# 2018 Dsl 40cr Full Review...



## Bloodrock

So I received my new DSL 40 this afternoon and gave it a couple of hours of tweaking, here are my findings. This review is compared to my old JCM2000 DSL 50 that I have had for almost 10 years. The Reverb is still Meh! Don't care I have pedals.

First of all, the 2 added master volumes give you an entire new range of gain and volume sounds when blended with the gain and volume of each channel. you can crank the channel volume and back off the master to get a much more pushed power section type of tone if you want, and also get much better cranked sounds at lower volumes using the masters.

The EQ itself it much better sounding all around. No more ear piercing clanking highs and no more flubby lows, (although you can dial in extremes using the resonance and presence). But no more living on 2 with your treble and presence when you use the ultra channel.

Much more balanced EQ between the channels. No more huge volume jump, and only minor EQ tweaks needed between Classic and Ultra channels.

More gain on Classic, and less gain on Ultra. Subjective to opinions, but much better balance IMO. Classic Crunch now does close to Slash type gain if cranked, and Ultra is dialed back a bit, plus it's a lot more open and less compressed sounding.

V-Type speaker... Very well matched to this amp. I'm a huge V30 fan and my old JCM800 cab I use has 2 V30's and 2 H30's, this speaker is very well matched. Nothing offensive sounding out of the box.

The most surprising thing is that Ultra 2 is actually useable! No more flubby low end and fizzy highs! Kick it in with modest gain and put the mid shift in and it's an amazing EVH brown sound. Lows are much tighter and punchier on all channels. Much more like an old 5150 than the previous DSL. The low end is tight and chunky.
Overall I'd say Marshall nailed it 20 years later with the DSL. LOL! I'm sure it will sound even better after a good tube swap and a bias adjustment.


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## stinkfinger

Sweet... how well does the "low output" mode work in terms of tone suck?


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## Bloodrock

stinkfinger said:


> Sweet... how well does the "low output" mode work in terms of tone suck?



It works very well. IMO it basically cuts the volume about 50% to my ears, but doesn't effect the tone at all.


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## Micky

What about external bias points?


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## Bloodrock

Micky said:


> What about external bias points?



Bias points are still inside the chassis like the last dsl40 combo


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## Jethro Rocker

That sounds really good actually. Damn!! I found not enough gain on Crunch channel 1 on the last DSL40. Hmm....oh, oh...


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## Bloodrock

Jethro Rocker said:


> That sounds really good actually. Damn!! I found not enough gain on Crunch channel 1 on the last DSL40. Hmm....oh, oh...



Yeah, it sounds like just a little more gain on the crunch channel, and a little less on both Ultra channels. Very well balanced.


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## Ian Alderman

I have one being allocated to me from Sweetwater to replace a faulty unit, and this seems like an improvement if I've ever heard one. I got along really well with the previous version and got great tones out of it, but this seems like an amp I'll get quite a bit of enjoyment out of. In the name of curiosity, what are the stock tubes? Are they still the Marshall branded tubes?


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## Bloodrock

Ian Alderman said:


> I have one being allocated to me from Sweetwater to replace a faulty unit, and this seems like an improvement if I've ever heard one. I got along really well with the previous version and got great tones out of it, but this seems like an amp I'll get quite a bit of enjoyment out of. In the name of curiosity, what are the stock tubes? Are they still the Marshall branded tubes?



Still Marshall branded Chinese tubes i'd assume. But if you liked your previous version, you'll be much happier with this amp. it's a major improvement.


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## Bloodrock

My JMD 6 button footswitch does not work with this amp BTW. Unlike the JVM footswitch is supposed to.


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## Ian Alderman

Bloodrock said:


> Still Marshall branded Chinese tubes i'd assume. But if you liked your previous version, you'll be much happier with this amp. it's a major improvement.



Awesome. I dug the old version, despite having had 2 bum units. Sweetwater is making things right by me. I resolved to purchase some better tubes in case tube death happens early and I'll be prepared. It sounds like Marshall really did their homework with this amp.


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## Bloodrock

Only issue I see is that all the channels and modes use relays to switch now, hope that doesn't become an issue.


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## MonstersOfTheMidway

Bloodrock said:


> Only issue I see is that all the channels and modes use relays to switch now, hope that doesn't become an issue.


Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think I read the amp comes with a two button footswitch. Does the footswitch only switch between channels and not modes? Is the switching time pretty fast with the footswitch?

I think I read that these new DSL amps were design by Santiago. My 410H uses relays, and I've had not problem with malfunction or speed. I guess time will tell to be certain.

Congratulations on the new amp. Pics and clips perhaps when you get a chance?


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## EndGame00

Great review. It's good to hear they finally re-tweaked the Ultra Channel. Perhaps the V Type speaker is better suited with the DSL than the Creamback 65 ...


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## Ian Alderman

EndGame00 said:


> Great review. It's good to hear they finally re-tweaked the Ultra Channel. Perhaps the V Type speaker is better suited with the DSL than the Creamback 65 ...



Dude when mine comes in, I'll let you know. I absolutely love the Creamback, and it'll be something if this turns out being something that satisfies even more.


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## Jethro Rocker

The 2 button switches channels not modes. As I recall, the 2nd button is for MV. Sounds interesting. I just can't justify it what with the 6101 etc. 
Stil.... gears turn...


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## Jimmyohio75

Here is the footswitch that came with my DSL20HR that I just picked up today. Great amp. Much improved over the previous versions.


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## ken361

Wonder if there actually biasing them correctly now??


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## JAC

Bloodrock said:


> So I received my new DSL 40 this afternoon and gave it a couple of hours of tweaking, here are my findings. This review is compared to my old JCM2000 DSL 50 that I have had for almost 10 years. The Reverb is still Meh! Don't care I have pedals.
> 
> First of all, the 2 added master volumes give you an entire new range of gain and volume sounds when blended with the gain and volume of each channel. you can crank the channel volume and back off the master to get a much more pushed power section type of tone if you want, and also get much better cranked sounds at lower volumes using the masters.
> 
> The EQ itself it much better sounding all around. No more ear piercing clanking highs and no more flubby lows, (although you can dial in extremes using the resonance and presence). But no more living on 2 with your treble and presence when you use the ultra channel.
> 
> Much more balanced EQ between the channels. No more huge volume jump, and only minor EQ tweaks needed between Classic and Ultra channels.
> 
> More gain on Classic, and less gain on Ultra. Subjective to opinions, but much better balance IMO. Classic Crunch now does close to Slash type gain if cranked, and Ultra is dialed back a bit, plus it's a lot more open and less compressed sounding.
> 
> V-Type speaker... Very well matched to this amp. I'm a huge V30 fan and my old JCM800 cab I use has 2 V30's and 2 H30's, this speaker is very well matched. Nothing offensive sounding out of the box.
> 
> The most surprising thing is that Ultra 2 is actually useable! No more flubby low end and fizzy highs! Kick it in with modest gain and put the mid shift in and it's an amazing EVH brown sound. Lows are much tighter and punchier on all channels. Much more like an old 5150 than the previous DSL. The low end is tight and chunky.
> Overall I'd say Marshall nailed it 20 years later with the DSL. LOL! I'm sure it will sound even better after a good tube swap and a bias adjustment.



Good review! I appreciate this review coming from someone who also has a DSL 50 and a former JCM800 user. I like what I have read. It sounds like the new DSL40 have passed up the original one, which I myself like very much as well. Nice job.


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## Jimmyohio75

My new DSL20HR......

View media item 9650


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## ken361

JAC said:


> Good review! I appreciate this review coming from someone who also has a DSL 50 and a former JCM800 user. I like what I have read. It sounds like the new DSL40 have passed up the original one, which I myself like very much as well. Nice job.


Someone on facebook has the new one and the creamback one he loves both, new one didnt seem too much different to him


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## LPMarshall hack

Jimmyohio75 said:


> Here is the footswitch that came with my DSL20HR that I just picked up today. Great amp. Much improved over the previous versions.


Ew gross


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## Ian Alderman

LPMarshall hack said:


> Ew gross



It's just toes man, just toes lol


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## MonstersOfTheMidway

@Bloodrock : I forgot to say thank you for the review. From a player's perspective, it's very informative and helpful in getting the full experience with these new DSL amps.

@Jimmyohio75 : thanks for sharing pics of the new two button footswitch. It looks like the footswitch is attached to a cable, which is not what I expected (I thought it would connect via a regular guitar lead). Thanks for the info.


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## santiall

MonstersOfTheMidway said:


> Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think I read the amp comes with a two button footswitch. Does the footswitch only switch between channels and not modes? Is the switching time pretty fast with the footswitch?
> 
> I think I read that these new DSL amps were design by Santiago. My 410H uses relays, and I've had not problem with malfunction or speed. I guess time will tell to be certain.
> 
> Congratulations on the new amp. Pics and clips perhaps when you get a chance?


no, not my design. My involvement on those amps was the usual follow ups and design reviews but I haven't really worked on the DSLs.


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## MonstersOfTheMidway

santiall said:


> no, not my design. My involvement on those amps was the usual follow ups and design reviews but I haven't really worked on the DSLs.


Sorry for the confusion. Thanks for clearing that up, Santiago. Hope all is going well for you.


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## Springfield Scooter

Tell us more Bloodrock....!


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## MaskingApathy

Thanks for the review! Looking forward to picking up one of these models soon.


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## Kinkless Tetrode

Well this report is not disappointing.


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## pupleplexi

Like mine a lot (40 cr). After a bit of a faff with bias (you can only set it on full power) I have it set on 37. It was on 40 where it was very smooth on ultra gain but I like some complexity and character so I backed it off a little. Didn't make a massive difference so I'll leave it there. Even on ultra gain it's quite responsive to pick attack which makes it lots of fun to play. I like a tight bottom so I roll the bass and the resonance which can make the high notes a bit squeaky but a bit of reverb fattens those quite nicely. Haven't had it louder than room volume yet but even quiet on half power it sounds great. Bit miffed that the 6 button footswitch doesn't come with it but I suppose that's one reason why the price is so low. Years ago I had a tsl 50 which caused me no sadness when it was traded away. This is completely different - for the price, portability and range of sounds I'd say Marshall has a total winner here. Yes I am a marshall fan but I'm blessed with the gift of plain speaking. If this thing sucked I'd say so. Well in fact I would never have bought it....


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## ken361

32 or 33 people love it like meits much better!


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## Bloodrock

ken361 said:


> 32 or 33 people love it like meits much better!



That’s where I like mine too. I’ll be installing better tubes and rebiasing mine this weekend to see if it sounds even better!


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## ken361

what ya putting in?


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## Micky

Bloodrock said:


> Bias points are still inside the chassis like the last dsl40 combo


@purpleplexi says otherwise...


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## Bloodrock

ken361 said:


> what ya putting in?



I’ve got 2 sets of power tubes to try. New Mullards and Svetlanas. Old Amperex made 12ax7’s, and a sovtek LPS for the phase inverter


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## Bloodrock

Micky said:


> @purpleplexi says otherwise...



You’re right. They’re right inside the back cover! Duh. I was looking only at the back of the chassis, not the bottom. Tube swaps will be a snap!


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## MaskingApathy

@purpleplexi @Bloodrock can you post a photo of the inside of the back of the amp? Where are the bias points now?


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## Bloodrock

MaskingApathy said:


> @purpleplexi @Bloodrock can you post a photo of the inside of the back of the amp? Where are the bias points now?















IMG_0991



__ Bloodrock
__ Feb 2, 2018



DSL40cr bias points

















IMG_0991



__ Bloodrock
__ Feb 2, 2018



DSL40cr bias points


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## Springfield Scooter

So biased at somewhere between 32 and 40?


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## tschrama

clips clips clips!


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## ken361

Springfield Scooter said:


> So biased at somewhere between 32 and 40?


32! My tech highly recommends it and he's right! all preamp distortion, less heat less problems, more tube life.


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## tschrama

Even 32mA is pushing it with the low impedance and high HT Marshall is traditionally using.


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## Micky

ken361 said:


> 32! My tech highly recommends it and he's right! all preamp distortion, less heat less problems, more tube life.


That was the sweet spot for me before I modded mine for 6550's...


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## ken361

tschrama said:


> Even 32mA is pushing it with the low impedance and high HT Marshall is traditionally using.


He originally set it at 30 months later with new tubes I tried 30,32,36 and settled at 32. I see so many on FB with 40+ from the factory


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## ken361

ken361 said:


> He originally set it at 30 months later with new tubes I tried 30,32,36 and settled at 32. I see so many on FB with 40+ from the factory


It gets a bad rep on the red channel because so many set theres hot just because the Weber site says too i thought so too for awhile


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## Rafael080

I've seen that the amp has a midi ... I've never used this type of connection, but I'm interested in using it someday ... so if I buy a midi foot controller, can I control the channels of this amplifier via midi simultaneously to the effect racks?


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## pupleplexi

I tried some 6550s in mine today and I really liked them but I couldn't get the bias below high 40s. I run them in my plexi clone at 38 no probs. What's the mod to get them into spec?
Incidentally when I was talking to the marshall tech he told me all the ones they tried at the factory were between 32 and 35. Stock tubes obviously. I tried mine on 35 with the stockers and it sounded sort of thin and pinched.
I like the flat response of the 6550s. Makes it really easy to eq.


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## Micky

pupleplexi said:


> I tried some 6550s in mine today and I really liked them but I couldn't get the bias below high 40s. I run them in my plexi clone at 38 no probs. What's the mod to get them into spec?
> Incidentally when I was talking to the marshall tech he told me all the ones they tried at the factory were between 32 and 35. Stock tubes obviously. I tried mine on 35 with the stockers and it sounded sort of thin and pinched.
> I like the flat response of the 6550s. Makes it really easy to eq.


You have to change the grid resistors and modify the bias circuit.


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## solarburn

tschrama said:


> Even 32mA is pushing it with the low impedance and high HT Marshall is traditionally using.



LOL. I have mine at 36mv and threaten it at high volumes repeatedly. It says kill.


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## tschrama

And you asume treating it at high volume makes it hard on the tubes... LOL


ur ignorance is bliss


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## dave999z

Rafael080 said:


> I've seen that the amp has a midi ... I've never used this type of connection, but I'm interested in using it someday ... so if I buy a midi foot controller, can I control the channels of this amplifier via midi simultaneously to the effect racks?



Yes.


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## solarburn

tschrama said:


> And you asume treating it at high volume makes it hard on the tubes... LOL
> 
> 
> ur ignorance is bliss



Hard on the neighbors.


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## solarburn

Green clean channel boosted. Not crunch.


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## solarburn

I set my DSL40 to have a bit of mud cause I dig spitting Marshall Nuggets into faces...hehee


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## Finnster

Have you tried the direct out cab sim yet?


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## Bloodrock

Finnster said:


> Have you tried the direct out cab sim yet?



I have not. I’m an old fart that just puts a mic in front of the amp, but my son was wanting to try recording with the direct out when he has time.


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## Finnster

Bloodrock said:


> I have not. I’m an old fart that just puts a mic in front of the amp, but my son was wanting to try recording with the direct out when he has time.



Might be cool when playing live to use the DI to the board along with a mic on the amp to get 2 slightly different flavors of tone! That is...IF the emulated out sounds pleasing.

I have a 40cr enroute to me. Cant wait to try it. I use a Fractal FX8 so the midi will be a great feature so I can have access to all four modes.


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## PU239

Bloodrock said:


> I have not. I’m an old fart that just puts a mic in front of the amp, but my son was wanting to try recording with the direct out when he has time.



The emulted out is first and foremost to be used into a mixer/PA. Obviously that doesn't need cabinet simulation.

If using it for recording it is always going to sound harsh or raw if not using some sort of cabinet simulation.

Solution.

1. Download 2 Notes Torpedo Wall of Sound suite to use in your DAW, great software. With it you assign a cabinet and select the virtual mic to use and assign it to your raw guitar track.

https://www.two-notes.com/en/wall-of-sound


2 Buy the 2 Notes load box or their CAB pedal and place it inline with the emulated out.

https://www.two-notes.com/en/torpedo-cab


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## Ghostman

So these new DSL's, for each channel has a Gain, a Channel Volume, and a Master Volume.

What is the purpose of having two volumes on a channel? I can understand a gain, to adjust the level of signal the tubes get, which in essence will adjust the amount of over-driven or distortion the channel gets, and a separate volume to adjust the overall loudness the channel is. But I don't understand the difference between the Channel volume and the Master Volume, for each channel.

Where in the signal chain is each Volume pot controlling the signal? 

School me.


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## chiliphil1

Ghostman said:


> So these new DSL's, for each channel has a Gain, a Channel Volume, and a Master Volume.
> 
> What is the purpose of having two volumes on a channel? I can understand a gain, to adjust the level of signal the tubes get, which in essence will adjust the amount of over-driven or distortion the channel gets, and a separate volume to adjust the overall loudness the channel is. But I don't understand the difference between the Channel volume and the Master Volume, for each channel.
> 
> Where in the signal chain is each Volume pot controlling the signal?
> 
> School me.



From my understanding it has A master volume, there are just 2 of them to allow for a volume boost. The volumes on the channels are used to balance their output while the master is to set the loudness of the amp overall without having to rebalance the channels each time as you used to have to do.


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## Ghostman

chiliphil1 said:


> From my understanding it has A master volume, there are just 2 of them to allow for a volume boost. The volumes on the channels are used to balance their output while the master is to set the loudness of the amp overall without having to rebalance the channels each time as you used to have to do.


Doesn't make sense, because you can balance the volumes with the Channel volume, and then mess it up completely with the Master Volumes.


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## chiliphil1

Ghostman said:


> Doesn't make sense, because you can balance the volumes with the Channel volume, and then mess it up completely with the Master Volumes.



I don’t think I said that right. So, you make the clean and distorted the same volume so that when you switch back and forth there is no jump. You do that in the bedroom and then go gig, you’ll need it to be louder. Instead of having to adjust each channel volume and balance them again you just twist the master and they both get louder at the same rate. The second master is for a volume boost.


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## Ghostman

ohhhhhhhhh Master 1 and Master 2 effect BOTH channels. For some reason I had it in my head that Master 1 was Channel 1 MV, and Master 2 was Channel 2 MV. 

Having two Master Volumes in series makes more sense.


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## Bloodrock

Ghostman said:


> ohhhhhhhhh Master 1 and Master 2 effect BOTH channels. For some reason I had it in my head that Master 1 was Channel 1 MV, and Master 2 was Channel 2 MV.
> 
> Having two Master Volumes in series makes more sense.



Not in series. You can use either master on any mode you want. It remembers the last master you used on each channel/mode. So you can set it so clean uses master 1, crunch is master 2. Lead one is master 1, lead 2 is master 2. Or which ever combination you want. You can set master one to all four modes if you want and never use master 2 but both masters are never active at the same time


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## Ghostman

Bloodrock said:


> Not in series. You can use either master on any mode you want. It remembers the last master you used on each channel/mode. So you can set it so clean uses master 1, crunch is master 2. Lead one is master 1, lead 2 is master 2. Or which ever combination you want. You can set master one to all four modes if you want and never use master 2 but both masters are never active at the same time


I'll have to get a hold of one in the real world, because that didn't make sense.


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## JeffMcLeod

solarburnDSL50 said:


> Green clean channel boosted. Not crunch.


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## Bloodrock

Ghostman said:


> I'll have to get a hold of one in the real world, because that didn't make sense.



Basically you have 2 masters and 4 modes. either master can be assigned to any of the four modes. All you need to know is the new DSL’s are Badass! Lol


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## Jethro Rocker

I use it on my JVM as a volume boost. Footswitch to MV2 whenever on any channel. 
In the case of the JVM you can set on a preset so whenever you hit say channel 3, it goes to MV2.


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## Finnster

solarburnDSL50 said:


> Green clean channel boosted. Not crunch.




Btw.....that sounds awesome! What did you boost it with?


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## bad565ss

The amp remembers what master you used last with each mode and changes to that with the mode or channel change.


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## Mystic38

trust me, am no expert on the dsl40 at all....but let me try?.. 

if you are looking solely at the front panel, and its a two channel amp with one mode per channel, then no it makes no sense, as of course you dont need more than 1 channel volume per channel and one master.

BUT

with midi control you have two channels with two modes per channel ..so its now a 4 "channel" amp ... and so the second "master" comes into play for setting volume levels for boosted parts or whatever.. 



Ghostman said:


> I'll have to get a hold of one in the real world, because that didn't make sense.


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## Crunchifyable

Mystic38 said:


> trust me, am no expert on the dsl40 at all....but let me try?..
> 
> if you are looking solely at the front panel, and its a two channel amp with one mode per channel, then no it makes no sense, as of course you dont need more than 1 channel volume per channel and one master.
> 
> BUT
> 
> with midi control you have two channels with two modes per channel ..so its now a 4 "channel" amp ... and so the second "master" comes into play for setting volume levels for boosted parts or whatever..



Isn't it like a two channel amp with midi switchable "boosts"?

Crunch mode is more like a boost, but also a volume gain?

And OD2, a volume increase with more gain?

It would be nice if it could remember things like switch between crunch and then go to OD2 with tone shift engaged, etc., but every relay has to have a per channel memory (like my Bugera amps do...my 333xl remembers reverb and fx loop on a per channel basis).

I don't think it's fair to call it a four channel amp. maybe 1 and 1/2 channel plus 1 and 1/2 channel.

