherwise I had Kt's on my brain. I have some of those rubbers for the tubes and they work pretty good for mild microphony. It wont stop it if its real bad, but it will tame some normally un-usable tubes. I found a Hartke 4x12 and Ima go get it later. It has 4 of those 20 watters in it. Or so he says. I'd bet they are the 30's when I get there. But either way its 80$ for a 4x12 with them speakers is a hell of a deal. Found it on craigs list like 30 miles from me. I can't wait to max this thing and damage my hearing some more. I like that body rattle and sick feeling ahha.


----------



## jeffb

I would describe the JJ KT77 as "high fidelity". They have a big low end, extended top end and a softer smoother mid than El34s. Very different than 6ca7s , el34s, 6550, etc. In the room they just seemed too high fi ,but recorded they sound awesome.

I never tried them in my Origin, but this is my DSL with them (and an 803). And looking at it seems like people either hate the post c19 mod, or my playing, or both, so be forewarned


----------



## Biff Maloy

They must not be Rush fans. I enjoyed the references. I like you having the Echoplex out front as it should be. I have gotten good results with my Dunlop EP103 Echoplex in front of my DSL20HR. Flashback X4 set to tape as well. 

I'm just going to play around with the Origin some more. Order some different sets. I have tubes but the collection is due some freshening up anyway. Get a couple of balanced for the PI which I'm totally out of and those KT77. Interested in those. I've gotten some great sounds with a pedal with this amp but I'd prefer to upgrade it's straight in tone and ditch the pedal.


----------



## jeffb

The KT77s are great. I just felt the EL34IIs and Mullard RI hew a bit closer to "classic" Marshall. If the KT77s had a bit less presence/highs, I think they would be my favorite tube out there. Much bigger soundstage than EL34s. Makes small amps sound bigger.

And FWIW- I have a new set of EL34IIs and that new super tube from JJ set for delivery this week, so after I get some time in on them I'll be sure to


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

jeffb said:


> I would describe the JJ KT77 as "high fidelity". They have a big low end, extended top end and a softer smoother mid than El34s. Very different than 6ca7s , el34s, 6550, etc. In the room they just seemed too high fi ,but recorded they sound awesome.
> 
> I never tried them in my Origin, but this is my DSL with them (and an 803). And looking at it seems like people either hate the post c19 mod, or my playing, or both, so be forewarned



Nothing wrong with your playing or tone, sounds great brother, I used to mess around with Bastille Day many moons ago, one of my favorite songs of that era.
Cheers


----------



## vtrain

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> Yea totally nothing to loose. They have killer return policy. Basically a try before you are stuck with it. They will return anything. And it is fast to get cash back on the card. I have never been stuck with something that was broken or wrong or I didn't want. So totally no risk there at all. And you got a seriously cool rig. No way you'll get rid of it. heh



There's a 1/8" tear in the Tolex on the front top left corner, otherwise it looks new. Still has the Marshall tag on the handle. It came in a box the size of a small refrigerator, and I don't mean a dorm mini fridge, I mean a refrigerator designed for a small kitchen. It was comical. There was another homemade box inside that had the head wrapped in plastic wrap. I hate that stuff.

The 5w setting through my 1x12 open back pine cab is quite loud, way, way louder than the Origin 5 on the 5w setting. I put my super cheap TC Dark Matter distortion in the effects loop and turned the gain all the way down (and set the tone controls to neutral) and used it as a master volume. It worked brilliantly, I could get amazing lead tones at true 2 AM bedroom levels. 

The sound is incredible. It's the first time I've ever played a riff and though to myself, yeah, that's how it sounds on the album. For example, my shitty playing excluded, I was basically getting 100% accurate Angus Young tones, without even tweaking anything. I feel like this is the amp I've been searching for my whole life.

Problem is, even at the used deal price, and with the 5% off from using my Amazon card, it's still about double what I intended to pay for a head. I can afford it, just not sure if I'll live long enough to enjoy it if/when my wife finds out how much it cost.


----------



## L Newman

Can the DI be used with the speaker unplugged?


----------



## steveb63

L Newman said:


> Can the DI be used with the speaker unplugged?


Yes sir.

It's in the manual, kinda hidden. But it's in there.

I use the line out on my load box, didn't care for Origin's speaker emulation for recording.

Just my opinion, mostly worthless lol.

Have fun.


----------



## L Newman

steveb63 said:


> Yes sir.
> 
> It's in the manual, kinda hidden.....



Thanks!


----------



## TXOldRedRocker

Ahhh man. My 3 week old Origin 20H bit the dust. I had a couple of incidents of a pop followed by no sound, then another pop and the sound back on. Didn't happen regularly. Initial though was bad power tube, but you never know. So, I checked *everything*, The guitar I was playing had a bit of a loose jack. Tightened it, and then had a couple of days of no issues. Thought that was it. Now, nothing, no sound when I play. For initial amp test, I have only power, speaker and guitar directly plugged in. Tried 2 instrument cables and 3 guitars. All work fine on a different amp. Left the volume up to about 4 when I powered down the amp and heard the little pop click. So the speaker is fine. Next, I wonder if it's the jack. If I plug pedals into the FX loop, I can get hear playback from my looper pedal. I bought it from Sweetwater, and it's brand new. I haven't cracked it open, don't have time right now anyway. I'll get in touch with them soon. Tried, but after being on hold for 25 minutes, I'll try back when I have more time. Really wanted to like this amp, and I have upgrade tubes in transit for it.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

TXOldRedRocker said:


> Ahhh man. My 3 week old Origin 20H bit the dust. I had a couple of incidents of a pop followed by no sound, then another pop and the sound back on. Didn't happen regularly. Initial though was bad power tube, but you never know. So, I checked *everything*, The guitar I was playing had a bit of a loose jack. Tightened it, and then had a couple of days of no issues. Thought that was it. Now, nothing, no sound when I play. For initial amp test, I have only power, speaker and guitar directly plugged in. Tried 2 instrument cables and 3 guitars. All work fine on a different amp. Left the volume up to about 4 when I powered down the amp and heard the little pop click. So the speaker is fine. Next, I wonder if it's the jack. If I plug pedals into the FX loop, I can get hear playback from my looper pedal. I bought it from Sweetwater, and it's brand new. I haven't cracked it open, don't have time right now anyway. I'll get in touch with them soon. Tried, but after being on hold for 25 minutes, I'll try back when I have more time. Really wanted to like this amp, and I have upgrade tubes in transit for it.


Sorry to hear this, have you tried the preamp tube trick yet ?
I know it may not be much but the manual does say to drop volume on power down. Or you will hear a pop, as you experienced .
I would say try plugging your guitar into the return on the FX loop, if you can hear anything, then take the one known good preamp tube and check each position.
If it’s a bad one you will find it.
Other than that I have no idea.
Cheers to getting it back up and running, mine are the 50H’s and so far so good.
Mitch


----------



## TXOldRedRocker

Interesting. Thanks. I always turn the volume down before plugging, unplugging, etc. I left it up a bit this one time just to see if I would hear anything at all, as a test. I did not think to try the effects loop return. I do in fact have sound from my guitar when I plug into the FX loop return. Still no sound from the main input. So it's preamp, EQ, or jack most likely.

Still deciding when I talk to Sweetwater whether this is going to be an exchange/repair situation, or whether I use their 90 day return policy and buy a different model amp.



Mitchell Pearrow said:


> Sorry to hear this, have you tried the preamp tube trick yet ?
> I know it may not be much but the manual does say to drop volume on power down. Or you will hear a pop, as you experienced .
> I would say try plugging your guitar into the return on the FX loop, if you can hear anything, then take the one known good preamp tube and check each position.
> If it’s a bad one you will find it.
> Other than that I have no idea.
> Cheers to getting it back up and running, mine are the 50H’s and so far so good.
> Mitch


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

TXOldRedRocker said:


> Interesting. Thanks. I always turn the volume down before plugging, unplugging, etc. I left it up a bit this one time just to see if I would hear anything at all, as a test. I did not think to try the effects loop return. I do in fact have sound from my guitar when I plug into the FX loop return. Still no sound from the main input. So it's preamp, EQ, or jack most likely.
> 
> Still deciding when I talk to Sweetwater whether this is going to be an exchange/repair situation, or whether I use their 90 day return policy and buy a different model amp.


Well then you are getting signal, take a preamp tube and start with the first slot then hit the front of your amp with the guitar, if still nothing, try the next one at a time, and you will find the bad tube, also make sure your speaker cable is not the culprit.
I have had both scenarios happen to me.
Cheers


----------



## BRMarshall

NAD Friday -Marshall Origin20h. Haven’t played on it a lot thus far - taking care of outside tasks while weather is good.

Looks and feels solid. Low gain as advertised. Gain Boost seems to make a marked increase in volume and fullness of tone. Old Tube Screamer in front beefs up the tone. Mine has the current speaker out graphic - 1 or 2 16ohm cabs or 1 8ohm.
I’m liking it so far. With the tilt and presence adjustments, tone can be shaped greatly within the design of the amp. I’ve played a 2014 GLP Studio (490R & T) and a Jackson JS11 (Dimarzio SD and Air Norton) through open back 1x12 cabs (25w Greenback and V-Type). The Greenback sounds better to me.


----------



## konrad gibson

Marshall Origin 20c. Peter Frampton like sound with JB Dunlop Wah


----------



## konrad gibson




----------



## Alloftheabove

Hi All, 

I just wanted to introduce myself- I've been lurking around for a little while reading up on the ori20- such a wealth of information here! 

I would define myself as a casual guitar player been noodling about since I was kid (I'm in my late 30s now) and only last year picked up playing electric again (a lot.)
For the past several months i've been gathering up gear and have been experimenting with 'my tone' mainly playing out of a VOX Pathfinder10 (amazing little amp btw)until I started sampling valve/tube amps at various stores I would come across. 

Long story short- I bought myself an Ori20c recently. First Marshall. First valve amp. Almost feels like my first 'real' amp. And I am loving it. 

My biggest problem is I live in flat and I really want to be able to get it to break up without having to charge my neighbours admission to hear me play as a result I have just ordered an L-pad based attenuator. I think I've seen someone on here mention that they were using a Carls Custom Power Soak. Does anyone have any experience using this sort of attenuator with this amp? What are the drawbacks and what should i expect?

Many thanks in advance! 

aota


----------



## tonycaster

Hi all, i'm new to the forum, although long time watcher and Marshall owner. I recently purchased an Origin 20h and all I can say it's a killer amp for the price. I've swapped power tubes with a pair of original '90s Svetlanas and a pair of tung sol press (left the factory V3 in) and the amp, which was very good before the swap, became awesome, more controllable; the presence is a little more useable and the head covers lots of grounds, from beautiful cleans to EVH territory with a SSS start and a bunch of pedals. Best results reached with an Xotic AC booster, which leaves almost intact the character of both amp and guitar. I tried it with a Maxon SD9 but it adds too much lower miss for my taste as well as some fizziness, which happened with my '78 JMP 2203 as well.


----------



## tonycaster

Alloftheabove said:


> Hi All,
> 
> I just wanted to introduce myself- I've been lurking around for a little while reading up on the ori20- such a wealth of information here!
> 
> I would define myself as a casual guitar player been noodling about since I was kid (I'm in my late 30s now) and only last year picked up playing electric again (a lot.)
> For the past several months i've been gathering up gear and have been experimenting with 'my tone' mainly playing out of a VOX Pathfinder10 (amazing little amp btw)until I started sampling valve/tube amps at various stores I would come across.
> 
> Long story short- I bought myself an Ori20c recently. First Marshall. First valve amp. Almost feels like my first 'real' amp. And I am loving it.
> 
> My biggest problem is I live in flat and I really want to be able to get it to break up without having to charge my neighbours admission to hear me play as a result I have just ordered an L-pad based attenuator. I think I've seen someone on here mention that they were using a Carls Custom Power Soak. Does anyone have any experience using this sort of attenuator with this amp? What are the drawbacks and what should i expect?
> 
> Many thanks in advance!
> 
> aota


I use an Harley Benton PA100 with my JMP 2203, which is a 100w amp, and the loss of tone at extreme settings is noticeable but tolerable, so a good compromise between letting your power tubes work without being shot by your neighbors. I think that for 69 euros you can buy that device and play freely ad bedroom volumes with the origin, even if at the lowest power settings I find it a very quite amp; maybe not to be played at 3 'o'clock in the morning with the master cranked but really useable. Moreover, at minimum attenuation (volume of the attain. maxed) you have a loss of 3 db which is quite a lot, with minimal tone loss


----------



## Alloftheabove

I agree I think it has a super nice clean- But I'm finding that I have to really dial up the gain on my OD pedal (mosky golden horse) to get a little bit of crunch. I think I anticipated being able to crank the gain and ride the mv to dial in break up- but what do i know...

In any case, I've ordered a Stamis Custom attenuator the other day hoping that I can get the dynamics of this amp working for me at an appropriate volume for where I am.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Alloftheabove said:


> I agree I think it has a super nice clean- But I'm finding that I have to really dial up the gain on my OD pedal (mosky golden horse) to get a little bit of crunch. I think I anticipated being able to crank the gain and ride the mv to dial in break up- but what do i know...
> 
> In any case, I've ordered a Stamis Custom attenuator the other day hoping that I can get the dynamics of this amp working for me at an appropriate volume for where I am.


Welcome to the forum 
Congratulations on your new amp 
Mitch


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

tonycaster said:


> I use an Harley Benton PA100 with my JMP 2203, which is a 100w amp, and the loss of tone at extreme settings is noticeable but tolerable, so a good compromise between letting your power tubes work without being shot by your neighbors. I think that for 69 euros you can buy that device and play freely ad bedroom volumes with the origin, even if at the lowest power settings I find it a very quite amp; maybe not to be played at 3 'o'clock in the morning with the master cranked but really useable. Moreover, at minimum attenuation (volume of the attain. maxed) you have a loss of 3 db which is quite a lot, with minimal tone loss


Welcome to the forum 
The Origin amp line is a great piece of gear.
Mitch


----------



## tonycaster

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> Welcome to the forum
> The Origin amp line is a great piece of gear.
> Mitch


Thanks Mitch! for the price line is impressive, very hard to beat


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

tonycaster said:


> Thanks Mitch! for the price line is impressive, very hard to beat


I am with you on that my brother.
I purchased 2 of the 50H’s.


----------



## TXOldRedRocker

Personally, I use a JHS Little Black Amp Box. I can crank the amp up all the way and control the speaker volume with it.

https://www.jhspedals.info/little-black-amp-box



Alloftheabove said:


> Hi All,
> 
> I just wanted to introduce myself- I've been lurking around for a little while reading up on the ori20- such a wealth of information here!
> 
> I would define myself as a casual guitar player been noodling about since I was kid (I'm in my late 30s now) and only last year picked up playing electric again (a lot.)
> For the past several months i've been gathering up gear and have been experimenting with 'my tone' mainly playing out of a VOX Pathfinder10 (amazing little amp btw)until I started sampling valve/tube amps at various stores I would come across.
> 
> Long story short- I bought myself an Ori20c recently. First Marshall. First valve amp. Almost feels like my first 'real' amp. And I am loving it.
> 
> My biggest problem is I live in flat and I really want to be able to get it to break up without having to charge my neighbours admission to hear me play as a result I have just ordered an L-pad based attenuator. I think I've seen someone on here mention that they were using a Carls Custom Power Soak. Does anyone have any experience using this sort of attenuator with this amp? What are the drawbacks and what should i expect?
> 
> Many thanks in advance!
> 
> aota


----------



## TXOldRedRocker

Since the 20H was only 3 weeks old, I didn't crack it open, Sweetwater is sending me a replacement 2 day FedEx. Hopefully FedEx handles this better. I had nice new tubes for the 20H coming in, before it died, and FedEx says they delivered the box with the tubes. I know 100% the box was not delivered. In a day and a half, I should (come on FedEx) have a brand new 20H. Hopefully FedEx will find the box, or I'll be dealing with trying to get the order of tubes replaced.



Mitchell Pearrow said:


> Well then you are getting signal, take a preamp tube and start with the first slot then hit the front of your amp with the guitar, if still nothing, try the next one at a time, and you will find the bad tube, also make sure your speaker cable is not the culprit.
> I have had both scenarios happen to me.
> Cheers


----------



## Alloftheabove

TXOldRedRocker said:


> Personally, I use a JHS Little Black Amp Box. I can crank the amp up all the way and control the speaker volume with it.
> 
> /QUOTE]
> 
> So I looked into these before- its essentially a volume pot between the preamp and the power amp no? I havent used the effects loop yet I might have to give that a try with the vol level on my reverb. Thanks!


----------



## TXOldRedRocker

Yes it is. Mine is plugged into the output of the last pedal in the effect loops and the fx return. But even if you're not using the fx loop for effects, you can turn the fx loop on have just this to control the output volume. Or one like it. Or make one, or whatever. I like it because I can crank up the MV and Gain of the amp. I can set the level's on my pedals to higher value to achieve some better results. When the family is home, the volume is low, but with good sound. When they're not, turn one knob and the dogs go running! Have fun!


----------



## Alloftheabove

So I tried this with the reverb and also with the klone (not concurrently) w/ gain at zero using their respective volume out to control volume post preamp-

Guitar at 10,
amp gain at 3 - to full plus boost, 
tilt biased towards bright ,
rolled back the bass a bit to noon, 
mid to 3ish
treble full
MV at noon to 3. 
Presence noon to full.

There was a sprinkling of break up but not as saturated when the amp is doing its own thing and penetrating dry wall.

I must be doing something wrong or missing a trick


----------



## Biff Maloy

Not trying to be a smart... because maybe there's something I'm missing but this volume box in the loop is the most trendy thing I've seen on forums in years. For low volume breakup to disturb no one i find a cheap EHX Soul Food set right sounds close to the grind i get with the Origin 20H cranked. IMO i honestly don't get why this sound would not be liked. Totally good with it. 

Somebody educate me. So many are singing its praises on NMV or in the Origin's case MV yet in my 30+ years playing it makes no sense to me. For my 20H to sound right it on its own and without a pedal it is completely dependant on balancing the preamp and master volumes. How does throwing a volume control in between the two not compromise this?


----------



## RCM 800

Biff Maloy said:


> Not trying to be a smart... because maybe there's something I'm missing but this volume box in the loop is the most trendy thing I've seen on forums in years. For low volume breakup to disturb no one i find a cheap EHX Soul Food set right sounds close to the grind i get with the Origin 20H cranked. IMO i honestly don't get why this sound would not be liked. Totally good with it.
> 
> Somebody educate me. So many are singing its praises on NMV or in the Origin's case MV yet in my 30+ years playing it makes no sense to me. For my 20H to sound right it on its own and without a pedal it is completely dependant on balancing the preamp and master volumes. How does throwing a volume control in between the two not compromise this?



More than one way to skin a cat. Doesnt matter how you get there, just that youre happy with the result. Some people want all the distortion from the amp, some want a crystal clean to run pedals off of and some people are in between. I set mine so that I can get clean or dirty with just pick attack, like just on the edge of breakup. I then use Boost, OD and Distortion to layer it on thicker to suit the needs of the song. Roll off guitar volumes, use coil taps or switch pickups as needed to achieve cleaner tones.


----------



## vtrain

bradley Thomas Wilson said:


> Yea totally nothing to loose. They have killer return policy. Basically a try before you are stuck with it. They will return anything. And it is fast to get cash back on the card. I have never been stuck with something that was broken or wrong or I didn't want. So totally no risk there at all. And you got a seriously cool rig. No way you'll get rid of it. heh



Well, I sent it back. Basically, I could not get a good tone out of it at anything approaching an acceptable volume level. I not only have other people in the house, I’m also dealing with some tinnitus in my left ear, undoubtedly from too much time spent too close to guitars amps and PA cabinets. Thinking I may need to just get some ear plugs that will keep the SPL down for me. But bottom line, the SV20H wasn’t going to work. I’m giving the Origin 20 combo a whirl, to see if the additional drop in output wattage and the master volume help me get the tones I’m looking for at lower volumes. Oh, well. If you see it pop back up on Amazon, I hope you grab it. I would have offered it here, but with sales tax and shipping I would have either had to bump the price or take a loss. This way, UPS picked it up from my house and I should have my full purchase price back on my Amazon card in a few days.


----------



## Biff Maloy

RCM 800 said:


> More than one way to skin a cat. Doesnt matter how you get there, just that youre happy with the result. Some people want all the distortion from the amp, some want a crystal clean to run pedals off of and some people are in between. I set mine so that I can get clean or dirty with just pick attack, like just on the edge of breakup. I then use Boost, OD and Distortion to layer it on thicker to suit the needs of the song. Roll off guitar volumes, use coil taps or switch pickups as needed to achieve cleaner tones.



Yeah. I get it and not everybody going for the same thing. Master on 8, Pre 6-8 and my Les Paul i hardly ever use anything to push it other than my right hand. That is when it's best to me. I've also scaled it back but clean and got dirt if needed mostly from pedals. It seems though the volume in the loop is for cutting the volume fairly low on one that goes to .5 watts and has a master volume already. I guess i can try it and see but it has always sounded odd to cut volume there at the loop.


----------



## Biff Maloy

Or maybe I'm just getting old because i remember practicing with a JCM800 stack at less than tv volume using a TS in my upstairs bedroom as a teenager. Never gave it a second thought.


----------



## RCM 800

Biff Maloy said:


> Or maybe I'm just getting old because i remember practicing with a JCM800 stack at less than tv volume using a TS in my upstairs bedroom as a teenager. Never gave it a second thought.


yea I have a 2204 and 4x12 and turning mine down as low as it goes on the hi input is still a lot louder than my 20 on the mid power setting where Ive been playing mostly. I have a little Ludwig pocket drum set and a fender rumble 100 bass amp and everything works together really well. My bandmates dont have to lug their own gear over to practice and I rarely get tinnitus anymore. I really have started being more concerned about my hearing as both my parents are using hearing aids now and Id like to avoid that if possible.


----------



## tonycaster

I've just made a tube swap, putting some tungsols as pres and original svetlanas as powers: the controls are more useable, especially presence and tilt. What I don't like is the effects loop, which I never liked in most amps, and the boost, which tends to mud everything with gain above 6. I'm also finding this amp to give its best with the master above 8 and the gain above 6, even @ low power settings. I can get a great crunch with a SSS strat and use pedals (an AC booster with vol maxed and gain below 10 o'clock is enough) to push it into higher gain territories, although not real high gain, but enough to nail EVH tones, which is more than fine to me. As far as effects, I use another amp for the wet/dry thing, taking the signal from the DI out, going into a strymon mobius>DLS echotap>TC HoF2>ground loop killer>VHT Special6 Ultra, just magic. Maybe not a bedroom amp, but @ min power settings is quiet enough that cones struggle to move...


----------



## Biff Maloy

tonycaster said:


> I've just made a tube swap, putting some tungsols as pres and original svetlanas as powers: the controls are more useable, especially presence and tilt. What I don't like is the effects loop, which I never liked in most amps, and the boost, which tends to mud everything with gain above 6. I'm also finding this amp to give its best with the master above 8 and the gain above 6, even @ low power settings. I can get a great crunch with a SSS strat and use pedals (an AC booster with vol maxed and gain below 10 o'clock is enough) to push it into higher gain territories, although not real high gain, but enough to nail EVH tones, which is more than fine to me. As far as effects, I use another amp for the wet/dry thing, taking the signal from the DI out, going into a strymon mobius>DLS echotap>TC HoF2>ground loop killer>VHT Special6 Ultra, just magic. Maybe not a bedroom amp, but @ min power settings is quiet enough that cones struggle to move...



I had a VHT S6U a few years back. I liked that little amp. 

Yes, rolling tubes makes a difference in the Origin. Stock, i thought it sounded decent but a little splatty in the high end. I just tried some Tungsols in the preamp. I have Mullard EL34 in the power but I'm waiting for some KT77 to come in.

I normally don't use the effects loop other than for low volume ambience i run a HOF Reverb in it. I notice a little thinning out if using it up loud. I run everything else in front.


----------



## tonycaster

This morning I tried a Sovtek 12ax7LPS in V3, which should be the phase inverter, and I could use the presence control further than 5, even at extreme settings is still listenable without piercing!


----------



## jeffb

LPS is probably the best overall current production PI out there. Warm. Smooth. Mine had a pin get wobbly and I've retired it. Otherwise I'd be using it.

In the (b)right amp, it makes a pretty good gain stage tube too if it doesnt get microphonic on you.


----------



## tonycaster

In the Origin I found the best results with tung sol press and Sovtek LPS in the PI, in my 2203 I had great results with EH 12ax7 and LPS in the PI.
I bought an used Palmer 1x12 open cab and thrown a G12H30 16 ohm which I didn't use; the tone is stellar, really, and this tiny cab (which is bigger and better sounding than any other I've tried) makes justice to the head, both at low or high volumes. It sounds big enough that I'm not missing the 2x12 I'm using with the 2203, and at way more manageable levels...


----------



## MatFnEhUK

tonycaster said:


> In the Origin I found the best results with tung sol press and Sovtek LPS in the PI, in my 2203 I had great results with EH 12ax7 and LPS in the PI.
> I bought an used Palmer 1x12 open cab and thrown a G12H30 16 ohm which I didn't use; the tone is stellar, really, and this tiny cab (which is bigger and better sounding than any other I've tried) makes justice to the head, both at low or high volumes. It sounds big enough that I'm not missing the 2x12 I'm using with the 2203, and at way more manageable levels...


Nice! Which G12H30 you using? The 55Hz or the 75Hz?


----------



## tonycaster

MatFnEhUK said:


> Nice! Which G12H30 you using? The 55Hz or the 75Hz?


it's the 75hz made in UK (about 2001), but is plenty of bass! with that cab it's huge, really. I had several 1x12 combos and cabs, I tried the same speaker but it always sounded thin and small, I have to admit that the Palmer 1x12 opens back is really good, even though is made of particle board and the baffle is in MDF


----------



## coyoteblue

I'm wondering what reverb pedals work well with your Origin. I've been using an EHX Oceans 11 since I bought the amp last year but find now that it's quite a tone sucking pedal. I know reverbs colour sound but is anyone using a reverb pedal that better preserves the sound of this amp. Thanks.


----------



## tce63

coyoteblue said:


> I'm wondering what reverb pedals work well with your Origin. I've been using an EHX Oceans 11 since I bought the amp last year but find now that it's quite a tone sucking pedal. I know reverbs colour sound but is anyone using a reverb pedal that better preserves the sound of this amp. Thanks.



I use my TC-E HOF, great pedal


----------



## vtrain

TXOldRedRocker said:


> Personally, I use a JHS Little Black Amp Box. I can crank the amp up all the way and control the speaker volume with it.
> 
> https://www.jhspedals.info/little-black-amp-box



Is that working well with your Origin 20? I tried it with my SV20H, initially with an overdrive pedal with the gain turned down all the way, just using the level to adjust the volume. It worked great, but when I tried an actual volume control like the JHS unit, it basically did nothing (I was only able to control clean volume). So there must've been some gain still leaking out from my overdrive, even with the dial down to zero. I returned the SV20H because it was basically too much amp for my needs, and picked up the Origin 20 combo. I am getting good tones from it at reasonable volumes, but if your JHS unit is working well for you, maybe I should try it.


----------



## TXOldRedRocker

vtrain said:


> Is that working well with your Origin 20? I tried it with my SV20H, initially with an overdrive pedal with the gain turned down all the way, just using the level to adjust the volume. It worked great, but when I tried an actual volume control like the JHS unit, it basically did nothing (I was only able to control clean volume). So there must've been some gain still leaking out from my overdrive, even with the dial down to zero. I returned the SV20H because it was basically too much amp for my needs, and picked up the Origin 20 combo. I am getting good tones from it at reasonable volumes, but if your JHS unit is working well for you, maybe I should try it.




Yes, personally, I love it. I have the MV turned way up to push the amp. The 20H Gain changes based on what I am doing. But I have a ton of pedals and mess around with lots of tones. It I want something really dirty I can crank up the amp gain, the overdrive and others to push them hard, and then just control the volume coming out of the speaker, so to speak. No complaints from the family or neighbors. That JHS sits up on top of the amp and is easy to see and get to.


----------



## vtrain

So I cracked open my 20C last night and installed Tung-Sol 12AX7's in V1 and V2. I noticed the original Marshall tubes were not the same, V1 had red print and V2 seemed to have brown/gold print on it, and the construction was a bit different between them. Actually, I had no complaints about the sound of the original tubes.

The Tung-Sols, which had worked well in the Origin 5, turned out to not be an improvement in the 20C. There was more gain, but the sound was a bit more buzzy and not as smooth as with the original tubes. Maybe I'll switch their positions to see if that helps at all, but if not, I might just put the original tubes back in.


----------



## jeffb

Unless they have changed things- the Origins ship with a Marshall labeled JJ ECC83S in V1, and Shugang/Sino 12ax7's in V2/V3

I don't feel the Shugs are the best for those spots, but I like the Shugs in my DSL in V1 and the CF (V3).

I've never had much luck with (reissue/New Sensor/Russian)Tung-Sol 12ax7s- They sound big, yes, but bloated in the low mids and have this grainy thing going on the top. They also are short-lived in the CF and PI position. I think they would probably be a much better tube in American style pre-amps. But that's just IME with my rig and speakers. YMMV.


----------



## vtrain

jeffb said:


> Unless they have changed things- the Origins ship with a Marshall labeled JJ ECC83S in V1, and Shugang/Sino 12ax7's in V2/V3
> 
> I don't feel the Shugs are the best for those spots, but I like the Shugs in my DSL in V1 and the CF (V3).
> 
> I've never had much luck with (reissue/New Sensor/Russian)Tung-Sol 12ax7s- They sound big, yes, but bloated in the low mids and have this grainy thing going on the top. They also are short-lived in the CF and PI position. I think they would probably be a much better tube in American style pre-amps. But that's just IME with my rig and speakers. YMMV.



That must be the case with the different tubes, thanks for explaining that. They actually sounded pretty good. I think I'll swap them back in.

The Tung-Sols worked great in the Origin 5, which might be because that amp lacked a master volume. They increased the gain and sounded more musical with an improved frequency response, no grainy thing (which must be what I call buzz). Perhaps the fact that the Origin 5 comes across more like a Champ than a Marshall explains why the Tung-Sols work well there.


----------



## jeffb

vtrain said:


> That must be the case with the different tubes, thanks for explaining that. They actually sounded pretty good. I think I'll swap them back in.
> 
> The Tung-Sols worked great in the Origin 5, which might be because that amp lacked a master volume. They increased the gain and sounded more musical with an improved frequency response, no grainy thing (which must be what I call buzz). Perhaps the fact that the Origin 5 comes across more like a Champ than a Marshall explains why the Tung-Sols work well there.




And EL-84s occupy a different frequency range as well. The Tung Sols sound better in my Class 5 and my Orange OR15 than they do in my Big Bottle amps.


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Hey everybody

Have a mostly accurate schematic for the Origin 20... :-D 

There's just the last bits of the power amp to finish off, but they weren't in doubt as to how they work.

The Phase Inverter was in doubt back at the beginning, but it's a standard PI, with all the right components.

The Master Volume has obviously been a trickster for me.
I suspected it of been pre-PI, based on looking at it from above. Then I flipped the board and it confused the issue as the lines that went to pins 1 and 6 seemed to also go to the flyover for the master and presence, which would have made it post PI.
However, following it thoroughly now, it's definitely going to pin 2, which actually puts it pre PI (pins 1 and 6 are actually going to the Presence control)... so... at least I finally solved the riddle.

There's 3 mistakes I put crosses next to, 2 above V2, where I moved a resistor and capacitor to the right place, now after V2.
And after V3, I put the capacitor between the 2 resistors after the plates.

I've had a peek at doing the switching relays, and it's a whole other page for all that. They're all for the footswitch, boost, fx loop, and the power scaling. But it's just a bit time consuming.




There's a chap in the Workbench section of the forum gave me a good basis to do this sketch. He's done a good job, got it mostly there, and with using my pictures of the underside I tweaked it....

Need to go through and add on all the numbers too, so still working on it... I'll get there eventually.

It's pretty much a classic circuit, between JTM45/plexi style. All the classic components are there, with some switches and a DI, and power scaling... Good stuff, great price.


----------



## Msharky67

So does this answer my question of is the master volume placed in the wrong spot? I am just wondering. If so I feel this is why I didn't like the amp. It does not respond like a P-T-M-B-MV-G layout! I am really bummed about this amp. I was hoping for more but it just didn't sound right for me.


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Msharky67 said:


> So does this answer my question of is the master volume placed in the wrong spot? I am just wondering. If so I feel this is why I didn't like the amp. It does not respond like a P-T-M-B-MV-G layout! I am really bummed about this amp. I was hoping for more but it just didn't sound right for me.



Well, that depends where you believe the 'wrong' place to be....

Bear in mind the master volume JMPs, 1986 and JCM800s are PRE Phase Inverter masters, such as this.... But that doesn't mean I agree that's the best place for the master volume (though my tech friends say it is and can't understand why I'd change it... But...)

Lets say an early JMP Plexi would go:
Input 1 > V1a > Gain > V2 > BMT > MV > PI > V4+V5 > Output
Input 2 > V1b > Gain /\ (as above)

Then lets say a JCM800 2204 goes:
Input > V1b > Gain > V1a > V2 > BMT > MV > PI > V4+V5 > Output

The Origin goes:
Input > V1a > Gain > V1b > BMT > V2 > MV > PI > V4+V5 > Output

So, really it's the EQ moved to before V2 that's different, possibly so it could be fitted in before the FX loop and power scaling. But, that shouldn't have much of an effect. For the most part, with the exception of the resistor and capacitor values(which makes a big difference), the layout looks similar to something between the 2, and more like an 800.

But, I do think (as many have done about the 800s and JMPs) it may benefit from a PPIMV mod.... Luckily, I can now see just how easy that is to do, and it's a matter of just moving 2 wires over.

I'll draw that up and post it too... ;-) 

Don't be too disappointed, either way it's based on a pretty clean, simple amp, that's not gonna be a hi-gain monster, and this is why everybody in the 80s had to push their Marshalls with pedals... Which made some pedal manufacturers and their units very popular. :-D


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Pre PI MV to Post PI MV mod

Ignore where it says 'pin 7' should be 'pin 6'.







So yeah, if you locate the 4 cables that fly over to underneath the phase inverter, or V3 as it's labelled.

We need to unplug the 2 on the left side, on the main board. There's 2 wires in each cable, but that doesn't mean anything for our purposes, and won't affect the outcome.

Use a small electronics screwdriver to release the clasp holding the wire on the connector.

Then we need to unplug the other 2 cables for the presence circuit.
We need to combine 1 volume cable to 1 presence cable. Right to right, left to left.

Finally we need to push the combined cables back into the holes for the presence, these are the 4 on the right hand of the picture.

Before finishing we need to reconnect the signal going to pin 2, we could take all the board out and solder a join between hole 1 and 3, or we could push a peice of shielded wire into holes 1 and 3 that we've just removed.

Now the master volume will be what is known as a Type 3/Crossline PPIMV.


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

I mean, you could also, if you wanted both options, add another pot and just wire it to the presence pot (the presence pot in NOT using the negative feedback it appears, it is blending two caps between the 2 signal paths.... Actually, you know what that's like doing? Tone Cut on a Vox... :-O ).

Anyway yeah, you could easily add another pot and connect lugs 3 and 2 to lugs 3 and 2 on the presence pot, drill a hole and then you'd have 'gain', 'pre master' and 'post master'.

OR, you could literally just push the wires from your new MV pot into the holes where the white wires are for the Presence. (Might do that one actually).


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Schematic update, filled in the resistors and did up until the power valves, will finish that off at some point.

Please ignore my daughters crayon intrusion on the bottom corner, she wanted to help me colour it in.
When do they go back to school? XD haha.

Anyway, I hope it helps someone, it is all from what I have traced and can see is going where...


----------



## L Newman

I'm curious. IS it possible to use the combo speaker PLUS an extension cab of some sort?


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

L Newman said:


> I'm curious. IS it possible to use the combo speaker PLUS an extension cab of some sort?



As long as both are 16 ohm, yes.
But just make sure the speaker outs on the back say '16 ohm', '8 ohm' and '2x16 ohm'.

If it says '8 ohm' twice it has the speaker issue that they originally shipped with.


----------



## L Newman

Jason Fieldhouseespk said:


> As long as both are 16 ohm



So, the combo speaker out of the 16ohm and a 16 ohm extension cab out of the second 2 x 16 ohm out?


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Not quite, the 2x16ohm out is the 2 8ohm outs used together.  as the cabs would equal 8 ohm total.


----------



## vtrain

I saw a comment on YouTube that Tung-Sol reissues in V1 and V2 with the stock V1 in the V3/PI position is great, so I tried it. While I like it better than the Tung-Sol V1 and V2 with the stock PI tube, it's not as good as all three stock tubes in their original locations.

I also tried an Eminence Cannabis Rex 10. Nice speaker, and very loud, but the distortion is quite aggressive sounding. Might be good for a higher gain amp.

Then tried a G10 Greenback. Jackpot! Really good vintage Marshall tones with that, much better than the stock G10 VT Jr. Think I'll stick with that, and if I experiment with more speakers in the future, they'll be 12".


----------



## Alloftheabove

Hi all, 
Pardon my complete ignorance:
I've notice when im playing through my Gibson with humbuckers that my 20c is 'crackling' with gain roughly at 3 onwards. Could this be indicative for a valve about to fail? Would this be self serviceable for a complete noob like myself or should let a tech handle it?


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Alloftheabove said:


> Hi all,
> Pardon my complete ignorance:
> I've notice when im playing through my Gibson with humbuckers that my 20c is 'crackling' with gain roughly at 3 onwards. Could this be indicative for a valve about to fail? Would this be self serviceable for a complete noob like myself or should let a tech handle it?


If you have a known good preamp tube, try it in the first position, test amp, if the crackling continues move and test the next and so on, your amp is self biasing so no need to go to a tech, if you get the same results in all 3 positions, take a pencil and with the eraser side check your power tubes , with the amp on as you would for playing tap the big tubes, if you hear the crackling then it’s one or both of your power tubes , you can try the test in any order, big tubes first (EL34’s) or the preamp tubes the smaller ones (12AX7’s) good luck with your amp brother but my gut tells me you have a tube going south.
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## Alloftheabove

Thanks! possibly a very silly question with a very obvious answer. How do you get access to the valves in the combo? I am assuming that you would have to remove the chassis?

Is this safe to do? What are the precautions I need to take?


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Alloftheabove said:


> Thanks! possibly a very silly question with a very obvious answer. How do you get access to the valves in the combo? I am assuming that you would have to remove the chassis?
> 
> Is this safe to do? What are the precautions I need to take?


I think you just remove the back, mine are the heads, but my Dsl40c’s are combos, and I just pull the back panel , and you should be able to access them.
Be sure to watch how the pins are oriented ..
Cheers


----------



## Alloftheabove

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> I think you just remove the back, mine are the heads, but my Dsl40c’s are combos, and I just pull the back panel , and you should be able to access them.
> Be sure to watch how the pins are oriented ..
> Cheers


Thanks! 

I found a thread about this on a 50c. Am I correct in thinking that I can remove the rear baffle which is the centre panel which covers the back of the speaker and get access to the valves that way? 

Just seems like a tight space to working in with obstructed visibility...


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Alloftheabove said:


> Thanks!
> 
> I found a thread about this on a 50c. Am I correct in thinking that I can remove the rear baffle which is the centre panel which covers the back of the speaker and get access to the valves that way?
> 
> Just seems like a tight space to working in with obstructed visibility...


I believe you can, and I know about those spaces and not having very good visibility.
I bent the pins on a tube and had to straighten them, good luck brother.
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## BatmansMarshall

Can anyone here with an Origin recommend some overdrives or boosts for me? The Origin also has its own boost and at the moment I also have an Earthquaker Devices Dunes Mosfet/Si OD with an 808-style tone. It can also act clear on the clear switch. I have a boost with some color called Arrows also from Earthquaker. I have a Ibanez TS9. 

I am not so much looking for pedals aimed at being a distortion pedal as I have those. If it leans towards being an OD then maybe. What I want is to is pretty much what I am doing already. Trying to find some good ways to boost the Origin. I have a graphic equalizer also. I run it at the very end of the chain. So what OD recommendations can people give me to hit this amp with. I don't mind if the recommendation is for metal, blues or folk as long as you got some really noticeable tones that make you think this is a good combination and a keeper.


----------



## tonycaster

BatmansMarshall said:


> Can anyone here with an Origin recommend some overdrives or boosts for me? The Origin also has its own boost and at the moment I also have an Earthquaker Devices Dunes Mosfet/Si OD with an 808-style tone. It can also act clear on the clear switch. I have a boost with some color called Arrows also from Earthquaker. I have a Ibanez TS9.
> 
> I am not so much looking for pedals aimed at being a distortion pedal as I have those. If it leans towards being an OD then maybe. What I want is to is pretty much what I am doing already. Trying to find some good ways to boost the Origin. I have a graphic equalizer also. I run it at the very end of the chain. So what OD recommendations can people give me to hit this amp with. I don't mind if the recommendation is for metal, blues or folk as long as you got some really noticeable tones that make you think this is a good combination and a keeper.


I have some good results with Xotic AC Booster, here's a quick demo:

I've also tried a Maxon SD9 in the effects loop with gain slightly above 0, tone @9 o'clock and vol maxed, but not too convincing, it adds too much bass and tends to cloud everything up, the same happened into the front end of the head. The AC booster in front with gain @9 o'clock and vol maxed is a good choice to me, I tried a BB preamp as well, but the AC works better to my ears with this amp


----------



## konrad gibson

BatmansMarshall said:


> Can anyone here with an Origin recommend some overdrives or boosts for me? The Origin also has its own boost and at the moment I also have an Earthquaker Devices Dunes Mosfet/Si OD with an 808-style tone. It can also act clear on the clear switch. I have a boost with some color called Arrows also from Earthquaker. I have a Ibanez TS9.
> 
> I am not so much looking for pedals aimed at being a distortion pedal as I have those. If it leans towards being an OD then maybe. What I want is to is pretty much what I am doing already. Trying to find some good ways to boost the Origin. I have a graphic equalizer also. I run it at the very end of the chain. So what OD recommendations can people give me to hit this amp with. I don't mind if the recommendation is for metal, blues or folk as long as you got some really noticeable tones that make you think this is a good combination and a keeper.


So here you are:





For Joe Bonamassa like sounds I use Friedman dirty Shirley. And to boost the Sound for a vintage tone I use Marshall´s Bluesbreaker pedal (+ or w/o built inOrigin boost)


----------



## konrad gibson

BatmansMarshall said:


> Can anyone here with an Origin recommend some overdrives or boosts for me? The Origin also has its own boost and at the moment I also have an Earthquaker Devices Dunes Mosfet/Si OD with an 808-style tone. It can also act clear on the clear switch. I have a boost with some color called Arrows also from Earthquaker. I have a Ibanez TS9.
> 
> I am not so much looking for pedals aimed at being a distortion pedal as I have those. If it leans towards being an OD then maybe. What I want is to is pretty much what I am doing already. Trying to find some good ways to boost the Origin. I have a graphic equalizer also. I run it at the very end of the chain. So what OD recommendations can people give me to hit this amp with. I don't mind if the recommendation is for metal, blues or folk as long as you got some really noticeable tones that make you think this is a good combination and a keeper.







Marshall´s Bluesbreaker pedal got to modes: Boost and Blues (drive). Blues is an Overdrive with tone , volume and drive knob. In boost mode you only use volume knob.


----------



## Brooklyn

Hello From Brooklyn, NY. I just scored my second Marshall today, an Origin 20H with Marshall SV212 Cab. My teenage son & I will plug this beauty in tonight and check it out. Any setting suggestions for Blues and/or Seattle Rock (Juniors settings) will be greatly appreciated. 

Thank you in advance & stay healthy. PEACE!


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

BatmansMarshall said:


> Can anyone here with an Origin recommend some overdrives or boosts for me? The Origin also has its own boost and at the moment I also have an Earthquaker Devices Dunes Mosfet/Si OD with an 808-style tone. It can also act clear on the clear switch. I have a boost with some color called Arrows also from Earthquaker. I have a Ibanez TS9.
> 
> I am not so much looking for pedals aimed at being a distortion pedal as I have those. If it leans towards being an OD then maybe. What I want is to is pretty much what I am doing already. Trying to find some good ways to boost the Origin. I have a graphic equalizer also. I run it at the very end of the chain. So what OD recommendations can people give me to hit this amp with. I don't mind if the recommendation is for metal, blues or folk as long as you got some really noticeable tones that make you think this is a good combination and a keeper.



Hey there,

I think many people have had success with klon type boosts, I use a EHX Soul Food, sometime I use it as a treble boost type thing, sometimes just as a solo boost, and I think it is a pretty decent overdrive too when you crank the gain. Works on everything, very versatile pedal,  
I love my RAT pedal too, but I have to play with the filter a bit as it's different to when I have it with my Vox.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Brooklyn said:


> Hello From Brooklyn, NY. I just scored my second Marshall today, an Origin 20H with Marshall SV212 Cab. My teenage son & I will plug this beauty in tonight and check it out. Any setting suggestions for Blues and/or Seattle Rock (Juniors settings) will be greatly appreciated.
> 
> Thank you in advance & stay healthy. PEACE!


Pretty much any type of overdrive pedal will give you a great starting point, the amp on its own is fairly clean, but get the volume up over 6 and it starts to really sing, but quite loud, have fun. and experimenting is going to tell your ears what works best for you.
Cheers
Mitch


----------



## Biff Maloy

I prefer Klon types for adding some harmonic content.


----------



## Brooklyn

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> Pretty much any type of overdrive pedal will give you a great starting point, the amp on its own is fairly clean, but get the volume up over 6 and it starts to really sing, but quite loud, have fun. and experimenting is going to tell your ears what works best for you.
> Cheers
> Mitch



Thanks Mitch,

I have too many pedals and I want to put my guitars straight into the 20R and tweak the settings to get that organic Marshall tone. Junior and I will spin the dials often to get the sound we are after. We want to wait some time before putting pedals in the mix. I'll keep you all posted. Thanks again for your input.


----------



## Alloftheabove

Brooklyn said:


> Thanks Mitch,
> 
> I have too many pedals and I want to put my guitars straight into the 20R and tweak the settings to get that organic Marshall tone. Junior and I will spin the dials often to get the sound we are after. We want to wait some time before putting pedals in the mix. I'll keep you all posted. Thanks again for your input.



Just to add to what Mitch had already mentioned. I've found that you really need to push this amp to get a grind- which can get unsocialably loud (if you share walls/floors/ceilings with nieghbours like me)even at its lowest setting. 

Ive also found that i've had to really dig in with my strat to get a bit of break up. While with humbuckers and even p90s you get some nice crunch without much effort.
FWIW:
The guy I bought this amp off of used to keep the EQ dimed, gain pulled and at 3o'clock and the MV a little past noon. Tilt center towards bright and presence to taste. 

You get a smattering of good dirt there. 

Happy exploring/ tweaking !


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Alloftheabove said:


> Just to add to what Mitch had already mentioned. I've found that you really need to push this amp to get a grind- which can get unsocialably loud (if you share walls/floors/ceilings with nieghbours like me)even at its lowest setting.
> 
> Ive also found that i've had to really dig in with my strat to get a bit of break up. While with humbuckers and even p90s you get some nice crunch without much effort.
> FWIW:
> The guy I bought this amp off of used to keep the EQ dimed, gain pulled and at 3o'clock and the MV a little past noon. Tilt center towards bright and presence to taste.
> 
> You get a smattering of good dirt there.
> 
> Happy exploring/ tweaking !


I have been leaving the amps gain off, and using a pedal, it’s still loud, but I love the old school flavor it has ..
Thanks


----------



## Biff Maloy

I've gone back and forth about the amp's gain boost. On one hand it's nice to have when plugged straight in. Some echo in the loop and it's a bare bones setup i can live with. But, different pedals add their own flavor so with them i never use it. 

I don't think the built in boost is that bad really. Maybe because lately i have been giving it more a go again.


----------



## jeffb

The Boost function is great- up to a certain point - then it turns to fizz. It seems to be a very fine line for my setup. I would prefer to have it on all the time when the voltage is dropped because it beefs the amp up. So I tend to start out with it on, and sculpt from there. I don't think it's as good as some of the great pedals out there, but it's better than alot of them.


----------



## TXOldRedRocker

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> I have been leaving the amps gain off, and using a pedal, it’s still loud, but I love the old school flavor it has ..
> Thanks



I see my Origin as a 2 channel amp, with the amp itself being the clean channel. The second channel as my pedals. IMHO it's a great platform for pedals. Especially a 4 cable setup pedalboard.


----------



## vtrain

Alloftheabove said:


> Thanks!
> 
> I found a thread about this on a 50c. Am I correct in thinking that I can remove the rear baffle which is the centre panel which covers the back of the speaker and get access to the valves that way?
> 
> Just seems like a tight space to working in with obstructed visibility...



The chassis is bolted to the rear panel directly under the controls. Lay the amp speaker pointing down and unscrew the rear panel with the four small screws, and lift the chassis and panel out of the amp as one. Do not remove the larger bolts that hold the chassis to the panel, it’s unnecessary for a tube swap. Once you lift the panel and chassis out of the cab together as one, just set the panel down with the tubes facing up and swapping them is easy. Make sure you unplug the speaker and power cord from the chassis before removing it from the amp.


----------



## Alloftheabove

vtrain said:


> The chassis is bolted to the rear panel directly under the controls. Lay the amp speaker pointing down and unscrew the rear panel with the four small screws, and lift the chassis and panel out of the amp as one. Do not remove the larger bolts that hold the chassis to the panel, it’s unnecessary for a tube swap. Once you lift the panel and chassis out of the cab together as one, just set the panel down with the tubes facing up and swapping them is easy. Make sure you unplug the speaker and power cord from the chassis before removing it from the amp.


Thanks! I actually pulled it out the other day pretty straightforward forward. Is it safe to power it up when it is out of the cab? Was speaking to an amp tech earlier today who suggested re seating the valves i'm going to give that a go and see what happens.


----------



## vtrain

Alloftheabove said:


> Thanks! I actually pulled it out the other day pretty straightforward forward. Is it safe to power it up when it is out of the cab? Was speaking to an amp tech earlier today who suggested re seating the valves i'm going to give that a go and see what happens.



It’s safe, just make sure your speaker load is plugged in correctly, and don’t reach inside the chassis and touch anything! Even when the amp is off and unplugged, the filter caps hold a big charge and are capable of delivering it.


----------



## Axis39

vtrain said:


> It’s safe, just make sure your speaker load is plugged in correctly, and don’t reach inside the chassis and touch anything! Even when the amp is off and unplugged, the filter caps hold a big charge and are capable of delivering it.



A note here... On the Origins (not most tube amps, by the way) you do not have to have a speaker plugged in. If no speaker is plugged in, the amp has an internal load to keep from frying the output transformer. It allows you to do silent recording, or plug into a headphone amp for 'silent' playing.

But, you cannot plug or unplug a speaker while the amp is powered on!


----------



## vtrain

Axis39 said:


> A note here... On the Origins (not most tube amps, by the way) you do not have to have a speaker plugged in. If no speaker is plugged in, the amp has an internal load to keep from frying the output transformer. It allows you to do silent recording, or plug into a headphone amp for 'silent' playing.
> 
> But, you cannot plug or unplug a speaker while the amp is powered on!



Interesting, I missed that feature in the manual. Looks like the Origin 5 doesn't share that feature with the 20 and 50, since it doesn't have a DI output.

I wonder if anyone has tried connecting the DI output on the 20 or 50 to a solid state power amp and then connecting that power amp to either the internal combo speaker or a separate cabinet, as a way of "attenuating" the Origin.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

vtrain said:


> Interesting, I missed that feature in the manual. Looks like the Origin 5 doesn't share that feature with the 20 and 50, since it doesn't have a DI output.
> 
> I wonder if anyone has tried connecting the DI output on the 20 or 50 to a solid state power amp and then connecting that power amp to either the internal combo speaker or a separate cabinet, as a way of "attenuating" the Origin.


I have never tried that, but thanks for the intel.
Mitch


----------



## Axis39

vtrain said:


> Interesting, I missed that feature in the manual. Looks like the Origin 5 doesn't share that feature with the 20 and 50, since it doesn't have a DI output.
> 
> I wonder if anyone has tried connecting the DI output on the 20 or 50 to a solid state power amp and then connecting that power amp to either the internal combo speaker or a separate cabinet, as a way of "attenuating" the Origin.



Well, I ran my Origin 20 from the D/I out into my Behringer XR-18 and out into powered speakers a bunch of times. I've used it at shows to improve FOH sound, while keeping stage volume under control. I've used ti at home to test out the sound as well... Without cranking it.

I guess you could really just run it straight into a powered speaker as well...


----------



## vtrain

Axis39 said:


> Well, I ran my Origin 20 from the D/I out into my Behringer XR-18 and out into powered speakers a bunch of times. I've used it at shows to improve FOH sound, while keeping stage volume under control. I've used ti at home to test out the sound as well... Without cranking it.
> 
> I guess you could really just run it straight into a powered speaker as well...



