# The makeover...



## DirtySteve

First off, sorry for the long post, but a lot has happened in the last few weeks and this is really just the "in a nut shell" version, lol.

Some of you already know I'm in the process of rebuilding my Blades 20 watt """prototype""". I think it's about time to start talking about what's going on since so many of you have shown interest and offered advice.

I started out to just identify and fix the safety issues that were brought to my attention when I posted pics of the guts a while back, but as I got into it I found more issues...a filament wire burned clean through to bare wire that was tie wrapped up and hidden in goop and I also found a couple of grounds with bad solder joints that had popped off the pots, not to mention the globs or solder everywhere so who knows what's good and what's not. I decided I'm going to redo the whole thing including a new board, all new components and wiring. I'm not sure yet, but I might replace the sockets, too.

I want to give credit where it's due and say that I've had some help to get this far already. Guitar Rocker and Mrosa have been more than generous in helping me identify parts and understanding what I have here and what was changed from the circuit this amp is based on. I wouldn't be this far along if it wasn't for them and I want to publicly thank them for their time and generosity in making this a fun learning experience for me. They are straight up genuine down to earth and "real" people that I'm proud to have gotten to know and consider my friends!

I now have a basic understanding of how it works and what the parts are and what they do. I'm getting more of an education here than I ever though I would and I'm learning new things everyday. I'm very thankful to those guys as well as the support I've gotten here on this forum from others. You know who you are and I appreciate all of you. 



So far I have the entire amp drawn out in autocad and I'm going to start disassembling it this weekend and work on labeling everything on my drawing and verifying values. I've already IDed a lot of them just by removing the goop and using a q-tip with alcohol to remove the sharpie. (< good tip and it also works to get hot glue off of just about anything) Then I'll be ready to draw it up with a new layout and start putting it back together.

At first I wasn't sure how I would go about doing the rebuild and and was starting to second guess myself, but thanks to these guys not only am I confident I can do it, but I'm also learning a lot through the process that I probably wouldn't have learned on my own.

So, that's where I'm at. I've already received some of the parts I need and I'm in the process of listing everything else I need to order. I'm going to hopefully start ordering the rest this coming week and get this show on the road. The hardest part now seems like it will be laying out the new board. I'm sure I will probably make some beginner mistakes and who knows what else might come up since I've never done this before, but in the end I have no doubt it will be safe, it will look a lot better than it does now and from what I've learned so far I'm confident it's going to sound even better than it already did.

I hope that this can be a positive thread and not have to get shut down so please stay on topic. This isn't about bashing, that's all in another place if you want to go back and read up. We know what's wrong and what should have been done that wasn't. That's all water under the bridge now and this is about moving forward...

...wish me luck!


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## bulldozer1984

DirtySteve said:


> ...wish me luck!




good luck brother


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## damienbeale

Go Steve. I'm willing you on, chief. This will be a good thing, for many reasons, but most of all because I suspect you will really enjoy it. Except the spending money on parts bit.


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## DirtySteve

damienbeale said:


> Go Steve. I'm willing you on, chief. This will be a good thing, for many reasons, but most of all because I suspect you will really enjoy it. Except the spending money on parts bit.



Nah, if it wasn't this I'd be spending money on something else, like the Tele I want to build, but don't really need! Besides, it's really not that much.


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## sam marshall

Good luck!!!


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## Ghostman

What an exciting project. My next amp will be a kit build. Nothing like what you're doing, but good luck Steve! You know we are all pulling for you! Just a tip though. Once you're done, if you put any labels or names on it that has anything to do with where it comes from, you're asking for a swift kick in the dick. LOL 

But I gotta ask, aren't you a little hesitant to void the warranty? 

edit. (threw the nutkick smiley, when else would I use one?)


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## DirtySteve

Ghostman said:


> What an exciting project. My next amp will be a kit build. Nothing like what you're doing, but good luck Steve! You know we are all pulling for you! Just a tip though. Once you're done, if you put any labels or names on it that has anything to do with where it comes from, you're asking for a swift kick in the dick. LOL
> 
> But I gotta ask, aren't you a little hesitant to void the warranty?


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## DirtySteve

Technically, this is nothing original and I'm planning to remove the mods to the current circuit and add some different options...maybe I'll call it the DirtySteve.


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## DirtySteve

I'm going to remove the PPIMV, I just think it sounds good at the lowest volumes and doesn't need it. I'm also doing away with the mid shift and deep switch and I'm going to add a few things that I think will be much more useful.


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## Ghostman

DirtySteve said:


> Technically, this is nothing original and I'm planning to remove the mods to the current circuit and add some different options...maybe I'll call it the DirtySteve.



I'd buy that.


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## shredless

I think the mods should monitor this thread and keep all the dirt out of it

and esp keep mister blades out of it


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## damienbeale

Dirt not required. Just plen'y of enthusiasm.


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## Alabama Thunderpussy

DirtySteve Amplification

_"Dirty and Sturdy"_


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## paul-e-mann

Yay Steve!  Pictures or it didn't happen!


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## Rocktane

Wow, how exciting! Take a not so great experience and turn it an awesome learning adventure that will yield the amp you want and provide hands-on amp constructing knowledge. Serendipity in action! I wish you great success!


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## DirtySteve

pedecamp said:


> Yay Steve!  Pictures or it didn't happen!



I wouldn't have it any other way.


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## Micky

That does sound cool Steve.
Your soldering skills will be top notch by the time you are done!
It isn't rocket science, and there is no surface mount stuff, so you should have fun too.
Kinda like playing with Duplo blocks instead of Lego's...


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## DirtySteve

Micky said:


> That does sound cool Steve.
> Your soldering skills will be top notch by the time you are done!
> It isn't rocket science, and there is no surface mount stuff, so you should have fun too.
> Kinda like playing with Duplo blocks instead of Lego's...



What?!! I love legos! My soldering skills aren't an issue, I've been soldering for 30 years...just not in an amp. 

edit: oops, I didn't know what duplo blocks were and got that backwards. Yeah that's it..


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## brp

It will be at least a million times better than it was.

Glad to hear you're getting lots of help from those guys. Good on you boys.


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## mott555

Steve, you seem to have a great outlook on things. I'm not trying to bring up that other thread, but you're trying to learn from the situation and improve it where most people wouldn't be able to move past their anger. That's very admirable and you'll do well with this attitude!

Good luck on your project, I'm sure you'll learn a lot!


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## Guitar-Rocker

So far, this has been a very meaningful project. As Steve has said, what started as maybe just a repair the safety issues, has morphed into a redo, which is really where it needed to be. With Robb's assistance, the existing build has been traced out, components identified, and the changes needed clarified. and so far Steve's head hasn't exploded with the two of us force feeding him info! 

I couldn't stand seeing those "sharpie marked up" components getting reused, and so I donated most of the components needed to Steve as a "teaser" to get him to scrap them all, and he's made a great choice in going on through with a completely new board, with quality components. I sent him Vishay metal film 2w resistors that are the same physical size as 1/2w, Vishay caps, and Steve bought any other components needed that I had in stock, so his "buy " wish list won't be too large. 

The main theme of the preamp is as Robb stated in the other thread, pretty much a spot on Cameron Jose, with very few changes. The few that were added, were common mods, with a few not going back into the rebuild. The power section was a sort of hybrid 18W, with the B+ dropping string styled after not an 18W, but a 100W. While the amp did work, there were a few, let's just say unusual tweaks there, that will not be a part of the rework. No matter what, the final product will be a safe amp to use, and Steve will have a much better overall picture of amps. Personally, I don't think by the time he's done that this will be the only build...addictive!


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## Ghostman

I haven't been this excited about a thread since....

....well, ever!


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## Guitar-Rocker

It's exciting, because it's about doing the "right" thing.


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## Söulcaster

Good luck DS, good to hear some of the technically minded are helping out. Funny how things work out.
I betchya the amp will sound better than ever.

Peace man


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## rmroza

Your welcome Steve and Terry. This is a collaborative project and like you said, in the end, the tone will be amazing and amp safe.

I think both Steve and Terry touched on the scope, but think it needs to formalized.

As indicated, we're throwing out the voicing and PPIMV. We're putting the correct 18-watt power section in there. The preamp will go to a Jose HG with 3-way selectable and defeatable zener clip. There are a few things Steve can do to add versatility, or keep it simple....like keep (but better designed) voicing, bright switches, or variable depth, resonance, thump controls. If you want to keep it simple, I would say no voicing or bright and put in a fixed depth control. If you want to do more, we can add variable thump or depth and add versatility. If you want more versatility, we can add the other stuff. We should know the scope beforehand to finalize design n before board and layout are solidified.

Do you like more Alice in Chains/Aldrich loose amp, over the top gain, and fizzy or more tighter and Marshally VH stuff? We'll adjust the preamp depending on your tone. Baseline Jose is going to be tighter and EVH-style. The way the amp was set up was for original Cameron Jose HG preamp, like I said, it was poorly copied a component-for-component rip (clone) with incorrect power section, poor solder joints, probably miswired and who knows about biasing yet, etc as discussed above.

Anyway, a few more things to do and think about before we solidify deisgn n layout. Let me/us know.


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## DirtySteve

Well to be honest, I'm just not sure right now. A lot of this is still over my head. Actually, I'm not looking specifically for any of those tones per say, certain aspects maybe. I like tight, but I thought that incorporating the sag resister mod would give me some variety. I guess if I had to compare what I'm looking for to known artists tone I would say it's somewhere between early James H and Mike Ness for a main sound (and that's vague I know, but I don't know how to explain), but with options to get into VH, Randy, Scorps territory. ...if that makes sense.


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## rmroza

Yep, it does. We're gonna need to loosen up the tone for everyone escept VH and switch zeners depending on the amount of clipping you're looking for. I would say you should up the fizz cap from Marshall and you'll probably want to add a 3-way bright switch with certain values or defeated to get you more toward the VH tone or we'll need to adjust the slope resistor and some of the tone stack circuit so it is attenuating certain frequencies all simple tweaks.


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## bulldozer1984

DirtySteve said:


> Well to be honest, I'm just not sure right now. A lot of this is still over my head. Actually, I'm not looking specifically for any of those tones per say, certain aspects maybe. I like tight, but I thought that incorporating the sag resister mod would give me some variety. I guess if I had to compare what I'm looking for to known artists tone I would say it's somewhere between early James H and Mike Ness for a main sound (and that's vague I know, but I don't know how to explain), but with options to get into VH, Randy, Scorps territory. ...if that makes sense.



But Steve, werent you happy with the way it sounded before ?? 

If thats the case, you don't want the Aldrich mod.. That is 4 stages of gain and you will lose the sound you currently have..


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## DirtySteve

Ok, let pretend for a second that I didn't say VH. ...that was the really a stretch.


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## DirtySteve

bulldozer1984 said:


> But Steve, werent you happy with the way it sounded before ??
> 
> If thats the case, you don't want the Aldrich mod.. That is 4 stages of gain and you will lose the sound you currently have..



Yes, I'm assuming we are talking about the base tone it already has, but improved. This is getting into areas I don't fully understand I guess. I'm not looking to turn it into something else per say, just looking for better options "for me" than what it came with. I might be getting too carried away.


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## bulldozer1984

Oh yeh i fully agree with giving yourself some extra options, i just wouldn't advise you to move away from the 3 stage Jose if you are happy with the core tone. That' s all man


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## NewReligion

Outstanding Steve. Really happy to see you take this opportunity to improve the circuit with the guidance of such capable technicians.

Sounds like you have the plan and all of the components you need but I do have a few Sozo Caps I can donate if you like. If needed or interested send me a PM and I will provide the data.

Good luck and take your time.

David ♫


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## minerman

Great news Steve!!! You know, I'd wondered about you & your amp...You know, it'd kill me to have an amp built for me, then find out about the issues after I got it...BUT, you've got a great outlook & are taking things in stride dude, you'll have *your* amp before long, with no worries, & it'll be a learning experience as well....My hat's off to ya man!!!

Super nice of the forum members to pitch in with parts, help & advice on the re-build too, what a great bunch of guys!!!

So, lemme get this right, you're gonna build your own amp, that can cover EVH, Metallica, Aldrich, Rhoads & more all in one box??? Super cool man, super cool!!!

I'm gonna be following this thread as close as I possibly can for learning purposes myself. While my soldering skills aren't great (shitty actually...), this thread would be great for guys like me to learn about how amps/circuits work, & maybe actually do a few mods/tweaks to some of my gear without having to worry if I'm gonna screw something up beyond repair...

Again, my hat's off to ya dude, please do keep us posted with lots of details & pics!!!


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## solarburn

Good luck with the build Durty! Will be spectating and cheering you on!

Oh and way to go Techs! Very generous of you.


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## DirtySteve

Thanks David, I really appreciate the offer!


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## DirtySteve

Thanks to all you guys for the support! I'm glad we decided to go ahead and start a thread.


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## john l

OMG I must have missed where someone here bought one of his amps. I have to say Im dying to see what it looked like lol , PICS?


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## Guitar-Rocker

I e-mailed Steve earlier, recommended some layout stuff, and he said there were literally huge blobs of solder coming off of each joint as he's disassembling. Must have been from that triple soldering thing.


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## DirtySteve

Yeah the star ground is gobbed. That little shit pile of solder flung off when I pulled one of the wires. That's another glob that fell off at the corner of the tranny and I got a lot of it with my sucker, but couldn't keep up with it. But that's not totally why I posted this pic. I'm wondering about the goop on the transformer and what it would mean if I damaged that getting it off, looks to be paper or some kind of tape or something? It was easy to get it off most of the board, but I've left it alone here until I asked.


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## damienbeale

It's usually an impregnating paper or similar, but it's only an insulator, so if you do damage it and expose wires underneath you can just insulate it again via other means. Even if it's just anti-tracking paint.

A little heat should soften that goop right up though. Looks like hot-melt glue rather than silicone/rtv. Even a hairdryer up close will probably work. Assuming that you have one, that is.


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## DirtySteve

damienbeale said:


> It's usually an impregnating paper or similar, but it's only an insulator, so if you do damage it and expose wires underneath you can just insulate it again via other means. Even if it's just anti-tracking paint.
> 
> A little heat should soften that goop right up though. Looks like hot-melt glue rather than silicone/rtv. Even a hairdryer up close will probably work. Assuming that you have one, that is.




Thanks dude, yeah it's hot glue. I was able to get it off the board components and wires using a little rubbing alcohol. I looked up how to remove hot glue, that's what came up and it worked great. It pops it loose easily, but I was worried about using it on that. But since you said what you did I went ahead and gave it a tug and it popped right off.


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## damienbeale

So are you sticking with star ground system?

If so, you'll probably reap big benefits by moving the ground point AWAY from the transformer mount. That's not a recipe for a quiet amp how it is currently. Ideally for most earths, you don't want to share a ground point with anything connected to the laminations.


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## DirtySteve

No, at least I don't think so. That was one of the first things Terry and I discussed.


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## DirtySteve

Actually, now that I think about it, I'm not sure how I'm going to do the grounds. That still needs to be determined. One of the problems I have is the transformer wires are cut so short.


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## damienbeale

Good call. Not the best of systems.


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## damienbeale

Randall Aiken can help with that...
Aiken Amplification

Go advanced, then star grounding.
You'll see that star grounding isn't necessarily single point.

Just extend the leads and heat shrink the joint if you need to, for the transformers.


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## Guitar-Rocker

You could use one of those 3 terminal strips that I sent for the green filament wires to give you a splice point. The red/yellow striped wire will need spliced probably. Did I send a piece of that same color wire? It's the center tap for the HV coil. The red HV's should re-reach the new turret board.


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## DirtySteve

Oh cool, wow I could spend all week reading on that site. Thanks man.


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## DirtySteve

Guitar-Rocker said:


> You could use one of those 3 terminal strips that I sent for the green filament wires to give you a splice point. The red/yellow striped wire will need spliced probably. Did I send a piece of that same color wire? It's the center tap for the HV coil. The red HV's should re-reach the new turret board.



I don't see any wire in the bag. I did know you sent the terminal strips, but I don't know what to do with them yet. I figured I'd cross that bridge when I got there. I'm just trying to take in what I understand right now and ask questions if the light bulb doesn't go on between now and then. 

Seriously, a lot of times things I don't understand fall into place later in the process. I'm on information overload right now guys, lol.


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## rmroza

Hey Steve, for grounding, I'd recommend "Galactic Grounding". I can send you and/or post pics of the approach.

Robb


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## DirtySteve

Thanks bro, bring it on! It might be helpful to someone else, too.


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## rmroza

Enjoy!

Robb


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## damienbeale

DirtySteve said:


> Oh cool, wow I could spend all week reading on that site. Thanks man.



Yes, Randall Aiken is one of the VERY few tube "guru"s (I so frigging hate that word) that I recommend following very closely. Between him and R G Keen there is some great learning to be had, without wild and wacky opinion.


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## DirtySteve

Here we go...just passed the point of no return.  



 

More solder globs...





Say goodbye  





...oops, I almost forgot.


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## 2203xman

Very proud of you man,shows balls.Just like my dad,just jumps right into anything,and learns as he goes.Your in some good hands there.


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## charveldan

Id take that board and shove it sideways up B blades arse ...


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## rmroza

What do you want? He's not a technician. He's not an engineer. It's not a slam, it is what it is. 

BB con'ed some people into giving him some designs (he could never do a design or layout...on his own) and after tooling around for a couple years and saying he had zero interest in going into business, is trying, but he has no business...in the business. 

He's a tattoo artist and not a very good one as by the reviews.

Neither he, nor I'm sure his friends, family, or staff are technologically qualified to build any high voltage tube amplifier. This is the reason he believes a well designed and properly trained and experienced person should not pay $2500 or $3500 for an amp. He is absolutely delusional and any customer is really getting what they pay for...and the proof is in the pudding and I'm sorry Steve had to deal with this, but in the end, we'll get him to where he should be and wants and the grail tone.

Bily Blades and Blades Amplification makes crap with Joe Blow bulding them. As my grandfather said..."you buy cheap, you got cheap". There's a reason you pay a little, or some times a lot more for something.


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## gldtp99

rmroza said:


> What do you want? He's not a technician. He's not an engineer. It's not a slam, it is what it is.
> 
> BB con'ed some people into giving him some designs (he could never do a design or layout...on his own) and after tooling around for a couple years and saying he had zero interest in going into business, is trying, but he has no business...in the business.
> 
> He's a tattoo artist and not a very good one as by the reviews.
> 
> Neither he, nor I'm sure his friends, family, or staff are technologically qualified to build any high voltage tube amplifier. This is the reason he believes a well designed and properly trained and experienced person should not pay $2500 or $3500 for an amp. He is absolutely delusional and any customer is really getting what they pay for...and the proof is in the pudding and I'm sorry Steve had to deal with this, but in the end, we'll get him to where he should be and wants and the grail tone.
> 
> Bily Blades and Blades Amplification makes crap with Joe Blow bulding them. As my grandfather said..."you buy cheap, you got cheap". There's a reason you pay a little, or some times a lot more for something.



Agree---- watching this gut-and-rebuild with interest......................gldtp99


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## bulldozer1984

Looks good to see the shitstorm of a board outta there Steve. Cant wait to see the final product. 

Professional looking cabs and internals, gunna be great man.


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## hbach

Good on you Steve! I think you have made the best of it and are learning a lot.


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## DirtySteve

The wire ground thing in this pic that's "soldered" to the ring connector at that bolt wasn't even soldered good. I just pulled it off with my fingers. 





I'm amazed this thing wasn't noisy as hell with all the ground issues.


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## Guitar-Rocker

That was one of my thoughts too, when I first saw the original photos, especially seeing grounds every which where. I don't use common component bolt mounts for ground points, but instead use separate holes. That's a short cut in the photo.


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## Alabama Thunderpussy

DirtySteve said:


> The wire ground thing in this pic that's "soldered" to the ring connector at that bolt wasn't even soldered good. I just pulled it off with my fingers.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm amazed this thing wasn't noisy as hell with all the ground issues.



That says a lot actually. People get hung up on these ground schemes like "oh I have to do it this way or it's gonna hum."

It's not rocket science. You can achieve a quiet design without going out of your way.


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## NewReligion

DirtySteve said:


> The wire ground thing in this pic that's "soldered" to the ring connector at that bolt wasn't even soldered good. I just pulled it off with my fingers.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm amazed this thing wasn't noisy as hell with all the ground issues.



So does all of the extra solder blobs add to the "metal" tone. Sorry that was likely in poor taste. Glad to see Steve taking this on.

David ♫


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## DirtySteve

One thing I haven't mentioned yet is this thing was microphonic and picked up a religious radio station. I haven't mentioned it because my other amps have been microphonic too, just not as bad as this one. I blame it on the power where I live and sometimes it would get better if I just switched guitar cables, but now I wonder. What causes that?


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## DirtySteve

BTW I ordered my new board, turrets and wire today.


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## Alabama Thunderpussy

So you had "heavenly" tone.


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## DirtySteve

Alabama Thunderpussy said:


> So you had "heavenly" tone.



I certainly never stopped playing once I turned it on. I grew up in a strict religious home and it left a bad taste, I really hope it's gone when I fire it up again..


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## SonVolt

What the heck did Billy do to this amp? It sounds fantastic. 

"If you don't like it, suck it. If you do, fuck it."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvZGIBVgLcg


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## charveldan

DirtySteve said:


> One thing I haven't mentioned yet is this thing was microphonic and picked up a religious radio station. I haven't mentioned it because my other amps have been microphonic too, just not as bad as this one. I blame it on the power where I live and sometimes it would get better if I just switched guitar cables, but now I wonder. What causes that?



Ryan's Guitars: RF Mod for Kingsley ToneBaron

It's called RFI. I've done this mod to both my JMP's and it works well.


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## DirtySteve

charveldan said:


> Ryan's Guitars: RF Mod for Kingsley ToneBaron
> 
> It's called RFI. I've done this mod to both my JMP's and it works well.



Awesome! Thanks Dan, perfect timing too, I plan to order the rest of the components I need from from mouser tomorrow.


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## Guitar-Rocker

SonVolt said:


> What the heck did Billy do to this amp? It sounds fantastic.
> 
> "If you don't like it, suck it. If you do, fuck it."
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvZGIBVgLcg


 


Best guess is a clipping diode set, and maybe swapped out some preamp tube cathode values. Added an extra gain stage too.


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## john l

Yep sounds very Jose I don't know about another stage Id say 20v zeners, tweaked cathodes, resonance and maybe some beefier output couplers. Its a good sound but soooooo nothing new.


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## SonVolt

Is there a stock amp that sounds like this? If not, why?


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## S9X

Peavey VTM. Not exactly the same, but somewhat close to Jose stuff.


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## CaptainZero

Glad you're getting it worked out Steve! This may turn out to be a very positive thing for you after all. Nice to see so many people helping you you out too!


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## DirtySteve

CaptainZero said:


> Glad you're getting it worked out Steve! This may turn out to be a very positive thing for you after all. Nice to see so many people helping you you out too!



Thanks man, it already has turned out to be a positive thing. My entire attitude has changed about everything in the last few weeks.


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## rmroza

Yeah, thanks for the RF MOD link!

Yeah, put that on Steve. Cheap insurance and you'll be out a whole, what $0.10?!? lol

I opened up that Cameron - Old Bitch a guy trade me for my 2-channel. It has that on there and I was wondering why it was going from ground to chassis ground?!??!


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## damienbeale

Hold on with that RF mod for now. If shielding the grid wires on the first couple of gain stages is likely excess to requirements. I'm assuming your headcab has screening foil that covers the base of the chassis?


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## charveldan

DirtySteve said:


> Awesome! Thanks Dan, perfect timing too, I plan to order the rest of the components I need from from mouser tomorrow.


I did the RFI mod and i bought a decent cable from this guy and that took care of the problem.

Mogami 2524 Guitar Cable 20' Single Angled Gold Series | eBay

My old cable which i thought was pretty good but wasn't was acting like an antenna.


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## john l

Ive played around with shielding the first two grids pretty extensively and I came to the conclusion that it has no audible effect on tone if you keep your runs reasonable. The difference in noise aside from stoping problems like this in their tracks makes it very worth it any amp IMO. 

That said damiens totally right I fixed a bandmates amp from doing this at a gig once by layering the bottom of his headshell with aluminum HVAC tape I had in my truck lol. Worked wonders, still has it in there.


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## mott555

charveldan said:


> Ryan's Guitars: RF Mod for Kingsley ToneBaron
> 
> It's called RFI. I've done this mod to both my JMP's and it works well.



I'm not trying to hijack but I have a quick question about this. Do you think this could fix my Mosfet? It picks up radio stations, but only if the FX loop is active. Even a 6" patch cable in the loop causes radio reception. I wonder if I'd need a cap on the input, on the FX loop, or both.


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## charveldan

mott555 said:


> I'm not trying to hijack but I have a quick question about this. Do you think this could fix my Mosfet? It picks up radio stations, but only if the FX loop is active. Even a 6" patch cable in the loop causes radio reception. I wonder if I'd need a cap on the input, on the FX loop, or both.


My guess is with Mogami 2524 cables you may not have that problem but i can't know for sure.


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## Guitar-Rocker

mott555 said:


> I'm not trying to hijack but I have a quick question about this. Do you think this could fix my Mosfet? It picks up radio stations, but only if the FX loop is active. Even a 6" patch cable in the loop causes radio reception. I wonder if I'd need a cap on the input, on the FX loop, or both.


 


input only


----------



## biggs

Good to see you're doing this and that you have some quality help in your corner! Good on ya man!!! Looking forward to seeing the finished amp!


----------



## Big Mike

Interested to see the transformation. BB is a tool...can't believe he passed that off on someone.


----------



## GIBSON67

Good job so far Steve! I had a great time rebuilding my amp and I am sure will too!

Just give me a call if you need anything else, I have a lot of left over parts from my rebuild. I was going to do another build so I bought some extra parts but they're yours if you need them.

And no PPIMV? I really love my lar/mar PPIMV!


----------



## DirtySteve

Thanks guys.  



GIBSON67 said:


> Good job so far Steve! I had a great time rebuilding my amp and I am sure will too!
> 
> Just give me a call if you need anything else, I have a lot of left over parts from my rebuild. I was going to do another build so I bought some extra parts but they're yours if you need them.
> 
> And no PPIMV? I really love my lar/mar PPIMV!



Yeah Tim, I decided to do away with the PPIMV. It sounded good at low volume without it turned on and really it was pretty loud at any setting other than almost all the way down. It was really sensitive between nothing and getting loud so I just don't think I need it. 

I think I have all my parts ordered now except 2 110pf caps that are on backorder at mouser until Nov. 15th. I'll have to try and find them elsewhere.


----------



## damienbeale

DirtySteve said:


> I think I have all my parts ordered now except 2 110pf caps that are on backorder at mouser until Nov. 15th. I'll have to try and find them elsewhere.



100pF would suffice. I almost guarantee you probably won't notice the difference. (Haha, copout, just in case!)


----------



## GIBSON67

No problems...and I will check for those caps, tonight.


----------



## DirtySteve

damienbeale said:


> 100pF would suffice. I almost guarantee you probably won't notice the difference. (Haha, copout, just in case!)



Actually I couldn't find the 110ufs on mouser so I ordered the 100pfs and they are the ones on back order. I said 110uf because that's what's on my list. Terry gave me the part number.


----------



## S9X

DirtySteve said:


> Thanks guys.
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah Tim, I decided to do away with the PPIMV. It sounded good at low volume without it turned on and really it was pretty loud at any setting other than almost all the way down. It was really sensitive between nothing and getting loud so I just don't think I need it.



What is actual pot taper? Linear or log? I would blame incorrect taper choice for that problem in the first place.


> I think I have all my parts ordered now except 2 110pf caps that are on backorder at mouser until Nov. 15th. I'll have to try and find them elsewhere.



Just use 100pf, or more common 120pf. It's not crucial to have exactly 110pf cap in guitar amp.


----------



## GIBSON67

I was going to say that S9X...sounds like the wrong pot, ha!


----------



## DirtySteve

Well that figures, hahaha! Well...I'll see how it is without it, I can always add it later.


----------



## DirtySteve

It looks like a regular 250k p/p you would use in a guitar, it says B250K and what looks like OC3 on the casing.


----------



## S9X

Probably it's linear taper, and it would explain volume jump.


----------



## Alabama Thunderpussy

DirtySteve said:


> It looks like a regular 250k p/p you would use in a guitar, it says B250K and what looks like OC3 on the casing.



The B designation indicates it's a linear taper pot.


----------



## DirtySteve




----------



## S9X

With all due respect ATP, but that depends on where the pot was made. For example all ex Warsaw Pact countries (China included) are using reverse designation to this day.


----------



## rmroza

Yeah, when you verify everything Steve, just curious of what pots are in there. Billy is a ****ing hack in every shape and form. Had an amp he MODed with THREE 1M-B linear pots that were all supposed to be 1M-A...as well as sollder globs, wires hanging by literally ONE fiber of wire, frayed shielding, cold solder joints, parts of circuits hooked up incorrectly!!! Since we're on the subject of pots and correct values and type. I'm just wondering if he even got that right! lol

I sent you the zeners and switch to use, so you should be all set!  

Keep it going. You're going to have a killer and safe amp. Like Terry said, this will be the STURDY Dirty Steve 18!


----------



## DirtySteve

rmroza said:


> Yeah, when you verify everything Steve, just curious of what pots are in there. Billy is a ****ing hack in every shape and form. Had an amp he MODed with THREE 1M-B linear pots that were all supposed to be 1M-A...as well as sollder globs, wires hanging by literally ONE fiber of wire, frayed shielding, cold solder joints, parts of circuits hooked up incorrectly!!! Since we're on the subject of pots and correct values and type. I'm just wondering if he even got that right! lol
> 
> I sent you the zeners and switch to use, so you should be all set!
> 
> Keep it going. You're going to have a killer and safe amp. Like Terry said, this will be the STURDY Dirty Steve 18!



I'll get those values in a few minutes. Yeah I got your message and I already ordered the zeners and a switch from mouser. If it doesn't fit or it's not right I'll order the one you sent me me.

...there's no stopping, I have too much into it now. As for as I know, I'm only lacking the 2 caps after my orders come in later this week.


----------



## DirtySteve

Pres = 500k
Bass = 1M
Mids = 25k (25.85k?)
Treble = 300k
MV 1 = 1M
Gain 1 = 1M
Gain 2 = 1M


----------



## Alabama Thunderpussy

S9X said:


> With all due respect ATP, but that depends on where the pot was made. For example all ex Warsaw Pact countries (China included) are using reverse designation to this day.



Good to know. I haven't run into any of those. Most of the pots I've dealt recently with use the modern A-Audo B-Linear C-Reverse designations.


----------



## GIBSON67

Hey Steve, I looked but did not have any 110pf or 100pf caps. I had a 47pf and a 250pf, sorry. I guess you'll have to wait until 11/15.

If you end up needing extra wire, let me know, or anything else...


----------



## DirtySteve

That's ok man, thanks for checking.


----------



## The Ozzk

Just dropping by to say that I've been following and saw the whole story unfold and I'm very interested to see how the makeover turns out.


----------



## johnfv

I've been away for a couple of weeks and just checking back in. This is one of the greatest examples I've seen of "when life gives you lemons, make lemonade". All the best Steve and kudos to all that are helping out. 

Looking forward to progress updates and pictures...


----------



## DirtySteve

johnfv said:


> I've been away for a couple of weeks and just checking back in. This is one of the greatest examples I've seen of "when life gives you lemons, make lemonade". All the best Steve and kudos to all that are helping out.
> 
> Looking forward to progress updates and pictures...



I almost titled the thread "making lemonade".


----------



## The Ozzk

DirtySteve said:


> I almost titled the thread "making lemonade".



Nah... you needed something a little "gooppier"


----------



## Gene Ballzz

"Spooge Removal" could have been another appropriate title or "Globular Clusters F--K!" Seriously though, great attitude about this refurb and kudos on your approach (and all that are lending their hands/brains) to the solution to a perplexing set of issues.
BOL,
Gene


----------



## 66 galaxie

Somebody hit the needle, the record is skipping again.^^


----------



## DirtySteve

This has nothing to do with the one bad solder joint...that was understandable.


----------



## SonVolt

Mod edit.


Billy - any comments on that Plexi mod in the YouTube video? I want that sound, no idea how to get it.


----------



## 4STICKS

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xSLlZh9yelk]"And Here We Go" - Joker - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## DirtySteve

No, how about maybe lets don't...I'm tired of having my threads end up locked, man.


----------



## brp




----------



## 66 galaxie

Im done.
Just gonna read now.


----------



## DirtySteve

It's cool man, I was just hoping this thread could go on without turning into a shitstorm. We've had enough of that and I'm way over it. If it can't then that's ok, I'll just make another thread when I'm done instead of a step by step.


----------



## johnfv

66 galaxie said:


> Im done.
> Just gonna read now.


I'm not sure I will even continue reading. I'll hope for the best...


----------



## 4STICKS

DirtySteve said:


> No, how about maybe lets don't...I'm tired of having my threads end up locked, man.



Steve, that was a response to Billybabble. No offense to you and I hope you didn't take it that way. If so, my apologies.


----------



## Ghostman

Billyblades said:


> wow,,,,......



[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YhkNLHictW8]ARI GOLD - GET THE **** OUT - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## DirtySteve

4STICKS said:


> Steve, that was a response to Billybabble. No offense to you and I hope you didn't take it that way. If so, my apologies.



I know man and I guess my comment seemed directed at you and I meant it in general. I should have worded a little different. That's what I get for trying to steer.


----------



## MartyStrat54

DirtySteve said:


> No, how about maybe lets don't...I'm tired of having my threads end up locked, man.



This thread won't get locked. I personally guarantee it.


----------



## 4STICKS

DirtySteve said:


> I know man and I guess my comment seemed directed at you and I meant it in general. I should have worded a little different. That's what I get for trying to steer.



You can't wrangle a bunch of...Ummm...(cats?)


----------



## rmroza

Can't wait for you to finish it Steve. It will be probably the quietest amp you have ever heard and also one of the best sounding there is out there! Hell, after all, we're just going to clone a Cameron Jose design with some added features...and we're not going to relabel it as our own and call it something gay (not that there's anything wrong with it, like flamming person 18 (when you plug it in and electrocute yourself, you'll be flaming befoe you die!!...lol). It is being designed and built by us and containing the stuff it should have...switchable zeners, etc. and not include the stupid stuff like PPIMV on a Jose master volume amp!...geesh. Nor will it have the improper power section and filtering that was again ripped and clonned from something else and does not even fit in this application! No this amp will sound better than it ever has!


----------



## john l

Billyblades said:


> wow,,,, I hope you guys aren't that hard on yourselves when you first do something new lol. that was an experiment that ended up a tone beast,,,, it had a cold solder joint ,,,, and might not been a supermodel but it lived. it was a working amp that wasn't a noisy mess.
> ive learned so much since a year ago. I only modded amps and built a couple kits before then. I was producing garage built amps at the time not Mercedes Benz. THE TONE WAS THERE OR STEVE WOULDNT HAVE SOLD A MARSHALL AND KEPT IT?
> I tried to come on and help and it was thrown back at me. it was where I was at at the time before I gained more knowledge.
> 
> you guys have a great day and enjoy every step life allows.
> peace


 

Looking for your tone? Come on down to the ol' Flaaaaaamin' Dragon! Where everyone gets burnt!


----------



## rmroza

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RdP7HOKehNc]Homer I like my beer cold, my TV loud and my homosexuals flaming - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## DirtySteve

Some progress although not much. At least I have a decent place to work now, i didn't before yesterday...



 





Haha, y'all probably think I'm a goof, but I promised a step by step and...this is a step.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

And so it begins..............


----------



## DirtySteve




----------



## rmroza

lets get the layout done and have this bitch running by next weekend!


----------



## DirtySteve

Haha, I wish! I like the way you think but no, it's going slow on the layout and I'm not sure my parts are all here. Still stumped on a couple of things. It'll click, but I'm being very particular about the layout and I'm confused on a couple of things. Well see, I'm hoping by Christmas.


----------



## bulldozer1984

Christmas ?? Dude we cant wait that long !


----------



## DirtySteve

I was exaggerating (I hope), but at this point I really don't know how long...


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

The end result probably could go really fast, if, we stepped in and gave you a "paint by numbers" plan combined with a cattle prod, but then all you've learned so far would be mostly for not. You've learned a lot, and you are headed in the right direction at a good pace (not Christmas), and I think as long as we keep you steady on the path, then when you're done, you'll have a great handle on everything. It'll go really fast as soon as the new layout is done.


----------



## bulldozer1984

DirtySteve said:


> I was exaggerating (I hope), but at this point I really don't know how long...



As long as its before im 65 i dont mind


----------



## rmroza

Agreed. Once layout is done, it will go fast as everything is basically drilled and mounted and like Terry said, it's paint by numbers then.

Well, hopefully you can get the parts this week. The board drilling and turrets will just be a couple hours. Then the long chore of wiring up and not missing anything. 

#1 is finalizing design n layout!


----------



## DirtySteve

Ok, with the forum down all afternoon (haha, not really but it helped) I had some time this afternoon to sit down and think about this without any distractions and I think I've got the preamp worked out. I have a couple of questions, but I'll hold off and see if it makes sense after I think about it some more. I'm stoked again, of course I still have the B+ and cathode bias to go, but I feel a lot more confident again. Time to kick this things ass!!!


----------



## 66 galaxie

DirtySteve said:


> Ok, with the forum down all afternoon (haha, not really but it helped) I had some time this afternoon to sit down and think about this without any distractions and I think I've got the preamp worked out. I have a couple of questions, but I'll hold off and see if it makes sense after I think about it some more. I'm stoked again, of course I still have the B+ and cathode bias to go, but I feel a lot more confident again. Time to kick this things ass!!!



Go get em tiger


----------



## johnfv

I have replaced the filter caps on my Showman and installed a switchable master volume via relay on my 18W TMB. I have wired more guitars than I can count. That said, today I took my '68 Plexi to a real tech to get the filter caps replaced because I was nervous about getting the correct replacement parts and installing correctly. You go Steve...


----------



## Shazbot

DirtySteve said:


>



This is the most incompetent workmanship I've seen, ever.     

I saw better soldering in my junior high shop class. I don't pretend to know anything about building amps, so can someone explain to me why the gooped wire on top of that transformer is not connected to anything? What are we looking at here?


----------



## damienbeale

That was after Steve removed those three wires from that ground anchor.  But it was still crap beforehand going by the massive amounts of excess solder.


----------



## bulldozer1984

damienbeale said:


> That was after Steve removed those three wires from that ground anchor.  But it was still crap beforehand going by the massive amounts of excess solder.



For the final time. Thats not excessive solder. That is the just what happens when you use the world renowned "triple solder" technique..


----------



## damienbeale

Yup. If it's cold as hell, add some more, that'll be sure to fix it.


----------



## bulldozer1984

damienbeale said:


> Yup. If it's cold as hell, add some more, that'll be sure to fix it.



exactly ! Its perfect logic, isn't it ??


----------



## 2203xman

Wish I was closer, Steve.I learn by doing things hands on.I would love to be there, and go through the circuit with you.Some nice people,including Terry have tried to coach me,but the only way it's going to sink in is if I do it.Don't think I'll be tearing any of my current amps apart,so I'll just have to watch you closely.


----------



## DirtySteve

Shazbot said:


> This is the most incompetent workmanship I've seen, ever.
> 
> I saw better soldering in my junior high shop class. I don't pretend to know anything about building amps, so can someone explain to me why the gooped wire on top of that transformer is not connected to anything? What are we looking at here?



That pic was to show the solder that fell off of the star ground even though I sucked about half of it up with a solder sucker and it still dripped everywhere. (refer to "triple solderied")There's a lot of history here going back to the very beginning of the year. That's all water under the bridge now and I don't think we need to rehash what happened. It's all searchable (well, most of it)...

Sorry if that sounds rude, but I'm moving on and making the best out of a stupid/embarrassing mistake on my part by trusting what someone else said and not doing my own research. It's not all bad, I always wanted to understand amps and I'm getting quite the education thanks to some awesome guys here on the forum that are coaching me along. I don't know if I could pull it off without them, but I was certainly going to try. These guys went WAY out of their way to help me out and I wouldn't be anywhere near this far along if it wasn't for them. 

I was trying to help out someone who I thought was misunderstood and I got my ass burned bad. ...live and learn they say. 





Moving on...I got a lot done today on the new drawing and parts inventory, things are going to start happening soon. lots of pics to come...


----------



## DirtySteve

2203xman said:


> Wish I was closer, Steve.I learn by doing things hands on.I would love to be there, and go through the circuit with you.Some nice people,including Terry have tried to coach me,but the only way it's going to sink in is if I do it.Don't think I'll be tearing any of my current amps apart,so I'll just have to watch you closely.



I wish you were closer too bro! We'd learn a lot no doubt. You never know. I might show up some day.


----------



## Shazbot

Live and learn, right? Good job on turning what was a horrible situation into a positive experience.


----------



## DirtySteve

Thanks dude, that's what it's all about now. ...welcome to the forum btw.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Every day there are amps built, that would be better off tore right back apart, because they are not fit to be left as is. And most of the buyers thought they were getting a good amp. What makes this one different is a good guy on the forum was let down by another member who sees no fault. The up side is the amp will be remade right, and it will be a much better deal than was expected, and that old one is forever gone. Karma.


----------



## NewReligion

Guitar-Rocker said:


> Every day there are amps built, that would be better off tore right back apart, because they are not fit to be left as is. And most of the buyers thought they were getting a good amp. What makes this one different is a good guy on the forum was let down by another member who sees no fault. The up side is the amp will be remade right, and it will be a much better deal than was expected, and that old one is forever gone. Karma.



+1


----------



## JayCM800

Steve, what are you going to call the amp when it's done?

Me, I'd slap a Marshall logo on it and call it a day!


----------



## bulldozer1984

If i were Steve id call it "The Headache"


----------



## DirtySteve

Haha, I'm actually thinking about that. At first I was just going to call it the DirtySteve, but that's lame. I'm trying to think of something. I'm going to have a new control panel made and I thought I would put it there. I wasn't thinking about a logo on the cab...