It's like the 5150s feel like a 2 and 1/2 channel amp until Fender recently modded them to have an independent gain / vol control for "crunch". and now they are true 3 channel amps.

I would like to see Marshall that is as versatile and as powerful as my Bugeras (which in turn are based on Peaveys). But I believe I will have to wait for Marshall to retire the JVM first (which isn't a bad amp...but having built a 2203...I find the tone limiting and wouldn't want an amp with 4 versions of that sound).


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## Bloodrock

You guys are making it sound a lot more complicated that it is. Lol. BTW, the effects loop can be assigned on or off to each of the four modes as well


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## Springfield Scooter

Clips Bloodrock....We want clips!
Cheap cell phone video would suffice!
Lets hear that baby!


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## DannyB

Bloodrock said:


> You guys are making it sound a lot more complicated that it is. Lol. BTW, the effects loop can be assigned on or off to each of the four modes as well



So, it shares functionality with the 410HJS??

If so, no coolaid, but I’m on the band wagon!


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## Bloodrock

DannyB said:


> So, it shares functionality with the 410HJS??
> 
> If so, no coolaid, but I’m on the band wagon!



Yes the effects loop and masters works similar to the JVM js. It remembers which master you were using on each mode and weather the loop was on or off in that mode. The mid shift is the only option not assignable like the JHS.


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## solarburn

Finnster said:


> Btw.....that sounds awesome! What did you boost it with?



Marvel Drive.


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## paul-e-mann

They almost got this right, I'm gonna wait until Marshall adds a second EQ to this amp before I buy one. I bet they will one of these days, they added JVM switching that's an awesome advancement.


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## Bloodrock

pedecamp said:


> They almost got this right, I'm gonna wait until Marshall adds a second EQ to this amp before I buy one. I bet they will one of these days, they added JVM switching that's an awesome advancement.



If that’s your only drawback I’d suggest trying one of these to see how you like it. The EQ balance from channel to channel is much better on this amp then on my dsl50. No massive eq shift anymore. My old DSL50 has not enough treble on classic gain, then way too much treble on ultra. The only difference on the new ones is classic gain has punchier low end. When you switch to ultra you lose a little oomph and get a little thinner “slash like” tone. But bumping the bass or resonance will thicken up ultra nicely.


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## paul-e-mann

Bloodrock said:


> If that’s your only drawback I’d suggest trying one of these to see how you like it. The EQ balance from channel to channel is much better on this amp then on my dsl50. No massive eq shift anymore. My old DSL50 has not enough treble on classic gain, then way too much treble on ultra. The only difference on the new ones is classic gain has punchier low end. When you switch to ultra you lose a little oomph and get a little thinner “slash like” tone. But bumping the bass or resonance will thicken up ultra nicely.


I'll have to try one when my store gets them in. So it sounds like ultra still isn't right if youre planning on switching between channels? I dumped my DSL50 for two reasons, maybe three, the EQ between channels was too different, the amp had too much compression, the amp was not reliable was plagued with issues. It fell short of my needs and it was an annoying amp to own.


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## eschatts

I am not out here much, but watch the forum. I picked up the 40 combo. It is a rock machine. For pure rock, I think I like better than my Egnater Rebel 30. My buddy thinks it sounds better as well. Was playing with my les Paul with super distortions. Kiss sound all the way. The only comment, I don’t know if it gets as loud as my Egnater. Might be just where we were set up.


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## recto-robbie

So I plugged mine in for the first time last night, everything sounded excellent until I tried the OD1 and 2 channels with high gain and fairly high volume, the amp really started flubbing out, thought there was something wrong with it at first.

Wound up checking the bias and it was reading 40 for both tubes but the bias trim pots were completely maxed straight from the factory. So with only one direction to turn I was easily able to get the amp to stop flubbing out. I eventually settled at 25 for both tubes, happy with the sound but can bias a bit hotter still , up to around 35 or so with no issues.

My findings here seem a bit off to what most of you are seeing with your amps, any explanations why this may be?

Do you guys know what Marshall suggests the amps bias to be set at??

Are any of you actually checking the plate voltage on pin 3 to figure out where the bias should be set?

Anyway the amp sounds incredible regardless, I missed owning a Marshall for a while now and this thing sure put a smile on my face.


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## ken361

32 works for me, 36 seemed a bit too hot sorta raspy less defined less tight bass also. My tech sets them at 30 to 32 450 to 500 PV most likely.


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## ken361

recto-robbie said:


> So I plugged mine in for the first time last night, everything sounded excellent until I tried the OD1 and 2 channels with high gain and fairly high volume, the amp really started flubbing out, thought there was something wrong with it at first.
> 
> Wound up checking the bias and it was reading 40 for both tubes but the bias trim pots were completely maxed straight from the factory. So with only one direction to turn I was easily able to get the amp to stop flubbing out. I eventually settled at 25 for both tubes, happy with the sound but can bias a bit hotter still , up to around 35 or so with no issues.
> 
> My findings here seem a bit off to what most of you are seeing with your amps, any explanations why this may be?
> 
> Do you guys know what Marshall suggests the amps bias to be set at??
> 
> Are any of you actually checking the plate voltage on pin 3 to figure out where the bias should be set?
> 
> Anyway the amp sounds incredible regardless, I missed owning a Marshall for a while now and this thing sure put a smile on my face.


U have the newer one?


----------



## Finnster

eschatts said:


> I am not out here much, but watch the forum. I picked up the 40 combo. It is a rock machine. For pure rock, I think I like better than my Egnater Rebel 30. My buddy thinks it sounds better as well. Was playing with my les Paul with super distortions. Kiss sound all the way. The only comment, I don’t know if it gets as loud as my Egnater. Might be just where we were set up.



Just as a reference. My new DSL40CR isn't anywhere near as loud as my Mesa TC-50 1x12 Combo.


----------



## recto-robbie

ken361 said:


> U have the newer one?




Yes I do


----------



## recto-robbie

Finnster said:


> Just as a reference. My new DSL40CR isn't anywhere near as loud as my Mesa TC-50 1x12 Combo.



While I haven't compared the two I would probably agree with you here. It is Mesa though, they are normally brutal loud.
This Marshall can get really loud too, just need both the channel and master volumes up. I honestly don't think I have figured out the master volumes yet, the amp certainly seems to have some decent volume taper, none of that fully maxed at 3 business here.


----------



## recto-robbie

Hey any of you guys have an idea what brand the EL34,s are in these new DSL,s?


----------



## slide222

I wanna hear or try the 1 watt dsl 1c new amp , I reckon for the price it might be having a 1 watt combo to lug around especially if its light , and they do seem available now


----------



## Bloodrock

recto-robbie said:


> Hey any of you guys have an idea what brand the EL34,s are in these new DSL,s?



I checked the tube codes on mine. They are JJ el34’s.


----------



## dnottis

So with the dsl40c if you connected a device like an rp1000 to the effects return you got it at full volume due to where in the power amp the return was located. The volume knob didn’t control volume this way. Can anyone tell me if the dsl40cr is the same? Also for anyone with a dsl40c that swapped the speaker does the dsl40cr still sound better?


----------



## stratocastermarshall

I just received my dsl40cr. I currently own a dsl40c. I did an initial side-by-side comparison.

This is not quite an apples-to-apples test. The dsl40cr is stock. The dsl40c has a broken in creamback 65, some NOS tubes, and the c19 mod using a 100 pF capacitor.

The guitar used was a LP Classic.

I haven't checked the bias of the 40cr yet. I believe the bias on the 40c is set to 34.

My "tests" were done in 20 watt mode at bedroom to low-rehearsal volumes. On the 40cr all channels and modes were set to use master volume 1.

First test was done with EQ at noon on both amps - including presence and resonance.

I don't think either amp sounds particularly good ad bedroom volumes. This is with gain at anywhere between 9 o'clock and dimed, and volume at just enough to be heard. For the 40cr this means the channel volume is dimed and the master is adjusted accordingly. It's still fun with the gain all the way up, but I wouldn't really call it a "good" sound from either amp.

At low rehearsal volumes both amps sound pretty good, but certainly different. The 40cr cut through more with clearer mids and highs. The 40c had more thump. The 40c could be EQd to match the 40cr - or come pretty close, but I didn't spend too much time experimenting with this. I could EQ the 40cr to get some of the thump of the 40c, but not as much.

I can confirm that there isn't nearly the volume jump on the classic gain channel going from clean to crunch. There's some, but not as much. And certainly any difference could be addressed by using different master volumes for each mode.

Also, the EQ between the classic and ultra gain channels is as has been described - virtually no EQ changes are required. Nice.

Some have suggested new tonal/gain possibilities using different combinations of channel and master volume settings in the 40cr. I do not agree with this. At comparable volumes, setting channel volume to max and adjusting the master vs master at max and adjusting the channel, I couldn't really tell any difference. It's as if the channel/master volumes are wired in series. I would consider the channel/master volume controls solely in the context of balancing volume between channels/modes and then adjusting the total volume based on venue or material.

There is no difference in the reverb between the two amps.

In my case the 40cr is quieter than the 40c...less hiss.

And there is no doubt in my mind that the v-type speaker is MUCH better than the Seventy-80.

I thought I read that the FX loop would also change with the channel/mode switching. That is not the case. The FX loop can only be switched on/off using the footswitch FX switch.

I also tried diming the volume on both amps for a very short while. The 40c seems louder than the 40cr. Again, this is in 20 watt mode. It's possible that the new method for reducing power just translates differently in the new amp in 1/2 power mode. This may not apply in full power mode.

It's probable that some or all of the tonal differences between the amps are due to different speakers, tubes, etc. But, one conclusion I think I can confidently make at this point is that the dsl40cr out of the box addresses virtually all of the tonal issues/concerns with the 40c with respect to volume jumps in classic gain mode changes and balancing EQ between the channels. So, out of the box the 40cr is pretty damn good.

The ONLY thing I'd ding the 40cr for is the channel switching. There is a very slight delay as the relays switch.

I'll be checking the bias and moving the NOS preamp tubes and creamback to the 40cr and possibly do additional reviews.


----------



## Bloodrock

Great comparison man. For any one who might be wondering, I swapped the v-type with a v30 a few days ago and the amp sounds even better imo. Not a world of difference actually but I’m a v30 guy. After comparing the two, the v-type is a lot like a v30 mixed with a greenback. A little smoother but still some of the v30 mid bite. I think most will be extremely happy with the v-type.


----------



## _ripper_

stratocastermarshall said:


> Also, the EQ between the classic and ultra gain channels is as has been described - virtually no EQ changes are required. Nice.



If there's one thing I'd like to have on my 1st gen DSL (I've got the 100H) is this. Hopefully at some point, the schematics will start to float around or someone will examine the circuit or something and do a comparison with the 1st gen DSLs and see what's different and come up with a mod. If such a thing is even possible....?

May I ask a question: I've read reports that the gain staging is different between the four modes on the new DSLs. Having both side-by-side, do you agree with this?

Cheers,
ripper


----------



## ken361

No volume issues with 40c say playing loud red on 4 volume and crunch on 8 no issues just turn the crunch up


----------



## Bloodrock

ken361 said:


> No volume issues with 40c say playing loud red on 4 volume and crunch on 8 no issues just turn the crunch up



I think his perceived volume difference is because of the new master volumes. They make tailoring the gain an volumes much more manageable. But if you dime the master like it’s not there, the channel volume works just like the old DSL’s. Gets very loud above 3.


----------



## stratocastermarshall

_ripper_ said:


> If there's one thing I'd like to have on my 1st gen DSL (I've got the 100H) is this. Hopefully at some point, the schematics will start to float around or someone will examine the circuit or something and do a comparison with the 1st gen DSLs and see what's different and come up with a mod. If such a thing is even possible....?
> 
> May I ask a question: I've read reports that the gain staging is different between the four modes on the new DSLs. Having both side-by-side, do you agree with this?
> 
> Cheers,
> ripper



If I understand your question about balancing the EQ between channels, the mod you're seeking is called the C19 mod. I've done it on my 40c and it works exactly as described. Some think it takes away a bit too much of what makes a Marshall a Marshall, but you'd just need to try it and see if you like it. In my case I replaced the 470 pF cap with a 100 pF cap. Some use different capacitors. Some use no capacitor.

As to the gain staging, yes I'd agree with others. I didn't explicitly look for this when I tested, but I did notice that on my gain setting that I typically use to play Zeppelin, on the 40cr on the ultra gain channel there was still too much gain. But remember, I have NOS tubes on my 40c, so that may be the difference there.

So it seems like the classic gain channel has more gain on tap, the ultra gain channel perhaps a bit less, and mode 2 on ultra gain is now more usable.


----------



## dnottis

stratocastermarshall said:


> If I understand your question about balancing the EQ between channels, the mod you're seeking is called the C19 mod. I've done it on my 40c and it works exactly as described. Some think it takes away a bit too much of what makes a Marshall a Marshall, but you'd just need to try it and see if you like it. In my case I replaced the 470 pF cap with a 100 pF cap. Some use different capacitors. Some use no capacitor.
> 
> As to the gain staging, yes I'd agree with others. I didn't explicitly look for this when I tested, but I did notice that on my gain setting that I typically use to play Zeppelin, on the 40cr on the ultra gain channel there was still too much gain. But remember, I have NOS tubes on my 40c, so that may be the difference there.
> 
> So it seems like the classic gain channel has more gain on tap, the ultra gain channel perhaps a bit less, and mode 2 on ultra gain is now more usable.




On my DSL40c I changed the speaker to a Eminence Cannabis Rex speaker and while it cut a bit of the high end making it sound much better to me (ultra gain was now usable not fizzy), I felt like it cut some of the gain on ultra; so maybe it's the V type speaker doing that.


----------



## _ripper_

I probably wasn't clear, sorry. I meant to say that it would be cool to see how the balanced eq between channels is being implemented on the new dsls and if the old dsls could be modded to have an eq like the new ones. If they did it by changing the value of the bright cap, that would be good to know. 




stratocastermarshall said:


> If I understand your question about balancing the EQ between channels, the mod you're seeking is called the C19 mod. I've done it on my 40c and it works exactly as described. Some think it takes away a bit too much of what makes a Marshall a Marshall, but you'd just need to try it and see if you like it. In my case I replaced the 470 pF cap with a 100 pF cap. Some use different capacitors. Some use no capacitor.
> 
> As to the gain staging, yes I'd agree with others. I didn't explicitly look for this when I tested, but I did notice that on my gain setting that I typically use to play Zeppelin, on the 40cr on the ultra gain channel there was still too much gain. But remember, I have NOS tubes on my 40c, so that may be the difference there.
> 
> So it seems like the classic gain channel has more gain on tap, the ultra gain channel perhaps a bit less, and mode 2 on ultra gain is now more usable.


----------



## ken361

Cant believe how many people complain about the EQ on TGP. Why does everyone think the red is supposed to be as warm as the green channel. Most higher gain is usually thinner then the crunch and cleans. Think my older 6505+ was like that I believe its been a while since I had one, Engl ect. My old delay added highs so i pulled it recently. Plugging right in front with a tad a reverb gives me the most natural sound from the amp. My bass and resonance are at 3 I dont have much issues with the EQ. 


_ripper_ said:


> I probably wasn't clear, sorry. I meant to say that it would be cool to see how the balanced eq between channels is being implemented on the new dsls and if the old dsls could be modded to have an eq like the new ones. If they did it by changing the value of the bright cap, that would be good to know.


I wonder if they just changed the cap and the back panel. I doubt if they rearranged the whole board but who knows


----------



## Ghostman

_ripper_ said:


> I probably wasn't clear, sorry. I meant to say that it would be cool to see how the balanced eq between channels is being implemented on the new dsls and if the old dsls could be modded to have an eq like the new ones. If they did it by changing the value of the bright cap, that would be good to know.



That's called the "Joey Mods" on the original JCM 2000 DSLs. I had to do it on mine when I had it. The Green and Red were so far off from each other, it was an unusable two channel amp.


----------



## _ripper_

I've seen that thread 

Has anyone sorted those mods for the DSL100H? 



Ghostman said:


> That's called the "Joey Mods" on the original JCM 2000 DSLs. I had to do it on mine when I had it. The Green and Red were so far off from each other, it was an unusable two channel amp.


----------



## Gary harrer

Any idea about the 6way foot switch??
I pickup up the amp today and tried the jvm controller, nothing.... not even lit up


----------



## stratocastermarshall

What model is the footswitch, PEDL-91016?


----------



## Finnster

stratocastermarshall said:


> What model is the footswitch, PEDL-91016?



PEDL-91005 according to the manual


----------



## stratocastermarshall

Interesting...the web site says PEDL-91016. Looks like it will need to go to Marshall for clarification.


----------



## Finnster

stratocastermarshall said:


> Interesting...the web site says PEDL-91016. Looks like it will need to go to Marshall for clarification.



https://marshall.com/downloads/downloadfile/4bac3f0d-5ca1-4e34-b0c3-cc2321e1bfaa


----------



## stratocastermarshall

Yep, manual says one thing. Site says another.


----------



## Finnster

stratocastermarshall said:


> Yep, manual says one thing. Site says another.
> 
> View attachment 46252


Well that clears it up....bwahahahah


----------



## recto-robbie

Are any of you guys experiencing issues using humbuckers on the high gain channels with the gain up high? Mine for some reason seems to be overloading the circuit and completely flubbing out the bottom end, so much so that if the gain is high enough it really is unplayable. I also ran into the issue with a simple rat pedal on the clean channel with amp gain down and pedal way up.

When I first got the amp I ran into this issue and wound up messing with the bias. The amp came from the factory with the bias knobs fully maxed and biased at around 41 or so. I dropped the bias way down into the upper 20's for the time being as I thought it sounded better and would get back to it once I heard where it should be biased at. I replaced all the preamp tubes also.

Anyway the amp is still flubbing out real bad with high gain, if I drop the gain on either od1/od2 to half or less it seems to work and sound just fine.
I have never run into an amp that cant be played with buckers with the gain all the way up, I know that's too much gain but the amp should still be usable, right?? any ideas????? thanks


----------



## stratocastermarshall

recto-robbie said:


> Are any of you guys experiencing issues using humbuckers on the high gain channels with the gain up high? Mine for some reason seems to be overloading the circuit and completely flubbing out the bottom end, so much so that if the gain is high enough it really is unplayable. I also ran into the issue with a simple rat pedal on the clean channel with amp gain down and pedal way up.
> 
> When I first got the amp I ran into this issue and wound up messing with the bias. The amp came from the factory with the bias knobs fully maxed and biased at around 41 or so. I dropped the bias way down into the upper 20's for the time being as I thought it sounded better and would get back to it once I heard where it should be biased at. I replaced all the preamp tubes also.
> 
> Anyway the amp is still flubbing out real bad with high gain, if I drop the gain on either od1/od2 to half or less it seems to work and sound just fine.
> I have never run into an amp that cant be played with buckers with the gain all the way up, I know that's too much gain but the amp should still be usable, right?? any ideas????? thanks



What volume are you playing at, what are the EQ settings, and are you running in half or full power mode when you run into the problem?

If in 1/2 power mode is it possible that your running out of headroom and just getting a more compressed "flubbing out" sound?

Also, do you have the same issue even without the effects loop and reverb engaged?

I haven't really opened the amp up volume wise yet...just low rehearsal volumes. But i have had the gain all the way up. Perhaps not surprisingly, I haven't run into any issues with that.


----------



## Gary harrer

Check the bias again, it almost sounds like extreme sag.
It's possible you have a bad preamp tube, I know they are new....but sometimes shot happens.

I had a jvmjs that was really fussy about the tube in v2, same as your description here.

Try your old ones in again


----------



## Gary harrer

Anyone tried the midi yet?


----------



## ken361

40c if you crank the gain full it will flub like the JVM, 6 or 7 is good for me bias 32. Volume loud I use it at 4 on the red and its plenty and stays completely focused and tight no flub at all. The higher bias may cause it.


----------



## recto-robbie

stratocastermarshall said:


> What volume are you playing at, what are the EQ settings, and are you running in half or full power mode when you run into the problem?
> 
> If in 1/2 power mode is it possible that your running out of headroom and just getting a more compressed "flubbing out" sound?
> 
> Also, do you have the same issue even without the effects loop and reverb engaged?
> 
> I haven't really opened the amp up volume wise yet...just low rehearsal volumes. But i have had the gain all the way up. Perhaps not surprisingly, I haven't run into any issues with that.[/QUOTE
> 
> 
> 
> ken361 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 40c if you crank the gain full it will flub like the JVM, 6 or 7 is good for me bias 32. Volume loud I use it at 4 on the red and its plenty and stays completely focused and tight no flub at all. The higher bias may cause it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for all the help guys, I am using it only on full power now, I never use its reverb but will try without the loop engaged. The tone controls are all around noon give or take just a bit. This happens regardless of volume, bedroom to rip your ears off.
> 
> 
> It does sound much like what Ken suggested here, I never tried a JVM but did own 2 dsl40's and 2 JCM 2000 dsl50's and never heard anything like this.
> 
> The clean channel sounds nice on its own but putting a high gain pedal in it flubs it out completely. It seems on OD1 I can get the gain to around 3/4 and on OD2 only to half way and then its useless.
> Using an OD in front of the amp does slightly seem to tighten it up though.
> I found if I drop my guitars volume it helps a bit too.
> I threw in some Ruby el34's I had laying around here and biased it to 32.
> Still pretty much the same. If I set the gain up to where it doesn't completely flub out it sounds incredible. Everything seems to be working just fine with it otherwise.
> Yea to me it sounds like the preamp is being completely overloaded with signal. Like it cant keep up with it and folds onto itself, weird really.
> 
> Ill keep messing with it, I just need to know if others get this at extreme gain settings with humbuckers, don't think single coils will do it. Otherwise I still have quite a while for an exchange, I do like the amp a lot though.
Click to expand...