This is kind of blowing my mind right now. I don't have a powered speaker or even a suitable separate amp, but I feel I must try this. I'm guessing the speaker emulation is at least acceptable?


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

So, yes, indeed it would go into a power amp and then to a speaker of your choosing.  

Ok, I am right now dismantling the micro RC connector for the master volume. If this works and anyone else is interested in it, you'll need to know about this video, to disassemble the connector.  If I get it done I should have tested it by Sunday. Will report back then.


----------



## Axis39

vtrain said:


> This is kind of blowing my mind right now. I don't have a powered speaker or even a suitable separate amp, but I feel I must try this. I'm guessing the speaker emulation is at least acceptable?



The second gig that I tried it at was an outdoor party. We ran the Origin into the PA. After we'd been playing a little bit, I asked the party-goers if the sound was good, how was the balance, blah, blah, blah. They all hefted beers and yelled. We took a break and it turned out there were four or five guitar players in the crowd. Well, they all rushed up to see what our set up was. Of course we got to talking about my new amp and they all gushed about how it sounded.

I actually haven't done anything to my amp (other than get the warranty speaker out fix done). No new tubes, stock speaker, etc. I actually really like the stock speaker. All that to qualify the idea that to me, the speaker emulation sounds just fine!


----------



## Alloftheabove

So my attenuator finally arrived this morning. The growl on this thing is so bloody beautiful when you open her up! 

Still not sure what is going on though- Not spitting as much as it was previously and definitely not spitting at all with the strat plugged in.


----------



## vtrain

Alloftheabove said:


> So my attenuator finally arrived this morning. The growl on this thing is so bloody beautiful when you open her up!
> 
> Still not sure what is going on though- Not spitting as much as it was previously and definitely not spitting at all with the strat plugged in.



What exactly do you mean by spitting?


----------



## Alloftheabove

vtrain said:


> What exactly do you mean by spitting?


The other week I plugged in a gibson with humbuckers and the sound was very broken -spitting and crunchy particularly with the gain dialed up. It goes away when clean. I tried to upload an audio clip but I couldn't for some odd reason. 

In any case I thought it was a valve on the way out. But I plugged in the attenuator this afternoon and its virtually disappeared. Which I thought was odd.


----------



## L Newman

Axis39 said:


> ... (other than get the warranty speaker out fix done)...!


 ??


----------



## Axis39

L Newman said:


> ??



The first releases had an issue with the speaker out jacks. They were mis-wired. So, the warranty work was a single wire, and a sticker. There's a lot of info online about it.


----------



## Buzzard

Is the or 20 tube or solid state rectified?


----------



## jeffb

SS.

Only tube rectified Marshalls are the JTM45 RI (and originals, obviously)


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Hazzah, finally finished the master volume change.

Had a plan in mind, to just use the existing cables, and although it was along the right lines, after disconnecting the wires from the connector clip I just found them too small and fiddly. In the end I found it easier to solder direct to the board and components.

So basically I bypassed the path of the old master volume (the short wire). Added the 2 wires for the new path, and soldered them to the original wires going to the current master volume...

1 slight problem.... the new wires are connected the wrong way around it would seem, and now the pot is ass about tit, turning it to ten is all the way off, turn it down to turn it up. Bugger!

It's no problem, easy enough to switch them from the top now anyway, which I can do Saturday. At least I don't have to go back underneath for a bit.
And at least I know it works as intended, it is a master volume, and it doesn't change the tone at all now.




Finally, there's still a niggly little annoyance, because of the type of taper of the pot, it goes from silence to full on pretty quickly, at about a 3rd of the way, and the rest of the travel doesn't change the volume at all...
Might look into changing the pot to linear taper eventually.

But for now, we'll see what it behaves like at the next band practice...


----------



## joe_cpwe

KiwiDrew said:


> Hey guys, finally finished up refurbishing my old 8412 cab to pair with the origin 20 head. Here's a couple before pics.
> 
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> __ Feb 24, 2020
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> 
> Was thrilled to find out the original baffle was made out of plywood, I had planned on fabbing a new one. However, I did cut a new back panel out of Birch ply. New hardware, new vintage style grill cloth and steel side handles.
> 
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> __ Feb 24, 2020
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> 
> And the final product.
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The cabinet refurb looks great. I'm looking at picking one up at GC to use with a Artist (24") head I just bought. There's some internet hate on these cabinets. Plywood baffle, that's awesome. You obviously like the cabinet enough to fix it up. I'm thinking that I'd use as a 2x12 to lessen the weight a little bit. The cabinet size + a plywood baffle for the price are luring to me.


----------



## nrjdennis1

BatmansMarshall said:


> Can anyone here with an Origin recommend some overdrives or boosts for me? The Origin also has its own boost and at the moment I also have an Earthquaker Devices Dunes Mosfet/Si OD with an 808-style tone. It can also act clear on the clear switch. I have a boost with some color called Arrows also from Earthquaker. I have a Ibanez TS9.
> 
> I am not so much looking for pedals aimed at being a distortion pedal as I have those. If it leans towards being an OD then maybe. What I want is to is pretty much what I am doing already. Trying to find some good ways to boost the Origin. I have a graphic equalizer also. I run it at the very end of the chain. So what OD recommendations can people give me to hit this amp with. I don't mind if the recommendation is for metal, blues or folk as long as you got some really noticeable tones that make you think this is a good combination and a keeper.



The only pedal you ever need togther with a Marshall;
SoloDallas - Storm, it is simply awesome...


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

nrjdennis1 said:


> The only pedal you ever need togther with a Marshall;
> SoloDallas - Storm, it is simply awesome...


I need to try one !


----------



## vtrain

I'm now thinking about doing a new cabinet for my Origin 20 combo with the baffle cut out for a 15" Celestion Fullback. Has anyone else thought about or done this? I think a typical 18-watt cabinet would fit, but might have to delete the front valance in order to accommodate the speaker (or make a totally custom one that's a bit taller than usual). Seems like that would be a great combo.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

vtrain said:


> I'm now thinking about doing a new cabinet for my Origin 20 combo with the baffle cut out for a 15" Celestion Fullback. Has anyone else thought about or done this? I think a typical 18-watt cabinet would fit, but might have to delete the front valance in order to accommodate the speaker (or make a totally custom one that's a bit taller than usual). Seems like that would be a great combo.


Give it a whirl , if you don’t like it , you can always change it back !!
Interesting concept though


----------



## RCM 800

Origin 20H, Orange 1x12 V30, my base tone. Mid power setting. Its pretty clean but will break up if I dig in. Strat on fat 50's neck PU. Only effect is delay on my pedal board.


----------



## vtrain

Thought I'd share my absolute favorite settings on the Origin 20 combo. I have a G10 Greenback speaker in it, stock tubes. I generally run it in 5w mode through a Weber MiniMass with some treble boost. These days I'm mostly playing it with a PRS SE 245 Standard, which I was somewhat surprised to love as much as I do. It just feels right in my hands, and feels like a much more expensive guitar than it is. Not sure if I'm in love with the pickups, but I can fix that problem.

On to the settings. I'm not using the "P word", but let's just say I get some excellent vintage Marshall tones at very low volumes with these settings. I can't really explain the rather extreme settings on the bass and treble, but it sounds great. No drive or boost pedals required. The master doesn't really like to be dimed, but from 7-9 sounds right to my ear.

Gain = 7
Boost ON
Tilt = 8
Bass = 1
Mid = 10
Treble = 10
Master = 9
Presence = 9

https://imgur.com/bsu3zfH


----------



## xland

New to the forum and new to Marshall. I just bought an Origin 20C and so far I love it. Vintage Marshall tone was exactly what I wanted and it delivers. And I can't get over how loud it is. Wow.

I run an EP Booster into the amp (with amp boost on) and I can get a really nice OD without having to peel the paint off the walls. Love it. I have used Celestion Creambacks in two other amps and I might try one with this amp. We'll see. In the meantime, I am going to enjoy my new amp.


----------



## tce63

xland said:


> New to the forum and new to Marshall. I just bought an Origin 20C and so far I love it. Vintage Marshall tone was exactly what I wanted and it delivers. And I can't get over how loud it is. Wow.
> 
> I run an EP Booster into the amp (with amp boost on) and I can get a really nice OD without having to peel the paint off the walls. Love it. I have used Celestion Creambacks in two other amps and I might try one with this amp. We'll see. In the meantime, I am going to enjoy my new amp.



Congrats to a great amp.
And  to the forum


----------



## RCM 800

tried the line out into my PA this morning, that was unimpressive lol. Seems like the output was really low.


----------



## Most_Triumphant

Hi all, I'm new to the forum. I ordered a 20H from Prymaxe, but they are back ordered for another week. There is lots of talks about tube swaps. These come stock with JJs correct?


----------



## tce63

Most_Triumphant said:


> Hi all, I'm new to the forum. I ordered a 20H from Prymaxe, but they are back ordered for another week. There is lots of talks about tube swaps. These come stock with JJs correct?



If I remeber correct there was JJ tubes in my 20C

And  to the forum.

Cheers


----------



## Most_Triumphant

tce63 said:


> If I remeber correct there was JJ tubes in my 20C
> 
> And  to the forum.
> 
> Cheers




Thanks! Glad to be here. Any notable mods out for the amp yet? I got mine super cheap and I already have some other amps that I love. This one was for getting some vintage Marshall flavor in an amp that won't break my back.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Most_Triumphant said:


> Thanks! Glad to be here. Any notable mods out for the amp yet? I got mine super cheap and I already have some other amps that I love. This one was for getting some vintage Marshall flavor in an amp that won't break my back.


Congratulations on your new amp score To the forum, I know there is a thread here about a Friedman modded Origin, and as stated by my friend TCE63 I believe JJ’s come stock.
Cheers
Mitch


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

xland said:


> New to the forum and new to Marshall. I just bought an Origin 20C and so far I love it. Vintage Marshall tone was exactly what I wanted and it delivers. And I can't get over how loud it is. Wow.
> 
> 
> I run an EP Booster into the amp (with amp boost on) and I can get a really nice OD without having to peel the paint off the walls. Love it. I have used Celestion Creambacks in two other amps and I might try one with this amp. We'll see. In the meantime, I am going to enjoy my new amp.


Congratulations on your new amp brother 
 To the forum 
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

Hi - I've had an Origin 20H for a few weeks now and mostly loving it.
I'm wondering however if others have issues with fizziness on the low and mid power settings when both gains are turned up?
I get an unpleasant transistor-y type distortion on top when I turn both gains past 7 or so. Isn't there when either is set high on their own, and doesn't seem to be there on full-power mode.
I didn't notice it at first so not sure if its something it developed or I just hadn't pushed it yet. Tried different guitars/pickups, bypassing all loops and effects. Doesn't seem to be as present if I bypass the preamp and go straight into the fx return (but probably less volume feeding the power stage then too).
I've seen a couple of youtube demos with the amp cranked that don't appear to do it and I have some other 12ax7's on the way to try. I can work around it somewhat with the tone stack.
Am I just hitting the limitations of the power scaling or should it sound good dimed on the lower settings too?


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

OriginOfTheSpecies said:


> Hi - I've had an Origin 20H for a few weeks now and mostly loving it.
> I'm wondering however if others have issues with fizziness on the low and mid power settings when both gains are turned up?
> I get an unpleasant transistor-y type distortion on top when I turn both gains past 7 or so. Isn't there when either is set high on their own, and doesn't seem to be there on full-power mode.
> I didn't notice it at first so not sure if its something it developed or I just hadn't pushed it yet. Tried different guitars/pickups, bypassing all loops and effects. Doesn't seem to be as present if I bypass the preamp and go straight into the fx return (but probably less volume feeding the power stage then too).
> I've seen a couple of youtube demos with the amp cranked that don't appear to do it and I have some other 12ax7's on the way to try. I can work around it somewhat with the tone stack.
> Am I just hitting the limitations of the power scaling or should it sound good dimed on the lower settings too?


 To the forum 
I have never noticed much of a change in tone with my 50H’s but I am no longer using the gain/boost function on mine.
I just put a SD1 in front, and only use the mid power, and full power modes.
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Another thing about these amps is they really start to open up and breathe once you get the volume past 5 , and I have never dimed mine, 8 on the dial is cracking good.
Cheers


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

Cheers. Yeah it's when the volume is up that the problem occurs. Sound great up till about 7 then the fizzy distortion (not just power tube grind) sets in. I dont *think* it did it in the first day. Oh well - I have another 12ax7 coming hopefully tomorrow, I'll open up and start switching preamp tubes around (then a trip to the music store to test/compare).


----------



## GarethWP

Hello and I am new to the forum. I wish I had found this last year, before I bought the origin 212 cab to go with my then new Ori20H. I love the tone I am getting, but I know it can be a huge amount better, as the seventy 80s that come loaded into this cab sound very brittle and harsh, I have found that a little tweaking can help, ie presence and tilt tweaks go a long way . Also I have a huge amount of head room and I can only really get that break up with my boss blues driver. Which tends to make fizz. So I have been thinking about upgrades to the speakers and have been considering Greenbacks and vintage 30s, I mostly plug in my 490s loaded les paul, and would really love to get that deep creamy growl that I hear others getting. So is there other speaker options I should consider?


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

GarethWP said:


> Hello and I am new to the forum. I wish I had found this last year, before I bought the origin 212 cab to go with my then new Ori20H. I love the tone I am getting, but I know it can be a huge amount better, as the seventy 80s that come loaded into this cab sound very brittle and harsh, I have found that a little tweaking can help, ie presence and tilt tweaks go a long way . Also I have a huge amount of head room and I can only really get that break up with my boss blues driver. Which tends to make fizz. So I have been thinking about upgrades to the speakers and have been considering Greenbacks and vintage 30s, I mostly plug in my 490s loaded les paul, and would really love to get that deep creamy growl that I hear others getting. So is there other speaker options I should consider?


 To the forum 
I can only comment on the greenbacks, and my Origin’s are the 50H’s, I loaded a pair in a MG slant cab, and they sound great to me.
But I have seen a lot of love for the creamback varieties.
Let your ears tell you what is best for your style of playing..
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## GarethWP

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> To the forum
> I can only comment on the greenbacks, and my Origin’s are the 50H’s, I loaded a pair in a MG slant cab, and they sound great to me.
> But I have seen a lot of love for the creamback varieties.
> Let your ears tell you what is best for your style of playing..
> Cheers
> Mitch


Thank you for the welcome it's good to have the knowledge to tap into, and so..... It could get expensive test driving lots of different speaker combinations for various reasons but covid 19 isn't helping. Also I don't have access to the variety of cabs to plug my 20H and LP into. I bought the origin 212 cab pre lock down and at the advice over the telephone of a sales advisor at a well known UK music shop. On hind sight I would have bought a 112. And I would not have bought the origin cab at all if I had the luxury of being able to listen to it with my rig plugged in. I think that it doesn't help that I am new to electric guitars (I'm an ex acoustic Player) until I got the LP last year.


----------



## scozz

GarethWP said:


> Hello and I am new to the forum. I wish I had found this last year, before I bought the origin 212 cab to go with my then new Ori20H. I love the tone I am getting, but I know it can be a huge amount better, as the seventy 80s that come loaded into this cab sound very brittle and harsh, I have found that a little tweaking can help, ie presence and tilt tweaks go a long way . Also I have a huge amount of head room and I can only really get that break up with my boss blues driver. Which tends to make fizz. So I have been thinking about upgrades to the speakers and have been considering Greenbacks and vintage 30s, I mostly plug in my 490s loaded les paul, and would really love to get that deep creamy growl that I hear others getting. So is there other speaker options I should consider?


 to The Marshall Forum!

Don't overlook the Celestion G12M-65 Creambacks, great speakers. I have a 1-12 loaded with one that I use with my SC20, man it sounds great, full tight lows, mids, and high end is near perfect imo, just a phenomenal sounding speaker!

I also have a 1-12 Made in the UK Greenback that I also use with my SC too, I don't use it very much, actually I'm thinking of selling it. It's just that the Creamback is a much better sounding speaker, better balanced, thicker, fuller lows, more headroom, crisper high end.

Part of the disparty I'm hearing between the two single speakers, could be because imo, a single Greenback doesn't sound good to my ears as it does in a 2-12 or 4-12 cabs. I just prefer the Creamback to the Greenback.


----------



## Biff Maloy

I had the 20H. I preferred either the Celestion Heritage G12M20 or the supposed to be equivalent EVH 20 watts. The 20 watt Heritage sounded best to me after rolling several Celestions. I needed 2 to fill my 2061CX so i ordered the EVH set. I thought they fit, especially with using the amp up very loud breaking up and basically straight in.


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

OriginOfTheSpecies said:


> Sound great up till about 7 then the fizzy distortion (not just power tube grind) sets in. I dont *think* it did it in the first day. Oh well - I have another 12ax7 coming hopefully tomorrow, I'll open up and start switching preamp tubes



I got impatient waiting for the new tube (post is glacial atm). I swapped over the V1 and V2 tubes (look like JJ) and left the PI (interestingly different - shuguang?). Seems to have greatly reduced the fizz so I suspect that Origin-al V1 tube has issues.

Thanks for advice!


----------



## vtrain

OriginOfTheSpecies said:


> I got impatient waiting for the new tube (post is glacial atm). I swapped over the V1 and V2 tubes (look like JJ) and left the PI (interestingly different - shuguang?). Seems to have greatly reduced the fizz so I suspect that Origin-al V1 tube has issues.
> 
> Thanks for advice!



You mean you reversed V1 and V2, or you swapped them out for other tubes you had on hand? My Origin 20 also has the Shuguang PI in V3.


----------



## Barry A

GarethWP said:


> I mostly plug in my 490s loaded les paul, and would really love to get that deep creamy growl that I hear others getting. So is there other speaker options I should consider?



have you considered changing out the preamp tubes? It’ll be far less expensive then changing speakers, and I was able to cut out the harsh bite in my 50H by putting Tung-sols in v1 and V2 and a JJ in the PI. Total cost was around 40 bucks. An EHX Soul Food pedal smooths the tone out even more. 

personally, I’m fine with the stock speakers.


----------



## GarethWP

Barry A said:


> have you considered changing out the preamp tubes? It’ll be far less expensive then changing speakers, and I was able to cut out the harsh bite in my 50H by putting Tung-sols in v1 and V2 and a JJ in the PI. Total cost was around 40 bucks. An EHX Soul Food pedal smooths the tone out even more.
> 
> personally, I’m fine with the stock speakers.



So you also have an Ori 212 cab? And you find the stock 70 80s good?

This guitar tone malarchy is a mire of quicksand that you get sucked into and there seems to be no way out. Oh wow.

OK so I have read and read reviews watched you tube reviews galore (don't find any help there because let's face it discernable differences listened to through the speakers of a phone or tablet are..... Well er not discernable) . And as for reviews.... Well for every review you read saying "this" there's another saying "that" because let's face it tone is subjective and very personal and tinged with things like brand loyalty or prejudices.

Thank you everyone by the way for all information I have been able to read on this thread from all contributing. And please forgive me if it looks like I'm hijacking things. Everything is now as clear as mud. . Speakers are one thing and there I was thinking that 80 watt cheap celestion speakers were my problem and now I'm delving into what is to me the alchemists world of valve changes??

Now I was just going to try to limit damage, I scrimped and scraped to buy my Ori20H and the Ori212 cab not to mention the LP. Seems from reading here and other places I might have been better buying a DSL 1hr and a 1x 10/12 16 0hm cab. Or even a DSL 20hr would have given me the tones I want.

I play at home in a small room with unforgiving neighbours. So I thought two low watt (25 watt greenbacks) would give me 50watts total. which should be a lot kinder than two 80 watt (160 watt) 70 80s. And I had read the previous posts about valve swapping but I had felt that was something someone else does.
So OK I like the idea of £40 instead £200.
Is it difficult to swap valves? The 20h is self biasing?? So no need to bias?? What valves will really improve my tone? ie break up at lower volumes. I have seen mention of JJ valves would a complete valve set change work? Will I still end up buying new greenbacks for my cab?? Think I need a JD my head is starting to hurt with the questions.
Anyway sorry for the diatribe and thanks for any thoughts.
Oh I do have a Boss blues driver which I had read works well with the 20h but just make anything more than the edge of break up sound like angry bees inside a paper bag.


----------



## vtrain

GarethWP said:


> So you also have an Ori 212 cab? And you find the stock 70 80s good?
> 
> This guitar tone malarchy is a mire of quicksand that you get sucked into and there seems to be no way out. Oh wow.
> 
> OK so I have read and read reviews watched you tube reviews galore (don't find any help there because let's face it discernable differences listened to through the speakers of a phone or tablet are..... Well er not discernable) . And as for reviews.... Well for every review you read saying "this" there's another saying "that" because let's face it tone is subjective and very personal and tinged with things like brand loyalty or prejudices.
> 
> Thank you everyone by the way for all information I have been able to read on this thread from all contributing. And please forgive me if it looks like I'm hijacking things. Everything is now as clear as mud. . Speakers are one thing and there I was thinking that 80 watt cheap celestion speakers were my problem and now I'm delving into what is to me the alchemists world of valve changes??
> 
> Now I was just going to try to limit damage, I scrimped and scraped to buy my Ori20H and the Ori212 cab not to mention the LP. Seems from reading here and other places I might have been better buying a DSL 1hr and a 1x 10/12 16 0hm cab. Or even a DSL 20hr would have given me the tones I want.
> 
> I play at home in a small room with unforgiving neighbours. So I thought two low watt (25 watt greenbacks) would give me 50watts total. which should be a lot kinder than two 80 watt (160 watt) 70 80s. And I had read the previous posts about valve swapping but I had felt that was something someone else does.
> So OK I like the idea of £40 instead £200.
> Is it difficult to swap valves? The 20h is self biasing?? So no need to bias?? What valves will really improve my tone? ie break up at lower volumes. I have seen mention of JJ valves would a complete valve set change work? Will I still end up buying new greenbacks for my cab?? Think I need a JD my head is starting to hurt with the questions.
> Anyway sorry for the diatribe and thanks for any thoughts.



You've got the wrong idea about speakers. Lower wattage speakers aren't quieter, loudness is a function of the amplifier and speaker efficiency. Less efficient speakers are quieter than more efficient ones, but that has nothing to do with wattage. The 70/80 and G12M Greenback have the same sensitivity, by the way (98db). So all else equal, they will have equal loudness, at least in theory.

The Origin 20 is cathode biased, but as far as swapping tubes in order to make the amp quieter, I doubt it. But I don't have any experience with that, so others may have better information.

If the amp is too loud even at the lowest power setting, you have two options. Use an overdrive pedal to get breakup at very low clean volumes, or use an attenuator. I use a Weber Mini Mass and can crank the amp pretty well while keeping it to television volume levels, if needed.


----------



## GarethWP

vtrain said:


> You've got the wrong idea about speakers. Lower wattage speakers aren't quieter, loudness is a function of the amplifier and speaker efficiency. Less efficient speakers are quieter than more efficient ones, but that has nothing to do with wattage.
> 
> The Origin 20 is cathode biased, but as far as swapping tubes in order to make the amp quieter, I doubt it. But I don't have any experience with that, so others may have better information.
> 
> If the amp is too loud even at the lowest power setting, you have two options. Use an overdrive pedal to get breakup at very low clean volumes, or use an attenuator. I use a Weber Mini Mass and can crank the amp pretty well while keeping it to television volume levels, if needed.


OK I can see that lower Wattage isn't directly related and I had also understood that the dB rating (1watt at 1mtr away) or sensitivity was the measure of loudness, but I did think that 25 watt greenbacks would maybe give me less headroom and allow me to get the tone I want even if only the characteristics difference between 80 watt 70 80s and 25 watt GBs. 
At the moment if I dime everything even on the lowest 0.1 watt power setting I am still pretty clean in terms of tone. And I have spent hours changing amp and guitar settings trying to optimise. 
Perhaps I will just have to accept that I made the wrong amp and cab choices and that's it.
Blues driver not really helping in any pleasant way.
Accoustic guitar playing was so much simpler. Though didn't make me smile like making the Les Paul cry


----------



## Biff Maloy

An Origin 20 has a certain threshold for volume needed to get the best out of it. Even in it's low .5 watt mode it is hard to tame in a low volume setting. 

I just recently sold my 20H but had and used it a lot since they came out. I thought it was in its best zone at 20 watts, into a 2x12, master on 8 and preamp around 6 to 7. There, i hardly used anything to drive it further. For quiet purposes, i used an EHX Soul Food for drive and i plugged into a 1x12 with a Celestion Heritage G12M20. That is a 96db speaker. It knocks a little volume off. Other than going with attenuation there's not a whole lot i can add to sell you on the amp for your situation. You're right. It just may not be your thing. 

I also had a DSL1HR. Great sounding little amp for the money. I also have all of the Marshall 50th Anniversary 1 watts that came out in 2012. A 1 watt tube amp is the best thing In My Opinion for a dedicated home player looking for tube tone without having to take a 20, 50 or 100 watt amp and choke it with an attenuator. But, they can be fairly loud themselves. If that don't work then i suggest a good modeler, some nice studio monitors. I have a Line 6 Helix i use like that with KRK Rokits and sub all the time.


----------



## GarethWP

Biff Maloy said:


> An Origin 20 has a certain threshold for volume needed to get the best out of it. Even in it's low .5 watt mode it is hard to tame in a low volume setting.
> 
> I just recently sold my 20H but had and used it a lot since they came out. I thought it was in its best zone at 20 watts, into a 2x12, master on 8 and preamp around 6 to 7. There, i hardly used anything to drive it further. For quiet purposes, i used an EHX Soul Food for drive and i plugged into a 1x12 with a Celestion Heritage G12M20. That is a 96db speaker. It knocks a little volume off. Other than going with attenuation there's not a whole lot i can add to sell you on the amp for your situation. You're right. It just may not be your thing.
> 
> I also had a DSL1HR. Great sounding little amp for the money. I also have all of the Marshall 50th Anniversary 1 watts that came out in 2012. A 1 watt tube amp is the best thing In My Opinion for a dedicated home player looking for tube tone without having to take a 20, 50 or 100 watt amp and choke it with an attenuator. But, they can be fairly loud themselves. If that don't work then i suggest a good modeler, some nice studio monitors. I have a Line 6 Helix i use like that with KRK Rokits and sub all the time.



The "financial director i"sn't going to like the way this is going....... Apparently I spend too much already. And I am apparently never happy with what I have and she asks aren't they all the same sounding??
Thank you for the thoughts though.
I bought the valve amp because I had, an admittedly a fairly budget modelling amp and it drove me nuts fiddling with all the settings and still not getting anything I thought sounds nice like other people's valve amps get. I, like so many. Want that valve amp thing.
Don't get me wrong, It's not all about volume but more about tone at an acceptable volume.
I think that I would just buy a dsl1hr but that means a new cab as well.
I actually mostly (apart from the brittle harshness that I still think comes from the 70 80s maybe made worse bt the tone of the ori20 amp) love the low volume clean tones that I am achieving on all power settings from the 0.5 and middle setting right up to the 20 Watts position particularly when the neighbours are out. But I don't have the room or £££s for more amps and cabs and I am beginning to think like other people before have said, whilst the 20h is lovely for what it does, it seems to be, especially when played through the origin 2 x12 cab, it is a one trick pony.
I believe now that I would feel the same but at the opposite end of the spectrum about the higher gain DSL20h I want both in one head. Am I asking too much or is it just too expensive??


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

GarethWP said:


> The "financial director i"sn't going to like the way this is going....... Apparently I spend too much already. And I am apparently never happy with what I have and she asks aren't they all the same sounding??
> Thank you for the thoughts though.
> I bought the valve amp because I had, an admittedly a fairly budget modelling amp and it drove me nuts fiddling with all the settings and still not getting anything I thought sounds nice like other people's valve amps get. I, like so many. Want that valve amp thing.
> Don't get me wrong, It's not all about volume but more about tone at an acceptable volume.
> I think that I would just buy a dsl1hr but that means a new cab as well.
> I actually mostly (apart from the brittle harshness that I still think comes from the 70 80s maybe made worse bt the tone of the ori20 amp) love the low volume clean tones that I am achieving on all power settings from the 0.5 and middle setting right up to the 20 Watts position particularly when the neighbours are out. But I don't have the room or £££s for more amps and cabs and I am beginning to think like other people before have said, whilst the 20h is lovely for what it does, it seems to be, especially when played through the origin 2 x12 cab, it is a one trick pony.
> I believe now that I would feel the same but at the opposite end of the spectrum about the higher gain DSL20h I want both in one head. Am I asking too much or is it just too expensive??


Save up and add the 20hr head to the collection, I started with the DSL40C’s then added the Origin 50H’s, the Origin’s for loud, the 40c’s for low volume, but they can do loud as well.
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## steveb63

^^^^^

Listen to this man, he has been using both those models extensively.

Also, a volume control of some sort in the loop will give up the goods in the pre- amp. The Origin is mainly a pre- amp tone styled amp to begin with.

I believe if you were to try this it might work out alright for you.

Of course IMO.

Good luck, have fun with learning all about your new toys.


----------



## Barry A

GarethWP said:


> So you also have an Ori 212 cab? And you find the stock 70 80s good?
> 
> This guitar tone malarchy is a mire of quicksand that you get sucked into and there seems to be no way out. Oh wow.
> 
> OK so I have read and read reviews watched you tube reviews galore (don't find any help there because let's face it discernable differences listened to through the speakers of a phone or tablet are..... Well er not discernable) . And as for reviews.... Well for every review you read saying "this" there's another saying "that" because let's face it tone is subjective and very personal and tinged with things like brand loyalty or prejudices.
> 
> Thank you everyone by the way for all information I have been able to read on this thread from all contributing. And please forgive me if it looks like I'm hijacking things. Everything is now as clear as mud. . Speakers are one thing and there I was thinking that 80 watt cheap celestion speakers were my problem and now I'm delving into what is to me the alchemists world of valve changes??
> 
> Now I was just going to try to limit damage, I scrimped and scraped to buy my Ori20H and the Ori212 cab not to mention the LP. Seems from reading here and other places I might have been better buying a DSL 1hr and a 1x 10/12 16 0hm cab. Or even a DSL 20hr would have given me the tones I want.
> 
> I play at home in a small room with unforgiving neighbours. So I thought two low watt (25 watt greenbacks) would give me 50watts total. which should be a lot kinder than two 80 watt (160 watt) 70 80s. And I had read the previous posts about valve swapping but I had felt that was something someone else does.
> So OK I like the idea of £40 instead £200.
> Is it difficult to swap valves? The 20h is self biasing?? So no need to bias?? What valves will really improve my tone? ie break up at lower volumes. I have seen mention of JJ valves would a complete valve set change work? Will I still end up buying new greenbacks for my cab?? Think I need a JD my head is starting to hurt with the questions.
> Anyway sorry for the diatribe and thanks for any thoughts.
> Oh I do have a Boss blues driver which I had read works well with the 20h but just make anything more than the edge of break up sound like angry bees inside a paper bag.


Tung sols are well known for smoothing out OD and distortion, and providing a bit more gain at lower volumes. At 12 bucks a piece, it’s a very cheap upgrade. Just need two of them for V1 and V2 in your power amp. Super easy to change tubes. If you can change a light bulb, you can change a tube.


----------



## vtrain

Barry A said:


> If you can change a light bulb, you can change a tube.



That’s a big “if” for me.


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

GarethWP said:


> I bought the valve amp because I had, an admittedly a fairly budget modelling amp and it drove me nuts fiddling with all the settings and still not getting anything I thought sounds nice like other people's valve amps get. I, like so many. Want that valve amp thing.



My background is mostly playing bass live, but had an EG for messing around at home via PC based amp modelling/monitors (amplitube mainly) for many years.
The power scaling for the Origin was a big draw for me over the DSL or other amps on the market. I figured 0.5w would allow me to get cranked AC/DC marshall tones at night time volumes (ha) and the 20w would be enough if I ever start gigging with it.
It is so much more satisfying to play but I too was a bit disappointed that 0.5w (or whatever it really is when cranked) with a 212 is in fact, loud.
However I have found that I can get killer high gain (metal) tones at low volumes with an MI Audio Tube Zone pedal doing all the pre-gain though (not boosting). I reckon I'm going to be able to do the same for classic mid-gain Marshall hard-rock tones with the right pedal (I have a Bogner Blue mini on the way, but there's a heap of great choices out there).
I'm approaching the Origin more as a "pedal platform" with nice cleans but the ability to still do the simple, classic boosted thing at jam/gig volumes. I plan to eventually have 3 or more different, foot-switchable flavours of gain.
Trying a couple S/H MIAB type pedals might get you to where you want for little outlay. I understand wanting to use the amp au naturale, but I think with pedals the origin will provide a better solution for low volume tones than most things. 
One thing if you go down this route is make sure the pedals you choose have effective tone controls (especially mids) and multiple clipping stages for the most pre-amp like tone and shaping. I've had a couple pedals let down by simple tone controls.


----------



## GarethWP

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> Save up and add the 20hr head to the collection, I started with the DSL40C’s then added the Origin 50H’s, the Origin’s for loud, the 40c’s for low volume, but they can do loud as well.
> Cheers
> Mitch


Yes I think a DSL is going to be on my Christmas list


----------



## GarethWP

steveb63 said:


> ^^^^^
> 
> Listen to this man, he has been using both those models extensively.
> 
> Also, a volume control of some sort in the loop will give up the goods in the pre- amp. The Origin is mainly a pre- amp tone styled amp to begin with.
> 
> I believe if you were to try this it might work out alright for you.
> 
> Of course IMO.
> 
> Good luck, have fun with learning all about your new toys.


A volume control plus many more pedals to add to the growing Christmas list


----------



## GarethWP

OriginOfTheSpecies said:


> My background is mostly playing bass live, but had an EG for messing around at home via PC based amp modelling/monitors (amplitube mainly) for many years.
> The power scaling for the Origin was a big draw for me over the DSL or other amps on the market. I figured 0.5w would allow me to get cranked AC/DC marshall tones at night time volumes (ha) and the 20w would be enough if I ever start gigging with it.
> It is so much more satisfying to play but I too was a bit disappointed that 0.5w (or whatever it really is when cranked) with a 212 is in fact, loud.
> However I have found that I can get killer high gain (metal) tones at low volumes with an MI Audio Tube Zone pedal doing all the pre-gain though (not boosting). I reckon I'm going to be able to do the same for classic mid-gain Marshall hard-rock tones with the right pedal (I have a Bogner Blue mini on the way, but there's a heap of great choices out there).
> I'm approaching the Origin more as a "pedal platform" with nice cleans but the ability to still do the simple, classic boosted thing at jam/gig volumes. I plan to eventually have 3 or more different, foot-switchable flavours of gain.
> Trying a couple S/H MIAB type pedals might get you to where you want for little outlay. I understand wanting to use the amp au naturale, but I think with pedals the origin will provide a better solution for low volume tones than most things.
> One thing if you go down this route is make sure the pedals you choose have effective tone controls (especially mids) and multiple clipping stages for the most pre-amp like tone and shaping. I've had a couple pedals let down by simple tone controls.


Yes the Origin is definitely loud if you want to get anything other than clean unless with pedals so..... Pedals are on the shopping list to add to the BD2 I have. And I think the amp we wanted was a DSL 20


----------



## GarethWP

So after my hijack of this thread (my guilty apologies to the OP)

But thank you for everyones input fantastic information and opinions which I'm sure are useful to not just me.
As I have said I am an acoustic chord player, and not a good one. But I have always loved the way guitarists like Gary Moore, Peter Green, Snowy white and many many more create beautiful sound. So I bought a budget Gibson Les Paul and an amp and a cab and though I don't actually know the name of any scales I am loving moving my fingers up and down the fret board in a new way. My wife (the financial director) says I make the guitar wail...... In my head it was cry and sing.
So now I'm finding myself becoming a tone junky. Because the tone in my head isn't quite the one my fingers or the equipment I'm using are getting(probably more my fingers than the equipment) .
So yes I can see valve changes(yes I can change a light bulb) in the not too distant future for the Origin 20h, I can see new speakers for the Origin 2x12 cab, perhaps even a custom cab for the new speakers. And yes definitely a DSL too.
But I have managed to get a little baby Bugera (T5 infinium) head and an ancient Matamp original 1x12 cab loaded with an ancient G12H-100 speaker which I felt didn't love each other, so I swapped cabs and interestingly though neither produce the sounds in my head but I do love the tone coming from both the ori20h with the single G12H-100 and the little bugera is definitely loving the 2x12 seventy 80s.
What I have learned is something good is always possible, with experimentation and some good advice.


----------



## GarethWP

Oops


----------



## scozz

GarethWP said:


> So after my hijack of this thread (my guilty apologies to the OP)
> 
> But thank you for everyones input fantastic information and opinions which I'm sure are useful to not just me.
> As I have said I am an acoustic chord player, and not a good one. But I have always loved the way guitarists like Gary Moore, Peter Green, Snowy white and many many more create beautiful sound. So I bought a budget Gibson Les Paul and an amp and a cab and though I don't actually know the name of any scales I am loving moving my fingers up and down the fret board in a new way. My wife (the financial director) says I make the guitar wail...... In my head it was cry and sing.
> So now I'm finding myself becoming a tone junky. Because the tone in my head isn't quite the one my fingers or the equipment I'm using are getting(probably more my fingers than the equipment) .
> So yes I can see valve changes(yes I can change a light bulb) in the not too distant future for the Origin 20h, I can see new speakers for the Origin 2x12 cab, perhaps even a custom cab for the new speakers. And yes definitely a DSL too.
> But I have managed to get a little baby Bugera (T5 infinium) head and an ancient Matamp original 1x12 cab loaded with an ancient G12H-100 speaker which I felt didn't love each other, so I swapped cabs and interestingly though neither produce the sounds in my head but I do love the tone coming from both the ori20h with the single G12H-100 and the little bugera is definitely loving the 2x12 seventy 80s.
> What I have learned is something good is always possible, with experimentation and some good advice.


 to the Marshall Forum! You'll learn a lot, here if you're interested. A great bunch of guys here with a wealth of information of all things Marshall,...and other gear too!

I'm happy to hear you're enjoying playing electric guitar, a wonderful instrument and hobby, both.

Those little Bugeras' really pump out some tones, I know, I have a G5 Infinium. I never really thought it but I bet those 70/80 speakers do sound good with the T5, if it's anything similar to the G5. The G5 is a slightly dark amp and those 70/80 speakers are very bright sooo, maybe a good combination. I had a 70/80 in a 1-12 Marshall cab I was using with two different Marshall heads, not a good match imo. I changed it out and never thought about trying it with the Bugera,I had a different cab for the Bugera.


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Evening all... interesting conversations I've missed.... 

Hope all are keeping well, and rockin out when and where you can in these tricky times.


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

GarethWP said:


> I think the amp we wanted was a DSL 20



Might have been a more sensible choice and would have been mine if it was in stock at the time.
I do prefer the cleans and the classic rock sounds out of the Origin from the demo's I heard, and I've already nailed the high gain tone I want with the MI Audio Tube Zone (amazing but discontinued pedal if you can find one).
I just had a quick jam on my WFH lunch break with just the Origin and a new sovtek LPS in V1 replacing the problematic, fizz causing JJ I mentioned earlier. It sounded so good, perfect classic 70's Marshall rock tone with my TV Jones equipped Tele. That was on low setting too - still too loud for night practice (think loud TV volume) but fine for day time.
It's the bridge between 70's vintage and modern high-gain I need tie-down now. I can get in the ballpark with a tube screamer or the tube zone but not quite what I'm after yet (still waiting on that bogner blue).
I am really enjoying the trialling and tweaking, building versatility into a simple single channel amp and moulding it into my own - maybe more than I would have with a DSL.



GarethWP said:


> My wife (the financial director) says I make the guitar wail...... In my head it was cry and sing.
> So now I'm finding myself becoming a tone junky. Because the tone in my head isn't quite the one my fingers or the equipment I'm using are getting(probably more my fingers than the equipment) .


 
Haha I know what you mean. I've bought mine a couple of nice things to balance out all the random packages showing up for myself. I haven't traditionally purchased or flipped much music gear, actually this all snowballed after my guitar collection grew from one to three and wanting a basic, real amp for home use instead of modellers. Now it's a gig ready quarter stack, new tubes, pickups, pedals, a powered wedge to run drums through... mostly sticking to second hand but I'm fortunate to now be in a place where I can spend a little on these things.



GarethWP said:


> I can see valve changes(yes I can change a light bulb) in the not too distant future for the Origin 20h



An easy, free experiment if yours has 2 types of 12AX7 installed like mine did is to switch the order around. Try the gold (shuguang) in the first V1 spot - I believe these are meant to be a bit gainier than the red/JJ.


----------



## GarethWP

Thank you again for the new warm welcomes, I got a little tangled trying to reply to all parts of the the thread so decided it would be simpler to start fresh.
Scozz, I am damn surprised by the little T5 I would love to plug into a G5 I think it would be really good pairing with the 70/80s.
Originofthespecies I am now beginning to feel really optimistic about the 20H, since plugging into a 1x12 and hearing a distinct softening of the harsh nasal tones that I think the 70/80s exaggerated it's also getting those softer tones at decent volume levels.
I also swapped out the v1 valve with the v2....... I didn't have any gold tubes ..... There is a red marshall in v1 and the other 2 are white marshall tubes... Anyway definate change to tone. I also swapped the red v1 valve with the red bugera pre amp tube very similar result but the bugera didn't like the red marshall valve that's for sure.
So I have a question...... If I would like to get a bit more growl.... A meatier buzz saw type break up from the Origin 20h can I get it by replacing some or all of the pre amp valves? And if so bearing in mind I have to duck and dive for every guitar penny. What valves would I be best looking to buy? I would, I think, prefer to save for quality. If I'm going to make changes I'd prefer to make it a proper upgrade. And should I change the power amp valves too???
Though yes I do think that I am actually getting the tones I should from the Origin 20 and I know that perhaps if I want the meatier gain tones I should perhaps look at getting a DSL.... But I am now curious to what can be achieved with a few modifications.


----------



## Mark Collier

I have O20 and DSL 20. 

I find the DSL has too much distortion for my taste. Weird because the DSL 5 (from memory) was about pefect.

I swapped the DSL speaker for a V30 and that helped but I think im selling it and saving up for the SV20 and some sort of attenuator.


----------



## Mark Collier

Also, I am thinking of buying the G10 greenback for the O20. I figure if i dont like it, it should sound pretty good in the Class 5.

Anyone done that yet?


----------



## vtrain

Mark Collier said:


> Also, I am thinking of buying the G10 greenback for the O20. I figure if i dont like it, it should sound pretty good in the Class 5.
> 
> Anyone done that yet?



I have done exactly that. I think it's an excellent speaker for this amp. Gives it a much better vintage vibe, IMO.


----------



## GarethWP

.


Mark Collier said:


> I have O20 and DSL 20.
> 
> I find the DSL has too much distortion for my taste. Weird because the DSL 5 (from memory) was about pefect.
> 
> I swapped the DSL speaker for a V30 and that helped but I think im selling it and saving up for the SV20 and some sort of attenuator.


Sounds like music (no pun intended honest) to my ears then.... Sometime in the, I hope not to distant future, a DSL 20 head to give me some grit to balance the cleans of the Origin. The neighbours will just have to live with it or rock with me.


----------



## Barry A

GarethWP said:


> If I would like to get a bit more growl.... A meatier buzz saw type break up from the Origin 20h can I get it by replacing some or all of the pre amp valves? And if so bearing in mind I have to duck and dive for every guitar penny. What valves would I be best looking to buy? I would, I think, prefer to save for quality. If I'm going to make changes I'd prefer to make it a proper upgrade. And should I change the power amp valves too???
> Though yes I do think that I am actually getting the tones I should from the Origin 20 and I know that perhaps if I want the meatier gain tones I should perhaps look at getting a DSL.... But I am now curious to what can be achieved with a few modifications.



Tung sols are known to be best for distortion, I’d get two of those for v1 and v2 in your preamp. That’s where nearly all of your tone is coming from in your amp. I put a JJ in the phase inverter (3rd spot in preamp), but there wasn’t too much of a difference in tone. 

since nearly all of your tone comes from your preamp, it’s up to you if you want to switch out the power amp tubes. Most people don’t, and I haven’t, but when the power amp boosts the sound it’ll impart some tone. Power amp tubes are bigger and considerably more expensive Then the preamp tubes, which I why a lot of people forgo this upgrade. 

I have tung sols in v1 and v2 and a jj in PI, and I’ll post a vid this weekend and you can see if that’s the tone you’re going for.


----------



## vtrain

Barry A said:


> Tung sols are known to be best for distortion, I’d get two of those for v1 and v2 in your preamp. That’s where nearly all of your tone is coming from in your amp. I put a JJ in the phase inverter (3rd spot in preamp), but there wasn’t too much of a difference in tone.
> 
> since nearly all of your tone comes from your preamp, it’s up to you if you want to switch out the power amp tubes. Most people don’t, and I haven’t, but when the power amp boosts the sound it’ll impart some tone. Power amp tubes are bigger and considerably more expensive Then the preamp tubes, which I why a lot of people forgo this upgrade.
> 
> I have tung sols in v1 and v2 and a jj in PI, and I’ll post a vid this weekend and you can see if that’s the tone you’re going for.




It’s all so subjective. I tried the Tung Sol reissues in V1 and v2 and did not like them at all, FWIW. Rather than sounding Marshall-like, I thought they made the amp sound quite fuzzy. Almost like it wasn’t a tube amp. They sounded great in my Origin 5 though. I think the stock JJ’s sound pretty great in my Origin 20.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

vtrain said:


> It’s all so subjective. I tried the Tung Sol reissues in V1 and v2 and did not like them at all, FWIW. Rather than sounding Marshall-like, I thought they made the amp sound quite fuzzy. Almost like it wasn’t a tube amp. They sounded great in my Origin 5 though. I think the stock JJ’s sound pretty great in my Origin 20.


I put Mullard reissues in my 50H, didn’t really hear much of a difference the other one is still stock tubes.
Cheers


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

GarethWP said:


> If I would like to get a bit more growl.... A meatier buzz saw type break up from the Origin 20h can I get it by replacing some or all of the pre amp valves?



Honestly I think you'd have more luck looking at pedals. A tube screamer can get a pretty dead on 80's Metallica tone (look up Origin metal on youtube). You could probably get a cheap TS or MI Crunchbox clone (Joyo deluxe crunch etc) for the price of a pair of tubes. Buzzsaw makes me think Entombed/Dismember though, in which case you want a HM-2 (or 2).



Barry A said:


> Tung sols are known to be best for distortion, I’d get two of those for v1 and v2 in your preamp



I've read the Tung Sol's don't hold up in Marshall's V2 because of the nature of the circuit (Cathode follower)? I've got another JJ and also a pair RFT's on the way from Russia to try out (pretty happy with the Sovtek LPS and stock Chinese tubes though tbh).

I got my Bogner blue mini yesterday and it's pretty impressive. It actually sounds quite close to the Origin on low- moderate gain but gives me a bit more flexibility when I want more (into JCM800 type territory) and at different volumes. I plan on getting an fx loop switcher so I can swap between clean, crunch and high gain while keeping the levels similar for one project, while using the old school raw amp and guitar volume way for the other. Next is some fuzz and maybe a clean boost pedal...


----------



## Barry A

OriginOfTheSpecies said:


> Honestly I think you'd have more luck looking at pedals. A tube screamer can get a pretty dead on 80's Metallica tone (look up Origin metal on youtube). You could probably get a cheap TS or MI Crunchbox clone (Joyo deluxe crunch etc) for the price of a pair of tubes. Buzzsaw makes me think Entombed/Dismember though, in which case you want a HM-2 (or 2).
> 
> 
> 
> I've read the Tung Sol's don't hold up in Marshall's V2 because of the nature of the circuit (Cathode follower)? I've got another JJ and also a pair RFT's on the way from Russia to try out (pretty happy with the Sovtek LPS and stock Chinese tubes though tbh).
> 
> I got my Bogner blue mini yesterday and it's pretty impressive. It actually sounds quite close to the Origin on low- moderate gain but gives me a bit more flexibility when I want more (into JCM800 type territory) and at different volumes. I plan on getting an fx loop switcher so I can swap between clean, crunch and high gain while keeping the levels similar for one project, while using the old school raw amp and guitar volume way for the other. Next is some fuzz and maybe a clean boost pedal...



I can tell you my big muff made my ears bleed with stock tubes, when I upgraded to tung sols, i finally achieved that deep growly fuzz that I was looking for. Think Smashing Pumpkins Siamese Dream or Appetite for Destruction.


----------



## scozz

Mark Collier said:


> Also, I am thinking of buying the G10 greenback for the O20. I figure if i dont like it, it should sound pretty good in the Class 5.
> 
> Anyone done that yet?


This is for anyone thinking about a replacement 10" speaker,........don't overlook the G10 Creamback! 

If they're anything like their big brothers, the Creamback is a much better choice than the Greenback, for a single speaker amp imo,....and others too.


----------



## scozz

Btw,... to The Marshall Forum @Mark Collier!


----------



## GarethWP

Being new to the forum myself I don't know if I am stepping out of line welcoming other new members but I'll try and see what happens.... Welcome Mark Collier. And it's a shame your now vintage 30 equipped DSL is a Combi I really don't have room or desire for a Combi in my life.

And I thought I would give an update on my new feelings about my Origin 20 h.


So overall tone was definitely hugely improved just by unplugging the Origin 212 cab and plugging in a 100 wat ancient G12H-100 single cab(I know its an 8ohm speaker but have no idea of frequency response but would love to know more about it ) not only the tone but the volumes the tone was usable at and now I love it. And then a switch round of the v1 and middle valves (it's actually easier than changing a light bulb, as it doesn't involve standing on a chair) and I love it more, that is except for the new hum introduced. Also it now loves the Blues driver pedal which does nudge the tone just a little bit more into the realms of break up without sounding like angry bees in a gigantic paper bag now. I'm sure that some new pedals will give me more. Your suggestions have been taken note of.

So that brings me to a thank you for everyones conflicting opinions about that. Yes I am now less clear about what I want to do. I know that I certainly won't ever turn the Origin into a DSL and I actually don't want to. The Origin 20h is good as it is but I'm sure that the right choice replacement valves instead of the cheap Chinese ones(I know I'm not an overnight expert but I did doa little bit of checking with the numbers on my valves) mine has inside will make it better. I'm thinking from your varied opinions, that a complete set of JJs will be my first step but I will look to trying a balanced Mullard and a Tung Sol just for v1. Because I can. And I think I can slip these past the financial director without to much GBH of the earholes.

Also birthday is only a few weeks away so instead of hinting about a new Strat (because I would like some single coil love too) I'll drop some hints for a pair of 16ohm greenbacks and an 8ohm Cream Back (or Vintage 30) for the cabs.
I hope someone will find this of interest and watch this space for the results as I try rolling valves and speakers in the not too distant future.
Oh and I have decided that it's definitely a DSL 20H for a touch of tiny forray into the slightly darker side of gain. And because.... How many do we need??? Yes one more definitely.


----------



## Barry A

GarethWP said:


> Being new to the forum myself I don't know if I am stepping out of line welcoming other new members but I'll try and see what happens.... Welcome Mark Collier. And it's a shame your now vintage 30 equipped DSL is a Combi I really don't have room or desire for a Combi in my life.
> 
> And I thought I would give an update on my new feelings about my Origin 20 h.
> 
> 
> So overall tone was definitely hugely improved just by unplugging the Origin 212 cab and plugging in a 100 wat ancient G12H-100 single cab(I know its an 8ohm speaker but have no idea of frequency response but would love to know more about it ) not only the tone but the volumes the tone was usable at and now I love it. And then a switch round of the v1 and middle valves (it's actually easier than changing a light bulb, as it doesn't involve standing on a chair) and I love it more, that is except for the new hum introduced. Also it now loves the Blues driver pedal which does nudge the tone just a little bit more into the realms of break up without sounding like angry bees in a gigantic paper bag now. I'm sure that some new pedals will give me more. Your suggestions have been taken note of.
> 
> So that brings me to a thank you for everyones conflicting opinions about that. Yes I am now less clear about what I want to do. I know that I certainly won't ever turn the Origin into a DSL and I actually don't want to. The Origin 20h is good as it is but I'm sure that the right choice replacement valves instead of the cheap Chinese ones(I know I'm not an overnight expert but I did doa little bit of checking with the numbers on my valves) mine has inside will make it better. I'm thinking from your varied opinions, that a complete set of JJs will be my first step but I will look to trying a balanced Mullard and a Tung Sol just for v1. Because I can. And I think I can slip these past the financial director without to much GBH of the earholes.
> 
> Also birthday is only a few weeks away so instead of hinting about a new Strat (because I would like some single coil love too) I'll drop some hints for a pair of 16ohm greenbacks and an 8ohm Cream Back (or Vintage 30) for the cabs.
> I hope someone will find this of interest and watch this space for the results as I try rolling valves and speakers in the not too distant future.
> Oh and I have decided that it's definitely a DSL 20H for a touch of tiny forray into the slightly darker side of gain. And because.... How many do we need??? Yes one more definitely.



glad you found a good tone! It can be frustrating, because we all want to play music, not fiddle with knobs and tubes and shit. Congrats!