Maybe I should let you guys decide...maybe a poll.  One thing's for sure...there will be no indication anywhere as to where it came from. It's no longer a firebolt!


----------



## Ghostman

the Pheonix. Out of the ashes of a catastrophy comes a bad ass machine!


----------



## rmroza

I like Terry's suggestion of: "Steve's Sturdy Dirty 18 Watt"


----------



## DirtySteve

Ghostman said:


> the Pheonix. Out of the ashes of a catastrophy comes a bad ass machine!



I thought of that, but I thought it was too mythical in a Harry Potter sort of way...it fits tho.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

The more I looked at what I had posted, the more it didn't fit, so I deleted the idea. Maybe call it "Deeds",, as in Dirty Deeds


----------



## bulldozer1984

I think a Marshall logo is the way to go. When I start getting in front of my bills a Marshall logo is going on my Ceriatone.


----------



## DirtySteve

I thought that would be sacrilege or something...I mean, it's not a Marshall...are y'all serious?


----------



## bulldozer1984

If your amp looks like a Marshall yeh it would be cool. 

If I own an amp that has a logo on it well its gotta be a Marshall logo. So ill buy an amp that is a Marshall or looks like a Marshall

But that's just me.


----------



## brp

DirtySteve said:


> I thought that would be sacrilege or something...I mean, it's not a Marshall...are y'all serious?



ya I don't get it.
I can see it on a cab.

Maybe get some kinda custom made badge done.


----------



## 66 galaxie

Blade hunter


----------



## rmroza

I agree Steve. Do NOT put a Marshall on it. Marshall never made an amp that will sound this good and as quiet, sorry. No, this is something else.

Some ideas are the use of "vintage" and "jose", myabe the use of 18-watt or 18-watter, maybe another word play on "sturdy" as "robust" or "bulletproof"?!??

Keep 'em coming boyz


----------



## charveldan

Enough jabber, lets see some amp building.

And no Marshall logo, that would be beyond lame if this amp isnt already.


----------



## shredless

just dont let a drummer name it


----------



## john l

charveldan said:


> Enough jabber, lets see some amp building.


----------



## SpiritOfTheAge

charveldan said:


> Enough jabber, lets see some amp building.
> 
> And no Marshall logo, that would be beyond lame if this amp isnt already.




So let's take get this right, if he put's a marshall logo on his amp it will be banished beyond the point where lame falters and gives way to what ever lies beyond lame, and even if he does not wish to put a marshall logo on the amp he's faced with prospect of it already being there. That's just silly.


----------



## charveldan

SpiritOfTheAge said:


> So let's take get this right, if he put's a marshall logo on his amp it will be banished beyond the point where lame falters and gives way to what ever lies beyond lame, and even if he does not wish to put a marshall logo on the amp he's faced with prospect of it already being there. That's just silly.


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9SSOWORzw4]monty python - fish dance - YouTube[/ame]

No, this is silly ^^^^


----------



## charveldan

beginning to feel this thread is all show and no go ...


----------



## damienbeale

Ignore it all, Steve. Go at your own pace. Make sure you're comfortable with every step before jumping in. You're not doing this to satisfy us remember...

Remember,
Failing to plan, is planning to fail.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Steve is on the final drawing of the new scheme and layout. While maintaining the original overall voice of the Jose based amp, there are a few options that won't be featured on the rebuild. Also there was a lot of cleanup needed on the 18w power section. There were two veins of rebuilding this amp, the first was what was originally there, so there was the discovery process of, just what was originally put into the build....verifying the "blacked out values", before disassembly to verify what we thought was there. The second vein, after the tear down for confirmation of component values, was to leave out what Steve didn't care for or use, and correct the power section flaws. And then for Steve to redraw the layout as he wants to build it, and for a Rookie, that in itself is a huge task. The professionalism on the new layout drawings is stunning compared to the original layout. After this final draft, then Steve can start drilling out the custom turretboard, and there will be stuff to look at. For a first time builder, thrown in the mix, Steve has down a great job absorbing the information provided, the discovery process, and the design process. I am just one, of many who is able to lend a hand in the process, and believe me, figuring out that mess was monumental! oh, yeah. Thanks Billy


----------



## damienbeale

New turretboard and layout...

Phew, I am relieved. That was one of my big issues with it, aside from all the safety issues and bad workmanship. Stupid layout!


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

The new CAD drawings that Steve has drawn, look like a real amp layout, very well drawn, and the layout now will make sense, not a "as you go" theme like it looked like before. Sorry if that statement rubs a bit, but that is what the original looked like.


----------



## CaptainZero

If it works out TOO good, 'ol BB is likely to (try to) copy it and start a new 18 watt model line.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

I think it will make apparent what he should have built instead of what he did build. If Billy were to copy this rebuild, then at least his quality would be acceptable for market.


----------



## DirtySteve

Wow, I didn't realize I was on a schedule, lol. Thanks Terry, you explained it a lot better than I could.


----------



## DirtySteve

damienbeale said:


> New turretboard and layout...
> 
> Phew, I am relieved. That was one of my big issues with it, aside from all the safety issues and bad workmanship. Stupid layout!



I thought everyone knew that...my bad.


----------



## damienbeale

Hmmm, now you guys mention it, perhaps you shouldn't post too many gut shots, Steve.


----------



## rmroza

...besides verifying the original intention, many mistakes were made. They all have been corrected and as Terry said, the correct B+ and better and more appropriate filtering. A couple of items still open or difference of opinion is:

1. zener clipping. Right now, it's on the turretboard. I think it looks nice, but should be on the master/switch to keep the amount of turrets used and cost down, but also the connection length and possibilities of noise injection.
2. depth/resonance control - I think it should be added and for versatility. Doesn't matter if on the back. People just set it to their liking and leave alone anyway. It can also be wired in fixed.

That's about it. As Terry said, a draft layout is done and looks AMAZING. Steve did a really professional and thorough job!  

We still need the name. Who knows, maybe we should call it - Steve's "Prototype" If he can do it this good on a 1st off build (basically "prototype), this demonstrates quality....or lack thereof!

Robb


----------



## DirtySteve

Perfect timing Robb, I've been looking at this all evening and I realized I don't have the presence/depth control resister on the board yet. (btw this is still only on paper if that wasn't clear) I need to make some room somewhere. 

I think you've talked me into the resonance control so I guess it will be ok on the back. I was just trying to stay away from mounting anything on the back, but the way you said it's probably a set it and forget it maybe your right. I'm also installing the sag mod and will probably mount the switch on the back as well.

Haha, might as well let you guys in on a couple of things.


----------



## john l

DirtySteve said:


> Perfect timing Robb, I've been looking at this all evening and I realized I don't have the presence/depth control resister on the board yet. (btw this is still only on paper if that wasn't clear) I need to make some room somewhere.
> 
> I think you've talked me into the resonance control so I guess it will be ok on the back. I was just trying to stay away from mounting anything on the back, but the way you said it's probably a set it and forget it maybe your right. I'm also installing the sag mod and will probably mount the switch on the back as well.
> 
> Haha, might as well let you guys in on a couple of things and why the delay.


 
Im not sure where your at in all this steve but don't rule out pot mounting various parts of the circuit, in most cases this is better layout for resonance mods, presence controls and the entire tone stack. "Done properly" its totally safe and looks tits.


----------



## DirtySteve

I'm reusing the chassis and the front controls. There's not room for another pot on the front without major surgery, I'm trying to make this as simple as possible and still have the options I want as far as mounting stuff. (hmm, maybe I can relocate the power indicator light and put the depth/resonance pot in it's place ) Switches are cool as long as they're minis, but I'm having a hard time finding the right switches. That's why I'm mounting the sag switch on the back, it's big.


----------



## john l

Post your layout buddy. Lets see what your planning.


----------



## rmroza

Hey Steve

Don't over think it. Yeah, like I said, depth is to taste. A way-cool MOD, but some people want it out of the circuit, some people like it slightly in, and some people like it cranked, soo including it allows versatility, but like pointed out, it's set to taste and forget, so back is fine. IF you had the room, right next to the prescence is a great spot.

Yeah, I looked up your Sag MOD after you spoke about it and see you're making it switchable, so that's cool too.

Lastly, not sure if/what you're doing with faceplates, but since you're laying it out in CAD and know where everything is...you can always mount everything to the bare chassis, then when the plates come in (or if creating them), just unmount everything and put the faceplate in (note lamp can be tricky depending on type and if Marshall-type). I've done this a couple times in the past.

Robb


----------



## john l

rmroza said:


> Hey Steve
> 
> Don't over think it. Yeah, like I said, depth is to taste. A way-cool MOD, but some people want it out of the circuit, some people like it slightly in, and some people like it cranked, soo including it allows versatility, but like pointed out, it's set to taste and forget, so back is fine. IF you had the room, right next to the prescence is a great spot.
> 
> Yeah, I looked up your Sag MOD after you spoke about it and see you're making it switchable, so that's cool too.
> 
> Lastly, not sure if/what you're doing with faceplates, but since you're laying it out in CAD and know where everything is...you can always mount everything to the bare chassis, then when the plates come in (or if creating them), just unmount everything and put the faceplate in (note lamp can be tricky depending on type and if Marshall-type). I've done this a couple times in the past.
> 
> Robb


 
Sag mod?


----------



## bulldozer1984

john l said:


> Sag mod?



Thats when the Mrs leaves the house without a bra on lol


----------



## john l

bulldozer1984 said:


> Thats when the Mrs leaves the house without a bra on lol


Heh 
Must be a secret


----------



## Gene Ballzz

Steve,
If I understood correctly, I think john l was not suggesting more pots/controls, but rather the thought of mounting some components directly on the pots as opposed to using up turret board space. For certain things, it sure does cut down on wire length, etc.
My $.02,
Gene


----------



## john l

Gene Ballzz said:


> Steve,
> If I understood correctly, I think john l was not suggesting more pots/controls, but rather the thought of mounting some components directly on the pots as opposed to using up turret board space. For certain things, it sure does cut down on wire length, etc.
> My $.02,
> Gene


 
^^^ Yeah this but then my A.D.D. kicked in when I saw bug crawling on my window and completely checked out...

Doing this heads off a lot of other potential problems especially in high gain situations. If you refer to the pics of billys handywork this would delete the black blue and red wires going to your tone pots. Eliminating unnecessary runs and wire length keeps things quiet and improves tone. You do this by doing the above and locating pots appropriately. If you look at my build the Jose and res aren't in the back by accident. It put the res right by the Impedance selector and the Jose right on top of V2 so I didn't have to shield the hell out of it.


----------



## Gene Ballzz

Thanks john,
I will keep your thought in mind as I finish my final layout for my new build.
Thanx Again,
Gene


----------



## shredless

please tell me your gonna ditch those ghetto gold knobs


----------



## DirtySteve

john l said:


> Sag mod?



The way I understand it is that it simulates tube rectifier "sag" in an SS rectified amp. From my research it's especially good for lower gain bluesy stuff which is why I want to try it and it will be switchable..


----------



## DirtySteve

john l said:


> Im not sure where your at in all this steve but don't rule out pot mounting various parts of the circuit, in most cases this is better layout for resonance mods, presence controls and the entire tone stack. "Done properly" its totally safe and looks tits.



Sorry John I completely misunderstood your post.


----------



## DirtySteve

shredless said:


> please tell me your gonna ditch those ghetto gold knobs



No more gold knobs, going with Marshall style and a new faceplate.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

DirtySteve said:


> The way I understand it is that it simulates tube rectifier "sag" in an SS rectified amp. From my research it's especially good for lower gain bluesy stuff which is why I want to try it and it will be switchable..


 

A straight SS rectifier is stiff. Adding a switchable sag resistor simulates the soft side of a tube rectifier tone.


----------



## johnfv

I dunno, the SS rectifier in my 2204 makes ME stiff  

Carry on gents...


----------



## john l

That's the only mod that came up when I did a search but I didn't know if that's what you guys were referring to. Ive never really messed with tube rectifiers much, my only experience was in an old dual rec I rocked for a couple years way back when an I always preferred the silicone diode setting over tube. 

Wub wub wub vs chunk chunk chunk

...High time I played around with this


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Here is a overall pretty good explanation, although I don't agree with the implementation aspect. Usually on a 18W cathode bias amp, the value is @ 180R 5W, but no more than a 220R (too squishy if more). The resistor is placed directly after the SS diodes. If doing a mod, you just put a switch in line to engage, or bypass it. I would turn the power off between toggling. Larger wattage amps would of course use a higher wattage resistor. The link, not mine, just one I found while surfing the web:

http://home.comcast.net/~fredholz/Justin-Holton/The Tube Rectifier Sag Mod.pdf


----------



## johnfv

john l said:


> ...an old dual rec I rocked for a couple years way back when an I always preferred the silicone diode setting over tube.


+1
Don't get me wrong, I have several tube rec amps I love and have played one of Terry's that sounded killer. That said my FAVORITES are all SS: 1959T, 2204HW, Hiwatt Custom 50, Fender Showman. IMO, the Dual Rec is crap with the tube rec, mine is ALWAYS on the SS setting.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Just more flavors to taste the tone of !


----------



## rmroza

Yes, the "Sag" MOD comes before the choke (if applicable) and 1st filtering cap. Now that I think of it, the original did not utilize a choke! Are you going to put one in also?!?

I never used the Sage MOD myself. Anyone use it and have any experience and feedback in regard to it??

Here is the PDF from Ken over at Turretboards (Watts Tube Audio) - http://www.turretboards.com/mods/sag_mod_schematic.pdf


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

No choke planned.


----------



## john l

Steve did the amp have this originally? I just don't think of tube rectifiers when I think of the Jose sound, are you looking for more compression chewier feel kinda thing? I got clued in on a great mod that Im loving in my amp if your interested.

Also kinda off what we're discussing here but did that switch on the back just alter the slope resistor value?


----------



## rmroza

Yes, I commented previously, the switch had two resistor values on it to change slope in the tonestack, that's it....39k and 10k. I never seen a deep/depth/resonance with a 22uF value on it either....or 100W B+ on an 18-watt application...but I guess that's innovation......or something. lol


----------



## john l

rmroza said:


> Yes, I commented previously, the switch had two resistor values on it to change slope in the tonestack, that's it....39k and 10k. I never seen a deep/depth/resonance with a 22uF value on it either....or 100W B+ on an 18-watt application...but I guess that's innovation......or something. lol


 

Lol yeah or something right? I didn't see what you guys said about it earlier but if you like going as far down as 10k steve you should really ditch the dumb switch for a pot, say 50k or so. This would give you an ass load more versatility then a stupid switch with 2 values. This is the only mod I have in my favorite old 80' JMP I used to use a push pull pot there to also switch a 5uf across V2a but now its just the pot... its just all that amp needs.


----------



## S9X

rmroza said:


> Yes, I commented previously, the switch had two resistor values on it to change slope in the tonestack, that's it....39k and 10k. I never seen a deep/depth/resonance with a 22uF value on it either....or 100W B+ on an 18-watt application...but I guess that's innovation......or something. lol



33k+100k pot and voila - pretty useful mid sweep control, instead 2 switched presets. To be honest - 10k alone for slope resistor is muddy as hell.

btw, why no choke? and if I may ask - the power amp is gonna be cathode or fixed biased?


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Cathode bias. Billy didn't implement a choke, so we were staying more true to the original tone. The sag option is just something Steve wanted to hear and if it's undesireable, it's very easy to delete.


----------



## S9X

I would add choke anyway. And with cathode bias it's pretty easy to implement power scaling. Just a suggestion.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Not bad options to consider in the future, but I think Steve is more set to reproduce the amp pretty much as was delivered (minus the mentioned deletions, corrections, and minor additions). I'm sure after getting to that completion point that Steve could then figure out if there's anything lacking that he would want to address. I know during the earlier discussions Steve decided to delete the Master volume as he didn't use it much, and it wasn't a value for him.


----------



## DirtySteve

I never dreamed I'd be rebuilding an amp right now (or ever for that matter) I just dove right in. My plans were to build a Tele this year, lol! I'm just hoping to get it up and running at this point. By the time I do that hopefully I'll have learned enough to decide what else I might want/need to do, but for now I think I need to hold off before it gets too complicated. I'm buried in information at the moment and just trying to absorb it all and gain a basic understanding of what's already there.

We discussed adding a choke and I don't recall the reason why right now, but I decided to leave it out. I didn't use the mid shift or the depth knob and it sounds good even at the lowest volume without the PPIMV so I decided to leave those off. I like the idea of the resonance control and have decided to go with that, the only other things I'm doing at this time are the sag resister and zener switching. I feel like really have my hands full right now as it is and I don't want to bite off more than I can chew.. I'm working on getting a final parts list together so I can make one more order and get this show on the road. Maybe I'm worrying too much, I have tendency to do that anyway.


----------



## john l

Guitar-Rocker said:


> Not bad options to consider in the future, but I think Steve is more set to reproduce the amp pretty much as was delivered (minus the mentioned deletions, corrections, and minor additions). I'm sure after getting to that completion point that Steve could then figure out if there's anything lacking that he would want to address. I know during the earlier discussions Steve decided to delete the Master volume as he didn't use it much, and it wasn't a value for him.


 
Yeah totally. I just keep looking at the original pic keep seeing things that I personally would do differently (besides the lead dress) and throwing my 2 cents in is all... Switch with 2 options vs a pot with literally thousands that can be rolled through in seconds kinda tips the scales and doesn't take up any more room. 

I also agree with a choke being a no brainer.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

I firmly believe that this thread is one of the more positive in a while. It's extremely nice to see people chime in with great comments, ideas, or just positive feedback to keep Steve going forward. I salute all in the Forum who have been kind enough to lend a hand to getting this rebuild done. It's a tribute to the Forum, where occasionally you see posters say the people in here don't care.


----------



## rmroza

"33k+100k pot and voila - pretty useful mid sweep control, instead 2 switched presets. To be honest - 10k alone for slope resistor is muddy as hell."

Agreed and is looking for versatility. Currently, we're getting rid of the switchable slope resistors and just putting a fixed value in there. He can tweak to taste later.

Yeah, as Terry said, no choke due to just working with what we had and tweaking values. Not so sure about the sag either, but this is Steve's baby, idea, and design. He wants it, through it in there all he's adding is one resistor and switch....and it's defeatable, so harm done.

I think we're 99% there and on the layout. I didn't get a chance to review last night. Something is up, I think allergies with Fall and seasons changing and further recovering from Germany and time shifts. I'll check it out today and supply feedback.


----------



## DirtySteve

I'll send an updated drawing later today with the resonance in there...


----------



## DirtySteve

Guys my experience with tube amps is very limited and my experience with mods is nil besides what this one came with. Whether or not the amp sounded good compared to other similar amps I have no idea, I was happy that I was able to get the sounds I'd been chasing for so long and without any pedals . That was a huge deal so yes I was happy with the sound. I'm very curious to see if it actually sounded as great as I thought, or if it sounded great by comparison to what I've played before. (meaning, is is it going to sound better than it did before?)

Now that I'm this far into I see how things can be tweaked to further personalize the sound more if need be, but it's all new to me and I have no basis for deciding what I want, I only know that I don't want the options that were used originally. As of now we are fixing some issues while keeping basically the same sound only hopefully improved simply because of the issues being fixed. Once it's up and running and I have a better understanding of whats going on (and how it sounds) then I'll have a starting point to tweak and maybe try some different options. The first thing is to get it working again and properly.

At least that's the way I'm looking at it. ...also, I apologize if I'm missing some of the things you guys are saying, some of the terminology is still new to me and slips by.


----------



## S9X

rmroza said:


> Yeah, as Terry said, no choke due to just working with what we had and tweaking values. Not so sure about the sag either, but this is Steve's baby, idea, and design. He wants it, through it in there all he's adding is one resistor and switch....and it's defeatable, so harm done.



Sure, it is Stevie's project, not mine and I'm not trying to convince him to do it like I would.
But my point is:
with CRC filtering there's always more sag present in comparison to CLC. Less or more. So instead of adding another resistor of higher value, Stevie may as well add a (small) choke and make it switchable with a bit larger value resistor. It will make more noticeable difference among other goodies that choke provides.


----------



## bulldozer1984

Mod edit.

I wish you had something to keep you busy and away from your vices like ummm..... posting in here. 

Oh and meth. You must be on meth.


----------



## Lo-Tek

deleted


----------



## Gene Ballzz

I feel the need to comment, that the last couple/few responses from BB appear to demonstrate a measure of humility and change of attitude/demeanor and have been in complete/coherent sentences. I like to believe that human nature is basically good and that, given the opportunity, even some of the less palatable folks can improve their lot.
Just My $.02,
Gene


----------



## Shazbot

Mod edit.



What's up with this guy?! I thought he might be a troll until I checked out his tattoo site. Claims to have won awards, but my 5 year old nephew draws better.

Mod edit.

Are you not getting it? Doesn't matter how it sounds when it can electrocute you or set your house on fire!!!


----------



## brp

Gene Ballzz said:


> I feel the need to comment, that the last couple/few responses from BB appear to demonstrate a measure of humility and change of attitude/demeanor...




Really? Because this:

Mod edit.


was a condescending and snarky shot of contempt and anything but moving on or "humility", in case you missed it.

Might wanna listen to the clip.


----------



## Holme

Mod edit.


Nice flip around Billy 'Bend The Truth' Blades!

What you mean to say is you are gutted that Steve opened up his amp & to his horror found it looked like it had been put together by an infantile monkey with learning difficulties!
You,me & everyone else knows the ONLY reason Steve is rebuilding the 'Billy Babylon Banana Blaster' or whatever the f@@k it is-

IS BECAUSE IT ISN'T EVEN SAFE!!!!

Now stop making out like you're some kind of reach out programme & take it on the chin - you've been busted & made an ass of that amp!


----------



## damienbeale

Yep. Meth would certainly explain the extreme belief in delusions...

(re-edited for continuity)


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Since Billy's Soundcloud was deleted, my response to it should be too. It doesn't change my opinion of what I stated earlier though. But this is only right. Terry


----------



## shredless

I was hoping the mods would keep billy out of this thread

may I suggest deleting his posts and those that answer by stirring the pot?

no reason for any of that here in the makeover thread


----------



## Gene Ballzz

OMG,
My sincerest apologies for sticking my nose in before listening to that clip!
Gene


----------



## 66 galaxie

You can put a gun to my sack, and I still would not click on that clip.


----------



## Gene Ballzz

66 galaxie said:


> You can put a gun to my sack, and I still would not click on that clip.


WHoa, Dude,
That would put me just a bit to close to your business! But hey, I've never complimented you on your 66. Not sure of the color from the pic or if its an XL, but my big brother has one quite similar. A bench seat hdtp model with 428 and 4-speed. Yours looks pretty NICE!
Happy Motoring,
Gene


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

On a positive note: I was able to see the final draft of the new layout this afternoon, and I think it looks top quality, ready for building. Good job Steve!


----------



## Shazbot

That sound cloud clip is hilarious on so many different levels. BB backed by venture capital?!


----------



## brp

Guitar-Rocker said:


> ... However when Billy Blades decides to try to knock my products publicly, ....Do not try using my deeds in your ads again.



Huh?


----------



## rmroza

"it will sound the same. its a badass circuit...."

Really? It's a badass circuit...absolutely...and it is not or has NOTHING to do with Billy Blades. We have Jose and Mark to thank as well and Terry, Steve and I for doing this thing right.

No, it will NOT sound the "same". There were stupid decisions and mistakes in the last design and "Firebolt". This design and construction will be and sound BETTER....and 100% safe.

Thanks Terry and great job Steve on the the CAD. Yes, you are really kicking ass!


----------



## 2203xman

Just want to bump a great thread,and maybe learn as I keep up with it.Would the original b+ have had a negative effect on the amp,as far as reliability,and tube life,and will the new b+ affect the tone?


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

brp said:


> Huh?


 

In reference to the remarks made in the Soundcloud Billy-Blades/ Steve story


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

2203xman said:


> Just want to bump a great thread,and maybe learn as I keep up with it.Would the original b+ have had a negative effect on the amp,as far as reliability,and tube life,and will the new b+ affect the tone?


 

Mike, The original B+ buss was made as a buss from a 100W Marshall, not a typical 18W Marshall (reference a 18W 1974 made from 1965-1967). The rectifier installation was a horrible mess on the board, yeah it worked but that was the extent on that. The new B+ dropping buss will be from a typical 18W, modeled more for this type of power amp. Overall reliability from design was ok, installation was subpar poor quality. Tone should improve somewhat. What will make the tone better will be chucking the 22uf cap on the cathode bias. The lowest value typically used there is a 50uf, but that can make the bass flubby. Usually you would start at @ 100uf, then go higher based on desired tone. Your amp has a 1000uf.


----------



## brp

Guitar-Rocker said:


> In reference to the remarks made in the Soundcloud Billy-Blades/ Steve story



Oh well, I couldn't listen to ALL that nonsense 

kinda skimmed through it to get the gist but didn't hear you mentioned, must have missed that.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

It was tough to listen to, believe me there.


----------



## DirtySteve

I have a hard time believing there are 50 people that even know about this, much less that many messaging to say I've succumb to peer pressure. What peer pressure? lmfao!


----------



## MartyStrat54

Sorry for the mod edits. I promised Steve that I would keep this thread open. I'm sorry I didn't get to this sooner.


----------



## Micky

Jeez, go to dinner and miss all the good stuff.
Nice to hear the BETTER stuff is on the way!
We need more pics Steve!


----------



## rmroza

"Would the original b+ have had a negative effect on the amp,as far as reliability,and tube life,and will the new b+ affect the tone? "

If the B+ is not adjusted appropriately, you could running the preamp tube plate above it's max. voltage value and burning it up faster and reliability. Yes, it can affect tone and another 5% of the mojo!

I missed the soundcloud link, but I'm sure it was just babble, babble, babble.....I seen it, just didn't click on it....probably for the better.


----------



## 66 galaxie

Guitar-Rocker said:


> It was tough to listen to, believe me there.



I can only imagine...


----------



## 66 galaxie

Gene Ballzz said:


> WHoa, Dude,
> That would put me just a bit to close to your business! But hey, I've never complimented you on your 66. Not sure of the color from the pic or if its an XL, but my big brother has one quite similar. A bench seat hdtp model with 428 and 4-speed. Yours looks pretty NICE!
> Happy Motoring,
> Gene



Quick derail...
Thanks Gene, it is Black fastback with red interior. It has a 393 Windsor stroker in it. It has an automatic/manual overdrive. ( you can put it in drive and it is auto, or you can put it in 1st and shift manually.) Very fun on street or track.

Now back to Steves soon to be even better amp


----------



## john l

Ignore the fuktard Steve. Refusing another amp in place of this one was awesome. Tearing it apart and throwing it in the trash instead of passing it on to someone else shows that you're more credible than that clown could ever be, rebuilding it better then he ever could with your level of experience is just gnarly man! It will show anyone thinking of doing business with him to pass right on by. 

Keep going dude, don't even break stride.


----------



## johnfv

No way I was gonna listen to that silliness, glad Marty cleaned it up. This is a good thread except for a few occasional obnoxious interruptions


----------



## DirtySteve

The drawing/layout was just finalized today. I have a few more parts to order and I don't think I bought enough wire and I ordered the wrong size turrets so it will probably be a week before anything really gets going. Sorry to disappoint. I do have a few things to do this weekend. 

I need to clean up the chassis, remove solder splatters, clean up rough holes that were left with jagged edges, drill for my zener switch and ground lugs, drill the turret holes, rerun the filament wires, etc...etc... I have plenty of prep work to do while I'm waiting on parts. Hopefully there will be something out of all of that to post pics of...we'll see.


----------



## MartyStrat54

Just a note to you all. I know how some of you feel and it is understandable. However, let's keep this thread on topic and refrain from bringing Billy into it.

I want to see this thread continue until Steve's amp is up and running again and I think you want that too.

Let's keep it on track.

Marty


----------



## JayCM800

MartyStrat54 said:


> Sorry for the mod edits. I promised Steve that I would keep this thread open. I'm sorry I didn't get to this sooner.



You missed a spot! Some cleanup still required on post #223


----------



## brp

JayCM800 said:


> You missed a spot! Some cleanup still required on post #223



How so? He was only removing the original comments and quotes of it, not the replies to it.
Although that would have been good (better?) too....

In fact I suggest all the replies should be removed since the context is gone, they're OT and not going to be a good read for anyone stumbling in now wanting to get an update on the OP....


----------



## JayCM800

brp said:


> How so? He was only removing the original comments and quotes of it, not the replies to it.
> Although that would have been good (better?) too....
> 
> In fact I suggest all the replies should be removed since the context is gone, they're OT and not going to be a good read for anyone stumbling in now wanting to get an update on the OP....



There's still some billy quotes. If you're gonna delete what was said, don't leave a quote. I'm surprised you didn't even notice even after I pointed it out.

Edit- it wasn't your post brp, apparently a post was deleted, so now post 223 became post 222. It's ok, all's been taken care of now.


----------



## brp

Ah ok. I see how that caused the confusion.
I was like WTF is he on about that's in mah post?!


----------



## DirtySteve

To you that guys drill your own turret holes...do you use a template? How do you keep the bit from drifting? Just curious about different opinions/techniques since that's close on my list. 

Terry and I have talked about it, but I thought I'd throw it out there. I have a plan, but I'm thinking it might be overkill. Robb, we didn't get quite this far today, I was going to send you an e-mail, but I thought I'd try to get the thread back on track.  


I appreciate it Jay, you were right. ...thanks Marty!


----------



## brp

No access to a drillpress, Steve?


----------



## DirtySteve

No, I'll be using a dremel.


----------



## john l

A dremel isn't ideal at all steve, just go spend a couple of bucks on a bit with a "brad point" (they have a pilot tip) and chuck that sucker in cordless if you don't have a press. These don't wander and would be waaaay more controllable than a dremel. I assume your either working with 3/16 or 1/8" turrets? 

Like this
http://www.google.com/aclk?sa=l&ai=CRw1dFaF9UumwMqzriALKtYCgDajN5LkEgJu17V2YmLDKxgEIBhACKAhQ453yq_z_____AWDJ3uiGyKOQGaABlv-4_gPIAQeqBCRP0LHqpT020IK0ZMZCeFjnxAXC6j6FWhk1HlfHEHZ5fsr8ZifABQWgBiaAB9KAxwGQBwLgErKH7vaDjoOjwAE&sig=AOD64_1pYFv-UrqoeGye6aWXL7DeNbgF7Q&ctype=5&rct=j&frm=1&q=3%2F16+brad+point+drill+bit&ved=0CLgBEPMO&adurl=http://www.mscdirect.com/product/05529136%3Fcid%3DPLA-Google-PLA%2B-%2BTest_sFKnLET6K_PLA__25122935224_c_S%26mkwid%3DsFKnLET6K%7Cdc%26pcrid%3D25122935224%26src%3Dpla%26002%3D2167139%26004%3D7506854224%26005%3D53306199064%26006%3D25122935224%26007%3DSearch%26008%3D%26025%3Dc%26026%3D


----------



## Gene Ballzz

Steve,
If I did not have access to a drill press, I would be using a board like this:
Turret Board - Blank, 3 mm, 189 Holes, 258mm x 67mm, Red | Antique Electronic Supply
Heck, I have a drill press and I'm still starting with that style board.
Gene


----------



## DirtySteve

Those boards weren't big enough. I had to go 14" long to fit everything on one board and the width needed to be at least 3 1/8" to use the same mounts. Actually you guys have given me what I needed to know. I'll post some pics when I go to do it. I think my plan will work fine and isn't over kill after all. Thanks.


----------



## damienbeale

I normally use perf board or make a metal drill template first.


----------



## rmroza

Hey Steve, I don't use a jig/template or use perfboard personally. I print it to paper, tape it to some blank sheet of FR, cut it out and drill every whole by hand. Personally, I use a drill press. There is no drift and keep the holes straight. I would not use a dremel. I have 24" sheets, soo 14" or whatever is no issue.

You have a couple choices and depending on your budget. You can go to Harbor Freight and pick up a small press for about $70 - 5 Speed Bench Drill Press

Else, as I originally said to help expedite things, I can build it up....thou the long lead is the faceplate...probably a couple weeks for you to some up with a design, send it over, have them create it, ship out, and install!


----------



## 66 galaxie

^^The bench drill press is a good idea Steve. You would use is more than you think. I know you dont have a shop. You could mount it on a piece of MDF and then just put it on your counter when you use it. Put it away when your done.


----------



## john l

Well shit guys I didn't think "go buy a drill press" was on the menu lol.

Yes steve go buy a drill press. 

Hell if your board material is the 2mm stuff I don't even bother going out to the press. I just knock it out at my bench with this. Holes are perfectly straight. If its 3mm or thicker this probably wouldn't work well.


----------



## johnfv

I have the router attachment for my Dremel. Not near as precise as "pro" tools but definitely helps keep the holes straight (I use it more for drilling than routing); I use it a lot when assembling partscasters. A full size press would be nice to have, one nice thing about the Dremel is I can easily use it on angled head stocks.

EDIT: gotta post my quality inspector again with the Dremel


----------



## DirtySteve

I have a small piece of the same board I can make a test run on and try my idea. If it doesn't work I'll look into another way. 

John I have always wanted one of those dremel attachments, I might go with that. The look on your cats face is priceless!


----------



## DirtySteve

john l said:


> Well shit guys I didn't think "go buy a drill press" was on the menu lol.
> 
> Yes steve go buy a drill press.
> 
> Hell if your board material is the 2mm stuff I don't even bother going out to the press. I just knock it out at my bench with this. Holes are perfectly straight. If its 3mm or thicker this probably wouldn't work well.



My board is 1/8" thick so that won't work, I am however using something along those line to make my template though.


----------



## damienbeale

johnfv said:


> EDIT: gotta post my quality inspector again with the Dremel


Your quality inspector does not look impressed that you are working on his bench...


----------



## brp

I paid $70 brand new in box for my benchtop drill press





and yes, like Galaxie said I use it a lot more than I thought I would, and it was indespensible for drilling new stud inserts and neck screw holes. Great to have, can't believe I went without one for so long doing so many projects that could really use one.

You don't really need a shop or a bench, just a sturdy shelf or table, then store it in a closet or something.

Sure you can get by with a cordless and/or Dremel, which I also have but the press is so convenient and relatively hassle-free.

Pardon my messy bench, kinda dumped some stuff on there and have yet to clean up


----------



## DirtySteve

Why the hell isn't there one place that has everything?! I have a headache after ordering the things I still need. It took me all afternoon and I had to order from 3 different places. Terry, thanks for the mouser link for the cap, I was pulling my hair out trying to find that 1 cap, ended up costing me almost 6 bucks with shipping for a 66 cent cap because it's all I needed from there. I'm still not positive I ordered the right turrets and those are the most expensive thing on my list that I've already bought once!....jeez!

ok, rant over


----------



## DirtySteve

I'd love to have a drill press, but I don't have an actual work bench. I have a make shift temporary work bench set ip in my living room. If I'm not using it it will be in the way, I live in a dinky little apartment and I don't have any room for the stuff I already have. But on a positive note, I think I may have found one I can use.


----------



## 66 galaxie

DirtySteve said:


> I'd love to have a drill press, but I don't have an actual work bench. I have a make shift temporary work bench set ip in my living room. If I'm not using it it will be in the way, I live in a dinky little apartment and I don't have any room for the stuff I already have. But on a positive note, I think I may have found one I can use.



Next best thing.


----------



## bulldozer1984

DirtySteve said:


> I'd love to have a drill press, but I don't have an actual work bench. I have a make shift temporary work bench set ip in my living room. If I'm not using it it will be in the way, I live in a dinky little apartment and I don't have any room for the stuff I already have. But on a positive note, I think I may have found one I can use.



Thats what i was gunna say. Try find a machine shop that will let you use theirs.


----------



## DirtySteve

Hahaha, funny thing is it's right down stairs under my apartment in what used to be a machine shop that's now being used for storage.. I could see it, but I couldn't get to it. It's buried under a bunch of crap and covered with oil and metal shavings. I still have to dig it out and see if it works, but I've been assured it does. lmao!


----------



## bulldozer1984

DirtySteve said:


> Hahaha, funny thing is it's right down stairs under my apartment in what used to be a machine shop that's now being used for storage.. I could see it, but I couldn't get to it. It's buried under a bunch of crap and covered with oil and metal shavings. I still have to dig it out and see if it works, but I've been assured it does. lmao!



What are the odds ?? hahaha.. thats funny shit man


----------



## DirtySteve

Yeah I rent from my boss, he used to be into hot rods and racing and building motors and shit, but since his buddy died a few years ago he's not into it anymore. The shop was being used for some stuff back when I first moved in here, but it hasn't been used in a year or so except for storage. I knew there was a big lathe and some other stuff down there, but it only dawned on me a little while ago that there might be a drill press down there. It's a huge stand alone one with a base and everything. ...still lmao!


----------



## brp

Hell you should see it you can set up a little bench area there.
He's underpaying you, it's the least he could do lol


----------



## DirtySteve

It's jam packed full of shit with just a path through the middle and too many people have access to it. It would be more trouble than it's worth. It's going to be a job to get to the drill.


----------



## Ghostman

....how bad do you want it? LMAO!


----------



## DirtySteve

Well, I have another delay. I took the whole thing apart today. I wasn't planning on it, but almost every hole has burrs left on it like they were drilled with a dull bit and forced. I can't live with that, I have to clean this thing up and I'm thinking while I have it all apart I should go ahead and repaint the chassis. (thoughts?)

I already knew the holes for the pots were rough because I had to remove them to check the values so if they were like that and the cutout for the transformer was so rough I figured the rest of it was too. I was right. My bench was covered in metal shavings when I was done tearing it down... Like I said, hopefully by Christmas! 

Prototype or not, there's no excuse for this...


----------



## DirtySteve

I'm trying to decide on a faceplate that will look kickass in here??? I'll be using Marshall knobs....shoot me some ideas. 





...I'm talking about the control panel, not the cab.


----------



## damienbeale

Just go Marshall style. Clear plexiglass, black draughtsmans pen through decent stencil, gold paint over the top. All done from behind. (Oo-er)


----------



## DirtySteve

I was worried about the plexiglass being too thick.


----------



## brp

DirtySteve said:


>



A solid C- in 8th grade metal shop.

Actually my 8th grader showed more pride in workmanship.


----------



## DirtySteve

It almost looks like it was cut with a torch.


----------



## gldtp99

That's some poor metalwork there !!!! It's too bad you're having to re-work this thing to such a huge degree------ but it will be safe when you're finished and you'll have learned a lot about amp building.

On another note:
I Triple Soldered my nuts to my workbench the other day (don't ask how this happened)------ Good thing that Triple Soldering produces such a weak solder joint, I was able to just lean back and break the solder- 
I escaped without permanent injury !!!


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Obviously Billy doesn't own a deburring tool, a step bit, or a common file ! Or for that matter doesn't own a conscience either with those burrs left behind. Had to edit this. I forgot that this was a prototype, so it's ok to half ass a job, so it's top shelf ! Nope that ain't it either, those burrs are a new prototype of a star washer


----------



## bulldozer1984

Im a metal worker by trade and that is absolutely woeful. Im literally shaking my head.

He has definitely cut that tranny hole out with a torch. You can tell by the rounded and melted over corners . 

OMFG.


----------



## rmroza

"Prototype or not, there's no excuse for this..."

Wow, thanks for the additional pics Steve. Yeah, that is Fuuuuucked up!

Yeah, there's holes in each corners, so obviously drilled, but then like you said, the edges are foleded over. Not sure if hack-job used a plasma cutter or nibbler or witf, but like you said NO excuses. That's not prototype...that's poor quality. C-? Try D- grade.

I can't believe all of the flash and shavings. Listen, if you're doing them by hand (anyone), onve ALL holes are in their place, use a pneumatic grinder with the screw in scratchbrite pads and grind everything down for god's sake. Then if one wants to paint....then you shoot it (Side A only)

I hope this helps.

Robb


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

That was a grinding disc he used on the cutout, you can see it if you look on the right hand side. Probably a cut off type that fits on a common Dremel type tool


----------



## DirtySteve

bulldozer1984 said:


> Im a metal worker by trade and that is absolutely woeful. Im literally shaking my head.
> 
> He has definitely cut that tranny hole out with a torch. You can tell by the rounded and melted over corners .
> 
> OMFG.



It looks like that in the pics and I'm no stranger an acetylene torch and it looks like melted metal in the pic, but actually it's jagged and sharp edges. My camera sucks. lmao,


----------



## Grenade

Good god that looks like a plasma cutter and a very unsteady hand. Have you had a tetanus shot lately?


----------



## scat7s

> ...I'm talking about the control panel, not the cab.



whatever you do, dump the gold chickenheads. not a good look...


----------



## DirtySteve

Guitar-Rocker said:


> That was a grinding disc he used on the cutout, you can see it if you look on the right hand side. Probably a cut off type that fits on a common Dremel type tool



I've cut metal with a dremel and your right, that's just what it looks like, or something similar with a cutting wheel. I think I need to hit this thing with a grinder and then clean it up with files, none of which I own. 

By the time I'm done with this I could've bought a real one, but I wouldn't have had the education (or the circuit) so this is all cool and still worth it so far...it's just going to delay things is all.


----------



## DirtySteve

scat7s said:


> whatever you do, dump the gold chickenheads. not a good look...



See post #280.  I'm going with Marshall knobs on. They've been ordered and should arrive this week.


----------



## brp

rmroza said:


> C-? Try D- grade.



Well keep in mind I was talking about 13 yr olds who've never done ANYTHING remotely like this in their life with zero skill or technique


----------



## kamran

brp said:


> Well keep in mind I was talking about 13 yr olds who've never done ANYTHING remotely like this in their life with zero skill or technique




So...Billy?


----------



## rmroza

Not that it matters, but the IEC 110V jack looks like dremel and disc, but I was looking and referring to the transformer hole cutout. This doesn't look like from a disc. he right side it soo jagged laft to right, then the left side, you can seee the metal folded over. This can happen when bending the aluminum back and forth, but some of the other stuff in that pic, looks like plasma or something. 