----------



## recto-robbie

So yes regardless of loop same issues, threw the original el34's back in no difference. I do like those JJ's though.

I found that punching the front end with an OD cuts most of the flub out.
Also found that I can pretty much max the gain with my P90 SG on the OD channels and with that same rat on the clean channel. 



So it seems at least with mine that humbuckers are just way too much for the OD channels with any gain past noon unless I use an OD. It gets much worse without the OD in front.

Ive heard other amps get a bit flubby, loose and mushy but never unusable like this.


----------



## Dmann

I originally bought the DSL40C in 2014, low end flubbing or farting with volumes at rehearsals level with acoustic drums was the reason I returned it and went with the DSL100H head and opted to stick with 412 cabs.

Honestly though, even the 100H flubs if pushed too hard, pretty sure it's the cheap tranny, so if the new refresh of DSL's stuck with the same tranny........


----------



## slide222

why is it so hard to get information on these amps I've been looking on PMT website and they do not say what tubes are in these amps yet they tell you you if you purchase these amps before 1500pm, you can get next day free delivery and they are pushing their finance options hard , but are not so keen on telling you what amps have what tubes in


----------



## stratocastermarshall

Interesting. I never experienced "flubbiness" with my 40c at gigs. I use full gain when playing Weezer and Radiohead. No problems bouncing between classic and ultra gain channels with classic gain set to about 10 o'clock and ultra gain set to 10. This is in 40 watt mode using a creamback 65 with a volume setting of 4 or 5. So maybe I don't use the amp loud enough to create the problem. Though maybe it's flubby and I just don't know it.

Just throwing this out there...any possibility the pickup height is high and may be contributing to the problem? Are your pickups particularly hot?


----------



## ken361

stratocastermarshall said:


> Interesting. I never experienced "flubbiness" with my 40c at gigs. I use full gain when playing Weezer and Radiohead. No problems bouncing between classic and ultra gain channels with classic gain set to about 10 o'clock and ultra gain set to 10. This is in 40 watt mode using a creamback 65 with a volume setting of 4 or 5. So maybe I don't use the amp loud enough to create the problem. Though maybe it's flubby and I just don't know it.
> 
> Just throwing this out there...any possibility the pickup height is high and may be contributing to the problem? Are your pickups particularly hot?


Never had a issue either !


----------



## recto-robbie

stratocastermarshall said:


> So maybe I don't use the amp loud enough to create the problem. Though maybe it's flubby and I just don't know it.




No, volume isn't the issue, its the amp for sure. It happens whether its full blast or whisper quiet. I run it into mesa 1x12,s with v30s, ran a dual rectifier through them with no issues.

And you would most definitely know this issue if you had it. Are you using humbuckers?

Pickup height isn't the problem, they've been the same height for literally dozens of other amps with no issues.


Ah well I will mess with it a bit more, don't want to turn this into a total issue thread. Ill contact my guy about exchanging it or at least trying another. 
I do wonder how that damn 20 watt head sounds compared to this now.
I'm gonna own one regardless, I'm just not going to deal with issues.


----------



## ken361

hot bias maybe


----------



## stratocastermarshall

recto-robbie said:


> No, volume isn't the issue, its the amp for sure. It happens whether its full blast or whisper quiet. I run it into mesa 1x12,s with v30s, ran a dual rectifier through them with no issues.
> 
> And you would most definitely know this issue if you had it. Are you using humbuckers?
> 
> Pickup height isn't the problem, they've been the same height for literally dozens of other amps with no issues.
> 
> 
> Ah well I will mess with it a bit more, don't want to turn this into a total issue thread. Ill contact my guy about exchanging it or at least trying another.
> I do wonder how that damn 20 watt head sounds compared to this now.
> I'm gonna own one regardless, I'm just not going to deal with issues.



Yeah, using both single coils and humbuckers and I have no issues that I'm aware of. Someone has mentioned a possible bias problem. Before you go thru the hassle of returning/exchanging the amp (assuming you'd need to ship it) you may want to check out that last thing - though checking the bias can be a hassle unto itself because you have to pull the chassis (DSL 40c, right?). And if that isn't it then you likely have something wrong with your amp.


----------



## ken361

bias are crazy over the map some at 46!


----------



## Finnster

ken361 said:


> bias are crazy over the map some at 46!



I wonder why the Marshall manual doesn't give the bias spec. Is this because it is "users preference" ?


----------



## stratocastermarshall

recto-robbie said:


> No, volume isn't the issue, its the amp for sure. It happens whether its full blast or whisper quiet. I run it into mesa 1x12,s with v30s, ran a dual rectifier through them with no issues.
> 
> And you would most definitely know this issue if you had it. Are you using humbuckers?
> 
> Pickup height isn't the problem, they've been the same height for literally dozens of other amps with no issues.
> 
> 
> Ah well I will mess with it a bit more, don't want to turn this into a total issue thread. Ill contact my guy about exchanging it or at least trying another.
> I do wonder how that damn 20 watt head sounds compared to this now.
> I'm gonna own one regardless, I'm just not going to deal with issues.



I looked at your signature and realized you're talking about the 40cr. I haven't gigged my 40cr yet, so perhaps I just haven't noticed the problem yet, though I did run it a low volumes with full gain and didn't notice any issues.

At least with the 40cr checking your bias should be easy if you have a multimeter - no need to pull the chassis.


----------



## ken361

Finnster said:


> I wonder why the Marshall manual doesn't give the bias spec. Is this because it is "users preference" ?


My tech told me marshall doesnt even know why they set there amp hot ! I know some you should like a plexi because its power tube distortion but the dsl is preamp distortion. He said 30 to 32 plate voltage say 450 500 something like that


----------



## ken361

Most go by the bias calculator and think well it says 36 so that must be best and I thought the same until i talked to Dean about it


----------



## recto-robbie

I bought it locally so it should be an easy exchange if they currently have more.


I have been messing with the bias, it came from factory with bias knobs maxed out and read 41. The issue persists whether at 41 or dropped down into the 20s. Doesn't seem to help with the ridiculous flubbing.

If all worked well with it I would eventually pull the chassis and read the plate voltage on pin 3 to get better idea where to bias with the tubes used. 

Thanks for all the help guys I appreciate it.


----------



## ken361

recto-robbie said:


> I bought it locally so it should be an easy exchange if they currently have more.
> 
> 
> I have been messing with the bias, it came from factory with bias knobs maxed out and read 41. The issue persists whether at 41 or dropped down into the 20s. Doesn't seem to help with the ridiculous flubbing.
> 
> If all worked well with it I would eventually pull the chassis and read the plate voltage on pin 3 to get better idea where to bias with the tubes used.
> 
> Thanks for all the help guys I appreciate it.


20 seems way low


----------



## recto-robbie

ken361 said:


> 20 seems way low





Yea it was, it warmed up a bit as I raised it.
Wound up with your suggestion at 32.

Talked to my dealer, all taken care of, getting a new one in short order.


----------



## stratocastermarshall

recto-robbie said:


> Yea it was, it warmed up a bit as I raised it.
> Wound up with your suggestion at 32.
> 
> Talked to my dealer, all taken care of, getting a new one in short order.



Definitely let us know what the new one sounds like. I'm curious as hell.


----------



## Bloodrock

Hey recto-Robbie. I just spent a while cranking my 40cr. I will say that in 20w mode the amp does feel a little looser/squishier on the low end compared to 40w mode, mine doesn’t fart out even with full gain. It gets pretty over saturated and compressed but I don’t get any flubbing out of the speaker. 40w mode sound much better to my ears if you’re playing above bedroom volume. Much tighter and punchier at high volume. Hope you get your issue worked out brother, these are fantastic sounding amps!


----------



## Finnster

Bloodrock said:


> Hey recto-Robbie. I just spent a while cranking my 40cr. I will say that in 20w mode the amp does feel a little looser/squishier on the low end compared to 40w mode, mine doesn’t fart out even with full gain. It gets pretty over saturated and compressed but I don’t get any flubbing out of the speaker. 40w mode sound much better to my ears if you’re playing above bedroom volume. Much tighter and punchier at high volume. Hope you get your issue worked out brother, these are fantastic sounding amps!



Bloorock. I know you changed some tubes. 

What bias level did you finally end up at?


----------



## recto-robbie

Yes they do sound great, even my faulty one, I like it enough that for a second I considered just keeping it as I rarely use the gain over 5-6 on the OD channels anyways, but it would have been eating away at me to no end if I did.


----------



## Bloodrock

Finnster said:


> Bloorock. I know you changed some tubes.
> 
> What bias level did you finally end up at?



I think it sounds best between 32 & 33


----------



## GibsonKramer

Bescu


Bloodrock said:


> Great comparison man. For any one who might be wondering, I swapped the v-type with a v30 a few days ago and the amp sounds even better imo. Not a world of difference actually but I’m a v30 guy. After comparing the two, the v-type is a lot like a v30 mixed with a greenback. A little smoother but still some of the v30 mid bite. I think most will be extremely happy with the v-type.



This was the answer I was looking for. Was curious about that "v-type" designation.

I'm trading my DSL40C for the new CR. First thing I did with the C, was throw a Marshall branded Vintage 30 in there. I'm trading the amp back in, with the old Seventy/80.

So, I'll most likely be throwing my broken in, UK V30 into the new CR. 

Should have it tomorrow.


----------



## stratocastermarshall

Minor evaluation follow-up to my 40c/40cr side-by-side comparison.

I ran the 40cr using the creamback 65 in my 40c cabinet as an extension speaker. Then just did some low volume power chord crunching with various gain settings between 4 and 10 on both channels using all modes.

Conclusions:
1) Two speakers are better than one.
2) The thump of the 40c I referenced in the original review was largely, if not wholly, due to the broken in creamback 65. As I changed my directional position in front of each speaker you could definitely hear/feel the thump in front of the creamback. I doubt much, if any of that, had to do with the cabinet of the 40c (while identical dimensionally, the back panel is slightly different). And how much of that thump was due to a broken in vs new speaker, that I don't know.
3) The more pronounced mids and highs in the 40cr are due in large part to the v type. When I moved in front of the v type it was obvious. I've never owned a Vintage 30. I understand the v type is Vintage 30-like. Now I understand what everyone means about the more pronounced mids. It would be interesting to hear what a broken in v-type sounds like. Maybe I'll keep the v-type in for a while rather than swapping in my creamback right away.

Both speakers sound great - just different. And no perceived volume difference with the 1 db difference in sensitivity (not surprisingly). I was thinking about building a 2x12 extension cabinet, but maybe I'll just build a 1x12 using either the creamback or v-type in it. Another thing I found with this type of test (as limited as it is) is that mixing speakers may be of dubious benefit relative to getting a blend of sound characteristics from the different speakers. I found the sound characteristics to be highly directional unless I stood right between the speakers. While an audience may hear a blend, you as the guitarist standing in front of your amp are pretty much going to hear the speaker that's closest to your ears.

While I hope the thread doesn't veer off into speakers comparisons, I just thought I'd bring up what I found speaker-wise since the creamback is often used in the 40c and might be relative to someone interested in comparing a 40cr and a 40c.

So again, I'd say the dsl40cr is a pretty complete sounding package out-of-the-box. Very, very nice. It's at least as good sounding and balanced as a 40c with a c19 mod, and has a better standard speaker, nicer features with the dual masters, more useable footswitch (with LEDs), power switching built into the standby, external bias points, emulated out, etc. Very well worth the extra $50 over the 40c. Without getting into potential features like separate channel EQs, the only possible additional benefit I can think of would be if it came standard with the 6 channel footswitch (and more seamless channel switching).


----------



## Gary harrer

I've got chance of a nearly new neo creamback, do you think it would be a worthwhile upgrade to the fitted v-type


----------



## Bloodrock

Gary harrer said:


> I've got chance of a nearly new neo creamback, do you think it would be a worthwhile upgrade to the fitted v-type



Haven’t tried a Neo. If it sound like the regular cream back I’d say it could be an improvement. And make the amp a little lighter


----------



## Finnster

Gary harrer said:


> I've got chance of a nearly new neo creamback, do you think it would be a worthwhile upgrade to the fitted v-type



I've had both a neo and a regular Cream. I couldn't hear any difference. I didn't care for the H75 Cream.... it was a bit harsh on the highs.


----------



## Finnster

FWIW....I just had a chance to check my bias on my 40CR.
It was 38/35 from the factory.

I settled on 32.4/32.4. I was trying to get both sides equal and just ended up there. It’s nice having to exposed ports.


----------



## ken361

Finnster said:


> FWIW....I just had a chance to check my bias on my 40CR.
> It was 38/35 from the factory.
> 
> I settled on 32.4/32.4. I was trying to get both sides equal and just ended up there. It’s nice having to exposed ports.


how is it now


----------



## Finnster

ken361 said:


> how is it now



Only had about 5minutes to test. When I get back home I will run thru it some more at volume and repost.


----------



## Gary harrer

Anyone tried a creamback yet?
Or new tubes?


----------



## Tbomb

Finnster said:


> Only had about 5minutes to test. When I get back home I will run thru it some more at volume and repost.





recto-robbie said:


> Yea it was, it warmed up a bit as I raised it.
> Wound up with your suggestion at 32.
> Talked to my dealer, all taken care of, getting a new one in short order.



I seem to be having same issue. Bottom end is very flubby on my new dsl40cr and have been using a ts9 to tighten things up. Love the tone with the ts9 out front, but I agree you shouldn't have to use an overdrive. I had same issue with my 40c. Just figured that's the way it was designed and used it with my ts9 on at all times. Never did check bias since...so I will do that soon, but I am very interested to see if the new one you're getting is any better.....if you figure this out please let me know. Thanks!


----------



## ken361

red should be pretty tight check bias the crunch has more bass


----------



## GibsonKramer

Finnster said:


> FWIW....I just had a chance to check my bias on my 40CR.
> It was 38/35 from the factory.
> 
> I settled on 32.4/32.4. I was trying to get both sides equal and just ended up there. It’s nice having to exposed ports.



Mine were at like 34.6, and 35.4. I got them damn near equal, with considerable warm-up, at 35.1.

I'd like to hear your experience with 32.

EDIT: @Bloodrock... now I'm OCD thinking, setting mine to 32.

Since its only about 5 minutes, with taking the screws out... my daughter and her slooooooow ways... I'm going to end up in my guitar cave, she's going to come out ready to leave, be like "WTF!"

C'mon man... I need an update!


----------



## Finnster

I got to,play it some. Im still finding the bass a bit flabby with low output humbuckers in the neck position on the clean channel. 

Didn’t notice a huge difference after the rebias. A TS tightens up the bass quite a bit...probably because it’s takimg some bass away.

My settings are (clock)
Clean/crunch:
G-11 using Master #2 at 2:30 for clean
V-12

Ultra:
G-12
V-1

T-9:30
M-12
B-9:30
Tone Shift IN
P-9:30
Resonance-11

I’m utilizing all 4modes with midi and my FX8.

Also, I tried the emulated out. Other than some hum(which could possibly be resolved with a DI box) it sounded great. I can see blending it with a mic’d cab at a gig. The emulated out is a tad darker but combined with the cab speaker....it sounds great.


----------



## GibsonKramer

Clean channel, neck position. Two places I won't spend much time. Though, if I were... I suppose it might be annoying.

You're switching between all 4 modes, through the MIDI out on a Fractal FX8? Wow... that's pretty cool.

I probably won't ever use the emulated out. I might try it, but I don't know about continued interest in using it. I'm dead set on getting this room to sound better. I really just need to add some more stuff, to kill some of the wet sound. Probably should do a bigger rug, as well.

Now I'm debating whether I should mess with the bias, if you don't think its impacting tone that much. Tubes will last a little longer, I suppose.

I'm still sensing a big winner here, for me. I hope they did their QC and we don't see problems cropping up in the future. I think all my amps have a weakness in some area. I'm not into modeling so I use different amps, for different things. If its weak point, is passable in a situation that I might use... then I can live with that, for its strong points, if those are what strokes my needs. So far, I haven't had so much as a hiccup. I took the Wah out of the chain, that's been causing my volume issues. I need to rebuild my pedalboard.

I don't remember anyone mentioning the FX loop?


----------



## Finnster

FX loop is working flawlessly. 

@GibsonKramer ....I agree with your assessment on different amps form different situations. My Mesa TC-50 is great, 3 awesome channels with individual EQ on each...BUT it can’t sound like this Marshall....and vice versa. I just prefer the Marshall tone for 80% of the stuff I play. The other 20% will be a compromise. 

The DSL cleans up better with the volume on the guitar than the Mesa does.


----------



## ken361

Best way for me to dial is to play loud! its probably a pickup height thing and lower your bass side or maybe raise the treble till your locked in. Humbuckers are usually like 2mm on the bass and 1.5 treb side for the bridge. Neck 2mm both sides. Remember speaker needs a good 30 hrs in that might be the issue. I always re dial my guitars in with a new amp just fine tune it. Try nothing running up front or in the loop for complete amp tone. I only been at it for 10 years so some of you might have a lot more experience. Also raising the pole pieces does a great deal to smooth it out.


----------



## stratocastermarshall

Gary harrer said:


> Anyone tried a creamback yet?
> Or new tubes?


Not yet, but I will be putting in a well broken in creamback 65 and some different pre-amp tubes within the next couple weeks.


----------



## LCW

Finnster said:


> FWIW....I just had a chance to check my bias on my 40CR.
> It was 38/35 from the factory.
> 
> I settled on 32.4/32.4. I was trying to get both sides equal and just ended up there. It’s nice having to exposed ports.



Did you also check plate voltage?


----------



## GibsonKramer

How many have the socket adapter?

I do. But, I've taken the back panel off like 10 times. I wanna play it for a while.


----------



## Gary harrer

I'm getting the neo creamback to throw in.
In regards to the preamp tubes I'm convinced this is the cause of the Flubb that people are reporting.


----------



## Finnster

LCW said:


> Did you also check plate voltage?



I did not. I need to, I just didn’t have time.


----------



## ken361

I know the creamback 65 is pretty tight, might be the 100.00 speaker


----------



## Wolvieberzerker

Just ordered one of these myself. I'm hoping to find that in between spot of my DSL5c and 2203kk. I'm pumped. Demos sound good, I'm a fan of the 5 watter.


----------



## Tbomb

Wolvieberzerker said:


> Just ordered one of these myself. I'm hoping to find that in between spot of my DSL5c and 2203kk. I'm pumped. Demos sound good, I'm a fan of the 5 watter.



It really is a great sounding amp and I think it is a definite improvement over the previous DSL40C. I have a Creamback g12h 75 loaded in mine right now. I do like the V Type, but the creamback just seems fuller sounding to me. On a previous post I did mention that I do get some low end flubbing on the Ultra channel and now that I think about it maybe it’s the Creamback with that heavy magnet. When I put a tube screamer in front though it tightens up very well and just sounds amazing.


----------



## ken361

Tbomb said:


> It really is a great sounding amp and I think it is a definite improvement over the previous DSL40C. I have a Creamback g12h 75 loaded in mine right now. I do like the V Type, but the creamback just seems fuller sounding to me. On a previous post I did mention that I do get some low end flubbing on the Ultra channel and now that I think about it maybe it’s the Creamback with that heavy magnet. When I put a tube screamer in front though it tightens up very well and just sounds amazing.


anything in your chain? try straight in?


----------



## Finnster

Tbomb said:


> It really is a great sounding amp and I think it is a definite improvement over the previous DSL40C. I have a Creamback g12h 75 loaded in mine right now. I do like the V Type, but the creamback just seems fuller sounding to me. On a previous post I did mention that I do get some low end flubbing on the Ultra channel and now that I think about it maybe it’s the Creamback with that heavy magnet. When I put a tube screamer in front though it tightens up very well and just sounds amazing.



I have the same result with a TS pedal and I'm running the stock V-Type. 

Where do you have your Bass and Resonance set?


----------



## GibsonKramer

That's probably my biggest tone issue right now. Adjusting the Bass and Resonance. I haven't had this problem on the other Marshalls I've had with it, especially my JVM.

I can't seem to dial in the tightness on the bass I want. My room is a pretty wet sound, but I can tighten it up on my other amps.

They're not set anyplace particular, I'm still trying to find that sweet spot. Though, I'm still trying to find the channel I like best.


----------



## ken361

GibsonKramer said:


> That's probably my biggest tone issue right now. Adjusting the Bass and Resonance. I haven't had this problem on the other Marshalls I've had with it, especially my JVM.
> 
> I can't seem to dial in the tightness on the bass I want. My room is a pretty wet sound, but I can tighten it up on my other amps.
> 
> They're not set anyplace particular, I'm still trying to find that sweet spot. Though, I'm still trying to find the channel I like best.


It might be the master volume causing the bass issue.When I tried it at low levels if it was too high I noticed the bass was looser can you bypass it? when I had a HW AC15 shutting the master off at loud volume it seemed smoother and a little more clearer sounding.


----------



## LCW

Finnster said:


> I have the same result with a TS pedal and I'm running the stock V-Type.
> 
> Where do you have your Bass and Resonance set?