----------



## RCM 800

GarethWP said:


> Being new to the forum myself I don't know if I am stepping out of line welcoming other new members but I'll try and see what happens.... Welcome Mark Collier. And it's a shame your now vintage 30 equipped DSL is a Combi I really don't have room or desire for a Combi in my life.
> 
> And I thought I would give an update on my new feelings about my Origin 20 h.
> 
> 
> So overall tone was definitely hugely improved just by unplugging the Origin 212 cab and plugging in a 100 wat ancient G12H-100 single cab(I know its an 8ohm speaker but have no idea of frequency response but would love to know more about it ) not only the tone but the volumes the tone was usable at and now I love it. And then a switch round of the v1 and middle valves (it's actually easier than changing a light bulb, as it doesn't involve standing on a chair) and I love it more, that is except for the new hum introduced. Also it now loves the Blues driver pedal which does nudge the tone just a little bit more into the realms of break up without sounding like angry bees in a gigantic paper bag now. I'm sure that some new pedals will give me more. Your suggestions have been taken note of.
> 
> So that brings me to a thank you for everyones conflicting opinions about that. Yes I am now less clear about what I want to do. I know that I certainly won't ever turn the Origin into a DSL and I actually don't want to. The Origin 20h is good as it is but I'm sure that the right choice replacement valves instead of the cheap Chinese ones(I know I'm not an overnight expert but I did doa little bit of checking with the numbers on my valves) mine has inside will make it better. I'm thinking from your varied opinions, that a complete set of JJs will be my first step but I will look to trying a balanced Mullard and a Tung Sol just for v1. Because I can. And I think I can slip these past the financial director without to much GBH of the earholes.
> 
> Also birthday is only a few weeks away so instead of hinting about a new Strat (because I would like some single coil love too) I'll drop some hints for a pair of 16ohm greenbacks and an 8ohm Cream Back (or Vintage 30) for the cabs.
> I hope someone will find this of interest and watch this space for the results as I try rolling valves and speakers in the not too distant future.
> Oh and I have decided that it's definitely a DSL 20H for a touch of tiny forray into the slightly darker side of gain. And because.... How many do we need??? Yes one more definitely.



Guess Im lucky, I tried the or20h thru a orange V30 1x12 at GC and it was pretty much exactly what I was looking for so I didnt have much tone chasing to do lol.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

GarethWP said:


> Being new to the forum myself I don't know if I am stepping out of line welcoming other new members but I'll try and see what happens.... Welcome Mark Collier. And it's a shame your now vintage 30 equipped DSL is a Combi I really don't have room or desire for a Combi in my life.
> 
> And I thought I would give an update on my new feelings about my Origin 20 h.
> 
> 
> So overall tone was definitely hugely improved just by unplugging the Origin 212 cab and plugging in a 100 wat ancient G12H-100 single cab(I know its an 8ohm speaker but have no idea of frequency response but would love to know more about it ) not only the tone but the volumes the tone was usable at and now I love it. And then a switch round of the v1 and middle valves (it's actually easier than changing a light bulb, as it doesn't involve standing on a chair) and I love it more, that is except for the new hum introduced. Also it now loves the Blues driver pedal which does nudge the tone just a little bit more into the realms of break up without sounding like angry bees in a gigantic paper bag now. I'm sure that some new pedals will give me more. Your suggestions have been taken note of.
> 
> So that brings me to a thank you for everyones conflicting opinions about that. Yes I am now less clear about what I want to do. I know that I certainly won't ever turn the Origin into a DSL and I actually don't want to. The Origin 20h is good as it is but I'm sure that the right choice replacement valves instead of the cheap Chinese ones(I know I'm not an overnight expert but I did doa little bit of checking with the numbers on my valves) mine has inside will make it better. I'm thinking from your varied opinions, that a complete set of JJs will be my first step but I will look to trying a balanced Mullard and a Tung Sol just for v1. Because I can. And I think I can slip these past the financial director without to much GBH of the earholes.
> 
> Also birthday is only a few weeks away so instead of hinting about a new Strat (because I would like some single coil love too) I'll drop some hints for a pair of 16ohm greenbacks and an 8ohm Cream Back (or Vintage 30) for the cabs.
> I hope someone will find this of interest and watch this space for the results as I try rolling valves and speakers in the not too distant future.
> Oh and I have decided that it's definitely a DSL 20H for a touch of tiny forray into the slightly darker side of gain. And because.... How many do we need??? Yes one more definitely.


No you are not stepping out of line at all.
And welcome to the forum if I have missed you, the greenbacks in one of my mg cabs kick serious ass, and that amp , Origin 50H got mullards in all preamp slots (reissues) and ruby power tubes.
It sounds great to me, and has balls for days. I have posted Origin clips in multiple locations in the forum.
Cheers to getting your tone.


Mitch


----------



## rolijen

GarethWP said:


> I know that I certainly won't ever turn the Origin into a DSL and I actually don't want to...
> Oh and I have decided that it's definitely a DSL 20H for a touch of tiny forray into the slightly darker side of gain. And because.... How many do we need??? Yes one more definitely.


They compliment each other. I have my dsl20h stacked on my origin20h and swap the cable going to my MX212 (loaded with V-Types) betweet them a lot. Love them both. Fatter clean on the DSL, grittier crunch on the Origin, and both do heavy distortion fine with various pedals.


----------



## GarethWP

rolijen said:


> They compliment each other. I have my dsl20h stacked on my origin20h


So that was what I was hoping to here wish I already had the DSL 20h fantastic really good to know that you are loving your amps. 

And thank you everyone for the encouraging words.
I would love to know what guitars people are playing through your Origins.... Oh and DSLs too. And what they find compliments the most.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

GarethWP said:


> So that was what I was hoping to here wish I already had the DSL 20h fantastic really good to know that you are loving your amps.
> 
> And thank you everyone for the encouraging words.
> I would love to know what guitars people are playing through your Origins.... Oh and DSLs too. And what they find compliments the most.


I have the Dsl40c’s, and Origin 50H’s
I like strats , LP’s,SG’s, and Gibson V through them, and I have mixed the 2 amps in dual mono.
And they do sound great together.
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## GarethWP

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> No you are not stepping out of line at all.
> And welcome to the forum if I have missed you, the greenbacks in one of my mg cabs kick serious ass, and that amp , Origin 50H got mullards in all preamp slots (reissues) and ruby power tubes.
> It sounds great to me, and has balls for days. I have posted Origin clips in multiple locations in the forum.
> Cheers to getting your tone.
> 
> 
> Mitch


 Thank you for the welcome.
A pair of greenbacks for my ori 2x12 cab too or on further research I'm beginning to like the idea of a greenback and vintage 30 combination I have read that they compliment each other beautifully. Though I have also seen that in the past many think that the vintage 30 overpowers the greenback. Personally I am sure they will improve my tone but there is only one way to find out. 

Yes I love the idea of mullard type valves in the pre amp stage. I'll do some reading about the Ruby for the power valves. 
I will look for your clips.


Mitchell Pearrow said:


> I have the Dsl40c’s, and Origin 50H’s
> I like strats , LP’s,SG’s, and Gibson V through them, and I have mixed the 2 amps in dual mono.
> And they do sound great together.
> Cheers
> Mitch


I love your collection that's some lovely guitars to play. But I think mixing amps in a dual mono set up is another learning curve for me to look forward to..... I'll keep you posted.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

GarethWP said:


> Thank you for the welcome.
> A pair of greenbacks for my ori 2x12 cab too or on further research I'm beginning to like the idea of a greenback and vintage 30 combination I have read that they compliment each other beautifully. Though I have also seen that in the past many think that the vintage 30 overpowers the greenback. Personally I am sure they will improve my tone but there is only one way to find out.
> 
> Yes I love the idea of mullard type valves in the pre amp stage. I'll do some reading about the Ruby for the power valves.
> I will look for your clips.
> 
> I love your collection that's some lovely guitars to play. But I think mixing amps in a dual mono set up is another learning curve for me to look forward to..... I'll keep you posted.


I have access to a V30 loaded 2-12 orange cab, I should mix them up and see how much I am missing out on.
My Origin clips are in Show me your riffs, and the official origin 50 thread , but I will bring one of my more recent ones here, just give me a sec.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Here is one from last week


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

This is shortly after I got the amp.
Cheers 
Sorry for the thread hijack .
Mitch


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

GarethWP said:


> Thank you for the welcome.
> A pair of greenbacks for my ori 2x12 cab too or on further research I'm beginning to like the idea of a greenback and vintage 30 combination I have read that they compliment each other beautifully. Though I have also seen that in the past many think that the vintage 30 overpowers the greenback. Personally I am sure they will improve my tone but there is only one way to find out.
> 
> Yes I love the idea of mullard type valves in the pre amp stage. I'll do some reading about the Ruby for the power valves.
> I will look for your clips.
> 
> I love your collection that's some lovely guitars to play. But I think mixing amps in a dual mono set up is another learning curve for me to look forward to..... I'll keep you posted.


The way I run multiple amps is easier than you think, the easiest way is to take an instrument cable from the #1 amp to the instrument in on the 2’nd amp, with #2 being on the clean channel.
The other way I do it is, my MXR10 band eq has 2 outs that go into the front of both amps, along with the first method now I have 3 amps running, which creates a very thick wall of tone.
I have set up and ran all six amps .
I will bring that clip in a minute.
Cheers


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

In this clip I am running all of them from the Dsl40c’s, the only thing different is the FX send from Dsl40c #2 is going to FX return on the Origins,
It made for a very quiet rig that could get brutally loud.
Thanks


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> In this clip I am running all of them from the Dsl40c’s, the only thing different is the FX send from Dsl40c #2 is going to FX return on the Origins,
> It made for a very quiet rig that could get brutally loud.
> Thanks



So this is basically DSL preamp and 2 Origin power amps? And the other 2 clips are straight into Origins? Sounds killer.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

OriginOfTheSpecies said:


> So this is basically DSL preamp and 2 Origin power amps? And the other 2 clips are straight into Origins? Sounds killer.


Yes and it was a great time doing it 
Cheers and thanks for the compliment


----------



## GarethWP

Sounds Awesome Mitch I can see that my set up skills and not to mention my playing skills have a long road to travel


----------



## Most_Triumphant

Finally got my Origin 20H in from Prymaxe. They were on backorder for most of August. I'm running mine through an Avatar 2x12 with loaded 2 Celestion G-12H 70th Anniversary speakers. So far, I haven't swapped tubes from the original as I haven't been able to crank it on anything higher than low watt mode. I'm digging the sound. I finally understand the Marshall sizzle thing. Has anyone figured out a mod for the effects loops to be on without needing the footpedal and being able to switch the boost on the amp by hand. I know some people just plug an extra patch cable in the back, but then I can't use the boost on the amp.


----------



## GarethWP

Most_Triumphant said:


> Finally got my Origin 20H in from Prymaxe. They were on backorder for most of August. I'm running mine through an Avatar 2x12 with loaded 2 Celestion G-12H 70th Anniversary speakers.


fantastic stuff and interesting that the G-12 H is working well with your 20h congratulations for being a happy Origin owner..... Oh and welcome to the forum too.


Most_Triumphant said:


> Has anyone figured out a mod for the effects loops to be on without needing the footpedal and being able to switch the boost on the amp by hand. I know some people just plug an extra patch cable in the back, but then I can't use the boost on the amp.


I have read various stuff about this but haven't seen a fix yet..... I think it's just an Origin thing that you just live with but I am happy to be corrected.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Most_Triumphant said:


> Finally got my Origin 20H in from Prymaxe. They were on backorder for most of August. I'm running mine through an Avatar 2x12 with loaded 2 Celestion G-12H 70th Anniversary speakers. So far, I haven't swapped tubes from the original as I haven't been able to crank it on anything higher than low watt mode. I'm digging the sound. I finally understand the Marshall sizzle thing. Has anyone figured out a mod for the effects loops to be on without needing the footpedal and being able to switch the boost on the amp by hand. I know some people just plug an extra patch cable in the back, but then I can't use the boost on the amp.


I just plug the footswitch in and use it to turn the boost or FX on or off, there is a member here that has been working on a solution for what you are asking , but I have not followed the progress.
Welcome to the forum 
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## Most_Triumphant

GarethWP said:


> fantastic stuff and interesting that the G-12 H is working well with your 20h congratulations for being a happy Origin owner..... Oh and welcome to the forum too.



What makes the speaker choice interesting? I thought the Anniversaries would be a good choice. Here's hoping someone finds a fix for the foot pedal. Has anyone here modded the front light to red square like on a plexi?


----------



## GarethWP

Most_Triumphant said:


> What makes the speaker choice interesting? I thought the Anniversaries would be a good choice.


Sorry that wasn't supposed to seem critical in any way, but only that it's another speaker option to consider when I come to buying some upgrades in the near future. If someone finds a combination of speakers with the H20 nice, then I am interested.......I don't want to spend my hard earned and find I need to spend more.
And the Anniversaries weren't even on my radar until you said that was what you were using.
I love options the more the better.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Most_Triumphant said:


> What makes the speaker choice interesting? I thought the Anniversaries would be a good choice. Here's hoping someone finds a fix for the foot pedal. Has anyone here modded the front light to red square like on a plexi?


Someone here has converted to the square light it’s in one of the Origin threads but I cannot remember who it was , and the square red light looks correct on these amps.
Cheers


----------



## Most_Triumphant

GarethWP said:


> I love options the more the better.



Isn't that what's its all about? No worries, I didn't think you were being critical. I just wanted to know what made it interesting. Again, I haven't been able to crank it on anything larger than the low setting, but I am getting good bass response with a Gibson SG armed with 57 Classics. 

I have a Traynor YCV15 Blue that has a G-12M Greenback in it, but I can also plug it into the cabinet. Overall, I think they're both really solid speakers.


----------



## rolijen

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> Someone here has converted to the square light it’s in one of the Origin threads but I cannot remember who it was , and the square red light looks correct on these amps.
> Cheers


It was me. I put the square indicator lamp on my Origin 50 head. I think it looks really good. Improves the tone a lot too!


----------



## GarethWP

Most_Triumphant said:


> Isn't that what's its all about? No worries, I didn't think you were being critical. I just wanted to know what made it interesting. Again, I haven't been able to crank it on anything larger than the low setting, but I am getting good bass response with a Gibson SG armed with 57 Classics.
> 
> I have a Traynor YCV15 Blue that has a G-12M Greenback in it, but I can also plug it into the cabinet. Overall, I think they're both really solid speakers.


Fantastic I think that the defensive response was me then my apologies.....but you are right it is what it's all about. I have made huge steps towards achieving my desired tone and I haven't spent any extra money yet... result.

I know what you mean about not being able to use the middle and high settings....I have to pick moments .... these amps are definitely loud enough. 
There's another expense ... new pups to replace the 490s in my LP.
I'm convinced still that greenbacks as a 2x is my preferred speaker cheers Gareth


----------



## GarethWP

rolijen said:


> View attachment 78928
> 
> It was me. I put the square indicator lamp on my Origin 50 head. I think it looks really good. Improves the tone a lot too!


 That's it then I'm off to buy a bank of square red lights I need that tone improvement


----------



## Ramo

why dose marshall logo looks compressed on those amps?


----------



## rolijen

Ramo said:


> why dose marshall logo looks compressed on those amps?


Here are my DSL20, Origin 20, and MX212 cab. In this pic and to my eye, the logo is the same size but cast in a slightly off-white color. Maybe it’s meant to look aged/vintage?


----------



## GarethWP

rolijen said:


> Here are my DSL20, Origin 20, and MX212 cab. In this pic and to my eye, the logo is the same size but cast in a slightly off-white color. Maybe it’s meant to look aged/vintage?


I love the look of that set up the DSL is definitely on my birthday/Xmas wish list. To compliment my Origin.
But yes I just looked at a 15 year-old MG15 combi and the Marshall logo is exactly the same as my Origin except my Origin is creamy coloured. I think that you are right, it's for the vintage look


----------



## Ramo

GarethWP said:


> I love the look of that set up the DSL is definitely on my birthday/Xmas wish list. To compliment my Origin.
> But yes I just looked at a 15 year-old MG15 combi and the Marshall logo is exactly the same as my Origin except my Origin is creamy coloured. I think that you are right, it's for the vintage look



i think on 20!its fine on 50 looks bit small.

by the way how do you like your mx cab? I hate my one.


----------



## vtrain

rolijen said:


> View attachment 78928
> 
> It was me. I put the square indicator lamp on my Origin 50 head. I think it looks really good. Improves the tone a lot too!



That looks great! I saw a thread you started about the voltage difference. Other than that, is it a direct retrofit?


----------



## rolijen

vtrain said:


> That looks great! I saw a thread you started about the voltage difference. Other than that, is it a direct retrofit?


I bought the square indicator lamp and retaining clip and a small transformer to knock the voltage down to 6v. Velcro’d The transformer to the inside of the amp and terminated the wires with female spade connectors. Plugged in into the terminals on the main board. Took 5 minutes. Looks killer. But is totally reversible if needed.


----------



## rolijen

Ramo said:


> i think on 20!its fine on 50 looks bit small.
> 
> by the way how do you like your mx cab? I hate my one.


My MX212 sounded pretty good with my DSL. But I yanked out the Seventy 80s and put celestion v-types in it. It now sounds awesome with the DSL and the Origin. I use a greenback loaded 1960 for my 50 watters.


----------



## Ramo

rolijen said:


> My MX212 sounded pretty good with my DSL. But I yanked out the Seventy 80s and put celestion v-types in it. It now sounds awesome with the DSL and the Origin. I use a greenback loaded 1960 for my 50 watters.



i want to change stock speakers , it has shrill sound . dont know what style o you play but me mostly i play metal lots of palm mute an chaging and it anoyed so much i went in pawn shop and found jcm 800 4x12 from 1982 for £130 so now im happy. but still need to change those shit speakers.


----------



## Most_Triumphant

rolijen said:


> I bought the square indicator lamp and retaining clip and a small transformer to knock the voltage down to 6v. Velcro’d The transformer to the inside of the amp and terminated the wires with female spade connectors. Plugged in into the terminals on the main board. Took 5 minutes. Looks killer. But is totally reversible if needed.



Do you know what the original voltage was off hand? I think I've seen 12v or 16v red square lights knocking around out there that would be easier still to swap in.


----------



## rolijen

Most_Triumphant said:


> Do you know what the original voltage was off hand? I think I've seen 12v or 16v red square lights knocking around out there that would be easier still to swap in.


I think the Origin lamp voltage is supposed to be 18v? I measured it with my meter and it was somewhere between 15v and 17v. I used a cheap buck step-down transformer/voltage converter.


----------



## GarethWP

Ramo said:


> by the way how do you like your mx cab? I hate my one.


Mine is an Origin 212 can but I think it's essentially the same as the MX with a pair of 16 ohm seventy 80s inside. And I don't like them with my Origin 20h . But then they sound good with a little Bugera T5 infinium head I managed to get hold of. So my cab is going to get either a pair of Greenbacks or a Greenback and a Vintage 30 mix


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

Does everyone else's gain knob feel less resistant/grainier than the others? Minor thing, but reveals some of the cheapness on mine (maybe other marshalls are the same?).


----------



## GarethWP

OriginOfTheSpecies said:


> Does everyone else's gain knob feel less resistant/grainier than the others? Minor thing, but reveals some of the cheapness on mine (maybe other marshalls are the same?).


Yes I hadn't noticed but yes the gain control on my ori20h definitely moves a lot more freely and definitely grainier too.


----------



## Ramo

GarethWP said:


> Mine is an Origin 212 can but I think it's essentially the same as the MX with a pair of 16 ohm seventy 80s inside. And I don't like them with my Origin 20h . But then they sound good with a little Bugera T5 infinium head I managed to get hold of. So my cab is going to get either a pair of Greenbacks or a Greenback and a Vintage 30 mix


 sound like good plan, i want g12-t75 with v30 mix or eminence swamp thang with govnors..


----------



## rolijen

OriginOfTheSpecies said:


> Does everyone else's gain knob feel less resistant/grainier than the others? Minor thing, but reveals some of the cheapness on mine (maybe other marshalls are the same?).


The gain control feels different because it is different. It has a push-pull switch built in. Not the same part as the others. Common for that type of pot to be a little easier to twist.


----------



## GarethWP

rolijen said:


> The gain control feels different because it is different. It has a push-pull switch built in. Not the same part as the others. Common for that type of pot to be a little easier to twist.


Aaaahh yes of course now that makes a sensible answer to that


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

GarethWP said:


> I would love to know what guitars people are playing through your Origins.... Oh and DSLs too. And what they find compliments the most.



I'm playing a baritone telecaster with a filtertron bridge and an Ibanez SZ (kind of like a fat, mahogany PRS) with Gibson Iommi HB's. I like the telecaster with the Origin best - the filtertron works great for the amps clean and classic rock tones. The Ibanez sounds good too, but I mainly use it with the pedals for hi gain stuff - I'd like to try it with an old school germanium treble booster.



Ramo said:


> i want g12-t75


I'm running a G12T-75 212 with mine cause I gravitated toward them in the amp modelling world, bandmate's 1960 cabs and demo comparisons (while not liking v30's so much). Sound great - plenty of low end for the baritone tuning I use, but have to watch bitey on axis treble. I might swap one out eventually if I start mic'ing up for recording.



rolijen said:


> It has a push-pull switch built in. Not the same part as the others.


Makes sense.

I have been messing around with an MI Audio Super Crunch Box (improved Guv'nor in turn copied by the Angry Charlie) and MI Megalith Delta pedal which is essentially their hi gain amp's preamp built into a pedal, swapping tubes for FETs.
Origin plus Crunch box does 80's boosted JCM800 metal and the Megalith turns it more "modern" brutal. This amp takes pedals really well if you want to expand it's palette.


----------



## GarethWP

OriginOfTheSpecies said:


> I'm playing a baritone telecaster with a filtertron bridge and an Ibanez SZ (kind of like a fat, mahogany PRS) with Gibson Iommi HB's. I like the telecaster with the Origin best - the filtertron works great for the amps clean and classic rock tones. The Ibanez sounds good too, but I mainly use it with the pedals for hi gain stuff - I'd like to try it with an old school germanium treble booster.
> 
> 
> I'm running a G12T-75 212 with mine cause I gravitated toward them in the amp modelling world, bandmate's 1960 cabs and demo comparisons (while not liking v30's so much). Sound great - plenty of low end for the baritone tuning I use, but have to watch bitey on axis treble. I might swap one out eventually if I start mic'ing up for recording.
> 
> 
> Makes sense.
> 
> I have been messing around with an MI Audio Super Crunch Box (improved Guv'nor in turn copied by the Angry Charlie) and MI Megalith Delta pedal which is essentially their hi gain amp's preamp built into a pedal, swapping tubes for FETs.
> Origin plus Crunch box does 80's boosted JCM800 metal and the Megalith turns it more "modern" brutal. This amp takes pedals really well if you want to expand it's palette.


You are all on another level.......I mean with knowledge of guitar goodies (you all have some lovely guitars amps and pedals) and how to apply them and talk about them. I have been an acoustic guitar player for years and never really got very good. I have only been playing electric for a short time and my 2018 faded Les Paul and Origin head and amp my first electric gear. At first it was like hitting a brick wall but a Boss RC3 looper and a BD2 and I have made more inroads in just a few months than I had in years of acoustic play. After paying attention to posts from everyone on here I have tweaked things and I love the tones that I am getting but I want more. I will soon have a pair of greenbacks in my cab. But I am finding that the BD2 beyond edge of break up just gives me fizz. There's so much choice and so little money but I want just one affordable pedal to give the Origin some proper meat in terms of gain/breakup/overdrive. Because I think that the DSL isn't going to be added to my collection anytime soon.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

GarethWP said:


> Sounds Awesome Mitch I can see that my set up skills and not to mention my playing skills have a long road to travel


It’s been a great learning experience for me, and every time I think I have conquered something, another idea pops up. But it has been a great journey.
Cheers 


Mitch


----------



## GarethWP

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> It’s been a great learning experience for me, and every time I think I have conquered something, another idea pops up. But it has been a great journey.


The joys of learning, especially a musical instrument and especially guitar. Of course some of you do more conquering than others.


----------



## L Newman

Anyone tried enclosing the back of the 20C?


----------



## vtrain

L Newman said:


> Anyone tried enclosing the back of the 20C?



No, but that's interesting. How would you go about doing that?


----------



## L Newman

vtrain said:


> No, but that's interesting. How would you go about doing that?



Piece of plywood, using existing screw holes or placed over the existing back with new holes in the outside edge - one hole for power cord. Was just a thing that crossed my mind, not necessarily thinking about it seriously.


----------



## Mx1977

Hi, everyone!

I'm Max and new to the Marshall world!

I'm from Argentina.

I've recently gotten a Origin 20C. Was very happy with it until I noticed a hiss. I've been reading and everything points to the tubes.

I've taken it to service, they changed the EL34s which appeared to be the problem, but the amp keeps ringing on certain notes I play.

They seemed clueless and at some point they suggested it could be a design issue and that it maybe had that issue.

They kept it to look into it further more and they were going to check with marshall as they are the official importers and retailers.

Any input on if this is a common issue or of someone faced anything similar and a solution?

Thanks in advance!

Mx


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

FX Loop On/Off Switch installed on back.

No more footswitch if you don't want, no more dangerous jack plugs poking out of the back, juts a nice discrete toggle switch(can be a push button if you want too)

Desructions are on the way as well in the next comment, enjoy.

Parts for a few jobs.



Open the box.



Taken out of the box.



Pins closed.



Jack plug inserted, pins open.



Middle pin lifted.



Resistor and switch installed.



Ground wire connected underneath.



Hole drilled and switch attached to chassis. Job done.


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk




----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

Most_Triumphant said:


> Finally got my Origin 20H in from Prymaxe. They were on backorder for most of August. I'm running mine through an Avatar 2x12 with loaded 2 Celestion G-12H 70th Anniversary speakers. So far, I haven't swapped tubes from the original as I haven't been able to crank it on anything higher than low watt mode. I'm digging the sound. I finally understand the Marshall sizzle thing. Has anyone figured out a mod for the effects loops to be on without needing the footpedal and being able to switch the boost on the amp by hand. I know some people just plug an extra patch cable in the back, but then I can't use the boost on the amp.




I don't know if I replied to you, but with regards the FX Loop issue. I have now sorted out the fix for that, a switch on the back to turn it on and off without the ftswtch, and yes, the boost will be unaffected.  
Look at above comments for details, enjoy.


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

Mx1977 said:


> Any input on if this is a common issue or of someone faced anything similar and a solution?
> 
> Thanks in advance!


One of my preamp tubes went bad soon after buying. You could try swapping the order of the 3 12AX7's around to see if the problem gets better or worse. If so, get another 12ax7 and replace each one till you find the culprit.

Maybe check this video out too


----------



## Mx1977

OriginOfTheSpecies said:


> One of my preamp tubes went bad soon after buying. You could try swapping the order of the 3 12AX7's around to see if the problem gets better or worse. If so, get another 12ax7 and replace each one till you find the culprit.
> 
> Maybe check this video out too





Thank you. Now the official service has the amp. I went over there to try it out. Seems the EL34s are rattling. They changed them in front of me and for a while, it stopped, but after a while it resumed with the hiss.

I understand that a bad tube can cause this issue in sound. But I wanted to check with you all if this is a problem you have to live with, or the guys at the service need to keep on looking for what's causing my amp to malfunction.

Thank you!

Mx


----------



## RCM 800

I have 2 OR20h's. One was sounding much louder and brighter than the other. Swapped in a few tubes I had lying around. Tung sol reissue in V1 brought it to life. Kinda makes me wonder if some of the people not digging their origins are actually having issues with bunk tubes.


----------



## L Newman

Jason Fieldhouseespk said:


> FX Loop On/Off Switch installed on back.
> 
> No more footswitch if you don't want, no more dangerous jack plugs poking out of the back, juts a nice discrete toggle switch(can be a push button if you want too)...



Fantastic! I've been waiting for this ... but I think it might be just out of my skill set - d..n


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

L Newman said:


> Fantastic! I've been waiting for this ... but I think it might be just out of my skill set - d..n



Right, hold the phone on all this... Now I've got it back to the band room, found a dodgy tube, replaced it, and tried it.... I made a basic mistake...

This should be a 3 pin switch, not 2. The 2 pin just leaves it on all the time...

Anyway, I have a new wiring diagram for a 3 pin switch.

pin 1 to the resistor, pin 2(middle) to the ground, pin 3 to the jack pin(where the resistor is soldered to).






That's an SPDT, ON-ON, 3 pin, toggle.

Diagram to follow,


----------



## steveb63

Jason Fieldhouseespk said:


> Right, hold the phone on all this... Now I've got it back to the band room, found a dodgy tube, replaced it, and tried it.... I made a basic mistake...
> 
> This should be a 3 pin switch, not 2. The 2 pin just leaves it on all the time...
> 
> Anyway, I have a new wiring diagram for a 3 pin switch.
> 
> pin 1 to the resistor, pin 2(middle) to the ground, pin 3 to the jack pin(where the resistor is soldered to).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That's an SPDT, ON-ON, 3 pin, toggle.
> 
> Diagram to follow,
> 
> View attachment 79919
> 
> 
> View attachment 79920


Thanks brotha,

Keep up the good work, I've been sitting back taking all your finds and filing them away for later use if need be.

Appreciate the effort. Well done.


----------



## RCM 800

Was jammin with my band the other day and we kinda drifted off schedule. I normally play on the mid power setting with everything around noon and the gain dimed but boost off. I use an EQ and TS to dirty it up more. We started screwing around playing a montage of early 80's Metallica tunes. Anyways I cut away for my first Kirk imitation and wasnt cutting thru due to the dynamics of the drums and bass (they were beating the shit out of them) so I walked over to my amp and switched it to 20 watts. At the end of bouncing thru Trapped under Ice, Jump in the Fire, Am I Evil, and the Four Horsemen our ears were ringing and they just looked at me glassy eyed and said "20 watts?" lol. I love my Origin's.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

RCM 800 said:


> Was jammin with my band the other day and we kinda drifted off schedule. I normally play on the mid power setting with everything around noon and the gain dimed but boost off. I use an EQ and TS to dirty it up more. We started screwing around playing a montage of early 80's Metallica tunes. Anyways I cut away for my first Kirk imitation and wasnt cutting thru due to the dynamics of the drums and bass (they were beating the shit out of them) so I walked over to my amp and switched it to 20 watts. At the end of bouncing thru Trapped under Ice, Jump in the Fire, Am I Evil, and the Four Horsemen our ears were ringing and they just looked at me glassy eyed and said "20 watts?" lol. I love my Origin's.


Hell yea , people can say what they will, but I have no problem with mine either, just a big dufus looking smile.
Thanks


----------



## ST035

I have searched all over the internet for the past couple of months and I COULDN'T find a demo where someone would play Strat guitar (s/s/s) into marshall origin 20c with both volume and gain on 10 and with a TubeScreamer or SD-1 slammed in front of it? 

My question is this - if Origin 20c (or head version, doesn't matter) is supposed to be in the style of a Plexi, then it should be a low-gain amp, right? If it is a low-gain amp, then you would have to apply hi-gain boost (one of those pedals with level on Full and drive on full) as opposed to JCM 800 (which is a hi-gain amp, where you would need lo-gain boost i.e Tube screamer level on Full but drive to minimum).

What are your suggestions for boosting Origin 20c (with gain on full and volume on full), which approach would be better? (I don't have the amp yet, I've been waiting for 7 months already for Thomann to restock them and will have to wait till January 2021)


----------



## rolijen

ST035 said:


> I have searched all over the internet for the past couple of months and I COULDN'T find a demo where someone would play Strat guitar (s/s/s) into marshall origin 20c with both volume and gain on 10 and with a TubeScreamer or SD-1 slammed in front of it?
> 
> My question is this - if Origin 20c (or head version, doesn't matter) is supposed to be in the style of a Plexi, then it should be a low-gain amp, right? If it is a low-gain amp, then you would have to apply hi-gain boost (one of those pedals with level on Full and drive on full) as opposed to JCM 800 (which is a hi-gain amp, where you would need lo-gain boost i.e Tube screamer level on Full but drive to minimum).
> 
> What are your suggestions for boosting Origin 20c (with gain on full and volume on full), which approach would be better? (I don't have the amp yet, I've been waiting for 7 months already for Thomann to restock them and will have to wait till January 2021)


Here’s an equation:
SSS + 20C(M10 + G10) + SD1(L10 + T5 + D10) = A hissy noisy mess.

If you’re wanting a classic rock tone, you don’t need everything on 10. Origin w Master at 7 or 8 and Gain at 7 or 8 is sweet and raunchy with humbuckers. And sweet and Hendrixy with single coils. Add a little fuzz or distortion, and you can get anything from Cream to Zep.

if you are looking for a more modern metal tone, Perhaps a DSL20 is a better choice. Like the Origin20, the DSL 
20 is a great amp at about the same price. The DSL’s Red channel has a tighter, more scooped modern metal voicing. Whereas the Origin has a looser, more midrangey, classic tone. I have both and really like them. 

Good luck on your quest!


----------



## RCM 800

ST035 said:


> I have searched all over the internet for the past couple of months and I COULDN'T find a demo where someone would play Strat guitar (s/s/s) into marshall origin 20c with both volume and gain on 10 and with a TubeScreamer or SD-1 slammed in front of it?
> 
> My question is this - if Origin 20c (or head version, doesn't matter) is supposed to be in the style of a Plexi, then it should be a low-gain amp, right? If it is a low-gain amp, then you would have to apply hi-gain boost (one of those pedals with level on Full and drive on full) as opposed to JCM 800 (which is a hi-gain amp, where you would need lo-gain boost i.e Tube screamer level on Full but drive to minimum).
> 
> What are your suggestions for boosting Origin 20c (with gain on full and volume on full), which approach would be better? (I don't have the amp yet, I've been waiting for 7 months already for Thomann to restock them and will have to wait till January 2021)



With amp gain on full and volume on full youre gonna be pretty distorted all on its own. I would just add a TS or EQ to tighten up the bottom and slam the front with level not gain. 

The way I do it is set the amp to where it will break up if I flog it but clean up if I pick softer. Then I hit it with a GE7 set in a very gentle frown shape and very slight level boost. If I need more gain than that I hit it with a TS9. I will try and get some sound samples recorded on a strat for you.


----------



## RCM 800

ST035 said:


> I have searched all over the internet for the past couple of months and I COULDN'T find a demo where someone would play Strat guitar (s/s/s) into marshall origin 20c with both volume and gain on 10 and with a TubeScreamer or SD-1 slammed in front of it?
> 
> My question is this - if Origin 20c (or head version, doesn't matter) is supposed to be in the style of a Plexi, then it should be a low-gain amp, right? If it is a low-gain amp, then you would have to apply hi-gain boost (one of those pedals with level on Full and drive on full) as opposed to JCM 800 (which is a hi-gain amp, where you would need lo-gain boost i.e Tube screamer level on Full but drive to minimum).
> 
> What are your suggestions for boosting Origin 20c (with gain on full and volume on full), which approach would be better? (I don't have the amp yet, I've been waiting for 7 months already for Thomann to restock them and will have to wait till January 2021)


Ok this is my origin 20h into a closed back 1x12 and open back 1x12 both with V30's. Amp is dimed on the gain and master and all the other knobs are set around noon amp boost is off. The guitar is a Fender strat with fat 50's in the neck and middle. The phone compressed the highs a good bit but should give a pretty good idea of what singles will do with a OR20. It was loud AF in the room, I normally play on the mid power setting.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

RCM 800 said:


> Ok this is my origin 20h into a closed back 1x12 and open back 1x12 both with V30's. Amp is dimed on the gain and master and all the other knobs are set around noon amp boost is off. The guitar is a Fender strat with fat 50's in the neck and middle. The phone compressed the highs a good bit but should give a pretty good idea of what singles will do with a OR20. It was loud AF in the room, I normally play on the mid power setting.



Sounds just like it should nice work brother, your strat was pushing some air , this I know for fact.
Thanks for posting 
Mitch


----------



## RCM 800

Forgot to mention thats on the full power setting. I went position 5 then 4 then 3. Unfortunately I dont have a strat with a bridge single.


----------



## ST035

thank you kindly RCM 800 for your effort <3, but from what I hear, this sounds like a Plexi style mild overdrive (which I love) - but for the sound I am after (Yngwie from Alcatrazz period) it looks it will need a boost with both level and drive to 10 (I actually have both SD-1 and dod308) of course, I also have NS-2 to remove the hiss and the noise.... In reality, I don't need much gain (think of Paul Gilbert Racer X era, or I don't know - the beehive DS-1) but I need warm sweet color of an overdriven plexi but boosted and tightened so that it has sustain and bass-cut which I need when I play staccato on lower strings

Thank you, again, for your time  YOu are very kind.


----------



## scozz

GarethWP said:


> ......I want just one affordable pedal to give the Origin some proper meat in terms of gain/breakup/overdrive. Because I think that the DSL isn't going to be added to my collection anytime soon.


Have you tried a Tubescreamer with your Origin? Or how about a SD1? I’m not a fan of of the SD1 but Mitch, (@Mitchell Pearrow), uses one with his Origin50. If I’m not mistaken, he loves the tones he’s getting!


----------



## jeffb

@ST035

Yep as @scozz said- try a Tubescreamer. They've worn out their welcome for my ears, but it's a great tool for tightening up an already cooking Marshall low end and focusing in the high midrange.

I found my old nearly deceased Bad Monkey (TS clone with active EQ) about a year or so ago, and plugged it in for S&G on my ORI20H (and DSL). It'll do what you require.

Set the level high, and the gain low.


----------



## RCM 800

ST035 said:


> thank you kindly RCM 800 for your effort <3, but from what I hear, this sounds like a Plexi style mild overdrive (which I love) - but for the sound I am after (Yngwie from Alcatrazz period) it looks it will need a boost with both level and drive to 10 (I actually have both SD-1 and dod308) of course, I also have NS-2 to remove the hiss and the noise.... In reality, I don't need much gain (think of Paul Gilbert Racer X era, or I don't know - the beehive DS-1) but I need warm sweet color of an overdriven plexi but boosted and tightened so that it has sustain and bass-cut which I need when I play staccato on lower strings
> 
> Thank you, again, for your time  YOu are very kind.


Yea I would slam the front with boost/OD. If you cant get what youre looking for with the pedals you have I would try a TS9 or an EQ. Also if you play on the lower power settings it breaks up earlier so that might be worth looking into also.


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

ST035 said:


> but for the sound I am after (Yngwie from Alcatrazz period)



This is the head (with a yngvie malmsteen OD), but he even has scalloped frets?



Interestingly he also tested the 50w which he wasn't as impressed with.


----------



## ST035

Yes, I have heard this clip before but for the most part he was using wah pedal which kind of disguised the color of the sound... I am guessing that my SD-1 or dod308 will do the job but, again, it's a combo, and I am gonna have to change the speaker to G10 greenback (I emailed Celestion to see if G10, rated at 30w, could handle the full throttle of 20 w origin, and they said "yes")

thanks guys for your input, rock on!


----------



## jeffb

In a effort to come to terms with my Ori20H, I decided to run it at full power through the Rivera today and make a noodle clip. All the details are pretty much in the vid (use headphones)

My thoughts later.


----------



## jeffb

I was purposefully really attacking the strings today (to the point of crappier than usual playing) because I wanted to make sure the things I was hearing in the room come through on the recording.

I think it sounds like complete @$$ through the attenuator. Even at the minimal amount of attenuation the amp thins out, gets that awful compressed squish on the attack, and the speakers just aren't getting any love so it sounds dark and distant. It makes everything sound like a cheap strat through a bad modelling amp. 

Running with the boost on increased the lows, but the lows become less defined and sloppy. It's just added tubbiness. This is a problem in 5 Watt mode too. I have a clip of that as well that I will upload soon. When i tirn the bas down to reduce the tubbiness, the amp thins out again. I'm guessing the 50W version with bigger iron would do much better with this.

I think the following things would make it better

1) power tubes with some real beef and less midrange. Maybe KT66s or 6l6
2) Running a single G12M20/25 or better yet a H30 55hz at 16 ohms. 1x8ohms speaker sounds really thin too.

But I'm not about to buy new cab and speakers and whatever else just to appease the amp. 

My Son wants this thing (he'll use a distortion pedal) and he'll be able to crank it up all the time so I think it's adios, amigo- time for an amp revamp.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

jeffb said:


> I was purposefully really attacking the strings today (to the point of crappier than usual playing) because I wanted to make sure the things I was hearing in the room come through on the recording.
> 
> I think it sounds like complete @$$ through the attenuator. Even at the minimal amount of attenuation the amp thins out, gets that awful compressed squish on the attack, and the speakers just aren't getting any love so it sounds dark and distant. It makes everything sound like a cheap strat through a bad modelling amp.
> 
> Running with the boost on increased the lows, but the lows become less defined and sloppy. It's just added tubbiness. This is a problem in 5 Watt mode too. I have a clip of that as well that I will upload soon. When i tirn the bas down to reduce the tubbiness, the amp thins out again. I'm guessing the 50W version with bigger iron would do much better with this.
> 
> I think the following things would make it better
> 
> 1) power tubes with some real beef and less midrange. Maybe KT66s or 6l6
> 2) Running a single G12M20/25 or better yet a H30 55hz at 16 ohms. 1x8ohms speaker sounds really thin too.
> 
> But I'm not about to buy new cab and speakers and whatever else just to appease the amp.
> 
> My Son wants this thing (he'll use a distortion pedal) and he'll be able to crank it up all the time so I think it's adios, amigo- time for an amp revamp.


That’s too bad you can’t get what ya want from it Jeff, good to see it staying in the family though.
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## jeffb

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> That’s too bad you can’t get what ya want from it Jeff, good to see it staying in the family though.
> Cheers
> Mitch




Yeah, he will be fine with it. He'll be able to crank it right up, and put a pedal in front to get the kind of tones he's into. I've tried everything, attenuators, pedals, tubes, speakers, etc, and the only way I like it, is 20W full power and blasting-that's when it comes alive and opens up. 

I bought him a Code 25 a few years back and he hates it, I'll probably trade it out for that until I figure out where I'm going for my downsize rig.


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

jeffb said:


> I think it sounds like complete @$$ through the attenuator.



I think your demo sounds pretty good! I think its hard to capture how they change the feel and reaction to playing though. I have also just acquired a two notes captor which has a reactive load attenuator function that sounds Ok but does make the amp feel a bit stifled (same way pedals can't quite cop power tube distortion). I think the built in scaling is better but still not quiet enough for night time jamming.

For me the most satisfying way to get low volume tones so far is run silently into the captor as a loadbox, though my interface with IR's, then out my monitor wedge. The IR's simulating a driven cab restored a lot of the feeling. With high gain pedals the power scaling options alone work well enough for me.

Before I got the captor I also tried running the FX send to a handful of virtual power amp sims (Revalver, Bias Amp and Ignite amps - these can have their "preamps" bypassed) which worked Ok but it seems none emulate power amp crunch convincingly or at all (Bias Amp was the best though). Using Amplitube on its own was better than trying to meld analog and digital in that way. Again doing hi-gain pedal stuff through virtual power amps worked Ok through BIAS amp, but as a rule real pedals end up sounding crappy in front of digital amps.

It would be cool if Marshall made a vintage crunch focused Origin 1/0.1w head equivalent to the DSL1. I reckon that would be handy for a lot of people.


----------



## Mark Collier

jeffb said:


> In a effort to come to terms with my Ori20H, I decided to run it at full power through the Rivera today and make a noodle clip. All the details are pretty much in the vid (use headphones)
> 
> My thoughts later.




Parts of it seem you like your hitting the strings too hard....Some of which is in the Tim Pearce Video he does with Phil X I just rewatched today. 

Phil X says along the lines of, he'll talk to his hands and say sometimes you have to hit softer and play the amp.

A lot of this sounds really really good! to me anyway.

I love how it and you nail the Led Zep soft finger played part and then rock out the rest of What is and What Should Never Be.


----------



## jeffb

Well at least 2 people like it  Thanks for taking the time to listen!

A few comments

1) I was hitting it harder than normal on purpose at times- to show how undynamic it was- a NMV does not act the same way- my Class 5 is superior here, too- The compression on the attenuated ORI20H sounds unnatural- like a compressor pedal/modeller.

2) It's so THIN. That was my new(ish) Les Paul with which is a beefy monster. Here, it sounds pretty much like a strat (hence why I was playing the old Gary Moore, and Blackmore licks- that's the vibe it gave off)

3) Compared to my full volume clip I've posted here and there, you can really tell how badly it reacts to the attenuator. It's gets one dimensional, loses it's dynamics, and compresses horribly. My Class5 at full power (5w) utilizing the attenuator at the same settings does not get nearly as thin or undynamic as the Origin. The DSL also fares much better.

And that was all just by knocking it down 3db from full volume. Castrated.

IDK if the 50W would work better for me, but I'm mad at myself for not going that route to begin with. I have a feeling it would fare much better under reduced voltages, or attenuated.


----------



## Jason Fieldhouseespk

jeffb said:


> Well at least 2 people like it  Thanks for taking the time to listen!
> 
> A few comments
> 
> 1) I was hitting it harder than normal on purpose at times- to show how undynamic it was- a NMV does not act the same way- my Class 5 is superior here, too- The compression on the attenuated ORI20H sounds unnatural- like a compressor pedal/modeller.
> 
> 2) It's so THIN. That was my new(ish) Les Paul with which is a beefy monster. Here, it sounds pretty much like a strat (hence why I was playing the old Gary Moore, and Blackmore licks- that's the vibe it gave off)
> 
> 3) Compared to my full volume clip I've posted here and there, you can really tell how badly it reacts to the attenuator. It's gets one dimensional, loses it's dynamics, and compresses horribly. My Class5 at full power (5w) utilizing the attenuator at the same settings does not get nearly as thin or undynamic as the Origin. The DSL also fares much better.
> 
> And that was all just by knocking it down 3db from full volume. Castrated.
> 
> IDK if the 50W would work better for me, but I'm mad at myself for not going that route to begin with. I have a feeling it would fare much better under reduced voltages, or attenuated.



Your Les paul sounded like a strat?? That's not right at all man.... I've dropped the volume on this numerous time with various attenuators and that has not been my experience at all... weird that is! :-/


----------



## jeffb

Jason Fieldhouseespk said:


> Your Les paul sounded like a strat?? That's not right at all man.... I've dropped the volume on this numerous time with various attenuators and that has not been my experience at all... weird that is! :-/




that is my les paul in the clip above.


----------



## Barry A

ST035 said:


> What are your suggestions for boosting Origin 20c (with gain on full and volume on full), which approach would be better? (I don't have the amp yet, I've been waiting for 7 months already for Thomann to restock them and will have to wait till January 2021)



I use an sss Strat with emg pickups, and i put an sd-1 and big muff in front. Sounds fantastic


----------



## Mark Collier

jeffb said:


> that is my les paul in the clip above.



Sounded just like a Les Paul into a marshal to me...?

I am not sure your hearing the same as me (or us?) here. Purposely hitting too hard aside, On a Plexi level, it sounded pretty damn good to me......

I also have a Class 5 and Origin 20. Class 5 gets "quite" compressed and muddy at gain too.....I dunno, each has their thing and depending on settings, playing, etc. both can sound good and bad to me.

Weirdly, in forum land when the Class 5 came out, there was a big swing towards it, very quickly there was a big swing away. Muddy, not loud enough to practice with a band, 10" not good enough, too bassy, cab rattles etc.

Now suddenly I am back into Marshal Forum land after a few years away and am seeing a big swing back towards them again....with all that previously held belief suddenly forgotten.

Suits me, the values have started going up!


----------



## jeffb

Mark Collier said:


> Sounded just like a Les Paul into a marshal to me...?
> 
> I am not sure your hearing the same as me (or us?) here. Purposely hitting too hard aside, On a Plexi level, it sounded pretty damn good to me......
> 
> I also have a Class 5 and Origin 20. Class 5 gets "quite" compressed and muddy at gain too.....I dunno, each has their thing and depending on settings, playing, etc. both can sound good and bad to me.
> 
> Weirdly, in forum land when the Class 5 came out, there was a big swing towards it, very quickly there was a big swing away. Muddy, not loud enough to practice with a band, 10" not good enough, too bassy, cab rattles etc.
> 
> Now suddenly I am back into Marshal Forum land after a few years away and am seeing a big swing back towards them again....with all that previously held belief suddenly forgotten.
> 
> Suits me, the values have started going up!



Hey I don't expect everyone to like and dislike what *I* like and dislike! 

I run my C5 (and ORI20H and DSL40) through a 2x12, so I suppose that's not fair comparing it to the stock combo cab.

With the 20H In the room, the guitar is super thin. I just don't think it's moving the speakers very well and thus not getting the love from the G12Ms. This is with the attenuator (-3DB) and at 20W. At medium power and unattenuated it sounds louder and not as thin and it sounds more like it should. Medium power does a better job of pushing the speakers.

I ordered a new 55hz for my cab as I finally found a good deal on one, so I'll give that a try too (unattenuated) before I hand it off to my boy at break.

I'm going to post the medium power, no attenuation clip in a bit. I'm starting to wonder if the amp is working properly to begin with. It sounds pretty nasty in med power with the boost on (and feels worse).


----------



## jeffb

And done- Unless anyone wants to hear me  about settings and opining, skip to 1:26


----------



## rolijen

Sounds really good to my ears. I get the “Thin” comment. I too feel like my Origin 20 with the master below 3 o’clock is on the thin side. But, in this video, your tone is sounding really Zeppy to me. In fact, you’ve inspired me to go crank up my Origin 20 right now! Thanks, bro!


----------



## rolijen

“During these difficult days, it really helps to just get out and play a little guitar.”


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

jeffb said:


> And done- Unless anyone wants to hear me  about settings and opining, skip to 1:26



I don’t know Jeff that sounded pretty damn good to me my friend.
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## jeffb

Maybe I just need to take a break from the amp for a few weeks/change things up.

New 55HZ will definitely change things up. 

thanks all!


----------



## Most_Triumphant

I find the Origin is really lacking low mids. Find a speaker that emphasizes the low mids and it'll thicken up again. 

I recently found a local Randall 2x12 that has Jaguar speakers in it. The cab was so bassy I almost couldn't get enough treble out of the amp. Definitely a weird trip with this amp. Usually I have to dial back the treble.


----------



## Mark Collier

rolijen said:


> Sounds really good to my ears. I get the “Thin” comment. I too feel like my Origin 20 with the master below 3 o’clock is on the thin side. But, in this video, your tone is sounding really Zeppy to me. In fact, you’ve inspired me to go crank up my Origin 20 right now! Thanks, bro!



Haven't heard the new clip yet but I agree 100% with this, I usually have gain at 3/4 to full (no boost) and master at 3/4 to full and control final overall volume with the attenuator switch.

edit - further to watching the clip, The Origin does 20, 3 and 1/2 watt setting so if your comparing your "5 watt " (which is really 3) to the class 5 it might account for some of the difference.

P.S Clip sounds awesome!!! - Exactly what a Plexi should in my ears...unreal in fact.

I think you must be over or under - exposed...I often get like this going from one amp to another....my ears take a bit to accustomise.


----------



## jeffb

Most_Triumphant said:


> I find the Origin is really lacking low mids. Find a speaker that emphasizes the low mids and it'll thicken up again.



Agreed. Doesn't quite growl like an actual NMV. 12H30 55hz I think will help here.


----------



## jeffb

Mark Collier said:


> Haven't heard the new clip yet but I agree 100% with this, I usually have gain at 3/4 to full (no boost) and master at 3/4 to full and control final overall volume with the attenuator switch.
> 
> edit - further to watching the clip, The Origin does 20, 3 and 1/2 watt setting so if your comparing your "5 watt " (which is really 3) to the class 5 it might account for some of the difference.



Yeah. always think 5w for medium and 1w for low, which is incorrect.

As for the comparison earlier I was talking 20H @ full power through the RockCrusher vs. The Class 5 @ full power through the RockCrusher. The Class5 for whatever reason doesn't "suffer" nearly as much..



> P.S Clip sounds awesome!!! - Exactly what a Plexi should in my ears...unreal in fact.
> 
> I think you must be over or under - exposed...I often get like this going from one amp to another....my ears take a bit to accustomise.



Or maybe I just don't like "plexi" as much as I used to? I think my ears are drifting towards HiWatts and big watt Fenders in my old age. More meat, less sizzle.

But thanks for the listen! IDK WTF my problem is


----------



## jeffb

<<<<<<--------55hz has arrived. Earlier than expected. Installed yesterday evening- I left the EVH at 96DB in the 2x12 to go along as I knew it would get drowned out vs. the 98db G12M25. Played for about 45 min. 

First impressions-

pushing power section in low and medium does not result in as much flub and farty-ness. . Still retains the good "greenback" top end fizzies. Significant change

With the increase in SPL, now as loud on low power as it was previously on medium power, and low power sound and response much better than it used to be. Significant change.

Tone with boost off, now sounds similar in "bigness" to G12ms (only) with boost on. Significant change.