In any event, make all holes, etc., then grind everything down. 
These are the grinding disc I was referring to: Piece 2 in. Grade Fiber Surface Conditioning Discs


----------



## DirtySteve

Ok guys, sorry no pics yet so I thought I'd post these so you can see more what I'm dealing with here.

Definitely a cutting wheel of some sort, I'd say Dremel. Nothing wrong with that, but ****, file it and clean it up! The paint pealed right off with each part I removed and was still tacky and gummy in some areas because it wasn't done right. It looks like no primer was used and I'd bet it wasn't even cleaned before the paint was shot! This is why I'm stripping it and repainting it properly. No part of this amp is done right!















Nice logo...





The pots, power plug, fuse, speaker and input jacks, everything really, the holes were drilled exactly the same size as the threads and everything was forced into place either by threading it in or just shoving it I guess. The 110v power jack and the fuse were a bitch to remove, I thought I was going to break them getting them out! 

I have taken Roza up on his offer to help me out with the board so He's drilling the holes and installing the turrets for me while I work on the chassis. (maybe as we speak) I planned to do it myself and was determined to, but being a first timer here I'm having trouble finding the right turrets and I don't have the tools to do it properly so to expedite things, I gave a little, lol. (thanks brother) I feel a little bit like I'm cheating, but I'm anxious to get the build going, I hope no one holds it against me. It's just been one thing after another and it will help out a lot. 

Maybe I'll call this thing The MF since I've had so much help with it and I'm forever grateful and humbled! No one what know will know what that really means except you guys, but everyone will assume an appropriate name, lol! 

Thanks for all the support, it's going to start coming together soon I swear!


----------



## Ghostman

DirtySteve said:


> .... I feel a little bit like I'm cheating, but I'm anxious to get the build going, I hope no one holds it against me....



YOU CHEATING SOB!!!! How could you? Really? I'm SOOoo disappointed. After I read this I spent an hour crying in the corner of my room. Fetal position, tears streaming, and the slow dull ache of a world crumbling in on me taking over my soul.


....never mind. I was thinking of my job.


Keep up the good work Steve!!


----------



## bulldozer1984

Yeh man I totally hold it against you for getting Rob to drill and install turrets. How dare you ! Lol 

I cant believe he didnt drill clearance. What a dumb kunt. 

How are you going to open up the holes. Die Grinder or grinding bit on your dremel ?


----------



## DirtySteve

As of right now I'm going to use my dremel and a file, lol! I laugh because your probably rolling your eye's, but you hide and watch...I'm good at this sort of "making do" thing. I do a lot of things without proper tools!


----------



## charveldan

Just go buy an amp dude.


----------



## DirtySteve

That sounds really boring.


----------



## rmroza

O MY GOD. How in the fudge is paint not dry after ONE YEAR?!?! Whatever. The guy is a tool, the thing was a trainwreck. On to the build....

I offered to do the board as I thought if you guys didn't see any real progress and Steve using mid-evil tools, you were going to kill him! lol

The board is done per your spec Steve. I'm working from home tomorrow and will get it out first thing in the morning. I'm sending out USPS Priority Flat Rate, soo you should have it Friday and if not, Saturday, but absolutely this weekend!  Attached is a photo. Sorry photo isn't the greatest....hard in the house at night n no natural light.

I'll include the layout sheet in the photo also to ensure your mounting holes are in the correct location and line up.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Now that is a turretboard, instead of a connect the dots.


----------



## DirtySteve

We shall see. It looks right comparing it to my drawing. Whether that's right or not remains to be seen, but you see the layout. I drew all the components pretty close to actual size so it should be good, but I've never done this before so... 

I appreciate it Robb! Hopefully I'll have the chassis ready by the time it gets here.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Somewhere in Maryland there's a lot of face palming going on. Kind of like "I could have had a V-8". Smack !!!!


----------



## john l

DirtySteve said:


> That sounds really boring.


 
Yes why build something yourself when you can just go buy what someone else thinks you should have for double the cash you're already out... Wake up Steve its not like you have all the parts and are waiting for the board thats practically in the mail


----------



## rmroza

No issue, just trying to bring this beast to life faster. You do the populating and soldering.

Until then...

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_VZxE6pW_to]V8 Commercial with Baby - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## brp

DirtySteve said:


> As of right now I'm going to use my dremel and a file, lol! I laugh because your probably rolling your eye's, but you hide and watch...I'm good at this sort of "making do" thing. I do a lot of things without proper tools!



Dremel and a file should do fine.


----------



## bulldozer1984

DirtySteve said:


> As of right now I'm going to use my dremel and a file, lol! I laugh because your probably rolling your eye's, but you hide and watch...I'm good at this sort of "making do" thing. I do a lot of things without proper tools!



Dude there is nothing wrong with using ANY tool that gets the job done properly. 

As long as it looks good when it is finished - thats what matters. 

Sure there are tools that make a job quicker but that really doesnt matter unless your on the clock.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

After all the heartache, the obstacles found, and everything else that Steve has endured, when the turretboard arrives, he gets to finally have fun.


----------



## DirtySteve

Oh I'm having fun now! I'm having so much fun I burned up my sander tonight.  Sparks flew out the side as it popped and quit on me. Dammit! it was going good too. *sigh* The good news is it only took about 5 minutes with a file to square up those cutouts and clean them up. I've never worked with aluminum before, but I think I love this stuff!


----------



## 66 galaxie

charveldan said:


> Just go buy an amp dude.



:blahblah:

Where is the dislike button?


----------



## 66 galaxie

Keep on keepin on man. Its gonna turn out great


----------



## DirtySteve

So  ...referring to the warning label on the packaging, what precautions am I supposed to observe when handling the diodes? Do I need one of those ground straps that goes on your wrist?


----------



## scat7s

no


----------



## DirtySteve

I have handled diodes before without worry. I just think that's one hell of a warning on those things. ...wanted to be sure. Thanks Scat.


----------



## DirtySteve

I think I'm finally starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel. I know you guys probably already have, lol, but I get bogged down. 2 boxes showed up today, 2 more to go and I should have everything. whew!

All that's left besides the board and one cap is to finish the chassis clean up and I can start putting this thing together. I should have it painted and done Saturday. If there are no more setbacks I don't see why I shouldn't be rockin' by Thanksgiving weekend coming up!  

I'm starting get anxious, like on that last hour of a long road trip when you know your getting close and the ole foot starts getting heavy...hell yeah!


----------



## johnfv

Plenty of pics please Steve! You might give some of us enough motivation and inspiration to give it a go.


----------



## Ghostman

Keep the pace Steve. Don't get too anxious and speed through it. 













....but hurry the **** up.


----------



## DirtySteve

johnfv said:


> Plenty of pics please Steve! You might give some of us enough motivation and inspiration to give it a go.


----------



## brp

DirtySteve said:


> . I should have it painted and done Saturday.



How you getting the old paint off? Or did I miss that?


----------



## DirtySteve

brp said:


> How you getting the old paint off? Or did I miss that?



Yeah I think everyone missed it. I posted about it last night, but I don't think anyone saw it, lol. I'm using a vibrating sander and it was working great last night until it quit on me. I'm going to just buy a new one, but I haven't made it to the store yet...that's why Saturday.

I did my research on stripping and painting aluminum and I'm actually going to clean it up and use primer before I spray it like what should have been done. There will be pics of the outcome.


----------



## brp

A heat gun might be a better investment than the sander.

Also be sure to try the sander again, might have just been temporary thermal shut-down


----------



## DirtySteve

I saw sparks fly and heard a loud pop at at the same time. I've tried it several times and it's dead. I'm just going to buy a new one. I use it all the time and I've given it hell. I'm not surprised it blew, it's just the timing sucks..

So you think a heat gun will work better?  A pressure washer didn't do shit, but it wasn't a very powerful one.


----------



## brp

Oh, well sparks, there's your problem 


I can't say the gun will be "better" but it can really work well and may get more use in the future than the sander ( great for shrinking heat shrink tube and stripping poly guitars)

From the look of the flaking paint, I'd say a heat gun would be quick work since there was no primer, you already tried the sander a bit, how was that going?


----------



## DirtySteve

Yeah sparks are not good, lol. The sander was going good, that's why I want to stick with it. A little heavier grit and it'll make short work of it. I'm just going to stick with it.


----------



## 66 galaxie

Throw the wire brush on your dremel and go to town


----------



## charveldan

At this rate, you should have some sort of mApz by 2017.


----------



## john l

Wouldn't it be just completely wacky if people spoke to other people online like they do in person... that would just blow my mind.

I find it hilarious how the absence of physical repercussions can make some people act 

My previous advice about ignoring the fuktards can be applied to not just one but damn near any type of asshole so feel free to use it generously steve.


----------



## 66 galaxie

They said boobs arent allowed,,,, but billy and dan seem to have circumvented the rule...


----------



## minerman

I've been following this thread silently, just an innocent bystander watching & learning.....

Keep at it Steve, you'll have _your_ amp before you know it dude...I still think you're a hell of a man to just let the shit roll off you the way you did, I don't think I could've (or would've) done that, my hat's off to ya....

Be sure to post plenty of pics man, you never know when a moron like me might even attempt to build something like this....


----------



## DirtySteve

Thanks Minerman. The chassis prep and repainting is taking more time than I anticipated. Hopefully I'll have some pics tomorrow. I got the board today in the mail, I have all my parts except for one cap that's due monday. It's going to start coming together soon! 

btw...I happen to know you're not a moron, lol!


----------



## damienbeale

Personally I wouldn't paint it at all. Just gives you more grief when grounding. I'd just clean it up, and maybe polish the outside with a buffing wheel.


----------



## DirtySteve

I'm not painting the inside, just the outside. I think it'll look "unfinished" if I don't paint it...do you think?

This is still rough and as far as I got today. I had to use some stripper on the front & back panel and there's still gunk everywhere...


----------



## damienbeale

Looks a million times better.



(polish)

(polish)

(polish)


G'wan, you know it makes sense!


----------



## DirtySteve

So you think I should leave it bare aluminum. I don't have tools to polish, lol! In fact, I'm starting to realize I don't have many tool at all. I need to invest in some tools!


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Hit it with a Scotch Brite pad and call it good


----------



## damienbeale

drill in a vice, pigtail, buffing wheel, soap = beautiful shine. Well, eventually.


----------



## rmroza

Hey Steve

Glad you finally got the board. USPS was running 1 day late! 
Yeah, I'm with Terry, you got it all cleaned up and were going to add faceplates, so really there is no reason to paint it. Further to do it takes more time and the paint adhering to the metal and laying down nice without orange peel, etc. Unnecessary waste of time. 

Like Terry said, clean it, maybe polish it, and call it a day. 

Can't wait for it to be done. Merry Christmas!  lol


----------



## DirtySteve

I see what you guys are talking about. I hit an area with the scotch bright pad real quick and I can see that it will shine up. I just need to go over it with some finer sandpaper first. Damn, I already bought the primer and paint!


----------



## john l

Screw it, its a labor of love now guys! If you want to paint the outside of that sucker I say go to town Steve lol. The better the finished product the more he turned this whole thing around on that guy.


----------



## rmroza

If you do paint it...I would tape off the entire inside. You can that surface bare aluminum to greate your ground plane and I would take it to a powder coater and not doo it yourself. When I do it this way, my guy charges me $20 (thou I bought an oven and powder coating gun n can do it myself now also). Also, if you do it yourself, ensure you elevate it if you want to get that bottom lip covered. Hope this helps!


----------



## S9X

Painting aluminium is just not worth the effort unless You're considering powder coating. Anything else won't last long, no matter if You use primer coat or not.


----------



## DirtySteve

Alright...I guess you guy's are starting to change my mind. When I woke up this morning and up until about 10 minutes ago my plan was to paint it anyway. I get something in my head and I can't let go of it. Should I rough up the inside or just clean it good?


----------



## Grenade

Just clean it. Take the shine off anywhere you will be grounding.


----------



## rmroza

Sorry Steve, we should have expounded on this previously and saved you some $$$ in paint. 

Yes, paint, even with primer or etching primer is just not good and fo this application. I mean the oly part "shown" is the front and back and you plan on using faceplates, soo it's a moot point. Either powder coat, or leave it bare metal and cover wth faceplates.


----------



## 2203xman

I like the brushed alum look.It's 'kinda classy,like nickel over chrome.


----------



## DirtySteve

I just wasn't planning on a back plate. I guess it will look ok and no one's going to see the back.


----------



## ibmorjamn

Steve what board are you using and are you building it like a 18w plexi from circa 1965 with EL84's ?
I found this but what other thread has the build idea ?
"Cameron Jose, with very few changes. The few that were added, were common mods, with a few not going back into the rebuild. The power section was a sort of hybrid 18W, with the B+ dropping string styled after not an 18W, but a 100W"


----------



## john l

My 
Everyone here has been beyond cool with what they've contributed to steves amp but lets not forget to step back and let him make it his if its not going to hurt anything ya know.
Absolutely no question, paint on the inside is a no go but painting the outside fine if he masks it off well and use good primer and hard ass enamel.

Just saying fellas, carry on


----------



## DirtySteve

I appreciate it John, and I agree with you. I had it pictured with paint, but I also at one time wondered about leaving it bare. I decided against it because I thought it would look unfinished, but after whats been posted I'm not so worried about that anymore. If I don't like it I can go ahead and do a back plate as well. I've never done this before so I'm trusting the guys that have been here before. I was dead set on painting it today, but if it's not going to stick it's a lot of work left to do and another day. At this point it's not quite ready to paint, but it's really close. However it is ready to start putting it back together if I don't paint it. 

















This is all that will show...


----------



## john l

Totally cool Steve! Personally I agree with what the other guys are saying about leaving the chassis bare and I cant imagine the restraint your exercising not jumping in with both feet by now... however as I said before the whole point to building your own stuff is have exactly what "you" want and I think its important for you to remember that.


----------



## DirtySteve

Did you see where I notched the back panel for the power jack?


----------



## minerman

Local moron checking in here....

Can't tell you whether to paint or not Steve, that's your call, as it's your amp, all I'm gonna say is you're on the right track doing everything "right" man....

I did a double take looking at the pics, I thought I saw some hemostats lying there, but I think those are scissors...aren't they???


----------



## MartyStrat54

That chassis is looking so much better, especially the tranny hole.

Well done.


----------



## DirtySteve

Thanks Marty. It was a lot more of a job cleaning that thing up than I thought it would be.


----------



## damienbeale

minerman said:


> Local moron checking in here....
> 
> Can't tell you whether to paint or not Steve, that's your call, as it's your amp, all I'm gonna say is you're on the right track doing everything "right" man....
> 
> I did a double take looking at the pics, I thought I saw some hemostats lying there, but I think those are scissors...aren't they???



Nothing wrong with using hemostats whilst building amps. Use them as a heat sink when soldering diodes for instance. 

Although I have aluminium heat sink tweezers instead.


----------



## 66 galaxie

My unasked for opinion is to rock that chassis the way it is.


----------



## DirtySteve

minerman said:


> Local moron checking in here....
> 
> Can't tell you whether to paint or not Steve, that's your call, as it's your amp, all I'm gonna say is you're on the right track doing everything "right" man....
> 
> I did a double take looking at the pics, I thought I saw some hemostats lying there, but I think those are scissors...aren't they???



It could have been either one. Hemos are great for holding wires or components together if you have to solder them.


----------



## damienbeale

Shouldn't be relying on them for that though, Steve. Don't depend on the solder to make the joint. Ideally, you should always be making a good mechanical joint before adding solder.


----------



## DirtySteve

I decided not to paint it and I started putting it back together. 









I'm not happy at all with the heater wirers, but it'll have to do. I ran them twice and I don't have enough of the right gauge wire left to do it again.  The only reason I was able to do it a second time was because I ordered some of the wrong wire on my first order. My first try was worse. That was the one thing I was worried about making it look good and sure enough, it was a bitch!


----------



## damienbeale

Yay! And thus it starts!


----------



## DirtySteve

damienbeale said:


> Shouldn't be relying on them for that though, Steve. Don't depend on the solder to make the joint. Ideally, you should always be making a good mechanical joint before adding solder.



Of course, but sometimes it helps to have something to just hold it still while you solder. I never depend on the solder to make the joint. I shouldn't have said "hold them together", I just meant hold it still or in place.


----------



## Rocktane

DirtySteve said:


> I decided not to paint it and I started putting it back together.



Woo-hoo!


----------



## DirtySteve

It took me long enough, huh?


----------



## damienbeale

No rush. I like to have everything in place and clear in my head before I start anything. Preparation is key.


----------



## Rocktane

I really have no point of reference LOL. My wiring experience is limited to household stuff, sprinkler systems, car stereos, pickups, and a pedal mod. Considering you just got the board back and just finished cleaning up & de-phuking the chassis, I'd say you're moving right along!


----------



## DirtySteve

This doesn't look too bad. Maybe I'll leave it like this and then only I will know the combination, lol. I could call it the "unknown solder" and get a POW/MIA badge for the cab.


----------



## bulldozer1984

Steve, your heater wires are fine dude. Its your first build, remember ?? 

Afterall, Marshall doesn't even twist them.


----------



## rmroza

Yeah, I missed that Marty (xfer holes). MUCH better!

Yeah, if you shoot the paint, it is not durable at all...even with etching primer. Every little thing...putting it in and out of the chassis, etc. will cause it to possibly peel and flake. Either keep it bare, or if your heart is set on painting, mask off and powder coat....but that will cost money (at least $20/chassis) and time (depending on color, the powder coater will have to manage getting it in and it could be 1 day to 2 weeks)!

To answer "ibmorjamn" question...it's a custom board/layout Steve did with the help of Terry and I. The board is 1/8" Garolite FR4 material with dual turrets. The design is keeping with the original base design, which Billy was just cloning Mark Cameron's HG Jose design! Steve is adding selectable or defeated zener clip and lastly, it corrects the power section which was based on an incorrect 100W B+ power rail and dropping string in favor of the correct B+ for an 18-watt application.

Hope this help. Steve, looks great buddy!


----------



## rmroza

Damn Steve, I type up a reply and by that time I see a photo and 2 other replies!!

Yeah, i like it both clean and I lilke the idea of an MIA/POW and the name. Great job. Very creative.

Are you thinking of adding a name plate or putting the name on the amp? I may be able to help you with that for cheap and still look nice!  I'll E-mail you.


----------



## rmroza

for the heater wires....take you wires (usually black and red) and lock them in the end of a drill. Turn the drill on and twist those bitches up tight for about 2 feet and cut off the amounts you need in between valves...that's it. "it ain't rocket science"


----------



## damienbeale

rmroza said:


> Yeah, if you shoot the paint, it is not durable at all...even with etching primer.



I think you need to experiment with better acid etch primers and decent 2pk paint. The stuff I used to use (decent Akzo-Nobel stuff) was unshiftable even on ally and stainless.

That said, I still wouldn't paint it.


----------



## DirtySteve

rmroza said:


> Damn Steve, I type up a reply and by that time I see a photo and 2 other replies!!
> 
> Yeah, i like it both clean and I lilke the idea of an MIA/POW and the name. Great job. Very creative.
> 
> Are you thinking of adding a name plate or putting the name on the amp? I may be able to help you with that for cheap and still look nice!  I'll E-mail you.



You know I was joking when I said that earlier, but I don't know. I'm sitting here looking at it in the head box and I like the way it looks all stripped down and raw. Somehow it's fitting and like I said, "I" know what everything is.  All the sudden I'm not in such a hurry to order a faceplate. I think if there's a name, it's "no name", "nameless", "he who shall not be named"  . I'm just stoked about getting it wired up, man!



rmroza said:


> for the heater wires....take you wires (usually black and red) and lock them in the end of a drill. Turn the drill on and twist those bitches up tight for about 2 feet and cut off the amounts you need in between valves...that's it. "it ain't rocket science"



Yeah, I saw a vid about that trick, but I don't have a drill and they wouldn't clamp in my dremel. I know, I'm pathetic, lol. I've decided that anyone that asks me what I want for christmas I'm going to say a Lowes gift card. I need to get some tools. 

I originally did use black and red, but I messed it up and did it again with some wire I ordered by mistake. I posted about that earlier.

Thanks Robb, the board looks great and I'll be starting on that next!


----------



## DirtySteve

damienbeale said:


> I think you need to experiment with better acid etch primers and decent 2pk paint. The stuff I used to use (decent Akzo-Nobel stuff) was unshiftable even on ally and stainless.
> 
> That said, I still wouldn't paint it.



I'm not convinced it wouldn't have worked fine, but I'm not painting it now. It's too late for that. You guys all agreed and I don't know enough to question it. Turns out I like the raw look.

I'm not taking this thing back apart. It build time!


----------



## DirtySteve

rmroza said:


> Yeah, I missed that Marty (xfer holes). MUCH better!
> 
> Yeah, if you shoot the paint, it is not durable at all...even with etching primer. Every little thing...putting it in and out of the chassis, etc. will cause it to possibly peel and flake. Either keep it bare, or if your heart is set on painting, mask off and powder coat....but that will cost money (at least $20/chassis) and time (depending on color, the powder coater will have to manage getting it in and it could be 1 day to 2 weeks)!
> 
> To answer "ibmorjamn" question...it's a custom board/layout Steve did with the help of Terry and I. The board is 1/8" Garolite FR4 material with dual turrets. The design is keeping with the original base design, which Billy was just cloning Mark Cameron's HG Jose design! Steve is adding selectable or defeated zener clip and lastly, it corrects the power section which was based on an incorrect 100W B+ power rail and dropping string in favor of the correct B+ for an 18-watt application.
> 
> Hope this help. Steve, looks great buddy!



You for got the resonance knob.  Sorry I forgot to answer you question Ibmorjamn. I meant to...


----------



## DirtySteve

66 galaxie said:


> My unasked for opinion is to rock that chassis the way it is.



You snuck that one in on me Alex, lol! I want everyone's opinion. well, not eeeveryone , but guys that know the techical stuff and guys that know what looks good. I know you know what looks good! If I post it I welcome any opinions or critique. I'm still just learning here.


----------



## minerman

Oh, I know about using the hemostats for holding wires, etc. for soldering guys, I was talking about using 'em to hold something else entirely...like a joint/doobie that's gotten down pretty small & might burn one's finger/thumb while hitting....not that I'd know anything about that, just sayin'....

The pic of the chassis in the headshell looks fine to me man, kinda gives it the AFD look IMO....

Just take your time & do it right dude, I know I'd be getting pretty anxious to play/hear it myself, & again, gotta hand it to you, you've handled all this like a real man Steve, you're a top notch guy IMHO....

Keep us posted!!!!


----------



## 66 galaxie

Its looking good bro. 
Keep after it. No need to push too hard.


----------



## rmroza

Yeah, variable depth. ...but the original intent WAS HG Cameron Jose and the design DOES include a variable depth control.


----------



## DirtySteve

rmroza said:


> Yeah, variable depth. ...but the original intent WAS HG Cameron Jose and the design DOES include a variable depth control.



That's it! I thought of it days ago, but didn't mention it. I like the idea.

Alex, I just decided you gotta do me a POW/MIA cigar box V. I'll start sending you payments on it!


----------



## Ghostman




----------



## shredless

doobie holder...how about a jefferson airplane?


----------



## 66 galaxie

DirtySteve said:


> That's it! I thought of it days ago, but didn't mention it. I like the idea.
> 
> Alex, I just decided you gotta do me a POW/MIA cigar box V. I'll start sending you payments on it!



I can make that happen 

Let me make a stew with some ideas.... I'll report back


----------



## paul-e-mann

DirtySteve said:


> This doesn't look too bad. Maybe I'll leave it like this and then only I will know the combination, lol. I could call it the "unknown solder" and get a POW/MIA badge for the cab.



Looks good. Hey Steve talk to the guys at Mojotone, tell him your concerns about the thickness of a plexi panel, I believe he can get material super thin and make you a Marshall style panel to fit.


----------



## DirtySteve

66 galaxie said:


> I can make that happen
> 
> Let me make a stew with some ideas.... I'll report back



No hurry, lol. I can't really do it until after chistmas now that I think about it, but I think that would be cool and I do want one of your Vs. Maybe we can work something out for the first of the year. Start thinking about it though, I like the idea a lot..


----------



## DirtySteve

pedecamp said:


> Looks good. Hey Steve talk to the guys at Mojotone, tell him your concerns about the thickness of a plexi panel, I believe he can get material super thin and make you a Marshall style panel to fit.



Thanks man! Mojotone is the one I was leaning towards. But now that I scraped about 1/16" of paint off the front panel I'm not as worried about it, lol.


----------



## 66 galaxie

DirtySteve said:


> No hurry, lol. I can't really do it until after chistmas now that I think about it, but I think that would be cool and I do want one of your Vs. Maybe we can work something out for the first of the year. Start thinking about it though, I like the idea a lot..



Wait till you see my next V


----------



## paul-e-mann

DirtySteve said:


> Thanks man! Mojotone is the one I was leaning towards. But now that I scraped about 1/16" of paint off the front panel I'm not as worried about it, lol.



Mojotone's panels are 1/32" thick.


----------



## damienbeale

Unknown solder... 

Would that be single, double or triple? Who knows...


----------



## DirtySteve

I was in a goofy mood last night, lol.


----------



## bulldozer1984

Im not really diggin' the MIA POW thing. 

I like.. "The White Knight".

Say that out loud while looking at it. 




[/URL][/QUOTE]


----------



## damienbeale

bulldozer1984 said:


> I like.. "The White Knight".
> 
> Say that out loud while looking at it.



Meh, sorry Ad, I think that sounds rather ghey...


----------



## DirtySteve

Hmm, too super hero_-ish_...don't you think?


----------



## bulldozer1984

damienbeale said:


> Meh, sorry Ad, I think that sounds rather ghey...



I think you sound rather ghey !


----------



## bulldozer1984

DirtySteve said:


> Hmm, too super hero_-ish_...don't you think?



No i dont. I think its cool.. 

Some people just dont get my top-shelf creativity 



Maybe you could go with 

"The Firebolt" ?? What you reckon ?


----------



## damienbeale

bulldozer1984 said:


> I think you sound rather ghey !



HEY! I resemble that remark!

No wait, I re...ah fugeddit.


----------



## damienbeale

You could always b@st@rdize a Marshall logo...


----------



## DirtySteve

bulldozer1984 said:


> No i dont. I think its cool..
> 
> Some people just dont get my top-shelf creativity
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe you could go with
> 
> "The Firebolt" ?? What you reckon ?





 um, no! So far I'm leaning towards no name because I suck at this.


----------



## bulldozer1984

damienbeale said:


> HEY! I resemble that remark!
> 
> No wait, I re...ah fugeddit.



Yes you do RESEMBLE that remark


----------



## damienbeale

No, I'm sure I resemble it. 

Ask the wife...


----------



## bulldozer1984

DirtySteve said:


> um, no! So far I'm leaning towards no name because I suck at this.



Or maybe "The Mountain of Mayhem"

That of course tells this whole saga in just 4 words lol


----------



## damienbeale

"Disorder"


----------



## DirtySteve

damienbeale said:


> "Disorder"



Nice!


----------



## DirtySteve

It needs to be something short, like one or two words and shouldn't start with the word "the". I like "dirtbag", too.


----------



## damienbeale

Hmmm, I might make a two channel amp called Chaos & Disorder, the only trouble is, those sort of names conjure up images of more gain than I'm likely to want to make for myself.


----------



## bulldozer1984

damienbeale said:


> Hmmm, I might make a two channel amp called Chaos & Disorder, the only trouble is, those sort of names conjure up images of more gain than I'm likely to want to make for myself.



Channel 1 - Cheech
Channel 2 - Chong 



I like "Dirtbag" Steve. Its kinda tongue in cheek. 

"Dirty Sanchez" would be cool too.


----------



## scat7s

thats looks great steve!


----------



## damienbeale

bulldozer1984 said:


> Channel 1 - Cheech
> Channel 2 - Chong


Both channels might be a little TOO laid back for my liking...


----------



## DirtySteve

scat7s said:


> thats looks great steve!



Thanks Scat.


----------



## DirtySteve

bulldozer1984 said:


> Channel 1 - Cheech
> Channel 2 - Chong
> 
> 
> 
> I like "Dirtbag" Steve. Its kinda tongue in cheek.
> 
> "Dirty Sanchez" would be cool too.



Ok, out of curiosity I looked up dirty sanchez and , I didn't know that. 
See I like dirt or dirty because this is my dirt amp and all this happened on line, and because I go by DirtySteve everywhere on line. My next amp will have a clean channel.


----------



## GIBSON67

I like it, looks good! A million times better is an understatement!

The faceplate section...if the knobs just had some numbers to go by, then I would say it looks finished. I like the silver/white combination.


----------



## scat7s

mark it up with a little fine tip sharpie. 

thats usually all i do. it fades after a little while, but it looks raw, like you built it yourself. as long as your penmanship is pretty clean, it can look good. and if you dont like it, it rubs off with a little scotchbrite.


----------



## damienbeale

Forget numbers, I'd just put a question mark under every knob and switch.

In fact, a big white question mark on a black plate for the headcab would look pretty cool...


----------



## DirtySteve

I like the way you guys are thinking now, but I don't need any marks really. The only thing I want to mark is the impedance selector on the back just so I don't get drunk and forget or something. And for that all I'm going to do is dots. A small dot for 4 ohm, a medium dot for 8 and a bigger dot for 16 ohm. 

Damien, you have no idea how cool that is. I have a question mark tat on my hand that goes back to '92 when I was in the military. It's a long story that I'm not going to tell, but it has some major significance and kind of fits this situation as well. I like that idea a lot. Really cool!


----------



## DirtySteve

Right now I wish I'd gone with black piping on the cabs instead of gold. I almost did...I should have followed my gut feeling.


----------



## Ghostman

Call it Ted.


----------



## DirtySteve

I got it!!! "problem child" oh Hell Yeah! it's a done deal...just heard this on pandora and had a "doh" moment.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nng92efL2f8[/ame]

...and oddly enough, this song ties in with the question mark thing. It was one of my bro's (who also got a question mark tat on his hand at the same time) favorite songs and the first time Bon Scott era AC/DC came on my radar. Funny how things happen.


----------



## JayCM800

"Problem Child"


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Very Fitting, no less !


----------



## Stringjunkie

Label the knobs attitude/gain and aggression/volume. Good stuff Steve!


----------



## DirtySteve

Stringjunkie said:


> Label the knobs attitude/gain and aggression/volume. Good stuff Steve!



Thanks brother..where the hell have you been? I was just thinking about shooting you a PM!


----------



## Stringjunkie

I'm a lurker these days. Haven't had much to say, just reading a bit..


----------



## DirtySteve

Stringjunkie said:


> I'm a lurker these days. Haven't had much to say, just reading a bit..



That's cool...strange days lately.


----------



## 66 galaxie

Stringjunkie said:


> I'm a lurker these days. Haven't had much to say, just reading a bit..



You need a V to lurk with...


----------



## DirtySteve

Have I seen the one with the skulls? I like the hell out of that!


----------



## rmroza




----------



## Stringjunkie

I'm always waiting to see the 'next' one from you Galaxie. It just keeps getting better.


----------



## mott555

Why only four strings? Been meaning to ask that for a while.


----------



## 66 galaxie

mott555 said:


> Why only four strings? Been meaning to ask that for a while.



The whole idea with four strings is that the idea came from cigar box guitars. Most of those have 3 or 4 strings. The other deal is that I dont have to install a truss rod. However, the next build.....


----------



## bulldozer1984

mott555 said:


> Why only four strings? Been meaning to ask that for a while.



My first thought is that maybe it would be too much tension to have more than 4


----------



## 66 galaxie

Thats pretty much it right there. No need for a truss rod with 4 strings. Its funny how much music you can make on those four strings though.


----------



## 66 galaxie

DirtySteve said:


> Have I seen the one with the skulls? I like the hell out of that!



Hey Steve, sorry I didnt get back on this sooner. I had a buddy call and he was pretty talky.
I thought you had seen the skull V? Its pretty trick, the skulls are painted with a glow in the dark paint, and they do glow in the dark!!! Its really cool.
I'll try and get you some more pics...


----------



## damienbeale

Easy enough to replace the string/piping yourself but you will need a little staple gun.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Love the Skulls guitar Alex! I should mention that I've been going through very serious problems with my vision in my left eye, and it literally feels like acid has been splashed in my eye, not to mention I can't see squat. I did get a steroid pack at a specialist yesterday, and it's working wonders. My apologies to all for being mean as a Snake, and for not commenting more on Steve's build lately (serving as a co-coach), hopefully I have not pissed too many off, sorry if I did. Yes, I agree, that if you really don't like the gold piping, it can be changed as long as you have access to a staple gun. Sorry to sidetrack the thread Steve.


----------



## 66 galaxie

Thanks Terry 
Be careful with your eyes. Hope you get healed up soon.


----------



## DirtySteve

Guitar-Rocker said:


> Love the Skulls guitar Alex! I should mention that I've been going through very serious problems with my vision in my left eye, and it literally feels like acid has been splashed in my eye, not to mention I can't see squat. I did get a steroid pack at a specialist yesterday, and it's working wonders. My apologies to all for being mean as a Snake, and for not commenting more on Steve's build lately (serving as a co-coach), hopefully I have not pissed too many off, sorry if I did. Yes, I agree, that if you really don't like the gold piping, it can be changed as long as you have access to a staple gun. Sorry to sidetrack the thread Steve.



No worries Terry. I'm glad it's better now. A little side tracking is cool, especially when I don't have anything else to show yet. I didn't notice you being mean, I just thought you'd been doing a lot of fishing or something.


----------



## The Ozzk

66 galaxie said:


> Thats pretty much it right there. No need for a truss rod with 4 strings. *Its funny how much music you can make on those four strings though.*



This is soooo true.


----------



## 66 galaxie

Here's a quick music interlude while we wait for an update..

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2RWksEf4CQM]Blind Pilgrim Collection 4-string Cigar Box Guitar - Keep Your Lamp Trimmed and Burning - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## DirtySteve

Sorry, I had to buy a drill to drill some holes for some of the ground wires and stuff in the board. I realized my dremel wasn't going to do it. I drilled the holes and I'm ready to start wiring and populating the board, but I have a sinus headache and don't really feel that good so I'm probably done for tonight. Pics soon I swear!


Cool tune Alex! Thanks for filling the holes.


----------



## brp

Silver face and Marshall knobs is a huge improvement.
It would definitely look better with black piping, for my taste.


----------



## DirtySteve

I think so too...on all counts. thanks! You know, I'm cool with the gold piping though, I'm not going to tear it apart to change it. It was a series of steps that led to what it is. There are a few things I would've done differently (hind sight being 20/20 and all), but this is a learning experience and not something I planned to do. It's cool. I'm taking notes for my next one, lol!


----------



## DirtySteve

In the interest of "no regrets" I decided to order new sockets, jacks and pots today. Also new filament wire so I can see if the 3rd time's a charm. Slight delay, but it was starting to bother me that I didn't go ahead and do that. The thread where you guy's where talking about the jacks was the straw that broke the camels back, lol. 

I still plan to have the board built this weekend. Work picked up and I have a side job I'm working on at home so I wasn't getting anything done at night this week anyway.

The only parts I'm reusing now are the trannys, the chassis, the impedance switch and the power and standby switches. Everything else will be new and I can be sure are undamaged and no solder has dripped into them during disassembly. Peace of mind is a wonderful thing.


----------



## damienbeale

For the first timer, you'd probably appreciate decent tinned copper wire for the heaters, rather than slippy, fiddly PTFE stuff. It stays where you bend it.


----------



## Far Rider

I've been following this thread with great interest. It's really good to see everyone supporting you in this. Makes me proud to be in a community of such good people. You're doing great Steve. Best of luck.


----------



## DirtySteve

Far Rider said:


> I've been following this thread with great interest. It's really good to see everyone supporting you in this. Makes me proud to be in a community of such good people. You're doing great Steve. Best of luck.



Indeed! I'm actually quite surprised at the way this thread has gone. Of course I know Marty has been watching, but I think there was only a couple of instances where it could have gone another way. Thanks to all you guys.


----------



## DirtySteve

damienbeale said:


> For the first timer, you'd probably appreciate decent tinned copper wire for the heaters, rather than slippy, fiddly PTFE stuff. It stays where you bend it.



Honestly, I don't know what that means, lol. I ordered the wire Terry recommended. I'm going to try the drill trick this time since now I have a drill.


----------



## damienbeale

Using a drill is unnecessary with the right wire. 
The 18AWG stuff at the top of the page here is great. 
Wire, Sleeving & Lugs | ValveStorm

Been using it ever since my metroamp days.


----------



## scat7s

the pretinned stuff is nice to work with...ive got miles of it from organ donors.


----------



## 2203xman

Steve,the amp is really looking classy.Looks pretty darn good with no name.


----------



## ibmorjamn

DirtySteve said:


> It needs to be something short, like one or two words and shouldn't start with the word "the". I like "dirtbag", too.



Just call it S2 Dirte
Dirte from Joe Dirt


----------



## solarburn

How many techs are helping? You could call it "Dirty Dozen" or use the actual number of them. Dozen could just stand for all those that helped. Dirty Driven. Drive Dirty. Den of Dirty. Dirt. Real Dirt. Dirty Skirty. Rumbl'n. My fav would be Pantie Dropper. Big Bottom Girl. Juice Box. Ok those last ones may be inspired by fond memories...

Redeem/ed: to restore the honour, worth or reputation of. Dirty Redemption or jus Redemption...Redemptor...Redempted.


----------



## DirtySteve

So y'all don't like "problem Child"? lol!


----------



## solarburn

Oh did you pick that already? I was bored and thought it was still up for naming.LOL


----------



## The Ozzk

DirtySteve said:


> So y'all don't like "problem Child"? lol!



I don't know man, "problem child" references the past.

I think this amp represents the future, the great people who helped, and the good times to come when you play that beast!


----------



## DirtySteve

You do have a point there Ozzk.


----------



## Rocktane

I think you should wait on deciding on a name until you play it, hear it, and feel it. Something might just come to you then. Like "whoa! this is a Wicked Bitch!" then you would have it nailed.


----------



## DirtySteve

Yep, I totally agree. I've kind of all already decided to do that. The main thing is to get it up and running.


----------



## Far Rider

The Ozzk said:


> I don't know man, "problem child" references the past.
> 
> I think this amp represents the future, the great people who helped, and the good times to come when you play that beast!



+100. You could name it "Forumizer".

Maybe not.


----------



## DirtySteve

"Down n' Dirty" ...oops, I wasn't thinking about this, but Blues poll on tone led to it...it's his fault.  ...


----------



## rmroza

...seen this and made me think of Blades, his crap work....and big mouth. lol

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nc_LIR5ExIU]YOU NEED TO SHUT THE **** UP - YouTube[/ame]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PaFLezxS1tA&feature=player_detailpage"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PaFLezxS1tA&feature=player_detailpage[/ame]


----------



## thrawn86

Steve, I'm really sorry about all of this. I was doing a little reading on what's been transpiring. Here's to you getting things up and running.


----------



## DirtySteve

Hey Thrawn, it's good to see you. Thanks bro! 

It turned out to be a good thing, man I've learned so much and gotten to know some really great people a lot better along the way. And I've had a good time doing it. (well, most of the time, lol) It got me off my ass and interested in something new and that was a really good thing. What happened that led to this is all water under the bridge, this is my amp now and I'm on the home stretch!


----------



## scat7s

a name is like a tattoo, seems like a good idea at first, but you probably outgrow it eventually.


----------



## a2dconverter

damienbeale said:


> You could always b@st@rdize a Marshall logo...



Or this one that I photo shopped....


----------



## damienbeale

Now that SO suits me down to the ground (why didn't I think of that!!!)

Might have to get a few Arsehole's CNC'd up.


----------



## DirtySteve

Well shit! I ordered the wrong preamp sockets! The power sockets and jacks are ok, but not the preamps. I'm so pissed right now. I don't think I have time to order new ones in time and I'll probably get the wrong ones again anyway. 

I did manage to get the buss wires and other board wiring done today, but that was frustrating too. Not a very good day. I have all day tomorrow so hopefully it will be better and I'll have pics. I could show you pics of what I got done today, but you would probably think I didn't get anywhere.

Sorry, but that's my update for today. :frown:


----------



## bulldozer1984

DirtySteve said:


> Well shit! I ordered the wrong preamp sockets! The power sockets and jacks are ok, but not the preamps. I'm so pissed right now. I don't think I have time to order new ones in time and I'll probably get the wrong ones again anyway.
> 
> I did manage to get the buss wires and other board wiring done today, but that was frustrating too. Not a very good day. I have all day tomorrow so hopefully it will be better and I'll have pics. I could show you pics of what I got done today, but you would probably think I didn't get anywhere.
> 
> Sorry, but that's my update for today. :frown:



Oh man my wiring aint too great either. I'll run a really good one, then a shit one lol..

Need more practice. 

So dont be too hard on yourself. And dont expect this amp to look like a pro builders either. Those guys been doing it for years


----------



## Gene Ballzz

+1 on what bulldozer said, and bear in mind that as musicians, we all tend to be our own most picky critics! Tube bad on the wrong sockets. How wrong are they?
Keep Your Chin Up,
Gene


----------



## DirtySteve

Gene Ballzz said:


> +1 on what bulldozer said, and bear in mind that as musicians, we all tend to be our own most picky critics! Tube bad on the wrong sockets.
> How wrong are they?
> Keep Your Chin Up,
> Gene



2 things, the chassis holes are 7/8" and the sockets fit 3/4", and the shield mounting bracket holes are smaller than the screws I have. Now that I can fix by just drilling them out wider, but the gap... well, I guess that doesn't matter as long as they don't rock. Maybe I can use them, but they just aren't what I expected. I thought I ordered all Belton sockets, but only the power tubes are. These don't even have a name on my invoice. 





The power tube sockets don't fit right either (chassis holes), but they never did so I was ok with it. I guess I'm just getting too stressed and haven't unwound from the week yet. I'm starting to relax now. I'll probably feel better about it all tomorrow. I guess I just expected too much for today.


----------



## bulldozer1984

DirtySteve said:


> Well shit! I ordered the wrong preamp sockets!



To continue with what Gene said.. Yeh how wrong are they ?? 