Short clip of my CR with a TS (Maxon OD-9) in front. First half with it off. Then with it on. Super simple riff (don't judge lol). Difference is sort of subtle. I think. Is this similar to what you guys are hearing in terms of bass with and without a TS?

Gibson SG, bridge pickup (498T).

Classic Crunch channel. Gain full. Channel volume 10 o'clock. Treble noon. Mid 8 o'clock. Bass 1 o'clock. Presence 12:30. Resonance 11:30. Master 11:00.

TS settings - Drive 7:30. Tone 10:00. Level 11:00.


----------



## jericbrazier

Mystic38 said:


> trust me, am no expert on the dsl40 at all....but let me try?..
> 
> if you are looking solely at the front panel, and its a two channel amp with one mode per channel, then no it makes no sense, as of course you dont need more than 1 channel volume per channel and one master.
> 
> BUT
> 
> with midi control you have two channels with two modes per channel ..so its now a 4 "channel" amp ... and so the second "master" comes into play for setting volume levels for boosted parts or whatever..


That’s cool, I dont notice a volume difference between clean 1 and ultra 1, but between clean 1 and 2(crunch) it is huge. It makes it impossible to switch between the 2 w/o adjustment. 
The new dsls sound like they’re pretty cool. I got the last incarnation in 2015, and love it (after a speaker and tube swap). I’d be interested in the new one, but my wife got me the older one for my 40th bday, and it has a lot of sentimental value. Having 2 seems silly. I’d be down for the 1w head, but I’m not a fan of el84 tone. I’ve had 2 amps with 84s (Vox ac4 and Mesa Studio 22+), and I much prefer the tone of the amps I’ve owned that have something bigger in the engine room. 
Congrats to all y’all with the new ones, seems like a score!


----------



## ken361

LCW said:


> Short clip of my CR with a TS (Maxon OD-9) in front. First half with it off. Then with it on. Super simple riff (don't judge lol). Difference is sort of subtle. I think. Is this similar to what you guys are hearing in terms of bass with and without a TS?
> 
> Gibson SG, bridge pickup (498T).
> 
> Classic Crunch channel. Gain full. Channel volume 10 o'clock. Treble noon. Mid 8 o'clock. Bass 1 o'clock. Presence 12:30. Resonance 11:30. Master 11:00.
> 
> TS settings - Drive 7:30. Tone 10:00. Level 11:00.


 Sounds fine
keep in mind the pedal isnt true bypass so when its off there is some tone suck! I wont use one that way anymore because sometimes I want less gain and when I turn it off its more bassy unless you keep it on all the time. What I do with Fryette SAS pedal even though its true bypass I put the pedal on top of the amp and use a patch cable instead of a second long cable for less signal loss


----------



## jericbrazier

Tbomb said:


> I seem to be having same issue. Bottom end is very flubby on my new dsl40cr and have been using a ts9 to tighten things up. Love the tone with the ts9 out front, but I agree you shouldn't have to use an overdrive. I had same issue with my 40c. Just figured that's the way it was designed and used it with my ts9 on at all times. Never did check bias since...so I will do that soon, but I am very interested to see if the new one you're getting is any better.....if you figure this out please let me know. Thanks!


Me too, I got a Keeley Oxblood (very similar to Tumnus Deluxe) on all the time. I run lead 1 with the gain on 6, w/o pedal it’s really loose (palm muting sounds s$&@ty). I keep the od on all the time ( on clean channel it gives my tone a nice girth) with drive set to 8:30, tone noon, level at unity. For leads, I’ve a MXR microamp in the boost.


----------



## LCW

ken361 said:


> Sounds fine
> keep in mind the pedal isnt true bypass so when its off there is some tone suck! I wont use one that way anymore because sometimes I want less gain and when I turn it off its more bassy unless you keep it on all the time. What I do with Fryette SAS pedal even though its true bypass I put the pedal on top of the amp and use a patch cable instead of a second long cable for less signal loss



I thought I read somewhere that the OD-9 has true bypass compared to the Ibanez TS-9 - not that it matters to me.


----------



## ken361

LCW said:


> I thought I read somewhere that the OD-9 has true bypass compared to the Ibanez TS-9 - not that it matters to me.


its possible I was thinking TS9 maxons are good.


----------



## ken361

jericbrazier said:


> Me too, I got a Keeley Oxblood (very similar to Tumnus Deluxe) on all the time. I run lead 1 with the gain on 6, w/o pedal it’s really loose (palm muting sounds s$&@ty). I keep the od on all the time ( on clean channel it gives my tone a nice girth) with drive set to 8:30, tone noon, level at unity. For leads, I’ve a MXR microamp in the boost.


Have the new CR? sounds like a issue , older ones no problems


----------



## Finnster

jericbrazier said:


> That’s cool, I dont notice a volume difference between clean 1 and ultra 1, but between clean 1 and 2(crunch) it is huge. It makes it impossible to switch between the 2 w/o adjustment.
> The new dsls sound like they’re pretty cool. I got the last incarnation in 2015, and love it (after a speaker and tube swap). I’d be interested in the new one, but my wife got me the older one for my 40th bday, and it has a lot of sentimental value. Having 2 seems silly. I’d be down for the 1w head, but I’m not a fan of el84 tone. I’ve had 2 amps with 84s (Vox ac4 and Mesa Studio 22+), and I much prefer the tone of the amps I’ve owned that have something bigger in the engine room.
> Congrats to all y’all with the new ones, seems like a score!



Here is how I combat this. 
I use midi switching. Crunch, OD1 and OD2 are assigned to the same Master Volume. Clean gets the other Master Volume turned up to match the others.

Works like a charm.


----------



## LCW

jericbrazier said:


> That’s cool, I dont notice a volume difference between clean 1 and ultra 1, but between clean 1 and 2(crunch) it is huge. It makes it impossible to switch between the 2 w/o adjustment.



This is why the assignable dual master volumes in the 40CR is so useful.


----------



## LCW

Finnster said:


> Here is how I combat this.
> I use midi switching. Crunch, OD1 and OD2 are assigned to the same Master Volume. Clean gets the other Master Volume turned up to match the others.
> 
> Works like a charm.



Don’t even need MIDI switching as the amp remembers which master is assigned to which channel.


----------



## Finnster

LCW said:


> Don’t even need MIDI switching as the amp remembers which master is assigned to which channel.



True. But if you want to use all 4-modes you need either midi or the optional footswitch that seems to be a unicorn at the moment....lol.


----------



## LCW

Finnster said:


> True. But if you want to use all 4-modes you need either midi or the optional footswitch that seems to be a unicorn at the moment....lol.



Ah gotcha. In that case you’re absolutely right.


----------



## Gary harrer

I use the line 6 helix to switch channels via midi.
I can also add a gain block to switch in to level the volume on any channel I choose leaving the second master for a solo boost.
Sooo many options with the helix connected


----------



## Finnster

Gary harrer said:


> I use the line 6 helix to switch channels via midi.
> I can also add a gain block to switch in to level the volume on any channel I choose leaving the second master for a solo boost.
> Sooo many options with the helix connected



Yep! I use a filter block in the loop with FX8 for similar results.


----------



## jericbrazier

Finnster said:


> Here is how I combat this.
> I use midi switching. Crunch, OD1 and OD2 are assigned to the same Master Volume. Clean gets the other Master Volume turned up to match the others.
> 
> Works like a charm.


Sounds like it would, problem is; I have dsl40c from 2015. So no midi switching, I don’t have a switching system like a G2, someday(fingers crossed) either. Would one of those work with the previous dsls?


----------



## Gary harrer

You could use the trs switching, however this would only give you the same switching options as the supplied footswith but also has the capability to switch in effects and/or stomps at the same time.
I'm referring to the g2 here but helix and ax8 can do the same


----------



## jericbrazier

ken361 said:


> Have the new CR? sounds like a issue , older ones no problems


I’ve got a ‘15 dsl40c. I love it. I have a Mesa Studio .22+ that rarely gets played. I like the Marshall’s clean more, and I love that KERRANG of a cranked Marshall. I have a fondness for EL34 amp’s. The Mesa has el84s, and I used to have a Vox AC4 with el84s. IMHO they just don’t have the balls of a el34. Sorry for the tangent, but I just can’t say enough good things about my dsl40c.


----------



## jericbrazier

Gary harrer said:


> You could use the trs switching, however this would only give you the same switching options as the supplied footswith but also has the capability to switch in effects and/or stomps at the same time.
> I'm referring to the g2 here but helix and ax8 can do the same


I’m definitely more into a switcher than a modeler. Don’t get me wrong, the higher end ones sound killer, but I love the tone of my amp, and I’ve spent years putting together my board. It’s not a flight deck, but it has the bases covered exactly how I want them to be. In the trial and error process, I’ve also accrued a bunch of extras that are fun to put in when I want something a little different. 
Long story short (too late) I have a blast trying different pedals, and sometimes even make a couple bucks flipping the ones I know won’t get used.


----------



## ken361

jericbrazier said:


> I’ve got a ‘15 dsl40c. I love it. I have a Mesa Studio .22+ that rarely gets played. I like the Marshall’s clean more, and I love that KERRANG of a cranked Marshall. I have a fondness for EL34 amp’s. The Mesa has el84s, and I used to have a Vox AC4 with el84s. IMHO they just don’t have the balls of a el34. Sorry for the tangent, but I just can’t say enough good things about my dsl40c.


Had the mini rec for awhile it was no marshall though little vox also.


----------



## Tbomb

ken361 said:


> anything in your chain? try straight in?



When I run straight in I have the issue as well. Any new amp I get I always run them that way for a bit to get a feel for the amp and what it can/can’t do.


----------



## Tbomb

Finnster said:


> I have the same result with a TS pedal and I'm running the stock V-Type.
> 
> Where do you have your Bass and Resonance set?



Bass and Resonance are set right around 9:00


----------



## Tbomb

LCW said:


> Short clip of my CR with a TS (Maxon OD-9) in front. First half with it off. Then with it on. Super simple riff (don't judge lol). Difference is sort of subtle. I think. Is this similar to what you guys are hearing in terms of bass with and without a TS?
> 
> Gibson SG, bridge pickup (498T).
> 
> Classic Crunch channel. Gain full. Channel volume 10 o'clock. Treble noon. Mid 8 o'clock. Bass 1 o'clock. Presence 12:30. Resonance 11:30. Master 11:00.
> 
> TS settings - Drive 7:30. Tone 10:00. Level 11:00.




Sorta...however I notice the low end flubbiness more on the Ultra Channel. That’s where the TS really helps to tighten things up.


----------



## Tbomb

jericbrazier said:


> Me too, I got a Keeley Oxblood (very similar to Tumnus Deluxe) on all the time. I run lead 1 with the gain on 6, w/o pedal it’s really loose (palm muting sounds s$&@ty). I keep the od on all the time ( on clean channel it gives my tone a nice girth) with drive set to 8:30, tone noon, level at unity. For leads, I’ve a MXR microamp in the boost.



Nice to know it not just me. Maybe that’s just the way it’s designed. I’m very happy with the tone pushing the front end with an OD. I could just be my ears and expectations, but I agree palm mutes on Ultra Channel sound like crap unless they are tightened up with an OD


----------



## ken361

Tbomb said:


> Nice to know it not just me. Maybe that’s just the way it’s designed. I’m very happy with the tone pushing the front end with an OD. I could just be my ears and expectations, but I agree palm mutes on Ultra Channel sound like crap unless they are tightened up with an OD


sounds like a design flaw or its the speaker mines totally fine for mutes. Creamback is pretty tight


----------



## ken361

Lead 2 gain on 3 at bedroom levels but sounds great and tight loud also. i usually use lead 1 most of the time though


----------



## Finnster

ken361 said:


> Lead 2 gain on 3 at bedroom levels but sounds great and tight loud also. i usually use lead 1 most of the time though




Sounds great.
Can you post you settings?


----------



## Tbomb

ken361 said:


> Lead 2 gain on 3 at bedroom levels but sounds great and tight loud also. i usually use lead 1 most of the time though




Nice!!!! Yeah mine doesn’t sound that tight without an OD up front. What do you have EQ, Presence and Resonance set at? I’m also on Lead 1 most of the time, but will use Lead 2 for some more modern heavy stuff when I need a little bit more gain.


----------



## ken361

Trb 6 mids 7 bass 3 resonance 3 pres 6


----------



## LCW

Tbomb said:


> Nice to know it not just me. Maybe that’s just the way it’s designed. I’m very happy with the tone pushing the front end with an OD. I could just be my ears and expectations, but I agree palm mutes on Ultra Channel sound like crap unless they are tightened up with an OD



recording stuff - granted via iphone X, but listening back with headphones - makes it sound way less bassy than what it sounded like playing... so my take is possibly "the sound in my/your/one's head" isn't necessarily accurate...


----------



## Dmann

I wouldn't expect the 2012 DSL40C design with a Creamback to sound anything like a 2018 design DSL40CR with a Seventy 80 speaker regardless of settings.

just looking at the guts it's a completely different amp.


----------



## Gary harrer

ken361 said:


> sounds like a design flaw or its the speaker mines totally fine for mutes. Creamback is pretty tight



Are you using the 40c or 40cr?


----------



## ken361

40c


----------



## ken361

Dmann said:


> I wouldn't expect the 2012 DSL40C design with a Creamback to sound anything like a 2018 design DSL40CR with a Seventy 80 speaker regardless of settings.
> 
> just looking at the guts it's a completely different amp.


I played them side by side lastweek at store levels it didnt seem that different


----------



## ken361

someone on Facebook owns both he said the same thing correct bias and a creamback


----------



## Bloodrock

I just played my dsl40cr for about 30 minuets and I don’t get any flub on ultra gain. I’m running bass and resonance at 5. Lead 2, gain on 3 is nice tight chuggy metal.


----------



## Gary harrer

Bloodrock said:


> I just played my dsl40cr for about 30 minuets and I don’t get any flub on ultra gain. I’m running bass and resonance at 5. Lead 2, gain on 3 is nice tight chuggy metal.


I'm guessing people are using far more gain than this when the issue occurs


----------



## LCW

Gary harrer said:


> I'm guessing people are using far more gain than this when the issue occurs



Possibly also people cranking the Resonance or dialing in too much Bass.


----------



## Tbomb

Bloodrock said:


> I just played my dsl40cr for about 30 minuets and I don’t get any flub on ultra gain. I’m running bass and resonance at 5. Lead 2, gain on 3 is nice tight chuggy metal.



I’m using Lead 1 on Ultra Channel most of the time with gain @ about 6-7. Bass and resonance at 9 o’clock. So maybe too much gain?


----------



## Bloodrock

Possibly. These amps have plenty of gain. No need to go over noon for me. Also what type of music are you trying to play? These amps aren’t going to give you Recto type metal chunk.


----------



## Tbomb

Bloodrock said:


> Possibly. These amps have plenty of gain. No need to go over noon for me. Also what type of music are you trying to play? These amps aren’t going to give you Recto type metal chunk.



I play mainly 90’s and early 2000’s hard rock my band; think Alice In Chains, Stone Temple Pilots (Core album), Godsmack, etc... also love the hard rock tones of the 80’s as well. Not a huge fan of the newer metal tones.


----------



## Bloodrock

Tbomb said:


> I play mainly 90’s and early 2000’s hard rock my band; think Alice In Chains, Stone Temple Pilots (Core album), Godsmack, etc... also love the hard rock tones of the 80’s as well. Not a huge fan of the newer metal tones.



Maybe try using ultra 2 with the gain at 2-3, it will be tighter but more saturated. Make sure you’re not dialing back the mids and highs too much also. Marshalls are bright amps and will get muddy if you try to dial the treble and mids back too much


----------



## LCW

Tried another pedal today. Great for old school Metallica. Proco Rat (distortion 8:00, filter 11:00, level 11:30) into OD2 with gain at 11:00, (T 11:30, M 8:30, B 11:00, P 9:30, R 10:30). Nice and tight!


----------



## Gary harrer

Are the physical dimensions the same as the old 40c??
I need to buy a cover


----------



## solarburn

.


----------



## solarburn

Gary harrer said:


> We are talking about the new cr here, not the 40c



And which version you like?


----------



## Gary harrer

solarburnDSL50 said:


> And which version you like?



I reported your comment calling everyone pussies, I notice you have now removed it.
People are having a descussion about the amp and you come in with petty name calling for absolutely no reason.
Take a bow


----------



## Tbomb

Bloodrock said:


> Maybe try using ultra 2 with the gain at 2-3, it will be tighter but more saturated. Make sure you’re not dialing back the mids and highs too much also. Marshalls are bright amps and will get muddy if you try to dial the treble and mids back too much



Tried your suggestion and while it did tighten things up but it also lost some of it’s oomph. For whatever reason I just can’t get it to sound like some of clips people have posted here and on You Tube. Had gain on 3 (Ultra) mids @ noon and treble on 7. No matter.... I played my previous 40C with a TS out front for same reason and I will just do the same with the new 40CR. I never did get around to checking the bias....maybe I’ll do that this weekend if there’s time. Love the amp even though I need to push it with a TS to get it where I like it. I appreciate all the input. Happy Friday all.....Cheers!


----------



## Gary harrer

Tbomb said:


> Tried your suggestion and while it did tighten things up but it also lost some of it’s oomph. For whatever reason I just can’t get it to sound like some of clips people have posted here and on You Tube. Had gain on 3 (Ultra) mids @ noon and treble on 7. No matter.... I played my previous 40C with a TS out front for same reason and I will just do the same with the new 40CR. I never did get around to checking the bias....maybe I’ll do that this weekend if there’s time. Love the amp even though I need to push it with a TS to get it where I like it. I appreciate all the input. Happy Friday all.....Cheers!


Do you run the ts with the gain all the way off?


----------



## ken361

Tbomb said:


> Tried your suggestion and while it did tighten things up but it also lost some of it’s oomph. For whatever reason I just can’t get it to sound like some of clips people have posted here and on You Tube. Had gain on 3 (Ultra) mids @ noon and treble on 7. No matter.... I played my previous 40C with a TS out front for same reason and I will just do the same with the new 40CR. I never did get around to checking the bias....maybe I’ll do that this weekend if there’s time. Love the amp even though I need to push it with a TS to get it where I like it. I appreciate all the input. Happy Friday all.....Cheers!


Like I said your pickups might be too low, the neck can play a big role to the bridge output believe it or not you have a mechanics ruler? and measure by placing a finger on the last fret. It cant hurt to try.


----------



## Snowdogyyz

Gary harrer said:


> Are the physical dimensions the same as the old 40c??
> I need to buy a cover



Let me know if you find one! I’ve been looking and have only found a generic one on reverb. I’m assuming they are the same size.


----------



## Tbomb

Gary harrer said:


> Do you run the ts with the gain all the way off?



Yes...still get just a hair of dirt when on clean channel, which I like. I use a second OD (SD-1) for solo boosts, but that stays off most of the time.


----------



## Finnster

Snowdogyyz said:


> Let me know if you find one! I’ve been looking and have only found a generic one on reverb. I’m assuming they are the same size.



Look at Studio Slips. They make amazingly good quality covers with lots of options.


----------



## Tbomb

ken361 said:


> Like I said your pickups might be too low, the neck can play a big role to the bridge output believe it or not you have a mechanics ruler? and measure by placing a finger on the last fret. It cant hurt to try.



I'll check it out. I play mainly on bridge pickup, which is either a Burstbucker Pro or Classic '57 depending on the guitar I use. I usually tend to set pickup height according to Gibson specs, which for the bridge is 1/16" I believe.


----------



## bill0287

What kind of leads do I need to use with my multi-meter read the bias ports on the 40CR? My meters only have the needle tips?


----------



## kingbee

Needle tips slide right in nicely!


----------



## GibsonKramer

Gary harrer said:


> Are the physical dimensions the same as the old 40c??
> I need to buy a cover



Exact same dimensions. I had limited space, and it slipped right in, where the 40C was. Also, as I had a chance to A/B them, I placed one on top of the other. Exact.



bill0287 said:


> What kind of leads do I need to use with my multi-meter read the bias ports on the 40CR? My meters only have the needle tips?



Those are perfect for it.


----------



## LPMarshall hack

Gary harrer said:


> I reported your comment calling everyone pussies, I notice you have now removed it.
> People are having a descussion about the amp and you come in with petty name calling for absolutely no reason.
> Take a bow


Knowing Solar, he said it in jest. No need to get worked up about it.

Welcome to MF btw!


----------



## GibsonKramer

LPMarshall hack said:


> Knowing Solar, he said it in jest. No need to get worked up about it.
> 
> Welcome to MF btw!



First rule of Fight Club...


----------



## bill0287

kingbee said:


> Needle tips slide right in nicely!



Thanks. I thought I saw a picture somewhere that looked like the ports might fit banana tips, where maybe I wouldn't need to hold the leads. I could be mistaken.

With that said, are there any good videos that walk you through the bias process. I saw a couple online, but wondered what you guys were using.

I don't have the amp yet, but when I pick it up I just want to get a starter reading and go from there.


----------



## solarburn

Gary harrer said:


> I reported your comment calling everyone pussies, I notice you have now removed it.
> People are having a descussion about the amp and you come in with petty name calling for absolutely no reason.
> Take a bow



My bad. Please forgive my name calling. Sometimes I'm the village idiot.

Oh and welcome to the forum!