I should have some time on Saturday to start working the cone over. Still needs much break-in. My hunch of the H30 55hz being a better overall match for the inefficiencies of the 20 watter seems like it will be the case.


----------



## What?

jeffb said:


> <<<<<<--------55hz has arrived. Earlier than expected. Installed yesterday evening- I left the EVH at 96DB in the 2x12 to go along as I knew it would get drowned out vs. the 98db G12M25. Played for about 45 min.
> 
> First impressions-
> 
> pushing power section in low and medium does not result in as much flub and farty-ness. . Still retains the good "greenback" top end fizzies. Significant change
> 
> With the increase in SPL, now as loud on low power as it was previously on medium power, and low power sound and response much better than it used to be. Significant change.
> 
> Tone with boost off, now sounds similar in "bigness" to G12ms (only) with boost on. Significant change.
> 
> I should have some time on Saturday to start working the cone over. Still needs much break-in. My hunch of the H30 55hz being a better overall match for the inefficiencies of the 20 watter seems like it will be the case.



Your description reminds me alot of the Weber 1230 55hz but with lower efficiency and without the long break-in time. And when the 1230 is pushed to the point of compression it gets this nice grittiness to it that I haven't heard elsewhere.


----------



## jeffb

What? said:


> Your description reminds me alot of the Weber 1230 55hz but with lower efficiency and without the long break-in time. And when the 1230 is pushed to the point of compression it gets this nice grittiness to it that I haven't heard elsewhere.



Had not heard of the weber version. Lower SPL is a good thing. Will have to do some digging.


----------



## What?

jeffb said:


> Had not heard of the weber version. Lower SPL is a good thing. Will have to do some digging.



See if I can dig up a couple of sound clips. They will likely have been recorded at lower volumes though, not to the point of compression.


----------



## What?

@jeffb Some junky playing here. Was just noodling some stuff out to listen back to when trying to dial things in. It's the DSL50 green channel. https://app.box.com/s/ljjmefx46it0tmoa5h66ym3lr6hlcp1p

That was recorded at lower volume. Pushing that speaker, it gets compressed, the mids come up, and a grittiness shows it's face. But that speaker sounds cool at any volume, after the short break-in period.

Whoops. Had the link hosed. Fixed.


----------



## scozz

jeffb said:


> In a effort to come to terms with my Ori20H, I decided to run it at full power through the Rivera today and make a noodle clip. All the details are pretty much in the vid (use headphones)
> 
> My thoughts later.



I also think it sounds pretty good, but I think I understand what you’re saying. There are certain sections when I’m thinking,....hmmm that doesn’t sound that great.


----------



## jeffb

What? said:


> Some junky playing here. Was just noodling some stuff out to listen back to when trying to dial things in. It's the DSL50 green channel. https://app.box.com/s/ljjmefx46it0tmoa5h66ym3lr6hlcp1p
> 
> That was recorded at lower volume. Pushing that speaker, it gets compressed, the mids come up, and a grittiness shows it's face. But that speaker sounds cool at any volume, after the short break-in period.
> 
> Whoops. Had the link hosed. Fixed.



Excellent. That's the tone! Nice playing. I'm looking forward to trying it with my DSL too. 55Hz always has that Rev Willy G vibe going on. I'm guessing that was what was in his Marshall cabs BITD.


----------



## What?

@jeffb Some more junky playing when dialing things in with the DSL50 and 1230 55hz, low master volume on this one. Was trying to get a brighter and tighter sound. Just wasn't happening with the DSL50. https://app.box.com/s/81jmow8vvllc25vt5424tcsj1xrxt0qt


----------



## scozz

jeffb said:


> And done- Unless anyone wants to hear me  about settings and opining, skip to 1:26



That sounds good too! It’s just,...I don’t know,....there just seems to be a little something missing, to my ears.

Great playing Jeff, I enjoy listening to you.


----------



## What?

jeffb said:


> Excellent. That's the tone! Nice playing. I'm looking forward to trying it with my DSL too. 55Hz always has that Rev Willy G vibe going on. I'm guessing that was what was in his Marshall cabs BITD.



It's a good tone from that speaker and DSL50 for sure. Sometimes I love that sort of thing. But sometimes I want more of a Malcolm cleaner, brighter, tighter thing. I was never able to get that from the DSL50 with any speaker that I tried. It's the amp, not the speaker.


----------



## jeffb

scozz said:


> I also think it sounds pretty good, but I think I understand what you’re saying. There are certain sections when I’m thinking,....hmmm that doesn’t sound that great.



The ORI20H for me, just doesn't have the refined nature of it's bigger and/or more expensive brothers and sisters, which I'm used to. While it sounds good, it doesn't ever really sound great until you blast the damn thing- at which point you will get a more complex and professional sound doing the same thing with other vintage voice Marshalls- Vintage Modern, NMVs. It's a price point amp- get you in the ballpark, and take a single. Never a homerun. 

IMO of course.


----------



## scozz

What? said:


> @jeffb Some junky playing here. Was just noodling some stuff out to listen back to when trying to dial things in. It's the DSL50 green channel. https://app.box.com/s/ljjmefx46it0tmoa5h66ym3lr6hlcp1p
> 
> That was recorded at lower volume. Pushing that speaker, it gets compressed, the mids come up, and a grittiness shows it's face. But that speaker sounds cool at any volume, after the short break-in period.
> 
> Whoops. Had the link hosed. Fixed.


That’s it,.......to my ears! Nice What!


----------



## jeffb

What? said:


> It's a good tone from that speaker and DSL50 for sure. Sometimes I love that sort of thing. But sometimes I want more of a Malcolm cleaner, brighter, tighter thing. I was never able to get that from the DSL50 with any speaker that I tried. It's the amp, not the speaker.



Understood.

Try the KT77s.

Seriously.


----------



## What?

scozz said:


> That’s it,.......to my ears! Nice What!



Weber 1230 55hz 50 watt, pre-rola doping. DSL50 green channel, attenuated. There is an irony here. That speaker sounds the biz for metal too on the red channel.


----------



## What?

jeffb said:


> Understood.
> 
> Try the KT77s.
> 
> Seriously.



Think I will have to. You making me spend too much money on current produciton tubes.


----------



## What?

jeffb said:


> And done- Unless anyone wants to hear me  about settings and opining, skip to 1:26




Sounds good here man, especially considering that it isn't miked up. I just like learning more about amps and speakers in general, so opine away.


----------



## What?

@jeffb

I would say to get that speaker good and broken in before judging it too much. It doesn't sound far and away from the Weber 1230 55 hz to me, considering that it is spankin new.

It's past 10AM here, so time to go do some crankin' up and tube sniffin'.


----------



## jeffb

What? said:


> @jeffb
> 
> I would say to get that speaker good and broken in before judging it too much. It doesn't sound far and away from the Weber 1230 55 hz to me, considering that it is spankin new.
> 
> It's past 10AM here, so time to go do some crankin' up and tube sniffin'.



Just to clarify- That's not the 55hz in those clips. That's the m25 and EVH M20. I won't make a clip of the 55hz until I get some hours on it and it gets rid of the cardboard.


----------



## What?

jeffb said:


> Just to clarify- That's not the 55hz in those clips. That's the m25 and EVH M20. I won't make a clip of the 55hz until I get some hours on it and it gets rid of the cardboard.



Ha!

Funny thing here. I just went and dialed that same sort of sound up on the Plexi 51 with the G12K-85's while beginning on today's tube sniffin' adventure. Very much in that neighborhood. Maybe it is less about the speaker and more about the amp. That 1230 gets some deep lows though that can make it sound looser.


----------



## jeffb

What? said:


> Ha!
> 
> Funny thing here. I just went and dialed that same sort of sound up on the Plexi 51 with the G12K-85's while beginning on today's tube sniffin' adventure. Very much in that neighborhood. Maybe it is less about the speaker and more about the amp. That 1230 gets some deep lows though that can make it sound looser.



I think they are both equally important. And I'd say IME, the "wrong" speakers are more of a hindrance than the "wrong" amp when it comes to "the marshall sound". You can go plug a DR. Z whatever , a Hi_Watt, or a Silverface Bassman into G12ms and all of a sudden you have something way closer to "the marshall sound" than you would running the Marshall into a set of old Jensens or Fanes or whatever.


----------



## What?

jeffb said:


> I think they are both equally important. And I'd say IME, the "wrong" speakers are more of a hindrance than the "wrong" amp when it comes to "the marshall sound". You can go plug a DR. Z whatever , a Hi_Watt, or a Silverface Bassman into G12ms and all of a sudden you have something way closer to "the marshall sound" than you would running the Marshall into a set of old Jensens or Fanes or whatever.



I agree with that, in my limited experience with 'Marshalls'.


----------



## What?

Btw, I never tried that 1230 in a closed back. It might get real boomy that way. Sounds nice in open back and semi-open back. It can get pretty bright but not in a glaring offensive way, always having a nice fat warmth over it.


----------



## GarethWP

scozz said:


> Have you tried a Tubescreamer with your Origin? Or how about a SD1? I’m not a fan of of the SD1 but Mitch, (@Mitchell Pearrow), uses one with his Origin50. If I’m not mistaken, he loves the tones he’s getting!


Sorry about my late response Scozz unfortunately I don't have a tube screamer or SD1 I have only one pedal and that's my blues driver oh and a looper, but I can see the SD1 being added even though my financial director is constantly telling me I have too much guitar stuff ....I actually believe that one more is still not enough but hey. 

Interestingly after a little more time with my Ori 20H and the matching 2 x12 seventy 80 loaded cab I have to say that I'm actually loving the tones I'm getting and for anyone who might be reading this and wondering if to get the Origin Head and Cab. I would say yes definitely get one. But give them a chance to settle and break in before committing to an opinion because there is definitely a huge change in the tones coming from my set up since mine were new.

And no its not all the tone that I want, certainly without the help of some pedals, But I seriously love the sounds that I can get just with the amp and cab. Enough of a change to think that now my desire for rolling the valves and speakers, Is not so much a need but more a because I can and would like to. And although I would still love a DSL to give me the end of the spectrum of tone that the Origin cant get without the help of pedals, the DSL is now just a want not a need.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

GarethWP said:


> Sorry about my late response Scozz unfortunately I don't have a tube screamer or SD1 I have only one pedal and that's my blues driver oh and a looper, but I can see the SD1 being added even though my financial director is constantly telling me I have too much guitar stuff ....I actually believe that one more is still not enough but hey.
> 
> Interestingly after a little more time with my Ori 20H and the matching 2 x12 seventy 80 loaded cab I have to say that I'm actually loving the tones I'm getting and for anyone who might be reading this and wondering if to get the Origin Head and Cab. I would say yes definitely get one. But give them a chance to settle and break in before committing to an opinion because there is definitely a huge change in the tones coming from my set up since mine were new.
> 
> And no its not all the tone that I want, certainly without the help of some pedals, But I seriously love the sounds that I can get just with the amp and cab. Enough of a change to think that now my desire for rolling the valves and speakers, Is not so much a need but more a because I can and would like to. And although I would still love a DSL to give me the end of the spectrum of tone that the Origin cant get without the help of pedals, the DSL is now just a want not a need.


I fully understand your position on the DSL, I had the Dsl40c’s first and wanted the change the Origin brought to the table, while in the local GC , I heard some one playing through the Origin 20H, so as he finished up I took a tribute LP over and gave it a quick run.
It was enough to get me to order the 50H.
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## GarethWP

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> I fully understand your position on the DSL, I had the Dsl40c’s first and wanted the change the Origin brought to the table, while in the local GC , I heard some one playing through the Origin 20H, so as he finished up I took a tribute LP over and gave it a quick run.
> It was enough to get me to order the 50H.
> Cheers
> Mitch


Yes Mitch I cant wait to get back into the local guitar shop and have a trial play if they have what i want to test run in stock. and I know ill come home with that DSL. On another note I've been catching up on the thread since I last looked in and very interested in and loving the clips Jeffb has shared with us. But id like to add that I actually love the the sounds I'm getting with the low power settings and keeping my Les Paul volume on 10 I vary the amp master and gain to suit the time of day and If the neighbours are home. I now find everything a bit to lively for my skill set when I get the chance to crank everything.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

GarethWP said:


> Yes Mitch I cant wait to get back into the local guitar shop and have a trial play if they have what i want to test run in stock. and I know ill come home with that DSL. On another note I've been catching up on the thread since I last looked in and very interested in and loving the clips Jeffb has shared with us. But id like to add that I actually love the the sounds I'm getting with the low power settings and keeping my Les Paul volume on 10 I vary the amp master and gain to suit the time of day and If the neighbours are home. I now find everything a bit to lively for my skill set when I get the chance to crank everything.


I had been running mine on the mid power setting, and just went back to full, at 3 on the dial I am getting loud enough for all my neighbors to hear. And I don’t feel the tone suffering much, I no longer use the boost function, but I dial the gain up to 8.
I am using the MXR10 band eq to run both heads, with either the SD1 or the Joyo ultimate drive in front of the amp’s . They get down an dirty just as I like to hear them.
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## jeffb

Welp. 

I've been playing on and off for 7 hours. Got the initial break-in done for the 55hz. 

I don't think it will save the Origin, for me- But it damn sure is an improvement, and especially so with the DSL. Really gets green crunch barking like 'Calling Dr. Love" or some other early KISS, like Alive, etc. Very 1975.


----------



## jeffb

UPDATE

I owe my Origin an apology. It wasn't the amp's fault for the trouble I've been having. Though I was correct, there was an issue in the signal path.

I started experiencing weird issues with nasty tones with my DSL too over the past few days, and I was damn near ready to throw everything out the window. Same sort of issues I was having with the Origin- Fizzy, flubby, undefined but extremely bright/trebly tones I was hearing and a weird "feel" in the amps, like the speakers were starting to crap out (but the volume was fine).  

I then tried my Class5. Same thing. Now I knew something was going on besides the amps....

Did mad tube swaps. No changes. 
Did speaker swaps, no changes, though it was way more pronounced with some speakers.
I re-did/touched up my guitar wiring. No changes.
Swapped out my pickups- it actually became even worse with some brighter and thumpy A5 pickups. 
I tried a different guitar cord ( I plug straight in these days), nope, not it.


If I had hair (I shave my head) I would have pulled every one of them out, so these little emoji guys are not too far off the real thing  

And then  

The grinch got a wonderful, awful idea



 Fracking speaker cable. I pulled it, and replaced with another that I have when I use my attenuator.  

All amps sounding healthy again- I'm guessing there's a cold solder joint or something else going on internally with the old speaker cable/plug. 

Also G12M25 and H3055hz is a better mix than EVHM20 and H3055Hz- not just because of volume issues, the EQ's of each speaker are a better match too.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Wow that’s cool you got it figured out.
I had a similar experience.
I rolled tubes and still was getting nothing, on a whim I changed the speaker cable and there it was lol


----------



## L Newman

I'm getting the noise in linked file from my Origin 20C. Don't know what's causing it. Valve crapping itself? Can't handle the transient? Only happening on E 12th fret.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/eu8idlwellmv5st/noise - 10:11:20, 9.32 am.mp3?dl=0


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

L Newman said:


> I'm getting the noise in linked file from my Origin 20C. Don't know what's causing it. Valve crapping itself? Can't handle the transient? Only happening on E 12th fret.
> 
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/eu8idlwellmv5st/noise - 10:11:20, 9.32 am.mp3?dl=0


Does it do this with all guitars ??
That’s an odd dilemma, I have never had any thing like that sound.
Sorry I am of no help but it only takes place at the 12’th fret, makes me think it’s the guitar..
Cheers


----------



## C-Grin

Anyone put a Celestion gold in a 20c ?


----------



## RCM 800

L Newman said:


> I'm getting the noise in linked file from my Origin 20C. Don't know what's causing it. Valve crapping itself? Can't handle the transient? Only happening on E 12th fret.
> 
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/eu8idlwellmv5st/noise - 10:11:20, 9.32 am.mp3?dl=0


Is that delay/reverb on your board or post? Maybe try plugging straight in? I think I hear what youre talking about but might be easier to hear with a dry signal.


----------



## L Newman

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> Does it do this with all guitars ??
> That’s an odd dilemma, I have never had any thing like that sound.
> Sorry I am of no help but it only takes place at the 12’th fret, makes me think it’s the guitar..
> Cheers


Thanks. Only have the one guitar. Only on bridge pick up - have dropped it. Won't get another opportunity for a while to crank the amp and record it.


----------



## L Newman

RCM 800 said:


> Is that delay/reverb on your board or post? Maybe try plugging straight in? I think I hear what youre talking about but might be easier to hear with a dry signal.


Thanks. Delay and reverb from the board. Won't get another opportunity to crank the amp and test it for a while.


----------



## acosta

Hoping someone might explain the Tilt knob relative to the two channel plexi. I get that the Tilt knob allows combining both normal and high treble channels. But I don't know that it allows differential gain settings from both channels, as there is only one gain knob. so my question relates to how configure the origin at the settings I use on my SV20. 1 and 10 are easy to figure out. But again, relative to the two channel plexi, does 5 on Tilt therefore mean both channels at 10? and therefore 3 on Tilt is 1/3 N and 2/3 HT? and therefore 7 on Tilt is 1/3 HT and 2/3 N? Thoughts and insights on this would be greatly appreciated.


----------



## RCM 800

acosta said:


> Hoping someone might explain the Tilt knob relative to the two channel plexi. I get that the Tilt knob allows combining both normal and high treble channels. But I don't know that it allows differential gain settings from both channels, as there is only one gain knob. so my question relates to how configure the origin at the settings I use on my SV20. 1 and 10 are easy to figure out. But again, relative to the two channel plexi, does 5 on Tilt therefore mean both channels at 10? and therefore 3 on Tilt is 1/3 N and 2/3 HT? and therefore 7 on Tilt is 1/3 HT and 2/3 N? Thoughts and insights on this would be greatly appreciated.



I thought it was MV takes the place of VI and VII and that the tilt was a blend knob. I might be wrong though.


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

acosta said:


> Hoping someone might explain the Tilt knob relative to the two channel plexi.



I'm pretty sure it's more a tone control that "simulates" the effect of blending channels rather than replicating the plexi circuit. The idea is full tilt is like high treble channel and no tilt is normal channel, but I get the impression the Origin is an overall brighter amp. With just the one preamp gain it's something you'd have to approximate by ear (overall listening with ears rather than eyes is best approach with it).

The tilt is very handy for taming the harshness of dirt pedals and compensating for the differences in power modes. I rely on it more than the tone stack for dialling it in.


----------



## acosta

OTTS, Thanks for this insight: to understand tilt *as* the HT circuit itself. That is, It blends HT *into* the default Normal channel. Meaning that Tilt at 10 is Normal channel at 0, and Tilt at 9 is Normal at 1, so on. Awesome. thanks a million.


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

acosta said:


> That is, It blends HT *into* the default Normal channel. Meaning that Tilt at 10 is Normal channel at 0, and Tilt at 9 is Normal at 1, so on. Awesome. thanks a million.



Yeah that seems the gist of it. FWIW I rarely have mine up more than half way, and leave presence off or barely on.

Still digging this amp a lot 4 months on. I've noticed they don't come up on local classifieds so either no one's been buying them or most people are happy.
I've had a lot of fun experimenting with pedals and gear, but more often than not I just use the amp straight up.

Some opinions:
The power scaling, even the low/0.5w mode is well done, and sounds/feels better to me than my two notes reactive load attenuator.

It's a bright amp with my G12T75s.
As mentioned above I don't use much if any presence and tilt rarely more than half. It gets a bit brighter on full power mode too, so I use the tilt to compensate. Although with tilt, treble and presence controls it offers a lot of control for the high end, its possible some could find the amp too bright for their personal gear/sound.

Master volume on full isn't a bad starting point for finding good tones. The amp probably could have nearly done without a MV but I could see that scaring off buyers.

You can get the amp to do great high chugga chugga with pedals, but volume get's a but limited if you want to keep it tight (high gain pedals into crunching Origin starts to get a bit messy). May not hold up to a loud band scenario for that context.

I've run a few preamp tubes through after one of the originals were bad, and I really like the JJ ECC803s (longplate vs their regular ecc83) in V1 (with stock chinese tube in v2 and sovtek lps in v3).
Most of the effects of swapping around was pretty subtle but the ecc803s seems to add a nice lower mid growl and less tendency for harshness with gain up.


----------



## Mike Cheli

Joe_Easy said:


> Any call for an official Marshall Origin 20 Thread here? If so, I just created it! If not, I created it anyway...
> 
> Recently took delivery of one. Loved it. Replaced all stock tubes with premium Groove Tubes. Loved it even more.
> 
> Any other recommended upgrades, Etc? I was thinking of swapping the stock Celestion for a Greenback, or maybe a Creamback. I have a 12” Creamback I used to swap into previous 12” combos I’ve owned (there’s been a few!) and I always preferred it...no experience with the 10”, though. This is actually the first 10” combo I’ve owned. Actually, that’s a lie...it’s the first 10” I’ve wanted to hang on to; I very briefly owned a Marshall Class 5, but sold it a day later![/QUOTE
> Thanks for creating this thread!
> I put a 12” Greenback in my 20C.
> It really breathes! Anyone have experience with the volume dropping randomly (a lot) while playing? After shutting it down it comes back ok. Still under warranty so that’s good. Any advice would be appreciated!!
> Happy 2021 everyone!


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Sorry I have had no problems at all with the volume dropping out, but try a patch cable in the loop, this cured that problem on my 3210’s (lead 100 mosfet’s)
Cheers
Mitch


----------



## Scottz

Has anyone tried a TAD ECC83WA in this amp? Or have any idea how it might sound?


----------



## Scottz

Ok, can someone explain to me, between V1, V2, and V3 which position would benefit more from a tube change from the factory tubes?


----------



## RCM 800

V1 will have the most effect if youre tube rolling, then V2 and 3


----------



## Scottz

Thanks, I hava a TAD ECC83WA in another amp I was thinking of popping in, would there be any benefit in moving the JJ from V1 into V2 or V3?


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Scottz said:


> Thanks, I hava a TAD ECC83WA in another amp I was thinking of popping in, would there be any benefit in moving the JJ from V1 into V2 or V3?


Try it and give it a listen , your ears will decide the final location..


Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## C-Grin

Scottz said:


> Thanks, I hava a TAD ECC83WA in another amp I was thinking of popping in, would there be any benefit in moving the JJ from V1 into V2 or V3?


I agree give it a try. I have been trying a few different pre amp tubes since I got my 20c a couple months ago and found a combo that is just killing it. The stock pre amp tubes that came in mine were not good, treble was too harsh, horribly microphonic, rattling badly, gain was not good. I think anything would have been an improvement. But now this amp (through a different speaker, I did not care for the V type) is just awesome.


----------



## Rjgxp

C-Grin said:


> I agree give it a try. I have been trying a few different pre amp tubes since I got my 20c a couple months ago and found a combo that is just killing it. The stock pre amp tubes that came in mine were not good, treble was too harsh, horribly microphonic, rattling badly, gain was not good. I think anything would have been an improvement. But now this amp (through a different speaker, I did not care for the V type) is just awesome.



So what tubes did you end up going with?


----------



## C-Grin

Rjgxp said:


> So what tubes did you end up going with?


So in V-1 I have a Mesa Boogie (branded) 
12AX7-S that I had from 20 years ago or so. In V-2 and old Electro Harmonix 12AX7 rolling around in a box a tubes from who knows how long ago. And in the pi spot a mesa 12ax7-str. Also I replaced the power tubes with straight up JJ EL34s and even though the originals were JJs also I like the new ones better.
I have no idea who actually made those Mesa tubes, but they are killing it in this amp.


----------



## L Newman

Does anyone have the Marshall Origin 2x12" Angled Speaker Cabinet? And, if so, comments?


----------



## tincbtrar

L Newman said:


> Does anyone have the Marshall Origin 2x12" Angled Speaker Cabinet? And, if so, comments?



I tried it and returned it in a day. You can do a lot better. I wound up using my 1966B cab instead, which had the original vented G12T75's. Didn't sound bad, but wanted more speaker push so I stuck some Greenbacks in and they match pretty well with the Origin 20.


----------



## RCM 800

L Newman said:


> Does anyone have the Marshall Origin 2x12" Angled Speaker Cabinet? And, if so, comments?


I have one on order, Ill do a follow up when it gets here.


----------



## fitz

L Newman said:


> Does anyone have the Marshall Origin 2x12" Angled Speaker Cabinet? And, if so, comments?



I didn't get one for my Origin20H because I didn't quite like the way it looks.
Also it's MDF and loaded with the much un-loved Seventy-80 speakers.
I made my own 212A with Vintage30s - nice, rich, classic tone IMO.
(Although, I like the Seventy-80 MX112Rs with my DSL20HR - kinda' gritty/punchy/dirty-good with the gain cranked...)

edit: also out of stock at GC, used are non existent, and I have a chronic aversion to buying new gear to begin with.


----------



## RCM 800

fitz288 said:


> I didn't get one for my Origin20H because I didn't quite like the way it looks.
> Also it's MDF and loaded with the much un-loved Seventy-80 speakers.
> I made my own 212A with Vintage30s - nice, rich, classic tone IMO.
> (Although, I like the Seventy-80 MX112Rs with my DSL20HR - kinda' gritty/punchy/dirty-good with the gain cranked...)
> 
> edit: also out of stock at GC, used are non existent, and I have a chronic aversion to buying new gear to begin with.



yea If I dont like it I might put a couple Hellatone 60's in it and do something else with the 70/80s. I usually like building my own cabs but Im really pressed for any free time lately so I went ahead and ordered one.


----------



## GarethWP

Y


L Newman said:


> Does anyone have the Marshall Origin 2x12" Angled Speaker Cabinet? And, if so, comments?


So not the angled cab but I do have the Origin 212 flat cab I would agree that to begin with the seventy 80s don't inspire much. But given time they really improve. Speakers need to break in especially 70/80s they are not made of prime materials .......I rolled them anyway and put a couple of G12M greenbacks in. Wow what a difference my LP and my Strat sound amazing and even at lower volumes and I can even make use of the high power setting on the origin 20 head now


----------



## GarethWP

RCM 800 said:


> yea If I dont like it I might put a couple Hellatone 60's in it and do something else with the 70/80s. I usually like building my own cabs but Im really pressed for any free time lately so I went ahead and ordered one.


Yes I think that I might have to have a go at making the 70/80s into a switchable 8ohm mono 16ohm stereo cab


----------



## RCM 800

GarethWP said:


> Yes I think that I might have to have a go at making the 70/80s into a switchable 8ohm mono 16ohm stereo cab


and I canceled the cab lol. There was a mess up on the order so I used it as an out. Gonna go ahead and build one seeing as I can build a better one that will be lighter. I like the stereo idea. Also I think Im gonna make it with seperated top and bottom so I can make it convertible semi open and closed back.


----------



## GarethWP

RCM 800 said:


> and I canceled the cab lol. There was a mess up on the order so I used it as an out. Gonna go ahead and build one seeing as I can build a better one that will be lighter. I like the stereo idea. Also I think Im gonna make it with seperated top and bottom so I can make it convertible semi open and closed back.


Let us know how you get on with it, any tips I can get before I start to build mine will be appreciated. I think that having the convertible closed/ semi open along with 8ohm mono 16 ohm stereo is the way to go


----------



## bcbcbc

I have a Marshall 50C for a few months. I haven't used it much and in the last few months it has only been at home in one room.

When I recently turned it back on, I noticed that it has a strange humming noise that it didn't do before.

I thought it might be from having it off for months (maybe damp or something), so I left it on without plugging in the guitar for an hour or two or so, but the hum remained the same.

I guess it has to do with the valves.

I put the amp away again and now, a few weeks later, when I have looked at it again, I have noticed that around the power switch there is a stain or perhaps the top gold foil has disintegrated ...


----------



## fitz

bcbcbc said:


> I have a Marshall 50C for a few months. I haven't used it much and in the last few months it has only been at home in one room.
> 
> When I recently turned it back on, I noticed that it has a strange humming noise that it didn't do before.
> 
> I thought it might be from having it off for months (maybe damp or something), so I left it on without plugging in the guitar for an hour or two or so, but the hum remained the same.
> 
> I guess it has to do with the valves.
> 
> I put the amp away again and now, a few weeks later, when I have looked at it again, I have noticed that around the power switch there is a stain or perhaps the top gold foil has disintegrated ...
> View attachment 85115




Looks to me like something corrosive was sprayed in the power switch and blead out onto the face plate.
Did you try to fix the "strange humming noise" by spraying something in that switch?


----------



## GarethWP

I put the amp away again and now, a few weeks later, when I have looked at it again, I have noticed that around the power switch there is a stain or perhaps the top gold foil has disintegrated ... 
Oooer Bcbcbc
That does not look good at all.
I have a hum or a hiss gets louder as I crank up the volume and gain ....I think it's dodgy patch lead and not the best power supplies for the pedals


----------



## bcbcbc

fitz288 said:


> Looks to me like something corrosive was sprayed in the power switch and blead out onto the face plate.
> Did you try to fix the "strange humming noise" by spraying something in that switch?



I did not spray anything, I tried to fix de humming noise leaving it on for an hour or two, some weeks ago. Nothing wrong then. Today I took a look at it again with the idea of turning it back on and I found this


----------



## fitz

bcbcbc said:


> I did not spray anything, I tried to fix de humming noise leaving it on for an hour or two, some weeks ago. Nothing wrong then. Today I took a look at it again with the idea of turning it back on and I found this


Well the hum may be from a tube going bad, from an unproperly grounded power source or some other source of EM interference, but may also be related to whatever happened to the power switch.
There's not a "gold foil" on the faceplate, the metal is plated that color and the lettering is screen printed.
I'll agree on the disintegrating diagnosis, it looks like something is eating it away.
If you are not familiar with the inside of an amp, I'd say look up the nearest Marshall service location from the website and take it there.
Here's a link, check the service center option.
Recommended retailers - marshall.com


----------



## RCM 800

fitz288 said:


> Well the hum may be from a tube going bad, from an unproperly grounded power source or some other source of EM interference, but may also be related to whatever happened to the power switch.
> There's not a "gold foil" on the faceplate, the metal is plated that color and the lettering is screen printed.
> I'll agree on the disintegrating diagnosis, it looks like something is eating it away.
> If you are not familiar with the inside of an amp, I'd say look up the nearest Marshall service location from the website and take it there.
> Here's a link, check the service center option.
> Recommended retailers - marshall.com


yea it looks almost like the switch got hot or had some kind of cathodic reaction between the gold and switch. I would take that in I would hate to get juiced through the switch if there is a short of some kind.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

bcbcbc said:


> I have a Marshall 50C for a few months. I haven't used it much and in the last few months it has only been at home in one room.
> 
> When I recently turned it back on, I noticed that it has a strange humming noise that it didn't do before.
> 
> I thought it might be from having it off for months (maybe damp or something), so I left it on without plugging in the guitar for an hour or two or so, but the hum remained the same.
> 
> I guess it has to do with the valves.
> 
> I put the amp away again and now, a few weeks later, when I have looked at it again, I have noticed that around the power switch there is a stain or perhaps the top gold foil has disintegrated ...
> View attachment 85115


Welcome to the forum not sure what would do that, mine are the 50H’s, and there is a slight hum when I power up, but my volume is always at zero on power up.
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## ST035

I have a question for you Origin users - is it safe to change the power mode while the amp is ON but with master volume and gain down to zero? 

The manual says, if I remember correctly that you should change the power mode before powering up the amp, but some Youtuber testers have done it with their volume still up and nothing happened apart from an audible "pop" sound... what would you recommend me do?


----------



## fitz

Power off.
But if you've got youtuber money to burn, flip it back and forth until it makes smoke, take video, share with the world.


----------



## steveb63

ST035 said:


> I have a question for you Origin users - is it safe to change the power mode while the amp is ON but with master volume and gain down to zero?
> 
> The manual says, if I remember correctly that you should change the power mode before powering up the amp, but some Youtuber testers have done it with their volume still up and nothing happened apart from an audible "pop" sound... what would you recommend me do?


I've seen that same thing.

I believe I'll just follow Marshall's guidelines on this one........


----------



## Edgar Frog

Holy crap I don't even remember seeing that in the manuel! I just recently did it a couple different times without even thinking! I even did it at volume. No pops or anything just heard the volume increase and decrease on each setting. What damage is it supposed to cause for I know if I did anything bad? Never did it before recently and wont do it again. I always have master and gain all the way down while powering up and down I clearly remember that in the manuel but always did that with any amp. I always keep guitar volumes at zero as well before unplugging/plugging in.


----------



## ST035

thanks guys for your input, I appreciate it


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

ST035 said:


> The manual says, if I remember correctly that you should change the power mode before powering up the amp



I can't see that in my manual. I flick between power settings all the time, with master up and all.

Should probably contact marshall of you have doubts. They got back to me pretty quick when I wanted to check I could run it without load.


----------



## Edgar Frog

OriginOfTheSpecies said:


> I can't see that in my manual. I flick between power settings all the time, with master up and all.
> 
> Should probably contact marshall of you have doubts. They got back to me pretty quick when I wanted to check I could run it without load.



I checked mine again and on the very front page towards the bottom in small writing where it tells you the power up procedure it mentions selecting a power setting in the steps before powering it on. It mentions it as a step but there is no warning at all about doing it while it's on. 

Here is a response I pulled from Marshall support from their website answering the question if it's safe to select settings while it's powered on. 

"Regarding your ORI50, you can select between power outputs with the amplifier on, but it is not recommended to keep switching up and down the power output rapidly when playing. 

Kind Regards

Marshall Support"


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

Edgar Frog said:


> it is not recommended to keep switching up and down the power output rapidly when playing.



Dammit now I need to invest in a tremolo pedal.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

steveb63 said:


> I've seen that same thing.
> 
> I believe I'll just follow Marshall's guidelines on this one........


That’s the way I have been doing it, I just flick to the power setting I want before turning it on and volume is always on zero, because of no standby switch!!
Cheers


----------



## ST035

Okay, so I have to share an interesting situation which happened today in the studio . I was supposed to record rhythm guitars (double track) , guitar intro and solo - of course. 

I own Origin 50c. Squier Stratocaster with Di Marzio Hs-3 in the bridge and neck positions, Boss NS-2 and Boss SD-1.

At rehearsals a month ago, I recorded a video and posted it all over Origin threads here.
The amp was in 5 watt mode, master on 10, tilt on 10, gain on 8, mids a hair above 8, bass 8, treble 6, presence 4. SD-1 was : level max, tone a hair over 12 o'clock, and DRIVE max. And it worked well... or so I thought.

Today at the studio me and two engineers were trying to find the sweet spot and to make the sound both natural and USEFUL. Because of the soundproof room, I turned the amp on 50w mode settings, I kept EQ exactly like I stated above, and I kept SD-1 settings the same.
And I got "brown sound", Van Halen type. Which is something I dislike. I hate distortion , even if it's natural. There was much more gain and overcompression. So, one of the engineers suggested that I should try lowering DRIVE setting on my SD-1 to 12 o'clock and then it was OK, it sounded like overdrive just a bit rougher overdrive. So I recorded rhythm guitars and it was okay.

But, when it came to the solo part - everything fell apart. I just couldn't get clarity and note separation I sought. At first I thought it was the problem with me, tension, insecurity, "this is just not my day, I guess". But when I played the solo, with my volume pot on guitar turned off, basically "unplugged", it came out clean and okay.
So we wasted another hour of me trying to pick very difficulty sequences trying to mute it etc.
But nothing worked.

Then another, very young engineer came to relieve those two older guys and at some point he was like "maybe the problem is in the booster". And then it clicked to me - I lowered DRIVE knob to 9 o'clock and voila - everything was perfect, I had sustain, I had overdrive sound/color, the note separation was there.... 

From this I learned the following > The higher the wattage mode, the more tubes will naturally distort , so you have to compensate with the pedal (ie, back the drive knob on SD-1 in my case). We even tried to put DRIVE knob at zero (which is how everyone uses it , but with JCM 800 and that amp has A WAY MORE gain than the Origin) and NOTHING happened. No sustain, no edge, nothing... but when I put it back at 9 o'clock, I got that good sound back.

Now, I am a bit afraid that I might have to redo rhythm guitars tomorrow with these newly found settings (which worked) on SD-1. But it's okay. Been playing for almost 6 hours straight, with a few 10 minute breaks for coffee, smokes, etc. Also, it seems that ... I SPEED AT NIGHT, since the best takes of solos and intros were captured at around half past 11 pm.

have a good one, good people, cheers, 
Scott Noricsson of LA Sunset


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

Has anyone tried KT77s or 6ca7's in their Origin 20's? (Or know if it is possible?)

Something I wouldn't mind experimenting...


----------



## RCM 800

OriginOfTheSpecies said:


> Has anyone tried KT77s or 6ca7's in their Origin 20's? (Or know if it is possible?)
> 
> Something I wouldn't mind experimenting...


no man I dont even fully understand how the cathode bias works so havent experimented. Please follow up if you do.


----------



## solarburn

OriginOfTheSpecies said:


> Has anyone tried KT77s or 6ca7's in their Origin 20's? (Or know if it is possible?)
> 
> Something I wouldn't mind experimenting...



I've got JJ 6CA7'S in my ORI50.

Both KT77's and 6CA7's can be used in EL34 amps. They will bias up the same. Meaning the bias resistor in your amp has the range to bias those tubes because they are within the bias range of an EL34 tube and have the same pin outs.


----------



## Johnny 99

OriginOfTheSpecies said:


> Has anyone tried KT77s or 6ca7's in their Origin 20's? (Or know if it is possible?)
> 
> Something I wouldn't mind experimenting...



The 20 watt Origin is cathode biased and will accept any octal tube. KT77s and 6CA7s are basically direct replacements for EL34s. I have had success with both 6L6s and KT66s. I would like to try 6V6s, as I believe they would run closer to their usual voltages and may provide a more noticeable difference.

Note- KT66s are big tubes. In order to get them in the head the retainer clips must be removed. They barely cleared the top of the headshell when I installed them....


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

Thanks for info chaps - I wasn't sure if the 20's unusual power amp would be a help or hindrance.


----------



## Txdslguy

If this video is a good example of the tone of the Origin 20 I’m super stocked.


----------



## solarburn




----------



## solarburn

Dude does some "Satch Boogie" in this vid...


----------



## Time Traveler

In your opinions , for home using , which is the best setting volume and gain whit Origin 20h for using pedals Overdrive, fuzz and treble booster ? For sounds cranch or distortion.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Time Traveler said:


> In your opinions , for home using , which is the best setting volume and gain whit Origin 20h for using pedals Overdrive, fuzz and treble booster ? For sounds cranch or distortion.


Welcome to the forum 
To answer your question mine are loud , 50 H and I play them at live gig volume from what we did in the early 80’s, I think that to play them quietly you would have to use a couple of pedals stacked into the front of the amp, on the lowest power setting.
But I have never tried this approach.
Give it a shot.
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## RCM 800

Time Traveler said:


> In your opinions , for home using , which is the best setting volume and gain whit Origin 20h for using pedals Overdrive, fuzz and treble booster ? For sounds cranch or distortion.


Not saying this is the best way but this is how Im setup now. I have everything at about noon except the gain is cranked. I dont use the built in boost. Base tone is clean if you play soft and mildly distorted if you really thwack it. I have my GE7 set with a slight mid hump and a slight gain boost for AC/DC kinda gain. Run a TS on top of that for full distortion. Im currently running 2 TS's one set cleaner than the other just for different levels of gain. I use the low power setting when playing alone and mid (mostly mid) or full for playing with the band.


----------



## Time Traveler

Has anyone played a fuzz tonebender with Marshall origin 20 ? It would be better on clean or crunch amp?


----------



## solarburn

Time Traveler said:


> Has anyone played a fuzz tonebender with Marshall origin 20 ? It would be better on clean or crunch amp?



Man fuzzes are really tricky. And who has the money to explore much?

Try both. It really depends on the fuzz circuit. So it's pedal dependant. The only thing I can say for sure is less amp gain usually better.


----------



## solarburn

I have the Origin 50H. I find hair on its distortion already. Mix knowing the amp can get a natural fuzz at higher gain levels.


----------



## RCM 800

Time Traveler said:


> Has anyone played a fuzz tonebender with Marshall origin 20 ? It would be better on clean or crunch amp?


Only fuzz Ive tried that works on mine is the JHS Bender. I run my amp on the edge of breakup and most pedals I tried didnt sound right with it. I imagine if you were to run the amp straight clean like with the master maxed and use the gain as a volume others might work better but I wanted a fuzz that works with my base tone.


----------



## solarburn

RCM 800 said:


> Only fuzz Ive tried that works on mine is the JHS Bender. I run my amp on the edge of breakup and most pedals I tried didnt sound right with it. I imagine if you were to run the amp straight clean like with the master maxed and use the gain as a volume others might work better but I wanted a fuzz that works with my base tone.



So far I have not been able to find a fuzz that works as I want with one amp let alone others. My biggest gear struggle.


----------



## RCM 800

solarburnDSL50 said:


> So far I have not been able to find a fuzz that works as I want with one amp let alone others. My biggest gear struggle.


yea almost like you have to have an amp setup just to run with fuzz.


----------



## Scottz

Quick question not really addressed in the manual - is it ok to switch power levels while the amp is on or should you turn it off to change the power level? Thanks


----------



## fitz

Scottz said:


> Quick question not really addressed in the manual - is it ok to switch power levels while the amp is on or should you turn it off to change the power level? Thanks



Here's a quote from earlier in this thread referencing the manual & online support Q&A:



Edgar Frog said:


> I checked mine again and on the very front page towards the bottom in small writing where it tells you the power up procedure it mentions selecting a power setting in the steps before powering it on. It mentions it as a step but there is no warning at all about doing it while it's on.
> 
> Here is a response I pulled from Marshall support from their website answering the question if it's safe to select settings while it's powered on.
> 
> "Regarding your ORI50, you can select between power outputs with the amplifier on, but it is not recommended to keep switching up and down the power output rapidly when playing.
> 
> Kind Regards
> 
> Marshall Support"


----------



## Scottz

fitz288 said:


> Here's a quote from earlier in this thread referencing the manual & online support Q&A:


Thanks! So don't try to use the power switch as a tremolo.


----------



## NotSure

solarburnDSL50 said:


> So far I have not been able to find a fuzz that works as I want with one amp let alone others. My biggest gear struggle.


I would suggest the Univox Superfuzz (the orange/blue circuit). There are plenty of clones of those available in many different price points, just make sure it's based on that specific circuit. I have a vintage fuzz/wah that has that circuit in it, and the sound through the Origin 20 is massive. Plus you have two tone options with a Superfuzz: mid-scooped for heavy tones, and mid-boost to cut through the mix. It's a great fuzz for any amp really, just stay away from the ones without the internal 10k bias trimmer. The Superfuzz can sound like dissonant garbage when the octave transistors aren't biased correctly. The early vintage ones were very hit and miss. The vintage Orange/Blue ones though are the real deal.


----------



## scozz

NotSure said:


> I would suggest the Univox Superfuzz (the orange/blue circuit). There are plenty of clones of those available in many different price points, just make sure it's based on that specific circuit. I have a vintage fuzz/wah that has that circuit in it, and the sound through the Origin 20 is massive. Plus you have two tone options with a Superfuzz: mid-scooped for heavy tones, and mid-boost to cut through the mix. It's a great fuzz for any amp really, just stay away from the ones without the internal 10k bias trimmer. The Superfuzz can sound like dissonant garbage when the octave transistors aren't biased correctly. The early vintage ones were very hit and miss. The vintage Orange/Blue ones though are the real deal.


I had one of those blue and orange Univox Fuzz pedals back in the 70s. I recall buying it at a Sam Ash in White Plains NY for $35 brand new. Man that was a big pedal, (size wise).

I’ve seen a couple on Reverb for like $1500 asking price!


----------



## solarburn

scozz said:


> I had one of those blue and orange Univox Fuzz pedals back in the 70s. I recall buying it at a Sam Ash in White Plains NY for $35 brand new. Man that was a big pedal, (size wise).
> 
> I’ve seen a couple on Reverb for like $1500 asking price!





Yeah I'll just roll back my tone knob instead.


----------



## natethegreat978

Hi everyone,

I've overall been a happy Origin 20H owner the past 9 months or so, mostly play hard 70's/80's rock (Van Halen, Guns N Roses, AC/DC). I am trying to figure out options to tame the brightness a bit, and maybe fill in a bit of low end/low mids, and add a touch more gain as well but without getting a wooly/mushy tone. I haven't found a combination of settings on the amp or my guitars tone knobs that quite gets what I'm after. Scanning these forums and others, I'm feeling a bit overwhelmed with potential options!

What I have:
- Origin 20 H, running through a 1x12 EVH closed back cab with G12H30 celestion. Usually run on low watt mode with master anywhere between 7 to 10 and gain around 6-8
- Fender fat strat with dimarzio air zone humbucker, also have an epiphone 59' les paul with gibson burstbuckers
- EHX soul food used as a boost in front of the amp when needed. Boss RV-6 in the loop for reverb.

What I'm considering:
- Boss SD-1 (have seen multiple people recommend this as a boost into the front of the origin 20, not sure how much of a difference I'll see compared to the Soul Food, but hey it's only $40-50)
- Swapping preamp tubes
- Swapping in a Greenback speaker
- Get an EQ pedal (in front of amp, or in effects loop?)
- Going crazy and saving up for a 4x12 cab


----------



## fitz

natethegreat978 said:


> - Boss SD-1 (have seen multiple people recommend this as a boost into the front of the origin 20, not sure how much of a difference I'll see compared to the Soul Food, but hey it's only $40-50)


Yes. SD-1 + Marshall = Yeah buddy!


natethegreat978 said:


> - Swapping preamp tubes


Possible? - I put in 3 JJ803 and it added a little growl on straight in & cranked.


natethegreat978 said:


> - Get an EQ pedal (in front of amp, or in effects loop?)


Yes. GE-7 or MXR 10 ~ IN THE LOOP.


natethegreat978 said:


> - Swapping in a Greenback speaker





natethegreat978 said:


> - Going crazy and saving up for a 4x12 cab


Well, maybe a 2x12 - a pair of Vintage30s hit the spot for me.

AND,  to the forum!


----------



## solarburn

natethegreat978 said:


> Hi everyone,
> 
> I've overall been a happy Origin 20H owner the past 9 months or so, mostly play hard 70's/80's rock (Van Halen, Guns N Roses, AC/DC). I am trying to figure out options to tame the brightness a bit, and maybe fill in a bit of low end/low mids, and add a touch more gain as well but without getting a wooly/mushy tone. I haven't found a combination of settings on the amp or my guitars tone knobs that quite gets what I'm after. Scanning these forums and others, I'm feeling a bit overwhelmed with potential options!
> 
> What I have:
> - Origin 20 H, running through a 1x12 EVH closed back cab with G12H30 celestion. Usually run on low watt mode with master anywhere between 7 to 10 and gain around 6-8
> - Fender fat strat with dimarzio air zone humbucker, also have an epiphone 59' les paul with gibson burstbuckers
> - EHX soul food used as a boost in front of the amp when needed. Boss RV-6 in the loop for reverb.
> 
> What I'm considering:
> - Boss SD-1 (have seen multiple people recommend this as a boost into the front of the origin 20, not sure how much of a difference I'll see compared to the Soul Food, but hey it's only $40-50)
> - Swapping preamp tubes
> - Swapping in a Greenback speaker
> - Get an EQ pedal (in front of amp, or in effects loop?)
> - Going crazy and saving up for a 4x12 cab



Circuit wise the amp gets whooly. You have a great OD pedal already. I use mine with a 412 GB cab. I'm using a Breakdown pedal with my 50 watter. I've found a happy place without the mush. Still a hint of whooly which I don't mind. I have other amps that aren't whooly. I actually like how old school unpolished it sounds. Especially with my EVH 412. I can't play quietly. Just FYI.

I did put a 12AY7 in V1. Definitely helps with any bottom mush. But that's me. I like to wrestle my amp when I play. Plenty of saturation...Just clearer.


----------



## solarburn

Oh chit! Welcome NTG!


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

natethegreat978 said:


> Hi everyone,
> 
> I've overall been a happy Origin 20H owner the past 9 months or so, mostly play hard 70's/80's rock (Van Halen, Guns N Roses, AC/DC). I am trying to figure out options to tame the brightness a bit, and maybe fill in a bit of low end/low mids, and add a touch more gain as well but without getting a wooly/mushy tone. I haven't found a combination of settings on the amp or my guitars tone knobs that quite gets what I'm after. Scanning these forums and others, I'm feeling a bit overwhelmed with potential options!
> 
> What I have:
> - Origin 20 H, running through a 1x12 EVH closed back cab with G12H30 celestion. Usually run on low watt mode with master anywhere between 7 to 10 and gain around 6-8
> - Fender fat strat with dimarzio air zone humbucker, also have an epiphone 59' les paul with gibson burstbuckers
> - EHX soul food used as a boost in front of the amp when needed. Boss RV-6 in the loop for reverb.
> 
> What I'm considering:
> - Boss SD-1 (have seen multiple people recommend this as a boost into the front of the origin 20, not sure how much of a difference I'll see compared to the Soul Food, but hey it's only $40-50)
> - Swapping preamp tubes
> - Swapping in a Greenback speaker
> - Get an EQ pedal (in front of amp, or in effects loop?)
> - Going crazy and saving up for a 4x12 cab


Welcome to the forum 
It’s already been said before me, SD1, MXR10 band eq, and your dialing in just became far broader than just the amp and guitar.
I am also an owner of the Origin 50H
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

natethegreat978 said:


> - Swapping preamp tubes





fitz288 said:


> Possible? - I put in 3 JJ803 and it added a little growl on straight in & cranked



+1 for the long plate JJ. Did seem to add a bit more low-mid growl and also mesh better with OD's than other preamp tubes I tried.
You might be fighting a losing battle playing in low power mode though, it's noticeably more mushy and fizzy than the mid/high setting.


----------



## fitz

natethegreat978 said:


> Usually run on low watt mode with master anywhere between 7 to 10 and gain around 6-8


I missed this in the OP.


OriginOfTheSpecies said:


> You might be fighting a losing battle playing in low power mode though, it's noticeably more mushy and fizzy than the mid/high setting.


Agreed. I run mine on 20w at any volume.
At low volume I use the amp boost, up the gain on the SD-1, and give the GE-7 a high/low "V" shape with some boost.
As the volume goes up, I turn the amp boost off, lower the SD-1 gain, and flatten out the GE-7 as the amp gain takes over and opens up.


----------



## natethegreat978

Thank you for the advice everyone, think my next step is going to be grabbing a GE-7 first, then maybe an SD-1. I'll try the mid power setting with a bit of drive dialed in on the Soul Food or SD-1 (so far when I turn on the Soul Food, I've been using it as a clean-ish boost with level maxed and drive near-zero)


----------



## Georgiatec

Just picked up an Origin 20H cheapish (£225). Stock JJ's and Shuguang went in the parts drawer and fitted a pair of vintage RFT EL34's, RFT ECC83 in v1, 60's Valvo (Mullard) in v2 and a Sovtek 12AX7LPS in v3. It was pretty harsh sounding with all the original tubes, but a whole lot better now. Completely different animal to the Ori 5c I have transplanted into a 1 x 12 cab.
Will be a worthy back up to the SV20 when gigs open up again.


----------



## GarethWP

Thought I would re-awaken this thread with an update....... so my Origin 20 HR .........Definitely improved by playing through 2 Greenbacks instead of the pair of 70/80s I started with, but I was still not getting even close to edge of breakup with the amp as it was stock...no not even cranked, yeah putting a BD2 or a SD1 or even a DS1 ( they were presents I asked for TS or soul food) got it there, and don't get me wrong I love the tones I'm getting ......but I wanted more. So I rolled the Tubes first I swapped the stock 12ax7s (marshall) for some Tung-Sols with a balanced one over nearest the power amp tubes and yeah Im there I can now get that edge of breakup tone with the master and gain both on 7. wooohoo. so heck I thought what can I get if I roll the EL34s so in went a matched pair of Tung-Sols in the power amp stage......and nah sounds beautiful full thick and creamy but definitely cleaner again so back in with the stock Marshall EL34s and I'm pretty happy now this sounds really good now at all volumes in every power stage and both my SSS Strat and LP. But I'm still wondering what else I can get with some more tube rolling cos it definitely with absolutely no doubt makes big differences to this amp. Still think I might need a DSL though or an SC or even SV

Thanks everyone and keep on rocking


----------



## fitz

GarethWP said:


> Thought I would re-awaken this thread with an update....... so my Origin 20 HR .........Definitely improved by playing through 2 Greenbacks instead of the pair of 70/80s I started with, but I was still not getting even close to edge of breakup with the amp as it was stock...no not even cranked, yeah putting a BD2 or a SD1 or even a DS1 ( they were presents I asked for TS or soul food) got it there, and don't get me wrong I love the tones I'm getting ......but I wanted more. So I rolled the Tubes first I swapped the stock 12ax7s (marshall) for some Tung-Sols with a balanced one over nearest the power amp tubes and yeah Im there I can now get that edge of breakup tone with the master and gain both on 7. wooohoo. so heck I thought what can I get if I roll the EL34s so in went a matched pair of Tung-Sols in the power amp stage......and nah sounds beautiful full thick and creamy but definitely cleaner again so back in with the stock Marshall EL34s and I'm pretty happy now this sounds really good now at all volumes in every power stage and both my SSS Strat and LP. But I'm still wondering what else I can get with some more tube rolling cos it definitely with absolutely no doubt makes big differences to this amp. Still think I might need a DSL though or an SC or even SV
> 
> Thanks everyone and keep on rocking



A few of us have put the JJ E34L's in the power tubes.
Consensus is that they add some noticeable growl.
If you missed this recent thread, give it a read.
E34L in Origin20 | MarshallForum.com
I've also put JJ ECC803S's in mine - matched set in V1 & V2, balanced one in V3 PI.