I bet Billy would have made em work


----------



## DirtySteve

Well here it is fellas, my first board...





I'm missing one cap so I just made a rush order and went ahead and ordered different preamp sockets while I was at it. Hopefully it will be here tuesday.


----------



## Micky

Nice!


----------



## Stringjunkie

Looks great man!

Edit: even though I don't know what I'm looking at..


----------



## john l

Hell ya steve your wrecking that thing! Looks tits man. Where are you getting your resistors


----------



## DirtySteve

Thanks guys. 

John, most of the resisters were donated to the cause and I don't know where he bought them. ...they look good don't they.


----------



## DirtySteve

Today was the funnest day yet! I'm gonna have a beer now.


----------



## GtT

Excellent. Sad back story, but props to you for making lemonade from a nasty old lemon.


----------



## MartyStrat54

Steve. You may recall that we had a discussion about the socket holes. It is my assumption that Mr. Blade's used an electrician's knockout to make the holes and thus they are oversized. 

I do want to bring something to your attention. The shouldered preamp tube sockets should be stronger and more durable in those oversized holes, but you should check to see if your preamp tubes will fit inside the shouldered area. Some CP tubes are thicker and will not fit in a shouldered socket.

I want you to know about this now instead of later.

Your board looks damn good.


----------



## DirtySteve

MartyStrat54 said:


> Steve. You may recall that we had a discussion about the socket holes. It is my assumption that Mr. Blade's used an electrician's knockout to make the holes and thus they are oversized.
> 
> I do want to bring something to your attention. The shouldered preamp tube sockets should be stronger and more durable in those oversized holes, but you should check to see if your preamp tubes will fit inside the shouldered area. Some CP tubes are thicker and will not fit in a shouldered socket.
> 
> I want you to know about this now instead of later.
> 
> Your board looks damn good.



Thanks Marty and yes I remember our conversation like it was yesterday. You told me about "tube rocking" and the power tubes were indeed loose as hell, but the socket themselves were tight and didn't move. It's only the power tubes though and I was concerned about that, the socket didn't rock, only the tubes fit really loose. I never did figure out why so I blamed it on the socket's being cheap. 

That's one of the reasons why I wanted to replace at least the power tube sockets and I bought new preamp sockets too just because the pins on these are all ****ed up. I thought the preamp tubes fit good and tight all along. I didn't know some tubes might not fit with the shields, but all the ones I bought from you and Alan fit no problem. 

I ordered new preamp sockets today because of that but the new power tube sockets are the same fit as before and they are solid and don't move. I think the preamp sockets I ordered today will be the same as what bill used. (I think!...but, probably not I'm not having much luck lately). In one of BBs vids he was drilling them out with a universal bit. I don't think he used a punch on any of it.

Here are some pics. The red smears are blood. I cut my finger last night trying to drill bigger holes in the shield bases to try and make the ones I bought work. On the last one the drill grabbed it and spun it around. At first I didn't think it cut me until I saw the blood on the chassis and that's when I stopped last night. I would stop bleeding, lol. I think I might leave it.


----------



## Rocktane

Nice work Steve! You are inspiring me, that looks like so much fun! I may have to attempt a build myself soon.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

DirtySteve said:


> Well here it is fellas, my first board...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm missing one cap so I just made a rush order and went ahead and ordered different preamp sockets while I was at it. Hopefully it will be here tuesday.


 


Billy would be sooooooo damn jealous of your work !! Now that's how it should be done. Kudo's!


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

john l said:


> Hell ya steve your wrecking that thing! Looks tits man. Where are you getting your resistors


 

I donated those to the cause. They are 2W Vishay metal films, from Mouser.


----------



## DirtySteve

Rocktane said:


> Nice work Steve! You are inspiring me, that looks like so much fun! I may have to attempt a build myself soon.



That's why I'm posting all my set backs too. I don't know about a kit, but doing this from scratch is a HUGE learning curve. I've had a lot of help, I can't imagine doing this all on my own. That's the only reason I'm this far along. Much respect for the guys that do this all the time. I imagine it get's easier the more you do, but wow, I never realized how much thought and prep goes into an amp build. It's not as easy as these guys make it look. ...Much respect!!!!


----------



## mott555

DirtySteve said:


> Well here it is fellas, my first board...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm missing one cap so I just made a rush order and went ahead and ordered different preamp sockets while I was at it. Hopefully it will be here tuesday.



That is one CLEAN board. I'm sure a meme could somehow be made with the before-and-after pics. Maybe one of those "This is your brain on drugs..." things.


----------



## GtT

I've spent a lot of time reading the back story about all of this. What a raw deal. I hope karma is real because that "blades" clown has a lot of bad stuff headed his way.


----------



## DirtySteve

mott555 said:


> That is one CLEAN board. I'm sure a meme could somehow be made with the before-and-after pics. Maybe one of those "This is your brain on drugs..." things.



I don't know what a meme is, but this is the build thread. I think I'll post another thread when it's done and show plenty of before and after pics.


----------



## GtT

I don't know anything about building an amp, but this is a very intriguing thread and story. Very interesting. And it appears that a bunch of people predicted this would happen. Just keep up the good work man. It's going to be great.


----------



## bulldozer1984

Very nice work Steve !


----------



## rmroza

Lookin' good Steve. Why didn't you ask for the correct parts to order instead of wingin' it?!?!? Oh well, live and learn. Do you still need help on anything to order, like jacks? switched? and sockets??


----------



## DirtySteve

rmroza said:


> Lookin' good Steve. Why didn't you ask for the correct parts to order instead of wingin' it?!?!? Oh well, live and learn. Do you still need help on anything to order, like jacks? switched? and sockets??



Because I thought I was asking questions that I thought I shouldn't need to ask and I thought it would be simple. The jacks were the only thing I was sure about because there was a discussion in another thread and I was even wrong about that. Terry helped me out, but I thought the sockets were cut and dry. I see now that they aren't. Chalk another one up to a learning experience! I was in a rush to order in time to get them before the long weekend and I panicked a little.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Ahhhhhh, don't beat yourself up on that one. I have more than once ordered the wrong part, thinking I was getting what I wanted. And it's usually just when I really wanted the right part to continue.


----------



## Ghostman

Steve that looks spectacular!!! Badass incarnate!


----------



## 2203xman

Steve,just checking in,the board looks neat as hell. Great soldering,man!


----------



## DirtySteve

More goodies in the mail today...shiny new CTS pots





...and installed. note the Cliff UK input jack. I got new speaker jacks too.







Marty, I called AES today just in time to change the preamp sockets I ordered to ones without the shield base. Thanks for the heads up.


----------



## GtT

Cool! When do you expect to have this finished? 

(Sorry if you've said it already and I missed it)


----------



## DirtySteve

"IF" I have all my parts, which I should after this next delivery but I thought that before, I hope I can finish it up over this 4 day weekend coming up. Of course turkey day is family and all, but then I have 3 days to work on it. I hope this coming weekend, but I have no idea what I might run into. 

The way I see it all that's left is to hook up some wires, but since I've never done this before, I really don't know how it's going to go. Fingers crossed! I'm awfully bored with my acoustic and my micro terror is collecting dust. I'm soooo ready to turn this thing on...

I need to get it going soon because I've been neglecting all the other things I need to get done. Like working on my truck, it needs a tune up bad.


----------



## GtT

DirtySteve said:


> "IF" I have all my parts, which I should after this next delivery but I thought that before, I hope I can finish it up over this 4 day weekend coming up. Of course turkey day is family and all, but then I have 3 days to work on it. I hope this coming weekend, but I have no idea what I might run into.
> 
> The way I see it all that's left is to hook up some wires, but since I've never done this before, I really don't know how it's going to go. Fingers crossed! I'm awfully bored with my acoustic and my micro terror is collecting dust. I'm soooo ready to turn this thing on...



Awesome. I know how it goes sometimes. My humble unsolicited advice is to not rush it. I was restoring an old musclecar one time, and I kept saying "I think I'll have it done by so-and-so". Long story short, I finished it about 2 years after my proclaimed finish date.


----------



## charveldan

Gotta hand it to ya Steve, you've done a great job.
All hail.the Resurrection ...


----------



## DirtySteve

Thank you, Dan. ...didn't think I could do it did ya?


----------



## DirtySteve

GtT said:


> Awesome. I know how it goes sometimes. My humble unsolicited advice is to not rush it. I was restoring an old musclecar one time, and I kept saying "I think I'll have it done by so-and-so". Long story short, I finished it about 2 years after my proclaimed finish date.



I know man and I've thought about that, but I also know me and if I hadn't set this goal I'd still be sanding the chassis. I have to push myself, but I also have to be careful not to rush it, like I did with ordering parts last week.   thanks dude.


----------



## 66 galaxie

Nicework on the board Steve  Looks really clean and neat. You may regret not triple soldering though....


----------



## DirtySteve

66 galaxie said:


> Nicework on the board Steve  Looks really clean and neat. You may regret not triple soldering though....



Oh shit!!!...I forgot to order goop!


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Better buy 2 gallons to make sure you would have enough to go around, and don't forget to get a dozen Sharpie pens to color up all those nice new component values. (Seriously, why on earth would anyone do that if you have ever built an amp).


----------



## DirtySteve

Dammit!...forgot that too!


----------



## paul-e-mann

Looks great so far Steve!


----------



## GtT

What is the target sound of this amp? I don't know anything about amp building, so the components and pics really mean nothing to me besides just looking cool. Is this going to be a vintage sounding amp? Hairy 80s? Heavy 90s? All of the above?


----------



## johnfv

Board looks great Steve and you MUST leave the blood. I'm sure you've already got sweat into this (and probably a few tears as well).


----------



## DirtySteve

GtT said:


> What is the target sound of this amp? I don't know anything about amp building, so the components and pics really mean nothing to me besides just looking cool. Is this going to be a vintage sounding amp? Hairy 80s? Heavy 90s? All of the above?



I'm going to go with, "all of the above'.


----------



## Alabama Thunderpussy

Guitar-Rocker said:


> Better buy 2 gallons to make sure you would have enough to go around, and don't forget to get a dozen Sharpie pens to color up all those nice new component values. (Seriously, why on earth would anyone do that if you have ever built an amp).



Circuit notwithstanding, ideally it's because dickheads like to post gutshots all over the forums, and actual patents are hard to come by.

Great job Steve! Knew you could do it.


----------



## damienbeale

DirtySteve said:


> Well here it is fellas, my first board...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm missing one cap so I just made a rush order and went ahead and ordered different preamp sockets while I was at it. Hopefully it will be here tuesday.



Well lookee what we got here, a real sweetheart!

And if you can do work as good as that as a first timer, there was no real reason that somebody who "bigged himself up" as the greatest thing alive shouldn't have been able to at least have done the same.

Credit to ya Steve, you're handling this real nicely.


----------



## DirtySteve

Thanks for bringing that up Damien. That's exactly what I set out to prove.


----------



## damienbeale

Well the proof of the pudding is always in the eating, but this game so far it looks like you're knocking them out of the park.


----------



## DirtySteve

That's why I can't get too excited about it yet. I have my fingers crossed all the way. I'll be so nervous when the time comes to turn it on I'll probably need a xanax.


----------



## damienbeale

DirtySteve said:


> That's why I can't get too excited about it yet. I have my fingers crossed all the way. I'll be so nervous when the time comes to turn it on I'll probably need a xanax.



Aw shit Steve, even I get real nervous when throwing that switch for the first time on ANY of my builds. 
That even goes for those that are carbon copies of my previous work (and mostly Marshalls previous work).


----------



## brp

Great job, Steve, I knew it would be cuz I think I knew as well as you that you weren't going to post pics of less than proper work, first build or not.

That board very dramatically illustrates what a pretender hack job was sold to you in a way that's really almost unbelievable.


----------



## DirtySteve

damienbeale said:


> Aw shit Steve, even I get real nervous when throwing that switch for the first time on ANY of my builds.
> That even goes for those that are carbon copies of my previous work (and mostly Marshalls previous work).



 I'm already second guessing my soldering skills and I've been soldering since I was a kid, but soldering on those turrets was a lot harder than I thought it would be.


----------



## DirtySteve

brp said:


> Great job, Steve, I knew it would be cuz I think I knew as well as you that you weren't going to post pics of less than proper work, first build or not.
> 
> That board very dramatically illustrates what a pretender hack job was sold to you in a way that's really almost unbelievable.



Yes, I wouldn't have taken this on if I didn't believe that, that was the whole point. thanks bro. I'm just thankful that there are some awesome guys around here that believed in me enough to take the time and effort to coach me along. Without that I would have had to take it to a tech (IF I could find one willing to take it on) just to make it safe and after all I've learned, I probably would have spent a lot more cash than I have to rebuild it. 

(not including all the extra shipping charges..I think I've spent more on shipping than I did parts! )

For someone that barely even knew there was a workbench section on the forum, I'm still blown away and humbled by that.


----------



## damienbeale

It's not my soldering skills that I question, it's more my ability to think clearly, since I am easily distracted.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

brp said:


> Great job, Steve, I knew it would be cuz I think I knew as well as you that you weren't going to post pics of less than proper work, first build or not.
> 
> That board very dramatically illustrates what a pretender hack job was sold to you in a way that's really almost unbelievable.


 

Almost unbelievable is an exact description of the two different boards.


----------



## DirtySteve

I was going to post a side by side shot of the 2 boards the other night, but that wouldn't be fair considering what I had to do to the original board to identify values. It looks even worse than it did.


----------



## Far Rider

Steve, *TAKE YOUR TIME*. Nothing will frustrate your more than hurrying and possibly missing something that might end up with meltdown. I hear what your are saying about pushing yourself. I have that problem too. But I have always used the old carpenters rule of thumb: Measure twice, cut once. That little adage has saved me more times than I can count. We are all excited for you and can't wait for you to flip the switch, but not a one of us wants you move faster than what you feel is comfortable.


----------



## Magictwanger

That thing was a mess! You sure have made a difference. Your work looks stellar. Good luck when you "flip the switch".


----------



## DirtySteve

I got my sockets today and they fit good, I also got my missing cap and I have 4 days off. that's it, nothing left to do but put it all together...wish me luck.


----------



## 66 galaxie

Good luck


----------



## 2203xman

Steve,sounds like the perfect way to spend your holiday break.That is going to be one bad ass machine.I love the white cab boxes,and with the knobs,and faceplate,that thing is gorgeous too!


----------



## minerman

Good luck brother, hope it all goes as planned....keep us posted, I'm still keeping up with the progress even if I don't post very much...


----------



## DirtySteve

Thanks guys, I've already been working on it this morning.


----------



## rmroza

Steve will have this bitch going this weekend. The board looks great and clean. Can't wait. Now THIS is what a one-off "prototype" is supposed to me like.

Happy Thanksgiving Steve and everyone!


----------



## DirtySteve

Thanks Robb, hope you all had a great day! I just got home and I'm stuffed! Turns out I have to work tomorrow. It probably won't be all day though, but we had several new jobs come in this week and I have to work up some bid drawings to get a little ahead for next week. I'll still have plenty of time.


----------



## bulldozer1984

DirtySteve said:


> Thanks Robb, hope you all had a great day! I just got home and I'm stuffed! Turns out I have to work tomorrow. It probably won't be all day though, but we had several new jobs come in this week and I have to work up some bid drawings to get a little ahead for next week. I'll still have plenty of time.



What kind of drafting do you Steve ? As in. what do you draw ??


----------



## DirtySteve

bulldozer1984 said:


> What kind of drafting do you Steve ? As in. what do you draw ??



I'm a structural draftsman. I draw everything from pole barns to condos The company I work for mostly does horse barns and storage buildings and such, but lately we've been getting into a lot more house's and commercial building. We do a lot of work for theme parks around the area like Legoland, Busch Gardens, Lowery park zoo in Tampa and stuff like that. 

We just built the largest pole barn in the US that covers 4.2 acres in Fellsmere FL for a huge shrimp farm operation. http://www.veronews.com/news/fellsmere/spotlight/colossal-shrimp-farm-in-fellsmere-breaks-ground-on-facility/article_0dfc4e42-b0f3-11e2-9771-0019bb30f31a.html

_"Located near SunAg where County Road 512 makes the sharp turn south toward State Road 60, Florida Organic Aquaculture is busy building what is being hailed as the nation’s largest pole-barn, a 4.2-acre structure the length of 3.5 football fields. The structure will be utilized for growing the shrimp and other aquatic organisms."_

...built from my drawings, but did I get any credit from it? Nooooo! My bosses are all driving around in brand new $70,000 trucks living like kings and I didn't get a bonus or anything. ....the biggest job they've ever done. *sigh*


----------



## charveldan

don't forget to triple solder for max conductance ...


----------



## DirtySteve

Oh yeah, I'll be done tomorrow me thinks...or very close. I only had a few hours this afternoon and made good progress I think.


----------



## bulldozer1984

Steve, are you a fraud ? Like a guy who decided to show pics of his first amp build to gain notoriety as a really talented guy that kicks ass on his first build - but really it aint his first build ??


----------



## DirtySteve

Thanks man. I just have some great coaches is all. My only advantage is I'm very familiar with a soldering iron and detail work. I'm an artist and a perfectionist. I was a phone guy in the military for 10 years and ran thousands of wires and cables and it had to look professional. I've done a lot of wiring in my days, just not on an amp.

You think I would have bought that mess if I could build my own?


----------



## Holme

By the time Steve's finished he'll be putting BB out of business!!!

Dirty Steve's JDH Bolt?!


----------



## DirtySteve

He was supposed to launch in October...


----------



## mg1987

Very nice job on the build.


----------



## charveldan

DirtySteve said:


> He was supposed to launch in October...



[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GbcAIqjX9TM]Russian Rocket Crashes - RAW FOOTAGE HD - YouTube[/ame]

Houston, we have a problem ...


----------



## bulldozer1984

The only thing that has launched since November is his cholesterol


----------



## Far Rider

Somehow it doesn't look the same without gobs of goop.

And that my friend, is a GOOD thing.


----------



## charveldan

bulldozer1984 said:


> The only thing that has launched since November is his cholesterol
> 
> MOD EDIT.


----------



## Stringjunkie

Dude, just because he built a sloppy amp doesn't mean you should call for his death. Geez..


----------



## charveldan

Stringjunkie said:


> Dude, just because he built a sloppy amp doesn't mean you should call for his death. Geez..


Yes, yes it does. 

One less cheesball douchebag makes for a happier world.

In case u haven't noticed, nobody gets outta this world alive.


----------



## damienbeale

charveldan said:


> Yes, yes it does.
> 
> One less cheesball douchebag makes for a happier world.
> 
> In case u haven't noticed, nobody gets outta this world alive.



Dan, that is pretty despicable.
Billy might be a deluded waste of space, but he is a boys father. Assuming he doesn't mistreat that child in any way, do you honestly believe that child is better off without that cheeseball douchebag?

It'd be nice if he never picked up a soldering iron ever again, but I couldn't wish ill against the fool.


----------



## 66 galaxie

Its looking good Steve!
Cant wait til you fire it up


----------



## MartyStrat54

Let's not get heated up talking about Billy. This is Steve's thread.


----------



## Ghostman

MartyStrat54 said:


> Let's not get heated up talking about Billy. This is Steve's thread.



But it's cold where I'm at right now. And I don't want to turn on the heater.


----------



## charveldan

damienbeale said:


> Dan, that is pretty despicable.
> Billy might be a deluded waste of space, but he is a boys father. Assuming he doesn't mistreat that child in any way, do you honestly believe that child is better off without that cheeseball douchebag?
> 
> It'd be nice if he never picked up a soldering iron ever again, but I couldn't wish ill against the fool.


This is Steve's thread and he's doing a marvelous job. 

As for scumbags, just turned 50 and have no time or sympathy for those who choose to be part of the problem rather than part of the solution.


----------



## damienbeale

charveldan said:


> This is Steve's thread and he's doing a marvelous job.
> 
> As for scumbags, just turned 50 and have no time or sympathy for those who choose to be part of the problem rather than part of the solution.



That's not the point. Wishing somebody dead, especially when they have a dependant family, makes you a piece of crap in my honest opinion. Not that you asked for it, of course, but I'll happily give it anyway.


MAAARTY... cleanup time... this post included I fully expect.


----------



## charveldan

goodbye damien, you've become part of the problem. 

might suggest fresh air & sunshine once a millennium.


----------



## damienbeale

charveldan said:


> goodbye damien, you've become part of the problem.
> 
> might suggest fresh air & sunshine once a millennium.



"Part of the problem"...

What, you honestly think that everybody who doesn't conform to your idea of how a person should behave should die, perhaps?

Perhaps Hitler had it right, all along... Is that what you're saying?


----------



## bulldozer1984

LOL.. Yeh the guy is a deluded wanker but i don't wish death upon him. A little harsh..

And yes it is Steve's thread but unfortunately the saga of Billy Blades will be rehashed throughout any thread where Steve's amp is the subject matter.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

The bottom line is no matter how bad a job was done on the amp, it's getting redone right now, professionally, and built with pride.


----------



## DirtySteve

I can't believe I'm saying this, but I'm done for today. I tried, but I'm at the point now where I'm starting to get tired and I'm starting to screw up, I just burned the shit out of my finger replacing a wire I burned the sheath on. I'm going cross eyed and I feel like I'm getting a cold (sinuses and sore throat) and feel like crap. :frown: I'm literally only 7 wires away, but it's not worth ****ing something up now. 

...but the good news is I still have tomorrow and I'm only 7 wires away!


----------



## Magictwanger

Wow!


----------



## bulldozer1984

Looking great Steve !


----------



## Rocktane

That looks amazing Steve!


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Somewhere in Maryland Billy's flopping like a fish on the floor! He never thought anyone could figure out his amp, much less build it 10 times better than he did. Payback is a Bitch, ain't it? Justice served. Yeah Baby!!!! Way to pay it back Steve!!!!


----------



## 66 galaxie

Looks great Steve 
Good call knowing when to walk away too. You'll get it tomorrow.


----------



## DirtySteve

Thanks dudes...can't wait to flip the switch tomorrow!!


----------



## john l

Been out of town for the last few days. Looks like Dans still a complete idiot and Steves still totally killing it! That thing is all business my friend way to go.


----------



## RussBert

DirtySteve said:


> Thanks dudes...can't wait to flip the switch tomorrow!!





Do you have a light bulb current limiter?


They sure are handy to have if when you do flip the switch and something isn't right...


----------



## solarburn

DirtySteve said:


> Thanks dudes...can't wait to flip the switch tomorrow!!



Wow Steve good job and you're ready to fire it up already? Awesome!


----------



## RussBert

Great save, Steve! It's so cool to see the best this community has to offer come together and make it happen!


----------



## DirtySteve

RussBert said:


> Do you have a light bulb current limiter?
> 
> 
> They sure are handy to have if when you do flip the switch and something isn't right...



No I don't. I have some knowledgeable eyes looking at some close up shots and I'm waiting on a reply, If he doesn't see anything (or when I fix what he sees) I'm going to cross my fingers and flip the switch, then I'll go from there.


----------



## minerman

Looks really professional Steve, you sure you ain't done this before????

IMO, if you're so tired you're seeing cross-eyed, it is without a doubt, time to put it away for a few hours & get some rest....I get the same way working on a song/mix, & when I get like that, I'll do things that I usually wouldn't, so yeah, take a break until tomorrow, have a beer (or 3) & relax dude....

Can't wait to hear it man, you are gonna record some clips, right???

Either way, you've handled this like a MAN, my hat's off to ya.......


----------



## DirtySteve

minerman said:


> Looks really professional Steve, you sure you ain't done this before????
> 
> IMO, if you're so tired you're seeing cross-eyed, it is without a doubt, time to put it away for a few hours & get some rest....I get the same way working on a song/mix, & when I get like that, I'll do things that I usually wouldn't, so yeah, take a break until tomorrow, have a beer (or 3) & relax dude....
> 
> Can't wait to hear it man, you are gonna record some clips, right???
> 
> Either way, you've handled this like a MAN, my hat's off to ya.......



Done! I feel much better now and it's all I can do not to go turn on the soldering iron, but I'm going to hold off. 

As far as a recording, I don't know yet...we'll see. 

..guess which tube is going in the PI first.


----------



## MartyStrat54

How about if I donate some tubes to the cause, Steve?

That nice of an amp should have some good glass in it.

PM me your address. I think I can also throw in a pair of TAD EL84's if you like.


----------



## DirtySteve

Wow really!?! I don't even know what to say. Thanks Marty, I'll send you a PM and tell you what I have now.


----------



## 66 galaxie

Marty = Cool


----------



## Micky

Nice one Marty.


----------



## solarburn

Awesome Marty!


----------



## john l

Damn decent of you sir.


----------



## minerman

Very cool Marty!!!!! Just goes to show what a great bunch of guys this forum has....Very cool!!!

Steve, I'd almost forgotten about the tube I traded with you man, FFS, I play the Ibby daily with the p'up... Can you say......
S-C-A-T-T-E-R-B-R-A-I-N 

I know what you mean about the "keep going" thing though Steve, I've been working on a new song basically all day, & while I've got a lot done, I think it's time to close the daw & do something else on my end too....

I'll be watching for some new posts here from you man, I'm pretty excited myself, can only imagine how stoked you are!!!

On the recording, hell, your phone's got a camera doesn't it??? 

Keep us posted Steve!!!!


----------



## DirtySteve

minerman said:


> Very cool Marty!!!!! Just goes to show what a great bunch of guys this forum has....Very cool!!!
> 
> Steve, I'd almost forgotten about the tube I traded with you man, FFS, I play the Ibby daily with the p'up... Can you say......
> S-C-A-T-T-E-R-B-R-A-I-N
> 
> I know what you mean about the "keep going" thing though Steve, I've been working on a new song basically all day, & while I've got a lot done, I think it's time to close the daw & do something else on my end too....
> 
> I'll be watching for some new posts here from you man, I'm pretty excited myself, can only imagine how stoked you are!!!
> 
> On the recording, hell, your phone's got a camera doesn't it???
> 
> Keep us posted Steve!!!!



You know whats funny? I was going through some stuff a few months ago and I found another CC that I'd forgotten all about. It's a zebra. I lmao when I realized what it was. I had no idea I still had it, I thought it went with a guitar I sold. As soon as I saw it I remembered I swapped it out before I sold the guitar.  You don't want another one do ya?

...and dude, yes I'm super stoked, but I'm also nervous as hell!


----------



## minerman

DirtySteve said:


> You know whats funny? I was going through some stuff a few months ago and I found another CC that I'd forgotten all about. It's a zebra. I lmao when I realized what it was. I had no idea I still had it, I thought it went with a guitar I sold. As soon as I saw it I remembered I swapped it out before I sold the guitar.  You don't want another one do ya?
> 
> ...and dude, yes I'm super stoked, but I'm also nervous as hell!


 
Dunno man, I've already got one in the bridge of the Ibby, I tried it in the Strat & it just didn't sound good....You reckon it'd work in the neck of the Ibby (tone-wise that is, I'm pretty confident about changing a p'up..... now...)??? Lemme know what you think, & we may work something out dude....


I wish I'd kept the other audio interface I had (Tascam US-122), I'd send it to you so you could get your feet wet in the recording thing, but I gave it to my nephew last year....I don't think he's ever even used it, I might try to get it back....

Keep us posted on the amp dude, I'm really curious to see (& hear if possible) how it turns out....It looks 100% better already Steve, nice-n-clean, very pro looking if you ask me....Looks as good on the inside as my Egnater or DSL-1 to be totally honest...actually better, your's is all hand wired/soldered, my amps are graphics cards from a '98 Dell laptop...

I don't think there's a reason in the world to be nervous man, I'm sure when you fire it up, only thing that's gonna smoke, burn, or flame up will be the tones coming from it....


----------



## shooto

really nice job Steve...I know I can't speak for you, but if this were my experience, after all the shock and frustration of the product I got... I would probably be thankful that I got it in that condition...because it sent me on a journey to learn something I didn't know before, do something I have never done and in the end, have something I could really be proud of for the experience of it


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Nice call Marty, well done ! I have helped look over the wiring, just one reversed polarity to change, other than the last 7 wires, it looks ready to go.


----------



## clutch71

I've been watching this and previous threads related to this amp. 

All I have to say is that the guidance, knowledge, and donations of Guitar-Rocker, Damienbeale, rmroza, and, Marty is a total class act. 

I've been a member of this forum for quite some time. I've seen a lot of members come and go...some good, some bad, some missed, some not so much IMO. Threads like these are what keep me coming back.

ALso a special thanks to the mods for keeping this thread alive and on track!

Great Job Steve, keep up the good work!


----------



## Grenade

The latest posts are the best thing I could have read today.


----------



## 2203xman

Good morning,Steve,is today the day?Bet your working on it right now!When you start building them for sale,I want one!


----------



## Grenade

Damn, I guess I'm second in line.


----------



## 2203xman

Yeah this thread makes me realize the time and patience that goes into a build.Respect to Steve,Terry,and all the builders out there with the skill,and nerves for this tedious work.I know Steve doesn't like to post vids,but maybe he'll give us a chord or two.....you know it's 'gonna kill.


----------



## DirtySteve

Guitar-Rocker said:


> Nice call Marty, well done ! I have helped look over the wiring, just one reversed polarity to change, other than the last 7 wires, it looks ready to go.



Yeah, I miscounted last night and missed one there are 8 wires left.

I put one set of diodes in backwards somehow and Terry caught it. I might not have so I'm really glad you looked it over for me.

Guys as luck would have it I'm sick as a dog this morning. It was coming on all day yesterday and it kicked my ass last night. I'm hoping I feel better after some coffee and a bite to eat. Then I'll get started and finish this thing up!


----------



## paul-e-mann

Today is the day Steve! I'm psyched man! You could potentially have this ready to fire up by lunch time today


----------



## DirtySteve

Thanks everyone! I really appreciate all your support and kudos. I'm actually as shocked as you guys are that it came out this nice.


----------



## Grenade

Steve, our bass players sister has bees and I get local honey from her. Every morning in my coffee or tea keeps my sinuses in check, it really helps the singing voice too.


----------



## john l

DirtySteve said:


> Thanks everyone! I really appreciate all your support and kudos. I'm actually as shocked as you guys are that it came out this nice.


 
You're an animal man. Have coffee, eat breakfast, have more coffee and fire up your iron.


----------



## DirtySteve

It's done!!!...now the moment of truth.


----------



## DirtySteve

Don't get too excited just yet, there's a problem...


----------



## Ghostman

...it's not a problem. It's an opportunity to learn and advance your amp building skills.

Stay positive.


----------



## john l

DirtySteve said:


> Don't get too excited just yet, there's a problem...


 
There always is with a ground up build buddy. Now you get to learn how to trouble shoot and this is where things get fun. What is it or is it not doing? Tubes lit up? Do you hear any air comming out of you're cab? Did you remember to install your fuses? Bleed it down down take a minute and give it the evil eye. Its going to be a simple mis wire more than likely. If everything looks good after you really look it over its time to take voltages.


----------



## DirtySteve

Tubes lit up, but there was loud hum when I flipped the stand by off with the volume turned all the way down. At least I didn't see smoke or smell anything funny.


----------



## Gene Ballzz

Steve & All,
I've been following daily and have not had anything truly constructive to share or add, but I must give you a big  for such nice sanitary work, and fairly quick to boot! I'm keepin' my fingers crossed for ya that doing a full-on "hard" fire up without a preliminary "soft" fire up won't bite you in the wazoo! Been keepin my comments to a minimum, as my brain has been closely focused on my new and up coming build and I did not want to clutter your awesome "resurrection" thread with my issues. I can only hope to get even 10% as detailed support when I start! Have a happy fire up and I hope your cold, etc. clears up enough for you to enjoy the fruits of your labor.
My ,
Gene


----------



## john l

Were any of your power tubes redplating? Was anything plugged in the input?


----------



## Gene Ballzz

YEAH,
NO SMOKE and some sort of sound at the speakers are both good things and even a "loud hum" is really much better than absolutely nothing! Likely a misplaced or forgotten ground somewhere. I'll leave it to the pros here to coach you on where/how to start looking/testing. Don't get discouraged, as I'm pretty certain that even the experts here encounter an occasional issue or two on many of their fire ups. Great job so far man!
Keep Up The Good Work,
Gene


----------



## paul-e-mann

Red and blue wires from the transformer to the power tubes are backwards? Could cause a loud hum.


----------



## Alabama Thunderpussy

pedecamp said:


> Red and blue wires from the transformer to the power tubes are backwards? Could cause a loud hum.



Not in my experience. You sometimes get the unmistakable banshee squeal when the primary wires are backwards.


----------



## charveldan

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QuoKNZjr8_U[/ame]


green & white make smoke ...


----------



## john l

charveldan said:


> One less cheesball douchebag makes for a happier world.


 

Clears throat.


----------



## paul-e-mann

pedecamp said:


> Red and blue wires from the transformer to the power tubes are backwards? Could cause a loud hum.





Alabama Thunderpussy said:


> Not in my experience. You sometimes get the unmistakable banshee squeal when the primary wires are backwards.



I have no experience....the amp kit I have has a footnote saying if these wires are backwards it makes a motorboat sound and switch the wires around to fix it. Its just a thought.


----------



## 66 galaxie

Steve, whats up? Curious cat is curious lol


----------



## damienbeale

pedecamp said:


> I have no experience....the amp kit I have has a footnote saying if these wires are backwards it makes a motorboat sound and switch the wires around to fix it. Its just a thought.



Motorboating is oscillation and instability. Not hum.


----------



## DirtySteve

When I flip the stand by off I get a super loud (like, full volume) hum. It sounds awful! Terry has been helping me check stuff all day, but we haven't found it yet. If I pull the V3 tube (PI) it goes away. So far haven't found anything shorted or wired wrong.

I don't know...


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Everything looks spot on, and I think we are both getting a headache from looking. I asked Steve to chop stick too, no change in hum.


----------



## DirtySteve

Another thing, in case it might ring a bell with someone. When I turn on the power one of the power tubes flashes really bright and then dims back down. It was V5 all day until I removed the zener mod from the circuit and then it was V4 that flashes bright. It doesn't matter which tube is in which position.


----------



## charveldan

I know a good amp tech who does tattoos ... :deadhorse:


----------



## DirtySteve

Guitar-Rocker said:


> Everything looks spot on, and I think we are both getting a headache from looking. I asked Steve to chop stick too, no change in hum.



Sorry Terry, (for the headache, lol) especially on a Sunday!! Thanks for taking the time to help me out today. I hope it didn't keep you from anything. I sure appreciate it. It has to be something simple, it has to be.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

When the problem is found, it'll be something that was a easy overlook, I'm sure.


----------



## 66 galaxie

Hope you guys get it figured out


----------



## damienbeale

DirtySteve said:


> Another thing, in case it might ring a bell with someone. When I turn on the power one of the power tubes flashes really bright and then dims back down. It was V5 all day until I removed the zener mod from the circuit and then it was V4 that flashes bright. It doesn't matter which tube is in which position.


Given that is all part of the heater string, I would say that is totally unrelated.


----------



## Micky

Time to start measuring voltages at the test points...


----------



## shredless

could you have damaged a tube with the diodes in backward?

just thinking the obvious instead of flexing any "tech" muscles


----------



## DirtySteve

No, caught the diodes before I ever put a tube in it and turned it on.


----------



## bulldozer1984

Steve. Please call Blades Amplification support before taking this any further.


----------



## 2203xman

Sounds like you may have to do something drastic...call out sick tomorrow!Hang in there,you're almost there man.


----------



## Alabama Thunderpussy

I think you've voided your warranty.


----------



## TwinACStacks

damienbeale said:


> Motorboating is oscillation and instability. Not hum.



 Very Loud motorboating.

 TWIN


----------



## TwinACStacks

DirtySteve said:


> It's done!!!...now the moment of truth.



 It's Good Steve. Not quite as avant garde' as Blades approach but it will work.....

 TWIN


----------



## DirtySteve




----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Found the problem, I think, and sent Steve an e-mail to check it out, missing a B+ feed.


----------



## johnfv

Guitar-Rocker said:


> Found the problem, I think, and sent Steve an e-mail to check it out, missing a B+ feed.



Hoping you nailed it Terry. You have definitely been a hero here!


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Well, that wasn't it either, as there was a wire under another that I couldn't see in the photos.


----------



## scat7s

sounds like its in the power amp, yes? 

full volume hum and all


----------



## solarburn

The power tubes are known good? Work in another amp if you have one. I have had bad power tubes cause loud humming. Even a bad preamp tube cause loud humming instead of ringing microphonically. Tubes were ruled out already?

That's as much knowledge I have in this hunt.LOL


----------



## rmroza

Holy Crap, I'm away for a day or two and miss a ton of postings. Ok, sound like you guys worked pretty hard on this and are getting tired. I wasn't cc'ed on the resent communications. Shoot me the pics so I can see what the heck is going on. We need to ensure the interconnects under the board. Also stupid question, but did you have something plugged into the input on while you took it off standby?? My "Old Bitch" makes a HELL of a sound if SOMETHING isn't plugged into it! Other than that, it's cool. 

Let me know. I'll review the last draft and connections and ensure everything is hooked up, then verify to print.


----------



## Gene Ballzz

I can't zoom in tight enough to see clearly, without getting a blurry picture! I might suggest removing first, the shielded wire from the input jack AT THE VI TUBE SOCKET and the try the other shielded wire from the pot to the tube socket. Many kinds of shielded wire can easily short (shield to hot) from just a tad too much heat from soldering or heat shrinking. If this is actually the issue, the hum should vanish by just removing V1.Being that you describe you problem as "a super loud (like, full volume) hum," I kind of expect the problem to be early in the preamp so as the hum is "well" amplified.
Just A Few Thoughts,
Gene


----------



## DirtySteve

Sorry Robb, I thought you were on vacation or something since you weren't around and it just happened the way it did. I didn't mean to leave you out of the loop. I forwarded the close up shots to you.

Gene, I think maybe you might be on to something, the one going to the gain pot looks a little iffy. I'll check it in a little while.

I did call in sick today, but not because of this. I genuinely feel like crap today. I can't shake this thing...

Thanks everyone, we'll figure it out. I'm not worried.


----------



## TwinACStacks

DirtySteve said:


> Sorry Robb, I thought you were on vacation or something since you weren't around and it just happened the way it did. I didn't mean to leave you out of the loop. I forwarded the close up shots to you.
> 
> Gene, I think maybe you might be on to something, the one going to the gain pot looks a little iffy. I'll check it in a little while.
> 
> I did call in sick today, but not because of this. I genuinely feel like crap today. I can't shake this thing...
> 
> Thanks everyone, we'll figure it out. I'm not worried.



 You must get better Steve. Life on this planet as we know it hangs in the balance of the outcome of this rebuild....

Take one for Mother Earth.

 TWIN


----------



## Micky

Here is the original circuit diagram for troubleshooting purposes:


----------



## charveldan

LOLOLOLOLOLOL !!!!!!!! ^^^^^^


----------



## john l

Micky said:


> Here is the original circuit diagram for troubleshooting purposes:


 

LMAO! That could be one of the funniest things Ive ever seen.


----------



## DirtySteve

rmroza said:


> Holy Crap, I'm away for a day or two and miss a ton of postings. Ok, sound like you guys worked pretty hard on this and are getting tired. I wasn't cc'ed on the resent communications. Shoot me the pics so I can see what the heck is going on. We need to ensure the interconnects under the board. Also stupid question, but did you have something plugged into the input on while you took it off standby?? My "Old Bitch" makes a HELL of a sound if SOMETHING isn't plugged into it! Other than that, it's cool.
> 
> Let me know. I'll review the last draft and connections and ensure everything is hooked up, then verify to print.



Forgot to mention that I checked all the under board wires and they are all there and correct with my drawing. I also tried it both with a guitar plugged in and without anything in the input and it didn't make any difference.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

john l said:


> LMAO! That could be one of the funniest things Ive ever seen.


 
That's rich !!!!!!! I needed a grin this morning.


----------



## charveldan

Hey Steve, what happens if the amp sounds like total dogsh*t ?

Might I suggest a "how to blow up an amplifier" youtube video.


----------



## john l

"Not a resistor wire just does this"


----------



## TwinACStacks

The place where it says touch tongue here must be the Bias points?

 TWIN


----------



## DirtySteve

Ok, the shielded wire going to the gain pot was definitely questionable. I redid it and I know it's good now. I'm going to go ahead and redo the other one going to the input (even though it looks good) and then give it another try.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

The two gray wires going to the two gain pots will need to be shielded too, or shortened as much as possible, I'm pretty sure.


----------



## DirtySteve

I don't have anymore shielded wire. In fact I never ordered any and had a real "oh shit!" moment when I got to that point in my wiring. I had to reuse what was in there before. luckily they were longer than they need to be and I had some slack. I will shorten those grey wires and hope that good enough for now.


----------



## DirtySteve

That wasn't it...


----------



## charveldan




----------



## Gene Ballzz

The reason I suggested leaving those two wires disconnected from the tube pins is that it eliminates several items from the circuit, not just the wires themselves. Let's take a logical look at what you've already discovered and what to look at next:
A-Removing V3 (PI) stops the hum. This tells you the issue is likely prior to it in the signal flow.
B-Try removing V2 with all other tubes in and see what happens. If hum persists, the issue is between V2 & V3. If hum is gone, the problem is prior to V2.
C-Do the same with V1.

This tube removal, in effect, helps you kind of break down the preamp circuit into smaller groupings of components/connections for narrowing the search, without having to actually unsolder anything. When you get to the earliest tube that stops your hum, you may want to swap in a different tube, as you might simply be chasing your tail over a faulty tube. Probably not that simple/easy, but it IS possible.
Just My ,
Gene


----------



## Alabama Thunderpussy

This is also assuming the preamp tubes themselves are known to be good? As Gene already hinted, the problem could very well be the simplest - preamp tube failure. It's best to rule that out first instead of going down to near-engineer level troubleshooting before hitting a wall and starting back at square one only to realize ockham's razor has struck once again.


----------



## solarburn

I think I mentioned that just a few posts back. Phuckn techs...


----------



## Alabama Thunderpussy

solarburnDSL50 said:


> I think I mentioned that just a few posts back. Phuckn techs...