----------



## solarburn

ken361 said:


> Lead 2 gain on 3 at bedroom levels but sounds great and tight loud also. i usually use lead 1 most of the time though




Fucking mayhem bro. You chuggernaught! Nice!played meanly.


----------



## bad565ss

solarburnDSL50 said:


> My bad. Please forgive my name calling. Sometimes I'm the village idiot.
> 
> Oh and welcome to the forum!



ALMOST everybody was hip to what you were layin' down Bro.


----------



## solarburn

bad565ss said:


> ALMOST everybody was hip to what you were layin' down Bro.



Thanks man. I just don't want scare away new members with my antics.


----------



## bad565ss

My opinion is that new members should take the time to look around and get a feel for the party before they start making assumptions and creating misunderstandings, but that's just me.


----------



## solarburn

bad565ss said:


> My opinion is that new members should take the time to look around and get a feel for the party before they start making assumptions and creating misunderstandings, but that's just me.



You're a seasoned member. I think he misunderstood me and took me seriously. Thanks for understanding I meant no harm. Preciate it!


----------



## whitecloud

kingbee said:


> Needle tips slide right in nicely!


But that breaks the one hand in there at a time rule. That said I did just that but am still shopping for mini-clip ends that have female end on the other side to connect to needle end lead or just a totally separate lead for the DVM


----------



## solarburn

.


----------



## Gary harrer

LPMarshall hack said:


> Knowing Solar, he said it in jest. No need to get worked up about it.
> 
> Welcome to MF btw!



I'm certainly not worked up, I guess the problem with text in general is it almost impossible to know how things are meant.
No harm done.

I'm coming to the dsl from long jvm usage, mainly a jvmjs and highly modified jvm 410 h,
They were a little overkill for the pubs and clubs I play in.


----------



## solarburn

Gary harrer said:


> I'm certainly not worked up, I guess the problem with text in general is it almost impossible to know how things are meant.
> No harm done.
> 
> I'm coming to the dsl from long jvm usage, mainly a jvmjs and highly modified jvm 410 h,
> They were a little overkill for the pubs and clubs I play in.



You were right. I was an indiot!

So amp wise what's going on?


----------



## Gary harrer

solarburnDSL50 said:


> You were right. I was an indiot!
> 
> So amp wise what's going on?



I've had the dsl 40cr for a week, had very little time to play it due to work, got the midi switching sorted with a line 6 helix which I will be using for effects.
Picking up a creamback neo tomorrow to throw in.I'm not totally happy with the v-type, that kind of slightly muffled mid forward sound isn't really my thing, I'd rather get a clearer speaker and turn up the mids

I'll report my thoughts once fitted


----------



## kingbee

Finally gigged my 40CR last night. Sounds so good. The speaker emulated output to the mixer sounded good too. I did have a problem when I would change channels and it wouldn't go back to the Master Volume that it was last on. This morning it all seems good again. Weird. Also, when the foot switch is NOT plugged in, changing channels manually remembers if the fx loop was on or not. Once the foot switch is plugged in is doesn't remember. Only on or off according to what the foot switch is set at. Not sure that this is the way it is supposed to be.


----------



## LCW

Rat into the 40CR...


----------



## Bloodrock

LCW said:


> Rat into the 40CR...




I’ve been thinking about getting a RAT for a while. Now I gotta order one. Is that boosting lead 1?


----------



## solarburn

LCW said:


> Rat into the 40CR...




Like that!


----------



## LCW

Bloodrock said:


> I’ve been thinking about getting a RAT for a while. Now I gotta order one. Is that boosting lead 1?



OD2, gain about 11:00. Distortion on Rat like 8:00 ie low. Filter about 11:30 or noon.


----------



## LCW

Bloodrock said:


> I’ve been thinking about getting a RAT for a while. Now I gotta order one. Is that boosting lead 1?



70 at Sweetwater right now. No tax. Free ship. Can’t beat.


----------



## Finnster

LCW said:


> 70 at Sweetwater right now. No tax. Free ship. Can’t beat.



Well my Fractal FX8 has a “Rat” in it. I generally only use the TS808 in the FX8 but now I’m going to try the Rat!! 

Thanks for the suggestion. Sounded really good.


----------



## Gary harrer

Finnster said:


> Well my Fractal FX8 has a “Rat” in it. I generally only use the TS808 in the FX8 but now I’m going to try the Rat!!
> 
> Thanks for the suggestion. Sounded really good.



Haha..... I thought that, I have a rat, a ts a klon and a Timmy.

Oh sorry it's called a helix


----------



## LCW

Finnster said:


> Well my Fractal FX8 has a “Rat” in it. I generally only use the TS808 in the FX8 but now I’m going to try the Rat!!
> 
> Thanks for the suggestion. Sounded really good.



Thank you. I’m still very much learning. But it’s so much fun! I’m digging experimenting with pedals. I’m starting with the old standbys (have OD-9 aka TS and the RAT).


----------



## Gary harrer

LCW said:


> Thank you. I’m still very much learning. But it’s so much fun! I’m digging experimenting with pedals. I’m starting with the old standbys (have OD-9 aka TS and the RAT).


I think a treble booster into the front could be interesting


----------



## LCW

Gary harrer said:


> I think a treble booster into the front could be interesting



Such as? I don’t know anything about treble boosters other than the Ti Boost that Laney released last year with the LA100BL reissue.

But treble booster to me implies “bright” which I detest.


----------



## ken361

LCW said:


> Such as? I don’t know anything about treble boosters other than the Ti Boost that Laney released last year with the LA100BL reissue.
> 
> But treble booster to me implies “bright” which I detest.


Vintage tones


----------



## Gary harrer

LCW said:


> Such as? I don’t know anything about treble boosters other than the Ti Boost that Laney released last year with the LA100BL reissue.
> 
> But treble booster to me implies “bright” which I detest.


Beano boost, very expensive but the best.
I think electro harmonics do one called the viper, they really act like a gain boost and surprisingly don't make the sound bright.
They work very well into the right amp


----------



## Gary harrer

Second half Of the Clip is a beano boost into a jvm crunch channel, not my style of music but it gives you a general idea of what a treble booster into a Marshall can do


----------



## bill0287

I brought home my new DSL40CR yesterday and so far I love it, but I noticed one odd thing right away. 

When I power on the amp and the channel that comes on has the effects loop "ON", the loop does not work until I cycle it off/on again, then it's fine. 

Does everyone's behave this way?


----------



## brianwrym1979

Hello Guys,

Im a weekend covers player that does some outdoor festivals once in a blue moon. I just played this at an outdoor festival yesterday and i have to say Marshall addressed any issues I have with the Dsl 40C and previous generations of Dsl's overall for my ears. 

I can echo the statements I see on this thread about the bass getting way too heavy when the gain on the OD channel is past 3/4 or 3 oclock. I think what is going on is that there is a fair amount, if not too much bass being introduced into the preamp section as the gain knob is past 3 oclock on the OD green channel. This issue continues onto the OD red channel as well. But I am very happy with the sound as this amp finally has the low end I craved out of a small amp like this!

The amp I have has external bias test points making it easy to bias using bias probes, especially once you know what the plate voltage is. I have not done a bias adjustment or even checked it as of yet even after the gig I played yesterday. 

The Stock Tubes in the preamp section (V1 + V2) seem to be Marshall branded JJ's... V 3 and V4 (PI) are chinese branded marshalls (Tube 00055's). The power tube EL34's seem to be marshall branded JJ's but will need to reference them, I dont think they are the JJ EL34L's but the standard EL34 JJ's.

I love the sound of JJ Preamp 12ax7's overall and use them in my JVM410H, EVH 100w EL34 and original Evh 100w 6l6, Blackstar HT stage 100 and Friedman Modded Marshall 1959 RI from 1993. Having modded my Jvm410H, Blackstar and the 1959 before Friedman modded it and having a stockpile of various brands of Preamp tubes (Ehx, Tung Sol, Chinese, Rft, Mullards etc) I can say that as I like the JJ's in the preamp the best, some amps dont work well with these tubes since in my opinion the JJ's have tons of bass like the Ehx ones do.

Until I have a chance to tube roll the preamp, my best guess would be for me to try and tube roll using a Tung Sol in V2... This particular tube to me along with the Chinese tubes seem to shave off some bass so as to not hit the preamp too hard bass wise. this may tame down this issue I have with the amp.. but at the same time may compromise the low end thump I love from the amp at the same time. Ill need to test this to verifiy it of course.

Another thing I noticed with the OD Channel is that the bass control seems to act more like a resonance control on my amp. Adjusting the resonance has less of an effect than using the bass control..... If I roll off the resonance I do lose some bass, but not like I do with the actual bass control on the OD channel.

The Clean/Crunch Channel works great, but I did notice that I was having a little bit of an issue balancing my clean volume against my OD channel volume... Since I only have the stock Footswitch I had to crank the clean channel volume on 10 (Gain set at 10oclock to match the OD channel volume as well) and of the OD channel Green I had gain on 3/4 (9 3 oclock or so) and the volume on a scale of 1-10 on about 9. The master (I only used Master 1) was set to 11 oclock as I needed the volume and the amp was set at full power. With these settings the amp was really nice sounding and I was playing a 2014 Les Paul Classic with a Newer JB in the bridge and a whole lotta humbucker in the neck. I always mod my guitars to have a 50's type circuit since I ride the volume knob when on the OD channel (I grew up on single channel Marshall Jmp's and Plexi's so im used ot riding the volume knob for cleans)... with the tone pot positive going ot the center output lug on the dimarzio 500k linear/custom taper volume pot in the guitar I dont lose high's when rolling the volume knob..... this amp is an awesome rock machine, and I got lots of compliments on my tone yesterday.

Im planning on using the 6 button footswitch with this amp (My JVM410H footswitch did not work with this using a TRS or regular 1/4 inch cable.... was thinking I needed to plug in the footswitch first before turning on the amp, but from what I read in this thread I dont think it will work. I dont mind buying another footswitch made for this amp as I beleive I can solve the volume issues on the channels by assigning the 2nd master volume to compensate for the volume inbalance (WHich isnt very much actually...). To be honbest the imbalance isnt such an issue, I would rather use master 2 to compensate for a volume jump im sure to have once I get the 6 button footswitch so i can finally on these amps use the crunch channel on the clean channel. I love that lower, basic distortion and I think its really awesome that they decided to put 2 master volumes in this amp!

I use a Boss Ge-7 in the effect loop to boost for solos, im sure thats what marshall was thinking about when they added the second master vol (Solo boosts).... but I would rather just use that to have a true 3 channel setup (Clean, Crunch then OD channels). I tried OD2 (Red) on this amp and it is good, but as you roll the gain past 11 oclock it starts introducing too much bass again into the preamp flubbing out the amp. I cant imagine a bias adjustment would help here as I think the issue is in the preamp overall.... 

Love the compression and chunk I get from power chords on this amp.. this is exactly what I was looking for in a small portable amp that I can take to small gigs or quick 1 set gigs where I play 1 set and have to get gear on/off stage very quickly. I can also state that this amp is very quiet as well, great job Marshall! Maybe ill grab the 100 head as well....

I normally play a 100watt head for the tone and low end thump into an avatar 2x12 oversized cab with vintage 30's (got tired of hauling 4x12 cabs plus the fact that there seems ot be some stigma about instantly being too loud by having a 4x12.... this avatar cab is as loud as some 4x12 cabs I have lol).

Thanks guys, im looking forward to reading further comments and hopefully maybe some simple mods in the future to address the preamp bassyness. Thanks!

Brian R.


----------



## brianwrym1979

bill0287 said:


> I brought home my new DSL40CR yesterday and so far I love it, but I noticed one odd thing right away.
> 
> When I power on the amp and the channel that comes on has the effects loop "ON", the loop does not work until I cycle it off/on again, then it's fine.
> 
> Does everyone's behave this way?




Are you saying that when you power the amp on, the efx loop light stays on but nothing is heard from the efx loop until you cycle the loop button? I notice on mine upon power up it will take a few seconds to light up the led's then it will go into whatever modes / settings were saved. Are you giving the amp time enough to boot up? (Yes boot up as in like a computer that needs time to get operational and recall settings)

Thanks


----------



## bill0287

brianwrym1979 said:


> Are you saying that when you power the amp on, the efx loop light stays on but nothing is heard from the efx loop until you cycle the loop button?



Yes. Try this:

1. Play the amp in clean channel, with effects loop on (effects are working)
2. Turn off the amp.
3. Wait about a minute or whatever.
4. Turn the amp back on (effect light is lit "green").
5. Test the effects loop -> it is no not working.
6. Press effect loop off, then on again -> now the effects are working.


----------



## bill0287

brianwrym1979 said:


> I can echo the statements I see on this thread about the bass getting way too heavy when the gain on the OD channel is past 3/4 or 3 oclock. I think what is going on is that there is a fair amount, if not too much bass being introduced into the preamp section as the gain knob is past 3 oclock on the OD green channel. This issue continues onto the OD red channel as well. But I am very happy with the sound as this amp finally has the low end I craved out of a small amp like this!



I don't really hear this on mine. I can push the Ultra Gain all the way to 10 (or is it "11") and I don't hear any "flubbing" (whatever that is). But maybe my ears are not so discerning as others here, or maybe I just like it bassy, I don't know.


----------



## brianwrym1979

bill0287 said:


> I don't really hear this on mine. I can push the Ultra Gain all the way to 10 (or is it "11") and I don't hear any "flubbing" (whatever that is). But maybe my ears are not so discerning as others here, or maybe I just like it bassy, I don't know.



Hello, Im curious... what Preamp tubes do you have in the amp? Mine came with 2 jj's in V1 and V2, then 2 Marshall Branded Chinese ones in V3 / V4.... Also are you playing in full power mode or half power?


----------



## brianwrym1979

bill0287 said:


> I don't really hear this on mine. I can push the Ultra Gain all the way to 10 (or is it "11") and I don't hear any "flubbing" (whatever that is). But maybe my ears are not so discerning as others here, or maybe I just like it bassy, I don't know.



How loud were you playing the amp? I had the master at 12 noon and the channel master on OD green on 9.5 / 10.. basically wide open. The bassyness / flubbing as I call it happens when turning the gain knob past 3 oclock on mine.. like its too much bass etc.. Just curious


----------



## bill0287

brianwrym1979 said:


> How loud were you playing the amp? I had the master at 12 noon and the channel master on OD green on 9.5 / 10.. basically wide open. The bassyness / flubbing as I call it happens when turning the gain knob past 3 oclock on mine.. like its too much bass etc.. Just curious



To your questions:

1. I don't know what the tubes are. They are whatever came with the amp. I brought it home last night and haven't ventured into the back yet (having too much fun)
2. Masters were both at 11 o'clock
3.Ultra gain volume was at about 11 o'clock and gain was maxed when I tried it.
4. I was at half power

I just tried this:

1. Ultra Gain channel (green)
2. Ultra Gain volume at Max
3. Ultra Gain 'Gain' at Max
4. Half power
5. Treble at 11
6. Mid at 10 
7. Bass around 1 or 2 o'clock (wasn't really paying attention when I tried this)

It was definitely heavy and 'bassy' but not something I would attribute to being a problem. I could feel it in the floor (at 1/2 power!). I would probably attribute it more to room characteristics and reverberation than an amp problem (but what do I know). Without taking it our to an open environment with wider acoustics I couldn't say for sure. But in my 'bedroom' practice room it was beastly and I liked it. I might roll back the bass somewhat with those specs, but I will probably never push it that hard in my situation.


----------



## brianwrym1979

bill0287 said:


> To your questions:
> 
> 1. I don't know what the tubes are. They are whatever came with the amp. I brought it home last night and haven't ventured into the back yet (having too much fun)
> 2. Masters were both at 11 o'clock
> 3.Ultra gain volume was at about 11 o'clock and gain was maxed when I tried it.
> 4. I was at half power
> 
> I just tried this:
> 
> 1. Ultra Gain channel (green)
> 2. Ultra Gain volume at Max
> 3. Ultra Gain 'Gain' at Max
> 4. Half power
> 5. Treble at 11
> 6. Mid at 10
> 7. Bass around 1 or 2 o'clock (wasn't really paying attention when I tried this)
> 
> It was definitely heavy and 'bassy' but not something I would attribute to being a problem. I could feel it in the floor (at 1/2 power!). I would probably attribute it more to room characteristics and reverberation than an amp problem (but what do I know). Without taking it our to an open environment with wider acoustics I couldn't say for sure. But in my 'bedroom' practice room it was beastly and I liked it. I might roll back the bass somewhat with those specs, but I will probably never push it that hard in my situation.




Nice!

I love my 100 Watters and various cabs... but for a single 1x12 40W combo compared to the other dsl 40c and previous gen Marshall Dsl's im super happy with how this sounds overall out of the box.

Im looking forward to getting the new Plexi clones they came out with... I want to try out the Origin 50W head when they become available at Ams....


----------



## bill0287

Could you please try what I described in message #252 and see if you experience the same behavior.


----------



## BanditPanda

solarburnDSL50 said:


> My bad. Please forgive my name calling. Sometimes I'm the village idiot.
> 
> Oh and welcome to the forum!




Sometimes !!??? 

BP


----------



## solarburn

LCW said:


> Thank you. I’m still very much learning. But it’s so much fun! I’m digging experimenting with pedals. I’m starting with the old standbys (have OD-9 aka TS and the RAT).



Are you getting anything like this? I use cheap pedals that can but aren't the best. Which I laugh at. I know you're not caught up with dudes who say you got to have this to get this. We could destroy that in seconds.


----------



## brianwrym1979

bill0287 said:


> Could you please try what I described in message #252 and see if you experience the same behavior.



Hello,

I just did a quick test using the steps you listed and I can confirm the same behavior. The light for efx loop is on, but there are no effects. once I cycle the efx loop button (On, Off then back on) I can hear the effects. I also tried just using a patch cable and leaving out the return side and confirm the same behavior. 

Thanks


----------



## bill0287

brianwrym1979 said:


> Hello,
> 
> I just did a quick test using the steps you listed and I can confirm the same behavior. The light for efx loop is on, but there are no effects. once I cycle the efx loop button (On, Off then back on) I can hear the effects. I also tried just using a patch cable and leaving out the return side and confirm the same behavior.
> 
> Thanks



Interesting. I have to wonder if they intended this or if it's a "feature". I find it annoying, but can tolerate it.


----------



## LCW

Do you think that's by design or a bug??


----------



## stratocastermarshall

brianwrym1979 said:


> How loud were you playing the amp? I had the master at 12 noon and the channel master on OD green on 9.5 / 10.. basically wide open. The bassyness / flubbing as I call it happens when turning the gain knob past 3 oclock on mine.. like its too much bass etc.. Just curious



I've *always* noticed an increase in bass as I turn the gain up...going back to my old DSL401, and including both the DSL40c and DSL40cr. I think that's just the way they're designed. I pretty much always have to increase/decrease my treble settings as the gain goes up/down excessively.


----------



## ken361

stratocastermarshall said:


> I've *always* noticed an increase in bass as I turn the gain up...going back to my old DSL401, and including both the DSL40c and DSL40cr. I think that's just the way they're designed. I pretty much always have to increase/decrease my treble settings as the gain goes up/down excessively.


Thats why mines at 7 tops on the gain both channels. If you boost the crunch you can get some of the bass out with the right pedals


----------



## Gary harrer

What boost pedals are people using with the cr??
Any good results


----------



## bill0287

Is any one else having trouble finding a balance between the clean mode and crunch mode volume in the classic gain channel? Any tips?


----------



## stratocastermarshall

bill0287 said:


> Is any one else having trouble finding a balance between the clean mode and crunch mode volume in the classic gain channel? Any tips?


I think it's better than the 40c, but it's still louder in crunch mode. I think the only real option is when the 6 button footswitch comes out you can set each mode to use different masters and you can set the masters as needed to balance out the volume.

Or, actually, is I think about it, since you can't currently use a footswitch to switch between clean and crunch mode on the fly anyway, all you need to do is use the different masters - use one for clean and the other for crunch. When you manually switch modes each mode will use the master you assigned to it. That will balance it out. You just can't switch it on the fly until the 6 button switch is available.


----------



## LCW

The dual assignable masters on the 40CR is a brilliant setup by Marshall and that alone is a worthwhile upgrade.

Not only can you balance out the modes and channels to your liking, as you can assign either Master vol to any of the channels and modes as strato mentioned above. But since each channel has a volume (along with gain), in addition to the Master, you can further dial things in. I don't for sure who these things work, but I'd think the channel volume controls the pre-amp stage, and master volume is the power stage... which would change the tone depending on which one is cranked... ??


----------



## stratocastermarshall

LCW said:


> The dual assignable masters on the 40CR is a brilliant setup by Marshall and that alone is a worthwhile upgrade.
> 
> Not only can you balance out the modes and channels to your liking, as you can assign either Master vol to any of the channels and modes as strato mentioned above. But since each channel has a volume (along with gain), in addition to the Master, you can further dial things in. I don't for sure who these things work, but I'd think the channel volume controls the pre-amp stage, and master volume is the power stage... which would change the tone depending on which one is cranked... ??


I think you may be right about the channel volume controlling the pre-amp stage and master the power stage. When I use the emulated out into headphones, changing the master volume has no effect - volume is controlled using the channel volume.

And as I've thought more about the dual master set up, I'm thinking the only real benefits are:
1) providing the ability to balance out/set volumes between modes within a given channel
2) providing a slightly simpler way of increasing/decreasing volumes globally when moving to different venues, e.g. lower volumes for rehearsal, higher for gig, without changing the respective channel volume settings.
3) providing a boost ability within a given channel/mode setting, i.e. like a clean boost pedal.