----------



## GarethWP

Thank you @fitz288 I will be having a go with some JJs and some Sovteks in the near future I have to say that I have read so much about these amps and watched so many YT vids and a lot is contradictory and especially with the videos not my experience with my ORI20 that I almost didn't care what tubes I tried first. I was really hoping for more from the Tungsol EL34s though. I had read that thread on the 
I will try the E34ls and 803s too soon and again thanks I love the sharing of ideas that we have here on this forum


----------



## Georgiatec

Quick update on my amp three weeks into owning it. Despite Marshall's miss-leading on line manuals and stupid 8 ohm output set up I managed to get away with not blowing the O/T. Although it did smell like I was cooking kippers in my studio. 
This is no master volume amp. You cannot get good overdriven tones with the master low and the gain on full....it just sounds quiet and flat. The master and the gain seem to work like two volume controls and both need to be around 3/4 or above before the amp gives up the goods. I'm currently using Tung Sol new production EL34's, ECC83's are vintage RFT in v1, Vintage I63 Mullard in v2 and a Sovtek 12ax7LPS in v3.
The amp sounds the best for recording in mid power mode where it produces good focused tone. low power mode is there for folk noodling in their bedrooms, but sounds crap. Full power mode is a bit unruly for my taste. The amp starts to sound a little dazed and confused....but not in a Led Zep kind of way.
This amp is nowhere near the SV20 for quality of tone. The SV20, pretty much, nails the Plexi tone in a lower wattage amp. The Origin 20h, while sounding completely acceptable is not in the same league tone-wise....nor for the money would you expect it to be.
It is loads of fun however and does have that characteristic Marshall bark albiet a little hoarse.


----------



## BRMarshall

Appreciate you folks sharing your tube rolling experiences. I hope to try some different pre and power tubes I have this summer when I’ve got more time.


----------



## solarburn

With my 50 watter I thought I'd try something different and something closer to a plexi like attack. Putting a 12AY7 in V1 lowers gain but the tone and attack is vintage.

I always play loud so for this amp having pre and power section up is key like a lot of you have found. The other thing is being able to have the amp boost mix better with the 12AY7 doing it's thing.

Next thing I do is add just a bit of boost with my Breakdown OD. I love the mix I'm getting but just as important is the old school feel. Which has really got me enamoured with this Marshall.

The 2 final ingredients are my 412 GB'D cab plus my EC1000 equipped Fishmen Fluence Classic Core actives. I've got PAF, hot rodded and SC pups all in one and they are all good. This guitar kills through the ORI. Just what it needed.

Course I never would expect any player to do anything other that what sounds good to them. Isn't it great when we dial in our tonez?


----------



## Msharky67

Would you still get the Origin20h if you wanted the SV20h or couldn't afford it. I didn't want to get flamed posting a new thread. My birthday is next week. I am almost swing for the Origin again. I can't do the SV20 at this time. No price is worth that much. Its on my bucket list but someday I will have one. I want an honest opinion from those who have both.


----------



## Georgiatec

Msharky67 said:


> Would you still get the Origin20h if you wanted the SV20h or couldn't afford it. I didn't want to get flamed posting a new thread. My birthday is next week. I am almost swing for the Origin again. I can't do the SV20 at this time. No price is worth that much. Its on my bucket list but someday I will have one. I want an honest opinion from those who have both.


The Origin 20 is great for the price....but the SV20 is in a different league.
I bought the Origin as back up for my SV20 and it is just that. It will never be my 1st choice, but if the SV20 ever fails the Origin will do the gig just fine.
Mid power mode is good for loud home playing, but low power mode is pretty lame.


----------



## Georgiatec

solarburnDSL50 said:


> With my 50 watter I thought I'd try something different and something closer to a plexi like attack. Putting a 12AY7 in V1 lowers gain but the tone and attack is vintage.
> 
> I always play loud so for this amp having pre and power section up is key like a lot of you have found. The other thing is being able to have the amp boost mix better with the 12AY7 doing it's thing.
> 
> Next thing I do is add just a bit of boost with my Breakdown OD. I love the mix I'm getting but just as important is the old school feel. Which has really got me enamoured with this Marshall.
> 
> The 2 final ingredients are my 412 GB'D cab plus my EC1000 equipped Fishmen Fluence Classic Core actives. I've got PAF, hot rodded and SC pups all in one and they are all good. This guitar kills through the ORI. Just what it needed.
> 
> Course I never would expect any player to do anything other that what sounds good to them. Isn't it great when we dial in our tonez?


I think the 50w will be better. Fixed bias and more voltage on the plates is what will make the amp sound better. I think the EL34's in the 20w aren't quite in their sweet spot....which is strange 'coz in the SV20 they most definitely are.


----------



## solarburn

Georgiatec said:


> I think the 50w will be better. Fixed bias and more voltage on the plates is what will make the amp sound better. I think the EL34's in the 20w aren't quite in their sweet spot....which is strange 'coz in the SV20 they most definitely are.



I agree. The added thump from the Iron always gets a certain sound and feel.

I love my SC. But it is a shadow of its big bruther. I knew that and am happy with the shadow.

I love the 50 but I sure as hell wouldn't mind a 100 watt version. In fact I'd jump on it. The 50 is jus beginning to give thump. Where I start to get randy.


----------



## fitz

Msharky67 said:


> Would you still get the Origin20h if you wanted the SV20h or couldn't afford it. I didn't want to get flamed posting a new thread. My birthday is next week. I am almost swing for the Origin again. I can't do the SV20 at this time. No price is worth that much. Its on my bucket list but someday I will have one. I want an honest opinion from those who have both.


I don't have an SV20H for comparison, and I have never wanted one at that price, but I have the Origin20H and love it.
And I've spent a lot of ching on pedals, and tubes, and speakers, to get it where I'm really digging it.
You've had 2 and returned them.
The O20H amp hasn't changed (other than price increases), have your expectations changed?
I think you should wait for the SV20H, buying a substitute is just going to delay you getting what you really want.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

I have no hands on experience with the 20 watt Origin, but I have had my 2 50watt Origins for almost 2-1/2 years and I am still loving the vintage type tones that I can get out of them.
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## GarethWP

Msharky67 said:


> Would you still get the Origin20h if you wanted the SV20h or couldn't afford it. I didn't want to get flamed posting a new thread. My birthday is next week. I am almost swing for the Origin again. I can't do the SV20 at this time. No price is worth that much. Its on my bucket list but someday I will have one. I want an honest opinion from those who have both.


Hello and I have to be honest I don't have both and my only amp is the Origin 20h(and one tiny other make one) but for what it's worth I will pass on my thoughts on this........yes I love my Origin ....but ....... only after a lot of fiddling and rolling tubes and certainly more to go.....I won't be getting rid of it now. Here's another But....but if I could go back and do it again I would buy the DSL20 head instead if I could afford double the money I would definitely be considering the SC20 or the SV20 but on a budget I think that the DSL gives a good range of tone from cleans to dirty where as "my" Origin is pretty much clean unless I turn the master and the Gain up high and then it is loud..... very loud even on the lowest 0.5 W setting. The Origin does take pedals exceptionally well. And therefore does achieve a really versatile range of tones .....here's another but....but you do need the pedals or at least be able to crank it to get there. ....... I hope that this helps. Personally I would say go find somewhere to compare them though.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

GarethWP said:


> Hello and I have to be honest I don't have both and my only amp is the Origin 20h(and one tiny other make one) but for what it's worth I will pass on my thoughts on this........yes I love my Origin ....but ....... only after a lot of fiddling and rolling tubes and certainly more to go.....I won't be getting rid of it now. Here's another But....but if I could go back and do it again I would buy the DSL20 head instead if I could afford double the money I would definitely be considering the SC20 or the SV20 but on a budget I think that the DSL gives a good range of tone from cleans to dirty where as "my" Origin is pretty much clean unless I turn the master and the Gain up high and then it is loud..... very loud even on the lowest 0.5 W setting. The Origin does take pedals exceptionally well. And therefore does achieve a really versatile range of tones .....here's another but....but you do need the pedals or at least be able to crank it to get there. ....... I hope that this helps. Personally I would say go find somewhere to compare them though.


I agree, and I do have the Dsl40c’s as well, so both bases covered here, on a budget..
Cheers


----------



## GarethWP

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> I agree, and I do have the Dsl40c’s as well, so both bases covered here, on a budget..
> Cheers


Thanks Mitch and that definitely confirms my thinking as my thoughts are in good company
Cheers too


----------



## GarethWP

GarethWP said:


> Hello and I have to be honest I don't have both and my only amp is the Origin 20h(and one tiny other make one) but for what it's worth I will pass on my thoughts on this........yes I love my Origin ....but ....... only after a lot of fiddling and rolling tubes and certainly more to go.....I won't be getting rid of it now. Here's another But....but if I could go back and do it again I would buy the DSL20 head instead if I could afford double the money I would definitely be considering the SC20 or the SV20 but on a budget I think that the DSL gives a good range of tone from cleans to dirty where as "my" Origin is pretty much clean unless I turn the master and the Gain up high and then it is loud..... very loud even on the lowest 0.5 W setting. The Origin does take pedals exceptionally well. And therefore does achieve a really versatile range of tones .....here's another but....but you do need the pedals or at least be able to crank it to get there. ....... I hope that this helps. Personally I would say go find somewhere to compare them though.


I do have another thought ..... and that is the Origin20h has made me dig inside the amp. I have swapped out speakers I've swapped out valves I've swapped them back again oh and the I've swapped em all again.......I have bought pedals and then bought some more......ha ha ha I can't play my guitars any better but I know a lot more about my amplifier my cab and guitar pedals than I did before. I also have a much better Idea of 
" my tone" than I would have.....wow I love my Origin...it's not the perfect amp and I would not swap .....I'd buy more amps but I would not part with it. Happy playing everyone


----------



## bander

Got a question: Just brought home a OR20 head. I don't have a cab for it yet, but I do have an 4 ohm cabinet. Any issue with using it with some restraint on max levels?


----------



## fitz

bander said:


> Got a question: Just brought home a OR20 head. I don't have a cab for it yet, but I do have an 4 ohm cabinet. Any issue with using it with some restraint on max levels?


 to the forum.
Do not use the 4ohm cab with this amp.
It's not a matter of volume like using a low rated speaker wattage.
The ohm mis-match can damage both the speaker and the amp.
Get a 16ohm or 8ohm speaker cab.
What exactly is this 4ohm cab?


----------



## bander

fitz288 said:


> to the forum.
> Do not use the 4ohm cab with this amp.
> It's not a matter of volume like using a low rated speaker wattage.
> The ohm mis-match can damage both the speaker and the amp.
> Get a 16ohm or 8ohm speaker cab.
> What exactly is this 4ohm cab?


Narrow panel extension with a E130-4. I use it with a 5e3 sometimes. Different, I know.


----------



## scozz

Welcome to the Marshall Forum @bander.

l’ll defer to @fitz288 here of course, he owns the amp I don’t. 

I just wanted to mention that if your Marshall *doesn’t *have a 4ohm output option, (like the one in the pic below), you cannot use a 4ohm cab


----------



## bander

scozz said:


> Welcome to the Marshall Forum @bander.
> 
> l’ll defer to @fitz288 here of course, he owns the amp I don’t.
> 
> I just wanted to mention that if your Marshall *doesn’t *have a 4ohm output option, (like the one in the pic below), you cannot use a 4ohm cab



Thanks and gotcha. In the Fender world, running a 4 ohm cab on an 8 ohm amp/supply is an accepted practice, with a lot of testimony by long time users, even if Fender won't endorse it. I'm thinking Marshall's are a tighter design, and at greater risk. I'm in no rush, I've got plenty of 8 ohm combo's that I can rig as a cab. And, I'll step up my shopping for a 2x12, not an unpleasant task.


----------



## Markfresh

Is the 4ohm cab u have just for use with other amps or just for the origin 20h?
Im no expert but ill comment anyway, if this is a spare cab either 4x12 or 2x12 is it not possible to wire it to make it 8ohm (2x12) 0r 16ohm (4x12)?
Just a idea 
http://www.colomar.com/Shavano/2x12wiring.html
http://www.colomar.com/Shavano/4x12wiring.html


----------



## fitz

Markfresh said:


> Is the 4ohm cab u have just for use with other amps or just for the origin 20h?
> Im no expert but ill comment anyway, if this is a spare cab either 4x12 or 2x12 is it not possible to wire it to make it 8ohm (2x12) 0r 16ohm (4x12)?
> Just a idea
> http://www.colomar.com/Shavano/2x12wiring.html
> http://www.colomar.com/Shavano/4x12wiring.html


That cab is a single 4 ohm speaker (JBL) extension cab for a Fender combo.
If you had two of them, you could series wire to 8ohm.
O20H output transformer can do 1x16ohm, 2x16ohm, or 1x8ohm.


----------



## Markfresh

Oh ok no probs for some reason when @bander mentioned looking for a 2x12 i thought the 4ohm cab may have been multi speaker  .
Also i have the same head , glad yours has come with the fixed sticker on it aswell .


----------



## GarethWP

bander said:


> Got a question: Just brought home a OR20 head. I don't have a cab for it yet, but I do have an 4 ohm cabinet. Any issue with using it with some restraint on max levels?


Hello and welcome
I'm not a speaker/amp expert and definitely not an electrician my understanding of speaker and amp loadings is basic at best. But from what I do know, my advice would definitely be hold fire and get an 8ohm or 16 ohm cab and DON'T plug a 4 ohm cab into your new ORI 20 h even at restrained levels. If you don't kill a transformer it certainly won't sound it's best as these amps like most valve amps need a lack of restraint to sound good. But I actually think that a 4 ohm cab is going to cause problems to an 8/16 ohm rated amp. I am sure someone with more knowledge will back me up if I'm correct or tell me I'm wrong soon.
But hello and welcome to the forum I am sure you will love your Origin.


----------



## mspart

I am getting my first ever amp head today, an Origin 20. I'm pretty stoked about it. I have been doing a lot of reading and listening and think this should be a good fit. I'm not much of a player but always wanted a head and cab. Got the cab with 2 V-30s and now will have the head. I'm pretty stoked about it. 

Cab is 8 ohm and Origin 20 has an 8 ohm output. So that should work fine. I know my ohms from my nomes. ha ha

mspart


----------



## mspart

GarethWP said:


> Hello and welcome
> I'm not a speaker/amp expert and definitely not an electrician my understanding of speaker and amp loadings is basic at best. But from what I do know, my advice would definitely be hold fire and get an 8ohm or 16 ohm cab and DON'T plug a 4 ohm cab into your new ORI 20 h even at restrained levels. If you don't kill a transformer it certainly won't sound it's best as these amps like most valve amps need a lack of restraint to sound good. But I actually think that a 4 ohm cab is going to cause problems to an 8/16 ohm rated amp. I am sure someone with more knowledge will back me up if I'm correct or tell me I'm wrong soon.
> But hello and welcome to the forum I am sure you will love your Origin.



Correctomundo! No 4 ohm into the Origin 20. Bad juju. You could rewire the 4 ohm cab with two 8 ohm speakers in series to make it a 16 ohm cab. That would work. Right now the two speakers are in parallel to make a 4 ohm cab. No good. 

mspart


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

mspart said:


> I am getting my first ever amp head today, an Origin 20. I'm pretty stoked about it. I have been doing a lot of reading and listening and think this should be a good fit. I'm not much of a player but always wanted a head and cab. Got the cab with 2 V-30s and now will have the head. I'm pretty stoked about it.
> 
> Cab is 8 ohm and Origin 20 has an 8 ohm output. So that should work fine. I know my ohms from my nomes. ha ha
> 
> mspart




To the forum 
Congratulations on your new Origin head and cab , I do believe you are going to love it...
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

bander said:


> Got a question: Just brought home a OR20 head. I don't have a cab for it yet, but I do have an 4 ohm cabinet. Any issue with using it with some restraint on max levels?


WELCOME TO THE FORUM 
you have already got your answer about the no go on a 4 ohm load, please enjoy your new amp with the correct matching cab , and speaker cable !!
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## bander

Hey thanks everyone. I forgot I've got a 412 that has been a work bench for several years, I'll drop some speakers in, probably wired for 8 ohm. Might be my Saturday morning project.


----------



## Time Traveler

I'm happy to announce, I bought the Marshall origin 20h, I've had it for a week, and I'm enjoying it a lot


----------



## fitz

Time Traveler said:


> I'm happy to announce, I bought the Marshall origin 20h, I've had it for a week, and I'm enjoying it a lot


Nice, happy new amp... week.
What are you using for cab/speakers?


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Time Traveler said:


> I'm happy to announce, I bought the Marshall origin 20h, I've had it for a week, and I'm enjoying it a lot


Congratulations on a fine amp brother


----------



## Time Traveler

fitz288 said:


> Nice, happy new amp... week.
> What are you using for cab/speakers?



I have a palmer cab 1X12 with greenback , these palmer cab 1x12 are more wide for the standard 1x12 , it's a good cab


----------



## fitz

Time Traveler said:


> I have a palmer cab 1X12 with greenback , these palmer cab 1x12 are more wide for the standard 1x12 , it's a good cab


Be careful with the volume from a 20w tube amp into a 25w speaker.


----------



## speyfly

Time Traveler said:


> I'm happy to announce, I bought the Marshall origin 20h, I've had it for a week, and I'm enjoying it a lot



Welcome to the O20H club.


----------



## Maggot Brain

DUUUUDES!!!

I can't get over how awesome my Origin 20 sounds with E34Ls and recently put a hot Electro Harmonix 12AX7 in the PI and it just sounds glorious! It is 100% old school Marshall and truly sounds and feels like some of the 70s JMPs I've played.

With the E34L and the hot EH 12AX7 I am getting stingy hot crunch n grind gain with the volume at 5 (noon). It just gets hotter more gain and crunch with compression past 5 and on 10 it is roaring KaranG.

I swapped the stock EL34s and 12AX7 PI back in just to compare and the amp seemed very anemic, I am very surprised how "dull" the amp sounds stock imho and I loved it upon first playing it but after going this route there is no going back. I put the E34Ls and EH back in and my God what a difference... The Origin is FIRE with these tubes! I highly recommend anyone looking for more gain and distortion to swap in E34Ls, I find my EH 12AX7 adds more harmonic depth... it's a magic combo for me.


----------



## fitz

I will second the E34Ls - I was surprised at how much better the amp sounds with these power tubes (thanks again for the tip, MB) 
I had previously upgraded the stock preamp and PI tubes to JJ ECC803 long plates - matched pair in V1&2, balanced in the PI.
Now I'm going to have to try the EH in the PI...
Rolling some tubes in the O20 can make a big difference for sure. 
EQ in the loop and this amp will run with the big dogs.


----------



## speyfly

Gawd I hate this place! NOW I have to order more tubes


----------



## Maggot Brain

fitz288 said:


> I will second the E34Ls - I was surprised at how much better the amps sounds with these power tubes (thanks again for the tip, MB)
> I had previously upgraded the stock preamp and PI tubes to JJ ECC803 long plates - matched pair in V1&2, balanced in the PI.
> Now I'm going to have to try the EH in the PI...
> Rolling some tubes in the O20 can make a big difference for sure.
> EQ in the loop and this amp will run with the big dogs.



Glad someone else appreciates the E34L experience in the Origin! I am still in awe of the difference it makes!

I am not sure if the EH 12AX7s are all similar but I know this one I have and God knows where I got it, is very high in gain compared to my JJs and Ruby's. I am not too fond of it in a V1 as it has a lot of gain and gets fizzy but once I rolled it into the PI on my last 2 Marshalls (2204 & 2266) it really made a difference in harmonics. I was torn in which amp I wanted it in, my Origin or my BB45 but the combination with the E34Ls in the Origin were just pure Marshall. I plan to get some more EH 12AX7s and hope they have the same character as my "magic" one in PI slots.

I truly believe if more people discovered the major improvement E34Ls make on the Origin20 it would get a LOT more respect. Marshall would have been wise to use them to begin with but I am sure a lot of the Origin's sale's pitch is the "traditional" EL34 experience BUT I find the E34Ls sound like EL34s in the Origin.... only much much better!

For anyone reading this that wants more "Marshall" from your Marshall Origin 20 Head or Combo, drop in some E34Ls, I promise you won't be disappointed. The Origin 20 is cathode biased and E34Ls are the same size as the stock EL34s, it's plug and play.

I would love to know how the E34L sounds in a Origin 50! I really want an Origin50H now that I am so impressed with my 20C.


----------



## Maggot Brain

speyfly said:


> Gawd I hate this place! NOW I have to order more tubes



You'll love the E34Ls!

I'm getting carried away haha but I can't recommend them enough.


----------



## speyfly

ORDER PLACED!!!


----------



## scozz

speyfly said:


> Gawd I hate this place! NOW I have to order more tubes


Haha, you’re doing real good if tubes are your only worry from too much GAS!


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Maggot Brain said:


> You'll love the E34Ls!
> 
> I'm getting carried away haha but I can't recommend them enough.


Next bit of free cash is going for a quad of the E34L’s !!
Thanks for the tip @ Maggot Brain


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Maggot Brain said:


> You'll love the E34Ls!
> 
> I'm getting carried away haha but I can't recommend them enough.


Ok which brand are you using ??


----------



## Maggot Brain

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> Ok which brand are you using ??


I am using Groove Tubes GT-E34LS.

I can't wait to hear them in your rigs! Now that is a video I am excited for!
I think they will compliment your style wonderfully Mitch.


----------



## Maggot Brain

speyfly said:


> ORDER PLACED!!!


I believe this is the beginning of something truly beautiful!


----------



## fitz

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> Ok which brand are you using ??


I got JJs.


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

I was curious about the difference between the JJ's and GT 'L's as the JJ's are more affordable and readily available here. Apparently it's the same tube.

https://www.thetubestore.com/tube-brands/groove-tubes

I've got a quad of ehx 12ax7 I pulled out of a free amp converted into a cab. I may have to give them and the EL34L a crack.

As an aside, has anyone burned through their stock tubes yet? I presume mine will last forever at the 3 watts they're normally run.


----------



## fitz

OriginOfTheSpecies said:


> I was curious about the difference between the JJ's and GT 'L's as the JJ's are more affordable and readily available here. Apparently it's the same tube.
> 
> https://www.thetubestore.com/tube-brands/groove-tubes


That's a good read for all the tube brand cork sniffers...


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

OriginOfTheSpecies said:


> I was curious about the difference between the JJ's and GT 'L's as the JJ's are more affordable and readily available here. Apparently it's the same tube.
> 
> https://www.thetubestore.com/tube-brands/groove-tubes
> 
> I've got a quad of ehx 12ax7 I pulled out of a free amp converted into a cab. I may have to give them and the EL34L a crack.
> 
> As an aside, has anyone burned through their stock tubes yet? I presume mine will last forever at the 3 watts they're normally run.


I have not burned up a tube in either one so far, but I did stick Rubies in the power tube slot on one of them, and Mullard preamp tubes in it, and one Mullard preamp tube in V1 of the other.


----------



## ronmail65

@ guys who swapped out EL34 to EL34L tubes... do you have to rebias the OR20H?


----------



## fitz

ronmail65 said:


> @ guys who swapped out EL34 to EL34L tubes... do you have to rebias the OR20H?


Nope. The Origin20 is cathode biased, so swap away!


----------



## Maggot Brain

ronmail65 said:


> @ guys who swapped out EL34 to EL34L tubes... do you have to rebias the OR20H?





fitz288 said:


> Nope. The Origin20 is cathode biased, so swap away!


 Ditto!

Cathode bias in the Origin20s so it's plug and play.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

This is a short clip, with no amp boost, and no SD1, once the E34L’s arrive I will do this again...
Thanks for letting me post my slop here.


Mitch


----------



## scozz

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> This is a short clip, with no amp boost, and no SD1, once the E34L’s arrive I will do this again...
> Thanks for letting me post my slop here.
> 
> 
> Mitch




Thanks brother! I’ll be interested in hearing that. These e34l’s have intrigued me the past couple of years, I might buy a set. 

I’ve seen a few videos and I can hear a difference between the two, so I would think if I can hear a difference on a video, there must be an even bigger difference in the room.

Thanks again buddy!


----------



## Jeffery Levesque

I've got a ORI20H coming into the backline replacing a worn out JTM30. I run into split cabs. 1x12 open back w/Cannibis Rex and 1x12 closed back w/Weber Silver Bell. I'll keep you posted on my thoughts. Looking forward to some grunt from the backline.


----------



## fitz

Jeffery Levesque said:


> I've got a ORI20H coming into the backline replacing a worn out JTM30. I run into split cabs. 1x12 open back w/Cannibis Rex and 1x12 closed back w/Weber Silver Bell. I'll keep you posted on my thoughts. Looking forward to some grunt from the backline.


What does "worn out" mean, and what are you doing with the JTM30?


----------



## scozz

OriginOfTheSpecies said:


> I was curious about the difference between the JJ's and GT 'L's as the JJ's are more affordable and readily available here. Apparently it's the same tube.........



Yeah, that link from the Tube Store is correct, and I’ve only seen e34l’s branded as JJs. There are only a very few tube manufacturers anymore, and they’re all in China and Russia.


----------



## Jeffery Levesque

H


fitz288 said:


> What does "worn out" mean, and what are you doing with the JTM30?


Hi there.....she's spending too much time on the bench. Been a hard workin girl since 95 but has gotten too unreliable. We'll keep her as the Queen of Clean in the Studio. The combo side got squished so she's a head now. Unless somebody wants her.


----------



## fitz

Jeffery Levesque said:


> H
> 
> Hi there.....she's spending too much time on the bench. Been a hard workin girl since 95 but has gotten too unreliable. We'll keep her as the Queen of Clean in the Studio. The combo side got squished so she's a head now. Unless somebody wants her.


Post a thread in the classified page with some pics.


----------



## solarburn

fitz288 said:


> I will second the E34Ls - I was surprised at how much better the amp sounds with these power tubes (thanks again for the tip, MB)
> I had previously upgraded the stock preamp and PI tubes to JJ ECC803 long plates - matched pair in V1&2, balanced in the PI.
> Now I'm going to have to try the EH in the PI...
> Rolling some tubes in the O20 can make a big difference for sure.
> EQ in the loop and this amp will run with the big dogs.



Here's why these L's sound good in this amp. The bottom is tighter in this version of 34's. And that's what this amp needs. A tighter butt!

You want it tighter? Put a 12AY7 in V1 and mildly boost with your fav OD pedal. Trust me. I don't compromise. Hairy loose ballz may be good for some...I like a kung foo grip from my Marshallz.


----------



## Msharky67

You guys are killing me. I hate to say I have some regret for retuning my Origin20h. If I had known the prices on everything were going up I would have kept it. I don't remember what I paid for it but it was probably decent. I know I really want the SV but I still keep looking at this. Why I don't know. It has not been easy to save up even a couple hundred let alone $1000. I am not paying no more than $900 for an SV. Anymore is not worth it. I would get both if I could afford it. I have little or no patience at this point.


----------



## solarburn

Msharky67 said:


> You guys are killing me. I hate to say I have some regret for retuning my Origin20h. If I had known the prices on everything were going up I would have kept it. I don't remember what I paid for it but it was probably decent. I know I really want the SV but I still keep looking at this. Why I don't know. It has not been easy to save up even a couple hundred let alone $1000. I am not paying no more than $900 for an SV. Anymore is not worth it. I would get both if I could afford it. I have little or no patience at this point.



I haven't regretted money spent on my 50 watter. It's different than my other Marshallz but old school through and through. Classic thrill for me. Price was awesome per performance.


----------



## fitz

Msharky67 said:


> You guys are killing me. I hate to say I have some regret for retuning my Origin20h. If I had known the prices on everything were going up I would have kept it. I don't remember what I paid for it but it was probably decent. I know I really want the SV but I still keep looking at this. Why I don't know. It has not been easy to save up even a couple hundred let alone $1000. I am not paying no more than $900 for an SV. Anymore is not worth it. I would get both if I could afford it. I have little or no patience at this point.


You might want to change your plan, you're never going to see an SV for $900 unless it has a bullet hole.
I got my O20H for $299, and you'll probably never see that again either.
You could get another O20H and hot rod the tubes for another $50-100, but you're still not going to get SC20 kind of balls without pedals, and you already got the SC20.
@solarburnDSL50 may have hit on your solution - O50H


----------



## speyfly

Well, brothers , the E34Ls will be here tomorrow and I have several new EH 12AX7 on hand. Can't wait for the test drive. Luv rollin tubes!!!


----------



## fitz

speyfly said:


> Well, brothers , the E34Ls will be here tomorrow and I have several new EH 12AX7 on hand. Can't wait for the test drive. Luv rollin tubes!!!


I'm looking forward to your assessment of the E34Ls.
Give the amp a good run before the tube change for a baseline.
Straight in and push it hard, then roll the tubes.


----------



## Edgar Frog

After all this hype I'll be planning on getting a set of the E34L's as well whenever it's time to retube. I already have a basically brand new set of high gain JJ ECC83S's I pulled from my Crate V33H before I got rid of it to go in whenever the time comes. Between the 2 I think it will breath a little more life into an already IMHO a killer sounding amp. I'm not a tube roller so they will wait till it's time to change, so it could be a while.


----------



## fitz

Review - JJ E34L / EL34 | thetubestore Blog


----------



## fitz

I did a minor speaker swap over the weekend for My O20H rig with some very favorable results (IMO).
I've been using a pair of Vintage30s in the 212 cab I built a few months ago.
When cranked, I was getting a very flubby/farty low end.
I put some ports in the back panel and it seemed to help, but not entirely.
I have a G12T-75 that I bought recently to try as an alternative to the Seventy-80s in my MX112s on the DSL20H. (went with a different set there)
I saw this pairing on the GC site as a "metal/hard rock 2x12 speaker set", so I figured I kill some time on a rainy Saturday.






I put the G12T-75 in the top position in the cab, leaving a V30 in the bottom.
Excellent results, I must say.
Crisper, cleaner and louder - or I should say I can get it much louder without the low end problems I was getting with the pair of V30s.
Just a suggestion if you're lookin' for O20H speaker options.


----------



## speyfly

fitz288 said:


> I'm looking forward to your assessment of the E34Ls.



Been replacing tubes since the 60's and to this day, I enjoy hearing (still have pretty good hearing) the subtle and sometimes not so subtle nuances between the guitar, amp and speakers when swapping tubes. I too am looking forward to what I'll find.

I have a Tweaker that has cost me a bunch in tubes but it's been fun. This little beasty will take so many different power tubes and more if I want to remove the heat grill so they'll fit. 6v6, 6L6, 5881, EL34, KT66, KT88



fitz288 said:


> Give the amp a good run before the tube change for a baseline.



Always!


----------



## speyfly

I've spent the last 6 hours swappin tubes and the combo right now that I'm diggin is:

v1 JJ ECC803s
v2 Shuguang ECC83 Gold Label (stock tube) 
PI EH12AX7 (MB recommendation) 
Power- JJ E34L

So far the bottom end is tighter mids are better managed and articulate without sounding scooped, highs are crisp and clear without harshness, increased gain.

Still a lot more work to go but so far, pretty happy.


----------



## eastsidecincy

The 2nd and 3rd ecc83 tube blew out on my Origin20h....was just wondering how many other people have had this problem and what was the cause?...it is a newer amp and not used very often so this was a surprise to me...maybe 2 bad tubes?


----------



## fitz

eastsidecincy said:


> The 2nd and 3rd ecc83 tube blew out on my Origin20h....was just wondering how many other people have had this problem and what was the cause?...it is a newer amp and not used very often so this was a surprise to me...maybe 2 bad tubes?


3rd thread - same question.
I'm not aware of either causing the other to fail, but I'm no expert, and would also like to know if this is an issue to be aware of.
Tubes can go for no reason, perhaps it was just 2 bad tubes.


----------



## eastsidecincy

Yeah...I posted this in other threads...because I want to know if other members have had this problem...but I just played thru it and so far it sounds great with the 2 new ecc83s...hopefully it was just 2 bad tubes and nothing else...


----------



## fitz

eastsidecincy said:


> Yeah...I posted this in other threads...because I want to know if other members have had this problem...but I just played thru it and so far it sounds great with the 2 new ecc83s...hopefully it was just 2 bad tubes and nothing else...


No problem, I like answers too when I'm not sure what I'm doing.
So did both of the VLVE-00049 12AX7B/ECC83 Shuguang Gold Logo go bad?
And is the VLVE-00066 ECC83S JJ Red Logo from V1 still good?
Just want to verify.
I've taken them out of my O20H, but still have the gold ones in my DSL20HR.


----------



## fitz

I got a new gizmo for my O20H yesterday - Carl's Custom Guitars Speaker Soak - 8ohm, 60w.
Carl's Custom Guitars 8 ohm Speaker Soak Guitar Amp Volume Attenuator | Carl's Custom Guitars | Reverb
Got a used one for $35+s&h.
It's a cheap Lpad attenuator.
Probably not to difficult to make from parts if you're on a budget.
Here's a thread from a few years back with some more MFer's opinions.
Carl's Custom Guitars Speaker Soak | MarshallForum.com
As said in above thread, it dampens the highs as you turn up the resistance to the speaker.
On the O20, you can crank the amp and the speaker soak and get full tube gain at low volume.
Compensating with loop EQ can just about even out the attenuator tone shift.
I can get just as good overdrive tone with an SD-1 and the O20 on 20w with the volume where ever I want.
Perhaps spending more money on a better attenuator that costs more than the amp would yield better results?
My overall take is *there's just no substitute for volume.*


----------



## Time Traveler

Hi
there is a problem with my origin 20h, , today I was playing and suddenly there been a drop in volume, and it's always like this, during the turn on there is a loud and bad crackling and then a sharp drop in volume, what can it be in your opinion?


----------



## fitz

Time Traveler said:


> Hi
> there is a problem with my origin 20h, , today I was playing and suddenly there been a drop in volume, and it's always like this, during the turn on there is a loud and bad crackling and then a sharp drop in volume, what can it be in your opinion?


First thought would be to check the tubes.
Do you have any spares?


----------



## Time Traveler

fitz288 said:


> First thought would be to check the tubes.
> Do you have any spares?



I touched the patch cable in fx loop of the reverb pedal and dosen't anymore now, has it possible that was only that? Maybe there was a cable a little bit loose


----------



## fitz

Time Traveler said:


> I touched the patch cable in fx loop of the reverb pedal and dosen't anymore now, has it possible that was only that? Maybe there was a cable a little bit loose


Or perhaps a cleaning would help.
Try some Deoxit on a cable plug and work some into each socket.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

fitz288 said:


> Or perhaps a cleaning would help.
> Try some Deoxit on a cable plug and work some into each socket.


Excellent idea, I am going to do this with my 3210’s..


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

My Origins have been trouble free.
Cheers


----------



## 5cr33nager

Hello the Origin 20c is my first Marshall and I love it. I’ve had it for about 6 months. I changed out the speaker and that worked. Speaker is an Eminence Copperhead. I like the tubes but will be getting EL34L’s and a 12AY7. I’ve read the post from the beginning.

Cheers,
Richard


----------



## fitz

5cr33nager said:


> Hello the Origin 20c is my first Marshall and I love it. I’ve had it for about 6 months. I changed out the speaker and that worked. Speaker is an Eminence Copperhead. I like the tubes but will be getting EL34L’s and a 12AY7. I’ve read the post from the beginning.
> 
> Cheers,
> Richard



I think you'll like the E34L power tubes.
Curious what position you plan to use the 12AY7?


----------



## 5cr33nager

fitz288 said:


> I think you'll like the E34L power tubes.
> Curious what position you plan to use the 12AY7?


I’m going to put it in the V1 position.


----------



## ColdEye

Anyone tried creambacks on the 20Combo? I had the head, but sold it. Moving to an apartment so the combo would be ideal (and as for the volume, the JHS little black box works MAGIC). Are the speakers easy to replace?


----------



## fitz

ColdEye said:


> (and as for the volume, the JHS little black box works MAGIC)


Please expand on your "MAGIC" results from the LBB in the loop.
(sorry, I have no experience with creambacks in the combo)


----------



## ColdEye

In regards to volume control. I usually play at the 20w setting and I can go with whatever combo of the gain/volume, unlike without I usually set it up with just the lowest wattage when playing at home. BTW this is only in regards to playing it at "bedroom" levels. If you have no volume constraints on where you are playing this does not even apply. Its a simple passive volume box.

I might experiment with the creamback, I love it in my closed back mesa boogie 1x10.


----------



## fitz

ColdEye said:


> In regards to volume control. I usually play at the 20w setting and I can go with whatever combo of the gain/volume, unlike without I usually set it up with just the lowest wattage when playing at home. BTW this is only in regards to playing it at "bedroom" levels. If you have no volume constraints on where you are playing this does not even apply. Its a simple passive volume box.
> 
> I might experiment with the creamback, I love it in my closed back mesa boogie 1x10.


Thanks for the reply.
I am familiar with the LBB used in the loop on other amps to crank the preamp for increased gain.
My understanding is the Origin uses the entire signal chain to develop some sweet overdrive tones.
I almost bought one once, but figured it would defeat it's own purpose.
I am lucky to NOT have volume constraints, but I also love to experiment and try new things with my amps.
Cheers.


----------



## speyfly

The JHS LBB is nothing more than putting a volume control between the preamp stage and the power stage of the amp (really easy to build one). You need to make sure that the FX loop is a series loop or you're going to damage the amp.


----------



## neoclassical

Why shouldn't I buy an Origin 20? It sounds like it makes the cut, but I'm on the fence. The only other thing on my radar is a Laney LA30BL for more than 2x the price.


----------



## fitz

neoclassical said:


> Why shouldn't I buy an Origin 20? It sounds like it makes the cut, but I'm on the fence. The only other thing on my radar is a Laney LA30BL for more than 2x the price.


If you don't like to use a few pedals to get a variety if tones,
If you want the Origin20 to sound just like a plexi, an 800, or a rectifier,
If you play in a band with a hard hitting drummer and you just need 100w,
If you need your amp to show other people your better because you can buy things that cost 2x what they are worth,
Then you shouldn't buy an Origin20.


----------



## speyfly

speyfly said:


> The JHS LBB is nothing more than putting a volume control between the preamp stage and the power stage of the amp (really easy to build one). You need to make sure that the FX loop is a series loop or you're going to damage the amp.



Having reread my post regarding the JHS "Little Black Box", I don't want for anyone to think I'm devaluing it's place on a pedalboard, I have one on mine!


----------



## fitz

speyfly said:


> Having reread my post regarding the JHS "Little Black Box", I don't want for anyone to think I'm devaluing it's place on a pedalboard, I have one on mine!


Do you use it in the loop on the Origin20 as a preamp throttle?


----------



## speyfly

fitz288 said:


> Do you use it in the loop on the Origin20 as a preamp throttle?



Yeah, it's the last pedal in the effects chain, then into the return.


----------



## fitz

speyfly said:


> Yeah, it's the last pedal in the effects chain, then into the return.


add to cart...


----------



## Time Traveler

Well, now I want to replacing the tubes me too, I would like a early break up in this amp , I think that I'll get two E34l and a ECC803s.


----------



## Time Traveler

in the descriptions of the ecc803s it says that they offer detailed bass, so maybe they will give me too pronounced bass, I like the tone focused on the mid-trebles


----------



## fitz

Time Traveler said:


> in the descriptions of the ecc803s it says that they offer detailed bass, so maybe they will give me too pronounced bass, I like the tone focused on the mid-trebles


It's not louder bass, it's clearer bass - JJ describes it as "fuller and stronger".
The 803 has higher gain then the JJ ECC83 and it gives my O20H better breakup with less volume.
Long plate tubes are more microphonic in high gain amps, but I've had no issues using them in the Origin.
If you like mids boosted and lower bass, try an EQ in the loop if the TMB knobs are not getting where you want your tone.


----------



## Time Traveler

If I'll put it the E34L , it is better to replace it all of them in preamp ?, or I can put it only one ecc803s?


----------



## fitz

Time Traveler said:


> If I'll put it the E34L , it is better to replace it all of them in preamp ?, or I can put it only one ecc803s?


I first changed all 3 preamp tubes to 803's, and was surprised at how much better the amp sounded.
I don't know if just changing V1 would do the same, but it will still be the biggest change in tone.
I have since tried different tubes in the PI / V3, but went back to the 803.
The power tube change to E34L's was later, and again was surprising at how much better the amp sounded.
All of this is just my opinion of what I like, I hope that you have similar results.


----------



## Time Traveler

I want to try these tubes just for a early break up, I don't know how the tone can changing, I like rock 70' , so I want to keep that vintage sound.
In addition to the early break up, how has the tone changed in your amp after the replacement?


----------



## fitz

Time Traveler said:


> I want to try these tubes just for a early break up, I don't know how the tone can changing, I like rock 70' , so I want to keep that vintage sound.
> In addition to the early break up, how has the tone changed in your amp after the replacement?


Early breakup is the "tone" I'm talking about - organic overdrive '70's rock.
The 803 tube isn't going to change the Origin into a hair band gain monster (I have other amps for that).
You're just going to have to try it and see if it works for you.
Worst case scenario is you wind up with some spare tubes.


----------



## Time Traveler

I read a thread in a website about the differences of ECC83s and ECC803s , they said that the ECC803s have less gain, how is it possible?


----------



## fitz

Time Traveler said:


> I read a thread in a website about the differences of ECC83s and ECC803s , they said that the ECC803s have less gain, how is it possible?


Some brands of ECC83 are claimed to have more gain.
The JJ803 has more than the JJ83 (usually).
If you buy a dozen identical tubes, they will measure 12 different gain levels.
Identical brand tubes in identical model amps will sound different.
Finding the right "tone mojo" with any amp, and any set of tubes, is a lifelong quest for some people. 
It's a journey, not a destination.
Godspeed brother.


----------



## Silverdome

Are the Marshall Origins the cheapest pathway to a Plexi sound? I was reading a little about these this morning. I'm seeing them at a pretty reasonable price on Reverb. At over a grand I find the new vintage series to be cost prohibitive.


----------



## fitz

Silverdome said:


> Are the Marshall Origins the cheapest pathway to a Plexi sound? I was reading a little about these this morning. I'm seeing them at a pretty reasonable price on Reverb. At over a grand I find the new vintage series to be cost prohibitive.


Nope.
$50 +/- plexi pedal is your cheapest pathway.
The Origin is an organic tube overdrive amp that can be very versatile, and more so with pedals.
I agree that the price on the Studio series amps is excessive, but they sell like hotcakes at a church fundraiser.
Mods like the Headfirst circuit changes can completely change the Origin amp into a gain monster, if that's what you want.
I find an OD in the front and an EQ in the loop gives me more than I know what to do with.


----------



## Ps. 37

fitz288 said:


> I find an OD in the front and an EQ in the loop gives me more than I know what to do with.


I agree with fitz288. I play the Origin 50 at home, and with OD (and occasionally some EQ at lower volumes), it goes from chimey, sparkly clean to angry, snarling aggressive.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Silverdome said:


> Are the Marshall Origins the cheapest pathway to a Plexi sound? I was reading a little about these this morning. I'm seeing them at a pretty reasonable price on Reverb. At over a grand I find the new vintage series to be cost prohibitive.


When I first got my Origin 50H I called it my working mans plexi, it may not do it exactly, but it sure gets close.
I hit mine with an SD1 in the front, along with the MXR10 band eq.
And I love what I am hearing, plus I tend to play it loud, normally about 5 on the dial, and I don’t use the boost feature.
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## CroTone

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> When I first got my Origin 50H I called it my working mans plexi, it may not do it exactly, but it sure gets close.
> I hit mine with an SD1 in the front, along with the MXR10 band eq.
> And I love what I am hearing, plus I tend to play it loud, normally about 5 on the dial, and I don’t use the boost feature.
> Cheers
> Mitch


Similar experience here. I too have an Origin 50H.
Honestly, I was struggling a bit with this amp from the start...it was sort of a "love-hate" relationship. At moments I was happy with the sound, then unhappy, God knows it...
However, after learning more about it and knowing an amp better I can attest that this amp can put out some serious sounds.
The key to it is really...volume.
Once you crank it from 7 and onwards, even with the gain at noon...you get that really healthy Marshall crunch.
From that point boost it up a bit with TS-9, SD-1, or anything really...it elevates you further.

Lately, I've been using it with master volume at 7, gain at noon, boost feature not used and from there I drive it with an OCD (very mild settings, gain set at 9'o clock, volume slightly less than noon). I get some really really terrific sounds! The amp delivers!
And one little detail that should be disclosed...all EQ controls to 10...maxed out...except Tilt...I keep that at 8 because all the way to 10 the amp gets too bright and shrill for my taste.

Moral of the story (at least in my case): Once I've learned how to use this amp properly...it became a serious tone beast!


----------



## speyfly

CroTone said:


> Similar experience here. I too have an Origin 50H.
> Honestly, I was struggling a bit with this amp from the start...it was sort of a "love-hate" relationship. At moments I was happy with the sound, then unhappy, God knows it...
> However, after learning more about it and knowing an amp better I can attest that this amp can put out some serious sounds.
> The key to it is really...volume.
> Once you crank it from 7 and onwards, even with the gain at noon...you get that really healthy Marshall crunch.
> From that point boost it up a bit with TS-9, SD-1, or anything really...it elevates you further.
> 
> Lately, I've been using it with master volume at 7, gain at noon, boost feature not used and from there I drive it with an OCD (very mild settings, gain set at 9'o clock, volume slightly less than noon). I get some really really terrific sounds! The amp delivers!
> And one little detail that should be disclosed...all EQ controls to 10...maxed out...except Tilt...I keep that at 8 because all the way to 10 the amp gets too bright and shrill for my taste.
> 
> Moral of the story (at least in my case): Once I've learned how to use this amp properly...it became a serious tone beast!


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

CroTone said:


> Similar experience here. I too have an Origin 50H.
> Honestly, I was struggling a bit with this amp from the start...it was sort of a "love-hate" relationship. At moments I was happy with the sound, then unhappy, God knows it...
> However, after learning more about it and knowing an amp better I can attest that this amp can put out some serious sounds.
> The key to it is really...volume.
> Once you crank it from 7 and onwards, even with the gain at noon...you get that really healthy Marshall crunch.
> From that point boost it up a bit with TS-9, SD-1, or anything really...it elevates you further.
> 
> Lately, I've been using it with master volume at 7, gain at noon, boost feature not used and from there I drive it with an OCD (very mild settings, gain set at 9'o clock, volume slightly less than noon). I get some really really terrific sounds! The amp delivers!
> And one little detail that should be disclosed...all EQ controls to 10...maxed out...except Tilt...I keep that at 8 because all the way to 10 the amp gets too bright and shrill for my taste.
> 
> Moral of the story (at least in my case): Once I've learned how to use this amp properly...it became a serious tone beast!


Hell yes buddy.
I have even ran it with no clean boost, no amp boost, and as you said get that volume up and it gets very tasty, my bass is usually at 5 , and 8 on treble, an mids, gain on 8 and tilt on 5, it’s a roaring amp..


----------



## speyfly

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> Hell yes buddy.
> I have even ran it with no clean boost, no amp boost, and as you said get that volume up and it gets very tasty, my bass is usually at 5 , and 8 on treble, an mids, gain on 8 and tilt on 5, it’s a roaring amp..




And don't forget about a good EQ in the loop, pays huge dividends regarding tone.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

speyfly said:


> And don't forget about a good EQ in the loop, pays huge dividends regarding tone.


I have yet to put it in the loop, as I am always using the 2 outs to the front of both of the 50H’s, but I am going to try it soon, I think I need to get another one ha ha so it can be dedicated to the loop, on both of my rigs.
Cheers
Mitch


----------



## speyfly

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> I have yet to put it in the loop, as I am always using the 2 outs to the front of both of the 50H’s, but I am going to try it soon, I think I need to get another one ha ha so it can be dedicated to the loop, on both of my rigs.
> Cheers
> Mitch



Mitch, if I can make a recommendation, Source Audio EQ2!


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

speyfly said:


> Mitch, if I can make a recommendation, Source Audio EQ2!


I will have to look them up.
Thanks for the information, because I was just going to look at another MXR10 band eq .
Thanks 
Mitch


----------



## speyfly

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> I will have to look them up.
> Thanks for the information, because I was just going to look at another MXR10 band eq .
> Thanks
> Mitch



Mitch, after getting the EQ2, I've put my 108S up for sale. 2 inputs give you a bunch of routing options, very versatile. I'm seriously thinking about adding another one.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

speyfly said:


> Mitch, after getting the EQ2, I've put my 108S up for sale. 2 inputs give you a bunch of routing options, very versatile. I'm seriously thinking about adding another one.


What is the price on that EQ2 ?


----------



## speyfly

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> What is the price on that EQ2 ?



Expensive but well worth it, $269.00. My rep at Sweetwater gave it to me @ $250. The 108S could not compete with it.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

speyfly said:


> Expensive but well worth it, $269.00. My rep at Sweetwater gave it to me @ $250. The 108S could not compete with it.


Thanks buddy I will keep it in mind.
Mitch


----------



## fitz

I got a pair of used Boss pedals to try and get a little extra dirt in the front of my O20H.
Had some GC gear cred from the Strat acquisition, so I had to do _something_ with it...
I'll never replace the SD-1 on the Origin, but I do like my high gain amps (DSL20H & 6101), so I was looking for something to push the O20 into some higher gain tones.
After watching YT vids ad nauseam, I decided have a go at the Boss ST-2 Power Stack - intrigued by the crunch to ultra "sound" control.
Also watched a comparison of the SD-1, OD-3 & BD-2.
The ST-2 used still left me with some cred, so I put a used BD-2 Blues Driver in the cart too.

Well the ST-2 is a COMPLETE disappointment.
I don't know if I just got a bad unit, or if they all suck - it's going back.
Ok on crunch, but as the gain is increased to ultra, it starts hissing like no other pedal I've ever had.
By the time I turn up the dirt to anything past what the SD-1 is already capable of, it becomes unusable (imho).

Now on the other hand, the BD-2 is EXACTLY what I wanted.
LOVE IT, LOVE IT, LOVE IT.
That comparison vid I watched was a dude playing a Tele through a Fender amp, and the 3 pedals seemed really similar, so I had fairly low expectations.
The BD-2, gain knob cranked, with an LP into a Marshall is *kick ass*.
It has a permanent home now on my O20H board along side the SD-1.
Clean, crunch, gain at a toe tap - happy camper.

New problem - ST-2 return store cred.


----------



## Ps. 37

fitz288 said:


> Now on the other hand, the BD-2 is EXACTLY what I wanted.
> LOVE IT, LOVE IT, LOVE IT.



I agree. I use the Boss GT-100 with my O50, and of all the OD's it emulates, the BD-2 gives me exactly what I want for both single-coils and humbuckers.


----------



## Buzzard

I wonder if the OR 20 can get more of a plexi grind than the OR 50 by turning it up full, overdriving a smaller transformer?


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Buzzard said:


> I wonder if the OR 20 can get more of a plexi grind than the OR 50 by turning it up full, overdriving a smaller transformer?


Hard to say , I don’t have the 20.
But I can get pretty close to the plexi with my 3210 being pushed by the Origin 50H


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

fitz288 said:


> I got a pair of used Boss pedals to try and get a little extra dirt in the front of my O20H.
> Had some GC gear cred from the Strat acquisition, so I had to do _something_ with it...
> I'll never replace the SD-1 on the Origin, but I do like my high gain amps (DSL20H & 6101), so I was looking for something to push the O20 into some higher gain tones.
> After watching YT vids ad nauseam, I decided have a go at the Boss ST-2 Power Stack - intrigued by the crunch to ultra "sound" control.
> Also watched a comparison of the SD-1, OD-3 & BD-2.
> The ST-2 used still left me with some cred, so I put a used BD-2 Blues Driver in the cart too.
> 
> Well the ST-2 is a COMPLETE disappointment.
> I don't know if I just got a bad unit, or if they all suck - it's going back.
> Ok on crunch, but as the gain is increased to ultra, it starts hissing like no other pedal I've ever had.
> By the time I turn up the dirt to anything past what the SD-1 is already capable of, it becomes unusable (imho).
> 
> Now on the other hand, the BD-2 is EXACTLY what I wanted.
> LOVE IT, LOVE IT, LOVE IT.
> That comparison vid I watched was a dude playing a Tele through a Fender amp, and the 3 pedals seemed really similar, so I had fairly low expectations.
> The BD-2, gain knob cranked, with an LP into a Marshall is *kick ass*.
> It has a permanent home now on my O20H board along side the SD-1.
> Clean, crunch, gain at a toe tap - happy camper.
> 
> New problem - ST-2 return store cred.