When a thread is this long, sometimes the best I can hope for is to catch the key posts and hope I didn't miss anything. Occasionally, it still happens.


----------



## Gene Ballzz

+1 What He (ATP) Said! Most new fire up issues boil down to just one or two simple (often D'OH) problems. The real trick is tracking it/them down! I certainly don't claim to be an experienced/great tech, but a logical approach to troubleshooting works well for me and usually teaches me something along the way and helps me hone my skills. Not to discount that this forum allows an inside glimpse of many awesomely experienced techs' trials, successes and errors, which provide a fantastic learning opportunity. 6 months ago, I would never have dreamed of building even a kit amp, but now I'm playing through one and confident enough to tackle my first "from scratch" build. You folks are awesome!
Gene


----------



## solarburn

You know I'm jus bustn chops. You guys are gonna get this figured out. If it could only be as easy as a bad tube...


----------



## DirtySteve

Gene Ballzz said:


> The reason I suggested leaving those two wires disconnected from the tube pins is that it eliminates several items from the circuit, not just the wires themselves. Let's take a logical look at what you've already discovered and what to look at next:
> A-Removing V3 (PI) stops the hum. This tells you the issue is likely prior to it in the signal flow.
> B-Try removing V2 with all other tubes in and see what happens. If hum persists, the issue is between V2 & V3. If hum is gone, the problem is prior to V2.
> C-Do the same with V1.
> 
> This tube removal, in effect, helps you kind of break down the preamp circuit into smaller groupings of components/connections for narrowing the search, without having to actually unsolder anything. When you get to the earliest tube that stops your hum, you may want to swap in a different tube, as you might simply be chasing your tail over a faulty tube. Probably not that simple/easy, but it IS possible.
> Just My ,
> Gene



Hey Gene, I have not tried removing the wires from the socket, but I did pull each preamp tube starting with V1 and only when I got to V3 did the hum go away.


----------



## charveldan

22 pages about an amp that doesn't work ...


BTW shouldn't this be in the "other amps" category ?


----------



## damienbeale

Hmmm, as a thread about a work in progress, requiring input and help from others, no, I definitely think Workbench is the right place for it.
Nobody said workbench had to be Marshall as far as I can tell...


----------



## 66 galaxie

Dan, if you dont like it, dont read it.


----------



## charveldan

66 galaxie said:


> Dan, if you dont like it, dont read it.


Observations bro.

Im into old Marshalls & Les Pauls.

blades amps don't do a thing for me.

Must say the dramas been going for weeks tho.


----------



## DirtySteve

What drama??? You're the only one being negative here.


----------



## Gene Ballzz

Yeah,
I don't think Dan's being to hard on us, just strikes me as a detail oriented kinda guy, some may call it nit picking and others would call it observing details! I have noted that many of the techs/musicians I know tend to be fairly opinionated and seemingly dick headed and it just seems to come with the territory for individuals who at least work towards striving for excellence.
Gene


----------



## MartyStrat54

This thread is right where it is supposed to be.

And I don't think you can call it a Blade's amp anymore. All Steve used is the transformers and the chassis.

While the aim of all those involved was to keep the "theme" of the amp as a Jose based amp, the components used are much better quality and it is not the same amp as the one Steve originally bought.


----------



## damienbeale

When is a Blades amp not a Blades amp? And in reality could it ever have been called a Blades amp in the first place since it sure as hell wasn't his circuit...

The only part that you could attribute to Blades was all the cock-ups. 
But if this whole thing doesn't do anything for you, Dan, why the hell are you here?

Jus' sayin'...


----------



## Ghostman

charveldan said:


>



I pissed myself this was so damn funny. Perfectly timed jokes are why I live on this earth.


----------



## scat7s

V3 is the only tube that eliminates the hum when pulled. 

have you tried a different tube in V3?

have you tried different pwr tubes? 

steve, is this amp cathode biased or fixed?


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

cathode bias


----------



## Alabama Thunderpussy

I bet an artificial CT on the heater string would help quiet it down.

But you should check component values on V3, and verify that your presence pot is wired correctly.


----------



## DirtySteve

Yes Scat, I've swapped all the tubes out to verify they are good.


----------



## rmroza

Well, I don't see anything yet. Just going on the underboard wiring done right. I requested a voltage check of various things. Yes, the components are pretty killer!  I also seen the gray wires and the one from gain 2 to the C13/R13 junction should be shielded from the gain side (actually you labelled gain 1 in your layout) just like the grids. Yes, it's cathode biased, just like the original from BB....but with the correct B+ string for 18w application.

I hope and wish Steve has extra tubes. There may be a problem with them. I suggested maybe a WebEx video conference and we could possibly work in real time to expedite things.

We'll see what happens. Get some rest and get well soon Steve so you can enjoy this thing. 

Also the 1nF bright cap is optional. Since you dont have switchable brights, you might want to try different values 250pF to 2200pF or not use at all.


----------



## charveldan

My apologies to Steve if he's offended.

Would like to see/hear this amp.


----------



## john l

charveldan said:


> 22 pages about an amp that doesn't work ...
> 
> 
> BTW shouldn't this be in the "other amps" category ?


 
50 years of wasted life on a guy that cant play for shit and aspires to be Friedmans blow up doll... 

The threads fine, your in the wrong forum


----------



## Ghostman

Did you try turning it off then on again?


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

rmroza said:


> Well, I don't see anything yet. Just going on the underboard wiring done right. I requested a voltage check of various things. Yes, the components are pretty killer!  I also seen the gray wires and the one from gain 2 to the C13/R13 junction should be shielded from the gain side (actually you labelled gain 1 in your layout) just like the grids. Yes, it's cathode biased, just like the original from BB....but with the correct B+ string for 18w application.
> 
> I hope and wish Steve has extra tubes. There may be a problem with them. I suggested maybe a WebEx video conference and we could possibly work in real time to expedite things.
> 
> We'll see what happens. Get some rest and get well soon Steve so you can enjoy this thing.
> 
> Also the 1nF bright cap is optional. Since you dont have switchable brights, you might want to try different values 250pF to 2200pF or not use at all.





Some input: Steve did some voltage checks:

356 at standby
338 after the 2.2K dropping resistor
311 at screens
290 after 8.2K dropping resistor
210 after final 27k dropping resistor

I spoke with Steve on the phone, listened to the hum, which sounded to me like the OT out of phase. Had Steve swap the blue and brown wires on the OT. Fired it back up. It made a sound like a washing machine extremely out of balance. Since then, Steve removed the clipping diodes, was able to get sound out of the amp, not at full volume or the correct gain for a while, then the washing machine came back


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

I'm wondering if the sag mod was somehow not set up right, and if it could have damaged a power tube. That mod is currently not in the circuit. The ability to finally get some sound out of the amp lends me to believe the OT was out of phase, and there is a lingering power problem. Heaters are @ 6.5v.


----------



## DirtySteve

After I sent you that message and you said it sounds like it could be a tube issue now, I swapped out all the tubes and tried it again with the same results. I have 2 sets of el84s and several 12ax7s.


----------



## johnfv

Ghostman said:


> Did you try turning it off then on again?


Well, at least THIS computer nerd chuckled.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Thanks Steve, out of ideas at the moment, sorry to be a lacky.


----------



## johnfv

Sorry to laugh at the jokes. Steve I'm confident you will get this sorted with the expert help here. Take your time...


----------



## DirtySteve

Guitar-Rocker said:


> Thanks Steve, out of ideas at the moment, sorry to be a lacky.



It's cool Terry! At least we're making progress. I'm done for tonight anyway. I have to go in tomorrow and my heads still stuffed up. I'm just glad the chills and sweating is over.


----------



## DirtySteve

charveldan said:


> My apologies to Steve if he's offended.
> 
> Would like to see/hear this amp.



It's ok Dan, but you are the only one that seems to be irritated about it. I was never on a schedule here really except for my own personal goals whether they worked out or not. It was my goal to get it wired up and flip the switch over the weekend and even with the flu, I did that. Now I actually get to learn something in trouble shooting this, what seems to be a unique, problem. I'm learning a lot through all of this and I think there are some guys here that are interested in the process. I'm not in any hurry really. 

Like I said more than once before, maybe by christmas.


----------



## RussBert

Can you verify the components on the board?


I've been known to put a 47 ohm where a 470k should go. It happens


----------



## DirtySteve

The components were all verified as they were installed.


----------



## RussBert

Is the hum affected by turning any of the knobs?


----------



## DirtySteve

No, but I think you might have missed something. Now we're dealing with low volume and low gain and then after about a minute (+/-) a popping sound, kind of sounds like a washing machine out of balance on the spin cycle.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

I've messaged Steve, and think the remaining sound stems from an oscillation problem. I gave him a couple of ideas to check out, maybe they will help.


----------



## DirtySteve

Joe, I just put 2 and 2 together, lol! I thought I answered you but I guess I didn't...sorry about that.


----------



## solarburn

No worries man. I'm glad you eliminated that. This thread is great. To me watching the techs figure this out with you is fascinating. Cool stuff. Can't wait to see what the issue is.


----------



## DirtySteve

solarburnDSL50 said:


> No worries man. I'm glad you eliminated that. This thread is great. To me watching the techs figure this out with you is fascinating. Cool stuff. Can't wait to see what the issue is.



That's what it's all about. Thanks man!


----------



## rmroza

Steve, do you have any clips so I/we can listen to it. I know Terry did. I'd like to hear it also. It also could be a compound issue.


----------



## john l

Steve Im sure you've posted that you've done this and Ive just missed it or forgotten but you've checked all your work with a meter set to resistance to rule out bad joints and stuff right. Don't rely on the beep function, that thing will beep even if the joint is making a half assed connection. I ask only because I went an embarrassingly long time without knowing this and ran into a lot of problems when I first started tinkering.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

I've tossed out a couple of other things to look at too. Maybe it's one of those


----------



## DirtySteve

Hahahahahaha!!! Terry you're a GENIUS!!!


----------



## shredless

DirtySanchez said:


> Hahahahahaha!!! Terry you're a GENIUS!!!









does that mean its fixed?


----------



## MartyStrat54

I got Steve's tubes mailed out today. I was thinking how it would have been nice if I had a pair of Sylvania Black Plate EL84's to send, but I don't. However, those TAD's sound really nice.

Here is what Steve is getting:

NOS Canadian Mullard (by Philips)
NOS BEL India Mullard (by Philips)
USED 1959 Square Getter RCA
USED Raytheon Black Plate, Lopsided PI tube
NEW PAIR of TAD EL84's

That should be a good stash for Steve to roll.


----------



## damienbeale

DirtySteve said:


> No, but I think you might have missed something. Now we're dealing with low volume and low gain and then after about a minute (+/-) a popping sound, kind of sounds like a washing machine out of balance on the spin cycle.


Now this COULD be a filter cap with compromised dielectric, BUT I wouldn't expect it to wait a whole minute before failing to hold in this manner.


----------



## DirtySteve

shredless said:


> does that mean its fixed?



It means the problem has been isolated to the presence and I think it was my connection on the board. I removed the presence from the circuit as Terry suggested and played for about 15 or 20 minutes and it worked fine. So basically yes!  I've hooked it back up and reheated all the connections related and I'm warming it up to try it again now.


----------



## john l

So bad joint?


----------



## DirtySteve

No there's still a problem with the presence and resonance hooked up. Low volume and low gain. But I'm still excited because it works. I haven't played it in what 3 months now? This is huge.


----------



## brp

So how does she sound with the presence disconnected?


----------



## MartyStrat54

Cold beers all around!


----------



## damienbeale

And there was much rejoicing...
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yciX2meIkXI]And there was much rejoicing (yaaaaaaaay) - Monty Python & the Holy Grail - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## DirtySteve

MartyStrat54 said:


> Cold beers all around!



I'm buying!


----------



## DirtySteve

brp said:


> So how does she sound with the presence disconnected?



Wasn't really paying that much attention, I was just happy to be playing it.


----------



## TwinACStacks

DirtySteve said:


> Wasn't really paying that much attention, I was just happy to be playing it.



 You can't miss what you never had.

Congrats Steve.

 TWIN


----------



## DirtySteve

I miss read the question somehow. It sounds great without it, but I'd like it to be there I think.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

MartyStrat54 said:


> I got Steve's tubes mailed out today. I was thinking how it would have been nice if I had a pair of Sylvania Black Plate EL84's to send, but I don't. However, those TAD's sound really nice.
> 
> Here is what Steve is getting:
> 
> NOS Canadian Mullard (by Philips)
> NOS BEL India Mullard (by Philips)
> USED 1959 Square Getter RCA
> USED Raytheon Black Plate, Lopsided PI tube
> NEW PAIR of TAD EL84's
> 
> That should be a good stash for Steve to roll.


 

Wow Marty, I'm honored to be in the same company of you on this re-build. That was an unbelievable gesture !


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

MartyStrat54 said:


> Cold beers all around!





The only thing better than the amp finally firing up, are the two beers that I poked into the freezer about an hour ago. So thanks Marty, I'll have Dous!


----------



## brp

DirtySteve said:


> I miss read the question somehow. It sounds great without it, but I'd like it to be there I think.



Yes it would be great to have. Just curious how you liked it in general without it.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

I'm thinking the wire runs are too long for the Presence and Resonance pots, being they are in opposite corners and probably picking up everything, and the shielded cable that Steve has coming should take care of that problem.


----------



## brp

Is the cab for this head shielded ala Faraday at all?


----------



## MartyStrat54

Well at least it fires up. The problem is isolated and shouldn't be an issue to rectify.


----------



## MartyStrat54

Guitar-Rocker said:


> Wow Marty, I'm honored to be in the same company of you on this re-build. That was an unbelievable gesture !



Right back at you, Terry.


----------



## 2203xman

MartyStrat54 said:


> I got Steve's tubes mailed out today. I was thinking how it would have been nice if I had a pair of Sylvania Black Plate EL84's to send, but I don't. However, those TAD's sound really nice.
> 
> Here is what Steve is getting:
> 
> NOS Canadian Mullard (by Philips)
> NOS BEL India Mullard (by Philips)
> USED 1959 Square Getter RCA
> USED Raytheon Black Plate, Lopsided PI tube
> NEW PAIR of TAD EL84's
> 
> That should be a good stash for Steve to roll.



Nice stash.Maybe you should roll now! Congrats! Nice catch,Terry!


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

The remaining items item's to be sorted out won't be as bad. Steve had a monumental amount of patience to try suggestions, answer questions, and take photos for all the stuff that Robb and I were throwing at him. And all the while he was knocked down with the flu. Most first timers would have quit a long time ago. Thanks for putting up with our horde of try this and try that.


----------



## DirtySteve

Yeah Marty, I really don't know what to say. I'm still kind of in shock I think. I feel like I should at least pay the shipping, man. That's a very generous thing you did. 

The quality of some of the people on this forum is top notch and so rare these days. I'm humbled. Do you guys have any idea the amount of mojo that's built into this amp thanks to the generosity of some of you. And I'm not forgetting the ones that offered to help answer questions or donate things that I didn't take you up on. Blows me away!


----------



## 2203xman

DirtySteve said:


> This doesn't look too bad. Maybe I'll leave it like this and then only I will know the combination, lol. I could call it the "unknown solder" and get a POW/MIA badge for the cab.


Wanted to bump this.Very nice.


----------



## damienbeale

Guitar-Rocker said:


> I'm thinking the wire runs are too long for the Presence and Resonance pots, being they are in opposite corners and probably picking up everything, and the shielded cable that Steve has coming should take care of that problem.



Surely if it's a NFB loop, it's more that it is emitting the problem to elsewhere in the circuit rather than picking it up? This is why NFB lead dress is crucial. Not because it is prone, but because it itself is very noisy.

I'm assuming it's a NFB loop anyways...


----------



## DirtySteve

Guitar-Rocker said:


> The remaining items item's to be sorted out won't be as bad. Steve had a monumental amount of patience to try suggestions, answer questions, and take photos for all the stuff that Robb and I were throwing at him. And all the while he was knocked down with the flu. Most first timers would have quit a long time ago. Thanks for putting up with our horde of try this and try that.



You guys being that willing to help and take the time like you did is incredible to me. It was a lot of time! I'd have done anything to get you what you needed. I'll never be able to tell you how much I appreciate it!


----------



## DirtySteve

brp said:


> Is the cab for this head shielded ala Faraday at all?



I'm going to go with no, I'm not familiar with Faraday.


----------



## damienbeale

DirtySteve said:


> I'm going to go with no, I'm not familiar with Faraday.


Hahaha, is there any shielding foil in the bottom of the headcab? If not, there needs to be. If there is, does the problem go away with the head in the cab?

All that said, if the problem is within an NFB loop, this ain't gonna cure it.


----------



## DirtySteve

damienbeale said:


> Hahaha, is there any shielding foil in the bottom of the headcab? If not, there needs to be. If there is, does the problem go away with the head in the cab?
> 
> All that said, if the problem is within an NFB loop, this ain't gonna cure it.



I haven't put it in the cab yet, but there is no shielding in the bottom. I'm a dumbass and meant to ask before, whats an NFB loop?


----------



## damienbeale

DirtySteve said:


> I haven't put it in the cab yet, but there is no shielding in the bottom. I'm a dumbass and meant to ask before, whats an NFB loop?



Negative FeedBack. Feeds a controlled portion of the signal from the powertubes back to earlier in the circuit, to help stabilise it, and tightens the low end somewhat.

Not a dumbass. Yer doin' jus' fine.


But get yerself some nice thin steel sheet to cover the footprint of the chassis on that headcab.


----------



## brp

DirtySteve said:


> I haven't put it in the cab yet, but there is no shielding in the bottom.



You're going to want to change that, as Damien said.


----------



## Alabama Thunderpussy

Not to quote myself, or anything.


Alabama Thunderpussy said:


> But you should check component values on V3, and verify that your presence pot is wired correctly.



Glad you got it mostly sorted, Steve!


----------



## Grenade

When Steve is done and clips are posted, this thread needs to be a sticky. A lot of input from some great people.


----------



## DirtySteve

Alabama Thunderpussy said:


> Not to quote myself, or anything.
> 
> Glad you got it mostly sorted, Steve!



But I did all that. We still don't know why it's causing the problem, but the components are correct and it is wired correctly...other than the shielded wire like Terry suggested and it's on it's way.


----------



## damienbeale

Rather than put it to one side for now...

Reconnect the presence circuit. Get a wooden chopstick or something non-conductive and start moving around the presence and resonance control wires to see where is most quiet whilst the amp is running. Make sure the wires cross other leads at right angles if possible, and NOT running in parallel with anything.

Worth a shot, at least...

But please, be careful...


----------



## DirtySteve

Grenade said:


> When Steve is done and clips are posted, this thread needs to be a sticky. A lot of input from some great people.



Look I gotta be straight with you. If I had known clips were "required" I might not have done this, lol. I don't really know if I can pull that off, I guess I'm going to have to try, but don't expect much. We'll see.


----------



## brp

You're in FLA. 
take the head with you to Frankie's, make clips there


----------



## damienbeale

DirtySteve said:


> Look I gotta be straight with you. If I had known clips were required I might not have done this, lol. I don't really know if I can pull that off, I guess I'm going to have to try, but don't expect much. We'll see.



Just post your clips when you finish...


----------



## Grenade

No pressure, you've done more recently than a lot of people ever do.


----------



## DirtySteve

brp said:


> You're in FLA.
> take the head with you to Frankie's, make clips there



Haha, I already thought of that and it's a good idea. I wonder where Frankie's been. ...and Dave (NR) too for that matter?


----------



## shredless

maybe a bunch of us should post some of our "not so good" clips to make the guy feel at ease....whos first?


----------



## DirtySteve

I'm in a great mood tonight, I even laughed at something that wasn't even funny.  wow! I didn't realized how bogged down I was with this, but it is all I've thought about for the last 3 months! What a relief...I'm so proud of it!  This is by far the coolest thing I've ever done...


----------



## Micky

DirtySteve said:


> I'm in a great mood tonight, I even laughed at something that wasn't even funny.  wow! I didn't realized how bogged down I was with this, but it is all I've thought about for the last 3 months! What a relief...I'm so proud of it!  This is by far the coolest thing I've ever done...



If there was anyone who ever deserved a good day, it is you Steve.
Glad you are feeling better, and even more glad things are working.
I gotta admit, you took on a huge project, and are now enjoying the benefits.
Stay healthy my friend, so you can crank that bitch...


----------



## Micky

brp said:


> You're in FLA.
> take the head with you to Frankie's, make clips there



Road trip to Tampa...

MSG Frankie on Facebook.
I can't wait to hear the Star Spangled Banner outta that amp...


----------



## bulldozer1984

Good wrk brother Steve. Happy for u my friend


----------



## MartyStrat54

Steve, I sent the tubes by First Class. It was less than $4. Don't worry about it.

Just remember me in your will.

Giving me your first born son is an option as well.


----------



## bulldozer1984

MartyStrat54 said:


> Steve, I sent the tubes by First Class. It was less than $4. Don't worry about it.
> 
> Just remember me in your will.
> 
> Giving me your first born son is an option as well.



Or.. Steves amp. The MAF-18


----------



## MartyStrat54

Naw. I'd never take his amp. His son, but not his amp.


----------



## JEB

I just got to say this is an awesome thread. You guys rock and I can't wait to hear some clips of Steve's amp.


----------



## DirtySteve

I wish I could pass it around the room and have all you guys sign it! 

Thanks Marty, but you should know that I'm 46 with no kids yet, I'm not really planning on any so you might want to take what you can get.


----------



## paul-e-mann

Its Party Time Steve!!!


----------



## MartyStrat54

DirtySteve said:


> I'm 46 with no kids yet.



Ah ha! That explains your fascination with big breasted women.


----------



## Far Rider

Outstanding Steve. Way to go bro.


----------



## DirtySteve

MartyStrat54 said:


> Ah ha! That explains your fascination with big breasted women.


----------



## john l

MartyStrat54 said:


> Ah ha! That explains your fascination with big breasted women.


 
Kay so...

A) It also explains why hes got the time to work on this thing lol.

B) Absolutely no explanation needed to have a fascination with big breasted women. Pull yourself together man.


----------



## MartyStrat54

I'm way into big breasted women. Steve can testify to this.

A nice ass and a pretty face is a plus.


----------



## Ghostman

I love this thread.


----------



## john l

Reported!


----------



## 66 galaxie

Nice job Steve, Terry, Marty and everybody else that helped 

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L74XDgMcwKk]Boston - Party - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## minerman

MartyStrat54 said:


> I got Steve's tubes mailed out today. I was thinking how it would have been nice if I had a pair of Sylvania Black Plate EL84's to send, but I don't. However, those TAD's sound really nice.
> 
> Here is what Steve is getting:
> 
> NOS Canadian Mullard (by Philips)
> NOS BEL India Mullard (by Philips)
> USED 1959 Square Getter RCA
> USED Raytheon Black Plate, Lopsided PI tube
> NEW PAIR of TAD EL84's
> 
> That should be a good stash for Steve to roll.


 
Awesome Marty, very, very nice of you to do this for Steve!!!!

Congrats Steve, glad you got the problem sorted, you'll have it up & running properly in a day or two, really proud of you man....On the clips, your cell phone does have a camera, right??? If not, just box the head up & send it to me, & I'll do the clips for ya.....

Seriously though, really proud of ya dude, you let the Blades shit just roll off of ya, calmly brushed what was left on you off, & made an example of how a *man* is supposed to act for all to follow....Great day dude, again, very proud of ya!!!!


----------



## rmroza

Great Job and Thank to EVERYONE! Soo glad it's running and your welcome.

YES, clips ARE going to be required. You now hold the grail tone and this "prototype built CORRECTLY (lol) and with love. Hold it dear. Hold it true.


----------



## charveldan

Im glad the amp works but the man-love in this thread is a bit uncomfy.

Can we pleeze go back to flaming each other ...


----------



## rmroza

Great job in finding the original root-cause Terry. I had Steve verify a couple things also. There is/are errors in some of the values of resistors and at least one specifically...the 56k and in the PI to presence/depth...where the issue seemed to arise.

I requested Steve check EVERY value to layout and if cannot get a reading, lift the leg.

We're almost there.


----------



## DirtySteve

Terry sent me a pm a little while ago and he found it also. I was going nuts trying to figure out what to do as maybe a temporary fix until I can get one and I remembered there's one on the original board. I'm warming up the iron now.


----------



## mott555

So is there a TL;DR explanation of the amp's current state? I don't feel like reading the previous 10 - 15 pages.


----------



## Micky

So no one has really explaned what the problem was to everyone else here...
PM are great but they are private. Give up the details of the fix, so others here who aren't on the PM list can see what is going on!


----------



## DirtySteve

I'm sure Terry or Robb can give a more technical answer, but I'll try. 

When I first turned it on I got a really nasty squeal/full volume hum. Terry had me reverse the brown and blue wires from the OT to the el84s. I had it wired the way it was before so I'm still not sure the technical reason it was not working this time. That stopped the squeal, but it started making a popping sound that kind of sounded like a washing machine out of balance on the spin cycle. 

This is where my memory gets fuzzy because we tried several things, but then Terry had me remove the presence and resonance from the circuit and this time it worked, I was able to play it for about a minute and then the popping would come back.

I'm pretty sure I had a bad solder connection on the turret for the wire going to the presence pot. I redid it and then somewhere in there I also shortened the wires going to the gain pots. 

Now I could play it and there was no squeal and no popping, but it seemed to have low gain and low volume and sounded really bright and thin last night. That's when Robb e-mailed me and said the 56k didn't look right and was probably a 56 ohm. I confirmed that this morning about the same time I got a PM from Terry saying the same thing. 

So I snagged the 56k from the old board and swapped it out and hooked the pres/res pots back up and now they are working properly and it also thickened up the overall tone. I still feel like there should be more gain, but I can't crank it right now to see if it just needs more volume. The volume knob does nothing between 0-2 or so and then it's pretty loud. 

There's a touchy area right before it gets really loud that I can find a low volume setting, but it really too low and there's nothing in between. I don't think that's normal, but it's playable and sounds pretty good! I have shielded wire on the way and I'm going to rerun the gains, presence and resonance wires. That's where I'm at. I may be mixed up on the order some of that happened.  I did all this with the flu and it doesn't seem to want to give up. That's why I'm still home today.


----------



## paul-e-mann

Who gave you the flu, the bosses daughter?


----------



## DirtySteve

pedecamp said:


> Who gave you the flu, the bosses daughter?



I don't know, but I went to my brothers house for Thanksgiving and I could feel it coming on by friday night. They all have kids and are around kids and it seems like every time I get around kids I get sick. The only kid there that day was my nephew and I was playing with him some. It's going on 5 days now. I thought it was over last night because I was feeling so much better, but I think it might have just been the adrenalin.


----------



## Gene Ballzz

A HUGE  
I can only dream of such a short troubleshoot on my next build.
Great Work,
Gene


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Steve, Check your order slip on the replacement pots that you bought and see if the 1 Meg's are audio. Maybe you have linear pots. Terry


----------



## DirtySteve

Guitar-Rocker said:


> Steve, Check your order slip on the replacement pots that you bought and see if the 1 Meg's are audio. Maybe you have linear pots. Terry



The presence and mid pots are linear, the rest are audio taper.


----------



## damienbeale

DirtySteve said:


> The presence and mid pots are linear, the rest are audio taper.



Ahhh, but ARE they...

A lot of the time particularly with cheap pots, the log tapers read pretty much the same as the linears when you check the sweep with an analogue meter. This is why mil spec pots can be a big bonus in certain circuits when it comes to volume pots.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

They are CTS pots, should be fine.


----------



## Micky

Yes, but is an audio pot switched with a linear pot?
Same value- different place?

And yes, I know, 18W can be incredibly LOUD...


----------



## damienbeale

Guitar-Rocker said:


> They are CTS pots, should be fine.



I find it quite often with Alpha AND CTS. I have a whole stack of 500K Alpha's that are no good for guitar use that I might as well junk...


----------



## scat7s

there should be an A or a B noted next to the value of the pot printed on the pot itself.

A denotes audio taper. 

you may have to remove the pot from chassis to view. you shouldnt have to unwire it, but just pull it away from chassis to get a top view.


----------



## rmroza

Readers digest versions:

Original issue was cold/bad solder joint causing popping/squeal
Still not right and thin - resistor wrong value....I'm still waiting confirmation of ALL resistors. Based on pics and color banding, I seen more issues.
Volume issue - This is normal and due to logarithmic pots. I guess Steve never had a 100w Plexi and unbarably loud 1 to 2. If you want more play, try 1M linear or other value pots.
Flu - He got from the relatives kid(s).

Ensure you check all resistor values and lift one leg if need be. Previously you confirmed and reflowed solder joint I believe Steve and still the issue was solder joint, so you need to be absolute, positively sure. I let you know the I think 3 resistor values in question. 

Is EVERYTHING hooked up NOW??...depth, presence, and saturation switch?? Once all of this is finalized, you may want to try your sag MOD.

Robb


----------



## rmroza

Ok, I see you set more photos to my personal account. Resistors look ok. Some oranges look like brown, so just wanted to be sure of those also. Can't see the face of C13 and C18, so can't verify them.

I just caught something else thou...check the bright cap across the gain pot. Should be a value of 500p to 4.7n usually and typically 500p, 1n, 2n, 2.2n....anyway, it reads 10k400v, soo isn't that 10,000pF, or 10n, or .01uF! If so, you have the wrong cap in there and it may be bright...fyi


----------



## DirtySteve

I just checked all resisters and they are all correct. R17 is 15k not 12 like it shows on my drawing, I guess I just forgot to change it, but that's what Terry sent me to use there. What difference will it make to go to 12k? C13 & C18 are 560p. He also sent me the orange bright cap to use, I can't read the small print on it, but I never questioned it. Since I replaced the 56ohm with the correct 56k the brightness I was talking about is gone.

Everything is hooked up except for the sag mod. I was waiting for Terry to confirm it's wired correctly before hooking it back up. He asked to see better shots of it as well as the gains and zener switching.


----------



## charveldan

26 pages, this could be the greatest mApz that never played.

I predict clips by march.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

That's likely the most retarded thing you have ever posted. How many pages did you think would be enough to take an abortion and turn it into a good device, and all the while do it with someone who has never worked on an amp?


----------



## damienbeale

Guitar-Rocker said:


> That's likely the most retarded thing you have ever posted.


I wouldn't be so sure about that, Terry. Sadly, I've seen much worse...


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

It's not like Robb or I had the amp to dissect, figure how it was slopped together, re-engineer, and rebuild in a shop equipped with tools and parts. This was literally a rebuild completed over the e-mails, on off times for Steve, and with no layouts initially.


----------



## MartyStrat54

DAN...Com'on man! Drop it down a couple of notches.


----------



## brp

This thread was started 6 weeks ago.
That's a pretty good turn-around for a guy who started with BB's clusterf*ck, no experience, no parts, no layout and no plan.
Somebody's trollin


----------



## DirtySteve

What the hell is mApz anyway? I googled it and came up empty. I tried to be cool the other day and here we go again so his apology was worthless. I'm in ignore mode now.


----------



## 66 galaxie

I think somebody might be a little jealous.

I said it before, but, you guys really did a nice job.


----------



## MartyStrat54

This thread is the best thing to happen in the Workbench section since I have been here (early 2009).


----------



## Grenade

I think this thread is the best thing that has happened since I joined period. Great guys, great project, and a damn good reason to plan a trip to meet Steve and the amp in person. It's like his child now and I for one couldn't be prouder. Great job men.


----------



## DBi5

This project is setting a standard for an amp forum.


----------



## john l

damienbeale said:


> I wouldn't be so sure about that, Terry. Sadly, I've seen much worse...


 
At this point Im relatively sure Dan and BB are from the same degenerate gene pool.


----------



## DirtySteve

I can only imagine what this looks like from the outside. Especially going all the way back to where it started. I must have looked like such a fool. I'm too far into it to see it the way you guys do. I'm just so thankful and proud that it turned out the way it did. I (we) built an amp! ...and it works! How cool is that?! 

Thanks everyone! I'm glad you guys are enjoying it.


----------



## rmroza

Cool, thanks for the update Steve and confirming resistors are verified. We'll see how the sag works out. 

Yeah, I see the orange cap marking clearly in the photo and like I said I'm reading it 104 or 10,000pF. That's too large for the bright cap. You'll want to replace it with 500pF to 2200pF or take it out and no bright cap.

How's the saturation working??

Yeah, really, if Dan is serious, dude you're out of line. 6 weeks for a complete turn around, talking it out over the phone and E-mails, no layout, total dismantle and build, parts had to be ordered and on and on like everyone said and not a guy in a shop or even with a small drill press. nothing! and we advised him and the layout is even his! I was wearisome about it, but it even came through. 

No, this is a 6 week "prototype" (lol) that is saleable. Enclosure looks great too. Awesome job, Steve. Awesome!

I look forward to feedback on saturation, finalization of sag, and clips. do NOT have to be perfect. A damn quick cell phone I think everyone would agree would give an impression of the tone and capability and why Jose and really Mark as ****ed up as he is....are "the man"


----------



## DirtySteve

rmroza said:


> ...
> 
> How's the saturation working??
> 
> ...



I haven't had a chance to crank it yet. See I've called sick all week and I live in an apartment on the property where I work so if they hear me playing they'll think I was faking it because they know I've been building an amp up here. 

I can't answer that until I've had a chance to turn it up, but at low volume there's not much gain and the zeners don't make much difference at all. I think something's still not right there because it wasn't like that before.


----------



## DirtySteve

I was going to start another thread after it was up and running, but since this thread turned out the way it did it's just as good...maybe better. In case anyone's late to the party here's a before and after...

Terry put the circles on there to point out the safety issues and that's where one thing led to another and I decided to rebuild it.





And here it is now...





Before...





First upgrade...





And what it looks like now until I decide what I want for the faceplate and name...


----------



## MartyStrat54

And the ugly duckling turned into a beautiful swan.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Steve, I'm pouring over the two different layouts, rechecking the photos too. The orange cap on Gain 1 is wrong to spec. That is a .01UF, should be a .001uf. And check the black wire going to the zener's switch. In the photos it looks like it's soldered on the center lug, should be soldered on the right hand lug with the orange wire.


----------



## DirtySteve

Guitar-Rocker said:


> Steve, I'm pouring over the two different layouts, rechecking the photos too. The orange cap on Gain 1 is wrong to spec. That is a .01UF, should be a .001uf. And check the black wire going to the zener's switch. In the photos it looks like it's soldered on the center lug, should be soldered on the right hand lug with the orange wire.


----------



## CoffeeTones

If it is still humming, does the hum change or go away with rotating the Jose master volume?


----------



## CoffeeTones

Appears you have a redundant ground at the 100k cathode follower load resistor and clipping diodes. Two green wires and a jumper. Could be a ground loop.


----------



## DirtySteve

Guitar-Rocker said:


> Steve, I'm pouring over the two different layouts, rechecking the photos too. The orange cap on Gain 1 is wrong to spec. That is a .01UF, should be a .001uf. And check the black wire going to the zener's switch. In the photos it looks like it's soldered on the center lug, should be soldered on the right hand lug with the orange wire.



Thanks for catching that Terry, I'm kicking myself in the ass for not catching it. I just had a blast playing it after I switched it. Wow. I also removed the bright cap and really, I don't think it needs it at all. It's still pretty bright, if anything it could use some more bottom end. I have the bass turned all the way up. 

Wow and the coolest part, at least I think it is, I have more headroom than I did before. In fact there was none before and I'm a pedal junkie and I love being able to kick in a little more with an od. My Xotic BB preamp kicked ass!! What a cool amp, I'm one happy dude right now! I'll work on the sag mod tomorrow, can't wait to see what that does. 

Robb, sorry I'm an idiot, lol!


----------



## DirtySteve

CoffeeTones said:


> If it is still humming, does the hum change or go away with rotating the Jose master volume?



No it's not humming, In fact it's pretty quiet, but like I said, I haven't really cranked it yet. I also haven't put in the head box yet.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

The left wire goes over left to the 33uf, the right wire goes right to the voltage divider, pretty sure. I think the issues with hum are gone.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

DirtySteve said:


> Thanks for catching that Terry, I'm kicking myself in the ass for catching it. I just had a blast playing it after I switched it. Wow. I also removed the bright cap and really, I don't think it needs it at all. It's still pretty bright, if anything it could use some more bottom end. I have the bass turned all the way up.
> 
> Wow and the coolest part, at least I think it is, I have more headroom than I did before. In fact there was none before and I'm a pedal junkie and I love being able to kick in a little more with an od. My Xotic BB preamp kicked ass!! What a cool amp, I'm one happy dude right now! I'll work on the sag mod tomorrow, can't wait to see what that does.
> 
> Robb, sorry I'm an idiot, lol!


 
Hell the fun hasn't started yet. Wait till those tubes that Marty sent gets there. Yeah Baby!


----------



## charveldan

billy blades ... lol.

u guys sure are touchy for an internet forum.

Steve sees this amp for what it [could] be.

I see it for what it is.

I admire is passion to right the wrong.

I keep checking back for clips but that seems a no go.

If people are gonna whine and get flame happy everytime I post, im out of here.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

I don't think anyone is touchy Dan, but sometimes your statements are coarse. Regardless of what you see in the amp versus what Steve saw, the goal was to take a potential death trap of an amp, (that in all fairness to old Billy, did sound like Steve wanted it to sound like) , figure out the circuitry in it that was glued and sharpied without ripping it apart, determine what would be kept and what would be changed, tear it down and re-verify components, design a new layout (completed by a complete newbie amp builder), obtain all new parts, clean up a crappy paint job, build a new turretboard up, rebuild the amp by the seat of your pants (again by a newbie) troubleshoot and get to a playing amp. All without the regular tools, and all done by e-mail or phone. When the shielded cable gets here, Marty's tubes get here, and the amp gets tidyed up and stuffed into the cabinet, I'm sure by then Steve can come up with some clips. If it's a pain to see if all this work is justified to you for the amount of time required to get it there, and you don't want to hang around, then don't keep up with the post if it irritates you. But there's a heck of a lot of people that want to stick around for it.


----------



## CoffeeTones

Guitar-Rocker said:


> The left wire goes over left to the 33uf, the right wire goes right to the voltage divider, pretty sure. I think the issues with hum are gone.



Cool, so is there a difference in sound when using the solid core wire or is that pre tinned stranded? It sure is easier to work with.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

I've never heard there is any difference in tone, maybe someone else on here has some input on it.


----------



## CoffeeTones

Ken Fischer and some others claim / claimed the solid core is an advantage but I've never heard it compared.
@ 5:55 [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dnbe3A3pC_s[/ame]


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

I haven't smoked anything for 35 years, but I'd like to take a hit of what ever old Ken was on.


----------



## Micky

Guitar-Rocker said:


> I haven't smoked anything for 35 years, but I'd like to take a hit of what ever old Ken was on.



You wouldn't believe the cult following he has!
Almost like Jonestown...


----------



## solarburn

charveldan said:


> billy blades ... lol.
> 
> u guys sure are touchy for an internet forum.
> 
> Steve sees this amp for what it [could] be.
> 
> I see it for what it is.
> 
> I admire is passion to right the wrong.
> 
> I keep checking back for clips but that seems a no go.
> 
> If people are gonna whine and get flame happy everytime I post, im out of here.



Jeebus Dan...try to have fun.

Actually Steve did some decent clips before and sounded great. He just his own worse critic. I hope we get to hear the amp too but I'm not going to fault him if he chooses not to. It ain't gonna change my raunch and roll.

Now have a beer and let it unfold.


----------



## 66 galaxie

charveldan said:


> billy blades ... lol.
> 
> u guys sure are touchy for an internet forum.
> 
> Steve sees this amp for what it [could] be.
> 
> I see it for what it is.
> 
> I admire is passion to right the wrong.
> 
> I keep checking back for clips but that seems a no go.
> 
> If people are gonna whine and get flame happy everytime I post, im out of here.



[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ogAqgkkTV5U]Ace Ventura - Take Care Now, Bye Bye Then - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## rmroza

i've read all of ken's stuff n heard him n watched his videos n beyond that...i understand what he was getting at, but im not sure if it matters. specifically, he urges solid wires in the preamp section. now i dont use solid, but have, but always use 18awg stranded throughout n yes tin standed n my amps sound killer n almost never troubleshoot. i build, it works. based on not trying anything else, i cant compare, but using large wire WORKS, n i guess, thats my point.

soo u got the saturation working?!? great. the tone should be there at all volumes. yeah cant want for u to finalize components, sag, n when everthingis final...clips. id like to hear it in 18 watt cathode application n with sag...interesting.

as far as before n after.. like night n day...n from a newbie v. a guy builing n modding for yewrs...radiculously cool. again great job steve n thanks everyone, almost there!


----------



## minerman

This is the best thread since I've been a member of this forum....seriously....

Congrats Steve, you know you're gonna have to go back to work so you'll be able to crank that thing after work, right???

Again, congrats dude, dunno how different it sounds, but it sure looks different now....I really didn't wanna say this when you first got the BB amp/cab/headshell, but I honestly thought it looked terrible myself, but that's just my opinon...Looks like a professionally built super-duper tube amp man....

We're working on getting Steve some gear to make some proper clips too guys, if I have to, I'll drive all the way from Virginia with my computer, interface & SM57 mic....

Cool thread with some really cool forum members!!!!


----------



## john l

charveldan said:


> billy blades ... lol.
> 
> u guys sure are touchy for an internet forum.
> 
> Steve sees this amp for what it [could] be.
> 
> I see it for what it is.
> 
> I admire is passion to right the wrong.
> 
> I keep checking back for clips but that seems a no go.
> 
> If people are gonna whine and get flame happy everytime I post, im out of here.


 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tiFm3EUC8q0


----------



## bulldozer1984

charveldan said:


> billy blades ... lol.
> 
> u guys sure are touchy for an internet forum.
> 
> Steve sees this amp for what it [could] be.
> 
> I see it for what it is.
> 
> I admire is passion to right the wrong.
> 
> I keep checking back for clips but that seems a no go.
> 
> If people are gonna whine and get flame happy everytime I post, im out of here.



Your beloved Friedman is just a Jose mod you wanker which is all Billy did. 