If it were just a matter of balancing volumes between channels, the channel volumes can be used for that - no benefit of having master volumes.

And except for (2) above, those benefits are really only available with the 6 button footswitch.


----------



## Gary harrer

Hi guys
I had a little time this afternoon to do some experiments, stock amp sounded a fuzzy in the mids and didn't Seem to have much depth of sound or fullness.

I checked the bias which was at right around 34 per side, I adjusted this to 33 which is where they seemed to settle best at, was aiming for 32 but 33 was the result, obviously this didn't really change the sound.

On to the speaker, I recently picked up a neo creamback and decided to give it a go, it took only a few minutes to change out, and the results are.........
What a difference, I was blown away.
A far cleaner sound, less muddy in the mids and far less naisal sounding. 
The top end seemed a little rounder and more musical to my ears, all in all an excellent upgrade.
I still think the amp could use some more low mids but hey tone is subjective.


----------



## Finnster

Gary harrer said:


> Hi guys
> I had a little time this afternoon to do some experiments, stock amp sounded a fuzzy in the mids and didn't Seem to have much depth of sound or fullness.
> 
> I checked the bias which was at right around 34 per side, I adjusted this to 33 which is where they seemed to settle best at, was aiming for 32 but 33 was the result, obviously this didn't really change the sound.
> 
> On to the speaker, I recently picked up a neo creamback and decided to give it a go, it took only a few minutes to change out, and the results are.........
> What a difference, I was blown away.
> A far cleaner sound, less muddy in the mids and far less naisal sounding.
> The top end seemed a little rounder and more musical to my ears, all in all an excellent upgrade.
> I still think the amp could use some more low mids but hey tone is subjective.




I also have a neo-Creamback lying around that I may put in mine. 

In regards to bias. I set mine to 32.4 but Marshall emailed me and said it should be set to 35. Not sure I would hear a different or not.

Thanks for the review of the Neo.


----------



## ken361

least it wasnt 45


----------



## Gary harrer

ken361 said:


> least it wasnt 45


It certainly wasn't, I did notice however that one of the trim pots is down far further than the other


----------



## Gary harrer

Finnster said:


> I also have a neo-Creamback lying around that I may put in mine.
> 
> In regards to bias. I set mine to 32.4 but Marshall emailed me and said it should be set to 35. Not sure I would hear a different or not.
> 
> Thanks for the review of the Neo.



Put it in, I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on it.
For me it's a huge win


----------



## JeffMcLeod

solarburnDSL50 said:


> My bad. Please forgive my name calling. Sometimes I'm the village idiot.
> 
> Oh and welcome to the forum!




Not knowing the time-zone of you or the forum...at 4:47 AM, I figured you were either up really really early getting ready for work, or up really really late getting chewed. I'mma go with the latter. Been there, lol.


----------



## bill0287

Please, if you own a DSL40CR, take a look at this thread and respond. I am communicating with Customer Support in the UK to find out if it's designed this way, a fault in a few amps, or a design error in the whole line. I would like to have some data to present.


----------



## LCW

I don’t have any effects pedals but have a couple overdrives. Would those work to test the effects loop?


----------



## BrownNote71

LCW said:


> I don’t have any effects pedals but have a couple overdrives. Would those work to test the effects loop?


It might not sound great, but anything you can use to alter the tone will work - you just want to be able to tell if the FX Loop is on or off when you turn it on, if you left the FX Loop enabled when you turned the amp off.
The behavior we're seeing just *can't* be intended, so we are trying to determine whether this is an oversight/bug or whether it's just certain units that need replacement.


----------



## brianwrym1979

Hello Gents,

I have the amp on my bench and im fairly puzzled on this amp now. It has this cold bias sound to it and it got me thinking to check the bias using a bias probe and check the Plate Voltage.

Mine has a plate voltage of 403 with standby in high mode, 152 on low.

On high mode, the probes are telling me that the tubes (I have 2 probes) are running at 27ma.... which if you do the math (25/403 = 100% plate dissipation is 62.034ma) this amp comes stock at 26ma, which is about 42%... so I went to adjust the bias..... low and behold I only had a 1mm turn and I can only go up to about 27.5ma making this amp 44% and I have no more bias adjustment left. This explains why the base tone of this thing is ehhhhhh..... I normally bias my amps to 73% and I get a nice fat harmonically rich tone.

So with the stock bias adjustment this amp has no way of getting out of crossover distortion.... it will need to be modded to be able to bias the amp properly.

I have noticed the clean/crunch channel and OD channel volume jump and I have gotten over this by setting the clean channel volume at 10 and the od channel volume between 2-4oclock on the dial.

Im thinking about returning the amp..... I have a JCA5012C but the hting hums like crazy and the effect loop is useless... however its biased to 73% and sounds incredible on the od channel go figure. Frustrating!


----------



## ken361

400 is pretty to low for a 40 dsl, my 40 c is at around 480 32 bias runs great at 60% Not all amps should run hot the dsl with mostly preamp distortion runs best at 60. Now the new maybe different. They sounded similar at the store at low levels


----------



## brianwrym1979

Did you use bias probes or the test points? That sounds about right (25 / 480 = 52 or so ma x .6 = 31ma per tube or so)


----------



## ken361

brianwrym1979 said:


> Did you use bias probes or the test points? That sounds about right (25 / 480 = 52 or so ma x .6 = 31ma per tube or so)


probes


----------



## ken361

maybe new power tubes it might go higher on yours?


----------



## brianwrym1979

Sounds about right doing the math... I guess thats my issue, the plate voltage isnt high enough.. or I need the amp to be modded to allow more bias current. I have the 40CR


----------



## ken361

.


----------



## brianwrym1979

ken361 said:


> maybe new power tubes it might go higher on yours?




Yea I could try that, I have a stock pile of them as backups to my 100 watters....


----------



## ken361

ken361 said:


> .


have to played the old 40c loud at all? One guy said there similar to his creamback version just wonder if its your amp


----------



## Shane1353

I just got my DSL 40CR w/the 2 Masters. How do you 'assign' them? I've run the Channel Vols at 10 and used the masters for overall vol and had both masters on 10 and used the channel vols for overall vol. Which one drives the power amps the masters or the channel volumes? I really am not following how one 'assigns' the masters. Thanks.


----------



## Finnster

Shane1353 said:


> I just got my DSL 40CR w/the 2 Masters. How do you 'assign' them? I've run the Channel Vols at 10 and used the masters for overall vol and had both masters on 10 and used the channel vols for overall vol. Which one drives the power amps the masters or the channel volumes? I really am not following how one 'assigns' the masters. Thanks.



It’s easy. Whichever one you select for a channel the amp remembers it. Same goes for the effects loop.


----------



## Shane1353

So how do I 'select' or 'assign' it? How do I make the left one the crunch and right on the OD? Right now it's the opposite or so it seems and there is nothing in the manual. Thanks


----------



## Finnster

Shane1353 said:


> So how do I 'select' or 'assign' it? How do I make the left one the crunch and right on the OD? Right now it's the opposite or so it seems and there is nothing in the manual. Thanks



If you are on the crunch channel...push the button on the far right for whichever master you want to use. Then switch to the ultra channel and do the same.

It will remember which one you last chose. 

Make sense?


----------



## kingbee

Doesn't remember effects loop if using foot switch


----------



## Finnster

kingbee said:


> Doesn't remember effects loop if using foot switch


 
I didn’t know that. I use midi


----------



## kingbee

What would be a good midi controller?


----------



## Shane1353

The button on the far right turns the effects loop off/on.


----------



## Finnster

Shane1353 said:


> The button on the far right turns the effects loop off/on.


Click the button for the masters


----------



## Finnster

kingbee said:


> What would be a good midi controller?



I use an FX8. But any midi controller would work. The amp has simple commands.


----------



## kingbee

Would the boss es-5 work for this? Would be cool to select whatever pedal I want at the same time.


----------



## Bloodrock

Finnster said:


> Click the button for the masters


----------



## stratocastermarshall

bill0287 said:


> Yes. Try this:
> 
> 1. Play the amp in clean channel, with effects loop on (effects are working)
> 2. Turn off the amp.
> 3. Wait about a minute or whatever.
> 4. Turn the amp back on (effect light is lit "green").
> 5. Test the effects loop -> it is no not working.
> 6. Press effect loop off, then on again -> now the effects are working.



Same thing here. Looks like a design issue. The problem doesn't occur for me if the footswitch is connected. At the end of the day, even if it is a design issue I consider the problem pretty trivial. You only turn the amp on once...just click the the effects button. Or, just have the footswitch plugged in.


----------



## stratocastermarshall

I'd been comparing my stock DSL40cr against my modified DSL40c with c19 mod, some rolled pre-amp tubes, and a creamback 65 earlier in the thread. I've since moved the upgraded tubes and creamback from the 40c to the 40cr and put the original pre-amp tubes and seventy-80 stock speaker back in the 40c. I also checked the bias on the 40cr.

First of all, the bias on the 40cr was 41mv and 47 mv from the factory - a lot higher than I thought it would be. I adjusted them both to 34.5. I love the external bias points.

The pre-amp tubes I used are a Mullard re-issue in V1 and a NOS Sylvania long grey plate in V4. All others are the standard Marshall/JJ tubes.

With the bias change, different tubes, and creamback the sound is "rounder" and has more thump. I also find the quality at very low bedroom volumes with high gain on the Ultra gain channel to be good...it sounds decent - better than the standard amp configuration. Still doesn't sound that good at low volume on the classic gain channel until the volume gets turned up to what I'd call a bit above bedroom volume. It still isn't "loud", but it gets ones' attention. I really think this is where the amp needs to live - at that volume or above.

I again compared the 40cr with the above configuration against an almost stock 40c (only difference is the c19 mod) using identical gain, volume, and EQ settings. Very different sounding amplifiers. The 40c is brighter with much more highs and mids (even with the c19 mod) with tighter bass. At lower volumes the 40c is much fizzier than the 40cr. Again, I think these amps really need to be pushing reasonably loud volumes to really sound good. But when you do, boy, do they sound really good - both of them...just different.

At similar gain, volume, and EQ settings the 40c seems noticeably louder to me. I think the creamback is slightly less efficient, but that wouldn't account for the difference I noticed. Nonetheless, the 40cr will be plenty loud enough for gigging.

I didn't open up the 40cr chassis, but when you look at the chassis of both the 40cr and the 40c from the outside you can tell the designs appear to be substantially different. Tube placement is different. The output transformer of the 40cr is smaller than the 40c. The design change appears to be much more than just changing a couple capacitors. 

In my previous review I mentioned that one of the only dings I had with the 40cr was the slight delay when switching channels. I just happened to read on the Marshall site that this amp (and others) are purposefully designed this way to eliminate noise when switching channels. Not sure if I agree with this design approach or not, but that is the reasoning.

I also listened this time for flabby bass that was mentioned in this thread earlier. On the classic gain channel with high gain settings (> 2 o'clock), all EQ at noon, modestly high bedroom volume, and using a neck pickup on a Les Paul, I think I heard what I'd call a flabby bass. I did not experience this on the ultra gain channel or if I used the bridge pickup. This effect went away with increased volume.


----------



## Finnster

kingbee said:


> Would the boss es-5 work for this? Would be cool to select whatever pedal I want at the same time.


 
Yep! The Boss MS-3 would also work.


----------



## marksh24

stratocastermarshall said:


> In my previous review I mentioned that one of the only dings I had with the 40cr was the slight delay when switching channels. I just happened to read on the Marshall site that this amp (and others) are purposefully designed this way to eliminate noise when switching channels. Not sure if I agree with this design approach or not, but that is the reasoning.


Unfortunately this is a dealbreaker for me. I’d like to know if the 20W version works the same way.


----------



## brianwrym1979

marksh24 said:


> Unfortunately this is a dealbreaker for me. I’d like to know if the 20W version works the same way.



I can confirm the channel switching delay, playing the amp live it seemed like about a half second delay which was noticeable enough to change my mind on the amp. My amp also had at full power 403V for plate voltage which is the deal breaker for me since i cannot bias the amp over 44% Max tube dissipation..... I sent mine back. Currently have a Blackstar Ht stage 60 until I get the newer Evh 2x12 combo with dual concentric pots for the channel separation.


----------



## Troy T. Blues

I just picked one up yesterday. Sounds really good! I was impressed and got a good deal.


----------



## bill0287

I don't know about you guys, but my less-than-one-week-old DSL40CR just crackled, popped and went dead @@@!!!!#####


----------



## Bloodrock

bill0287 said:


> I don't know about you guys, but my less-than-one-week-old DSL40CR just crackled, popped and went dead @@@!!!!#####



First thing I did was pull the cheap stock tubes and replace them all. Plenty of cheap tube issues these days


----------



## bill0287

Bloodrock said:


> First thing I did was pull the cheap stock tubes and replace them all. Plenty of cheap tube issues these days



I hear ya, but jesus christ the tubes should last more than a week ! I am getting a whole new amp first as I don't really trust this one anymore


----------



## Crunchifyable

bill0287 said:


> I hear ya, but jesus christ the tubes should last more than a week ! I am getting a whole new amp first as I don't really trust this one anymore



With tubes, it's the luck of the draw.

I don't believe there are any cheap tubes. You pay good money for them regardless...and sometimes they last 10 years, sometimes 10 days.

Granted some of the resellers may do more testing and you're more likely to get good ones. I would think amp manufacturers would care enough to have decently tested tubes, since it's awfully expensive to deal with broken amps.


----------



## brianwrym1979

Its not the tubes in most cases... they get tested before shipping... its during the shipping process where the amps gets dinged up, dropped and from sheer vibration that these tubes get screwed up in my opinion...


----------



## Bloodrock

brianwrym1979 said:


> Its not the tubes in most cases... they get tested before shipping... its during the shipping process where the amps gets dinged up, dropped and from sheer vibration that these tubes get screwed up in my opinion...



That’s true. Plus manufacturers buy in bulk so they might not be getting the best tubes possible.


----------



## stratocastermarshall

bill0287 said:


> I hear ya, but jesus christ the tubes should last more than a week ! I am getting a whole new amp first as I don't really trust this one anymore



Obviously it's your choice. But perhaps if you contact Marshall - or possibly the vendor where you bought the amp - they may just send you out a new set of tubes. And if new tubes fix the problem you're amp is very likely just fine. Obviously if they don't you have to return the amp. 

But regardless if the problem turns out to be tubes or not, you've got some extra tubes whether you replace a bad tube or get the amp replaced. But whatever is easiest for you.


----------



## thembones

This isn't great music or anything just a demo of the direct out of the amp
guitar is a MIJ jackson dk2 on the bridge.
Ultra gain channel with the red light on
gain around 2
volume around 11
treble 9:30
middle 12:30
bass 9:30
tone button pushed in
presence 9
resonance 11
reverb around 11
master has no effect at all because i am not on 20 or 40 watts using the direct out.


----------



## Dmann

Marshall warrants their tubes that ship with the amp for 3 months, so you're covered.


----------



## musicman

Bit the bullet and bought a 40CR today... I was holding until Marshall released the PEDL-91016 but couldn't resist.
Having tried it at home I'm not sure I'll need anything more than the supplied footswitch... Red Classic Gain & Green Ultra Gain channels work well together & Red Classic Gain cleans up nicely with the guitars volume control.
Adding a Java Boost on full range and/or a TS9 in front of the preamp gives a nice boost in gain and an eq pedal in the loop boosts volume.
HT voltage in the UK is 465v which calculates to bias voltage of 30mV at 70% for 40w or 32mV at 60% for 50w. It was set at 34mV so I've tweaked back to 32mV


----------



## thembones

Checked my bias
I was at 40.8/41 on both. 
It was never ROCK steady is that normal? I waited a few seconds and it still fluctuated a little up and down.
I moved them down to around 33.5 each they seemed to be happier there, without much drastic changes to the other tube, IE I would turn a knob and the other would change and basically I just figured around 33.5ish each would be better than high 40 each.


----------



## brianwrym1979

Its a push pull circuit so you will have a slight back and fourth between the tubes or bias drift... its normal.. Just try to align the drift to where each side is goign up and down aroudn the same values and its all good. Just keep in mind, the bias your checking using the stock test points are not the same as using a bias probe on the tube sockets and measuring that way. This is exactly why I returned the amp as the tubes could not be biased over 44% in my particular amp and this with trying multiple sets of tubes i have as spares including different manufacturers. I set my bias on all of my amps to about 73% to get out of crossover distortion. Otherwise the amp sounds sterile to my ears and I want it to sing personally 


Thanks


----------



## musicman

Bear in mind that the mains voltage will fluctuate a little unless you're using some form of stabiliser.
I used a bias probe and read about 30.5mV compared to about 32mV at the amp bias points so there is a little difference.


----------



## brianwrym1979

What is the plate voltage on your amp?


----------



## brianwrym1979

My Plate Voltage on my amp was 301 in high mode.


----------



## thembones

brianwrym1979 said:


> Its a push pull circuit so you will have a slight back and fourth between the tubes or bias drift... its normal.. Just try to align the drift to where each side is goign up and down aroudn the same values and its all good. Just keep in mind, the bias your checking using the stock test points are not the same as using a bias probe on the tube sockets and measuring that way. This is exactly why I returned the amp as the tubes could not be biased over 44% in my particular amp and this with trying multiple sets of tubes i have as spares including different manufacturers. I set my bias on all of my amps to about 73% to get out of crossover distortion. Otherwise the amp sounds sterile to my ears and I want it to sing personally
> 
> 
> Thanks



I don’t know enough to know does this mean mine is messed up?
Or does this mean that since I was able to raise and lower mine I am ok?

I will say after I made that change I had the amp on the second channel in Green mode with the gain around 11 o’clock volume maybe noon and master down a little bit because I’m in an apartment
I was on 40 W and it had a nice growl
That’s the only way I know how to explain it just that nice aggressive sound


----------



## brianwrym1979

Yea it seems like your fine..... there will always be a slight drift due to voltage variances from the wall and the push/pull nature of the output stage


----------



## musicman

I'm no expert but 301v sounds quite low... previous threads show 465v as an average value for the old DSL40C


----------



## brianwrym1979

Yea I know.. it was 301 on high and like 215 on low. This is with the Dsl 40CR. I dont think others had that issue so it may be just my luck lol


----------



## Micky

brianwrym1979 said:


> My Plate Voltage on my amp was 301 in high mode.


And where were you measuring that?


----------



## brianwrym1979

Pin 3 of both power tubes (2 multimeters set to Dc 600V + chassis ground).


----------



## Adelino Neto

I thought this amp was great only for hard rock and stuff like that, but this video changed my mind. Now I think this amp is much more versatile than I could ever expect:


----------



## musicman

My first gig with the new DSL40CR will be next Saturday - just "classic rock" covers in a small pub near Chesterfield UK.
I thought I would need the PEDL-91016 footswitch but I think classic gain red and ultra gain green with a Java Boost & TS9 will be enough with an eq in the loop for volume boost (I hope so anyway!)
I'll post a review.


----------



## GibsonKramer

An EQ, or even better... a TC Spark, in your loop will give you more volume than you'll ever need.

On the bias note, I dropped mine down to 33. I was able to nail it, both sides, though it took a while. Damn OCD. I swapped V1 and V2 around, as I didn't really notice a difference with the Mesa 12ax7 in V1.

Amp sounds a lot better, though I attribute that more to the bias, than the tubes. I'm just not a big tube roller.


----------



## brianwrym1979

Well I solved my issues with the Marshall.... I bought a Bogner 1x12 and has built in delays, reverb and a solo boost option. All my issues with small amps not sounding like their big brothers are gone, this thing smokes the Marshall!  https://www.musiciansfriend.com/amp...ist-series-112-40w-1x12-tube-guitar-combo-amp


----------



## ken361

brianwrym1979 said:


> Well I solved my issues with the Marshall.... I bought a Bogner 1x12 and has built in delays, reverb and a solo boost option. All my issues with small amps not sounding like their big brothers are gone, this thing smokes the Marshall!  https://www.musiciansfriend.com/amp...ist-series-112-40w-1x12-tube-guitar-combo-amp


had one years ago too bad i didnt get enough loud time on it and traded it in for something else that I wanted. GC didnt sell very much of them the manager told me. The build quality was horrible every screw was loose even the chassis was caving in until i tightened everything down


----------



## brianwrym1979

I really dont mind any of that as I do my own repairs.. I played the amp for an hour before I realized that was the amp I was looking for. But on the Marshall topic, I just think that its silly to have to mod the new CR40 to fix a bad power tranny (Mine only had 301V on the plates) and also modify the tone stack to actually be musical without getting too much bass into the preamp with the gain dimed. The First one i had was the 40C version and this new 40CR version is def better, but compared to my other amps it just wont compete. This Alchemist smokes it stock!


----------



## Adelino Neto

Another video from the Australian youtuber name Shane David. He got a DSL40CR last month, as I mentioned in my last post. In this video, after hard use and gigs, he says this amp is his favorite now.


----------



## LCW

Decided to check bias on my 40CR this evening. Let it warm up for like 15-20 min. One tube was at 36.5 and the other at 38.0. I set them the same (or as close as I could) to around 35.2-35.3. I just used the external bias points. Didn't dig into to check plate voltage (never done it so a bit hesitant). So I don't really know how "correct" this is, but should be close. Was happy it wasn't in the 40's.