I have heard that the BE overdrive is the cats meow for this amp.
I personally don’t have one, but would love to give it a shot.
Cheers


----------



## fitz

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> I have heard that the BE overdrive is the cats meow for this amp.
> I personally don’t have one, but would love to give it a shot.
> Cheers


I considered a few of the Friedman pedals, but the BD-2 was a couple bucks less....



Buzzard said:


> I wonder if the OR 20 can get more of a plexi grind than the OR 50 by turning it up full, overdriving a smaller transformer?


The Origin20 native tone gets better with volume, so I'd assume it gets closer to a plexi at a lower volume than an Origin50.
I've never had the pleasure of a playing plexi.
I'd like to to have a go at putting an O20 & a few pedals up against one (or it's little SV brother) for a tone comparison.
Obviously not competing with a 100w full stack in the volume category, but I'd be curious how close they can get.


----------



## scozz

fitz288 said:


> ……….I agree that the price on the Studio series amps is *excessive*, but they sell like hotcakes at a church fundraiser.
> Mods like the Headfirst circuit changes can completely change the Origin amp into a gain monster, if that's what you want.
> I find an OD in the front and an EQ in the loop gives me more than I know what to do with.



I get what you’re saying about the price of today’s Studio Series amps. When I bought my Studio head they were selling for $1299, I paid $1100, today they’re $1499. 

100% with you buddy on the od in front and a eq in the loop. I have my eq pedal on all the time, and when I want more I use either my Maxon OD9 or Sd1 as a clean boost.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

fitz288 said:


> I considered a few of the Friedman pedals, but the BD-2 was a couple bucks less....
> 
> 
> The Origin20 native tone gets better with volume, so I'd assume it gets closer to a plexi at a lower volume than an Origin50.
> I've never had the pleasure of a playing plexi.
> I'd like to to have a go at putting an O20 & a few pedals up against one (or it's little SV brother) for a tone comparison.
> Obviously not competing with a 100w full stack in the volume category, but I'd be curious how close they can get.


I have played a 1959,at 5 on volume through a full stack.
It will shake the floor it’s sitting on.
As for a comparison SV20, to the Origin 50H. I did it in the same power modes, with the same settings.
I thought it was pretty close.
But I love my Origins.
With the MXR10 band eq,an SD1.
They rock..
Cheers


----------



## fitz

Update on my new dirt pedals for my O20H.
Returned the Boss ST-2 Power Stack that I bought off the GC website to my local GC.
Turns out the gear cred that I used to buy the 2 pedals in not refundable at the store (never read the fine print).
The dudes at my store were SUPER COOL and said they would mark down stuff to compensate if they could.
When I said I just wanted an even exchange for something of equal value they concocted a BS story to put in the system about the pedal I was returning being junk.
If they were the douch bags that I've heard other people describe, I'd have only got a $25 credit for the return.
So about a half hour later, I walked out of there with a brand new Pro Co Lil' Rat - even exchange, never even touched my wallet.
It's the tiniest pedal I've ever seen - here's a pick of it on my board with some Boss pedals for scale.


So anyway, for an even up exchange for the P-O-S ST-2, I'm stoked with yet another pedal that puts some serious balls in the front of the Origin.
If you're feeling that your Origin is a little limp in the gain knob, I highly suggest either of the two od/distortion pedals shown above to get some ying in your yang.


----------



## WienerDog

The Friedman Golden Pearl is the best dirt pedal I’ve used with my Origin 20H. It works so seamlessly, and there’s no flub in the bass.


----------



## solarburn

WienerDog said:


> The Friedman Golden Pearl is the best dirt pedal I’ve used with my Origin 20H. It works so seamlessly, and there’s no flub in the bass.



The Buxom Boost is tits too. Tightens that ass right up. Freaking quiet pedal. Impressive in and of itself.

I want the Golden Pearl as well. Both pedals for all my amps.


----------



## bhatta

fitz288 said:


> Now on the other hand, the BD-2 is EXACTLY what I wanted.
> LOVE IT, LOVE IT, LOVE IT.
> That comparison vid I watched was a dude playing a Tele through a Fender amp, and the 3 pedals seemed really similar, so I had fairly low expectations.
> The BD-2, gain knob cranked, with an LP into a Marshall is *kick ass*.
> It has a permanent home now on my O20H board along side the SD-1.
> Clean, crunch, gain at a toe tap - happy camper.
> 
> New problem - ST-2 return store cred.



I thought I was the only BD2 fan here in the forum. For last 13 years, no matter what amp I have had the BD has stayed on...
For the price I am yet to find a better pedal. Also love the SD1, but have let it go, not the BD.

Cheers


----------



## jeffb

Buzzard said:


> I wonder if the OR 20 can get more of a plexi grind than the OR 50 by turning it up full, overdriving a smaller transformer?



Closest I could ever get- This is loud - Master pretty high- 2-3oclock. With the Master up any higher it kind of falls apart- it's not as pleasant as a Plexi/Big Iron and gets thinner.


----------



## solarburn

jeffb said:


> Closest I could ever get- This is loud - Master pretty high- 2-3oclock. With the Master up any higher it kind of falls apart- it's not as pleasant as a Plexi/Big Iron and gets thinner.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

jeffb said:


> Closest I could ever get- This is loud - Master pretty high- 2-3oclock. With the Master up any higher it kind of falls apart- it's not as pleasant as a Plexi/Big Iron and gets thinner.



I thought you nailed the Bowie piece quite well buddy, Origin is sounding great bro.
Thanks for sharing 


Mitch


----------



## Edgar Frog

fitz288 said:


> Update on my new dirt pedals for my O20H.
> Returned the Boss ST-2 Power Stack that I bought off the GC website to my local GC.
> Turns out the gear cred that I used to buy the 2 pedals in not refundable at the store (never read the fine print).
> The dudes at my store were SUPER COOL and said they would mark down stuff to compensate if they could.
> When I said I just wanted an even exchange for something of equal value they concocted a BS story to put in the system about the pedal I was returning being junk.
> If they were the douch bags that I've heard other people describe, I'd have only got a $25 credit for the return.
> So about a half hour later, I walked out of there with a brand new Pro Co Lil' Rat - even exchange, never even touched my wallet.
> It's the tiniest pedal I've ever seen - here's a pick of it on my board with some Boss pedals for scale.
> View attachment 92837
> 
> So anyway, for an even up exchange for the P-O-S ST-2, I'm stoked with yet another pedal that puts some serious balls in the front of the Origin.
> If you're feeling that your Origin is a little limp in the gain knob, I highly suggest either of the two od/distortion pedals shown above to get some ying in your yang.



Congrats on the new pedals.  I use the GFS Brownie Classic for my Rat tones (WF Rat/Turbo Rat clone) in front of my ORI20H. The Rat is my favorite dirt/OD pedal. The Rat is also great pushed with a TS9/7 which is my other favorite dirt/OD especially in front of a Marshall. The TS is also great on its own as well of course.


----------



## jeffb

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> I thought you nailed the Bowie piece quite well buddy, Origin is sounding great bro.
> Thanks for sharing
> 
> 
> Mitch




Thank you Brother! That's my old clip from BITD. Unfortunately all my gear (except for my #1 Les Paul) is in storage right now as I'm in-between homes ...I need to grab a Lead 12 or something.

IME, the Origin (20, anyway) is almost like a MESA or modelling amp- It's not that easy to dial in a great tone like some classic Marshall designs are. There is a sweet spot between muddy muffled mess, and buzzy and farting out- it can be a real bitch to find (and keep- if you change some things around like a tube, or speakers, or guitars). The 50 seems to be way more tolerant- likely the bigger iron, and pushing the EL34s appropriately.

But when all the stars align, the 20 will put a smile on your face.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

jeffb said:


> Thank you Brother! That's my old clip from BITD. Unfortunately all my gear (except for my #1 Les Paul) is in storage right now as I'm in-between homes ...I need to grab a Lead 12 or something.
> 
> IME, the Origin (20, anyway) is almost like a MESA or modelling amp- It's not that easy to dial in a great tone like some classic Marshall designs are. There is a sweet spot between muddy muffled mess, and buzzy and farting out- it can be a real bitch to find (and keep- if you change some things around like a tube, or speakers, or guitars). The 50 seems to be way more tolerant- likely the bigger iron, and pushing the EL34s appropriately.
> 
> But when all the stars align, the 20 will put a smile on your face.


The 20 is what sold me on the 50H


----------



## solarburn

jeffb said:


> Thank you Brother! That's my old clip from BITD. Unfortunately all my gear (except for my #1 Les Paul) is in storage right now as I'm in-between homes ...I need to grab a Lead 12 or something.
> 
> IME, the Origin (20, anyway) is almost like a MESA or modelling amp- It's not that easy to dial in a great tone like some classic Marshall designs are. There is a sweet spot between muddy muffled mess, and buzzy and farting out- it can be a real bitch to find (and keep- if you change some things around like a tube, or speakers, or guitars). The 50 seems to be way more tolerant- likely the bigger iron, and pushing the EL34s appropriately.
> 
> But when all the stars align, the 20 will put a smile on your face.



I found my 50H wooly all around and loose in the bottom end going into my GB loaded 412.

Put a 12AY7 in V1 and it helped clear saturation noticeably. Still had plenty gain in the amp especially at volume/gain levels I use. Want that power section active. Put JJ 6CA7'S in for articulation and a fatter tone/feel.

Settling on the Buxom Boost really kills wooly or flabby anything yet keeps itself from changing The amps voiceing minimally. And it's so quiet.

I still love going straight in with the tube change but mildly boosted with this pedal killz.

Plan on getting the 50 combo and doing the same tube wise as well as putting a Celestion Gold in it. It's a plan only. Subject to change based on income and mechanical variables.


----------



## scozz

jeffb said:


> Thank you Brother! That's my old clip from BITD. Unfortunately all my gear (except for my #1 Les Paul) is in storage right now as I'm in-between homes ...I need to grab a Lead 12 or something.
> 
> IME, the Origin (20, anyway) is almost like a MESA or modelling amp- It's not that easy to dial in a great tone like some classic Marshall designs are. There is a sweet spot between muddy muffled mess, and buzzy and farting out- it can be a real bitch to find (and keep- if you change some things around like a tube, or speakers, or guitars). The 50 seems to be way more tolerant- likely the bigger iron, and pushing the EL34s appropriately.
> 
> But when all the stars align, the 20 will put a smile on your face.


Yeah man, I like your style of play Jeff, well done brother. 

Are you in Mexico now?


----------



## jeffb

scozz said:


> Yeah man, I like your style of play Jeff, well done brother.
> 
> Are you in Mexico now?



Worse....New York. 

Maybe you got me confused with someone else? I went to Tijuana when I lived in CA 30+ years ago, that was enough for me! 


On a serious note, My Wife, Daughter and I sold our home and moved about 20 miles from where I was and into NYS to get her into a much better school system, and we are with the in-laws for a bit. So most of our "life" is packed up and in storage for the short term.

Thanks for the kind words. I haven't played in over 8 months now, and I'm really missing it- need to grab a headphone amp or something really small that won't piss everyone off.


----------



## jeffb

solarburnDSL50 said:


> I found my 50H wooly all around and loose in the bottom end going into my GB loaded 412.
> 
> Put a 12AY7 in V1 and it helped clear saturation noticeably. Still had plenty gain in the amp especially at volume/gain levels I use. Want that power section active. Put JJ 6CA7'S in for articulation and a fatter tone/feel.
> 
> Settling on the Buxom Boost really kills wooly or flabby anything yet keeps itself from changing The amps voiceing minimally. And it's so quiet.
> 
> I still love going straight in with the tube change but mildly boosted with this pedal killz.
> 
> Plan on getting the 50 combo and doing the same tube wise as well as putting a Celestion Gold in it. It's a plan only. Subject to change based on income and mechanical variables.



Indeed, the Origins in general are "wild and wooly". I think I prefer the H30 55HZ speakers with mine. I did use some old JAN GE 5751s in V1- those help as well- and JJ 6ca7s (and KT77) are on the list for when I get back to using the amp. E34Ls were my fave so far for tightening it up with my G12M speakers.


----------



## solarburn

jeffb said:


> Indeed, the Origins in general are "wild and wooly". I think I prefer the H30 55HZ speakers with mine. I did use some old JAN GE 5751s in V1- those help as well- and JJ 6ca7s (and KT77) are on the list for when I get back to using the amp. E34Ls were my fave so far for tightening it up with my G12M speakers.



I can see the 34L's tightening it up. That's what they did with my DSL50.

if you ever feel adventurous try a JJ AY7. The 5751's can be much like a weakened/used up 12AX7 yet still too gainy to make a significant difference. 

The JJ AY7 version is inexpensive. I've got the TAD version and it was over $30 but man it sounds and feels great. Some times I splurge to see if what is written? Pans out. Much more plexi like(articulate/unforgiving), old school vintage feel. No problem rolling off to get clean and guitar tone pot gets some sweet spots.


----------



## jeffb

solarburnDSL50 said:


> I can see the 34L's tightening it up. That's what they did with my DSL50.
> 
> if you ever feel adventurous try a JJ AY7. The 5751's can be much like a weakened/used up 12AX7 yet still too gainy to make a significant difference.
> 
> The JJ AY7 version is inexpensive. I've got the TAD version and it was over $30 but man it sounds and feels great. Some times I splurge to see if what is written? Pans out. Much more plexi like(articulate/unforgiving), old school vintage feel. No problem rolling off to get clean and guitar tone pot gets some sweet spots.



I'm gonna put those on the list too, Thank you. Hopefully tubes won't be $100 a piece or completely gone by the time I get into a bigger place


----------



## solarburn

jeffb said:


> I'm gonna put those on the list too, Thank you. Hopefully tubes won't be $100 a piece or completely gone by the time I get into a bigger place



Everything is going up. Except my paycheck to meet the cost of living increases.

Hope you and family find a great place and sooner than later. You need to bend some strings through a Marshall!

Really liked your clip. Tone and playing was pure Marshall and tasty!


----------



## scozz

solarburnDSL50 said:


> I can see the 34L's tightening it up. That's what they did with my DSL50.
> 
> if you ever feel adventurous try a JJ AY7. The 5751's can be much like a weakened/used up 12AX7 yet still too gainy to make a significant difference.
> 
> The JJ AY7 version is inexpensive. I've got the TAD version and it was over $30 but man it sounds and feels great. Some times I splurge to see if what is written? Pans out. Much more plexi like(articulate/unforgiving), old school vintage feel. No problem rolling off to get clean and guitar tone pot gets some sweet spots.


Hey buddy,…,

… did you try the 34L in your SC20?


----------



## solarburn

scozz said:


> Hey buddy,…,
> 
> … did you try the 34L in your SC20?



No sure havent. The pair I had are long gone. I would expect a fat tight bottom and restrained top end which would be great in the SC. It is a toppy amp circuit. The JJ 6CA7'S would do similarily. Fat yet articulate. 

I did just get some 34M's again and am going to run them in the SC and ORI50. These are based off Mullard XF2'S. Never had the original Mullard's so don't know how close they are but I really like the way they sound/feel in a Marshall. Like they make the crunch juicy.LOL Haven't figured out words that describe them yet.


----------



## Yoshiii

steveb63 said:


> I've been using my new Friedman BE-OD Deluxe with my 20h, a little cleaner than edge of breakup on amp.
> 
> It certainly has it's sound, and I love it.
> 
> I know tone is subjective, but this thing is great for balls out.
> 
> Really diggin it, saturated hard rock? Best I can describe.


Is it different enough to use a marshall sounding pedal with the amp?


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Yoshiii said:


> Is it different enough to use a marshall sounding pedal with the amp?


I think it would pair well with it.
Cheers


----------



## fitz

Yoshiii said:


> Is it different enough to use a marshall sounding pedal with the amp?


What ever your favorite pedals are, the O20 is great with pedals.


----------



## steveb63

Yoshiii said:


> Is it different enough to use a marshall sounding pedal with the amp?


Really good question....

I really gave it some thought, and my opinion (IMO) only, to my damaged hearing......

And, in my case Lol Yes, my other drive pedals that I usually use on the same board are Marshally sounding, just different era's?

I can usually find an OCD, DS-1, Marshall BB od etc.. they grab the more "classic" Marshall tones, more kerrang, especially since the amp needs to be as clean as possible using the Friedman.

Hope this helps, keep us in the "loop" Lol


----------



## ledvedder

Hey guys! New Origin 20h owner here. I've been playing with it the past few days, getting it set up with my HX Effects for use with my band tonight at rehearsal and a gig this Sunday. I swapped out the stock preamp tunes with 2 Tungsols, and a Sovtek LPS in the PI. I've ended up with these settings. Master between 6-8, presence around 4, treble at 5, mid at 6-7, bass 4-5, gain at 7, boost off. I'm running into a closed 112 with a Vintage 30. With the HX, I'm boosting it with an SD1 in front, and an EQ in the loop with a 4dB boost for solos. Sounds good so far at home. We'll see how it performs with the band.


----------



## fitz

ledvedder said:


> SD1 in front, and an EQ in the loop



Looks to be in great shape.
Hope it works for you with the band.


----------



## 5TIMBO

steveb63 said:


> I've been using my new Friedman BE-OD Deluxe with my 20h, a little cleaner than edge of breakup on amp.
> 
> It certainly has it's sound, and I love it.
> 
> I know tone is subjective, but this thing is great for balls out.
> 
> Really diggin it, saturated hard rock? Best I can describe.


I have the same friedman pedal and 20h and it's one of my go to distortion tone.


----------



## steveb63

5TIMBO said:


> I have the same friedman pedal and 20h and it's one of my go to distortion tone.


Great combo IMO
Still using it for my goto balls distortion, two years later.


----------



## Edgar Frog

Since I was forced out of my apartment several months ago for the new owners could turn it into an air bnb I switched my setup and have it a mini stack now. Luckily there was literally only one place in town for rent and I happened to know the owners. It literally came up one week before I was out on the street with nowhere to go. I went from 1,500sqft to 650sqft so it's a little of a size shocker. Better than being homeless with nowhere to put my stuff in storage or anything. People really suck nowadays, especially when I had a perfect rent record at that place and never had a complaint from anyone.


----------



## Unburst

Hi everybody! 
A new member here. Been following this thread for a while now.
Got me a Origin 20H a month ago. Really surprised on the first power up,
how the cleans are warm and rich. Didn't even expect so much dirt!
The head is connected trough the Rock Crusher to DSL40CRs V-type, for now. Boosting it eventually with a EP booster. I'm thinking of getting a 1x12 Greenback equiped box in the near future. I must say there is a really great input from the members about tubes and I'm learning a lot.
Cheers!


----------



## fitz

Unburst said:


> Hi everybody!
> A new member here. Been following this thread for a while now.
> Got me a Origin 20H a month ago. Really surprised on the first power up,
> how the cleans are warm and rich. Didn't even expect so much dirt!
> The head is connected trough the Rock Crusher to DSL40CRs V-type, for now. Boosting it eventually with a EP booster. I'm thinking of getting a 1x12 Greenback equiped box in the near future. I must say there is a really great input from the members about tubes and I'm learning a lot.
> Cheers!


 to the forum


----------



## ledvedder

Hi guys! I figured I'd post about the 1st gig with my Origin 20h. My band played an outdoor venue yesterday. 

I had the head, a semi open 212 cab with 1 Vintage 30 and 1 G12H-30, an HX Effects in 4cm, and an EP Booster in front. I played my Gibson LP Classic and my Fender HSS strat. For the most part, it worked out great. There were a few things I was trying to dial in most of the night, but never was able to. I kept the head in the mid power setting, although I couldn't bring the master past 6 without it getting too loud. The low setting wasn't loud enough. I started with presence 5, treble 4, mid 6, bass 5, gain 6, with no boost. I kept the EP Booster on most of the night at about 25%, except during a few songs that needed real clean tones. I added drive with the Timmy in the HX Effects. Also used some reverb, and noise gate with the HXFX. For some songs, I used chorus, tremolo, etc from the HXFX as well. I kept trying to dial out top end most of the night. By the end of the final set, I had the amp presence and treble both at 3, and bumped the bass to 6. I also couldn't get a decent lead tone. I was using an EQ in the loop with the level bumped up 4dB. But that didn't seem to bump up volume the way it does with my DSL. Probably due to the pre PI master. How do you guys bump up your level for leads? For tubes, I'm using Ruby 7025ss in V1 and V2, Sovtek LPS in V3, and EH EL34's. 

I'm giving it a B overall. I need to find a way to give the tone more fullness and not be so trebley, as well as a way to bump the level for lead.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Unburst said:


> Hi everybody!
> A new member here. Been following this thread for a while now.
> Got me a Origin 20H a month ago. Really surprised on the first power up,
> how the cleans are warm and rich. Didn't even expect so much dirt!
> The head is connected trough the Rock Crusher to DSL40CRs V-type, for now. Boosting it eventually with a EP booster. I'm thinking of getting a 1x12 Greenback equiped box in the near future. I must say there is a really great input from the members about tubes and I'm learning a lot.
> Cheers!


Welcome to the forum


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

ledvedder said:


> Hi guys! I figured I'd post about the 1st gig with my Origin 20h. My band played an outdoor venue yesterday.
> 
> I had the head, a semi open 212 cab with 1 Vintage 30 and 1 G12H-30, an HX Effects in 4cm, and an EP Booster in front. I played my Gibson LP Classic and my Fender HSS strat. For the most part, it worked out great. There were a few things I was trying to dial in most of the night, but never was able to. I kept the head in the mid power setting, although I couldn't bring the master past 6 without it getting too loud. The low setting wasn't loud enough. I started with presence 5, treble 4, mid 6, bass 5, gain 6, with no boost. I kept the EP Booster on most of the night at about 25%, except during a few songs that needed real clean tones. I added drive with the Timmy in the HX Effects. Also used some reverb, and noise gate with the HXFX. For some songs, I used chorus, tremolo, etc from the HXFX as well. I kept trying to dial out top end most of the night. By the end of the final set, I had the amp presence and treble both at 3, and bumped the bass to 6. I also couldn't get a decent lead tone. I was using an EQ in the loop with the level bumped up 4dB. But that didn't seem to bump up volume the way it does with my DSL. Probably due to the pre PI master. How do you guys bump up your level for leads? For tubes, I'm using Ruby 7025ss in V1 and V2, Sovtek LPS in V3, and EH EL34's.
> 
> I'm giving it a B overall. I need to find a way to give the tone more fullness and not be so trebley, as well as a way to bump the level for lead.


Mine are the 50H’s one has all mullards in the preamp spots (CP’s) and Ruby power tubes.
The second one has a mullard in V1 stock tubes in the rest, I am using MG cabs one with a pair of greenbacks, the other one has a pair of Eminence golds.
I am using my MXR10 band eq in front of the amps , and either the SD1 or Joyo ultimate drive.
I don’t use the amps boost function, this may or may not work for a lead boost, I haven’t tried it in this manner.
But I feel that I am getting great NWOBHM tones out of them with both my Strats or any of my Gibson guitars.
Cheers


----------



## scozz

Edgar Frog said:


> Since I was forced out of my apartment several months ago for the new owners could turn it into an air bnb I switched my setup and have it a mini stack now. Luckily there was literally only one place in town for rent and I happened to know the owners. It literally came up one week before I was out on the street with nowhere to go. I went from 1,500sqft to 650sqft so it's a little of a size shocker. Better than being homeless with nowhere to put my stuff in storage or anything. People really suck nowadays, especially when I had a perfect rent record at that place and never had a complaint from anyone.


Sorry to hear that man,…


----------



## ledvedder

Is there information somewhere about changing the Origin to a post PI master volume?


----------



## ledvedder

Is anyone using a Friedman Smallbox pedal with their Origin? I have one, but I just can't get it to sound very good. It's very piercing.


----------



## Mark Collier

ledvedder said:


> Hi guys! I figured I'd post about the 1st gig with my Origin 20h. My band played an outdoor venue yesterday.
> 
> I had the head, a semi open 212 cab with 1 Vintage 30 and 1 G12H-30, an HX Effects in 4cm, and an EP Booster in front. I played my Gibson LP Classic and my Fender HSS strat. For the most part, it worked out great. There were a few things I was trying to dial in most of the night, but never was able to. I kept the head in the mid power setting, although I couldn't bring the master past 6 without it getting too loud. The low setting wasn't loud enough. I started with presence 5, treble 4, mid 6, bass 5, gain 6, with no boost. I kept the EP Booster on most of the night at about 25%, except during a few songs that needed real clean tones. I added drive with the Timmy in the HX Effects. Also used some reverb, and noise gate with the HXFX. For some songs, I used chorus, tremolo, etc from the HXFX as well. I kept trying to dial out top end most of the night. By the end of the final set, I had the amp presence and treble both at 3, and bumped the bass to 6. I also couldn't get a decent lead tone. I was using an EQ in the loop with the level bumped up 4dB. But that didn't seem to bump up volume the way it does with my DSL. Probably due to the pre PI master. How do you guys bump up your level for leads? For tubes, I'm using Ruby 7025ss in V1 and V2, Sovtek LPS in V3, and EH EL34's.
> 
> I'm giving it a B overall. I need to find a way to give the tone more fullness and not be so trebley, as well as a way to bump the level for lead.




In my experience, the O20 (maybe the 50 too?) doesn't get "warm" until the drive is at 8+ and the master is 7+ on the dials.

I highly recommend running it at 20watts and use a Bugera PS1 to control the volume. I think these are only $100.00 or so in the USA and work a treat.


----------



## solarburn

ledvedder said:


> Is anyone using a Friedman Smallbox pedal with their Origin? I have one, but I just can't get it to sound very good. It's very piercing.



I have the Small box and the Buxom Boost. I find the Small box not compatible with the Origin. The Buxom Boost is excellent. No problem varying useable tones and attack with it and Origin.

Have you messed around with your tilt control while dialing up the amps EQ?


----------



## solarburn

Mark Collier said:


> In my experience, the O20 (maybe the 50 too?) doesn't get "warm" until the drive is at 8+ and the master is 7+ on the dials.
> 
> I highly recommend running it at 20watts and use a Bugera PS1 to control the volume. I think these are only $100.00 or so in the USA and work a treat.



Agree and I don't play it any other way. Still able to roll off to cleans easily. Once I found how volume and gain intermingled and found the sweet zone I was on to the amps goods.

Any volume pot pedal/device in the loop will manage overall volume yet keep it in its sweet zone.


----------



## fitz

ledvedder said:


> Is anyone using a Friedman Smallbox pedal with their Origin? I have one, but I just can't get it to sound very good. It's very piercing.


I don't have the Small Box, but I've added a Boss BD-2 to the front end options on my O20 and it kicks way more ass than the SD-1.
I like them both, but if you're looking for some more balls for the O20, give the BD-2 a try.


----------



## jeffb

ledvedder said:


> Hi guys! I figured I'd post about the 1st gig with my Origin 20h. My band played an outdoor venue yesterday.
> 
> I had the head, a semi open 212 cab with 1 Vintage 30 and 1 G12H-30, an HX Effects in 4cm, and an EP Booster in front. I played my Gibson LP Classic and my Fender HSS strat. For the most part, it worked out great. There were a few things I was trying to dial in most of the night, but never was able to. I kept the head in the mid power setting, although I couldn't bring the master past 6 without it getting too loud. The low setting wasn't loud enough. I started with presence 5, treble 4, mid 6, bass 5, gain 6, with no boost. I kept the EP Booster on most of the night at about 25%, except during a few songs that needed real clean tones. I added drive with the Timmy in the HX Effects. Also used some reverb, and noise gate with the HXFX. For some songs, I used chorus, tremolo, etc from the HXFX as well. I kept trying to dial out top end most of the night. By the end of the final set, I had the amp presence and treble both at 3, and bumped the bass to 6. I also couldn't get a decent lead tone. I was using an EQ in the loop with the level bumped up 4dB. But that didn't seem to bump up volume the way it does with my DSL. Probably due to the pre PI master. How do you guys bump up your level for leads? For tubes, I'm using Ruby 7025ss in V1 and V2, Sovtek LPS in V3, and EH EL34's.
> 
> I'm giving it a B overall. I need to find a way to give the tone more fullness and not be so trebley, as well as a way to bump the level for lead.




Try some E34L's from JJ. EHX are pretty bright and chop off some low end. An EP booster is also bright, especially if you are not using the "vintage" mode. the JJ 34Ls will extend the lows, thicken the mids, and cut some of the extreme top off. This is crucial witha 20W compared to higher watt Marshalls. The E34Ls also have more headroom which will help with your boosted sounds (but still may not be enough). It's an inexpensive experiment.


----------



## fitz

jeffb said:


> Try some E34L's from JJ. EHX are pretty bright and chop off some low end. An EP booster is also bright, especially if you are not using the "vintage" mode. the JJ 34Ls will extend the lows, thicken the mids, and cut some of the extreme top off. This is crucial witha 20W compared to higher watt Marshalls. The E34Ls also have more headroom which will help with your boosted sounds (but still may not be enough). It's an inexpensive experiment.


+1 for E34L's.


----------



## ledvedder

jeffb said:


> Try some E34L's from JJ. EHX are pretty bright and chop off some low end. An EP booster is also bright, especially if you are not using the "vintage" mode. the JJ 34Ls will extend the lows, thicken the mids, and cut some of the extreme top off. This is crucial witha 20W compared to higher watt Marshalls. The E34Ls also have more headroom which will help with your boosted sounds (but still may not be enough). It's an inexpensive experiment.


Are the JJ el34L's much different than the JJ el34's that came stock with the amp? What about the JJ el34 II tubes? How do they compare?


----------



## jeffb

ledvedder said:


> Are the JJ el34L's much different than the JJ el34's that came stock with the amp? What about the JJ el34 II tubes? How do they compare?



They are all very different.

The E34Ls have more bass and high mids, more headroom

The 34IIs have more detail and highs than the 34Ls, and less lows. 

The standard EL34s have the least low end and are pretty bright, and not terribly popular for a reason.


----------



## solarburn

ledvedder said:


> Are the JJ el34L's much different than the JJ el34's that came stock with the amp? What about the JJ el34 II tubes? How do they compare?



I've had the JJ34 2'S not last long a couple of times. They are warmer than regular JJ 34's. I have used JJ 34L's a few times in other Marshallz. Bottom end increased top end was restrained. Mids were still present, not scooped. I'd say would be a great choice too.

I use JJ 6CA7'S which are fat and articulate. Helped diminish the amp gain wooliness. Definitely helped my Origin stay vintage but not enuff to make the Small box pedal work. That pedal is already there Plexi wise. Too much open vintage circuits together is too much.


----------



## WienerDog

ledvedder said:


> Is anyone using a Friedman Smallbox pedal with their Origin? I have one, but I just can't get it to sound very good. It's very piercing.



I use the Golden Pearl with my 20H and it sounds fantastic.


----------



## solarburn

WienerDog said:


> I use the Golden Pearl with my 20H and it sounds fantastic.


----------



## solarburn

Well...I use a Buxom Boost and the naughty girls ringing my doorbell throw panties. Clean or not.


----------



## Robbah99

Mark Collier said:


> In my experience, the O20 (maybe the 50 too?) doesn't get "warm" until the drive is at 8+ and the master is 7+ on the dials.
> 
> I highly recommend running it at 20watts and use a Bugera PS1 to control the volume. I think these are only $100.00 or so in the USA and work a treat.



Yes! this is the advice to listen to 
I have an OR50. There is only one way to run these amps. Power output on High. The Middle/Low settings are "shit".
Master volume needs atleast 7 and gain 6 (depending on pickups). I have a bugera ps1 to control the volume.
This is the only way to reach the marshall sound (in my opinion). But boy, the difference is day and night.
If I had'nt come up with this I would return the amp. Origin's are great when run correctly and mehh, when you dont.
Crank it and tame with power soak. 
Using a cheap one like the ps1 usually takes some treble off, but in this case it's good. since the amp has more than enough of treble.


----------



## jeffb

Robbah99 said:


> There is only one way to run these amps. Power output on High. .



Agreed. Low and Mid power are big tone compromises.

I'm not sure how much I like the attenuated sound either though using my Rockcrusher. ORI20H really thins out. The 50 I'm sure fares better.

The only way I've been able to run it in mid and low power and get a decent big sound is with the Boost on, and tweaking the volume to where the boost starts to get farty/fizzy sounding and back it off a touch. It's a very fine line between good, and sounds like @$$, with these amps in low and mid power. Very finnicky.


----------



## solarburn

Robbah99 said:


> Yes! this is the advice to listen to
> I have an OR50. There is only one way to run these amps. Power output on High. The Middle/Low settings are "shit".
> Master volume needs atleast 7 and gain 6 (depending on pickups). I have a bugera ps1 to control the volume.
> This is the only way to reach the marshall sound (in my opinion). But boy, the difference is day and night.
> If I had'nt come up with this I would return the amp. Origin's are great when run correctly and mehh, when you dont.
> Crank it and tame with power soak.
> Using a cheap one like the ps1 usually takes some treble off, but in this case it's good. since the amp has more than enough of treble.



There is no way I'd neuter my 50 watter let alone a 20 watter. WTF is wrong with you guys? Playing guitar means being loud. Unless you're fucked in the head.

I agree with you about the sweet spot. Smart player. You fuckerz think 20 watts need to be attenuated? Fux sakes. Grow a pair.


----------



## ColdEye

Finally decided to do some changes to my 20C. I am planning on putting a Creamback 10 on it. Anyone tried that? And also, I was wondering if I should just solder vs use the spade connectors for the speaker connection? I have a Weber Mini Mass but the stock speaker connector is too short. I am also planning on making my own speaker cables as I have most of the parts already.


----------



## fitz

ColdEye said:


> Finally decided to do some changes to my 20C. I am planning on putting a Creamback 10 on it. Anyone tried that? And also, I was wondering if I should just solder vs use the spade connectors for the speaker connection? I have a Weber Mini Mass but the stock speaker connector is too short. I am also planning on making my own speaker cables as I have most of the parts already.


If you're making your own cable, just make a male TS to spade connector speaker cable as long as you need to reach the Weber.
You could always solder the spade connectors if you're having a problem with them coming loose.
As far as a Creamback vs. the VT-jr? - that's a matter of what you like and the tones you're looking for.


----------



## ColdEye

fitz288 said:


> If you're making your own cable, just make a male TS to spade connector speaker cable as long as you need to reach the Weber.
> You could always solder the spade connectors if you're having a problem with them coming loose.
> As far as a Creamback vs. the VT-jr? - that's a matter of what you like and the tones you're looking for.




Thanks, that was my plan to make a TS to Spade. Sorry if this sounds stupid, so do you solder the spade connector on the tab at the speaker? Also when you crimp the spade connector, do you have to add some solder? I like redundancies. lol


----------



## fitz

ColdEye said:


> Thanks, that was my plan to make a TS to Spade. Sorry if this sounds stupid, so do you solder the spade connector on the tab at the speaker? Also when you crimp the spade connector, do you have to add some solder? I like redundancies. lol


I've usually soldered the connectors at the crimp to the wire, but I've never soldered the connector to the speaker spade, so I wouldn't need to unsolder to change speakers.
I don't move my cabs around much, except from room to room.
If I was tossing a combo in the back of the car on a regular basis, it might not be a bad idea to solder both.


----------



## ColdEye

I love the creamback on this, replaced the tubes too just cause. Let's see in a few weeks how I feel about it. Works really well with my strat.


----------



## Jorge Tome

One more member to this forum and thread. I am new to the forum and i own a stock Origin 20c.
Rock on!


----------



## fitz

Jorge Tome said:


> One more member to this forum and thread. I am new to the forum and i own a stock Origin 20c.
> Rock on!


 to the forum.
Start a new thread in the Introduce Yourself | MarshallForum.com page and tell us about your gear.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Jorge Tome said:


> One more member to this forum and thread. I am new to the forum and i own a stock Origin 20c.
> Rock on!


Welcome to the forum 
And the Origin club..
Cheers Mitch


----------



## scozz

ColdEye said:


> Finally decided to do some changes to my 20C. I am planning on putting a Creamback 10 on it. Anyone tried that? And also, I was wondering if I should just solder vs use the spade connectors for the speaker connection? I have a Weber Mini Mass but the stock speaker connector is too short. I am also planning on making my own speaker cables as I have most of the parts already.


I don’t have any personal knowledge of the 10” Creamback speaker, but I’ve heard good things about them. If they’re anything like their big brother you’re gonna love it. 

I have a Creamback 65 in a 1-12 cab I use with my SC20. It sounds exceptional to me, a well balanced speaker imo. 

I also use a Weber Minimass, it works and sounds great. I especially like the two treble boost options to restore whatever treble loss occurs from attenuation. I use the +3db treble boost, it’s always on. 

As far as soldering the speaker wire or just using the spade connections, I could be wrong but I don’t think it makes much of a difference either way. 

Also you can get a simple male to female speaker extension cable to use with the Minimass. Here’s a link to a 1.5’ speaker cable extension that would work fine. 

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/de...16qqf-1.5-ts-ts-female-speaker-cable-1.5-foot

Good luck moving forward,… and welcome to the Marshall Forum. 

Also welcome to you @Jorge Tome!


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

How much does power valve matching matter for these amps? I bought a JJ el34l for my single valve amp but don't really like it there. Could I buy another single from the same store and expect the pair to work fine in my Origin 20?


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

OriginOfTheSpecies said:


> How much does power valve matching matter for these amps? I bought a JJ el34l for my single valve amp but don't really like it there. Could I buy another single from the same store and expect the pair to work fine in my Origin 20?



Bumping this question if anyone can answer?


----------



## fitz

OriginOfTheSpecies said:


> How much does power valve matching matter for these amps? I bought a JJ el34l for my single valve amp but don't really like it there. Could I buy another single from the same store and expect the pair to work fine in my Origin 20?


I'm not an expert, but the amp's cathode bias should compensate for the difference.
I've never heard of a "has to be less than ____ different", or it won't work.
Reward outweighs the risk of possibly needing a 3rd, those tubes are magic in the O20!


----------



## EdgeOfBreakup

Howdy All!

Long term lurker first time poster here from Australia. Just finished reading through the 50 odd pages on this thread =) Have been playing the Origin 20 head for a few weeks now and absolutely loving it. Had a valvestate AVT50 for years, but really wanted to fulfil the urge for a small half stack setup.

Marshall stock is quite scarce in Oz currently due to supply issues, so I opted to pair the head with a Code212 cab, which I replaced the stock speakers out with a V30 that I already owned and a new Creamback. I also added the gold piping around the edges to marry it up a bit more with the Ori. Fairly happy aesthetically, but now my only ocd complaint is the Ori logo is a little more off white or cream than on the cab.

Rolled V1 for a Mullard and couldn't be happier with the sounds I'm getting. Either as clean platform for pedals or fully dimed and backing off on the vol pot for cleanup. Also have the PS1 which is working well to keep family and neighbours happy.

Keen to understand those of you who have swapped out V2 how it affects the sound when the FX loop is bypassed. Does the signal even go thru V2 in this instance?


----------



## fitz

EdgeOfBreakup said:


> Howdy All!
> 
> Long term lurker first time poster here from Australia. Just finished reading through the 50 odd pages on this thread =) Have been playing the Origin 20 head for a few weeks now and absolutely loving it. Had a valvestate AVT50 for years, but really wanted to fulfil the urge for a small half stack setup.
> 
> Marshall stock is quite scarce in Oz currently due to supply issues, so I opted to pair the head with a Code212 cab, which I replaced the stock speakers out with a V30 that I already owned and a new Creamback. I also added the gold piping around the edges to marry it up a bit more with the Ori. Fairly happy aesthetically, but now my only ocd complaint is the Ori logo is a little more off white or cream than on the cab.
> 
> Rolled V1 for a Mullard and couldn't be happier with the sounds I'm getting. Either as clean platform for pedals or fully dimed and backing off on the vol pot for cleanup. Also have the PS1 which is working well to keep family and neighbours happy.
> 
> Keen to understand those of you who have swapped out V2 how it affects the sound when the FX loop is bypassed. Does the signal even go thru V2 in this instance?
> 
> View attachment 99466
> View attachment 99467


 to the forum.
That Code 212 looks perfect with the O20H.
Nice work!


----------



## MarshallDog

Welcome aboard and glad you like your Origin, I love mine! Tubes and speakers do it justice unless one is a high gain junkie which this amp is not!


----------



## MarshallDog

Oh and yes, these amps love Creambacks IMO and the gold piping looks great!


----------



## scozz

EdgeOfBreakup said:


> Howdy All!
> 
> Long term lurker first time poster here from Australia. Just finished reading through the 50 odd pages on this thread =) Have been playing the Origin 20 head for a few weeks now and absolutely loving it. Had a valvestate AVT50 for years, but really wanted to fulfil the urge for a small half stack setup.
> 
> Marshall stock is quite scarce in Oz currently due to supply issues, so I opted to pair the head with a Code212 cab, which I replaced the stock speakers out with a V30 that I already owned and a new Creamback. I also added the gold piping around the edges to marry it up a bit more with the Ori. Fairly happy aesthetically, but now my only ocd complaint is the Ori logo is a little more off white or cream than on the cab.
> 
> Rolled V1 for a Mullard and couldn't be happier with the sounds I'm getting. Either as clean platform for pedals or fully dimed and backing off on the vol pot for cleanup. Also have the PS1 which is working well to keep family and neighbours happy.
> 
> Keen to understand those of you who have swapped out V2 how it affects the sound when the FX loop is bypassed. Does the signal even go thru V2 in this instance?
> 
> View attachment 99466
> View attachment 99467


Welcome to the Marshall Forum @EdgeOfBreakup. 

Nice rig, I think they look great together, the added piping you put on the Code cab helps to make the connection. How does it sound, does it sound better than your Avt50?

I can’t help you with your questions, I don’t own an O20, I’ve never even played one. As you probably know, there are lots of guys here that own O20s’, so some will be around shortly to help.


----------



## Georgiatec

EdgeOfBreakup said:


> Keen to understand those of you who have swapped out V2 how it affects the sound when the FX loop is bypassed. Does the signal even go thru V2 in this instance?



Can't say for sure without checking a schematic. Usually, the loop will only use one of the triodes with the other one adding more gain.


----------



## EdgeOfBreakup

Thanks for the warm welcome everyone!



scozz said:


> How does it sound, does it sound better than your Avt50?



It's miles above the old AVT50. So much more tonal avenues to play with it's hard to even compare !


----------



## BRMarshall

Welcome and appreciate you sharing pics. Head and cabinet look great. I’ve had my Origin 20H for a couple years. I have a small variety of preamp tubes, JJ, Tung Sol, Millard (new production), etc. but mine still has original tubes - I like the sound fine, but probably more due to laziness. 

Some folks on here have swapped out tubes and dug into the electronics of these and can share their knowledge and experience. Enjoy your amp!


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

EdgeOfBreakup said:


> Howdy All!
> 
> Long term lurker first time poster here from Australia. Just finished reading through the 50 odd pages on this thread =) Have been playing the Origin 20 head for a few weeks now and absolutely loving it. Had a valvestate AVT50 for years, but really wanted to fulfil the urge for a small half stack setup.
> 
> Marshall stock is quite scarce in Oz currently due to supply issues, so I opted to pair the head with a Code212 cab, which I replaced the stock speakers out with a V30 that I already owned and a new Creamback. I also added the gold piping around the edges to marry it up a bit more with the Ori. Fairly happy aesthetically, but now my only ocd complaint is the Ori logo is a little more off white or cream than on the cab.
> 
> Rolled V1 for a Mullard and couldn't be happier with the sounds I'm getting. Either as clean platform for pedals or fully dimed and backing off on the vol pot for cleanup. Also have the PS1 which is working well to keep family and neighbours happy.
> 
> Keen to understand those of you who have swapped out V2 how it affects the sound when the FX loop is bypassed. Does the signal even go thru V2 in this instance?
> 
> View attachment 99466
> View attachment 99467




TO THE FORUM 
Your cab mods make that head look like it came straight from Marshall in this configuration,, excellent job.
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## Sputnick60

I'm new to the forum. I have an Origin 20 combo. This is not my first Marshall, but the first after a number of years.
I bought my first Marshall in 1980. It was a 2204 Master Vol. I had that with a 1960a from the 70's, (the one with the checkered grille cloth and the Rola Celestion G12M greenbacks). What a beast of an amp! I loved it and got a really great sound from it. Sparkly clean to super gained out with just a LPB2 to force feed the Strat tones into it. By gosh I dug that sound.
Unfortunately the head was stolen (with my guitar) but I replaced it with a 70's Superlead. Now that was a really loud amp. So loud that I couldn't use it in the band and so began a long journey punctuated with just about every brand of amp there is. A constant theme of always a valve amp and diminishing size. 
I've got down to a H&K Tubemeister, an AC30 (from the Marshall factory), a Fender Concert brown face from 1963, a Fender blackface deluxe reverb from 1965, a reissue Champ, and now this Marshall Origin 20 Combo.
They all sound great in each their different ways. The H&K does crunch really well but I needed another form of master vol amp that sat on the Marshall side of the spectrum, not too loud and had modern features like an FX loop which my older amps don't offer. This O20C is a really nice amp. Great value for money and with a bit of use will be my main gigging amp alongside the H&K.
Anyhow good to meet you all. Readng this thread helped inform the choice of the amp, although some of the adjectives and superlatives had no meaning for me, the idea of an almost but not quite Plexi sound was conveyed. I knew what to expect auditioning the amp and it was an easy choice to make.


----------



## fitz

Sputnick60 said:


> I'm new to the forum. I have an Origin 20 combo. This is not my first Marshall, but the first after a number of years.
> I bought my first Marshall in 1980. It was a 2204 Master Vol. I had that with a 1960a from the 70's, (the one with the checkered grille cloth and the Rola Celestion G12M greenbacks). What a beast of an amp! I loved it and got a really great sound from it. Sparkly clean to super gained out with just a LPB2 to force feed the Strat tones into it. By gosh I dug that sound.
> Unfortunately the head was stolen (with my guitar) but I replaced it with a 70's Superlead. Now that was a really loud amp. So loud that I couldn't use it in the band and so began a long journey punctuated with just about every brand of amp there is. A constant theme of always a valve amp and diminishing size.
> I've got down to a H&K Tubemeister, an AC30 (from the Marshall factory), a Fender Concert brown face from 1963, a Fender blackface deluxe reverb from 1965, a reissue Champ, and now this Marshall Origin 20 Combo.
> They all sound great in each their different ways. The H&K does crunch really well but I needed another form of master vol amp that sat on the Marshall side of the spectrum, not too loud and had modern features like an FX loop which my older amps don't offer. This O20C is a really nice amp. Great value for money and with a bit of use will be my main gigging amp alongside the H&K.
> Anyhow good to meet you all. Readng this thread helped inform the choice of the amp, although some of the adjectives and superlatives had no meaning for me, the idea of an almost but not quite Plexi sound was conveyed. I knew what to expect auditioning the amp and it was an easy choice to make.


 to the forum.


----------



## C-Grin

Yes welcome and congrats.


----------



## speyfly

Welcome to the forum and to the Origin 20 club. Roll some tubes to dial it in and you'll love your amp, will do just about anything you want to play.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Sputnick60 said:


> I'm new to the forum. I have an Origin 20 combo. This is not my first Marshall, but the first after a number of years.
> I bought my first Marshall in 1980. It was a 2204 Master Vol. I had that with a 1960a from the 70's, (the one with the checkered grille cloth and the Rola Celestion G12M greenbacks). What a beast of an amp! I loved it and got a really great sound from it. Sparkly clean to super gained out with just a LPB2 to force feed the Strat tones into it. By gosh I dug that sound.
> Unfortunately the head was stolen (with my guitar) but I replaced it with a 70's Superlead. Now that was a really loud amp. So loud that I couldn't use it in the band and so began a long journey punctuated with just about every brand of amp there is. A constant theme of always a valve amp and diminishing size.
> I've got down to a H&K Tubemeister, an AC30 (from the Marshall factory), a Fender Concert brown face from 1963, a Fender blackface deluxe reverb from 1965, a reissue Champ, and now this Marshall Origin 20 Combo.
> They all sound great in each their different ways. The H&K does crunch really well but I needed another form of master vol amp that sat on the Marshall side of the spectrum, not too loud and had modern features like an FX loop which my older amps don't offer. This O20C is a really nice amp. Great value for money and with a bit of use will be my main gigging amp alongside the H&K.
> Anyhow good to meet you all. Readng this thread helped inform the choice of the amp, although some of the adjectives and superlatives had no meaning for me, the idea of an almost but not quite Plexi sound was conveyed. I knew what to expect auditioning the amp and it was an easy choice to make.


Welcome to the forum 
 To the Origin club.
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## solarburn

Good taste in tone and welcome.


----------



## L Newman

Hi. I'm looking for some second opinions. I'm wanting a backup in case my 20C goes bung at a gig. I'm tossing up between an EHX 5MM power amp in a pedal https://www.ehx.com/products/5mm/ or a Marshall MG15 https://marshall.com/marshall-amps/products/amps/mg-gold/mg15. I'm never able to run the 20C above the 3/5 watt mid power setting (venues have a thing about volume these days) ... although I get compliments on tone every time. I like the EHX 5MM for its size/convenience but am unsure about its volume capabilities live. The MG15 looks ok for volume but means lugging another amp (albeit small). I'm aware of the EHX 44mm but at over $300 AUD it's out of my price range just for a backup. Note these are for emergency short term use on gigs. And season's greeting to everyone on the forum!


----------



## EdgeOfBreakup

I'm keen to try one of these or similar as a backup/rehersal option as well. From what I've read and seen on YT demos, just by itself would sound a little sterile. You'd want a preamp of sorts before it to be able to sculpt some tonal options.

I'm keen to try a MIAB pedal set to edge of breakup before it with a view to go cleaner by riding the volume pot.

Am also considering making a DIY pedal amp (with master volume) as per the links below. There's also heaps more info on TGP about this as well.


----------



## EdgeOfBreakup

Links


http://bluesguitarunleashed.com/forum/index.php?threads/diy-pedal-amp-first-run.24167/

https://www.thegearpage.net/board/i...30-as-power-amp-for-digital-solution.1877746/


----------



## RCM 800

L Newman said:


> Hi. I'm looking for some second opinions. I'm wanting a backup in case my 20C goes bung at a gig. I'm tossing up between an EHX 5MM power amp in a pedal https://www.ehx.com/products/5mm/ or a Marshall MG15 https://marshall.com/marshall-amps/products/amps/mg-gold/mg15. I'm never able to run the 20C above the 3/5 watt mid power setting (venues have a thing about volume these days) ... although I get compliments on tone every time. I like the EHX 5MM for its size/convenience but am unsure about its volume capabilities live. The MG15 looks ok for volume but means lugging another amp (albeit small). I'm aware of the EHX 44mm but at over $300 AUD it's out of my price range just for a backup. Note these are for emergency short term use on gigs. And season's greeting to everyone on the forum!


When I wanted a backup I bought a second or20h.


----------



## L Newman

Cant afford to.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

RCM 800 said:


> When I wanted a backup I bought a second or20h.


I did the same with all 3 of my amps, so now I have six .. Dsl40c’s, Origin 50H’s , 3210 lead 100 mosfet’s it took me a few years but I did get them.
Cheers


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

L Newman said:


> Cant afford to.


The MG sounds like a good candidate, but I would shoot for the 30.
Cheers


----------



## L Newman

L Newman said:


> Hi. I'm looking for some second opinions. I'm wanting a backup in case my 20C goes bung at a gig. I'm tossing up between an EHX 5MM power amp in a pedal or a Marshall MG15 ...



I went for an EHX Howitzer 15W https://www.ehx.com/products/15watt-howitzer/ . It sounds pretty good (but doesn't have the "life" of the Origin).It'll certainly do its job as back up if ever needed.


----------



## EdgeOfBreakup

Firmed up my FX loop and made a little board for them. Pimped up with a little clear oxygen tubing and gold tinsel string courtesy of the kids. Turned out pretty cool


----------



## speyfly

Man I love the the tone of the O20H, Marshall all the way in a small package!
But then again, I don't have a JTM45 yet!


----------



## steveb63

speyfly said:


> Man I love the the tone of the O20H, Marshall all the way in a small package!
> But then again, I don't have a JTM45 yet!


I have a JTM 45 as well.......

Different horses for sure, but my Origin still plays a role in most of recording.

But nothing like the JTM at around 6-8, no overdrive pedal, just pure Marshall singing with some humbuckers.


----------



## L Newman

EdgeOfBreakup said:


> Firmed up my FX loop and made a little board for them. Pimped up with a little clear oxygen tubing and gold tinsel string courtesy of the kids. Turned out pretty cool



I have the NUX Atlantic, too. I had one. Thought I could do better. Sold it. Bought something else. Sold them. Bought another Atlantic. It's here to stay.


----------



## L Newman

I was idly reading this and that online and came across this https://reverb.com/news/how-to-improve-your-amps-tone-with-preamp-tube-swaps and wondered if anyone has tried a 5751 in the first stage? And, if so, the result?