So Steves amp is nearly the same as yours but without the HBE and C45. 

If u cant say something construct ive and bring something to the table phuck off

Hey Steve does your amp sound like this. 

http://www.soundclick.com/mobile/default.cfm?bandid=1150084&id=12589533

http://www.soundclick.com/player/single_player.cfm?songid=12589533&q=hi&newref=1

EDIT: Added link


----------



## Stonemole

This thread is better than bacon.


----------



## charveldan

bulldozer1984 said:


> Your beloved Friedman is just a Jose mod you wanker which is all Billy did.
> 
> So Steves amp is nearly the same as yours but without the HBE and C45.
> 
> If u cant say something construct ive and bring something to the table phuck off
> 
> Hey Steve does your amp sound like this.
> 
> http://www.soundclick.com/mobile/default.cfm?bandid=1150084&id=12589533
> 
> MP3 Player SoundClick
> 
> EDIT: Added link


I call bullshit, dude, drink much ?

Absolutely no [none] similairity to my amp and the new old morphed blades clusterphuck.
Glad everyone's having a good time, that's why we're here.
Glad Steve enjoys his new toy.
But to say my 35 yo metalface modded JMP is "nearly the same", yes they have caps, resistors, trannys & tewbs but anything after that is a sham.
Take all the pop shots at me you want but ur not changing the facts.
Ive been decent in this thread to everyone here.
But if yer gonna talk shit im taking the gloves off.


----------



## rmroza

Can we keep the negative crap out of the forum? Just be cool Dan. Really, you started it even if just messin around, but it's not necessary nor appreciated, so just keep it positive or don't sound off at all.

Since there are some Friedman worshippers here and on the site...I think Dave's designs are great and have that hot-rodded Marshall "Growl". I'd like everyone to have these amazing tones that we've now been hearing for 50 years and since the 70's and not at the price of a HOUSE in Detroit rate.

I will be building a variation of your/the precious Friedman BE-100 (and hopefully offering it for sale starting in 2014). The parts have all been ordered and final parts arrive today!!! It will be a turret board all hand assembled and made in USA 2-EL34 50-watt version (I personally HATE 100w amps unless playing stadiums and all of the extra unnecessary weight and size). It will be a 2-channel with 1 input. It will be similar to the BE-100 including voicing, fat, saturation, and fx loop. The floor pedal and design will be different in it will have a 2-button (with LED) floot switch and left switch will control clean and dirty. The right switch will be a "boost" for leads. I will start a new thread on the project, build it this this week, and may have it completely built by the end of this weekend! Stay Tuned.


----------



## Gene Ballzz

Hmmm…
Some folks just seem to thrive on pi$$ing in each others' Wheaties! This begs the question:
"Do they really like the taste of that urine soaked cereal?"
I Like Milk & Fruit In Mine,
Gene


----------



## MartyStrat54

Again guys, I will say this thread is about rebuilding an amp. Please don't make me have to edit or delete posts.

Dan, if you want to argue the merits of a Friedman, I suggest you start a thread in the "Other Amps" section.


----------



## Gene Ballzz

MartyStrat54 said:


> Again guys, I will say this thread is about rebuilding an amp. Please don't make me have to edit or delete posts.
> 
> Dan, if you want to argue the merits of a Friedman, I suggest you start a thread in the "Other Amps" section.



Marty,
Agreed! Many generous and thoughtful folks have positively contributed to this whole experience, not the least of which being Steve. His diligence of not only doing some very neat work, but also regularly posting timely pics and progress updates during a sometimes frustrating (for him) process is truly inspiring. The selfless off board assistance of some very cool techs & builders has helped to confirm/improve my positive outlook on human nature.
Now to Steve:
*PLAY THAT BAD MOFO!*
Gene


----------



## Gene Ballzz

And, Oh Yeah,
We should all remember that while its nice to be important, its *More Important To Be Nice!*
Gene


----------



## damienbeale

MartyStrat54 said:


> Dan, if you want to argue the merits of a Friedman, I suggest you start a thread in the "Other Amps" section.



I suggest he learns a little bit about what the hell he's actually talking about first, rather than biting at others who have much more of an idea what is really going on with the circuit than he himself does...

Dan, there's no point taking the gloves off if you're going to be making false swings, as you'll miss, overshoot, and fall flat on yer arse.


----------



## DirtySteve

On a positive note... The tubes and my shielded wire just showed up! 

Thanks again Marty! I haven't opened the box yet, but I don't hear any broken glass shaking around!


----------



## MartyStrat54

Hats off to the postal service. They got there quicker than what I was told.


----------



## scat7s

i guess im the only one who kind of enjoys dans vinegar attitude? gotta have something to break up the monotony. 

trolls can be fun. take it in stride.


----------



## MartyStrat54

I do. There's nothing I can do though if someone decides to put his foot in his mouth.

You get what you give.


----------



## scat7s

> You get what you give.


 
yep. 



> There's nothing I can do though if someone decides to put his foot in his mouth.


 
isnt that what makes it entertaining sometimes though? 

anyway, not trying to derail or pump dans tires. its just gotten to where i look forward to what he'll come up with next. haha...


----------



## Gene Ballzz

scat7s said:


> yep.
> 
> 
> 
> isnt that what makes it entertaining sometimes though?
> 
> anyway, not trying to derail or pump dans tires. its just gotten to where i look forward to what he'll come up with next. haha...



What he said!
Gene


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Steve, I'm curious if you've tried any of the tubes that Marty sent?


----------



## DirtySteve

Terry, no I haven't. I wanted to wire up the sag mod first and I don't think it's working. Actually, I'm a little disappointed right now. I wanted to crank it up and see how it sounded before I swapped the tubes so I could see what the difference is. Well, at best I've got maybe Social Distortion gain and that's iffy. 

As soon as I turn the gains down even just a little bit it cleans right up. I don't think the gain was ever right. At low volume with a pedal I was having fun, but it cleaned up if I turned the gains down. I thought maybe it just needed more volume, but that's not it. It's less than it was with the sag mod, but I don't think it was right yet.

I'm worn out from work today. I think I could have used another day to rest and I overdid it so I might have screwed something up. Wiring the sag mod wore me out and I was sweating my ass off. I need to figure out what's going on with the gain.


----------



## bulldozer1984

How much signalcis being dumped to ground in the pre amp Steve? 

Because the Jose circuit is gained up to the max with cathode bypassing on all 3 stages and then to control alot of signal is dumped to ground. 

What value resistor is going from the wiper of the gain pots to the right leg (ground) 

Raising the value here will immediately increase gain and bring in more bottom end (you were saying that there wasnt enough bottom) 

This will fix 2 issues as far as I can tell. 

And check the connections on your cathode bypass caps.


----------



## DirtySteve

bulldozer1984 said:


> How much signalcis being dumped to ground in the pre amp Steve?
> 
> Because the Jose circuit is gained up to the max with cathode bypassing on all 3 stages and then to control alot of signal is dumped to ground.
> 
> What value resistor is going from the wiper of the gain pots to the right leg (ground)
> 
> Raising the value here will immediately increase gain and bring in more bottom end (you were saying that there wasnt enough bottom)
> 
> This will fix 2 issues as far as I can tell.
> 
> And check the connections on your cathode bypass caps.



Sorry Dozer, most of that was over my head. The resister value is 8.2k.


----------



## CoffeeTones

Should be 82k and only on the first gain pot


----------



## rmroza

Yep.

R7 should be 82k. I said that last time in the layout you had. You must have missed it. 

82k will get you there and is right to Jose's spec!


----------



## CoffeeTones

The 2.2m resistors to ground already make the 1m pots into 687k pots, then the 8.2k would bring one side of the pot down to 8.1k which should have been 73k with the proper 82k from wiper to ground. I don't have any clear pics to make out your resistor colors but an 8.2k across the pot would kill your gain.


----------



## DirtySteve

rmroza said:


> Yep.
> 
> R7 should be 82k. I said that last time in the layout you had. You must have missed it.
> 
> 82k will get you there and is right to Jose's spec!



**** me!  yeah I missed it alright.

Well, that explains why I have an 82k resister leftover that I couldn't figure out why Terry sent.


----------



## CoffeeTones

Ha, change that out and crank everything up to 5 or 6 then she should kick butt!


----------



## DirtySteve

Dozer, I'm so glad you asked that!  Sorry Robb, I didn't see where you told me. I'm so pissed at myself. I knew the gain wasn't right. I even ordered the 8.2k for it because I didn't have one and the whole time the 82k was sitting right here!


----------



## john l

damienbeale said:


> I suggest he learns a little bit about what the hell he's actually talking about first, rather than biting at others who have much more of an idea what is really going on with the circuit than he himself does...
> 
> Dan, there's no point taking the gloves off if you're going to be making false swings, as you'll miss, overshoot, and fall flat on yer arse.


 

LOL! "Taking the gloves off?!" Whats that even supposed to mean! Ah shit look out hes about to ruin your day with all caps and another epic fail pic . 

Guys Im all for screwin' around and having fun but I really don't think theres that much too this. Hes just another internet tough guy that talks long shit from behind a screen cuz theres no one there to cold cock him for being a dip shit. 

If he knew something and occasionally contributed something useful to the forum then Id say maybe hes just another loud mouth but at least hes here for the right reasons but he cant and doesn't even want to by his own admission. The closest he gets to working on an amp is signing a check to have someone else get their hands dirty for him and then he takes shots at everyone else thats actually going to town on one and learning like Steve. If everyone didn't tell him to fuk off for that he never would have apologized 

In short. if looks like an asshole and smells like an asshole then there probably nothing more to it and its just an asshole and should be treated accordingly.


----------



## 4STICKS

Dan...


----------



## DirtySteve

THAT'S IT!!! HELL YEAH!!


----------



## Gene Ballzz

DirtySteve said:


> **** me!  yeah I missed it alright.
> 
> Well, that explains why I have an 82k resister leftover that I couldn't figure out why Terry sent.



Well…..,
There YA GO!:yes way:Crank that bad boy loud enough (Ya went to work so….) to knock that grunch outa yer system! Report back after yer ears are done bleeding'!
Oooo Yeah,
Gene


----------



## MartyStrat54

I appreciate all of you advanced techs/amp builders for zeroing in on Steve's resistor issue. Well done gentlemen.

And CoffeeTones..."Welcome!" Glad to have you on board.

(All you other guys, you know I love you already.)


----------



## Rocktane

Congrats man! Now go enjoy the spoils of your journey!


----------



## Ghostman

DirtySteve said:


> **** me!  yeah I missed it alright.
> 
> Well, that explains why I have an 82k resister leftover that I couldn't figure out why Terry sent.



That's awesome! Always leave it to the pile of left over parts. 

True sign of an amateur tech. Can't figure out what's up? look through the leftover parts. lmao


----------



## DirtySteve

I was really bummed earlier. Talk about ups and downs! The Sag still doesn't seem to work, but I'll worry about that later.

Now to see what these babies do! 

















Don't worry, I'm not wasting time taking pictures, I've been rockin' out. I had these set up already.

Marty I wish I'd thought to buy a t-shirt when you sent these. Awesome man, thanks again!!!


----------



## 4STICKS




----------



## Far Rider

Alright Steve!!!!!


----------



## 4STICKS

Steve,man, I just want you to know, I been followin' closely but not contributin' 'cause my expertise in amps (and all things electroinc) would be "Well is it pluged in? Power on?" 

That said...I'm proud for you, brother!!!!!!!!!


----------



## CoffeeTones

MartyStrat54 said:


> I appreciate all of you advanced techs/amp builders for zeroing in on Steve's resistor issue. Well done gentlemen.
> 
> And CoffeeTones..."Welcome!" Glad to have you on board.
> 
> (All you other guys, you know I love you already.)



Thanks Marty, I have actually been on the board for a while. Only as a guest for a long time and one post in nine months, as a member, until I started tracking this topic.

I recognize a few members here from a couple of other forums


----------



## Micky

T-shirts are highly overrated...


----------



## johnfv

Martimus Maximus!


----------



## 66 galaxie

DirtySteve said:


> I was really bummed earlier. Talk about ups and downs! The Sag still doesn't seem to work, but I'll worry about that later.
> 
> Now to see what these babies do!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Don't worry, I'm not wasting time taking pictures, I've been rockin' out. I had these set up already.
> 
> Marty I wish I'd thought to buy a t-shirt when you sent these. Awesome man, thanks again!!!



Dooood! Congrats on getting your amp damn near where you want it 

And, man am I jealous of those delish tubes Marty sent you.
Rock on Marty, your a class act


----------



## 4STICKS

66 galaxie said:


> Dooood! Congrats on getting your amp damn near where you want it
> 
> And, man am I jealous of those delish tubes Marty sent you.
> Rock on Mary, your a class act



Mary? Something you need to tell us Marty?


----------



## RussBert

DirtySteve said:


> I was going to start another thread after it was up and running, but since this thread turned out the way it did it's just as good...maybe better. In case anyone's late to the party here's a before and after...
> 
> Terry put the circles on there to point out the safety issues and that's where one thing led to another and I decided to rebuild it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And here it is now...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Before...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> First upgrade...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And what it looks like now until I decide what I want for the faceplate and name...







I just had to quote this post...from a blades cluster phuck to DirtySteve's "Phoenix". Well done, folks!



_...and I told y'all to check those pesky resistor values!_


----------



## CoffeeTones

Is it just me or does anyone else want to go solder something?


----------



## rmroza

"Well, that explains why I have an 82k resister leftover that I couldn't figure out why Terry sent"

Oh man, you made me laugh. thanks. No issues.

Yeah, you identified it in BB layout and I said are you sure that's 8.2k?!?? Not sure. He probably fudged up. He does all the time. Quality is job...NONE! lol

In any event, it doesn't matter. You knew something was off, we caught it, you updated it. Great job and now it killz!


----------



## DirtySteve

Micky said:


> T-shirts are highly overrated...



Ain't that the truth...


----------



## 66 galaxie

4STICKS said:


> Mary? Something you need to tell us Marty?



Fixed,, and actually Marty could post some pics, but thats another story


----------



## DirtySteve

rmroza said:


> "Well, that explains why I have an 82k resister leftover that I couldn't figure out why Terry sent"
> 
> Oh man, you made me laugh. thanks. No issues.
> 
> Yeah, you identified it in BB layout and I said are you sure that's 8.2k?!?? Not sure. He probably fudged up. He does all the time. Quality is job...NONE! lol
> 
> In any event, it doesn't matter. You knew something was off, we caught it, you updated it. Great job and now it killz!



 Thanks man! I don't know how I got that wrong, but I was going strictly by my drawing when I was checking values and I had that wrong from the beginning so I never though anything of it. It rips my head off now!


----------



## DirtySteve

Marty I started with the tubes like you recommended them and it's kickin' ass! I'm looking forward to rolling a few of 'em (and the other one) in different positions and see what I come up with.


----------



## paul-e-mann

Steve how does it sound and feel compared to before you ripped it apart? And now with NOS tubes?


----------



## DirtySteve

CoffeeTones said:


> Is it just me or does anyone else want to go solder something?



Thanks dude! Cool you decided to start posting here. ...hope you stick around!


----------



## DirtySteve

pedecamp said:


> How does it sound and feel compared to before you ripped it apart? And now with NOS tubes?



Well...hmm, it's kind of the same, but it has a little bit of different voice and I can't put my finger on what it is. The eq is different, not as much bass and lower mids, but the basic tone is similar. It has headroom and I can hit it with an OD, which I like and I couldn't before. 

Before it didn't matter what tubes I put in it, it didn't make much difference, but I could tell a big difference when I swapped these in.


----------



## paul-e-mann

So it sounds like a success! What else do you gotta do to finish it?


----------



## CoffeeTones

DirtySteve said:


> Well...hmm, it's kind of the same, but it has a little bit of different voice and I can't put my finger on what it is. The eq is different, not as much bass and lower mids, but the basic tone is similar. It has headroom and I can hit it with an OD, which I like and I couldn't before.
> 
> Before it didn't matter what tubes I put in it, it didn't make much difference, but I could tell a big difference when I swapped these in.



That was because of Billy's voltages and filter cap choices / mistakes


----------



## RussBert

Steve, what speaker(s) are you using with the amp?


----------



## DirtySteve

pedecamp said:


> So it sounds like a success! What else do you gotta do to finish it?



I would say so, yes.  I still need to fix the sag mod. I need to run my shielded gain and presence/resonance wires and shield the head box. Maybe a little clean/dress up in between.


----------



## DirtySteve

RussBert said:


> Steve, what speaker(s) are you using with the amp?



At the moment I have a WGS Green Beret in a Sourmash 112 cab. I have a couple of other speakers to try out.


----------



## CoffeeTones

When you get the chance, let us know what the voltage is on pins 6 and 1 of the V2 tube. It may be a good idea to elevate the heaters if the voltage is high. Those old tubes can take it better than new production ones though. The 2k7 cathode resistor will make that voltage run higher than normal but you have lower plate voltage to begin with, which will help the situation.


----------



## Gene Ballzz

Steve,
Words cannot describe the joy I feel for you in your amazing success. You should be damned proud of your accomplishment, even with all the help you've had. Most folks couldn't do 1/4 as well with even 4 times more assistance! I just wish anyone liked me so much as to send me a cool stash o' tubes like that! Just kidding, Marty is a truly stand up kinda guy! Play that amp proudly, loudly and often!




CoffeeTones said:


> Is it just me or does anyone else want to go solder something?



I'd love to be soldering, but the zone is a woodshop this week, as well as rehearsal space for my band's first payin' gig!

Gene


----------



## DirtySteve

Wow! just wow... 


It's so sweet and nasty at the same time. It's different. The feel is completely different. It just takes me along for the ride. It's got the sweetest feedback and harmonics just jump out in the coolest way. I'm in awe. It's got some awesome cleaner tones as well. Just too ****ing cool!


----------



## MartyStrat54

Are you running the BEL in V1 with the Electrohome in V2 and the lopsided Sylvania in the PI?


----------



## bulldozer1984

Glad I could help Steve. In my mind the only way to have low gain was to be sending it all to ground ! Haha


----------



## DirtySteve

MartyStrat54 said:


> Are you running the BEL in V1 with the Electrohome in V2 and the lopsided Sylvania in the PI?



Yes on V1 & V2, I have the Raytheon In the PI.


----------



## DirtySteve

bulldozer1984 said:


> Glad I could help Steve. In my mind the only way to have low gain was to be sending it all to ground ! Haha



It's got the gain now brother!


----------



## Stringjunkie

Congrats Steve! I can't think of anyone more deserving of a bit of success. Way to handle yourself through this whole thing. 


Can you build me one now? Lmao


----------



## DirtySteve

Thanks Guy. This was fun, but I don't know about building another one! I think I just aged about 5 years in the last 3 months, lol.


----------



## MartyStrat54

DirtySteve said:


> Yes on V1 & V2, I have the Raytheon In the PI.



DUH! I'm sorry, I meant the Raytheon. I don't get too many Black Plates like that one. Usually I sell the high gain, lopsided Sylvania's for PI's. I only have a few high gain, lopsided Raytheon's.


----------



## Alabama Thunderpussy

CoffeeTones said:


> Is it just me or does anyone else want to go solder something?



Hell no. I solder all day long as it is. Today I recapped a Fender SF Twin Reverb, diagnosed and fixed a Deluxe Reverb hum issue, installed a 3 prong cord on said Deluxe Reverb, and got a Laney Pro-Tube 30 rebuild up and running. I'm done for the day.


----------



## Dogs of Doom

Glad to see this has become a success Steve!


----------



## DirtySteve

MartyStrat54 said:


> DUH! I'm sorry, I meant the Raytheon. I don't get too many Black Plates like that one. Usually I sell the high gain, lopsided Sylvania's for PI's. I only have a few high gain, lopsided Raytheon's.



Haha, that's cool. I didn't think you sent a Sylvania.


----------



## solarburn

Just caught up...now pack that amp up and send it to me. I promise I'll give it back...LOL

Very happy for you Steve. Way to turn all this around. Thanks to the resident techs. Pretty impressive group. Knowledge and generosity. That's a great mix. 

Marty's tone packs deliver. He always gives an excellent starting point too. Have fun Steve!


----------



## DirtySteve

Dogs of Doom said:


> Glad to see this has become a success Steve!



Thanks Paul.


----------



## DirtySteve

solarburnDSL50 said:


> Just caught up...now pack that amp up and send it to me. I promise I'll give it back...LOL
> 
> Very happy for you Steve. Way to turn all this around. Thanks to the resident techs. Pretty impressive group. Knowledge and generosity. That's a great mix.
> 
> Marty's tone packs deliver. He always gives an excellent starting point too. Have fun Steve!



Joe I wish I could bring it over and let you do some clips lol! Thanks man.


----------



## Dogs of Doom

You can bring it over here! ...

Would love to hear a soundclip. Even if just a little mix up of chugging chords, sustaining chords & a couple heavy riffs.

I saw a few images, looks good. Good job man!


----------



## bulldozer1984

DirtySteve = Most respected,well liked and "famous" person at the MF.

There aint a phucker on 'ere that dont know ya name !!


----------



## DirtySteve

I'm going to work on a clip. but y'all don't expect anything fancy.


----------



## solarburn

Your last clips were just great and fancy is what I do when I'm playing air guitar. The only place I can haha!

Can't wait to your creation man. It's your baby...show it off!


----------



## RickyLee

Congrats on your Project Steve!


----------



## Gene Ballzz

Yeah, he's famous alright! The first time I read a post from Steve was when his older avatar was still there. It "inspired" me to look for every one of his posts. C'mon, you all know the pic I'm speaking' of! One o' the finest pics I've seen! I think it was more in keeping with his screen name than the current version!
Gene


----------



## minerman

So, lemme get this straight, the only issue left to sort is the "sag" control??? Do I have that right Steve??? Congrats dude, wish I could hear that thing, but I will soon enough....

Very nice looking stash of tubes you sent Marty, very generous of you man to say the least....

Congrats Steve, well done!!!!!


----------



## rockgod212

congrats on the rebuild, sorry you had to go through all of that. what a difference though. looking at the before pics, im surprised it didnt shock the shit out of you. you did a great job on the rebuild. have fun and rock out with your killer amp.


----------



## rmroza

sound great Steve! i like your thorough explanation on the previous page. Lets see how the sag MOD works out.


----------



## brp

DirtySteve said:


> I'm going to work on a clip. but y'all don't expect anything fancy.



As Dogs said, some sustaining chords and a bit of chunky riffage is all that's required.
Play King Contrary Man and some held chords and you're done.


----------



## mickeydg5

bulldozer1984 said:


> DirtySteve = Most respected,well liked and "famous" person at the MF.
> 
> There aint a phucker on 'ere that dont know ya name !!


Which Dirty Steve? Well who is the other dirty steve? 


Kidding. Steve it will be good to hear the finished product.


----------



## DirtySteve

minerman said:


> So, lemme get this straight, the only issue left to sort is the "sag" control??? Do I have that right Steve??? Congrats dude, wish I could hear that thing, but I will soon enough....
> 
> Very nice looking stash of tubes you sent Marty, very generous of you man to say the least....
> 
> Congrats Steve, well done!!!!!



Yep, that's pretty much it.


----------



## Marshall Gibson

Hey guys this is my first post, so howdy to all ... I'm a friend of Steve's, and I just want y'all to know that this thread and what Steve has done with this amp is what personifies what an amp forum is all about. Steve and the tech savvy guys who helped him here have displayed the very thing that I feel is sorely lacking in this country of late, and that is a sense of camaraderie and mutual interest in _righting the wrong_, it's inspiring to watch. 

Congrat's Steve! hope you rock that amp for many years to come buddy and thanks to all the efforts and patience of all involved the positive outcome of the project.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Welcome aboard Marshall!


----------



## DirtySteve

Thanks brother, good to have you here!  Yes, what has happened here is amazing to me. I'm still in awe of the support and help I received on this. My hats off to all you guys and especially the pros that took the time to make sure I understood what I was doing and not only freely gave their time, but also donated to the cause. I couldn't have done it without you! 

This just confirms that this is a great forum and proof that there are still good people in this world. I'm proud to know you!


----------



## DirtySteve

What a ride!


----------



## MartyStrat54

...still gotta name that sucker.


----------



## DirtySteve

MartyStrat54 said:


> ...still gotta name that sucker.



Indeed...I have a few ideas floating around in my head, but nothing that really stands out. It has to sybolize sweet and nasty at the same time.  Being that it's white with gold piping it looks sweet, but oh she's so dirty!  ...yes it's a she and she's like a nympho that turned out to be a royal bitch!


----------



## DBi5

DirtySteve said:


> Indeed...I have a few ideas floating around in my head, but nothing that really stands out. It has to sybolize sweet and nasty at the same time.  Being that it's white with gold piping it looks sweet, but oh she's so dirty!  ...yes it's a she and she's like a nympho that turned out to be a royal bitch!


 
If I remember correctly you're a big fan of The Cult?

What about "Lil' Devil".


----------



## DirtySteve

DBI5 said:


> If I remember correctly you're a big fan of The Cult?
> 
> What about "Lil' Devil".



Oh dude your definitely on the right track! ...not only is that one of my favorite songs by The Cult...it's the first song I ever learned to play on electric guitar! 

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8BMZdmFa-HU]The Cult - Lil Devil - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## paul-e-mann

DirtySteve said:


> Oh dude your definitely on the right track! ...not only is that one of my favorite songs by The Cult...it's the first song I ever learned to play on electric guitar!
> 
> The Cult - Lil Devil - YouTube



Demo this song with the new Steve amp!


----------



## paul-e-mann

Or this:

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WDjR6FJ91gA]The Cult - Love Removal Machine - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## solarburn

Great ideas DB! Would look sweet and the name is good too.


----------



## brp

Lil' devil isn't a bad name, given your Cult fandom.
But I like Dirty Sturdy.

MF'er is good too.


----------



## DirtySteve

I just can't stop playing it I swear. How is it different than it was before?...it's "alive"...it has a soul...it's better in every way, I can't even explain it...it might even be a little possessed! 

Sorry Billy, but I can say with authority now, it does NOT sound the same...it's so much more.


----------



## 66 galaxie

Glad your lovin it Steve


----------



## thrawn86

66 galaxie said:


> Glad your lovin it Steve



You know, we could do with AN UPDATED PROGRESS PIC at this time.


----------



## damienbeale

thrawn86 said:


> You know, we could do with AN UPDATED PROGRESS PIC at this time.



Too busy playin' I 'xpext.


----------



## DirtySteve

There's not really anything to update yet. I have to rerun the gain, presence and resonance wires with shielded wire and figure out what I did wrong on the sag mod.

...and yes, I've been playing it!


----------



## solarburn

Steve...I got my JMP back from Joey yesterday. My fingers hurt so bad I don't know if I can play today. You having the same thing playing the shit out of yours?LOL

I hope so!


----------



## DirtySteve

Yes, I haven't really played much in the last couple of months since I really got into this and my fingers are a little sore. My calluses are are all peeling, lol!

Congrats on your amp bro!


----------



## solarburn

I play all the time but I couldn't stop all day yesterday. My callouses have blisters haha!

Thanks Steve!


----------



## DirtySteve

Hey Pauly, how about A RECAP OF THE PROGRESS?  (I finally got it, lol)

We started out with this...





Lot's of half ass sloppy work to clean up... 

























Chassis all cleaned up, I was dead set on it for a while, but decided not to paint it.





























Decided to replace pots while I was at it...


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

And so it is. The reckoning.


----------



## DirtySteve

Terry, sorry I haven't messed with the sag mod yet, I've was too busy playing it. I'll work on it tomorrow and try to post a clip. I overdid it this morning working on my truck and I still have an infection so it wiped me out. I'm just now feeling better and I'm going to rock out some more. It's so much fun!


----------



## DirtySteve

You realize it isn't finished yet right? ...and you should also know that I'm not set up to record and have only been playing again for a few years. I'm not looking forward to trying to make clips. I'll do my best, but it will happen when it happens. I've never played in front of people and making a clip I know I'm going to post makes me freeze up just like I was standing in front of you all. It's a big deal. 

I never promised clips (or even thought about it), but I'll give in and say I agree it's required after all of this and I'll try. If I could figure out a way to have someone else do them, short of boxing it up and sending it off, I'd be going that route.


----------



## 4STICKS

charveldan said:


> predict 97 pages and still no clips



[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RL1Vcn8yX1g[/ame]


----------



## brp

thrawn86 said:


> You know, we could do with AN UPDATED PROGRESS PIC at this time.



Haha Pat Sims thread throwback *tips hat*


----------



## Ghostman

Steve, so if I'm understanding this correctly, you've rebuilt an amplifier and the only original parts used are the tranny's and chassis?


----------



## Ghostman

I'd just like to add that since the amp was reborn, it seems to be the antidote to the ill-fabeled BB. lmao.  it's great.

now for the bug spray for some other assholes.


----------



## DirtySteve

Ghostman said:


> Steve, so if I'm understanding this correctly, you've rebuilt an amplifier and the only original parts used are the tranny's and chassis?



...and the power and standby switches, the 110 power jack and the fuse holder and fuse. Hmm, I should probably check the fuse.  Pretty wild ain't it...who'd a thunk?  I was supposed to be building a Tele now.


----------



## 4STICKS

Guitar-Rocker said:


> And so it is. The reckoning.



[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sqcLjcSloXs]Highlander - "There Can Be Only One" - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## DirtySteve

Love the Highlander!...definitely in my top 5! ...and that's the first thing I thought of, too.


----------



## 4STICKS

DirtySteve said:


> Love the Highlander!...definitely in my top 5! ...and that's the first thing I thought of, too.



Well Hell Yeah, Steve!!!!


----------



## DirtySteve

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VEJ8lpCQbyw]Queen - 'Princes Of The Universe' - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## Marshall Gibson

Princes of the universe or .. King of Uranus


----------



## DirtySteve

That's why I laughed.


----------



## Far Rider

I may have missed this, but did you have to set the bias?


----------



## damienbeale

Cathode biased, dear fellow. Fixed resistor.


----------



## DirtySteve

Guys, I'm calling it done!!  ...at least for now, lol. Complete with blood, sweat, a few tears and even a little snot.  I reran my gains, presence and resonance today with shielded wires and it's pretty damn quiet. The gain wires didn't make any difference, but the pres/res wires sure did! 

I also redid the sag mod and even removed the resister from the board and attaching it directly to the switch and it still doesn't work. I guess it's working or it would kill my B+, correct? ...but I can't tell that it's doing anything. Maybe it needs a different resister value or something, I don't know.

Anyhoo, here are some final gut shots in better lighting. Sorry my camera sucks so bad.

I couldn't be happier about the way this turned out! 















...a couple I took the night I first fired it up...again, camera sucks, but these 2 came out kind of cool...












Marty I'm still using the same tubes. I'll roll some this week and report back.  (btw, those GTs are on the way)

Guys, I'll try and come up with a clip to post...even if it sucks.


----------



## brp

Shame on you, BB. THIS^ is someone setting out to do a quality job for his FIRST TIME EVER.
And he's not charging someone $800 for it or claiming it something unique.


----------



## Grenade

You should name this the DSM. DirtySteveModded. Congrats brother. Well done.


----------



## MartyStrat54

Steve if you like the lineup I suggested that's cool. I would however like your feedback of what the 1959 RCA Square Getter sounds like in V1. One thing for sure, keep that wild Black Plate in the PI slot.


----------



## DirtySteve

Grenade said:


> You should name this the DSM. DirtySteveModded. Congrats brother. Well done.



I think it's more like DSLD..."DirtySteve's Lil' Devil".  (unless I find out that's already an amp name)

Credit to DB15!


----------



## DirtySteve

MartyStrat54 said:


> Steve if you like the lineup I suggested that's cool. I would however like your feedback of what the 1959 RCA Square Getter sounds like in V1. One thing for sure, keep that wild Black Plate in the PI slot.



You can count on it!


----------



## paul-e-mann

Its an official wrap! Job well done Steve. Play it to your hearts content.


----------



## bulldozer1984

Great work Steve that looks great man. Hats off to ya ma ln


----------



## DirtySteve

pedecamp said:


> Its an official wrap! Job well done Steve. Play it to your hearts content.





bulldozer1984 said:


> Great work Steve that looks great man. Hats off to ya ma ln



Thanks bros


----------



## minerman

Congrats again Steve!!!!
Looks like a winner to me dude, amazing for your first build IMHO....

I know I keep pushing clips, so I'm gonna apologize dude, post 'em if you do, if not, no worries at all!!!

Just really glad you like the amp, & you being happy with it is all that matters!!!!!


----------



## Stringjunkie

So how is the sound at lower volume?


----------



## rmroza

Cool Steve. I'm a little perplexed we can't get that friggin sag working....hmm. 
Did you but 1N4007's or UF4007's in the rectifier section?

Maybe it should be call DSBST (Dirty Steve's Blood Sweat and Tears! 

I know the thing should sound killer, rips, and is quiet as hell. Great design Jose, wherever you are. God bless you and rest in peace.


----------



## DirtySteve

Stringjunkie said:


> So how is the sound at lower volume?



It sounds great at low volume.


----------



## DirtySteve

rmroza said:


> Cool Steve. I'm a little perplexed we can't get that friggin sag working....hmm.
> Did you but 1N4007's or UF4007's in the rectifier section?
> 
> Maybe it should be call DSBST (Dirty Steve's Blood Sweat and Tears!
> 
> I know the thing should sound killer, rips, and is quiet as hell. Great design Jose, wherever you are. God bless you and rest in peace.



Hey Robb, I used 1N4007s. I don't know what the sag should sound like so at this point I'm not missing anything, but I do wish it did something. If it does it's so subtle I can't tell.


----------



## TwinACStacks

I'm for naming it the "Dirty Blades SOB Amp"

Catchy No?

BTW: VERY Nice work Steve.

 TWIN


----------



## Micky

DirtySteve said:


> Hey Robb, I used 1N4007s. I don't know what the sag should sound like so at this point I'm not missing anything, but I do wish it did something. If it does it's so subtle I can't tell.



Probably won't make much of a difference until you crank it, then hit it hard.
You really need to draw a decent amount of current thru the PT in order to drop the voltage (SAG) enough to make a difference...

That is, unless the mod is designed differently...


----------



## rmroza

"I don't know what the sag should sound like so at this point I'm not missing anything, but I do wish it did something" lol

Yeah, fudge it and disconnect if you don't hear anything over some time with it, at volume.

Don't forget for Plexi sounds, to just turn down the gains and saturation OR turn the gains down to zero, turn the master up to "10", then creep the gains up. You'll love it!


----------



## DirtySteve

Thanks Robb, there's a lot I haven't tried yet, looking forward to experimenting.


----------



## DirtySteve

I just remembered the amp used to pick up a religious radio station before. Hahaha! That's gone... it's dead quiet!


----------



## Stringjunkie

I think you should just get a plate that says 'MINE' on it and leave it be.


----------



## charveldan

Steve to make it to 160 pages ur gonna hafta build another amp or 2.


----------



## gldtp99

Good Job !!! I'm glad this amp turned out like it did, considering its history---........................gldtp99


----------



## GIBSON67

Nice quality build, you did a great job! Pat yourself on the back!


----------



## hbach

Now that is a nice looking amp!


----------



## DirtySteve

Thanks guys.


----------



## rmroza

Steve, to ENSURE no religious channels are playing through the PA during a gig...employ the RF MOD (or no-RF)...

Take a large eyelet lug to fit over the input jack from the inside of the chassis, so that is touches the chassis when the input jack is installed. Solder a 10nF cap from it to ground. That's it!


----------



## DirtySteve

rmroza said:


> Steve, to ENSURE no religious channels are playing through the PA during a gig...employ the RF MOD (or no-RF)...
> 
> Take a large eyelet lug to fit over the input jack from the inside of the chassis, so that is touches the chassis when the input jack is installed. Solder a 10nF cap from it to ground. That's it!



I've read about that, I think it came up in a thread recently. I might just do that thanks for reminding me. 

I have to admit guys I'm lazy tonight. It's back to the old grind and because I was sick last week I'm up to my eyeballs playing catch up. I even had to bring it home with me tonight, I played a little bit, but not much. 

I'm listening to the amp and I swear it sounds different since I changed the gain wires to shielded and moved the sag resister to the switch, which shorted the runs from the standby to the diodes and the B+ (not sure if I worded that right). I really want to understand more about what's going on here with the power and gain sections. 

Maybe it's all in my head...


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Remember me laughing about "just you wait until it starts breaking in" ?


----------



## DirtySteve

Guitar-Rocker said:


> Remember me laughing about "just you wait until it starts breaking in" ?



Well I hope that's all it is, but I wasn't very clear. It's not as good. _edit: Deleted... sorry, I can't seem to get my thought sorted out to say what I was trying to say and it wasn't coming out right...decided to give it more time._


----------



## bulldozer1984

DirtySteve said:


> Well I hope that's all it is, but I wasn't very clear. It's not as good. _edit: Deleted... sorry, I can't seem to get my thought sorted out to say what I was trying to say and it wasn't coming out right...decided to give it more time._



Maybe Charveldan broke in over night and messed with your amp so it wont sound as good as his Friedman come clip time..


----------



## damienbeale

DirtySteve said:


> Well I hope that's all it is, but I wasn't very clear. It's not as good. _edit: Deleted... sorry, I can't seem to get my thought sorted out to say what I was trying to say and it wasn't coming out right...decided to give it more time._



Well the shielded cable will bleed off a little high end...


----------



## charveldan

bulldozer1984 said:


> Maybe Charveldan broke in over night and messed with your amp so it wont sound as good as his Friedman come clip time..
> 
> Sorry I just don't get the man-love about this amp.


----------



## Grenade

I see Dan is a bundle of joy in the morning. I just noticed your location Steve.


----------



## Stringjunkie

charveldan said:


> Sorry I just don't get the man-love about this amp.



And I don't get your ****ing negativity about it


----------



## Grenade

Well, a man got a custom amp built that was a hazard and a joke. TOTAL FAIL on BB's part. He gutted it and rebuilt it with the help of members here and now has a quality piece of gear with his first attempt. TOTAL WIN.


----------



## bulldozer1984

charveldan said:


> Sorry I just don't get the man-love about this amp.



That is because there is something not quite right with you. What, 50+ other members here understand the good that has come out of the whole thing, yet you dont. Its not us (the majority) that is mis-understood, its you..


U think your an internet hard ass. Well your not. Your just a sad little old man that is hated on every guitar forum on the net. 

And that is the truth


----------



## damienbeale

charveldan said:


> Sorry I just don't get the man-love about this amp.



Then fu € k off out of the thread and stop polluting it.

There is no man love for the amp, just for a well-liked member who unfortunately got stiffed by a bs artist.


Huh-huh... ^ he said member and stiffed... oops sorry, wrong thread.


----------



## Ghostman

Grenade said:


> Well, a man got a custom amp built that was a hazard and a joke. TOTAL FAIL on BB's part. He gutted it and rebuilt it with the help of members here and now has a quality piece of gear with his first attempt. TOTAL WIN.



+1


----------



## charveldan

I will say ive been on this forum for 3 years with 980 likes received and 471 given in a little over 3K post which aint a bad average.

Also this has been one of the more neutral forums as far as shitstorm content.

The amp is built, steve is happy, all is right with the world.


----------



## charveldan

charveldan said:


> Steve to make it to 160 pages ur gonna hafta build another amp or 2.


 My last post yesterday to steve ... don't see a tough guy content do you ?


----------



## Stringjunkie

[QUOTE
The amp is buit, steve is happy, all is right with the world, life goes on yada yada yada ...[/QUOTE]

This^


----------



## bulldozer1984

charveldan said:


> My last post yesterday to steve ... don't see a tough guy content do you ?



Are u stupid ?? Read the post I quoted from you in my last comment ? 


How is it not negative ??


----------



## MartyStrat54

> I wake up to find my name dragged into this [yet again] without any input from myself.



Really? No input? That would mean no comments.



> But people in this thread have just gotten ugly.



And they will get uglier if you continue to post negative remarks.

People are happy with their contributions, regular members are happy with what they have read and seen here and Steve is happy with the outcome.

So when you come on this thread acting like "it ain't no big deal," be prepared to get soaked.

Anymore negative comments from you will be deleted. In fact I think I'll take a look at some of your recent comments and do a little editing so that those new to this thread won't be distracted by your "insights."


----------



## 66 galaxie

The whole point of this thread was about taking something negative and making something positive. There are other facets to the story that are also cool, but the thread was never about clips or # of pages.


----------



## charveldan




----------



## brp

lol


----------



## MartyStrat54

"Please don't feed the bear."


----------



## DirtySteve

I said yesterday something changed and it's not the parts breaking in like Terry said. That may be true as well, but what I'm talking about is something that happened either when I ran my shielded wires or changed the way the sag mod was hooked up. 

I didn't think it sounded as good and now know now for sure. I thought it might be all in my head, but I tried some stuff today and it's not just in my head. It's especially noticeable with cleaner single notes (which I didn't try before). They have like a motor boating sound. I couldn't really tell with the gain up except that I knew it was different and not as good. It's like if you stick your tongue out and go pththththth and the cleaner the sound the more noticeable it is.

Also my V1 and V2 tubes flash bright when I flip the power on and they definitely didn't do that before.


----------



## MartyStrat54

Steve. Those are Philips tubes. They flash like that. It's normal. Nothing to be concerned about.

They may not do it all of the time, but it is normal.


----------



## DirtySteve

Thanks Marty. I remember now that when I first put them in there was the night I put the amp in the head box so I wouldn't have noticed it then. I was still sick then and I think my memory is a little foggy on some stuff.


----------



## john l

Well looks like Im going to have to set a few more places at the table in Dans ignore list. Seems like Ill be entertaining company soon.


----------



## DirtySteve

What? ...Dans still here? I didn't hear a thing. 