Didn't really notice much difference in sound to be honest, but at least I can rest easy knowing they are balanced the same.


----------



## Adelino Neto

LCW said:


> Decided to check bias on my 40CR this evening. Let it warm up for like 15-20 min. One tube was at 36.5 and the other at 38.0. I set them the same (or as close as I could) to around 35.2-35.3. I just used the external bias points. Didn't dig into to check plate voltage (never done it so a bit hesitant). So I don't really know how "correct" this is, but should be close. Was happy it wasn't in the 40's.
> 
> Didn't really notice much difference in sound to be honest, but at least I can rest easy knowing they are balanced the same.



I'm hesitant too cuz never did something like that. Did you have any video of how to do it?


----------



## LCW

Adelino Neto said:


> I'm hesitant too cuz never did something like that. Did you have any video of how to do it?



None that I found for the 40CR. There was a good video showing how to bias and check plate voltage for the 40C on youtube.

Between that and looking at the first post on this thread:

http://www.marshallforum.com/threads/dsl40cr-pic-video-warning.101014/

I was able to figure out how to check and adjust bias. It's quite easy with the external bias points. Just have to take back cover off and have some patience because it's a lot of back and forth between sides to get the values equal between both tubes.


----------



## Adelino Neto

LCW said:


> None that I found for the 40CR. There was a good video showing how to bias and check plate voltage for the 40C on youtube.
> 
> Between that and looking at the first post on this thread:
> 
> http://www.marshallforum.com/threads/dsl40cr-pic-video-warning.101014/
> 
> I was able to figure out how to check and adjust bias. It's quite easy with the external bias points. Just have to take back cover off and have some patience because it's a lot of back and forth between sides to get the values equal between both tubes.



Thanks man! I think you've inspired me to get this job done.


----------



## solarburn

Adelino Neto said:


> I thought this amp was great only for hard rock and stuff like that, but this video changed my mind. Now I think this amp is much more versatile than I could ever expect:




I liked his playing.

My DSL40 eats stalk clips. I want candy...then I'll join you!


----------



## solarburn

LCW said:


> None that I found for the 40CR. There was a good video showing how to bias and check plate voltage for the 40C on youtube.
> 
> Between that and looking at the first post on this thread:
> 
> http://www.marshallforum.com/threads/dsl40cr-pic-video-warning.101014/
> 
> I was able to figure out how to check and adjust bias. It's quite easy with the external bias points. Just have to take back cover off and have some patience because it's a lot of back and forth between sides to get the values equal between both tubes.



What?


----------



## LCW

Measured my plate voltage and rebiased. Details over in the DSL40CR bias thread.

*http://www.marshallforum.com/threads/marshall-dsl40cr-bias.100693/#post-1708950*


----------



## LCW

40CR gut shot:


----------



## matttornado

Hey everyone. I just got a 40cr this friday. i’m new to effects loops but i noticed that with the effects loop on, with effects turned off, i get a slight volume drop. when i turn the effects on, i loose signal and i have to turn the effect levels way up just to hear them. it seems like when i turn my effects loop on, a weak, clean signal goes through it. i also loose some of preamp distortion when i use an effect through the loop.
Do i have a faulty amp? like i said, i never used one before in my life. lol 

wondering if i need to take it back? the slight delay when switching chanels sucks. no delay when switching the effects loop though.
.


----------



## thembones

matttornado said:


> Hey everyone. I just got a 40cr this friday. i’m new to effects loops but i noticed that with the effects loop on, with effects turned off, i get a slight volume drop. when i turn the effects on, i loose signal and i have to turn the effect levels way up just to hear them. it seems like when i turn my effects loop on, a weak, clean signal goes through it. i also loose some of preamp distortion when i use an effect through the loop.
> Do i have a faulty amp? like i said, i never used one before in my life. lol
> 
> wondering if i need to take it back? the slight delay when switching chanels sucks. no delay when switching the effects loop though.
> .



I am by no means an expert but this sounds like something faulty.
Should be able to exchange no problem.


----------



## jlinde1973

LCW said:


> 40CR gut shot:
> 
> View attachment 47493
> 
> 
> View attachment 47494
> 
> 
> View attachment 47495


Hmmm...apparently the new Dsl40cr did away with the chassis mounted power tubes..


----------



## Bloodrock

jlinde1973 said:


> Hmmm...apparently the new Dsl40cr did away with the chassis mounted power tubes..



No they didn’t. Just installed differently. It’s been covered here already.


----------



## jlinde1973

Bloodrock said:


> No they didn’t. Just installed differently. It’s been covered here already.


Ok that's good then...guess I skipped that part out of the 18 or whatever pages of the thread.


----------



## jlinde1973

Bloodrock said:


> No they didn’t. Just installed differently. It’s been covered here already.


Not to disagree here but just went thru the thread. No it wasn't covered and yes those power tubes surely do appear board mounted to me. Bummer that seems like a step backwards from the dsl40c. Not a deal breaker though especially since all of the positive upgrades on the new Dsl.


----------



## LCW

They aren't board mounted... the tubes are chassis mounted, then there are other pins that go from the chassis to the board. I'm sure there's some pics in another thread that show that.

Edit: gooned this pic from FB... power tubes are chassis mounted. Pre-amp look board mounted.


----------



## Pat6969

Funny how people speculate about things before knowing the facts. IMO, the DSL40CR is the best affordable amp on the market today. The 20HR will be in my stable soon as well.


----------



## JAC

Pat6969 said:


> Funny how people speculate about things before knowing the facts. IMO, the DSL40CR is the best affordable amp on the market today. The 20HR will be in my stable soon as well.



Don't get too upset. Everyone has a right to their opinion on these forums. Sometimes crazy stuff is posted. I myself am impressed with the Origin 20 watt amp with EL34. I would love to have the head version. Right now I'm paying off my Fender 68 Custom Deluxe Reverb. When that is paid off, I will look further into the Origin 20 watt head. I feel it has a bitchen tone to it.


----------



## Pat6969

JAC said:


> Don't get too upset. Everyone has a right to their opinion on these forums. Sometimes crazy stuff is posted. I myself am impressed with the Origin 20 watt amp with EL34. I would love to have the head version. Right now I'm paying off my Fender 68 Custom Deluxe Reverb. When that is paid off, I will look further into the Origin 20 watt head. I feel it has a bitchen tone to it.



I'm not upset, I just find it funny. I think I'm saving up for a Mini Jubilee head and cab. Didn't like the combo but I can tell it would sound great with a nice closed back cab.


----------



## BftGibson

Hacking mine up today to make a head out of it

, love the V type but put it on top my gig cabs and holy crap.........


----------



## BftGibson

matttornado said:


> Hey everyone. I just got a 40cr this friday. i’m new to effects loops but i noticed that with the effects loop on, with effects turned off, i get a slight volume drop. when i turn the effects on, i loose signal and i have to turn the effect levels way up just to hear them. it seems like when i turn my effects loop on, a weak, clean signal goes through it. i also loose some of preamp distortion when i use an effect through the loop.
> Do i have a faulty amp? like i said, i never used one before in my life. lol
> 
> wondering if i need to take it back? the slight delay when switching chanels sucks. no delay when switching the effects loop though.
> .


put an eq pedal(i run RC booster in my loop) in loop, adjust volume to liking, also there is about a 1 count delay in footswitch, just anticipate as you approach your lead and hey you might even find out what my jazz friends do, lean back on the first solo note and then in ya come..very dramatic


----------



## BftGibson

good observations !! I think we all


stratocastermarshall said:


> I'd been comparing my stock DSL40cr against my modified DSL40c with c19 mod, some rolled pre-amp tubes, and a creamback 65 earlier in the thread. I've since moved the upgraded tubes and creamback from the 40c to the 40cr and put the original pre-amp tubes and seventy-80 stock speaker back in the 40c. I also checked the bias on the 40cr.
> 
> First of all, the bias on the 40cr was 41mv and 47 mv from the factory - a lot higher than I thought it would be. I adjusted them both to 34.5. I love the external bias points.
> 
> The pre-amp tubes I used are a Mullard re-issue in V1 and a NOS Sylvania long grey plate in V4. All others are the standard Marshall/JJ tubes.
> 
> With the bias change, different tubes, and creamback the sound is "rounder" and has more thump. I also find the quality at very low bedroom volumes with high gain on the Ultra gain channel to be good...it sounds decent - better than the standard amp configuration. Still doesn't sound that good at low volume on the classic gain channel until the volume gets turned up to what I'd call a bit above bedroom volume. It still isn't "loud", but it gets ones' attention. I really think this is where the amp needs to live - at that volume or above.
> 
> I again compared the 40cr with the above configuration against an almost stock 40c (only difference is the c19 mod) using identical gain, volume, and EQ settings. Very different sounding amplifiers. The 40c is brighter with much more highs and mids (even with the c19 mod) with tighter bass. At lower volumes the 40c is much fizzier than the 40cr. Again, I think these amps really need to be pushing reasonably loud volumes to really sound good. But when you do, boy, do they sound really good - both of them...just different.
> 
> At similar gain, volume, and EQ settings the 40c seems noticeably louder to me. I think the creamback is slightly less efficient, but that wouldn't account for the difference I noticed. Nonetheless, the 40cr will be plenty loud enough for gigging.
> 
> I didn't open up the 40cr chassis, but when you look at the chassis of both the 40cr and the 40c from the outside you can tell the designs appear to be substantially different. Tube placement is different. The output transformer of the 40cr is smaller than the 40c. The design change appears to be much more than just changing a couple capacitors.
> 
> In my previous review I mentioned that one of the only dings I had with the 40cr was the slight delay when switching channels. I just happened to read on the Marshall site that this amp (and others) are purposefully designed this way to eliminate noise when switching channels. Not sure if I agree with this design approach or not, but that is the reasoning.
> 
> I also listened this time for flabby bass that was mentioned in this thread earlier. On the classic gain channel with high gain settings (> 2 o'clock), all EQ at noon, modestly high bedroom volume, and using a neck pickup on a Les Paul, I think I heard what I'd call a flabby bass. I did not experience this on the ultra gain channel or if I used the bridge pickup. This effect went away with increased volume.


 Good observations !! I think we all got caught up in the bedroom to stage thing lately..which amps are getting good at..but..a Marshall always was designed to get the el34 tubes cooking..up comes natural everything with the right cabs....and the bedroom setting is all pre amp and the gig setting is power tubes involved..which really changes the ball game...everyone should own a Plexi and then get to play with the succeeding years amps...the reason is you learn the core marshall thing..and every marshall i have ever played(some better, some worse) has a Marshall tone there..just have to understand the intention was for volume vs lower level


----------



## BftGibson

Just made my combo into head...


----------



## thembones

I hope this doesn't de-rail the convo too much, I like my 40 combo, thinking about a 100 head for leaving at church do they basically sound the same?


----------



## dan4579

So where is this “optional 6 button footswitch”???


----------



## Springfield Scooter

Does the DSL40CR fit into the same head shell as the old DSL40C ?


----------



## bgreed2

_[QUOTE="thembones... thinking about a 100 head for leaving at church ...[/QUOTE]_

My, oh my. You folks must play a _lot_ louder at your church than we do!! I use a 12w tweed Deluxe and even that is isolated!! Make a joyful noise!


----------



## thembones

bgreed2 said:


> _[QUOTE="thembones... thinking about a 100 head for leaving at church ..._



My, oh my. You folks must play a _lot_ louder at your church than we do!! I use a 12w tweed Deluxe and even that is isolated!! Make a joyful noise![/QUOTE]

I use an isolated booth in the back, I may just use the 40 as a pseudo head by plugging the isolated cab into the amp and disconnecting the speaker


----------



## Snowdogyyz

dan4579 said:


> So where is this “optional 6 button footswitch”???



They are out in the UK, but I’ve yet to find one in the US. I even tried to order one but they wouldn’t ship it to the US.


----------



## Adelino Neto

Hi, folks! here is a small video I've recorded this week to demonstrate the 40CR Classic and Ultra Gain channels in a real song mix. 

This is for those people who don't have a clue about the 40CR versatility and tone.

The song is Everlong from Foo Fighters, and the backing track is from www.guitarbackingtrack.com. I don't know how long it takes until Youtube take it down.


----------



## thembones

Adelino Neto said:


> Hi, folks! here is a small video I've recorded this week to demonstrate the 40CR Classic and Ultra Gain channels in a real song mix.
> 
> This is for those people who don't have a clue about the 40CR versatility and tone.
> 
> The song is Everlong from Foo Fighters, and the backing track is from www.guitarbackingtrack.com. I don't know how long it takes until Youtube take it down.



It sounds really good!
Share your knob settings, always curious to see what others are doing.


----------



## Adelino Neto

thembones said:


> It sounds really good!
> Share your knob settings, always curious to see what others are doing.



Thanks, Thembones!

But for this video I didn't use my daily driver setup.

The idea behind this recording was to demonstrate the regular sound of the 40CR, so I choose not to color too much and set everything around noon.


----------



## kingbee

Has anyone measured the plate voltage for the 40CR?


----------



## LCW

kingbee said:


> Has anyone measured the plate voltage for the 40CR?



Measured mine a couple months ago and it was at 426 V. They will all vary so I wouldn't suggest you assume yours is the same. You should measure it. I've heard they can range from 415 to 490 roughly.

http://www.marshallforum.com/threads/marshall-dsl40cr-bias.100693/#post-1708950


----------



## kingbee

Okay, thanks!


----------



## solarburn

Adelino Neto said:


> Hi, folks! here is a small video I've recorded this week to demonstrate the 40CR Classic and Ultra Gain channels in a real song mix.
> 
> This is for those people who don't have a clue about the 40CR versatility and tone.
> 
> The song is Everlong from Foo Fighters, and the backing track is from www.guitarbackingtrack.com. I don't know how long it takes until Youtube take it down.




I hate the Foofighters!

You sounded great though!


----------



## texhex

Adelino Neto said:


> Hi, folks! here is a small video I've recorded this week to demonstrate the 40CR Classic and Ultra Gain channels in a real song mix.
> 
> This is for those people who don't have a clue about the 40CR versatility and tone.
> 
> The song is Everlong from Foo Fighters, and the backing track is from www.guitarbackingtrack.com. I don't know how long it takes until Youtube take it down.





Sounds killer dude! Great recording and edits. Very cool.


----------



## solarburn

.


----------



## solarburn

What an amp to romp with.


----------



## Springfield Scooter

solarburnDSL50 said:


> What an amp to romp with.




Sounds great Solar!
Is that one of those $40 green bad monkey pedals, in front of an older model dsl40c ????


----------



## solarburn

Springfield Scooter said:


> Sounds great Solar!
> Is that one of those $40 green bad monkey pedals, in front of an older model dsl40c ????



Yep.


----------



## solarburn

I dig my OR15 too...


----------



## BftGibson

head conversion....main rhythm on classic & leads bumped on Ultra...2016 Gibson Firebird studio strait in..that was song 4 in studio..really diggin this amp and since i made it into a head and put it on 2 2x12 cabs it sounds real full..great all around amp


----------



## solarburn

BftGibson said:


> head conversion....main rhythm on classic & leads bumped on Ultra...2016 Gibson Firebird studio strait in..that was song 4 in studio..really diggin this amp and since i made it into a head and put it on 2 2x12 cabs it sounds real full..great all around amp




Fuck yeass!


----------



## jlinde1973

Musicians Friend price drop. $699 brand new. Plus 15% off! That's a hell of a deal. I've got one on the way.


----------



## SG-Rocker

Marshall DSL40CR
Build date 3/18

Plate voltage - 470 volts

This is my second crack at this amp, the first one was returned for the well documented 'rumble noise' (it had a 1/18 build date).

This one has no rumble noise but the ultra gain channels do get saggy - almost saturated fuzz-like - with the gain up 3/4.

I replaced the power amp tubes for Mullard RI and biased to 31 mV.

I replaced all the power tubes with Tungsols.

I swapped in an 8 ohm Neo Creamback.

I'm just not totally bonding with this amp.

For contrast, I have an 83 2204, Mini-Jubilee with slant 212 and a Traynor YCV50 with extension cab.

The Traynor has a Creamback 65 in the combo and Creamback 75 in the extension cab and it absolutely crushes the 40CR.

Guitar used is a Gibson SG Standard loaded with Saturday Night Specials.


----------



## ken361

Try the C version I think the masters might be mudding the tone I tried one at store levels if its too high it muddied it up. dsl40c is sweet at loud playing. Rebea from Andertons doesn't care for it for some reason


----------



## jlinde1973

Yup just got mine and it's also going back. Got the same issue...almost sounds like blowing in a bottle. Kind of a windy hissy rumble at idle on both channels. Definitely some interference or shielding issues going on...not going to try another. Just been too much bad quality control with this amp. Wasnt overly impressed with the tone anyway.


----------



## Delete!!

Nothing worse than getting a defective piece of gear after waiting for it to arrive. Thankfully my 40CR has been working flawlessly. My issue has been with new Fender amps, specifically the Hot Rod series. I couldn’t find one that didn’t have a weird rattle or electrical issue. Finally I settled on a Super Champ X2 head and cab to get me by until I could find a bigger amp. I have a 1976 Deluxe Reverb that I love, but that amp needs some work and I only use it for special occasions anyway. That’s what led me to Marshall. 

I was skeptical about buying a Vietnamese Marshall, but so far I am very happy and have been pleasantly surprised. I also have a 5CR and that amp has been perfect as well. I don’t regret my purchases. My only other Marshall was a JCM2000 DSL100 that I owned around 2004. For what it’s worth, I find my new DSL’s easier to dial in than my old UK model. The eq is drastically improved in my opinion.


----------



## BftGibson

more review...this thing is really becoming my main amp..and i have a plexie,3203 and jcm900, i dialed in classic channel to close to my plexie for that big fat chunky marshall crunch-rhytym and then Ultra green gain on 5 for super tight distortion and then kick to red for that slightly modern sound...it caused me to write a song on the spot last week in studio cause i jus heard sounthin dif i been missing..not going to say modern-or new but but for me it is in a way..so mid CD i am going to ride this amp out for the next 5 songs...thing i am finding out about this amp is..it really is Marshall..the way i want it..the old school basics but with some new attitude..which is helping me come out of my typical mindset and just dime this beast and let it rip..making it into head and with 2 x2x12 cabs made this thing open up..40 watts is right at that point of loud but not my plexie call the cops loud..but very usable 40 watts..also i worked with scooping but found i like my controls pretty noonish with the resonance and presence really changing sounds for each song..it is a super amp for consistent sounds for gigging,,,so glad i took a chance,,if they would of had the head at 50 watt i would of got that but the 40 seems kinda right in the ball park for my exact live volume setting


----------



## Delete!!

When the new DSL line first came out I was interested but turned my nose up at them when I found out where they were made. I assumed they weren’t “real” Marshall amps. Fast forward to the present - the other guitarist on my worship team started bringing a DSL40C and after listening to it several times a week for a couple of months I was convinced it was the real thing. I missed out on the 40C $399 deal but I’m more than happy with the 40CR, and the V-type speaker is excellent - much better than a 70-80. For the first time in a while I am happy with the stock speaker. The amp really projects sound well on stage, I can hear myself so much better and others have commented that my tone and presence in the mix have improved.


----------



## Delete!!

For anyone out there using pedals with this amp.....

Have you experienced any issues with certain drive pedals being extremely boomy at stage volume? I had to quit using my Deluxe Pinnacle because when I would strike a note (especially for solos) it would sound like a loud bass drummer kicking along. I turned the resonance all the way down and the bass is halfway, it certainly doesn’t sound too boomy when played clean. I temporarily replaced the Pinnacle with a Dirty Rat and a Tube Screamer (for boost) and it seems to be fine. I tried everything to get the Pinnacle to work and couldn’t find a good sound without the “bass drum” effect.


----------



## Snowdogyyz

This really makes the amp nice!


----------



## purpleplexi

Delete!! said:


> For anyone out there using pedals with this amp.....
> 
> Have you experienced any issues with certain drive pedals being extremely boomy at stage volume? I had to quit using my Deluxe Pinnacle because when I would strike a note (especially for solos) it would sound like a loud bass drummer kicking along. I turned the resonance all the way down and the bass is halfway, it certainly doesn’t sound too boomy when played clean. I temporarily replaced the Pinnacle with a Dirty Rat and a Tube Screamer (for boost) and it seems to be fine. I tried everything to get the Pinnacle to work and couldn’t find a good sound without the “bass drum” effect.


I find that at house volumes even without pedals. This amp has a lot of bass response. That bass booomph that you get when you hit the strings is something I really don't like. I knock all or almost all the bass off and I have resonance down really low. Luckily that's how I like it to sound - for me the less bass there is the better. Bass is the bass player's job.


----------



## xeizo

purpleplexi said:


> I find that at house volumes even without pedals. This amp has a lot of bass response. That bass booomph that you get when you hit the strings is something I really don't like. I knock all or almost all the bass off and I have resonance down really low. Luckily that's how I like it to sound - for me the less bass there is the better. Bass is the bass player's job.



That's what I really liked about my new Creambacks(4x12) using the DSL20H, the very very tight bass. No overlap with the bassplayer at all. With the (much)cheaper Celestions I used before I had to turn bass down on the amp to reduce boom, not any more. That is at band volume with a drummer.