----------



## fitz

L Newman said:


> I was idly reading this and that online and came across this https://reverb.com/news/how-to-improve-your-amps-tone-with-preamp-tube-swaps and wondered if anyone has tried a 5751 in the first stage? And, if so, the result?


5751's are a little lower gain factor than the 12AX7.




Depends on what "improve your amp's tone" means to you.
In V1, it should give you more clean headroom, so if you want that, give it a try.
There are differences in identically labeled tubes, and a bit of luck involved in tube rolling - IMO.
I put JJ803S long plates in my O20H and liked the change so much I never thought about trying other tubes.


----------



## speyfly

L Newman said:


> I was idly reading this and that online and came across this https://reverb.com/news/how-to-improve-your-amps-tone-with-preamp-tube-swaps and wondered if anyone has tried a 5751 in the first stage? And, if so, the result?




Great read, thx.

12AT7 in V1 is giving me great results.


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## C-Grin

Lower gain, as if that's a thing


----------



## speyfly

fitz288 said:


> 5751's are a little lower gain factor than the 12AX7.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Depends on what "improve your amp's tone" means to you.
> In V1, it should give you more clean headroom, so if you want that, give it a try.
> There are differences in identically labeled tubes, and a bit of luck involved in tube rolling - IMO.
> I put JJ803S long plates in my O20H and liked the change so much I never thought about trying other tubes.



Hey fitz, try out your 803's in V2 and V3 with a 12AT7EH in V1, I really think you'll like that mix. Let me know what you think.


----------



## fitz

speyfly said:


> Hey fitz, try out your 803's in V2 and V3 with a 12AT7EH in V1, I really think you'll like that mix. Let me know what you think.


What do you like about it?
TubeDepot says 12AY7EH are good for reverb circuits & PI but can be microphonic in V1.
Lower gain factor then 12AX7.

I put the 803s tubes in all 3 slots because I read somewhere they are good for more gain.
Then I read somewhere they have less gain than the regular ECC83/12AX7.
Also read they can be microphonic in V1.

I've read so many threads about this or that tube brand, and magic combinations of this one here and that one there.
Once saw back-to-back posts - first was this brand for preamp and that brand for power - next post was exact opposite.
I've come to think that tube rolling is more dumb luck than science, or brand, or tube design.
I know there are different specs for different brands, but right now every tube is coming out of just 2 factories.

Every amp is different, every tube is different, every tone is subjective.
Throw different guitars, pickups, speakers, coily cords, and PEDALS, etc. into the mix and welcome to the asylum.
The tubes I have now are way better than the stock tubes that came with my O20H.
Dead quiet, way more grind when they're crankin' (what I want), and no microphonics.

sorry, too much coffee...


----------



## solarburn

fitz288 said:


> What do you like about it?
> TubeDepot says 12AY7EH are good for reverb circuits & PI but can be microphonic in V1.
> Lower gain factor then 12AX7.
> 
> I put the 803s tubes in all 3 slots because I read somewhere they are good for more gain.
> Then I read somewhere they have less gain than the regular ECC83/12AX7.
> Also read they can be microphonic in V1.
> 
> I've read so many threads about this or that tube brand, and magic combinations of this one here and that one there.
> Once saw back-to-back posts - first was this brand for preamp and that brand for power - next post was exact opposite.
> I've come to think that tube rolling is more dumb luck than science, or brand, or tube design.
> I know there are different specs for different brands, but right now every tube is coming out of just 2 factories.
> 
> Every amp is different, every tube is different, every tone is subjective.
> Throw different guitars, pickups, speakers, coily cords, and PEDALS, etc. into the mix and welcome to the asylum.
> The tubes I have now are way better than the stock tubes that came with my O20H.
> Dead quiet, way more grind when they're crankin' (what I want), and no microphonics.
> 
> sorry, too much coffee...



I've got a 12AY7 in V1 of my Origin 50. You get one that has low microfonics out of the box yer fine.


----------



## solarburn

Only place I buy tubes any more. CS is great! This is what sits so good in V1 of my ORI. I beat the shit volume wise out of mine. Plus tonewise? 5751's are a waste of money. I just retried a high grade one and no. Tone is not there. I prefer the AY7. Especially in the ORIGIN.


https://www.amplifiedparts.com/products/vacuum-tube-12ay7-tube-amp-doctor-highgrade


----------



## speyfly

That tube in the V1 circuit with this amp really tightens up the lows and mid's and takes out any brittle high's. You know I've been really working on getting a great amp tone without pedals and this is by fare the best yet with the E34L's. Now add in just a touch of reverb to give it some dimension, hit the front with a little boost but not too much and it's all there, very close to a plexi tone without getting too loud. Now add in what ever pedals you like.

I took the head in the other day to have it looked at (thought I had a problem), the guys plugged it into a BadCat single 12 and a reverb pedal, they took turns playing and couldn't believe the tone.

This is how I have the amp tuned to get imho awesome cleans and that only Marshall can do crunch. Regarding it being microphonic, not at all. I promise that you will like it, your just gona have to try it.


----------



## solarburn

speyfly said:


> That tube in the V1 circuit with this amp really tightens up the lows and mid's and takes out any brittle high's. You know I've been really working on getting a great amp tone without pedals and this is by fare the best yet with the E34L's. Now add in just a touch of reverb to give it some dimension, hit the front with a little boost but not too much and it's all there, very close to a plexi tone without getting too loud. Now add in what ever pedals you like.
> 
> I took the head in the other day to have it looked at (thought I had a problem), the guys plugged it into a BadCat single 12 and a reverb pedal, they took turns playing and couldn't believe the tone.
> 
> This is how I have the amp tuned to get imho awesome cleans and that only Marshall can do crunch. Regarding it being microphonic, not at all. I promise that you will like it, your just gona have to try it.
> 
> View attachment 101103



You talking about the AY7? I definitely got closer to Plexi like.


----------



## speyfly

solarburnDSL50 said:


> You talking about the AY7? I definitely got closer to Plexi like.



Haven't tried a AY7, might have to do that in the future but for now I'm VERY happy with the AT7, 803S and E34L mix.


----------



## solarburn

speyfly said:


> Haven't tried a AY7, might have to do that in the future but for now I'm VERY happy with the AT7, 803S and E34L mix.



I've used AT7'Z with good results too. I like your thinking and application with that line up. I've used all of them in other amps. And got good results. Clears gain up nicely without creating brittle harsh sounds. Going lighter tube wise in front with the right power tubes creates a nice feel.


----------



## fitz

speyfly said:


> This is how I have the amp tuned to get imho awesome cleans


You get *CLEANS* with settings like this?


Mine would be screaming like it stepped on a Lego in bare feet!
But I like it like that...


----------



## solarburn

fitz288 said:


> You get *CLEANS* with settings like this?
> View attachment 101104
> 
> Mine would be screaming like it stepped on a Lego in bare feet!
> But I like it like that...



on my 50 I have presence maxed. Treble and mids at 2pm. Bass at 9:30am and tilt bout the same. Volume and gain same as you. Into a 412 of GB's. Can roll off to cleans easily. Magic of a lighter tubed front end.


----------



## L Newman

FWIW I get compliments on my tone all the time. Signal chain = Yamaha Revstar 502 and 820 - EHX Soul Food (Vol 10 o'clock, Gain 2 o'c, Tone noon) always on - Origin = Gain 2 o'c Boost on, Tilt noon to max (depending on guitar), Bass max, Mid max, Treble Noon or Max (depends on which guitar), Master 10 0'c, Presence Noon or max (depending on guitar). Distortion managed by guitar volume (with treble bleed). No straight clean. Rhythm tone has a bit of edge on it. Unfortunately, the ways venues are these days I'm more often on mid power setting than max (although it sounds even better on max).


----------



## solarburn

L Newman said:


> FWIW I get compliments on my tone all the time. Signal chain = Yamaha Revstar 502 and 820 - EHX Soul Food (Vol 10 o'clock, Gain 2 o'c, Tone noon) always on - Origin 2 o'c Boost on, Bass max, Mid max, Treble Noon or Max (depends on which guitar), Master 10 0'c, Presence Noon or max (depending on guitar). Distortion managed by guitar volume (with treble bleed). No straight clean. Rhythm tone has a bit of edge on it.



I actually dig how different our settings are. And so is our gear.

Great to see! And the use of guitar volume roll +/-.

Cool techniques here if one looks.


----------



## speyfly

fitz288 said:


> You get *CLEANS* with settings like this?
> View attachment 101104
> 
> Mine would be screaming like it stepped on a Lego in bare feet!
> But I like it like that...



 My cleans are a little edgy, a sweet soft touch with a little growl when hit hard. With this tube mix I can now use the on-board boost which was unusable before.


----------



## solarburn

speyfly said:


> My cleans are a little edgy, a sweet soft touch with a little growl when hit hard. With this tube mix I can now use the on-board boost which was unusable before.



It was too whooly!

I can use it whenever too!

Overall the amp became more musical. Textures dynamics etc...sweet vintage Marshall!


----------



## speyfly

solarburnDSL50 said:


> It was too whooly!
> 
> I can use it whenever too!
> 
> Overall the amp became more musical. Textures dynamics etc...sweet vintage Marshall!



You nailed it!


----------



## solarburn

speyfly said:


> You nailed it!





When your Marshall hits that zone...


----------



## jeffb

IDk about new production but my old JAN GE 5751s sound great in my ORI20H either as a V1 or the PI (but not both). Particularly when using the boost, which is a ratty mess.

That said, the JJ803S is still my fave tube in V1 for it. Clears up the mud, adds a musical nasal grind, and still sounds big/full. I use those in combo with 83S in V2/V3 and E34Ls.

Some of the Sino/Ruby chinese stuff is good too in the pre (the Ruby 12ax7 HG mullard types) I have not liked anything from New Sensor (Mullard, ehx, sovtek, svetlana, etc) in the preamp in mine- I don't like the unnatural/forced sounding compression of new sensor pre's. The Mullard RI's EL34s sound very good though in the amp.

Of course that is with my guitars, pickups, speakers, yadda yadda yadda. When I move into a new home, and get a new place to open her up again, I may prefer something completely different (or my love/hate affair with the amp may get worse).


----------



## fitz

jeffb said:


> the JJ803S is still my fave tube in V1





jeffb said:


> EL34s sound very good though in the amp


This is what works for me.


jeffb said:


> Of course that is with my guitars, pickups, speakers, yadda yadda yadda


This too^^^
Moreso than a preamp tube, the different speakers I have used with my O20H have made a HUGE difference in how the amp behaves.
I love this set-up with my LP/490's or the Hondo w/ on-board preamp grind - not so much with singles on my Strat or Tele(s).
If I only had one guitar, and this was my only amp, I'd probably have a completely different configuration.


----------



## speyfly

It's not rocket science.

*12AX7 VS 12AT7 VS 12AU7: DIFFERENCES EXPLAINED*
The biggest difference between these power tubes is the amount of gain they will provide. The 12AX7 has a gain factor of 100, while the 12AT7 has 60. The 12AU7 has the smallest, at just 20.

The lower gain of the 12AT7 and 12AU7 also allows them to have a higher headroom, which can provide a warmer and cleaner sound.

Good demo-


----------



## scozz

speyfly said:


> It's not rocket science.
> 
> *12AX7 VS 12AT7 VS 12AU7: DIFFERENCES EXPLAINED*
> The biggest difference between these power tubes is the amount of gain they will provide. The 12AX7 has a gain factor of 100, while the 12AT7 has 60. The 12AU7 has the smallest, at just 20.
> 
> The lower gain of the 12AT7 and 12AU7 also allows them to have a higher headroom, which can provide a warmer and cleaner sound.
> 
> Good demo-



Interesting video, I just wish he also included 5751 tubes. (gain factor 70)


----------



## speyfly

Yeah, me to. I think on my next tube order I'll include a couple of the 5751's, can't have too many tubes!


----------



## Gemon

I Guys, I'm a new owner of a fantastic ORI20H
I bought a used 2018 one from a dealer. I tried it at home, it's sound was good but nothing special.
Then I saw it was still equipped with originals tubes, so I decided to change them, following what "suggested" in this forum. My new setting is:
V1 - JJ 5751
V2 - JJ ECC83S
V3 - JJ ECC83S
V4-V5 - E34L
The sound has completely changed and now it's fantastic !


----------



## fitz

Gemon said:


> I Guys, I'm a new owner of a fantastic ORI20H
> I bought a used 2018 one from a dealer. I tried it at home, it's sound was good but nothing special.
> Then I saw it was still equipped with originals tubes, so I decided to change them, following what "suggested" in this forum. My new setting is:
> V1 - JJ 5751
> V2 - JJ ECC83S
> V3 - JJ ECC83S
> V4-V5 - E34L
> The sound has completely changed and now it's fantastic !


 to the forum.
What cab/speakers are you using with your O20H?
If you like the tube changes, you should try an EQ in the loop.


----------



## Gemon

Hi Fitz,
I use a 1922 with G12M greenback's.
The GE-7 EQ is the next step !


----------



## fitz

Gemon said:


> Hi Fitz,
> I use a 1922 with G12M greenback's.
> The GE-7 EQ is the next step !


Nice!
I have a pair of G12M's in a custom cab.
Best speakers I've tried with the O20H.
And I have a GE-7 in the loop.
The Origin behaves differently at different volumes (and power settings).
EQ in the loop lets you fine tune the changes.


----------



## scozz

Gemon said:


> I Guys, I'm a new owner of a fantastic ORI20H
> I bought a used 2018 one from a dealer. I tried it at home, it's sound was good but nothing special.
> Then I saw it was still equipped with originals tubes, so I decided to change them, following what "suggested" in this forum. My new setting is:
> V1 - JJ 5751
> V2 - JJ ECC83S
> V3 - JJ ECC83S
> V4-V5 - E34L
> The sound has completely changed and now it's fantastic !


I’ve used 5751 preamp tubes in V1 in a number of amps, works great taming the gain a bit. I’ve never tried e34L power tubes, but I’ve heard good things about them.


----------



## jeffb

Gemon said:


> I Guys, I'm a new owner of a fantastic ORI20H
> I bought a used 2018 one from a dealer. I tried it at home, it's sound was good but nothing special.
> Then I saw it was still equipped with originals tubes, so I decided to change them, following what "suggested" in this forum. My new setting is:
> V1 - JJ 5751
> V2 - JJ ECC83S
> V3 - JJ ECC83S
> V4-V5 - E34L
> The sound has completely changed and now it's fantastic !



The JJ E34Ls IMO are just about the best change you can make to the ORI20- it adds a much needed natural sounding (vs. overt EQ) low end/deepness to the amp that is lacking because of the tiny iron (vs. 50/100 watt amps). They make the amp sound more like a 50 Watter (still not the same, but better).


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Gemon said:


> I Guys, I'm a new owner of a fantastic ORI20H
> I bought a used 2018 one from a dealer. I tried it at home, it's sound was good but nothing special.
> Then I saw it was still equipped with originals tubes, so I decided to change them, following what "suggested" in this forum. My new setting is:
> V1 - JJ 5751
> V2 - JJ ECC83S
> V3 - JJ ECC83S
> V4-V5 - E34L
> The sound has completely changed and now it's fantastic !




To The Forum 
Congrats on your new amp and getting it to sound the way you want it to 
.
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## Gemon

fitz288 said:


> I have a GE-7 in the loop.


Just a question.
In the loop I already have Delay and Reverb. What do you think is the better position for the GE7 in the loop chain ?


----------



## fitz

Gemon said:


> Just a question.
> In the loop I already have Delay and Reverb. What do you think is the better position for the GE7 in the loop chain ?


I like EQ first in the loop - I have one in every amp with a loop.
Others say put it last.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

I have also heard 1’st delay last


----------



## scozz

jeffb said:


> The JJ E34Ls IMO are just about the best change you can make to the ORI20- it adds a much needed natural sounding (vs. overt EQ) low end/deepness to the amp that is lacking because of the tiny iron (vs. 50/100 watt amps). They make the amp sound more like a 50 Watter (still not the same, but better).


I was thinking about E34L’s when I was considering trying different power tubes, I forgot about them though.

I might give them a try, from your description it sounds like it might be a good match with my SC20, it also lacks a bit of low end because of small iron.

Right now I’m using EH 6CA7’s, and they have added a bit more low end than the Mullard el34’s, so I’m happy about that. But those sound interesting too.


----------



## jeffb

scozz said:


> I was thinking about E34L’s when I was considering trying different power tubes, I forgot about them though.
> 
> I might give them a try, from your description it sounds like it might be a good match with my SC20, it also lacks a bit of low end because of small iron.
> 
> Right now I’m using EH 6CA7’s, and they have added a bit more low end than the Mullard el34’s, so I’m happy about that. But those sound interesting too.



I would imagine they would work well in the 20W 2203 circuit- tame a bit of the high end fizzy/make the treble and presence controls more usable*, and increase the depth of the low end.



* This is why prefer JJ tubes in general- with the new Sensor stuff, and some of the chinese tubes I'm always trying to tame all the high end and brightness and dial things back. With JJs my tone stack becomes usable and I can run my treble and especially the presence, higher.


----------



## jeffb

So I made this video at the end of 2020 right before I packed up my gear and we sold our house and moved. I had forgot about it but found it recently. So I edited out a bunch of my nonsense yapping nobody wants to hear and threw it up on yootoobz.

Origin 20H- G12M25 UK "greenback" is where the cam/mic is sitting. JJE34Ls, 803S in V1 and some ECC 83S in V2/3 (I think, possibly an 83CC in there somewhere) Medium power mode with the boost on (Listening now, I needed to give it a bit more tilt to the treble channel side and some more mids I think). Guitar is my Gibson Slash 50s with stock pickups. Crap playing is all me.


----------



## fitz

jeffb said:


> Origin 20H- G12M25 UK





jeffb said:


> JJE34Ls, 803S in V1


It does do early Zep well.
I've got mostly the same set-up (E34Ls, 803 in V1/2/3, 2xG12M25).
Thanks for the vid.


----------



## C-Grin

jeffb said:


> So I made this video at the end of 2020 right before I packed up my gear and we sold our house and moved. I had forgot about it but found it recently. So I edited out a bunch of my nonsense yapping nobody wants to hear and threw it up on yootoobz.
> 
> Origin 20H- G12M25 UK "greenback" is where the cam/mic is sitting. JJE34Ls, 803S in V1 and some ECC 83S in V2/3 (I think, possibly an 83CC in there somewhere) Medium power mode with the boost on (Listening now, I needed to give it a bit more tilt to the treble channel side and some more mids I think). Guitar is my Gibson Slash 50s with stock pickups. Crap playing is all me.



Sounds pretty good


----------



## jeffb

fitz288 said:


> It does do early Zep well.
> I've got mostly the same set-up (E34Ls, 803 in V1/2/3, 2xG12M25).
> Thanks for the vid.



Right? I just don't get that vid demo someone posted earlier where the guy was saying it doesn't do tones like AC DC/Zep, etc. IME, that is pretty much all the Origin is very good at plugged straight in to the amp. It's not a classic NMV, but its 80% there.


----------



## C-Grin

jeffb said:


> Right? I just don't get that vid demo someone posted earlier where the guy was saying it doesn't do tones like AC DC/Zep, etc. IME, that is pretty much all the Origin is very good at plugged straight in to the amp. It's not a classic NMV, but its 80% there.


I concur


----------



## solarburn

jeffb said:


> So I made this video at the end of 2020 right before I packed up my gear and we sold our house and moved. I had forgot about it but found it recently. So I edited out a bunch of my nonsense yapping nobody wants to hear and threw it up on yootoobz.
> 
> Origin 20H- G12M25 UK "greenback" is where the cam/mic is sitting. JJE34Ls, 803S in V1 and some ECC 83S in V2/3 (I think, possibly an 83CC in there somewhere) Medium power mode with the boost on (Listening now, I needed to give it a bit more tilt to the treble channel side and some more mids I think). Guitar is my Gibson Slash 50s with stock pickups. Crap playing is all me.




That's some sexy tone. I can see some chica's throwing panties on stage over that!

Love the Zep! Sounded great.


----------



## jeffb

solarburnDSL50 said:


> That's some sexy tone. I can see some chica's throwing panties on stage over that!
> 
> Love the Zep! Sounded great.




Solar gave me a panty drop tone comment! 

I have arrived.


----------



## C-Grin

I'm not as picky as I used to be


----------



## jeffb

C-Grin said:


> I'm not as picky as I used to be



thanks for ruining my moment, brother!


----------



## C-Grin

Sorry man is this better


----------



## jeffb

C-Grin said:


> Sorry man is this better



It's in B&W, so I'm hoping this is old. Cos these days, ya never know- may be some dude. But yeah... taken at face value, I'm good with that one !


----------



## solarburn

jeffb said:


> Solar gave me a panty drop tone comment!
> 
> I have arrived.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Great showing of tones @jeffb


----------



## steveb63

Hi
My name is Steve, I have owned a Marshall Origin for over two years, and would like to know how to redeem my chicas?

I mean, are they FedEx, or will Marshall send me a coupon for downloading?

In all seriousness, I only have the 20 watt head, so not expecting more than one or two?


----------



## fitz

steveb63 said:


> Hi
> My name is Steve, I have owned a Marshall Origin for over two years, and would like to know how to redeem my chicas?
> 
> I mean, are they FedEx, or will Marshall send me a coupon for downloading?
> 
> In all seriousness, I only have the 20 watt head, so not expecting more than one or two?


If you know how to use it, they just show up.


----------



## jeffb

Mitchell Pearrow said:


> Great showing of tones @jeffb



Thank you Brother!


----------



## scozz

jeffb said:


> So I made this video at the end of 2020 right before I packed up my gear and we sold our house and moved. I had forgot about it but found it recently. So I edited out a bunch of my nonsense yapping nobody wants to hear and threw it up on yootoobz.
> 
> Origin 20H- G12M25 UK "greenback" is where the cam/mic is sitting. JJE34Ls, 803S in V1 and some ECC 83S in V2/3 (I think, possibly an 83CC in there somewhere) Medium power mode with the boost on (Listening now, I needed to give it a bit more tilt to the treble channel side and some more mids I think). Guitar is my Gibson Slash 50s with stock pickups. Crap playing is all me.



Sounds great as usual Jeff!


----------



## scozz

jeffb said:


> So I made this video at the end of 2020 right before I packed up my gear and we sold our house and moved. I had forgot about it but found it recently. So I edited out a bunch of my nonsense yapping nobody wants to hear and threw it up on yootoobz.
> 
> Origin 20H- G12M25 UK "greenback" is where the cam/mic is sitting. JJE34Ls, 803S in V1 and some ECC 83S in V2/3 (I think, possibly an 83CC in there somewhere) Medium power mode with the boost on (Listening now, I needed to give it a bit more tilt to the treble channel side and some more mids I think). Guitar is my Gibson Slash 50s with stock pickups. Crap playing is all me.



Sounds great as usual Jeff!


----------



## jeffb

scozz said:


> Sounds great as usual Jeff!


Thank you Sir!


----------



## Sputnick60

Has anyone been through the process of up sizing the speaker to a 12'" on the Combo? 
I was looking at the spec sheet of the VT Jr and it is supposed to be 95mm from the baffle to the back of the magnet. To check further, I measured it with a metal ruler and a square and came up with 99mm. Sticking with 99mm there's another 43 mm of height ( depth?) before you get to the metal of the chassis. Adding the two gives 152mm from the Chassis to the Baffle. The speaker is off set in the cabinet which puts the magnet in that area around the transformers, well separated from the valves and nothing else to bump up against. 
So comparing with the G12M we find that trusty unit is spec'ed 130mm deep which means it can fit in the space between the chassis and the baffle leaving something around 22mm. Then its just a matter of enlarging the opening from the specified 245mm to G12M's 283mm. That wouldn't just be a simple matter of routing 19mm off the existing hole because the hole is right at the bottom of the cabinet and speaker edge just about touches the bottom board. The new hole would likely go right up to the Marshall logo. Maybe it wounld be better to just mount a 12 inch and leave the hole alone.
Anyhow, just thinking about it and looking for the pitfalls. Happy to hear comments.
Nicholas


----------



## fitz

Sputnick60 said:


> Has anyone been through the process of up sizing the speaker to a 12'" on the Combo?
> I was looking at the spec sheet of the VT Jr and it is supposed to be 95mm from the baffle to the back of the magnet. To check further, I measured it with a metal ruler and a square and came up with 99mm. Sticking with 99mm there's another 43 mm of height ( depth?) before you get to the metal of the chassis. Adding the two gives 152mm from the Chassis to the Baffle. The speaker is off set in the cabinet which puts the magnet in that area around the transformers, well separated from the valves and nothing else to bump up against.
> So comparing with the G12M we find that trusty unit is spec'ed 130mm deep which means it can fit in the space between the chassis and the baffle leaving something around 22mm. Then its just a matter of enlarging the opening from the specified 245mm to G12M's 283mm. That wouldn't just be a simple matter of routing 19mm off the existing hole because the hole is right at the bottom of the cabinet and speaker edge just about touches the bottom board. The new hole would likely go right up to the Marshall logo. Maybe it wounld be better to just mount a 12 inch and leave the hole alone.
> Anyhow, just thinking about it and looking for the pitfalls. Happy to hear comments.
> Nicholas


I don't have the combo, but the 12" upgrade has been done.
@C-Grin did it - see this thread:





Origin 20 12" speaker swap


Just could not take it anymore and broke out the tools and performed surgery to shoehorn this GB 128 in there, and after some cuttin and hackin it fits. It sounds like it was supposed to be there all along, much better.




www.marshallforum.com




There may be others, try the search function.


----------



## C-Grin

Sputnick60 said:


> Has anyone been through the process of up sizing the speaker to a 12'" on the Combo?
> I was looking at the spec sheet of the VT Jr and it is supposed to be 95mm from the baffle to the back of the magnet. To check further, I measured it with a metal ruler and a square and came up with 99mm. Sticking with 99mm there's another 43 mm of height ( depth?) before you get to the metal of the chassis. Adding the two gives 152mm from the Chassis to the Baffle. The speaker is off set in the cabinet which puts the magnet in that area around the transformers, well separated from the valves and nothing else to bump up against.
> So comparing with the G12M we find that trusty unit is spec'ed 130mm deep which means it can fit in the space between the chassis and the baffle leaving something around 22mm. Then its just a matter of enlarging the opening from the specified 245mm to G12M's 283mm. That wouldn't just be a simple matter of routing 19mm off the existing hole because the hole is right at the bottom of the cabinet and speaker edge just about touches the bottom board. The new hole would likely go right up to the Marshall logo. Maybe it wounld be better to just mount a 12 inch and leave the hole alone.
> Anyhow, just thinking about it and looking for the pitfalls. Happy to hear comments.
> Nicholas


Some have just mounted it over the 10" hole, I cut it out. I just took some wood spacers and pushed the grill cloth out and used a jig saw to open it up. Pretty easy with no drama. I can get a Creamback H in there, it's close but it makes it.


----------



## RV2022

Hello there, I'm a new owner of the 20H, or will be once it arrives.

I'm also a proper Amp newb, as I've only ever recorded Acoustic and Vocals. I'm looking to do some silent recording with it whilst also recording the DI to be reamped at a later date.

I thought it would be as simple as:
[Les Paul] ------> [Focusrite ISA One Digital *DI*] ----- via *amp* connector -----> [OD Pedals] -----> [Origin20H *Input*] ----- via *DI Out *-----> [ISA One *Line Input*] ----- via *spidf out *-----> [Scarlett 6i6 2nd Gen *Spidif In*]
Here's an image of the above:


Spoiler: Chain









However, I hear that you can get a better sound that utilizes the 20H more by going out from the FX Send rather than the DI Out.
If so, is the FX Send a Line Output, like the DI Out, meaning I'd just shift the cable over?

I've also seen some chatter elsewhere that you can further utitize an amp's sound (the power amp section) by going out of the speaker outputs?
Is this true? Those red outputs with the electricity symbols scare me lol

Perhaps there's a completely different way to do it, I dunno, but what's important to me is that I get a dry DI sound of the guitar, for reamping later, and use the sweet ADC of the ISA One Digital for whatever 20H sound I do get.

Any tips?
Cheers


----------



## jeffb

@RV2022 I plug straight into my amps or a couple of pedals straight into the front. I am old fashioned and of absolutely no help to you, sorry.

Welcome to the forum, I'm sure someone else will be along shortly who understands what you are talking about


----------



## scozz

jeffb said:


> @RV2022 I plug straight into my amps or a couple of pedals straight into the front. I am old fashioned and of absolutely no help to you, sorry.
> 
> Welcome to the forum, I'm sure someone else will be along shortly who _*understands what you are talking about.*_


Me too, I’m with you buddy, super low tech here! Lol! I use my amps, real speakers, a small pedal board, and an attenuator. The stuff @RV2022 is talking about, I don’t even know what it is! 

Welcome to the Marshall Forum @RV2022. 

I’m thinking that if the loop send works like an e-out, that might be a better choice than the DI out. I’ve never heard a Marshall e-out or di out that sounds good, or even that sounds “fair”, all the one I’ve tried aren’t worth a shit!


----------



## fitz

DI out is the dreaded emulated.
Send out gets you line level after the preamp.
Speaker out gets the power tubes.
Origin20 does not need a speaker load, but I'm not sure if plugging into the speaker out bypasses the dummy load.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

RV2022 said:


> Hello there, I'm a new owner of the 20H, or will be once it arrives.
> 
> I'm also a proper Amp newb, as I've only ever recorded Acoustic and Vocals. I'm looking to do some silent recording with it whilst also recording the DI to be reamped at a later date.
> 
> I thought it would be as simple as:
> [Les Paul] ------> [Focusrite ISA One Digital *DI*] ----- via *amp* connector -----> [OD Pedals] -----> [Origin20H *Input*] ----- via *DI Out *-----> [ISA One *Line Input*] ----- via *spidf out *-----> [Scarlett 6i6 2nd Gen *Spidif In*]
> Here's an image of the above:
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Chain
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 102579
> 
> 
> 
> 
> However, I hear that you can get a better sound that utilizes the 20H more by going out from the FX Send rather than the DI Out.
> If so, is the FX Send a Line Output, like the DI Out, meaning I'd just shift the cable over?
> 
> I've also seen some chatter elsewhere that you can further utitize an amp's sound (the power amp section) by going out of the speaker outputs?
> Is this true? Those red outputs with the electricity symbols scare me lol
> 
> Perhaps there's a completely different way to do it, I dunno, but what's important to me is that I get a dry DI sound of the guitar, for reamping later, and use the sweet ADC of the ISA One Digital for whatever 20H sound I do get.
> 
> Any tips?
> Cheers


Welcome To The Forum 
Not sure if the FX send is line level or not, but you can unplug the speaker out an achieve your silent recording of a dry signal.
Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## RV2022

Thanks @jeffb @scozz
I'm the same really. My brain is frazzled from all the searching I've been doing. Reckon I've broken my record for number of tabs open multiple times over



fitz288 said:


> DI out is the dreaded emulated.
> Send out gets you line level after the preamp.
> Speaker out gets the power tubes.
> Origin20 does not need a speaker load, but I'm not sure if plugging into the speaker out bypasses the dummy load.



Yea, that last bit about the dummy load is a stumbling block right now. I've emailed Marshall about it.

It not being bypassed would open up more options



Mitchell Pearrow said:


> Welcome To The Forum
> Not sure if the FX send is line level or not, but you can unplug the speaker out an achieve your silent recording of a dry signal.
> Cheers
> Mitch



Cheers. I only have the Amp Head, so there's nothing to unplug ...unless you're talking about me taking a spanner to it and probably electrocuting myself in the process


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

RV2022 said:


> Thanks @jeffb @scozz
> I'm the same really. My brain is frazzled from all the searching I've been doing. Reckon I've broken my record for number of tabs open multiple times over
> 
> 
> 
> Yea, that last bit about the dummy load is a stumbling block right now. I've emailed Marshall about it.
> 
> It not being bypassed would open up more options
> 
> 
> 
> Cheers. I only have the Amp Head, so there's nothing to unplug ...unless you're talking about me taking a spanner to it and probably electrocuting myself in the process


Not trying to get you to do something that would harm you. But you can unplug the speaker out , and not harm your amp, I have had the unfortunate experience of doing this twice now, and no harm to the amp. I am just not sure what the level is coming out of the FX send, but this is how I hook up multiple amps.

Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## SlyStrat

I'm putting a 12" V-Type speaker in my combo when its finally off a container ship somewhere.
I've tried MANY speakers and the V-Type sounds great with my SV.


----------



## fitz

RV2022 said:


> Perhaps there's a completely different way to do it, I dunno, but what's important to me is that I get a dry DI sound of the guitar, for reamping later, and use the sweet ADC of the ISA One Digital for whatever 20H sound I do get.
> 
> Any tips?


The Origin amps get their tone from both the preamp section and power section, and they sound better the more you can push them.
The best way to capture this is through a reactive load interface like a Two Notes Captor, Bad Cat Unleash, or stuff that costs 3x what the amp costs like an OX Box or TAE.
The one thing these solutions don't capture is the added tone you get from driving a speaker with the amp crankin".
You might also consider a mic'ed speaker isolation box.
But if you want a completely dry guitar sound to re-amp later, just skip amp altogether and plug all your gizmos into each other.


----------



## steveb63

^^^^^^^^^^^
Only thing I would add is adding a cab I.R. before my interface, after tapping the line out signal from my attenuators.

I never plug speakers in when doing this, the dummy load, or attenuator handles that end.


----------



## L Newman

We've all read/heard about impending/actual tube shortage. I was curious and went online. The last place I bought (spare) tubes from had sold out. I guessed it was due to supply shortage or high demand caused by anticipated shortage. Anyway, my real question is about tube life in Origin 20C. I use my amp everyday for at least an hour in DI mode for practice. I play out, on average, once a fortnight. But due to venues these days I rarely get the amp beyond the Mid setting and master volume beyond 4. So, I'm assuming that kind of usage isn't putting a great deal of load on the tubes and so should lead to a longer life (eg. twice the life of using the amp at High). Thoughts/comments?


----------



## BRMarshall

I checked SW site the other evening and they did not have 12ax7 or matched EL34 s in stock then. I believe the current low supply is in part due to some folks buying tubes for backups. I play my O20H at home a few times a week at modest volumes and it still has original tube set after a year and a half. Hope they hold out till you can find replacements at a fair price.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

I have had the 50H’s for about 3 years, they don’t get played daily anymore, but I have pushed the living hell out of them.. and no tube failures so far.

Thanks 
Mitch


----------



## SlyStrat

I got my new Origin 20 combo last week. I'm trying to break in the 10" speaker before I decide to change it. I have the SV 1x12 cab for comparison.
I really like this amp with my Weehbo JCM Drive. Bad ass TONE.


----------



## Silverdome

L Newman said:


> We've all read/heard about impending/actual tube shortage. I was curious and went online. The last place I bought (spare) tubes from had sold out. I guessed it was due to supply shortage or high demand caused by anticipated shortage. Anyway, my real question is about tube life in Origin 20C. I use my amp everyday for at least an hour in DI mode for practice. I play out, on average, once a fortnight. But due to venues these days I rarely get the amp beyond the Mid setting and master volume beyond 4. So, I'm assuming that kind of usage isn't putting a great deal of load on the tubes and so should lead to a longer life (eg. twice the life of using the amp at High). Thoughts/comments?



I wonder how much of this tube shortage is just to everyone freaking out and stock piling tubes. The supply can't meet the demand and most of the demand is driven by fear.


----------



## scozz

Silverdome said:


> I wonder how much of this tube shortage is just to everyone freaking out and stock piling tubes. The supply can't meet the demand and most of the demand is driven by fear.


There’s something to be said about this,…


----------



## middy

Silverdome said:


> I wonder how much of this tube shortage is just to everyone freaking out and stock piling tubes. The supply can't meet the demand and most of the demand is driven by fear.


Yup. It’s the toilet paper effect.


----------



## jeffb

Silverdome said:


> I wonder how much of this tube shortage is just to everyone freaking out and stock piling tubes. The supply can't meet the demand and most of the demand is driven by fear.


Some of it is, some of it isn't.

As been mentioned, Shugang, probably the biggest producer of tubes (quantity wise) has been down for a cuple of years.

Then COVID happened- Shipping/Supply chaos and increasing prices for raw materials, became a big problem in EVERY industry. From sporting goods to musical instruments to automobiles. Many pickups , tubes, amps guitars , and other things experienced a massive drop in production or ability to get product on shelves.

Now a major conflict in the exact region where the two biggest remaining guitar tube manufacturers are located. 

I don't blame people one bit for wanting to buy up. These are issues that are not going to just end quickly on a whim with the socio-political situation going on all over the globe. I know some folks like to be dismissive about it, or ignore it because of how the past 30 years post Cold War have gone- but we are entering a new age and the winds of change are blowing strong again.


----------



## Lefty68

Hello everyone. I'm brand new here. I was compelled to register and post because of all the valuable information in this thread. 

What a great community...thank you so much!!!


----------



## fitz

Lefty68 said:


> Hello everyone. I'm brand new here. I was compelled to register and post because of all the valuable information in this thread.
> 
> What a great community...thank you so much!!!


 to the forum.
I'll assume by the thread you've chosen, that you have an Origin20?
Feel free to tell us about yourself here,
More members will see it there than on an amp thread.





Introduce Yourself


New to MarshallForum? Tell us a little bit about yourself and how you found us. :)




www.marshallforum.com


----------



## scozz

Lefty68 said:


> Hello everyone. I'm brand new here. I was compelled to register and post because of all the valuable information in this thread.
> 
> What a great community...thank you so much!!!


Welcome to the Marshall Forum,…


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Lefty68 said:


> Hello everyone. I'm brand new here. I was compelled to register and post because of all the valuable information in this thread.
> 
> What a great community...thank you so much!!!



To The Forum 
We do have our bad sides.. but for the most we are a nice bunch..

Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## BRMarshall

Welcome Lefty68 - good information around here.

Tubes
I haven’t bought a new tube in over a year and have enough for a couple changes on my amps. After the ammo shortage around 2010 eased up, I did a check of consumables that my interests require. Guitar strings and tubes for this pursuit - generally purchased when things were on sale if possible. I live out in the country so a quick trip to the store isn’t quick so I try to plan ahead and have a reasonable reserve of necessities. I haven’t bought any ammo since before the pandemic. 
For those who need tubes, best of luck. I hope you can find what you need without a second mortgage. I’m sitting this market out.


----------



## Lefty68

fitz288 said:


> to the forum.
> I'll assume by the thread you've chosen, that you have an Origin20?
> Feel free to tell us about yourself here,
> More members will see it there than on an amp thread.


Yes- 20c.
Thanks for the heads up-I'll be sure to post in the intro section.


----------



## Moony

Jason did a cool mod again.

Turn your Origin 20 into a proper Plexi:




I think it sounds much better than the stock amp. 

Maybe a good alternative option for some of you guys since the prices for the SV20 Studio Plexi went up in the US.


----------



## fitz

Moony said:


> Jason did a cool mod again.
> 
> Turn your Origin 20 into a proper Plexi:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think it sounds much better than the stock amp.
> 
> Maybe a good alternative option for some of you guys since the prices for the SV20 Studio Plexi went up in the US.



Good Lord! 
He needs to put the Marshall knobs back on...

JK, Jason does amazing things with the Origin.
First an 800 mod, now a Plexi.
Cool stuff if you're into circuit mods.
Pedals work too.


----------



## Moony

fitz288 said:


> He needs to put the Marshall knobs back on...



Reminds me a bit of Friedman amps.


----------



## EJstrat&JVM

Moony said:


> Jason did a cool mod again.
> 
> Turn your Origin 20 into a proper Plexi:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I think it sounds much better than the stock amp.
> 
> Maybe a good alternative option for some of you guys since the prices for the SV20 Studio Plexi went up in the US.



Jason mod, this guy is a genius, not easy to turn the Origin 20 into such a monster.


----------



## RCM 800

he turned it into an ultra gain channel DSL. Sounds less like a plexi than stock. I guess its cool that you can do it but I dont see the point of doing it when there are already amps that do the same thing for a similar price.


----------



## Moony

@burger 

It would be nice to see you modding a DSL20 or even a JVM. 
What do you think about it?


----------



## jeffb

I think it sounds great.

I do think it sounds a bit more modern than an actual Plexi type circuit-maybe somewhere halfway between a NMV and a DSL ( as @RCM 800 mentions ) It's definitely a hot rodded NMV, more "friedman" than "JMP". It seemed pretty thin and not very ballsy until he really got the gain up. A old NMV still is a beast when it's loud but not gainy. 

I'm guessing that mod would make a lot of ORI20 owners happy.


----------



## Moony

jeffb said:


> I think it sounds great.



Certainly better than the stock one!


----------



## fitz

Moony said:


> Certainly better than the stock one!


I like my Origin20H.
It sounds just like an Origin20H. 
Cranked through a pair of greenbacks it can do what I want from it.
With a few pedals, I can make it sound like my other amps.
But then again, if I want a different amp sound, I have other amps...


----------



## C-Grin

I don't really care either way, I have modded just about everything I have ever owned so mod away I say. But if you are going to call something plexi and then proceed to explain how it sounds like a modded version, or how your mod compares to the pre amp on a Variac or how you get extra gain from it, you are not really trying to sound like a "real" plexi are you? Like I said I don't have anything against what he did, but I am with Fits my Or 20 sounds killer and with a couple pedals I can get anything I need. But I would give a modded version a tryout for sure, it dude wants to send me one.


----------



## Moony

fitz288 said:


> I like my Origin20H.
> It sounds just like an Origin20H.



Fair point.
Maybe I should add that's just my personal taste when I say that the modded one sounds better. Thought that was clear anyway.

And of course - a Marshall is a Marshall.
There are also many clips on Youtube that show that you can make the small 20 W studio amps sound very similar to each other.

I'm glad we have all the choices.


----------



## jeffb

Moony said:


> Certainly better than the stock one!


I have a love/hate relationship with mine, but I don't want it to sound more modern. I want it to sound older. So I cannot agree. The mod version just sounds different.


----------



## Moony

I liked how it sounded in the video, that's why I've posted it. 
I personally wouldn't buy an Origin if I wanted more gain. 

But maybe some others here who own that Origin may try that mod (or bring it to a local tech to do it). 

I'm sorry if I offended anyone here, that really wasn't my intenten, rather simply to show what else you can do with the Origin.


----------



## EJstrat&JVM

Moony said:


> I liked how it sounded in the video, that's why I've posted it.
> I personally wouldn't buy an Origin if I wanted more gain.
> 
> But maybe some others here who own that Origin may try that mod (or bring it to a local tech to do it).
> 
> I'm sorry if I offended anyone here, that really wasn't my intenten, rather simply to show what else you can do with the Origin.


To me it's a perfect mod, because it sounds still like a vintage plexi. Usually when you add gain there are side effects like fizz, hum, compression, and from the demo it sounds like the amp doesn't lose any warmth or vintage clarity.


----------



## jeffb

Moony said:


> I liked how it sounded in the video, that's why I've posted it.
> I personally wouldn't buy an Origin if I wanted more gain.
> 
> But maybe some others here who own that Origin may try that mod (or bring it to a local tech to do it).
> 
> I'm sorry if I offended anyone here, that really wasn't my intenten, rather simply to show what else you can do with the Origin.


No offense taken for my part. Just sharing my thoughts.


----------



## Ronquest

Or you can take your O20 mod to the next level.


----------



## Denis St Guinefort

I acquired a Marshall Ori20C last September. I love it however, as others have written, its Celestion isn't the best. However, I discovered that if you plug the 10 speaker with a cab, in my case a Traynor DHX 1X12 (Greenback) using both of the 16 Ohms output (for the 10 and the 12), it does give a great sound. 

I also use a Boss DS-1 which is always on to drive the preamp tubes with the distortion control at a little less than half, ibid for the tone control while I set the level at roughly 2 or 3 O'Clock. I'm mostly a classic rock and heavy blues player. On rhythm, I used my guitar control volume to achieve less drive. It also gives another option if one desires more sustain by activating the Ori20 boost for more sustain and loudness.


----------



## L Newman

Does anyone have any idea of the power output equivalent when in DI mode? (Eg equivalent to the low, medium, high output setting).


----------



## Manco

Not sure what I will say here, but I guess that Lo Mi Hi output only affects the power stage, and the DI output is taken before that. So, the answer could be "none" or/and "all of them". 

Probably the DI is taken from the fase inverter, and I dont think that the power output settinf isnaffecting the fase inverter and preamp.

But again, it is just a suspicion and should be check in the schematic (if there is already one)


----------



## vivanchenko

Back to this thread after a few years. Just came across an interesting video comparing the Studio SC20H and the Origin 20H. The interesting things is that the amps are made using virtually the same components and identical quality pcbs produced at the same factory using the same equipment. There is no any sort of special mojo coming from any magical components in the more expencive model. I think that the only reason why the SC20H costs more is that the pcbs were istalled and wired in the UK.

In my oppinion none of the amps is better or worse. They are just different flaivours of unmistakable Marshall sound. None of them nails the origional amps they were modelled after, both sound just as good.


----------



## scozz

vivanchenko said:


> Back to this thread after a few years. Just came across an interesting video comparing the Studio SC20H and the Origin 20H. The interesting things is that the amps are made using virtually the same components and identical quality pcbs produced at the same factory using the same equipment. There is no any sort of special mojo coming from any magical components in the more expencive model. I think that the only reason why the SC20H costs more is that the pcbs were istalled and wired in the UK.
> 
> In my oppinion none of the amps is better or worse. They are just different flaivours of unmistakable Marshall sound. None of them nails the origional amps they were modelled after, both sound just as good.



Obviously you haven’t played any of the Studio amps.


----------



## Moony

The pcbs and transformers are the same.
The caps are completely different (UK made uses Cornell Dubilier and Samwha caps)
The chassis is slightly different.
The housing is completely different (mdf vs birch plywood)

The circuit and pcb layout are completely different.
That's why an Origin does not sound like a SC20 or SV20.
And that's why Jason offers the mods because he doesn't like the Origin stock very much (at least he fully agreed in the comments of the Origin video Kyle aka Psionic Audio put out).


----------



## vivanchenko

scozz said:


> Obviously you haven’t played any of the Studio amps.


And what exactly makes this obvious to you? I did play both amps. None of them sounds better than the other, just different, each one of them is perfect for slightly or not so slightly diffent things.

My point is that the only reason why the SC costs more is that it was assembled in the UK. It wasn't intentionally designed to sound better than the Origin.

Cheaper amps tend to be criticized more but it doesn’t mean that they necessarily don't sound good. I am pretty sure if the Origin would cost a 1000 dollars more many people would take it as gospel.

I remember I once saw a comparison of one of the classic and venerable Marshals, don't remember exactly which model, vs a Hiwatt. The Hiwatt was crazy shrill, way brighter than the Marshall and it virtually had no low end, but the crowd in the comments had been totally thrilled and everyone raved about how great it is, and how much better it is than the Marshall. Now, imagine what the reaction would have been if it was some sort of a budget amp?

I am saying this to emphasize the obvious truth that tone is subjective. Me? The older I get the cleaner amps I tend to prefer.

See the comparison below. I would never ever guessed that one of the amps costs 1000 dollars more. The SC is a nice amp, and it's a perfectly valid choice for those who are after that tone and so is the Origin for those who preferes what it delivers. I just totally disagree with those who say that the SC sounds better than the Origin. Nope. Just different.


----------



## Moony

vivanchenko said:


> My point is that the only reason why the SC costs more is that it was assembled in the UK.



No, some components are more expensive as is the housing. 



vivanchenko said:


> It wasn't intentionally designed to sound better than the Origin.



The SC20 and the SV20 are classic circuits of the JCM800 and Plexi. 

The Origin is a new designed amp. It was started by Santiago Alvarez and was almost finished when he left Marshall. 
But they changed a lot of things and released a different amp. 
What the Origin was intended to be is somehow related to a 2061 with switchable extra gain, bass, mid and treble and a tilt control and had fx loop, reverb, emulated line out and a 4 position attenuator. 
The single ended Origin5 was kind of similar to the SL5. 
As I've said that's not what Marshall released then. 
You can hear, what he has to say about it in the Tone Talk episode with him.

Please note that the price difference between a SC20H or SV20H and the OR20 is only around 350 Euros here in Europe. So they are not miles apart pricewise. 

In the US however it's a $1100 price difference - and of course that isn't justified. 
I guess the price difference in Australia is the same and that's probably the reason why Jason pointed out these things.


----------



## vivanchenko

Moony said:


> No, some components are more expensive as is the housing.





Moony said:


> No, some components are more expensive as is the housing.


Which components exactly? If you take a closer look at the Origin PCB you will see that it is considerably more complicated and costs more to design and produce.


----------



## Moony

vivanchenko said:


> Which components exactly?



eg the caps. 



vivanchenko said:


> If you take a closer look at the Origin PCB you will see that it is considerably more complicated and costs more to design and produce.



I've watched Kyle's videos so I know how the pcb looks like. 

I get your point - as I've said, a price difference of $1100 isn't justified. 
A price difference of 300 to 350 Euros is. 
Because the Studio amps have a real wood enclosure and are assembled in the UK (and I think the pcbs are populated there too - at least that's what they did with the JVM). 
Producing in Vietnam is a bit cheaper. 

Soundwise everyone has to decide by their own ears which amp they prefer. 
I personally think the Studio amps sound better. 
But that's probably a matter of taste.


----------



## vivanchenko

Moony said:


> eg the caps.



Oh you must be joking. Which caps are you talking about? The caps which matter most for tone are the coupling caps and they are the same in either amp. Filter capacitors? They are very cheep in either amp. About 3 - 6 dollars each for the largest ones. The rest are way cheaper than that. The most expensive caps in the guitar amp building industry are the F&Ts. You only need a few of them and they cost about 15-25 dollars each, but don't worry, they are not used in these amps at all. About 80% of caps in this amps cost approximately 0.5 - 5 US dollars each.

The SC 20 is not even close to the original JCM 800s. The power and output transformers are completely different, power rating is different, no choke (really?). The SC 20 reproduces the flavor of the original JCM 800, but it's not the real deal by far, and we have never even seen proper schematics of either amp.

Also, the Origin heads are made of plywood just like the Studios. See the video in the original post. The cabinets are a different matter. The Studio's cabinet is made of proper plywood whereas the Origin's is not. This advantage only works for combos.


----------



## Moony

vivanchenko said:


> The caps which matter most for tone are the coupling caps and they are the same in either amp.



No they are not.



vivanchenko said:


> The most expensive caps in the guitar amp building industry are the F&Ts.



I'm glad you know F&T caps, they are nice indeed.

You aked I answered. Don't know what's the problem now?
Of course caps are only pennies per amp - but if making thousands that could add up, same thing with other "small" parts like the cheaper golden frontplate - you can also compare the one of the older DSL5C with the one of the newer DSL5CR - everyone (also people who don't play guitar) sees the difference. How much does the frontplate cost? Also pennies... but still they tried to save costs there too.



vivanchenko said:


> The SC 20 is not even close to the original JCM 800s. The power and output transformers are completely different, power rating is different, no choke (really?). The SC 20 reproduces the flavor of the original JCM 800, but it's not the real deal by far, and we have never even seen proper schematics of either amp.



And what does have to do with anything I wrote?
Of course it's not the same as the big one. You don't have to be a genius to see that.
Even running 2x EL34 with a plate voltage in the amp of around only 250 V isn't the real deal.

But who cares if it sounds good?
There are enough people out there who own a real 2203 or 2204 and like the small SC20.
Same with "Plexi" vs SV20.
These things sell like hotcakes in the EU - so Marshall probably did something right there.

The Mini Jube has a choke - just fyi - don't know why they left it out with the SC20 - but maybe you just don't need one in 20W amps.


----------



## Moony

vivanchenko said:


> Also, the Origin heads are made of plywood just like the Studios. See the video in the original post. The cabinets are a different matter. The Studio's cabinet is made of proper plywood whereas the Origin's is not. This advantage only works for combos.



Ok as you've edited that. 
He says the Origin headshells have thinner plywood, an mdf backplate and poor quailty tolex. 
So there you have it. It's not the same as the Studio headshells. 
Of course that doesn't do anything to the sound.


----------



## vivanchenko

Oh you glad I know F&T? Could you, please, drop that patronizing tone? I built 4 Marshal and 1 Fender clones and I didn't use kits. I took the time to personally chose the best components I could find. 3 of those Marshal heads came out perfect the first one was a flop. I am playing them to this day. The only problem with them is that they are way too loud.

Most of the coupling caps in both amps are the same. There is a few of yellows capacitors in the Origin head and only one of them is in the signal path. I am sure that those yellows capacitors where chosen only because they had more appropriate parameters, not because they are cheaper. The best modern metalized polyester film coupling caps, such as Vishay, cost pennies each if you by them wholesale. Is this where your extra hundreds of euros go?


----------



## vivanchenko

Moony said:


> Ok as you've edited that.
> He says the Origin headshells have thinner plywood, an mdf backplate and poor quailty tolex.
> So there you have it. It's not the same as the Studio headshells.


Sorry, the reviewer is wrong. Tolex is not any better or worse in either case. Marshall just used period correct telex. This also tells you that the amps are trying to represent different Marshall eras. They are not supposed to do the same thing.