_I know, I know...you didn't either _


----------



## charveldan

DirtySteve said:


> What? ...Dans still here? I didn't hear a thing.
> 
> _I know, I know...you didn't either _


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Qf6Sv3A9zs]Very Interesting But Also Stupid - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## CoffeeTones

DirtySteve said:


> I said yesterday something changed and it's not the parts breaking in like Terry said. That may be true as well, but what I'm talking about is something that happened either when I ran my shielded wires or changed the way the sag mod was hooked up.
> 
> I didn't think it sounded as good and now know now for sure. I thought it might be all in my head, but I tried some stuff today and it's not just in my head. It's especially noticeable with cleaner single notes (which I didn't try before). They have like a motor boating sound. I couldn't really tell with the gain up except that I knew it was different and not as good. It's like if you stick your tongue out and go pththththth and the cleaner the sound the more noticeable it is.
> 
> Also my V1 and V2 tubes flash bright when I flip the power on and they definitely didn't do that before.



Try taking the sag mod out. Wire the power to the capacitor as it was before, keeping the connection / wire short as possible. Those long leads to the switch are likely the problem.


----------



## rmroza

I was just going to say that. Not sure where we left off, but take out that funking "sag MOD". Not sue what is up, but doesn't seem to be working and causing extra grief, not needed.


----------



## CoffeeTones

How about installing an octal tube rectifier and use a plug in, solid state rectifier instead of sag mod and rectifier diodes on the board? If your power transformer has 5V taps, it would work great and give you a real tube rectifier option.

I would think you'd be getting some old school response from the cathode bias, plus you could play around with bypass cap values across the bias resistor for different response. 25uF to 1000uF cap with 63V or higher rating.


----------



## damienbeale

Just curious as to what type of shielded cable was used on the grids now...
I did have a couple of small builds that suffered from it myself, even using RG174U.
They just sounded better on the verge of instability.


----------



## thrawn86

Should call it the Switch-Blade. Looking good, you'll get the bugs sorted Steve.


----------



## ibmorjamn

DirtySteve said:


> Guys, I'm calling it done!!  ...at least for now, lol. Complete with blood, sweat, a few tears and even a little snot.  I reran my gains, presence and resonance today with shielded wires and it's pretty damn quiet. The gain wires didn't make any difference, but the pres/res wires sure did!
> 
> I also redid the sag mod and even removed the resister from the board and attaching it directly to the switch and it still doesn't work. I guess it's working or it would kill my B+, correct? ...but I can't tell that it's doing anything. Maybe it needs a different resister value or something, I don't know.
> 
> Anyhoo, here are some final gut shots in better lighting. Sorry my camera sucks so bad.
> 
> I couldn't be happier about the way this turned out!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...a couple I took the night I first fired it up...again, camera sucks, but these 2 came out kind of cool...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Marty I'm still using the same tubes. I'll roll some this week and report back.  (btw, those GTs are on the way)
> 
> Guys, I'll try and come up with a clip to post...even if it sucks.


I am quite impressed Steve Dirte !


----------



## bulldozer1984

charveldan said:


> Very Interesting But Also Stupid - YouTube



you would know all about that.


----------



## DirtySteve

CoffeeTones said:


> Try taking the sag mod out. Wire the power to the capacitor as it was before, keeping the connection / wire short as possible. Those long leads to the switch are likely the problem.





rmroza said:


> I was just going to say that. Not sure where we left off, but take out that funking "sag MOD". Not sue what is up, but doesn't seem to be working and causing extra grief, not needed.



That's what I'm going to do. I just haven't had a chance to do it yet. I put my whole life on hold to get it built and now I'm playing catchup, lol. I don't know what I'm missing with it anyway. 



damienbeale said:


> Just curious as to what type of shielded cable was used on the grids now...
> I did have a couple of small builds that suffered from it myself, even using RG174U.
> They just sounded better on the verge of instability.



I used RG174.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Steve, Try putting the 1nf back across Gain 1. I believe I had sent you the wrong value. Even with shielded cables, I have had an occasion or two of small amounts of motor boating until I put the cap back on the pot. I think I sent you the wrong cap, the orange one. Value on your print was 1nf.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

CoffeeTones said:


> How about installing an octal tube rectifier and use a plug in, solid state rectifier instead of sag mod and rectifier diodes on the board? If your power transformer has 5V taps, it would work great and give you a real tube rectifier option.
> 
> I would think you'd be getting some old school response from the cathode bias, plus you could play around with bypass cap values across the bias resistor for different response. 25uF to 1000uF cap with 63V or higher rating.



Discussed that somewhat early on, but Steve doesn't have access to a k.o. for the socket hole.


----------



## DirtySteve

Guitar-Rocker said:


> Steve, Try putting the 1nf back across Gain 1. I believe I had sent you the wrong value. Even with shielded cables, I have had an occasion or two of small amounts of motor boating until I put the cap back on the pot. I think I sent you the wrong cap, the orange one. Value on your print was 1nf.



Cool, I'll try that first, it's the easiest. Thanks Terry.


----------



## DirtySteve

Well I finally had a chance to do this today and sure as shit, it was the cap. No more motor boating and the sound is back, it's badass again! 

Thanks Terry, you are the man!  Only thing left to do is shield the bottom of the head box.


----------



## DirtySteve

Marty the 59 is great in V1, I haven't rolled any others, but I went back and forth between the BEL and the 59 in V1 and the 59 might be a little sweeter, especially on cleaner settings and lighter touch. They both sound great and if I had to choose one or the other I wouldn't be able to decide, lol. I'm looking forward to rolling all of them in different positions, but my time is going to be limited for about a week. I'll let you know what I think as I try things.


----------



## damienbeale

charveldan said:


> I will say ive been on this forum for 3 years with 980 likes received and 471 given in a little over 3K post which aint a bad average.


So is receiving likes for making smartarse remarks supposed to be a measure of greatness or something?

Do tell, as I'm confused as to the relevance of this...


----------



## john l

charveldan said:


> Sorry I just don't get the man-love about this amp.


 
...and that's where everything becomes clear about ol' Dan isn't it.
If he'd just pull his head out of his ass for a second hed be able to see the forest from the trees and understand that the best part of this thread isn't the amp at all lol.


----------



## rmroza

Steve

Any clips yet??

Robb


----------



## MartyStrat54

Hey, I'm the 1,000 post!!!


----------



## charveldan

rmroza said:


> Steve
> 
> Any clips yet??
> 
> Robb


2016+


----------



## Alabama Thunderpussy

DirtySteve said:


> Well I finally had a chance to do this today and sure as shit, it was the cap. No more motor boating and the sound is back, it's badass again!
> 
> Thanks Terry, you are the man!  Only thing left to do is shield the bottom of the head box.



Aluminum self adhesive flashing from Home Depot. Works great


----------



## rmroza

USeal Band 6 in. Aluminum Foil Self-Adhesive Repair Tape-8872AF6 at The Home Depot


----------



## Alabama Thunderpussy

This is what I use. Fuchs audio uses something similar. Nashua Tape, 322 1-57/64 in. x 50 yds. Aluminum Foil Tape, 3220020500 at The Home Depot - Mobile


----------



## mickeydg5

The *better* duct tape.


----------



## Gene Ballzz

Alabama Thunderpussy said:


> This is what I use. Fuchs audio uses something similar. Nashua Tape, 322 1-57/64 in. x 50 yds. Aluminum Foil Tape, 3220020500 at The Home Depot - Mobile



Yepper,
Does the job and the adhesive doesn't dry out and come "un-stuck." Its a good idea to wipe down the area that you apply it to with alcohol or similar to promote best adhesion.
HTH,
Gene


----------



## john l

Nothing wrong with aluminum tape at all, Ive used it and like it fine but if you want something a little beefier Steve you can also go to your local steel framing yard and pick up a piece of "25g flat stock." For some weird reason my brain says that its better even though theres probably no benefit lol


----------



## DirtySteve

I work for a construction company and have access to all sorts of flashing, but for ease of installation I'm going to try the metal duct tape first. I've been busy all weekend with my mom in town and I haven't had a chance to get to HD yet.


----------



## DirtySteve

I had a chance to really crank it and give it a workout for a little while last night (edit: deleted, what I said here is not a problem anymore. *false alarm* ) It sounded so good with the volume on full and gains up around 4. My buddy that was over was blown away!


----------



## 4STICKS

charveldan said:


> 2016+



Dear Charveldan,

Please GO THE FU@K AWAY!

Sincerely,

Every damn body!


----------



## Marshall Gibson

4STICKS said:


> Dear Charveldan,
> 
> Please GO THE FU@K AWAY!
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> Every damn body!



Amen to that!


----------



## DirtySteve

I edited my last post if anyone saw it...

BTW, I can't say when but there is a clip coming, you can thank Shredless!   ...I made a promise and I will keep it.


----------



## john l

Hey you get to it when you get to it Steve. "You're" hearing it and "you're" liking it, that's all that matters. So stoked for you buddy.


----------



## charveldan

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jCxLFfSh3Tg


Nope, not going anywhere, my forum too.


----------



## rmroza

Cool. Thanks for the foil-tape link and clarification. I may try some of this. Usually, I get aluminum sheets and cut them to size (and drill holes), but this seems easier and have to crunch if more cost effective. Do them sell wider tape thou?? My chassis are 6.5"

Robb


----------



## solarburn

charveldan said:


> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jCxLFfSh3Tg



That's one pissed off JMP.


----------



## solarburn

DirtySteve said:


> I edited my last post if anyone saw it...
> 
> BTW, I can't say when but there is a clip coming, you can thank Shredless!   ...I made a promise and I will keep it.



Don't you stress a lick over that clip. You're plenty capable and no one here will say stupid shit anyways. We want to bask in the tones!

The build was the mission and mission accomplished!


----------



## bulldozer1984

charveldan said:


> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jCxLFfSh3Tg
> 
> 
> Nope, not going anywhere, my forum too.



Yeh thats the way. Post a 2 yr old clip of your Jose mod for the 300th time.


----------



## damienbeale

Cause that's really relevant in somebody else's build thread, after all...

Aaaaand enough about you... look here's ME!


----------



## solarburn




----------



## charveldan

solarburnDSL50 said:


> That's one pissed off JMP.



GGGRRRrrrrrrrrrrr....... !!!!!


----------



## john l

charveldan said:


> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jCxLFfSh3Tg
> 
> 
> Nope, not going anywhere, my forum too.


 
Yes indeed, that's why no one understood at first why you were shitting where you eat and then it became clear to us that in light of your love affair with Friedman you in fact may actually like to eat shit.


----------



## DirtySteve

Well, I'm hooked! I guess I'm going to have to build another one of these from the ground up, lol! The cleanish plexi tones with the volume up and the gains low are kicking my ass! I've never had an amp I liked the clean channel on, including my DSL40, but this thing sounds incredible clean. I was going to look at getting another amp that has good cleans, but I have it right here. I'm going need one set for clean(ish) and one for dirt with a a/b switcher. Maybe I'll have to do a tube rectifier on the next one, haha!

I can tell you this, BBs version didn't have cleans like this. In fact I couldn't get any of these tones out of it. Just full on metal was all I could get out of it and even that's better now, this is so much more versatile. It's got everything I've always wanted and so much more. I just can't get over it! 

I have some time today and I'm trying to record something worth posting, but I haven't got anything that sounds good enough yet. Trying to find a spot to place my recorder where it isn't sounding muddy and distorted is my problem right now. The clip I posted before was recorded at very low volume, but that doesn't do this justice. I'm working on it...


----------



## Grenade




----------



## brp

How funny would it be (karma-wise) if Steve started building and selling these on the forum?


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

brp said:


> How funny would it be (karma-wise) if Steve started building and selling these on the forum?


 
Maybe Steve can sell them to Billy, then Billy would have something decent to sell.


----------



## brp

oh snap


----------



## DirtySteve

Well lets not get carried away, lol. I need a lot more practice. I'm a perfectionist and I'm not exactly completely happy with the way my soldering looks. It's not as pretty as I would have liked it. Granted it isn't triple soldered either, lol. The next one will be better though. I learned a lot and there are some things I will do different starting out fresh and that's the real reason I want to do another. I think I can do it better. Soldering on turrets was a huge learning curve. I've been soldering a long time, but on much easier stuff. This also isn't going to happen until I build my Tele first.


----------



## solarburn

DirtySteve said:


> I have some time today and I'm trying to record something worth posting, but I haven't got anything that sounds good enough yet. Trying to find a spot to place my recorder where it isn't sounding muddy and distorted is my problem right now. The clip I posted before was recorded at very low volume, but that doesn't do this justice. I'm working on it...



I had to settle for low volume with mine Steve. There is just too much push on the phone mic when I try to capture the amp wamp.LOL

Good luck finding a sweet spot. You know on my plexi voicing I noticed the cleans to be really nice too. It will work wonderfully for cleanish stuff. The other 2 voicings I have scoff at clean anything haha! I can tell you are enjoying the tones in that box. Play the shit out of it.

Congrats again on the revamp/build. That's your baby...let's here it cry and scream. No diapers buddy!


----------



## DirtySteve

I just have a little voice recorder...maybe if I buy a good mic I'd get better results?


----------



## DirtySteve

Guitar-Rocker said:


> Maybe Steve can sell them to Billy, then Billy would have something decent to sell.



 That's too funny, man....on a couple of levels, lol.


----------



## charveldan

DirtySteve said:


> Well, I'm hooked! I guess I'm going to have to build another one of these from the ground up, lol! The cleanish plexi tones with the volume up and the gains low are kicking my ass! I've never had an amp I liked the clean channel on, including my DSL40, but this thing sounds incredible clean. I was going to look at getting another amp that has good cleans, but I have it right here. I'm going need one set for clean(ish) and one for dirt with a a/b switcher. Maybe I'll have to do a tube rectifier on the next one, haha!
> 
> I can tell you this, BBs version didn't have cleans like this. In fact I couldn't get any of these tones out of it. Just full on metal was all I could get out of it and even that's better now, this is so much more versatile. It's got everything I've always wanted and so much more. I just can't get over it!
> 
> I have some time today and I'm trying to record something worth posting, but I haven't got anything that sounds good enough yet. Trying to find a spot to place my recorder where it isn't sounding muddy and distorted is my problem right now. The clip I posted before was recorded at very low volume, but that doesn't do this justice. I'm working on it...


Build a 100 watt, go big or don't go ...


----------



## brp

Why the hell would he want that?


----------



## DirtySteve

My Class 5 wasn't quite enough, my DSL40 was more than I needed...this sits right in the pocket. It's perfect!


----------



## Guitar-Rocker




----------



## charveldan

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=inQrMmh6QaE


----------



## scat7s

DirtySteve said:


> I just have a little voice recorder...maybe if I buy a good mic I'd get better results?


 
nope. any old cheap mic should get decent results. a guitar amp isnt really utilizing a very wide frequency range. 


try setting the recorder right up on the grill, (sensitivity or record volume down). if it has a "peak reduction" feature, turn it on. 

point the mic straight at the speaker splitting the difference between the dust cover and the cone. so theoretically, half the mics capsule is covering the cone, the other half is picking up the voice coil/dust cap. 

see how that sounds, tweak as needed.


----------



## thrawn86

Steve, will you please just post AN UPDATED clip so charveldan can bash it?


----------



## bulldozer1984

DirtySteve said:


> I just have a little voice recorder...maybe if I buy a good mic I'd get better results?



Scat gave you some great advice which should work fine.. 

If it doesnt then yeh an external mic might be in order. 

First off, what brand and model no. recorder is it ?


----------



## charveldan

thrawn86 said:


> Steve, will you please just post AN UPDATED clip so charveldan can bash it?


Who sez im gonna bash it ?

Just wanna hear what the 6 month 40 pages are all about.

Hell Beyoncé's new album was just released without any promo whatsoever and is the most popular in history.

I'm sure Steve's amp sounds fine.

Don't forget the hot glue, sharpie & triple solder for Cameron toan ...


----------



## rmroza

It should sound something like this - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6vOgkN8wiw

With the cathode bias and filtering scheme, I tink we just want to hear what that sounds like. We know what Jose HG sounds like.

Yeah, clips as soo as you can and put this thread to bed and lock it down. The amp works, sounds good, and play time is over. If you're waiting on "perfect" clips...just record wit a camera for a taste, then follow up with the final. I'm sure it's coming soon.


----------



## DirtySteve

I hope you guys aren't expecting something like that!


----------



## DirtySteve

scat7s said:


> nope. any old cheap mic should get decent results. a guitar amp isnt really utilizing a very wide frequency range.
> 
> 
> try setting the recorder right up on the grill, (sensitivity or record volume down). if it has a "peak reduction" feature, turn it on.
> 
> point the mic straight at the speaker splitting the difference between the dust cover and the cone. so theoretically, half the mics capsule is covering the cone, the other half is picking up the voice coil/dust cap.
> 
> see how that sounds, tweak as needed.



Thanks Scat, sorry I didn't make it back last night. I saw your posrt though. I'll try this for sure.



bulldozer1984 said:


> Scat gave you some great advice which should work fine..
> 
> If it doesnt then yeh an external mic might be in order.
> 
> First off, what brand and model no. recorder is it ?



Olympus® VN-702PC Digital Audio Recorder


----------



## charveldan

You want this dude ... $300 bucks but nice.


----------



## Stringjunkie

After you get the sound on there, what do you do with it? Where do you load it to? I have a tascam but I'm too stupid to know how to use it. 
I'd love to have the zoom. It looks easy. 

Easy is good for me.


----------



## DirtySteve

If I remember correctly when I did it before I had to download itunes to my computer and save it to that. Then I made a soundcloud account and loaded it on there to post it. It's been a while and I deleted my soundcloud account so I have to start over. I haven't gotten that far yet.


----------



## DirtySteve

Yeah that zoom looks like it would be much better, but I didn't want to spend that much at the time. Eventually I need to get something like that...or the tascam. I'd like to have something that can multi-track.


----------



## damienbeale

I don't understand why there's so much pressure for clips...

Amp is RE-built PROPERLY and safely, and Steve is super happy with it, that's mission accomplished as far as I'm concerned. Thread concluded.


----------



## Micky

Maybe Steve should ask a Mod to close the thread?


----------



## CoffeeTones

No pressure from me but I would like to hear that mod in a proper 18w, EL84 platform. Steve wants to do a clip and keep his word from what I understand. He and others are also learning more about recording and devices from the posts.

Reason to stress on either side is beyond me.


----------



## DirtySteve

Micky said:


> Maybe Steve should ask a Mod to close the thread?



I almost did that already, but then decided if I am doing a clip I don't really want to start a new thread for it. I'd rather it be buried in here!


----------



## brp

That Olympus should do a decent enough job, Steve, provided you use the right format.

You can also encode MP3 with Audacity for free, but your recorder will do that automatically.
Might need to back it away from the cab to avoid clipping the mic though, depending how loud you have it.


----------



## DirtySteve

brp said:


> That Olympus should do a decent enough job, Steve, provided you use the right format.
> 
> You can also encode MP3 with Audacity for free, but your recorder will do that automatically.
> Might need to back it away from the cab to avoid clipping the mic though, depending how loud you have it.



I think the problem might be the room. It has lousy acoustics and when I back it away and turn up the volume it records really muddy and muffled.


----------



## scat7s

thats sounds quite reasonable steve. when you start picking up square room reflections...it can get muddled/phasey 

the close mic technique will likely sound 'different' than you hear it with your ears in a room, but should give you the purest results...by eliminating phase and reflections. 

when up close, the slightest position shift can dramatically alter what you hear on playback. dont be afraid to experiment with your amps settings as well. recorded tone and ambient room tone (as percieved by your ears) can be very different things.

getting "close" to what you hear in the room is probably the best you can hope for. 

the close micing will also give it a more "in your face" sort of feel. but like brp said, watch your levels, its ok to peak momentarily once in a while, that will ensure you have nice hot levels, but steady peaking will sound shitty. digital distortion.


----------



## charveldan

DirtySteve said:


> I almost did that already, but then decided if I am doing a clip I don't really want to start a new thread for it. I'd rather it be buried in here!


Yeah cuz if theres one thing you don't want to do on a forum is start a new thread ... :deadhorse::deadhorse::deadhorse::deadhorse::deadhorse::deadhorse::deadhorse::deadhorse::deadhorse::minions:


----------



## DirtySteve

When I made my recording before I had the recorder about 3 or 4 ft from the speaker straight out in front. Some guys said I needed to turn it up some and that's when I tried to move it further away and it all fell apart. I guess I need to just stick with what worked before. 

I didn't consider the recorded sound being different from what I hear was anything other than the recorder, thanks for the tips Scat. I wasn't really happy with that recording, but I never tried changing any settings. I didn't know to, I was just scratching my head.


----------



## scat7s

it can be daunting, but once you get a routine established, it will be easily repeatable with predictable results.


----------



## DirtySteve

brp said:


> That Olympus should do a decent enough job, Steve, provided you use the right format.
> 
> You can also encode MP3 with Audacity for free, but your recorder will do that automatically.
> Might need to back it away from the cab to avoid clipping the mic though, depending how loud you have it.



The right format?  Maybe I'd better get the book out again...


----------



## scat7s

wave will yeild the best quality.


----------



## 2203xman

I thought that your first clip was actually pretty darn good.All I have is my digital camera,and the 18 watter cranked, clips it most everytime.Even way across the room!


----------



## DirtySteve

It has 2 record modes, MP3 and WMA. It also has a low cut filter and something called VCVA? I can't find my book for it.


----------



## damienbeale

WMA is what you want, out of those two. At the highest bit-rate it will allow (IF it is variable).


----------



## brp

Yep, it does up to 32kbps WMA, That's what I meant by format, use the highest quality setting.
Of course if you're going to code it to MP3 later might as well do it in the recorder,
only use WMA if you're going to upload WMA (which you should).

I think the VCVA is voice activated recording, nothing you need to worry about.


----------



## DirtySteve

Cool thanks guys, I have it set WMA at 32 bit. So I shouldn't worry about the low cut filter?


----------



## damienbeale

DirtySteve said:


> Cool thanks guys, I have it set WMA at 32 bit. So I shouldn't worry about the low cut filter?



Only if it seems overwhelmed by the bass, and flubby.
Although, mostly if this does happen, it will be due to the mic being overwhelmed, so it won't help.
If it happens, try it, but I suspect only re-positioning will cure it.

Try and get the unit in the same position that sounds best to you. If you think it sounds best standing up at head height, try to get the recorder up there. After all, you're not trying to get a recording tone and produce it, you're after a "room tone".

If it sounds clipped, lower the recording level. I would suspect this unit is more than capable of getting a half decent recording.


----------



## DirtySteve

Thanks


----------



## DirtySteve

Well so far this is just pissing me off! It picks up everything I don't want louder than what I'm doing. The amp still has some hiss. I'm hoping the head box shielding will take care of it, but I haven't done it yet and the recorder picks it up louder than I can even hear it. 

I also just had a new nut put on my LP and the guy did a crappy job. I took it back to him and he still did a crappy job so I'm waiting to get a new preslotted nut and I'm going to do it myself, like I should have done in the first place, but it's on back order for 5 more days. (yes I know how to do it, but it takes me a while and I just wanted it done) It buzzes on the E and A strings and deadens them and sounds like crap recorded. It's bad enough that I can't play, it at least has to sound good. 

I was too into the build and neglected to get my guitar fixed up before the amp was done like I'd planned to. I'm paying for it now.  It'll be a little while...sorry. This may sound like an excuse, but I swear it's not. I honestly wanted to get this done tonight so I could move on.


----------



## brp

Use a Godin? You have a couple right?


----------



## DirtySteve

brp said:


> Use a Godin? You have a couple right?



Yes I have a couple, but I'm selling them to fund my next project...my Tele build.  Which is what I was supposed to be building instead of an amp. Funny how things change. 

One is back to stock and the pickups suck so I don't want to use it and the other one has no pickups in it because I was in the process of putting the stock ones back in when this all started. All I have to use is my LP at the moment.


----------



## brp

Nuts on backorder? Have you tried GFS?


----------



## DirtySteve

No, I went with Stewmac. I didn't know where else. I have a confession now. This all happened last week and I already ordered a nut and received it, but I ordered the wrong string spacing. I swear!...I order wrong parts all the time, I suck at this! So I ordered the right one, but didn't notice that it's out of stock for 5-7 days...that was Sunday.


----------



## brp

lol
Man, I stress about ordering parts online for that reason. Always thinking I overlooked something and fear ordering the wrong thing. I have to triple check and then sleep on it for a week, then start over and try to find where I'm about to fvck up.
Especially stressful being in Canada due to border/customs complications.


----------



## Gene Ballzz

Hey Steve,
Here's a link to the manual for your recorder:

http://www.olympusamerica.com/files/oima_cckb/VN-702PC_VN-701PC_Detailed_Instructions_EN.pdf

It appears to not have any recording level controls, other than high & low. Using the voice memo function in an iPhone may be a better way to go, but try some different positions with the Olympus and see how it goes.
HTH,
Gene


----------



## JayCM800

Just do the clip with a phone! FFS!
[ame]http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Cw4F2k41VrQ[/ame]

No pressure! LOL


----------



## brp

Wait, you didn't get rid of the beer warmer on top, did you?


----------



## rmroza

"I don't understand why there's so much pressure for clips"

It's like what CoffeeTone said...we want to know how it sounds in cathode-biased, small tube break up, etc.

After the clips....then yeah, I think we can close it down.


----------



## DirtySteve

JayCM800 said:


> Just do the clip with a phone! FFS!
> http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Cw4F2k41VrQ
> 
> No pressure! LOL



Haha, that amp is no more.  I have a cheap flip phone and even if I could figure out how to record with it I wouldn't have a way to get it off of it, lol. I'm pathetic, I know...


----------



## DirtySteve

rmroza said:


> "I don't understand why there's so much pressure for clips"
> 
> It's like what CoffeeTone said...we want to know how it sounds in cathode-biased, small tube break up, etc.
> 
> After the clips....then yeah, I think we can close it down.



I agree it's required, but I don't want to embarrass myself in the process. Sorry I'm not set up for this. I'll work it out, I always do.


----------



## rmroza

I don't think you want Aldrich Steve. It's a great design by Mark, but a one trick pony. It has huge amounts of gain that multiple people have said when they've come over the amp is on the verge of being out of control! With that, it's noisy or much noisier than a Jose-style amp.

Virtually all artists you stated you should be able to get that tone including VH. You may need to hit it even more with an overdrive, include another gain stage on the front end or use of a compressor and change a few values or use an EQ to tweak, but VH should be there also!


----------



## DirtySteve

Nah, I don't play VH, did I say that somewhere? I didn't mean it that way if I did. I'm more into early thrash and 80's hard rock stuff and back to 70's hard rock. Nazareth and Foghat and shit like that, but with more gain. Lately I'm kind of in a transition stage. I play shit like "tweeter and the monkey man" with Hetfield type tone.


----------



## DirtySteve

brp said:


> Nuts on backorder? Have you tried GFS?



I cancelled my order with Stewmac and ordered one from GFS. ...and it was was $10 less. Thanks man!


----------



## 66 galaxie

Steve, next time you need a nut, let me know.


----------



## DirtySteve

Thanks Alex.


----------



## MartyStrat54

66 galaxie said:


> Steve, next time you need a nut, let me know.



There's a few running around this place.


----------



## charveldan

66 galaxie said:


> Steve, next time you need a nut, let me know.










poast has tendencies ...


----------



## thrawn86

charveldan said:


> poast has tendencies ...



Post. Post, Dan. Poast is something my 2 year old spells on his white board and says he eats with 'pan a cakes' and eggs.

Some of us have to work for a living. Some of us are not rich, as you are, and have time to relive the glory days through an old set of amp clips. We also are patient, unlike your generation. Steve is doing it right. You are an incredible bag. I know you already knew that, but it bore repeating. That means it's worth saying again, if you weren't sure.

Oh, and the topic of 'no new threads?' No quicker way to kill a forum. Is that your grand design? Excellent strategy. Soon it will be just you and your amps in here, re-living how cool guys like you, Chuck Norris and the Fonzie are, and still not having any UPDATED CLIPS (that's for Alex, not you, sorry to confuse), just the same old stuff.

Steve will deliver and I have full faith in him. I also had faith in your crapulence. (That means that you're crappy, again, we all knew that) Anyway, people set in their ways like yourself just don't change, so I'll await the retort (that means your nasty response) full of superficial angst and be on my merry way, hoping you know all the live long day that I couldn't possibly care any less.

Have a day.


----------



## Ghostman

66 galaxie said:


> Steve, next time you need *TO* nut, let me know.



.....that's how I read that. I needed to stop for a few minutes and contemplate exactly WHAT forum I was in again.....


----------



## MartyStrat54

Hee Hee Hee. Love it!


----------



## charveldan

This thread is 3 months and 37 pages of my life i'll never get back.

thrawn, nothing wrong with having money, I've done with and without and are smart enough to know I don't want to be without.

BTW you are a tool. :yoda::ban:


----------



## DirtySteve

Actually, the thread was about the build and it is done. Mission accomplished. I never promised clips until the end. I've tried to be clear that I'm not set up for it nor am I comfortable with it, but I'm doing the best I can. If that's not good enough for you I really don't care.


----------



## charveldan

DirtySteve said:


> Actually, the thread was about the build and it is done. Mission accomplished. I never promised clips until the end. I've tried to be clear that I'm not set up for it nor am I comfortable with it, but I'm doing the best I can. If that's not good enough for you I really don't care.


Right, its a wrap. Lets move on.

Having a 37 page 3 month thread about building an amp with no clips at the end is like going to Vegas and hiring a $1500 an hour hooker and asking her to leave without giving you a happy ending.








Know what I mean Vern ?


----------



## Grenade

Steve I have a usb mike I will send you and you can record to soundcloud or where ever if you like, PM me. Dan STFU bitch, you have proven yourself to be nothing but a dick.


----------



## MartyStrat54

charveldan said:


> This thread is 3 months and 37 pages of my life i'll never get back.



I want you to know Dan that I am truly sorry that you were forced to come on this thread and participate in it.

I guarantee you that I will look into finding out how this occurred and rectify it immediately.

We just don't need to let these kind of things happen. 

Until I can get to the bottom of it, try avoiding this thread.


----------



## Grenade

Thank you Marty.


----------



## Gene Ballzz

Dan,
I don't often lash out and generally take people's personal traits/foibles in stride, HELL, I even stuck up for your privilege to be who you are! However………..:
A-This thread is 2 months old to this day!
B-This young man did one f-ck of a good job for a novice!
C-This thread is really a tribute to the camaraderie and helpful/outgoing/supportive nature of many members on this forum.
D-You whine about clips, while the only thing *YOU* give us is a 2-ish year old clip. If ya gottzz some hair on them there raisins, show us what yer doin' *NOW*!
E-While you seem to be a knowledgable guy, nobody asked you to follow Steve's trials and tribulations or make derogatory comments!

C'mon, show us them raisins and if they turn out to be walnuts, we'll give ya the credit deserved!

My 
Gene


----------



## john l

Jayzus enoughs enough. All in favor of Marty shit canning this clown already...?


----------



## 66 galaxie

dan, I'm glad that you feel like you wasted three months of your life on this thread. Now you should know (should being the key word) not to bother wasting your time coming into a thread, and waiting for something that was never promised in the first place.
oh, and your updated progress retort to Mr Thrawn was exactly what I expected. Thanks for playing. to Mr Thrawn was exactly what we expected.


----------



## charveldan

Mod edit. Off topic.


----------



## damienbeale

charveldan said:


> Having a 37 page 3 month thread about building an amp with no clips at the end is like going to Vegas and hiring a $1500 an hour hooker and asking her to leave without giving you a happy ending.


Other than the fact that we know what you're like Dan, I fail to see why you say this thread does not deliver. This thread was not an "ooh, look at me, I'm building an amp..." thread at all. There was no promises made.

This thread was simply for the benefit of Steve, not you, or anybody else. It was to document the process of rebuilding a rats nest, in order for more experienced people around the world who had generously offered their time, experience, help, and indeed components to give advice where required, check Steve's progress, and make sure he hadn't done anything wrong.

The thread has served it's purpose. It wasn't here to make you want an amp. What do clips matter? It's not like this amp is for sale, or for anybody else's benefit other than Steve...

Anybody else reading this thread did so willfully, and has no right to expect anything of Steve. As do none of us, really, unless it was part of the deal behind the scenes with Rob and Terry...

Steve owes us nothing. Not one little bit. I don't recall paying him for sex either...


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

As for me, Steve owes me nothing. He has offered several times to compensate, but my reply to him is to someday pay it forward, however he may to someone else. The triumph of rebuilding a potential death trap to a very useable tone machine is kudos enough here on my end. My final thoughts on this thread are thank you to Robb, and job well done Steve.


----------



## DirtySteve

damienbeale said:


> Other than the fact that we know what you're like Dan, I fail to see why you say this thread does not deliver. This thread was not an "ooh, look at me, I'm building an amp..." thread at all. There was no promises made.
> 
> This thread was simply for the benefit of Steve, not you, or anybody else. It was to document the process of rebuilding a rats nest, in order for more experienced people around the world who had generously offered their time, experience, help, and indeed components to give advice where required, check Steve's progress, and make sure he hadn't done anything wrong.
> 
> The thread has served it's purpose. It wasn't here to make you want an amp. What do clips matter? It's not like this amp is for sale, or for anybody else's benefit other than Steve...
> 
> Anybody else reading this thread did so willfully, and has no right to expect anything of Steve. As do none of us, really, unless it was part of the deal behind the scenes with Rob and Terry...
> 
> Steve owes us nothing. Not one little bit. I don't recall paying him for sex either...



I think it has. For me this is the end of a long embarrassing journey that started almost a year ago. It's been a stressful situation from the start as you guys that have followed the whole saga well know. btw thank you all for not laughing me out of here like other forums would have done. 

This was the finale and I proved my point!!!! That's what it was about and I wanted it to be documented out in the open. I didn't want any room for anyone cool to try and say I sent it off and didn't do the work myself. That's why this thread.

When I did pull off the build and it looked good and worked right I was ready to kick back, it was was my chance to take a breath and enjoy the satisfaction. Instead I'm under pressure to make a clip and stressing instead of just enjoying the amp and getting to know it. Reaping the fruits and all that...

On top of that I paid a guy to screw up my guitar all because I went against my better judgement to get it done quick all to try and make this clip that I'm not even comfortable posting! All I'm thinking about is how I'm going to pull it off without embarrassing myself! Dan's not the only one that wants to hear it. (but he is the only one being a dick about it) I get that it needs a clip and I'll get one, but I'm done stressing as of right now. I'll get it when I get it!

I guess that turned into a rant, that wasn't the intent, but it just came out that way. I feel better now. It's Christmas dammit! 

Mods if you think this thread is done then so be it. I'll start another thread in the other amp section later when I get a clip I'm comfortable with. ...and Marty when I get a chance to roll some tubes I can post it either there or in the tube threads.

Thanks everyone!


----------



## charveldan

Mod edit.


----------



## DBi5

charveldan said:


> Merry Xmas, Happy Holidays.
> 
> Mod edit.
> [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3krPVXH84Vw"]Aldi - Fine Wines - Christmas 2013 - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## charveldan

Mod edit

Don't forget these ... [relatively world famous]

I think I'm the only one with my own Bant meme.


----------



## paul-e-mann

Steve relax and enjoy that amp, make sounds clips when and if you feel like it even if never. Job well done, you should be proud! 

Merry Christmas to you and everyone else!


----------



## DirtySteve

pedecamp said:


> Steve relax and enjoy that amp, make sounds clips when and if you feel like it even if never. Job well done, you should be proud!
> 
> Merry Christmas to you and everyone else!



Merry Christmas to you too, man.


----------



## 66 galaxie

Dan, one good thing about you. You can take a lot of crap and not let it bug you too much.
It takes a lot to be able to laugh at yourself.
Merry Christmas.


----------



## charveldan

66 galaxie said:


> Dan, one good thing about you. You can take a lot of crap and not let it bug you too much.
> It takes a lot to be able to laugh at yourself.
> Merry Christmas.










Merry Xmas to all dudes, its been a good thread.


----------



## damienbeale

charveldan said:


> Back to talking Marshall amps ...[since this is Marshall forum.


Oh goody, so this means you're finally going to stfu about your Friedmans then????


----------



## 2203xman

pedecamp said:


> Steve relax and enjoy that amp, make sounds clips when and if you feel like it even if never. Job well done, you should be proud!
> 
> Merry Christmas to you and everyone else!


 Enjoy your holiday amp!.....Fun Time!


----------



## thrawn86

.......I kinda wish there were some clips though.


----------



## DirtySteve

Marty, I told you I couldn't tell a lot of difference when I swapped the 59 back and forth with the BEL. Well now I've been playing my amp with the 59 in V1 there for over a week now and today I swapped it back to the BEL and I could definitely tell the difference! When I was swapping them before I wasn't using as much gain, but today I was rocking out full bore.

The '59 sounds great at cleaner lower gain settings, but the BEL wins hands down at high gain. The 59 is kind of jangly in the top end, a good thing cleaner, but too harsh at higher gain. The BEL is smoother and has kind of a bark at high gain. Man it Rocks! Reminds me a lot of the high gain MiniWatt I have.


----------



## DirtySteve

Ok, now I've tried your "for shits and giggles" request and put the Canadian Mullard in the PI, the BEL in V2 and the ultra gain BP in V1. Haha, what a beast with that line up. It's brutal, but also very bright and a little bit harsh. Next I swapped V1 and the PI leaving the BEL in V2. It was ok, but not as good as the Canadian in V2 and the BEL in V1. 

I think that's my line up. BEL in V1, Canadian Mullard in V2 and BP in the PI, but I'll try the RCA in V2, I haven't done that yet.


----------



## blues_n_cues

clips or not it's one helluva'n improvement on looks alone.


----------



## DirtySteve

I almost screwed up big time! I almost sold my Godin. I was in the process of putting it back stock to sell when this amp project started and I never finished. It's been sitting without any pickups for months. 

Since my LP is messed up at the moment (I won't get my nut til monday) I put a pickup back in it last night so I could play. The action was way high because the weather changed and I haven't played it in so long I hadn't tweaked the truss rod. I got it set up and I've been rocking it all day. What an awesome guitar it is. I guess I'll be keeping it after all. 

It's this one.


----------



## DirtySteve

blues_n_cues said:


> clips or not it's one helluva'n improvement on looks alone.



Thanks Blues. It's an improvement soundwise too.

----------------------------------

One more thing and I'll shut up, lol...what can I say, it's been a fun day.  I shielded the headbox today and it cut the remaining hiss in half. There's still a little, but it's not so bad. Also, and I guess it's just my ears adjusting or the parts breaking in like Terry said, but I can tell that the sag mod is doing something. It's just subtle is all. I didn't notice it doing anything before, but now I can, don't know why. It's just not as much as I thought it would be. Maybe it's more noticeable at higher volume. I haven't really cranked it today.


----------



## DirtySteve

I just saw this video in another thread that was posted about a bright cap, but at the beginning he talks about his power switch being a 3 position switch where in one position it drops the voltage and has a sag effect by his description. I don't know if it's the same thing, but to me what he's getting is just what I'm getting with my sag mod. I notice about as much difference in his as I do in my sag mod. It's not a drastic difference to me....maybe it's my ears. To me there's more of a feel difference than sound. ...and it's subtle. Not knowing what it did, maybe I was just expecting something different. This is what it does. At about 1:30...


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SsYBem8obKw]Metropoulos 12,000 Series Features - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

George is a lot of fun to talk to, he is a wealth of knowledge. It was a high point for me last year to have him tear up one of my amps, great player.


----------



## blues_n_cues

DirtySteve said:


> I just saw this video in another thread that was posted about a bright cap, but at the beginning he talks about his power switch being a 3 position switch where in one position it drops the voltage and has a sag effect by his description. I don't know if it's the same thing, but to me what he's getting is just what I'm getting with my sag mod. I notice about as much difference in his as I do in my sag mod. It's not a drastic difference to me....maybe it's my ears. To me there's more of a feel difference than sound. ...and it's subtle. Not knowing what it did, maybe I was just expecting something different. This is what it does. At about 1:30...
> 
> 
> Metropoulos 12,000 Series Features - YouTube



I can get into that.


----------



## 2203xman

Guitar-Rocker said:


> George is a lot of fun to talk to, he is a wealth of knowledge. It was a high point for me last year to have him tear up one of my amps, great player.


 Seems like a really cool guy,nice tone and playing as well...loved that vid Steve!


----------



## charveldan

No offense steve, I know you love ur amp but theres no way possiblle to compare your combo to a 100 Super Lead.

Lets keep things real.

I know a guy that does tattoos that can set u up with a 100 watt Cameron ...


----------



## Stringjunkie

He was talking about the friggin sag thingy he did and what IT sounded like. Not the amp.


----------



## charveldan

Stringjunkie said:


> He was talking about the friggin sag thingy he did and what IT sounded like. Not the amp.


"Sag mod" is part of the amp correct ?

Wasn't talking about a coffee pot I assume.

Whatever, wonder if steve has ever played a 60's/70's Marshall ?

Nothing new in this thread from the dead.

Can hear the butthurt now "how dare charvedan talk down to steve and the makeover thread" ...

You guys are adults right ?

If he's comparing a 20 watt blades combo to a Metro 12K or 60's JMP id say that his ear isn't finely tuned and has a genericly broad spectrum, but what do I know ...


----------



## DirtySteve

I was only trying to illustrate what the sag mod does, nothing else. My amp is not a Blades amp anymore, it's an 18 watt Cameron Jose HG.


----------



## 66 galaxie

charveldan said:


> "Sag mod" is part of the amp correct ?
> 
> Wasn't talking about a coffee pot I assume.
> 
> Whatever, wonder if steve has ever played a 60's/70's Marshall ?
> 
> Nothing new in this thread from the dead.
> 
> Can hear the butthurt now "how dare charvedan talk down to steve and the makeover thread" ...
> 
> You guys are adults right ?
> 
> If he's comparing a 20 watt blades combo to a Metro 12K or 60's JMP id say that his ear isn't finely tuned and has a genericly broad spectrum, but what do I know ...


----------



## charveldan

DirtySteve said:


> I was only trying to illustrate what the sag mod does, nothing else. My amp is not a Blades amp anymore, it's an 18 watt Cameron Jose HG.



Ohh ... Cameron, did Mark mod it himself ?

The JTM-45 has a little sag because of the GZ-34 rectifier.

1987, 1959, 2204 & 2203 JMP's have SS retification and no "sag" at all, they are very tight and you will hear all your mistakes, which if you practice will make you a better player.