----------



## Delete!!

purpleplexi said:


> I find that at house volumes even without pedals. This amp has a lot of bass response. That bass booomph that you get when you hit the strings is something I really don't like. I knock all or almost all the bass off and I have resonance down really low. Luckily that's how I like it to sound - for me the less bass there is the better. Bass is the bass player's job.



I went ahead and tested the same setup through my 1976 Deluxe Reverb (Creamback equipped) and had the exact same issue at what would be stage volume for me. For me, a lot of the problem is the Pinnacle, and the Dirty Rat that replaced it sounds incredible and isn’t boomy at all. We just played an outdoor concert here Sunday afternoon, and the amp sounded amazing. With the resonance all the way down it seems to carry enough low end and punch for my taste. 

I will concede that any pedals with a judicious amount of low end will probably be problematic with this amp though. Your comment about the bass is spot on. I had been using my amp for a few weeks and didn’t hear the problem until our bass player was gone one night - then all I could hear was my boomy amp. Now it’s fairly well balanced and all seems to be well, bass or no bass. 

This amp continues to serve me well, and works well with all of my guitars - even my 73 Gretsch Tennessean. I’m still very happy with it - and I finally have a loud amp that doesn’t rattle my head off or make strange noises. So far, so good.


----------



## LCW

Snowdogyyz said:


> This really makes the amp nice!



Is that the PEDL-91016 made for the 40CR? Where did you get from and how much?

Cheers


----------



## Snowdogyyz

LCW said:


> Is that the PEDL-91016 made for the 40CR? Where did you get from and how much?
> 
> Cheers


Yes! Pitbull Audio. Sticker shock though- $200!


----------



## LCW

Snowdogyyz said:


> Yes! Pitbull Audio. Sticker shock though- $200!



I got excited when I saw Thomann was selling for $120, but then realized they won’t ship that item to the US.


----------



## Snowdogyyz

LCW said:


> I got excited when I saw Thomann was selling for $120, but then realized they won’t ship that item to the US.


Yeah I tried that too! Someone on here said they found a dealer somewhere who quoted $150 but it would be mid July before they’d have any.


----------



## cvansickle

Snowdogyyz said:


> Yeah I tried that too! Someone on here said they found a dealer somewhere who quoted $150 but it would be mid July before they’d have any.



That was me. I heard from said dealer the other day and they said that now Marshall is pulling back on the distribution. They have no idea when they will have the switches. Apparently Pitbull scored the exclusivity on this item, and thus set the price.

I'm working on configuring my current MIDI setup to make these changes. I found my old MIDI Solutions Event Processor and I'm going to see if it can work in my rig. I need about 50 program changes mapped to the four channel settings. If it doesn't work I'll just break down and buy the PEDL-91016. I'll report my findings when I have an answer.


----------



## cvansickle

Snowdogyyz said:


> Yes! Pitbull Audio. Sticker shock though- $200!



If you please, will you measure the dimensions of this and post them? I want to make sure my pedalboard has enough space. Thanks.


----------



## purpleplexi

xeizo said:


> That's what I really liked about my new Creambacks(4x12) using the DSL20H, the very very tight bass. No overlap with the bassplayer at all. With the (much)cheaper Celestions I used before I had to turn bass down on the amp to reduce boom, not any more. That is at band volume with a drummer.


I guess I really do need to throw a creamback in there.....


----------



## rbrtlgss

Gary harrer said:


> I've had the dsl 40cr for a week, had very little time to play it due to work, got the midi switching sorted with a line 6 helix which I will be using for effects.
> Picking up a creamback neo tomorrow to throw in.I'm not totally happy with the v-type, that kind of slightly muffled mid forward sound isn't really my thing, I'd rather get a clearer speaker and turn up the mids
> 
> I'll report my thoughts once fitted


I've been trying to get my Helix to control my 40CR for the past few days...even had a line 6 tech on the phone, can't seem to get it to work..

How did you ultimately get yours to work?

I love the sounds from this amp, and combined with the helix, it's killer, the only thing left is having complete control of it

Thanks in advance


----------



## cspencer

Hello Everyone,

I was looking for info on DSL40CR and found this thread. Can't believe I missed it completely! 

I've upgraded mine with NOS Mullards (I61, I63, M8137 and XF2) and Celestion Gold speaker. I have a set of Mercury Magnetics PT, OT and Choke on it's way. Does anyone know which cap the choke is supposed to replace? R63? R71. 

Please don't say it's not worth spending on an "entry-level" amp  This amp is my "keeper" and I find the DSL40CR more versatile in genre and transportability, and with the upgrade it can match AC15HW1X, DSL50C, JCM800 combo/lead series. I only "need" the footswitch and a delay pedal in the loop.


----------



## K2JLX

The choke replaces a resistor, I *believe* it’s R135 - 220 ohm @ 5w but don’t quote me: I’m just seeing the schematic for the first time this evening for the ‘R’ DSL’s.


----------



## cspencer

K2JLX said:


> The choke replaces a resistor, I *believe* it’s R135 - 220 ohm @ 5w but don’t quote me: I’m just seeing the schematic for the first time this evening for the ‘R’ DSL’s.


Thanks for that. Apparently not many people know this amp. They're all referring to the older 40c or 50c. MM had to specially make the OT and PT for me.


----------



## K2JLX

Sure they are still fairly new and the schematic was, until recently, impossible to locate. I think we will see a lot more understanding of this line in the near future.


----------



## cspencer

K2JLX said:


> Sure they are still fairly new and the schematic was, until recently, impossible to locate. I think we will see a lot more understanding of this line in the near future.


I found a service manual online that appears to have reverb, so I guess that must be my amp. But the OT and PT are different to what I have. However, the PT in that manual has a low voltage connection which is similar. And what puzzles me is that there's no C19 in this model. No bright cap to mod I suppose


----------



## K2JLX

cspencer said:


> I found a service manual online that appears to have reverb, so I guess that must be my amp. But the OT and PT are different to what I have. However, the PT in that manual has a low voltage connection which is similar. And what puzzles me is that there's no C19 in this model. No bright cap to mod I suppose



It’s there, with a different number. To my eyes C19 has turned into C73 @ 470p. Whether it needs to be modified is another question, my 100HR channels seem more balanced than my old 40c were.


----------



## cspencer

K2JLX said:


> It’s there, with a different number. To my eyes C19 has turned into C73 @ 470p. Whether it needs to be modified is another question, my 100HR channels seem more balanced than my old 40c were.


Thanks again  I won't remove that cap. Especially when I don't know what it does in this model.

Edit: is this the service manual you're referring to https://music-electronics-forum.com...8b5073e026921&attachmentid=33886&d=1431127848


----------



## bacardi

That was a great review. I said this is a good amp. As you know I installed the Cel. Cream Alnico 90w and great tubes. I had the Bias set by my Tech friend. My amp sounds Great been telling all you guy's great amp.


----------



## Micky

cspencer said:


> Thanks again  I won't remove that cap. Especially when I don't know what it does in this model.
> 
> Edit: is this the service manual you're referring to https://music-electronics-forum.com...8b5073e026921&attachmentid=33886&d=1431127848


That is not a service manual.
It is the original version schematic.


----------



## K2JLX

cspencer said:


> Thanks again  I won't remove that cap. Especially when I don't know what it does in this model.
> 
> Edit: is this the service manual you're referring to https://music-electronics-forum.com...8b5073e026921&attachmentid=33886&d=1431127848




No, that’s the 2012 DSL schematic. I’m working off the new Nov 2016 dated schematic for the 40CR/100HR.


----------



## _ripper_

K2JLX said:


> It’s there, with a different number. To my eyes C19 has turned into C73 @ 470p. Whether it needs to be modified is another question, my 100HR channels seem more balanced than my old 40c were.



I'm no expert, so correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that C74 is the bright cap on that schematic, and it's labeled as NF (not fitted).


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## cspencer

Micky said:


> That is not a service manual.
> It is the original version schematic.


Hi Micky,
I did see the date but the reverb on the schematic confused me.



K2JLX said:


> No, that’s the 2012 DSL schematic. I’m working off the new Nov 2016 dated schematic for the 40CR/100HR.


Hi K2JLX,
I emailed a few techs around Sydney about replacing my OT/PT/choke. They all said they could do it, except one, who is also a Marshall service tech. He said he wasn't familiar with this model and would purchase a service manual if unsure (I think he meant schematic). But he is an hour's drive away! Is it really that difficult for experienced techs to install OT/PT? Just wondering if I should play it safe.


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## Micky

cspencer said:


> Hi Micky,
> I did see the date but the reverb on the schematic confused me.
> 
> 
> Hi K2JLX,
> I emailed a few techs around Sydney about replacing my OT/PT/choke. They all said they could do it, except one, who is also a Marshall service tech. He said he wasn't familiar with this model and would purchase a service manual if unsure (I think he meant schematic). But he is an hour's drive away! Is it really that difficult for experienced techs to install OT/PT? Just wondering if I should play it safe.


No, it is not extremely difficult, I outlined it in detail in my DSL40c thread.
It is always best to have an experienced teck work on your amp, especially if you are unfamiliar or unsure how to do the mod.


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## cspencer

Micky said:


> No, it is not extremely difficult, I outlined it in detail in my DSL40c thread.
> It is always best to have an experienced teck work on your amp, especially if you are unfamiliar or unsure how to do the mod.


Hi Micky,
I read a lot of your posts, some repeatedly. Thanks so much for contributing. There were posts in that mega thread about replacing OT/choke. Just wasn't sure if it applies to this model.


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## Micky

The specifics are a bit different, but the basic approach is the same. It will be difficult to find a replacement PT, but the OEM PT is fine. The OT has 3 outputs but ClassicTone makes a replacement. Your tech ought to be able to handle it easily.


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## cspencer

Micky said:


> The specifics are a bit different, but the basic approach is the same. It will be difficult to find a replacement PT, but the OEM PT is fine. The OT has 3 outputs but ClassicTone makes a replacement. Your tech ought to be able to handle it easily.


Hi Micky,

That's very reassuring. I really don't want to drive that far when there are techs nearer to me.

BTW, Mercury Magnetics is making both OT and PT for me. The OT they had was without a 4ohm speaker so they have to build one. As for PT, they have one MAR-DSL40C-P which has a low voltage winding. ClassicTone doesn't have that.

I reread a post of yours about choke replacement and I'm guessing the capacitor to replace on this new model is as arrowed below.


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## Robert Herndon Project

ken361 said:


> Lead 2 gain on 3 at bedroom levels but sounds great and tight loud also. i usually use lead 1 most of the time though




Interesting....


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## Robert Herndon Project

LCW said:


> Rat into the 40CR...




Hmmmmmm.....


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## Joeleoj

Delete!! said:


> For anyone out there using pedals with this amp.....
> 
> Have you experienced any issues with certain drive pedals being extremely boomy at stage volume? I had to quit using my Deluxe Pinnacle because when I would strike a note (especially for solos) it would sound like a loud bass drummer kicking along. I turned the resonance all the way down and the bass is halfway, it certainly doesn’t sound too boomy when played clean. I temporarily replaced the Pinnacle with a Dirty Rat and a Tube Screamer (for boost) and it seems to be fine. I tried everything to get the Pinnacle to work and couldn’t find a good sound without the “bass drum” effect.


I have the same exact problem. There's a weird bass artifact happening on any OD/distortion pedal I've used that has a bass knob. My trusty red Jekyll&Hyde works perfectly with it though. Seem's like I'm never gonna outgrow that pedal though...


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## ibmorjamn

Damn it , I get out of DSL world now I found the video . Am am surprised how good the amp sounds compared to the old one. However there are some issues with volume drop and switching ?


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## EC Strat

i know this is an old thread but had some questions : i have the newer version of the DSL 40 (post 2018) and find that the trebles, while better, can still be strident / ice picky I think the bright cap in the new DSL's are C73 for the red channels and C61 for the green. 

Does anyone know if this is correct? Has anyone dropped in lower value caps at these positions ?


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## Bull Rock

Turn the treble and presence down. No mods needed. Treble on 1/4 presence 1/3 ish give or take. It's a beautiful thing.


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## EC Strat

Bull Rock said:


> Turn the treble and presence down. No mods needed. Treble on 1/4 presence 1/3 ish give or take. It's a beautiful thing.



Not what I asked. Well aware of treble and presence knobs.


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## Jon C

EC Strat said:


> i know this is an old thread but had some questions : i have the newer version of the DSL 40 (post 2018) and find that the trebles, while better, can still be strident / ice picky I think the bright cap in the new DSL's are C73 for the red channels and C61 for the green.
> 
> Does anyone know if this is correct? Has anyone dropped in lower value caps at these positions ?


Can you make out the Values on the existing caps ?
Is C73 somewhere in the 470 Pico realm still ?


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## EC Strat

Jon C said:


> Can you make out the Values on the existing caps ?
> Is C73 somewhere in the 470 Pico realm still ?



yes I think so. It says “471” on it and then 1KV in C73. 

I can’t see any writing on the C61 cap but an exact same looking cap near it says 221. Hope this helps


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## Bull Rock

My bad. Carry on.


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## Jon C

EC Strat said:


> yes I think so. It says “471” on it and then 1KV in C73.
> 
> I can’t see any writing on the C61 cap but an exact same looking cap near it says 221. Hope this helps


I can't confirm the Treble Bleed cap locations on the CR .. Sorry
If it's still around 470pF then they did not change it much ( if at all ) since the 40C ..
I added an Option Switch to my 40C with 470pF / None / 100pF .. @ C19 of course
The 100pF is the Sweet Spot for TV Volume !!


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## EC Strat

Jon C said:


> I can't confirm the Treble Bleed cap locations on the CR .. Sorry
> If it's still around 470pF then they did not change it much ( if at all ) since the 40C ..
> I added an Option Switch to my 40C with 470pF / None / 100pF .. @ C19 of course
> The 100pF is the Sweet Spot for TV Volume !!


Appreciate the replies. Yeah, eyeballing it it looks like C73 is the red and C61 is the green based off of where they are positioned and where the lines are running. I bet they’re the same values. But for sure, Marshall made a ton of improvements to the line in 2018. It’s not as harsh and fizzy with volume differences like before. But I’m really having to roll off the trebles on my guitar to 5-6 and set the amp trebles at 9 to 11 depending when playing leads. But when playing rhythm need to increase the highs for a good tone Need to get it sorted.


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## EC Strat

Jon C said:


> I can't confirm the Treble Bleed cap locations on the CR .. Sorry
> If it's still around 470pF then they did not change it much ( if at all ) since the 40C ..
> I added an Option Switch to my 40C with 470pF / None / 100pF .. @ C19 of course
> The 100pF is the Sweet Spot for TV Volume !!





Jon C said:


> I can't confirm the Treble Bleed cap locations on the CR .. Sorry
> If it's still around 470pF then they did not change it much ( if at all ) since the 40C ..
> I added an Option Switch to my 40C with 470pF / None / 100pF .. @ C19 of course
> The 100pF is the Sweet Spot for TV Volume !!


I can’t find the schematics either.


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## Lukas

Bloodrock said:


> Bias points are still inside the chassis like the last dsl40 combo


No they’re not


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## SkyMonkey

EC Strat said:


> i have the newer version of the DSL 40 (post 2018) and find that the trebles, while better, can still be strident / ice picky


Many just put an EQ in the loop. I use a tiny bit from my GT. Much safer and easier than modding.​


EC Strat said:


> I can’t find the schematics either.


The schematics can take years to leak out for a relatively new amp design.
You will know about it when they finally do surface.
A wave of CR/HR modding threads will start appearing.

Are you using a particularly trebly pickup?
I have a range of pickups in my guitars (signature) and find a flat EQ (w/treble @6) with no Res or Pres is fine for all, whilst still letting them sound individual.
I am getting older though, so maybe the top end is going from my hearing.
Still, folk rarely complain of the CR being too trebly like the older C.​


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## EC Strat

SkyMonkey said:


> Many just put an EQ in the loop. I use a tiny bit from my GT. Much safer and easier than modding.​
> The schematics can take years to leak out for a relatively new amp design.
> You will know about it when they finally do surface.
> A wave of CR/HR modding threads will start appearing.
> 
> Are you using a particularly trebly pickup?
> I have a range of pickups in my guitars (signature) and find a flat EQ (w/treble @6) with no Res or Pres is fine for all, whilst still letting them sound individual.
> I am getting older though, so maybe the top end is going from my hearing.
> Still, folk rarely complain of the CR being too trebly like the older C.​


Yes my strats pretty bright


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## SkyMonkey

Get an EQ. 
Totally reversible, and fairly cheap. 
Preserves the original amp EQ for other guitars you may get down the road, and resale.


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## Carlos G

Bloodrock said:


> So I received my new DSL 40 this afternoon and gave it a couple of hours of tweaking, here are my findings. This review is compared to my old JCM2000 DSL 50 that I have had for almost 10 years. The Reverb is still Meh! Don't care I have pedals.
> 
> First of all, the 2 added master volumes give you an entire new range of gain and volume sounds when blended with the gain and volume of each channel. you can crank the channel volume and back off the master to get a much more pushed power section type of tone if you want, and also get much better cranked sounds at lower volumes using the masters.
> 
> The EQ itself it much better sounding all around. No more ear piercing clanking highs and no more flubby lows, (although you can dial in extremes using the resonance and presence). But no more living on 2 with your treble and presence when you use the ultra channel.
> 
> Much more balanced EQ between the channels. No more huge volume jump, and only minor EQ tweaks needed between Classic and Ultra channels.
> 
> More gain on Classic, and less gain on Ultra. Subjective to opinions, but much better balance IMO. Classic Crunch now does close to Slash type gain if cranked, and Ultra is dialed back a bit, plus it's a lot more open and less compressed sounding.
> 
> V-Type speaker... Very well matched to this amp. I'm a huge V30 fan and my old JCM800 cab I use has 2 V30's and 2 H30's, this speaker is very well matched. Nothing offensive sounding out of the box.
> 
> The most surprising thing is that Ultra 2 is actually useable! No more flubby low end and fizzy highs! Kick it in with modest gain and put the mid shift in and it's an amazing EVH brown sound. Lows are much tighter and punchier on all channels. Much more like an old 5150 than the previous DSL. The low end is tight and chunky.
> Overall I'd say Marshall nailed it 20 years later with the DSL. LOL! I'm sure it will sound even better after a good tube swap and a bias adjustment.


Did you adjust the bias and had an improvement ? Where did you set it for the best sound?


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## Randy Rhoads

Anyone know where I can get the 6 button foot switch for cheap?


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## SkyMonkey

£79 or more new in the UK.
Never seen one for less, or 2nd hand.


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## Tom Drouhard

kingbee said:


> Has anyone measured the plate voltage for the 40CR?


My dsl40cr plate voltage varies anywhere from 426dc to 433dc depending on where I have the bias voltage set. Right now, the bias is at 38.0 and the DC voltage is 426 with line voltage at 121 V AC.


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## mpaisan

Thoughts from reading this thread; initially came here looking for info on the two master volumes; here are my thoughts on that and more.
Master Volumes: Not needed; the design logic is centered around having the optional (not stock) footswitch. There is no other way to switch between the volume masters "live" for a "boost" whilst playing. There are some confusing descriptions of how these work. Each "channel" has two modes; *both channels *are controlled by *one or *the other master volume. I pretty much dime my master volume, doesn't matter which one because I only use one (for both channels). Use the channel volumes to balance between them for switching from clean to OD. Live, I dime my clean channel and run up the gain control to get the volume needed - keeps it under clean control that way. The OD channel, whatever floats your boat, I usually run gain at 11 o'clock and adjust OD channel volume to match the clean channel output, maybe a touch louder. I use a clean boost pedal for lead on both the classic (clean) and OD channels - that basically negates the dual master volume optional pedal dilemma. It also adds flexibility to amount of boost (gigs just get louder as the night goes on) and also adds a degree of tone control if the pedal offers it - I use a Strymon Sunset for this purpose.


Bias: I've tried several settings and found 34mv the sweet spot - above 35 is just noisy, maybe ok if all you do is hard rock/metal with an aggressive noise gate, but if that's the use case - a different amp might be a better choice. I got the 2022 DSL40CR for it's tonal stage flexibility and recording purposes, the speaker sim out is actually pretty half decent into a daw. 32mv results in very nice cleans, but that's just barely enough plate voltage to keep the tubes hot - depending on the main power available, you may get dropouts running below 34mv. 34mv also helped with some of the screechiness, down from 38mv as I received it. BTW; the bias connections being external (on the latest models) and super easy to use are a huge perk for experimenting with a simple/cheap multi-meter - that feature alone is pretty darn cool.

The Celestion type-V speaker just simply does not do this amp justice - in fact is it the cause of most of the peaky, screechy, ice pick treble response. Marshall had to scrimp somewhere to hit the sub 1K mark, and this is where they did it. I know this may be a bit beyond the reach of many here; I replaced the stock Celestion with with a Ted Weber Alnico Blue Dog - 75 watt 16 0hm Hemp cone. The difference is night and day, that speaker, plugged into the 8 Ohm out jack is so rich, clear, usable and responsive - it might make you cry, just amazing.

Overall given my comments above; if you gig and perform a variety of styles from clean/dirty blues to classic rock (cream, hendrix, santana, eagles, et al) to harder rock sounds like GNR, Zep, BS, DP, etc... then this amp can do it - a true swiss army knife type amp that does many things extremely well. It will fall short of modern or thrash metal; it won't stretch to a triple rec, aside from that... it's a terrific amp.


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