The Origin head is made of about 2/3" thick plywood. Never saw heads made of thicker plywood. Not even my Traynor combo. At least there is absolutely no need for it to be thicker.


----------



## middy

Sir, this is a Wendy’s.


----------



## Moony

vivanchenko said:


> Sorry, you or the reviewer are wrong. Tolex is not any better or worse in either case. Marshall just used period correct telex. This also tells you that the amps are trying to represent different Marshall eras. They are not supposed to do the same thing.



You may right here. 

As I've said, I agree that the US price difference between Origin 20 and Studio amps is not justified. 
But I think the EU price difference is ok and I see where it comes from.


----------



## Moony

vivanchenko said:


> Oh you glad I know F&T? Could you, please, drop that patronizing tone?



You started it. 



vivanchenko said:


> Most of the coupling caps in both amps are the same. There is a few of yellows capacitors in the Origin head and only one of them is in the signal path. I am sure that those yellows capacitors where chosen only because they had more appropriate parameters, not because they are cheaper. The best modern metalized polyester film coupling caps, such as Vishay, cost pennies each if you by them wholesale. Is this where your extra hundreds of euros go?



No they are not.
Vietnam made Marshalls = yellow, UK made Marshalls = grey.
Both metalized polyester film, but different brands.

And I like the Vishay MKT1813 a lot!

Here's one of my JVMs:







This guy helped me out 








Funny thing is that I have linked that Headfirst video about the Origin vs Studio here before. 
You are not the first one. 
And I did that to show that they are not miles apart. 
And now I can justify myself for what prices Marshall asks in the US - but hey, I have nothing to do with it.
And if I was up to me the amps would be just as cheap in the US as they are in the EU


----------



## fitz

@vivanchenko , @Moony

Tell us about your Origin 20's, and how you use them.
Share some pics, pedal suggestions, speaker pairings, that sort of thing...


----------



## vivanchenko

Same caps used in the Origin and the Studio. Well, most of them. The ones you posted above are not used in Origin at all. Here is the Origin PCB:


----------



## vivanchenko

fitz288 said:


> @vivanchenko , @Moony
> 
> Tell us about your Origin 20's, and how you use them.
> Share some pics, pedal suggestions, speaker pairings, that sort of thing...



You are right


----------



## Moony

@fitz288










vivanchenko said:


> Same caps used in the Origin. Well, most of them. The ones you posted above are not used in Origin at all. Here is the Origin PCB:



I know how the Origin looks like from the inside I have watched Kyle's videos > Klick < 

What I've posted are the pcbs of one of my JVMs.
I swapped the caps for Vishay MKT1813 (these yellow axial caps).
And yes it makes a difference (besides the real value that I've measured before).


----------



## vivanchenko

On a separate note I am happy to see that Marshall stopped using those horible


Moony said:


> @fitz288
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I know how the Origin looks like from the inside I have watched Kyle's videos > Klick <
> 
> What I've posted are the pcbs of one of my JVMs.
> I swapped the caps for Vishay MKT1813 (these yellow axial caps).
> And yes it makes a difference (besides the real value that I've measured before).


Any metalled pollster film caps which are not faulty will sound the same. I used to buy mustards before, until I realized that it's a waste of money.


----------



## Moony

vivanchenko said:


> Any metalled pollster film caps which are not faulty will sound the same. I used to buy mustards before, until I realized that it's a waste of money.



I kindly disagree.
I've tried a lot of different caps in amps and they sometimes have their own voice.

A JVM completely with Sozo Standard sounded very dark, mushy and had boomy low mids - they were that bad in that particular amp that I needed to desolder and replace them (they work nice in a few spots though fe as pi coupling caps).
A JVM completely with Mallory 150s was raspier than with the MKT1813 (the latter are a bit smoother).
(I know that the red stock ones in JVMs are polypropylene but I know how that amp sounds with MKT only.)

If you can do it by yourself it's a no brainer to swap caps (if you know which ones work).
If I had a SC20 I would put in MKT1813 for sure!
But not if I had to bring it to a tech who charges a couple of hundreds Euros for it.

There were nice comparison sound clips on the Metroamp forum years ago where George tried several caps in his Plexi - all measured and the same value - I don't know if they are still available. Worth checking out.

Or this one (though YT compression etc..)




Just for the record: Of course changing values can do even more than changing capacitor brands!


----------



## steveb63

fitz288 said:


> @vivanchenko , @Moony
> 
> Tell us about your Origin 20's, and how you use them.
> Share some pics, pedal suggestions, speaker pairings, that sort of thing...



Perfect.

You win at meme's for today, I busted out.


----------



## Edgar Frog




----------



## vivanchenko

I built amps using the mustards, Mallorys, Sozos, the cheep Chinese caps, Vishays and what not and I never could tell a difference in blind tests. After all, metalized polyester film is metalized polyester film (well, the mustards and Sozos are polyester film and foil). There is absolutely no magic in it. 

The only time when I could feel a difference was when I tried metalized polypropylene caps. Those ones do make a noticeable difference and they are not good for Marshall style amps. The cap videos you are linking mean nothing to me because none of then was shot in controlled conditions. I have first hand experience with all of those caps and I know exactly what I'm talking about. One of the beauty of the hand-wired amps is that you can easily experiment with them to your heart's content without fear of burning the delicate PCBs, and experiment I did. I experimented a lot.

In science no test or comparison is deemed conclusive or even acceptable until Placebo effect is completely ruled out. This is why I only trust blind tests conducted in controlled conditions.


----------



## Moony

vivanchenko said:


> I have first hand experience with all of those caps and I know exactly what I'm talking about.





vivanchenko said:


> I experimented a lot.




Same here. 
Cheers!


----------



## vivanchenko

Moony said:


> Same here.
> Cheers!


Buy the way, I also watched that tech video you linked and it looks like the guy is simply prejudiced against the amp and he is simply bashing it without any good reason. After watching all videos I am 100% convinced that they had been payed for by Marshall competition, because the guy is also bashing Marshall relentlessly.

Can you, please, explain to me what on earth he means by "out of phase signal" at the input stage? There is absolutely nothing there what can possibly be out of phase. To be out of phase you need as a minimum two alternating signals. One is the instrument signal. What's the other?

We all know that amps are powered using constant current (B+) which doesn't have any phases, right? So, one alternating signal is the instrument signal, what's the other? What is it that the instrument signal is out of phase with?

Honestly, the guy has no idea what he is talking about. It's just a heap of baloney. Also, how he can be so confident that something is "out of phase" with something without ever using an oscilograph? This is impossible!


----------



## Moony

@vivanchenko 

Please ask him and not me. 
Or Jason from Headfirst Amplification as he commented on Part 4 and said _"I agree with everything you set out here!"_
I mean you obviously watch his videos too as you've posted one.

I'm a bit tired of explaining things other people have said or done. 
Or even justifying myself for just mentioning it. 

PS: Kyle is not bashing Marshall - he also said that the DSL40 is one of the best amps to buy for under 1000 bucks. > Klick <


----------



## vivanchenko

Moony said:


> @vivanchenko
> 
> Please ask him and not me.
> Or Jason from Headfirst Amplification as he commented on Part 4 and said _"I agree with everything you set out here!"_
> I mean you obviously watch his videos too as you've posted one.
> 
> I'm a bit tired of explaining things other people have said or done.
> Or even justifying myself for just mentioning it.
> 
> PS: Kyle is not bashing Marshall - he also said that the DSL40 is one of the best amps to buy for under 1000 bucks. > Klick <


I was under impression you understand how tube amps work. Now I see that you and that guy Kyle obviously don’t. The only place where a signal can be out of phase is phase inverter and that is at the opposite end of the amp. Up to that point we are dealing with one alternating signal only and it is absolutely impossible for it to be out of phase with itself!!!

Also, the guy says pointing to V1 pins that there is a signal blending from pin A to pin B... What? Whaaaat? What kind of an amp tech refers to tube pins as A and B? Most importantly such "bleeding" is physically impossible to occer. Each pin has it's own standardized number and guitar techs know them better than the names of their wives and they always differentiate the pins by those numbers. Ever seen a tube data sheet?

Also, what "blending" is he talking about? If you listen to that guy you'd think that the Origin is bleeding like a bitch. This is the first tech I ever listened to who is talking about some kind of "signal bleeding" in a guitar amp, and I heard a lot. He says the Origing is "bleeding" because of how poorly Marshall desisigned it... And he Kyle, unlike Marshall engineers can undestendnd it. What a great guy Kyle is, shame on you, Marshal engineers!

If you had any idea of how a tube amp works you would imidiately understand how deeply absurd is most of what he's saying. How can he tell that there is a voltage "bleeding" without ever touching a voltmeter or any other instrument for that matter? This is simply absurd.

I did leave a comment under that video, but I am pretty sure that he will not want to talk about it.


----------



## Moony

@vivanchenko 

Oh I'm sorry. 
I made a mistake. 
His name is Lyle not Kyle. 

PS: 
For me it matters most how an amp sounds like.
If I don't like how an amp sounds I just don't buy it.


----------



## rolijen

vivanchenko said:


> Also, the guy says pointing to V1 pins that there is a signal blending from pin A to pin B... What? Whaaaat? What kind of an amp tech refers to tube pins as A and B?


He’s referring to a dual triode 12AX7 (ECC83). A and B denote the two triodes. He knows which pins are for plate, grid, cathode and heater by heart. Just as you do. This guy knows what he’s talking about.


----------



## vivanchenko

rolijen said:


> He’s referring to a dual triode 12AX7 (ECC83). A and B denote the two triodes. He knows which pins are for plate, grid, cathode and heater by heart. Just as you do. This guy knows what he’s talking about.
> View attachment 109688


A and B don't refer to any specific pin. Pin numbers do and amp techs know them very well. Regardless, most techs whould refer to the specific pins by their function, such as cathode, greed, etc which the guy does do, but how the signal can possibly "bleed" from A to B? What he even means by "bleeding"? What it has to do with how Marshall designed the amp? How can he tell that such bleeding does occer? How can he tell that there is any voltage bleeding without ever touching a voltmeter?

Whenever I listen to any real techs I can undestendnd perfectly well everything, I mean everything, what they say. What this guy says is 90% baloney, nonsense, abra cadabra, hogwash.


----------



## fitz

I had to un-watch this thread.
Tied of getting notices about your pissing match.
Neither one of you even have an Origin20...
smh


----------



## vivanchenko

fitz288 said:


> I had to un-watch this thread.
> Tied of getting notices about your pissing match.
> Neither one of you even have an Origin20...
> smh


You made me lough because I do own the Origin 20 H and I am even more tired of baseless bashing of the amp.


----------



## Edgar Frog

I love my ORI20H and IMHO it sounds great no matter what the price. There's nothing wrong with the design of these amps. You either like them or not, the same goes for every single amp known to man. Please just stop going round with each other before this thread gets closed like the last thread this was going on in. I may not post in here often but I do enjoy it since I do own one and like reading and listening to things associated with it.


----------



## fitz

vivanchenko said:


> You made me lough because I do own the Origin 20 H and I am even  more tired of baseless bashing of the amp.


My apologies.
I guess it's just @Moony that's an Origin basher.
IIRC he said he tried one once, so...


----------



## vivanchenko

fitz288 said:


> My apologies.
> I guess it's just @Moony that's an Origin basher.
> IIRC he said he tried one once, so...


No problem, absolutely.


----------



## Moony

fitz288 said:


> I had to un-watch this thread.
> Tied of getting notices about your pissing match.





fitz288 said:


> I guess it's just @Moony that's an Origin basher.
> IIRC he said he tried one once, so...





vivanchenko said:


> absolutely.




Hello?
I replied to @vivanchenko post and said that the Origin and Studio are not built in the same factories (UK vs Vietnam) and that the materials and components they use are not completely the same.
So it's quite normal, that the UK made Studio amps are a bit more expensive. And I think 300 Euros more is ok.
The US price difference however is not justified, I've already said that before and I'm sorry for you guys in the US that Marshall prices have increased that much.
So what's wrong with that?

I'm not one of the both respected amp techs who made videos and said that the Origin 20 has flaws and sounds bad therefore.
If you disagree with them and think you know better, go to their channels and speak up there.
I just put a link of one video here, because I was told that I don't know how the Origin pcb looks like and that it does use the same caps as the Studio which isn't true.


Please accept that no amp can please everyone and tastes are different.
And please stop with your personal attacks and accusations and focus on the amp itself.


----------



## fitz

Moony said:


> I'm not one of the both respected amp techs who said that the Origin 20 has flaws and sounds bad therefore.
> If you disagree with them and think you know better, go to their channels and speak up there.


I don't care who they are, and what they think.
I want to know what you think of YOUR Origin20 (see thread title).
If you don't have an Origin20, why do you feel the need to keep posting to this thread?


Moony said:


> please stop with your personal attacks and accusations and* focus on the amp itself.*


My point exactly.
Please stop with the biased YT vid links to support your personally unsubstantiated opinions.


----------



## Moony

fitz288 said:


> If you don't have an Origin20, why do you feel the need to keep posting to this thread?



that's why: 



Moony said:


> I replied to @vivanchenko post and said that the Origin and Studio are not built in the same factories (UK vs Vietnam) and that the materials and components they use are not completely the same.
> So it's quite normal, that the UK made Studio amps are a bit more expensiv






fitz288 said:


> My point exactly.
> Please stop with the biased YT vid links to support your personally unsubstantiated opinions.



I'm not the one who's attacking other forum members here and accuse them of something.
See, you did it again. 

How do you know how much experience I have with the Origin? 
And maybe it's the reason that I don't posted a long personal "review" here of that amp because I don't wanted to offend anyone who likes that amp?
Because it seems that it isn't possible to share your own honest findings and not being insulted then. Think about it.


----------



## fitz

Moony said:


> Think about it.


I promise to never insult you again.
In fact, after about another 30 seconds, I'll never see your posts again...


----------



## Moony

fitz288 said:


> I promise to never insult you again.
> In fact, after about another 30 seconds, I'll never see your posts again...



Thanks, I appreciate that!


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

Wow what an epic ending 


Cheers


----------



## C-Grin

I’m actually sorta disappointed, there were a couple of haymakers thrown but nobody got an ear bit off


----------



## jeffb




----------



## Edgar Frog

C-Grin said:


> I’m actually sorta disappointed, there were a couple of haymakers thrown but nobody got an ear bit off


----------



## Edgar Frog

Seriously though.


----------



## C-Grin

Edgar Frog said:


> Seriously though.



Hahaha


----------



## vivanchenko

Moony said:


> Hello?
> I replied to @vivanchenko post and said that the Origin and Studio are not built in the same factories (UK vs Vietnam) and that the materials and components they use are not completely the same.
> So it's quite normal, that the UK made Studio amps are a bit more expensive. And I think 300 Euros more is ok.
> The US price difference however is not justified, I've already said that before and I'm sorry for you guys in the US that Marshall prices have increased that much.


Moony, I never said that the Studio is not "built" in the UK. I said that it was assembled in the UK using PCBs and transformers built at the same factory from the same materials using the same manufacturing process as for the Origins.

How many PCB manufacturing facilities do you think Marshall have? Do you think Marshall manufactures these PCBs in different factories?




The components are not identical. They can't possibly be identical for different schematics. Coupling caps (the grey ones) are the same, same resistors, same diodes, pilot lights, switches...

Actually, I much prefer construction of the Origin. They used the proper large CTS pots for them instead of those stupid tiny plastic thingies I always hated. A huge plus as compared with the Studio! It's one of the key components. They used the same plastic POS pots for most of their recent budget amps. They also use them in their top of the line...This alone would make me chose the Origin if build quality was a decisive consideration.

Also, Origin's chassis have sidewalls, which makes it much harder to bend them out of shape if somebody drops it. The Origin actually looks like the better build quality as compared to the Studio.

By the way, I am no longer an Origin 20 owner. I swapped it for the 50 watt model. Still love the 20. I only preferred the 50 watt model because it has more clean headroom. I would have them both if I could.

Cheers.


----------



## Moony

vivanchenko said:


> Moony, I never said that the Studio is not "built" in the UK. I said that it was assembled in the UK using PCBs and transformers built at the same factory from the same materials using the same manufacturing process as for the Origins.
> 
> How many PCB manufacturing facilities do you think Marshall have? Do you think Marshall manufactures these PCBs in different factories?



I know what you've written.
And I haven't said that the pcbs are from different factories.

The components are. Different coupling caps, different filter caps, partially different resistors etc.. I bet there are a whole lot of other smaller parts, that are not the same.
You say the UK amps were just "assembled" in the UK. But afaik they have machines in the UK to even populate the pcbs - that's not "assembling" to me. They were shown in factory tours available on Youtube.

Of course most of the parts are made in China. But it does make a difference to the final price if you produce/build an amp in the UK vs Vietnam. I don't know why that is hard to understand?
And don't forget different materials for the headshells and cabs (and cheaper speakers) - as you've stated the cabs are mdf vs plywood (UK), within the Origin line the backplate of the headshells seems mdf and the rest thinner plywood (that's what Jason said in the video you've posted when he meant the Origin headshells are much lighter).

I know I sound like a broken record: I personally see why a UK made Marshall of the Studio line costs more than a Vietnam made Origin 20.
Please note that I haven't made the prices and I'm no Marshall employee.




vivanchenko said:


> By the way, I am no longer an Origin 20 owner. I swapped it for the 50 watt model. Still love the 20. I only preferred the 50 watt model because it has more clean headroom. I would have them both if I could.



Have fun with your new amp!
If you like to mod it, there are also some nice Headfirst mods out there - 3 different ones iirc, "Plexi", "800" and "Jose".


----------



## vivanchenko

Moony said:


> Have fun with your new amp!
> If you like to mod it, there are also some nice Headfirst mods out there - 3 different ones iirc, "Plexi", "800" and "Jose".


I will. Thank you. I might feel like modding the amp sometime down the road. As of now I like cleanish amps and the Origin has some of the best cleans I ever heard from a Marshall. I believe the amp had been inspired by the JTM more than by anything else, though it's not nearly as boomy as the JTMs which had a lot of low end which most people didn't care for. The later models of the JTM had SS rectifiers. Jimi Hendrix's JTM 100 had a ss rectifier. Also Marshall service centres back then converted tube rectifiers to solid state. I remember I saw an old Marshall promo poster which advertised the JTM as the cleanest amp on the market


----------



## mspart

Really enjoying my Origin 20H. I bought a fuzz box and it really makes the amp sound sweet. I put a delay on the signal too but it ate my battery in about 10 minutes. I need to get an adapter so I can run that thing. 

Mostly playing old UFO songs. I have always liked them and rediscoverd them about a year ago. I just play in the house. I have to say the 20 watt setting is very loud, surprisingly loud. I normally play on the lower setting so my wife doesn't disown me. 

mspart


----------



## Sputnick60

Origin 20 Face Plate Corrosion.
I'm kinda bummed out that the face plate on my less-than-2-years-old Origin 20 combo is showing ugly traces of corrosion. Has anyone else had that happen to their amp?
Nicholas
​


----------



## RCM 800

Sputnick60 said:


> Origin 20 Face Plate Corrosion.
> I'm kinda bummed out that the face plate on my less-than-2-years-old Origin 20 combo is showing ugly traces of corrosion. Has anyone else had that happen to their amp?
> Nicholas
> ​


mine spent all winter in a shipping container and didnt get any corrosion. That looks like something acidic got spilled or sprayed on it.


----------



## steveb63

Sputnick60 said:


> Origin 20 Face Plate Corrosion.
> I'm kinda bummed out that the face plate on my less-than-2-years-old Origin 20 combo is showing ugly traces of corrosion. Has anyone else had that happen to their amp?
> Nicholas
> ​


Starting on mine.

I've had it a couple of years, and it's been ridden hard so........


----------



## fitz

Sputnick60 said:


> Origin 20 Face Plate Corrosion.
> I'm kinda bummed out that the face plate on my less-than-2-years-old Origin 20 combo is showing ugly traces of corrosion. Has anyone else had that happen to their amp?
> Nicholas
> ​


Mine's about 2 yrs. old - looks like new.
But it sits in my temp & humidity controlled living room in western PA.
Do you live in a salt air environment near the coast, or haul it around to gigs/ jams?


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

@Sputnick60 
I have had my Origin 50H for a little over 3 years now, it sits on the top of a full stack of MG cabs in the garage here in SoCal, and I have not seen anything like your pic happening.


----------



## MarshallDog

I’ve had my 50c for 4 plus years and nothing!


----------



## steveb63

fitz288 said:


> Mine's about 2 yrs. old - looks like new.
> But it sits in my temp & humidity controlled living room in western PA.
> Do you live in a salt air environment near the coast, or haul it around to gigs/ jams?


In all fairness mine was at our rehearsal space.

An un- air conditioned mobile home turned into a studio, in Phoenix, Az Lol

The only cooling we have is a swamp cooler, that turns a 100 degree room into a 100 degree room with 80% humidity ha!

I'm sure that's why mine is a little "cloudy" in some spots.


----------



## scozz

Edgar Frog said:


> Seriously though.



I’ve never seen this,… that’s hilarious!!! I was watching the fight when it happened!!


I’m wondering if any of the youngsters here understand this?!


----------



## Sputnick60

fitz288 said:


> Mine's about 2 yrs. old - looks like new.
> But it sits in my temp & humidity controlled living room in western PA.
> Do you live in a salt air environment near the coast, or haul it around to gigs/ jams?


Mine stays at home next to the sofa all the time. It hasn't moved since I bought it. It sometimes gets dusted with a dry cloth. I'm in a coastal city ( like 90% of the world population) but there's no surf around that would blow salt into the air. The car sits outside and doesn't suffer like the indoor amp.


----------



## Ufoscorpion

Sputnick60 said:


> Mine stays at home next to the sofa all the time. It hasn't moved since I bought it. It sometimes gets dusted with a dry cloth. I'm in a coastal city ( like 90% of the world population) but there's no surf around that would blow salt into the air. The car sits outside and doesn't suffer like the indoor amp.


Send it back it’s got a 5year warranty.


----------



## scozz

vivanchenko said:


> And what exactly makes this obvious to you? I did play both amps. None of them sounds better than the other, just different, each one of them is perfect for slightly or not so slightly diffent things.
> 
> My point is that the only reason why the SC costs more is that it was assembled in the UK. It wasn't intentionally designed to sound better than the Origin.
> 
> Cheaper amps tend to be criticized more but it doesn’t mean that they necessarily don't sound good. I am pretty sure if the Origin would cost a 1000 dollars more many people would take it as gospel.
> 
> I remember I once saw a comparison of one of the classic and venerable Marshals, don't remember exactly which model, vs a Hiwatt. The Hiwatt was crazy shrill, way brighter than the Marshall and it virtually had no low end, but the crowd in the comments had been totally thrilled and everyone raved about how great it is, and how much better it is than the Marshall. Now, imagine what the reaction would have been if it was some sort of a budget amp?
> 
> I am saying this to emphasize the obvious truth that tone is subjective. Me? The older I get the cleaner amps I tend to prefer.
> 
> See the comparison below. I would never ever guessed that one of the amps costs 1000 dollars more. The SC is a nice amp, and it's a perfectly valid choice for those who are after that tone and so is the Origin for those who preferes what it delivers. I just totally disagree with those who say that the SC sounds better than the Origin. Nope. Just different.



Well, if you have played both amps and you still think what you think, then you’re just saying stupid $hit!


----------



## MarshallDog

Ufoscorpion said:


> Send it back it’s got a 5year warranty.


Good point!


----------



## scozz

scozz said:


> Well, if you have played both amps and you still think what you think, then you’re just saying stupid $hit!


Yeah that’s not good, musta been having a bad day, no excuse though,…


----------



## MarshallDog

scozz said:


> Well, if you have played both amps and you still think what you think, then you’re just saying stupid $hit!



Hes just saying there’s no real reason why one should cost more than the other, only difference is one is built in the Uk and they are both great sounding amps different in their on ways. Hell, if you think about it the O should cost more seeing as it has more parts and circuits, boost and the power scaling circuits!?


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

I've been hankering for a vox, but an AC30 is way overkill for my needs and the little AC4's lack reverb or an fx loop to add one in.
I came across someone selling Yellow Jacket converters w/el84's for about the same price as just the valves (specifically the non-power reducing, <20w power, low profile version) so thought I'd experiment to see if the Origin could get a bit voxy.
Short answer is it makes it a bit voxy but still more like the origin than an AC. I'm using Celestion T75's which probably isn't helping.


----------



## jeffb

OriginOfTheSpecies said:


> I've been hankering for a vox, but an AC30 is way overkill for my needs and the little AC4's lack reverb or an fx loop to add one in.
> I came across someone selling Yellow Jacket converters w/el84's for about the same price as just the valves (specifically the non-power reducing, <20w power, low profile version) so thought I'd experiment to see if the Origin could get a bit voxy.
> Short answer is it makes it a bit voxy but still more like the origin than an AC. I'm using Celestion T75's which probably isn't helping.


Try the current AC10 if you are looking for an affordable, decent , Vox sound.


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

jeffb said:


> Try the current AC10 if you are looking for an affordable, decent , Vox sound.


Yeah those look great


----------



## PaulHikeS2

OriginOfTheSpecies said:


> I've been hankering for a vox, but an AC30 is way overkill for my needs and the little AC4's lack reverb or an fx loop to add one in.
> I came across someone selling Yellow Jacket converters w/el84's for about the same price as just the valves (specifically the non-power reducing, <20w power, low profile version) so thought I'd experiment to see if the Origin could get a bit voxy.
> Short answer is it makes it a bit voxy but still more like the origin than an AC. I'm using Celestion T75's which probably isn't helping.


Yeah, I have an AC4 and it sounds nice, but you're right. But what about an AC15? Man, those are nice. I'm trying to decide between that and the Origin 20H.


----------



## OriginOfTheSpecies

PaulHikeS2 said:


> Yeah, I have an AC4 and it sounds nice, but you're right. But what about an AC15? Man, those are nice. I'm trying to decide between that and the Origin 20H.


Yeah I think longer term I'll get a real vox.
I'll keep the Origin though - it's so useful as a base. I use it as a straight up rock amp (when I can get loud), a clean platform for pedals, or an EL34 or whatever octals will fit power amp for preamps.


----------



## Sputnick60

Good news on the rusty front panel. I wrote to Marshall with all the information (serial purchase date and dealer) and a response came from the local agent who arranged a replacement for the partial cost of shipping from the UK to New Zealand. $25 NZD (about $15 USD) I can pick it up at the store on the weekend.


----------



## Sputnick60

Sputnick60 said:


> Good news on the rusty front panel. I wrote to Marshall with all the information (serial purchase date and dealer) and a response came from the local agent who arranged a replacement for the partial cost of shipping from the UK to New Zealand. $25 NZD (about $15 USD) I can pick it up at the store on the weekend.


I installed the replacement parts. All the nuts unscrewed from the front except the lamp. 
I tugged on the spade connector for the lamp but, as tiny as it is, it gripped with astonishing force. When it did let go my hand accelerated away and I tore the wire out of the crimp. This was fixed with a replacement crimp but on closer inspection I learned the error was unnecessary since white plastic back half can unscrew from the chrome bezel.
Here is a couple of photos for you…



Nicholas


----------



## Sputnick60

I added a smudge of carnuba wax to protect the surface and hopefully it will be more durable. 
Nicholas


----------



## Xenrelic

I've had few Origin 20H and 50H come my way and boy are those fun to mod into high gain monsters. You can do all sorts of cool things with them! The next one I do is going to be a 4 gain stage version, converting the cathode follower into an extra gain stage for even higher gain output that can still clean up nice. I might even have it, so that it switches out 2 gain stages for a nice foot switchable clean channel.


----------



## Xenrelic

If anyone wants a different color indicator lamp for their Origin, I've been making custom colors with the clear dome versions and I've also been getting good results just dyeing the stock amber dome versions and replacing the leds. 

The recipe for the dye is 2 parts boiling water taken off the stove to cool for a minute, 1 part Acetone and Rit Synthetic Dye for plastics added in to taste. The more dye you add in, the stronger the color. The longer you leave the dome in the solution, the darker the color gets. It only needs about 1-10 minutes of dyeing to get cool results and you can experiment on pieces of clear plastic to get the routine down before you try dyeing the dome itself. The hot water opens the pores of the plastic, so it holds the dye in like a tattoo after it cools down.

The domes easily unscrew from the assembly as well as the led and you can replace the led with pretty much any color 5mm you want, as long as you add the appropriate dropping resistor for 12v operation on one leg of the led. The resistor value and size can be calculated based on how bright you want it with an led calculator online from 5mA-20mA in brightness.

You can buy the clear dome white led assembly straight from FILN for under $5. They also sell Red, Blue and Green IP67 12v 10mm versions if you don't want to hassle with dyeing your own dome and changing the led out. 








Purchase link for the replacement FILN indicators: here


----------



## Xenrelic

Didn't get a chance to do a proper demo, but here's my buddy Sam Pura dialing in a modded Origin head on the high gain mode while we were getting it ready to make a plugin version of it. I'll try to get a proper recorded demo with actual playing in the future.


----------



## heavypic

Hey all - 

Well I'm kind of late to the party but after mulling over the Origin 20 head for the past year or so...and watching the price increases...I finally did the deal for a new one at a decent discount from an online vendor. I ordered the Peavey 212-6 Cab (two Greenback 25s) to go along with it. The Peavey is nice with the Greenbacks, all-plywood construction and optional, removable open-back panel, and mono/stereo input options, 16 and 8ohm respectively.

After my first long session with this set up, I really like what the Origin 20H delivers. I was able to play at full power setting (master at 4-6, gain at 4-6, guitar vols at 8) with the cab on a 10ft cord across an 18x18 room without abusing my hearing. I play blues and classic rock and plugged in my LP Special w/P90s...couldn't find a bad setting with that combo...clean or dirty...LOL!! The amp has good clean and moderate distortion tones and responsive controls that really help to shape the tone you're after. I played direct into the amp and also with a Keely modded TS-808 and a stock Boss OD-3. Both pedals sounded great through the amp...but I may be partial to the TS-808 for blues/rock tones...the OD-3 seems suited for classic rock tones. Allmans, Creme, ZZ, Mountain, AC/DC...all there...!! Gonna try the Strats (S/S/S) and LPs (H-H) next time. I'm guessing they'll sound great too! Seems like a very good and versatile amp! We'll see how the honeymoon goes...LOL!!

Not sure I'm missing reverb...most of my other amps are Fenders with spring reverb. I may need a reverb pedal for just a small touch. I have an old Boss GT-3 multi-pedal I may try in the loop.

Anyway...thanks to y'all for the inspiration to finally make this purchase. My first Marshall amp...!!

Regards


----------



## steveb63

heavypic said:


> Hey all -
> 
> Well I'm kind of late to the party but after mulling over the Origin 20 head for the past year or so...and watching the price increases...I finally did the deal for a new one at a decent discount from an online vendor. I ordered the Peavey 212-6 Cab (two Greenback 25s) to go along with it. The Peavey is nice with the Greenbacks, all-plywood construction and optional, removable open-back panel, and mono/stereo input options, 16 and 8ohm respectively.
> 
> After my first long session with this set up, I really like what the Origin 20H delivers. I was able to play at full power setting (master at 4-6, gain at 4-6, guitar vols at 8) with the cab on a 10ft cord across an 18x18 room without abusing my hearing. I play blues and classic rock and plugged in my LP Special w/P90s...couldn't find a bad setting with that combo...clean or dirty...LOL!! The amp has good clean and moderate distortion tones and responsive controls that really help to shape the tone you're after. I played direct into the amp and also with a Keely modded TS-808 and a stock Boss OD-3. Both pedals sounded great through the amp...but I may be partial to the TS-808 for blues/rock tones...the OD-3 seems suited for classic rock tones. Allmans, Creme, ZZ, Mountain, AC/DC...all there...!! Gonna try the Strats (S/S/S) and LPs (H-H) next time. I'm guessing they'll sound great too! Seems like a very good and versatile amp! We'll see how the honeymoon goes...LOL!!
> 
> Not sure I'm missing reverb...most of my other amps are Fenders with spring reverb. I may need a reverb pedal for just a small touch. I have an old Boss GT-3 multi-pedal I may try in the loop.
> 
> Anyway...thanks to y'all for the inspiration to finally make this purchase. My first Marshall amp...!!
> 
> Regards


Congratulations on the new gear.

IMO, of course, my opinion only....... the Origin 20 and Greenbacks are an unbeatable combo.

Sounds, to me, like that amp was designed with a Greenback "type" speaker in mind.

Throw in a boost/ overdrive, that's some great rock n roll to be made.

Anyway, I guess I will be the first to say........... Got any gear pics?

Peace
Steve


----------



## steveb63

Oh yeah, almost forgot.

Got to throw an E.Q. in the loop as well.

I know my brotha @fitz would have been along shortly, wanted to save him some typing!


----------



## fitz

steveb63 said:


> Oh yeah, almost forgot.
> 
> Got to throw an E.Q. in the loop as well.
> 
> I know my brotha @fitz would have been along shortly, wanted to save him some typing!


O20H
Greenbacks
GE-7 in the loop  
Hit the front end with an SD-1
Apply volume for tonal bliss


----------



## steveb63

fitz said:


> O20H
> Greenbacks
> GE-7 in the loop
> Hit the front end with an SD-1
> Apply volume for tonal bliss


Fore ever known as the "Origin Recipe".

Giving you full credit of course.

It just works.


----------



## Edgar Frog

heavypic said:


> Hey all -
> 
> Well I'm kind of late to the party but after mulling over the Origin 20 head for the past year or so...and watching the price increases...I finally did the deal for a new one at a decent discount from an online vendor. I ordered the Peavey 212-6 Cab (two Greenback 25s) to go along with it. The Peavey is nice with the Greenbacks, all-plywood construction and optional, removable open-back panel, and mono/stereo input options, 16 and 8ohm respectively.
> 
> After my first long session with this set up, I really like what the Origin 20H delivers. I was able to play at full power setting (master at 4-6, gain at 4-6, guitar vols at 8) with the cab on a 10ft cord across an 18x18 room without abusing my hearing. I play blues and classic rock and plugged in my LP Special w/P90s...couldn't find a bad setting with that combo...clean or dirty...LOL!! The amp has good clean and moderate distortion tones and responsive controls that really help to shape the tone you're after. I played direct into the amp and also with a Keely modded TS-808 and a stock Boss OD-3. Both pedals sounded great through the amp...but I may be partial to the TS-808 for blues/rock tones...the OD-3 seems suited for classic rock tones. Allmans, Creme, ZZ, Mountain, AC/DC...all there...!! Gonna try the Strats (S/S/S) and LPs (H-H) next time. I'm guessing they'll sound great too! Seems like a very good and versatile amp! We'll see how the honeymoon goes...LOL!!
> 
> Not sure I'm missing reverb...most of my other amps are Fenders with spring reverb. I may need a reverb pedal for just a small touch. I have an old Boss GT-3 multi-pedal I may try in the loop.
> 
> Anyway...thanks to y'all for the inspiration to finally make this purchase. My first Marshall amp...!!
> 
> Regards


Happy new amp/cab day! 

I'm a fan of the peavey cabs too with my ORI20H. I have 2 of the 112-6 1x12 Greenback cabs and think they're great. I run them in closed back configuration.


----------



## scozz

heavypic said:


> …………Not sure I'm missing reverb...most of my other amps are Fenders with spring reverb. I may need a reverb pedal for just a small touch. I have an old Boss GT-3 multi-pedal I may try in the loop.
> 
> Anyway...thanks to y'all for the inspiration to finally make this purchase. My first Marshall amp...!!
> 
> Regards


Try a delay pedal in the loop instead of reverb, and try an eq pedal too. An eq pedal in the loop makes virtually every Marshall amplifier blossom and bloom! Lol 

Lot of people use them, it’s a great way to really sculpt and tailor your tone to your taste. They’re more transparent than most other pedals imo. 

They work great, I use one with both my SC20 and my Dsl1.


----------



## Mitchell Pearrow

@heavypic 
Congratulations on your new amp 
Those Origins are not for everybody, but those of us who have them, can’t be talked out of the magic they possess ..

Cheers 
Mitch


----------



## fitz

Messin' with my O20H again today.
Did a power tube swap with my DSL20HR.
Moved the 6CA7's to the Origin and put the E34L's in the DSL.

I got the E34L's for the O20 upon recommendation from another thread (perhaps this thread?).
Also decided to try something different in the DSL at the same time so I got a pair of 6CA7's.
Definite improvement over stock EL34's in both amps, and I left them that way ever since.

Pulled both chassis and switched the tubes.
Runing chassis out sitting on the cabs - LP Tribute with 61 Burstbuckers straight in, no pedals.
Not much change to the DSL (I crank that amp all the time...), but the Origin seems to really like the bigger bottle 6CA7's.
Volume & gain cranked with the boost on, and it stayed crisp and defined in full overdrive growl.
Started with everything else at noon, but even cranked, the TMB, Tilt & Presence were responsive to further tone shaping.
The greenbacks were roaring. 

Just a suggestion if you're looking for an upgrade from stock tubes (IMHO / YMMV)


----------



## heavypic

Hey all,

Thanks for the replies and suggestions (the "recipe"...). I may give that SD-1 and GE-7 a try. Work has been busy. Just looking forward to finding more time to play with my new O20H and Peavey Cab 212-6. My Keeley modded TS-808 pedal sounded pretty good with the 'level' near 75% and gain at 25%. I was typically using more gain than level in the past with most of my amps but maxing the level with lower gain is a nice option too. More to come. Thanks all...

Regards


----------



## Manco

Hello everyone!! Just comment. I bought a Greenback G12M-25 8ohms for my combo Origin 20. I will build a box for de 12" and use the como as a head.
It arrives at the end of the week. Really exited for hear it.
So. The recipe:
Epiphone LP standard + Origin20 + greenback 

Best regards


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## Dave_11

Manco said:


> Hello everyone!! Just comment. I bought a Greenback G12M-25 8ohms for my combo Origin 20. I will build a box for de 12" and use the como as a head.


If you have the tools and skills to build a cab for your 12" greenback, then you could easily build a new baffle for the Origin 20 and mount the 12" greenback in that.


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## M JUBE 64

Just got this O20H today. This thing kicks ass with my original 1987 jubilee 4x12.
Plugged straight in, this sounds better than my 1981 JMP and my 1987 Jubilee heads.
Absolutely amazing quality for the price! Got it new for $525. Time will tell how it holds up but
I'm thoroughly impressed so far. Sent my little DSL 1 practice amp back after one day of use. the input jack stopped working after around 2 hours. Glad I got this instead and glad I didn't listen to all the bashers hating on this amp. This is not what they described.


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## steveb63

M JUBE 64 said:


> Just got this O20H today. This thing kicks ass with my original 1987 jubilee 4x12.
> Plugged straight in, this sounds better than my 1981 JMP and my 1987 Jubilee heads.
> Absolutely amazing quality for the price! Got it new for $525. Time will tell how it holds up but
> I'm thoroughly impressed so far. Sent my little DSL 1 practice amp back after one day of use. the input jack stopped working after around 2 hours. Glad I got this instead and glad I didn't listen to all the bashers hating on this amp. This is not what they described.
> View attachment 118373


Congratulations 
I don't know how it sounds, but it looks pretty bad azz.


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## OriginOfTheSpecies

+1 on the Greenback love. I swapped out one g12-t75 in a 2x12 for a current production g12m-25 and it's perfect. I also built a rangemaster to boost it and I'm getting a really complex harmonically rich cranked Marshall tone. The best part is with an attenuator and power scaling it still sounds great at household volume.


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## Mitchell Pearrow

@M JUBE 64 
congratulations on your new amp brother 
Sure looks killer in the photo.

Cheers 
Mitch


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## fitz

M JUBE 64 said:


> Just got this O20H today. This thing kicks ass with my original 1987 jubilee 4x12.
> Plugged straight in, this sounds better than my 1981 JMP and my 1987 Jubilee heads.
> Absolutely amazing quality for the price! Got it new for $525. Time will tell how it holds up but
> I'm thoroughly impressed so far. Sent my little DSL 1 practice amp back after one day of use. the input jack stopped working after around 2 hours. Glad I got this instead and glad I didn't listen to all the bashers hating on this amp. This is not what they described.
> View attachment 118373


HNAD!
Take the ass-kickin' up a notch - EQ in the loop, and ditch those stock tubes.


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## M JUBE 64

fitz said:


> HNAD!
> Take the ass-kickin' up a notch - EQ in the loop, and ditch those stock tubes.


Thanks, first thing I did was put my old GE 7 in the loop. I think the stock tubes sound pretty good ... What tubes do you recommend ? will they make that big of difference in this amp?


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## fitz

M JUBE 64 said:


> Thanks, first thing I did was put my old GE 7 in the loop. I think the stock tubes sound pretty good ... What tubes do you recommend ? will they make that big of difference in this amp?


Tubes (and speakers) are kind of a subjective personal preference thing - but I've found that what I put in sounded way better than the stock ones did - in *every* Marshall amp I've had.
Marshall branded tubes are a collection of what brands are available in bulk at any given time.
They are in no way "premium", and probably not as good as just about anything that's packaged for retail distribution.
Currently my O20H is running JJ 6CA7 power tubes and JJ ECC803S long plate preamps (all 3 slots).


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## solarburn

M JUBE 64 said:


> Thanks, first thing I did was put my old GE 7 in the loop. I think the stock tubes sound pretty good ... What tubes do you recommend ? will they make that big of difference in this amp?


Speakers make the biggest and best outcome for any amp especially a vintage rock sounding amp. The difference between my EVH 5153 412 & my EVH Iconic 412 was rediculous. The ORI into the EVH 5153 with Heritage greenbacks is glorious. All my amps into that cab get a level boost in sound and feel improvement.  

Tubes can effect "feel" along with subtle tone changes. More specifically gain level of the preamp tubes can definitely. For example a 12AY7 in V1 adds articulation and clearer saturation. Less wooly gain. Matter of taste feel/sound wise.

A few ways to skin a cat. If money is tight? Use what the amp came with!


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## Ps. 37

I agree with solar on the 12AY7 and fitz on the 6CA7.

Greenbacks as well. 

Enjoy your amp in the best of health.


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## M JUBE 64

Got my PS 1 Attenuator for my O20H today. Didn't have high hopes but it surprised me. Works great and sounds awesome even at a very low attenuation. I read some people said it gets hot, mine didn't even get warm and I was playing non-stop for a couple hours. At least I won't get kicked out of the neighborhood at night now  Loving the Origin amp!


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## heavypic

Hey All - Update here on my recent Origin 20H and Peavy 212-6 cab (2-12" Greenbacks) purchase.

No complaints here. This head/cab combo sounds great with or without the cab back panel installed. I've got the cab on a 10' speaker cable sitting horizontal on an amp stand angled about 20 degrees up in my living room. I've played my LPs and Strats through a Keeley TS808 and a Boss OD-3 pedal and it's all good for blues and classic rock. Speakers are sounding smoother as they break-in. I'm a fan of Allman Bros, ZZ, Led Zep, Joe B, Cream, Little Feat and the like, and this amp can cover those tones easily. Going to try my Boss GT-3 multi-pedal in the loop soon for reverb, delay, chorus, etc. I've got a Dunlop Fasel wah too that I'm looking to plug in. May try the SD-1, Black Box or other OD pedal soon...so many options there...tough decision. The amp also sounds great going straight in w/o a pedal with the 'gain' cranked a bit more. Even the 'boost' function has some useful settings. Still experimenting... I may even try some 5751 tubes in the preamp.

Very happy with my purchase. No problem with playing full power 20 watts at home if I keep the master vol at 3-5 max. The tone is very nice without abusing my hearing. However, I would like to hear it cranked in a larger room...I'm guessing that's where it shines!

If I did have a complaint, it would be that I'm sorry I didn't buy this rig 2-3 years ago and saved some $$...but my deal wasn't bad so it's all good!

I recommend this amp and the cab to anyone on the edge of a purchase.

Happy holidays all!! Keep pickin' and grinnin'...life is too short!!


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## solarburn

I am in utter joy when I fire up my Ori50H plugged into the Orange 412 V30/12H Annis top & bottom. My Jeff Archer, Buxom Boost and Thorpy Dane love this amp. And I in turn love them. I pleasure myself with Charvel & ESP's.

 to getting killer sounds out of this unapologetic Marshall.


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## Ps. 37

heavypic said:


> I'm a fan of Allman Bros, ZZ, Led Zep, Joe B, Cream, Little Feat and the like, and this amp can cover those tones easily.





heavypic said:


> Very happy with my purchase.
> 
> If I did have a complaint, it would be that I'm sorry I didn't buy this rig 2-3 years ago and saved some $$...but my deal wasn't bad so it's all good!





solarburn said:


> I am in utter joy when I fire up my Ori50H plugged into the Orange 412 V30/12H Annis top & bottom.
> 
> to getting killer sounds out of this unapologetic Marshall.


Totally agree. Almost 2 years after buying the Origin 50H, it still makes me smile uncontrollably every time I play.

I tell my wife "what I lack in guitar-playing ability, I make up for in the joy of making noise."

I see that Sweetwater and MusiciansFriend have dropped the price from $750 to $675.

Makes me smile even more to know I bought it brand new in Feb. 2021 for $425!  This amp has made a huge difference in how much I enjoy playing.

Enjoy in the best of health!


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## fitz

Ps. 37 said:


> "what I lack in guitar-playing ability, I make up for in the joy of making noise."


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## Dave_11

Just in time for Christmas, Origin 20 now available in white


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## Georgiatec

I don't understand what people don't like about the Origin amps. My 20H and 5C sound great. Okay, so the 5C has been modified to take a 10" speaker, but it didn't sound totally crap with the 8", it just sounds WAAAYY better with the 10".
The 20H hold it's own with my bigger, more illustrious Marshalls. Has it's own vintage vibe going on, not Plexi or JTM45 really, but somewhere in between.


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## cjs42079

Also chiming in to say that I am in utter joy when I fire up my Origin 50H into my 1960B 4x12. I run stereo amps, along side a SJ 2525H and the Origin totally hangs.


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## ledvedder

Can anyone help me out with links and values for the Origin 20 potentiometers? I need the push pull for gain, the tilt, and the master volume pots.


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## Mitchell Pearrow

ledvedder said:


> Can anyone help me out with links and values for the Origin 20 potentiometers? I need the push pull for gain, the tilt, and the master volume pots.


Sorry I am of no help, but be patient others will be able to help you with your questions.

Thanks 
Mitch


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## steveb63

Sorry, maybe Antique Electronics. 

They have more than "vintage" parts.


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## fitz

ledvedder said:


> values for the Origin 20 potentiometers?


There's nothing on the back of the pots except the Alpha logo and a lot# on the side.
The values must be on the front.


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## ledvedder

fitz said:


> There's nothing on the back of the pots except the Alpha logo and a lot# on the side.
> The values must be on the front.
> View attachment 119863


I think the tilt pot is 100k linear and the gain pot is 100k log. But I can't find that push pull 100k log pot anywhere.


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## fitz

ledvedder said:


> I think the tilt pot is 100k linear and the gain pot is 100k log. But I can't find that push pull 100k log pot anywhere.


Curious why you want to know.
The amp is not in your sig, and if you had one apart to replace pots, you should be able to see the values.


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## ledvedder

fitz said:


> Curious why you want to know.
> The amp is not in your sig, and if you had one apart to replace pots, you should be able to see the values.


I did a Headfirst plexi mod to it a while ago. So I ripped out the original gain and tilt pots. Now I want to do a Headfirst 800 mod to it, which requires the original pots. I've built and modded so many amps, it's hard to keep my signature up to date.


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## fitz

ledvedder said:


> I did a Headfirst plexi mod to it a while ago. So I ripped out the original gain and tilt pots. Now I want to do a Headfirst 800 mod to it, which requires the original pots. I've built and modded so many amps, it's hard to keep my signature up to date.


Email Jason, he could probably tell you what the pot values need to be for the mod.


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## ledvedder

fitz said:


> Email Jason, he could probably tell you what the pot values need to be for the mod.


He did confirm the pot values. Problem is, I can't find a 100k log dpdt pot that's pcb mount.


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## Cal Nevari

Hey everyone! Just had my "ah-ha" moment with my 20C. I didn't think it could produce a nice overdriven sound. Boy was I wrong! Having had it for almost 2 years, it's not clear why I didn't discover this earlier, but with the MV at about 6, if you crank up the Gain to about 9, what sweet OD and sustain! And this is at the low setting on the Output selector. Switching to the mid setting was a "holy cow!" moment. I guess I was so fixated on getting a good clean tone from the amp (which it does provide), that I never explored the higher Gain settings. No doubt others have had this experience and just wanted to share because it was so exciting!

:^)


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## Mitchell Pearrow

@Cal Nevari
Oh Yea .. also used to do that with the AVT50H’s


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## vivanchenko

fitz said:


> There's nothing on the back of the pots except the Alpha logo and a lot# on the side.
> The values must be on the front.




So refreshing to see the proper, cleanable Alpha pots in the "lower end" Marshall model. The cheap and disposable plastic ones go to the "high end" versions such as SV20. Good move, Marshall!


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## speyfly

M JUBE 64 said:


> Got my PS 1 Attenuator for my O20H today. Didn't have high hopes but it surprised me. Works great and sounds awesome even at a very low attenuation. I read some people said it gets hot, mine didn't even get warm and I was playing non-stop for a couple hours. At least I won't get kicked out of the neighborhood at night now  Loving the Origin amp!
> View attachment 118677


Can't help with the pot values question but I will say I have no regrets about the PS1 power soak paired with my other amps. I found one on sale and picked it up for a silly price, pleased with the performance, cheap compared to others but it works well!


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## Ufoscorpion

speyfly said:


> Can't help with the pot values question but I will say I have no regrets about the PS1 power soak paired with my other amps. I found one on sale and picked it up for a silly price, please with the performance, cheap compared to others but it works well!


Yep , I’ve got a jettenuator that I bought when they first came out that the ps1 is a clone of at it works great . It never even gets luke warm , even when I used it with a cranked 2203 800 . The only amp I’ve got that puts a very slight bit of heat into it is my Wangs 2204 hw and that’s hands down the loudest amp I’ve ever come across . Its crazy loud way louder than my Runt 50 and Ori50h for some reason .


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## J.LaGrassa

Just picked up another Origin 20 head, should have never sold the last one I had I regretted that move but all is good now. Got to get me a Greenback at some point but for now I'm using a Seventy 80 in my cab ...its not that bad! Glad to be back with Marshall


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## ledvedder

Has a full schematic ever been drawn up for the Origin 20?


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## Thom

Picked up my Origin 20 head in cream today! Loving it. My Dad has the combo so I knew what I was getting, but damn does it sound good through a 4x12!


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## fitz

Thom said:


> Picked up my Origin 20 head in cream today! Loving it. My Dad has the combo so I knew what I was getting, but damn does it sound good through a 4x12!
> 
> View attachment 122357
> View attachment 122358


 to the forum.
& HNAD!


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## Thom

Thanks!


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## Janp

Just an opnion.
There's seems to a lot of different
meanings about the gain boost on this amp.

I must say that i don't hear a lot of difference between the internal gain boost and an external full range boost like a lpb1 or a spark mini.
They all increase the bass.
If you keep the bass low the internal boost is usefull.
Not as a solo or volume boost but to increase the gain.


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## speyfly

Janp said:


> Just an opnion.
> There's seems to a lot of different
> meanings about the gain boost on this amp.
> 
> I must say that i don't hear a lot of difference between the internal gain boost and an external full range boost like a lpb1 or a spark mini.
> They all increase the bass.
> If you keep the bass low the internal boost is usefull.
> Not as a solo or volume boost but to increase the gain.



Well said!


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## fitz

Not sure if this has been posted here yet.
Some Origin features explained (by Marshall) with demo vids.








Origin


Learn more about what your origin can really do




marshall.com


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## speyfly

fitz said:


> Not sure if this has been posted here yet.
> Some Origin features explained (by Marshall) with demo vids.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Origin
> 
> 
> Learn more about what your origin can really do
> 
> 
> 
> 
> marshall.com



Anything related to the Origin is much appreciated. Looking forward to reviewing your link. 

Thx fitz!


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## R.B. Huckleberry

McCarty and an Origin 20 head here, too!


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## J.LaGrassa

So I've been trying some different tubes in my O20H that I have and the combination I like and find very responsive so far is:
V1 - JJ 5751
V2 - JJ ECC83MG
V3 - JAN Phillips 12AT7WC
What I was trying to achieve is a cleaner output section so I could get more use out of the loop without my delay being over clipped, so far so good the tone is still what I like and hardly clipping the output section. I can still get a nice pushed clean tone if I want but I keep it just at the edge. I use my Friedman Smallbox and Golden Pearl OD pedals for all the crunch and higher gain tones.
Been having a blast with this amp!!


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## markm

Just joined.
What a great compliment to my SC20!


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## fitz

Made a pair of 1x12 cabs for my O20H from some CODE 50's I got great deals on from local GC and CL.
New black cane grills and some piping from leftovers that I had laying around.
Moved the G12M-25's from my old homemade 212.


.


----------