Not to slam you steve but I'm a guy on a budget like you and its taken me a long time to get decent stuff.

If you want to call ur amp a Rembrant it's all right by me, merry Xmas.


----------



## MartyStrat54

charveldan said:


> You guys are adults right ?



Are you? 

Oh I wanted to ask you something. You use that old sig picture showing two JMP's. I distinctly remember you posting that you sold the unmodded one. 

Why do you use the sig picture showing that you have two JMP's?


----------



## charveldan

off topic, mod edit ... :yoda:


----------



## MartyStrat54

Off topic? Com'on man. You specialize in off topic comments. Oh and posting pictures of yourself in an amp thread.

EGO???


----------



## charveldan

Are you guys that bored and non-progressive this weekend that you have to start this non-sensical thread all over again ?

Marty if I gave 2 shits I might update my sig, but I don't sooo.

My pic's are mine to do with as I wish.

So ur saying that because I had an amp that I sold that I didn't have it, therefore im not allowed pic's of my own amps ?

anyhoo ...


----------



## damienbeale

charveldan said:


> 1987, 1959, 2204 & 2203 JMP's have SS retification and no "sag" at all, they are very tight and you will hear all your mistakes, which if you practice will make you a better player.



This statement alone proves that you know VERY LITTLE of what you are actually talking about.

Do you wish to continue with this BS so we can pull you to pieces, or are you going to back away quietly right now?


----------



## 66 galaxie

damienbeale said:


> This statement alone proves that you know VERY LITTLE of what you are actually talking about.
> 
> Do you wish to continue with this BS so we can pull you to pieces, or are you going to back away quietly right now?



Lol... I know where the smart money is on this bet...


----------



## MartyStrat54

And so it begins...


----------



## charveldan

Booyah ... :minions:


----------



## MartyStrat54

That's a good response to Damien's comment. Emoticons.


----------



## charveldan

Hey Martimus, give me a quote on a matched quad of Ruby EL-34 bstr's out the door ...


----------



## johnfv

I noticed there had been some recent activity here in the thread so came to see if there was anything worth reading. NOPE.


----------



## 66 galaxie

charveldan said:


> Hey Martimus, give me a quote on a matched quad of Ruby EL-34 bstr's out the door ...



[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-DJtHL3NV1o]Doctor evil- One Million Dollars - YouTube[/ame]


----------



## john l

Only Dan could take your post the way he did. I think everyone that has grey matter in their heads understood what you were saying as you meant it. Your amp is not a blades any more its a kick ass Jose'd 20 watter that he "you" made man. Lots of guys talk about doing thing things but not many get to doing them like you did man and I think its very clear whos just talking around here... let him hate.


----------



## MartyStrat54

I closed this thread a few days ago, because I thought that was what Steve wanted me to do. It had gone from being an amp thread and became a "Dan" thread. Then Steve asked me to open the thread back up, because he wanted to post some clips, so I did.

Unfortunately, Dan came back.

I still haven't been able to find out who is forcing Dan to post over here. Does anyone know?


----------



## MartyStrat54

Dan you should have used a bigger picture for your sig.

I guess what I said about your JMP's bothered you a little, huh?


----------



## charveldan

MartyStrat54 said:


> Dan you should have used a bigger picture for your sig.
> 
> I guess what I said about your JMP's bothered you a little, huh?


Forget about the tewbs ...

You obviously have a bias toward me and you removed or edited at least a dozen of my [and nobody else's] posts from this thread.

I call bullshit.

Mods are suppose to be impartial and not have personal vendetas or agendas ...


----------



## DirtySteve

MartyStrat54 said:


> I closed this thread a few days ago, because I thought that was what Steve wanted me to do. It had gone from being an amp thread and became a "Dan" thread. Then Steve asked me to open the thread back up, because he wanted to post some clips, so I did.
> 
> Unfortunately, Dan came back.
> 
> I still haven't been able to find out who is forcing Dan to post over here. Does anyone know?



 Maybe I should have let it be until I had a clip ready. I just wasn't sure where I should post my thoughts on the tubes.


----------



## Stringjunkie

And the kid with the 25w thread was labeled a troll and executed.


----------



## charveldan

Even tho it's 33 degrees think i'll ride the park or watch football, not much of interest here. :deadhorse:


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

charveldan said:


> Forget about the tewbs ...
> 
> You obviously have a bias toward me and you removed or edited at least a dozen of my [and nobody else's] posts from this thread.
> 
> I call bullshit.
> 
> Mods are suppose to be impartial and not have personal vendetas or agendas ...



Wasn't going to add any fuel to your sorry ass self lit fire, but here ya go, Bud. Mods are impartial, unless a poster is flat out always rude like you are Dan. Take a look in the mirror sometime, before you post. And if you just can't help yourself, then spend more time on that bicycle if it makes you happy and stay off here.


----------



## bulldozer1984

charveldan said:


> Even tho it's 33 degrees think i'll ride the park or watch football, not much of interest here. :deadhorse:



dont let the door hit you on the way out.


----------



## MartyStrat54

charveldan said:


> You obviously have a bias toward me.



No, I don't have a bias towards you. I have a bias towards your rudeness and thread thrashing. You might want to reflect back on some former members who were guilty of doing the same thing. They are gone now.


----------



## john l

charveldan said:


> Even tho it's 33 degrees think i'll ride the park or watch football, not much of interest here. :deadhorse:


 
Edit
Too much...even for me


----------



## DirtySteve

It's funny how the trolls always play the victim card. Like they don't realizes what they're doing and everybody's just picking on them.


----------



## bulldozer1984

MartyStrat54 said:


> No, I don't have a bias towards you. I have a bias towards your rudeness and thread thrashing. You might want to reflect back on some former members who were guilty of doing the same thing. They are gone now.



im surprised he is still here. He doesnt add anything positive. Its purely smart ass comments and trolling.


----------



## john l

Come on Marty moderate already lol. I know that disputes and shit happen but this is getting stupid now.


----------



## charveldan

:deadhorse::ban::yoda::acoustic:Lolololololol ...


----------



## damienbeale

You're not exactly doing anything to stop yourself from sounding like a complete twunt here Dan.

Keep digging that hole, you'll get to China eventually.


----------



## MartyStrat54

Stringjunkie said:


> And the kid with the 25w thread was labeled a troll and executed.



He was a troll. I won't mention any of his prior usernames, but he has been banned before for multiple accounts and trolling.


----------



## rmroza

"My amp is not a Blades amp anymore" THANK GOD!

"Ohh ... Cameron, did Mark mod it himself ?" Basically...yes he did. I gave the technical input and built the turret board. I have all of Mark's stuff...and Jose's...and Friedmans! In fact, I spoke with Mark a couple times THIS WEEK already!! :O

Most of this is off topic. We're just waiting the final clips and close this thread. We are learning there are true douchebags around, but we can't let them bother the forum or threads. Anything further negative should be ignored and IMHO account killed, but that's another story.


----------



## charveldan

rmroza said:


> "My amp is not a Blades amp anymore" THANK GOD!
> 
> "Ohh ... Cameron, did Mark mod it himself ?" Basically...yes he did. I gave the technical input and built the turret board. I have all of Mark's stuff...and Jose's...and Friedmans! In fact, I spoke with Mark a couple times THIS WEEK already!! :O
> 
> Most of this is off topic. We're just waiting the final clips and close this thread. We are learning there are true douchebags around, but we can't let them bother the forum or threads. Anything further negative should be ignored and IMHO account killed, but that's another story.


Close the thread and post clips later.

Doesn't take a Master's degree, just a $100 phone.

Guess steve's broke.


----------



## charveldan

DirtySteve said:


> It's funny how the trolls always play the victim card. Like they don't realizes what they're doing and everybody's just picking on them.


You don't have to agree with my opinion but I'm allowed to express it same as you or anyone.

I challenge you on ur facts and then the shitslinging starts and its my fault.

Whatevar dewd ...


----------



## charveldan

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USo2pW1jNMU

Cee how easy that was ...


----------



## MartyStrat54

> You don't have to agree with my opinion but I'm allowed to express it same as you or anyone.
> 
> I challenge you on ur facts and then the shitslinging starts and its my fault.
> 
> Whatevar dewd ...



<yawn>


----------



## john l

:ban:


----------



## 66 galaxie

charveldan said:


> Close the thread and post clips later.
> 
> Doesn't take a Master's degree, just a $100 phone.
> 
> Guess steve's broke.


----------



## MartyStrat54

Is that a LOON Alex?


----------



## rmroza

...expressing folks opinion is fine and sometimes indifferent and negative in nature, but going on and on and on...it's abusive in nature and unnecessary. make your point...once...and stfu!

on a good note, i personally like the last clip. sounds great hot-rodded marshall tone and tight. anyone would happy with that, as i know steve is estatic with his. great tone, sustains indefinitely without the use of a compressor and slightly bright to cut through the mix in a live setting.

now time for some football and watch the lions.


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

charveldan said:


> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USo2pW1jNMU
> 
> Cee how easy that was ...


 
Sorry wasn't impressed, any, at all, or even at the slightest. But yes, you can record. Wow.


----------



## 66 galaxie

MartyStrat54 said:


> Is that a LOON Alex?


----------



## damienbeale

Guitar-Rocker said:


> Sorry wasn't impressed, any, at all, or even at the slightest. But yes, you can record. Wow.



I didn't even bother clicking on it. My guess is it's yet another link to some real samey old chord bashing that he's posted at least 300 times before, and a real boxy low mid tone that would get somewhat lost in a loud two-guitar lineup.

My particular favourite is the one where he plays TieYourMotherDown really badly.


And I would pee myself laughing if someone comes back and tells me that was the actual clip...


----------



## Dogs of Doom

start peein'

just don't aim this way...


----------



## damienbeale

You're kiddin' me?


----------



## john l

Nope he's not. Are you? Id piss myself if you actually had to piss yourself over that.


----------



## damienbeale

Well it's better than a pissing match... 
I can't believe it's that clip. No wait, it's Dan, yes I can believe it.


----------



## DirtySteve

I'll make a clip next week after I get my LP set up with a new nut, it's not playable right now. I'm pretty sure I talked about that. I don't record. The last clip I made it took weeks befor I recorded something that sounded good enough to post. after all this it's got to sound better than that one did because I'm only doing this once. I tried to make one today with my Godin, but it sounds like ass and I'm not posting it if it doesn't do the amp justice. I've explained why I'm having trouble with it, but you ignored all that. I'm afraid you're going to be disappointed anyway Dan. I'm not a fancy player, it might be nothing more than an A chord.


----------



## damienbeale

From what I recall, I never heard any fancy playing from Dan either, so I wouldn't sweat it.


----------



## rmroza

Suggestion:

Steve, just take it up to the local Guitar Center and have some shreader beat the hell out of it and record on your phone. You can choose the bottom to plug it into and there is always a mariad of guitar slingers there and you don't have to play and can just focus on the recording.

Besides, I'm sure they'd be interested to hear it also and enjoy it!


----------



## charveldan

DirtySteve said:


> I'll make a clip next week after I get my LP set up with a new nut, it's not playable right now. I'm pretty sure I talked about that. I don't record. The last clip I made it took weeks befor I recorded something that sounded good enough to post. after all this it's got to sound better than that one did because I'm only doing this once. I tried to make one today with my Godin, but it sounds like ass and I'm not posting it if it doesn't do the amp justice. I've explained why I'm having trouble with it, but you ignored all that. I'm afraid you're going to be disappointed anyway Dan. I'm not a fancy player, it might be nothing more than an A chord just for you.


You don't have to please me or anyone else. You don't owe anyone anything.

You did a noble and courageous thing with this amp, you took a bad thing and made it into a very good thing !

And you learned some things about yourself like self confidence and engineering along the way.
I'm very proud of you for overcoming the challenges that came your way.

All you wanted was an amp, and you made it yourself, that's fantastic.

I've been outta line some in this thread and in the spirit of Christmas I'd like to apologize to you and anyone I offended.

Happy Holidays and all the best in the New Year.

Yep Steve, I get it now, the little amp that could ... and did.


----------



## Marshall Gibson

charveldan said:


> You don't have to please me or anyone else. You don't owe anyone anything.
> 
> You did a noble and courageous thing with this amp, you took a bad thing and made it into a very good thing !
> 
> And you learned some things about yourself like self confidence and engineering along the way.
> I'm very proud of you for overcoming the challenges that came your way.
> 
> All you wanted was an amp, and you made it yourself, that's fantastic.
> 
> I've been outta line some in this thread and in the spirit of Christmas I'd like to apologize to you and anyone I offended.
> 
> Happy Holidays and all the best in the New Year.
> 
> Yep Steve, I get it now, the little amp that could ... and did.


----------



## DirtySteve

rmroza said:


> Suggestion:
> 
> Steve, just take it up to the local Guitar Center and have some shreader beat the hell out of it and record on your phone. You can choose the bottom to plug it into and there is always a mariad of guitar slingers there and you don't have to play and can just focus on the recording.
> 
> Besides, I'm sure they'd be interested to hear it also and enjoy it!



I thought about that, lol. (or maybe someone else already suggested that I don't know) I used to know everyone there and now they've got all new people so I didn't know if I should. The GC that I go to (the only one near me) isn't like most GCs, there aren't a bunch of shredders hanging out and it's always quiet in there. I might take it down there and see what happens.  I really think it needs somebody that can really rip it up to show what it can do, but I'm not embarrassing myself like that. I would've already contacted Frankie if he wasn't so far away from me. He has a studio.


----------



## DirtySteve

charveldan said:


> You don't have to please me or anyone else. You don't owe anyone anything.
> 
> You did a noble and courageous thing with this amp, you took a bad thing and made it into a very good thing !
> 
> And you learned some things about yourself like self confidence and engineering along the way.
> I'm very proud of you for overcoming the challenges that came your way.
> 
> All you wanted was an amp, and you made it yourself, that's fantastic.
> 
> I've been outta line some in this thread and in the spirit of Christmas I'd like to apologize to you and anyone I offended.
> 
> Happy Holidays and all the best in the New Year.
> 
> Yep Steve, I get it now, the little amp that could ... and did.



Then why did you keep after it?  Everyone else was content to wait. You're partially right, I don't owe anyone anything, but I'd like for the guys that helped me with this get to hear it, that's only right and they have a right to expect it. You've been on my ass since before it was even finished and I don't get that. You put unneeded pressure on me and made it so I don't even want to post a clip. I don't get where you're coming from man.


----------



## charveldan

DirtySteve said:


> Then why did you keep after it?  Everyone else was content to wait. You're partially right, I don't owe anyone anything, but I'd like for the guys that helped me with this get to hear it, that's only right and they have a right to expect it. You've been on my ass since before it was even finished and I don't get that. You put unneeded pressure on me and made it so I don't even want to post a clip. I don't get where you're coming from man.


Hey ya schmuck I apologized WTF else do you want.

I don't owe you anything either.

Why did you post in this thread everyday for the last 3 months ?

Think you may be addicted. 

Certainly not about amps at this point.


----------



## DirtySteve

Marshall Gibson said:


>



I don't see it? There's nothing in your post but Dans quote???


----------



## DirtySteve

charveldan said:


> Hey ya schmuck I apologized WTF else do you want.
> 
> I don't owe you anything either.
> 
> Why did you post in this thread everyday for the last 3 months ?
> 
> Think you may be addicted.
> 
> Certainly not about amps at this point.



Ok then that's my bad, but this isn't the first time you apologized and then started over again so I didn't know how to take it. You can understand that can't you? If you mean it then cool, we're cool! 

Actually you summed it up nicely and thank you for the compliment. That's what it was all about. Merry Christmas Dan!


----------



## charveldan

DirtySteve said:


> Ok then that's my bad, but this isn't the first time you apologized and then started over again so I didn't know how to take it. You can understand that can't you? If you mean it then cool, were cool!
> 
> Actually you summed it up nicely and thank you for the compliment. That's what it was all about. Merry Christmas Dan!


Happy Holidays dewd 

If you lived here in town I'd record you myself with my Zoom Q3HD.


----------



## brp

DirtySteve said:


> You put unneeded pressure on me and made it so I don't even want to post a clip. I don't get where you're coming from man.



With all due respect bro, you give/gave too much weight to the expressions of some dude on the internets.
Seriously, you can't do that.


----------



## DirtySteve

I tend to take things too seriously. I can't help it, but I'm getting better. When I post I imagine we're all in the same room and actually talking. I'm a weirdo...


----------



## Grenade

Just go with it, as long as your happy it's a total win.


----------



## brp

DirtySteve said:


> I tend to take things too seriously. I can't help it, but I'm getting better. When I post I imagine we're all in the same room and actually talking. I'm a weirdo...



Ya that'll get you in trouble lol
Gotta temper the negative shit.
Remember the "G.I.F.T."
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-IpTsNIhhW...cwY/s1600/greater-internet-****wad-theory.jpg


----------



## DirtySteve

brp said:


> Ya that'll get you in trouble lol
> Gotta temper the negative shit.
> Remember the "G.I.F.T."
> http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-IpTsNIhhW...cwY/s1600/greater-internet-****wad-theory.jpg



I wouldn't have the friends I have if I thought that way. Through all of this, and I mean from the very beginning when I joined here, a lot of guys have proven to be "real" and I can't go through this forum experience thinking that people are anything other than what they appear to be. Otherwise I wouldn't be here. It's easy to spot the posers, but I had to go through some shit to be able to see it.


----------



## DirtySteve

Happy new year, guys! Here it is finally...as promised. Sorry it took so long, I had a lot of trouble with my guitar and then I was going to have someone else play on it and that didn't work out so I finally got my shit together today and here it is.

There are tons of other sounds in this beast, but this is what I wanted it for so this is what I'm showing off.

[SC]https://soundcloud.com/seaj67/0075-wma[/SC]

That's all folks!


----------



## Dogs of Doom

I'll give it a listen later!

(I had to run to the store & get something to grub)


----------



## Grenade

I dig it Steve, great job man. Happy new year.


----------



## MartyStrat54

Doesn't sound like a 20 watt amp. Were you getting that heavy crunch with a guitar straight into the amp? If so, nice!


----------



## DirtySteve

MartyStrat54 said:


> Doesn't sound like a 20 watt amp. Were you getting that heavy crunch with a guitar straight into the amp? If so, nice!



Yes! 

I have the same tube line up as you first suggested. BEL in V1, Canadian Mullard in V2 and lopsided BP in the PI.


----------



## DirtySteve

...and that was my LP with MHD Asylum + (A2) bridge pickup. I also put the Green Beret back in my cab. It recorded better in the bottom end.


----------



## Marshall Gibson

Good stuff Steve


----------



## Dogs of Doom

Sounds good! Would love to hear more when/if you get inspired to do so...


----------



## rmroza

Hey Steve

Happy New Year! Glad you got something up. Sounds good!

There doesn't appear to be any dynamics in your recording, everything is maximized, so no headroom (look at the histogram). Anyway, you might want to play with recording a little more. Audio engineering is an art all in itself.

I was going to ask you about specifics like speakers and guitar. You touched on it, but maybe you could expand on it...what type of Les Paul? What wood is it made out of? You mentioned Green Beret, but what is the resistance? Is this 1x12, or 2x12, or 4x12? Where did you place the microphone? What type of microphone? What are the settings on the amp? Are you using zener clip or no? If so, what level? 12V?? 20V??

The tone is interesting, but makes sense as the EL84's have pretty good break up and also you have those certain preamp tubes and in a certain order.

It'd be interesting to know the above, but in the end, all that matters is the success of rebuilding it with love and safety and you have the tone you're looking for! 

Let us know the above if you don't mind and yes, would love to hear more clips! 

Robb


----------



## DirtySteve

The LP is a 60s Tribute. The cab is a 112 sourmash and the GB is 16 ohm. All I have is a handheld voice recorder. After trying it in damn near every single place in my apartment (it seems like) it was set on top of a milk crate about 12" in front of the speaker. 

My settings were (in o'clock) pres 3, bass 10, mids 11, treb 1, both gains at a little over 3 o'clock, res 1, sag mod on, full saturation mode. 


Did I miss anything? lol

Just to give you an idea of how little I know about recording... In the last 3 or 4 days I've made well over 100 clips and this was the first one that sounded good enough to consider posting.  I'm not promising anymore clips (ever), but I won't say never again.


----------



## minerman

Very, very nice Steve, glad you posted a clip dude, not gonna go into any details about recording, as it's a whole 'nother animal, but very proud of ya man, the amp sounds tits!!!!!! 

I know you've sent me a couple p'ups, but why don't you just box that amp up & send it over here....

Seriously though, the clip sounds fine, nothing wrong at all with it dude...Nothing to be afraid of, or embarrased about, at all.....You should hear some of the awful shit I've done with a proper mic/interface....

Cool man, cool!!!


----------



## shooto

very nice, Steve


----------



## john l

Atta'boy Steve.


----------



## Gene Ballzz

Doo-ood,
Just give me a couple seconds to pick my balls up off the floor! Awsome tone, awesome amp, awesome job! Nothin' more to say.
Gene


----------



## bulldozer1984

DirtySteve said:


> Happy new year, guys! Here it is finally...as promised. Sorry it took so long, I had a lot of trouble with my guitar and then I was going to have someone else play on it and that didn't work out so I finally got my shit together today and here it is.
> 
> There are tons of other sounds in this beast, but this is what I wanted it for so this is what I'm showing off.
> 
> [SC]https://soundcloud.com/seaj67/0075-wma[/SC]
> 
> That's all folks!



That sounds sweet man !! I can hear the amp shine through in that recording. 

After listening to crappy rehearsal recordings for the past few years i can hear how it would sound in the room. Sounds great. Fat, dirty and sleazy.. mmmm mmmmmm 



PS. Where is that piece of shit CharvelDan ?? Cmon Dan, the recording is here and its only 2014..


----------



## john l

^lol


----------



## Rocktane

Yeah man, nice job!


----------



## 2203xman

Great job,Steve,That's crunchy!


----------



## Stringjunkie




----------



## charveldan

DirtySteve said:


> Happy new year, guys! Here it is finally...as promised. Sorry it took so long, I had a lot of trouble with my guitar and then I was going to have someone else play on it and that didn't work out so I finally got my shit together today and here it is.
> 
> There are tons of other sounds in this beast, but this is what I wanted it for so this is what I'm showing off.
> 
> [SC]https://soundcloud.com/seaj67/0075-wma[/SC]
> 
> That's all folks!


Sounds good ! Not sure why it took 3 months and 40 pages but whatever.

Sounds like you got a lot of background noise, was that straight amp or with a pedal ?

Not bad for homegrown ...


----------



## blues_n_cues

41 pages later it's vintage tone,vintage amp,vintage thread.
AWESOME.


----------



## damienbeale

charveldan said:


> Sounds good ! Not sure why it took 3 months and 40 pages but whatever.



With no prior experience, very little knowledge and never having had undertaken anything similar before, all the while waiting for advice on the Internet? Geez you are dim...


----------



## paul-e-mann

Mission accomplished! You got the amp rebuilt, posted a clip for all to hear, good job! Now get busy on that Tele build!


----------



## GIBSON67

Good job! Sounds heavy and ballsy for sure!


----------



## Guitar-Rocker

Great job Steve!!!


----------



## paul-e-mann

I like the presence of mids in your tone too Steve


----------



## DirtySteve

Thanks guys. You know I was not looking forward to posting a clip with this much attention on it. I appreciate you being kind. I'm new to recording and it wasn't easy to get it to sound like amp actually sounds. It's a beast, I still had gain on tap.


----------



## paul-e-mann

DirtySteve said:


> Thanks guys. You know I was not looking forward to posting a clip with this much attention on it. I appreciate you being kind. I'm new to recording and it wasn't easy to get it to sound like amp actually sounds. It's a beast, I still had gain on tap.



If you feel inclined, in addition to your high gain clip, it would be good to have a clip to show off the clean and crunch of your amp.


----------



## The Ozzk

DirtySteve said:


> Happy new year, guys! Here it is finally...as promised. Sorry it took so long, I had a lot of trouble with my guitar and then I was going to have someone else play on it and that didn't work out so I finally got my shit together today and here it is.
> 
> There are tons of other sounds in this beast, but this is what I wanted it for so this is what I'm showing off.
> 
> [SC]https://soundcloud.com/seaj67/0075-wma[/SC]
> 
> That's all folks!



Dayyyummm....  I love me some o' that tone!!!! 

That's one sweet sounding amp


----------



## john l

charveldan said:


> Not sure why it took 3 months and 40 pages but whatever.


 
Unbelievable.


----------



## Ghostman

Sounds great Steve!!!!

Top Notch!


----------



## charveldan

pedecamp said:


> I like the presence of mids in your tone too Steve


Yep, me too, not enough headroom for my taste but great tone, specially for a first built amp not to mention the clusterfeck of what it was from William.






Great Job Steve !!!


----------



## DirtySteve

I don't know what you mean by "not enough headroom", but I assume you mean the recording? I had to crank the amp up pretty loud to get any volume on playback. I tried different settings on my recorder, but what recorded best was WMA, record level high and low cut filter off. I don't have much to work with, the mp3 setting sounded really bad no matter how I set the rest of it.


----------



## JayCM800

That clip was too short!!! Better yet, Post a freakin video, gddmmit!

Congrats Steve!


----------



## john l

He meant the amps head room... Which is kind of funny because you didn't post your settings and the fact that its a dirty ass clip with "clipping diodes" in play makes that a pretty asinine statement. 



.... I know I know should stop but hes not making that very easy.


----------



## bulldozer1984

DirtySteve said:


> I don't know what you mean by "not enough headroom", but I assume you mean the recording? I had to crank the amp up pretty loud to get any volume on playback. I tried different settings on my recorder, but what recorded best was WMA, record level high and low cut filter off. I don't have much to work with, the mp3 setting sounded really bad no matter how I set the rest of it.



Dont even justify that crusty old loser with a response man. **** him


----------



## DirtySteve

I'm just trying to learn here is all. I'm completely lost on recording and I didn't know if he was talking about the amp or my recording. I'm getting a crash course behind the scenes and just trying to put the pieces together. I have headroom left and I didn't have the gains maxed, but I had a hard time capturing the "crunch" without getting the gain up there. I did post my settings after Robb asked me. go back a few posts.

I can hit this with an OD or even fuzz with the gains full up. It went to shit when I tried that with the BB version. What ever happened to BB anyway? I thought he would be happy to see how it should have been done...hmph, guess I was wrong.


----------



## john l

So you did Steve my mistake but my point is that there are variables that he cant know and therefore cant say what he did and not look stupid for saying it
Head room is not typically what guys are shooting for with a 20 watt diode clipper.
If you posted a clip with the Zeners off and rolled through some volume and gain knob combos and showed how they interact maybe then one could get "some" idea of whats on the menu but a 30 second clip clearly showing off the gainier stuff is simply that.

It would just be nice to see Dan give you a genuine compliment not a back handed one with stupid little criticisms hiding in it is all.


----------



## DirtySteve

This is not a promise and won't be posted in this thread, but thanks to a forum bro that would like to remain anonymous is helping me figure out this recording thing and I'm starting to get interested in learning more so you never know. I would love to show off all the options I have in this amp. It was my intention to do a longer clip starting out clean and add gain and zeners as I went, but it wasn't going to happen in any reasonable amount of time.

I thought I was going to have a studio and a guy that could really play help me out with the recording. He's a neighbor of a friend....the studio turned out to be a music room and not a studio at all and the dudes idea of ripping it up was the beatles. (not that there's anything wrong with that) He didn't even have a way to record.  I also tried GC, but my GC is lame and no one wanted to help me. They also don't have a sound room.

It's a new year, you never know what I might pull out of my ass.  If you had told me a year ago I was going to build my own amp I'd have laughed my ass off!


----------



## rmroza

He Steve

Thanks for posting your settings. Sounds great. Any deteriorization in "tone' is recording and like I said, it's a science and your not an expert in recording. Yeah man, spend some time playing that b1tch and getting to know it and doing some recording(s).

The tone is were is should be. As somsone pointed out, it's mid(dy). Jose's design is very much so and for cutting through the mix and in live applications.

I'm still up in the air about that green beret. Never heard one live, so no comment on that. It should be tighter, but I see you have the sag on, so that makes sense. If you want more headroom before breakup, back off the grid leak bias resistors. I think 18-watts run 470k/470k and Terry suggested typical Marshall values 220k/220k, but you can put in 100k/100k and not slam the phase inverter soo hard....up to you.


----------



## DirtySteve

There are a couple of things I'd like to try. Terry mentioned a "fizz cap" or something along those lines. (???) I need to find that e-mail...it's a little fizzy and I'd like to dial some of that out if possible. Other than that I'm pretty happy with it so far. We talked about speakers before and there are a couple I'd like to try.


----------



## paul-e-mann

DirtySteve said:


> I'm just trying to learn here is all. I'm completely lost on recording and I didn't know if he was talking about the amp or my recording. I'm getting a crash course behind the scenes and just trying to put the pieces together. I have headroom left and I didn't have the gains maxed, but I had a hard time capturing the "crunch" without getting the gain up there. I did post my settings after Robb asked me. go back a few posts.
> 
> I can hit this with an OD or even fuzz with the gains full up. It went to shit when I tried that with the BB version. What ever happened to BB anyway? I thought he would be happy to see how it should have been done...hmph, guess I was wrong.



Steve don't cater to that asshat, he's just in this thread to bust your chops and get a laugh cuz he knows you're sensitive about it. Do you like your amp? Do you like the way it sounds? That's all that matters!


----------



## john l

DirtySteve said:


> There are a couple of things I'd like to try. Terry mentioned a "fizz cap" or something along those lines. (???) I need to find that e-mail...it's a little fizzy and I'd like to dial some of that out if possible. Other than that I'm pretty happy with it so far. We talked about speakers before and there are a couple I'd like to try.


 
That can totally help. Your fizz cap is that little red cap bridging the plate resistors of the PI (in between the two mustardy looking caps) Its probably a 47pf and upping that to 100pf will "smoothen" things. If you want to take things a little further I like to make a little triangle of 100pfs there by adding to more 100pfs across the plate resistors. Pretty cool tweak.


----------



## DirtySteve

That sounds about right. There was so much information coming at me at that time, but I remember that being mentioned and I meant to copy it out and save it somewhere I'd remember to reference, but I was overwhelmed and forgot to do it. Thanks John!


----------



## john l

Sure. Theres a bunch of cool stuff you can do to get rid of that. You have quite the corner giving you suggestions at any given time so I don't feel the need to jump in often lol.


----------



## bulldozer1984

i wonder how much treble attenuation your amp has Steve. Jose's 80's HG mods were very bright and im wondering if you have any snubber or treble dump caps in your pre amp. 

Im certainly no expert AT ALL im just a hack but with all the tweaking i have done i like to dump treble early on in the pre amp for a smoother sound. 

That and alot of negative feedback in the power amp to keep things smooth (and tight)


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## Guitar-Rocker

john l said:


> That can totally help. Your fizz cap is that little red cap bridging the plate resistors of the PI (in between the two mustardy looking caps) Its probably a 47pf and upping that to 100pf will "smoothen" things. If you want to take things a little further I like to make a little triangle of 100pfs there by adding to more 100pfs across the plate resistors. Pretty cool tweak.



Are you referring to say a 250pf across, and some 120pf's across the plate resistors to take some flatness back out?


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## Gene Ballzz

Steve,
What kind of computer do you have? Is it Apple or PC and how up to date is it? How much RAM and how big is the hard drive?
Gene


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## RussBert

Somehow this has turned into a thread about charveldan. That's bullshit. It sucked all the good out of the thread, and shot it all over charveldan's face

cut the cord


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## Redstone

I must say Steve, that amp sounds amazing. I've been popping in and out of this threat for a long time. I've been dying to see all the pics of it and especially hearing what it sounds like. I may have no clue what is going on inside the amp, but it sure does look very neat and tidy, especially compared to what it was to begin with.Congrats on a job well done.


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## john l

Guitar-Rocker said:


> Are you referring to say a 250pf across, and some 120pf's across the plate resistors to take some flatness back out?


 
Not sure Im following you terry. Im just assuming that the value for the fizz cap is 47p like a typical marshall and recommending raising its value to 100pf to smooth things out and then adding additional 100pfs across what would be the 100k and 82k plates there as well should he want more.

Here sir
http://ampgarage.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=17334&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=


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## charveldan

RussBert said:


> Somehow this has turned into a thread about charveldan. That's bullshit. It sucked all the good out of the thread, and shot it all over charveldan's face
> 
> cut the cord


What in the actual feck ?


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## Guitar-Rocker

john l said:


> Not sure Im following you terry. Im just assuming that the value for the fizz cap is 47p like a typical marshall and recommending raising its value to 100pf to smooth things out and then adding additional 100pfs across what would be the 100k and 82k plates there as well should he want more.



yup, was saying the same thing. Just asking about higher values than those you've stated(actual probably max values)


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## john l

LOL apparently Russ is catching up on some reading this evening.


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## john l

Guitar-Rocker said:


> yup, was saying the same thing. Just asking about higher values than those you've stated(actual probably max values)


 
Sorry Terry I missed this.

Yes I see. I had an experience with a friends 78 2204 that was out of control bright and stayed fizzy as hell until half mast. I mistakenly used 180pfs instead of 100s and the effect was still very pleasing, I added a 100k between the master and the PI input and hes loving it.


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## thrawn86

I freaking love UPDATED threads. Sounds great Steve.  

If it makes you happy, it can't be that bad!!!


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## blues_n_cues

DirtySteve said:


> This is not a promise and won't be posted in this thread, but thanks to a forum bro that would like to remain anonymous is helping me figure out this recording thing and I'm starting to get interested in learning more so you never know. I would love to show off all the options I have in this amp. It was my intention to do a longer clip starting out clean and add gain and zeners as I went, but it wasn't going to happen in any reasonable amount of time.
> 
> I thought I was going to have a studio and a guy that could really play help me out with the recording. He's a neighbor of a friend....the studio turned out to be a music room and not a studio at all and the dudes idea of ripping it up was the beatles. (not that there's anything wrong with that) He didn't even have a way to record.  I also tried GC, but my GC is lame and no one wanted to help me. They also don't have a sound room.
> 
> 
> 
> It's a new year, you never know what I might pull out of my ass.  If you had told me a year ago I was going to build my own amp I'd have laughed my ass off!



if you ever need recording help just ask or PM.
p.s. I see that recording section never did materialize on this forum...


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## charveldan

Next up, how bout some video ... ?


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## DirtySteve

bulldozer1984 said:


> i wonder how much treble attenuation your amp has Steve. Jose's 80's HG mods were very bright and im wondering if you have any snubber or treble dump caps in your pre amp.
> 
> Im certainly no expert AT ALL im just a hack but with all the tweaking i have done i like to dump treble early on in the pre amp for a smoother sound.
> 
> That and alot of negative feedback in the power amp to keep things smooth (and tight)



I really don't know the answer to that.



Gene Ballzz said:


> Steve,
> What kind of computer do you have? Is it Apple or PC and how up to date is it? How much RAM and how big is the hard drive?
> Gene



It's an HP Pavillion from 2006, 960MB of RAM.


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## paul-e-mann

DirtySteve said:


> I really don't know the answer to that.
> 
> 
> 
> It's an HP Pavillion from 2006, 960MB of RAM.



Steve go to DDR3, DDR2 and DDR RAM memory upgrades from Crucial.com and do a scan of your PC and buy a full memory upgrade for your machine from them. Max out the memory, its dirt cheap and will make a huge difference its well worth it. Your XP machine will handle a pair of 2GB memory sticks.


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## DirtySteve

I did the scan, but I don't understand what I'm looking at. Is this something I have to physically open my computer and install? What is this going to do for me?


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## bulldozer1984

DirtySteve said:


> I did the scan, but I don't understand what I'm looking at. Is this something I have to physically open my computer and install? What is this going to do for me?



Well upgrading memory will make your machine run faster. But what the hell does this have to do with this thread ? What u trying to achieve ? Why are people trying to get you to upgrade your machine ?? 

Im missing something here.


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## paul-e-mann

DirtySteve said:


> I did the scan, but I don't understand what I'm looking at. Is this something I have to physically open my computer and install? What is this going to do for me?



After you do the scan look at the results. It shows you what you have in each slot and makes recommendations what you can upgrade to and lists the actual memory sticks to order. You can take an old slow PC and really increase the performance ten fold with a memory upgrade, most of my PCs are old like yours and upgrading the memory was night and day for performance and web browsing. Yes you will have to physically open your PC and swap out the memory sticks if you buy upgrades, its a really easy and cheap way to upgrade a PC. If you don't know how to swap out memory look it up on youtube I'm sure there's lots of videos showing this. Its really just a matter of popping the retainers off of each end of the existing memory to remove it and snapping in the new memory and snap the retainers back on. Way easier than building an amp .


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## bulldozer1984

pedecamp said:


> After you do the scan look at the results. It shows you what you have in each slot and makes recommendations what you can upgrade to and lists the actual memory sticks to order. You can take an old slow PC and really increase the performance ten fold with a memory upgrade, most of my PCs are old like yours and upgrading the memory was night and day for performance and web browsing. Yes you will have to physically open your PC and swap out the memory sticks if you buy upgrades, its a really easy and cheap way to upgrade a PC. If you don't know how to swap out memory look it up on youtube I'm sure there's lots of videos showing this. Its really just a matter of popping the retainers off of each end of the existing memory to remove it and snapping in the new memory and snap the retainers back on. Way easier than building an amp .



But why does he need to upgrade his PC ? Im lost here


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## Ghostman

pedecamp said:


> After you do the scan look at the results. It shows you what you have in each slot and makes recommendations what you can upgrade to and lists the actual memory sticks to order. You can take an old slow PC and really increase the performance ten fold with a memory upgrade, most of my PCs are old like yours and upgrading the memory was night and day for performance and web browsing. Yes you will have to physically open your PC and swap out the memory sticks if you buy upgrades, its a really easy and cheap way to upgrade a PC. If you don't know how to swap out memory look it up on youtube I'm sure there's lots of videos showing this. Its really just a matter of popping the retainers off of each end of the existing memory to remove it and snapping in the new memory and snap the retainers back on. Way easier than building an amp .


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## Gene Ballzz

bulldozer1984 said:


> Well upgrading memory will make your machine run faster. But what the hell does this have to do with this thread ? What u trying to achieve ? Why are people trying to get you to upgrade your machine ??
> 
> Im missing something here.



Hey All,
My apologies for zooming off topic. I was simply wondering where Steve's computer capabilities stood, as there are many inexpensive USB analog/digital converters available that with nothing more than an SM57 mic, the converter (maybe even not needed, depending on the computer) and the computer, some very good recordings can be made. It sounded like possibly he may have an interest in learning how to make some good recordings, given that he doesn't play in a gigging band. I was just trying to find out if his hardware had the capabilities to lead him there. I mean, he's a pretty good player AND has a fantastic sounding amp and it seems a shame to not have the means to share that beyond his four walls.
Sorry Guys,
Gene


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## DirtySteve

That's what I thought you were getting at and I am interested in learning how to make good recordings for a couple of reasons. One of them being just what you said. It will make playing more fun and motivate me to learn to play with some direction instead of just banging away.

This is not off topic to me, I've been talking with someone about it behind the scenes the last few days. I've downloaded Reaper and I'm in the process of learning the basics. Actually, that's how it started me getting interested in it. I've been completely lost and didn't even know what to ask to find out about this stuff and learn how to use it.

Had I been able to do my recording in mp3 instead of WMV I could have cleaned it up before I posted it. At least that's the way I understand it so far, but this is all brand spanking new to me.


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## damienbeale

mp3 is just a compressed version of wmv, so I don't think you'd want to clean it up as an mp3.

mp3 is actually quite a complicated mathematical squeeze.


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## DirtySteve

I guess it is off topic. technically the thread is over as far as I'm concerned, but this is related since it stemmed from everyone wanting to hear the amp and my having so much trouble recording....I think, lol!


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## Gene Ballzz

Steve,
Thanks for understanding my interest/point. Recording is a blast, especially when you realize how easy it can be to get GREAT sounds!
Gene


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## john l

DirtySteve said:


> I guess it is off topic. technically the thread is over as far as I'm concerned, but this is related since it stemmed from everyone wanting to hear the amp and my having so much trouble recording....I think, lol!


 
Your thread should go where you want it to... if its going to end I vote to start steering things more in the vein of big jugs immediately.


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## 4STICKS

Just wanted to let you know I just heard the clip. FUKIN Awesome Steve!
Great crunch w/ just a guitar straight into an amp! Well done!


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## DirtySteve

Thanks man, I'm having a hard time understanding why you saw where I said I was plugged straight in, but someone else keeps asking me and I keep answering for no reason.


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## 4STICKS

DirtySteve said:


> Thanks man, I'm having a hard time understanding why you saw where I said I was plugged straight in, but someone else keeps asking me and I keep answering for no reason.



Oh. I thought you responded to Marty saying it was straight in. Musta misread. Great job none the less!


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## DirtySteve

Sorry man, you misunderstood what I was saying.


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## 4STICKS

Still sounds ace to me!


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## rmroza

Hey Steve

Ok, finally getting back on the forum after riping into that early BE-100! 

Ok, fizz cap. yeah, change to taste. Marshall used 47p. Jose used 47p. Some folks and MODs use 100p (you can just double up on 47p's). Billy's dumbass used a 200p (2x 100p - I think he meant to use 2-47's - I only seen ONE design that used a cap that high. Friendman uses a 100p! Ooops, too much information! 

Anyway, tweak to your likeing buddy!  

...ok, back to work on the bench and make some homemade pizza with the blonde bombshell!


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## john l

Steve
Is there a layout you're using in this thread somewhere?


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## DirtySteve

No, I'm using my Autocad drawing that I made by drawing it the way it was built and then changing it to my new layout and Terry and Robb helped me get the correct values and correcting my mistakes and everything. I don't really know if it's cool to post it or not, but I was under the impression it's not cool to post it.


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## bulldozer1984

Regarding the computer. I think that you should try recording something first before upgrading your machine. 

Your only going to be recording 1 track, which lets be honest, doesn't need alot of resources. Im pretty sure my old Dell with 500 meg of RAM could record a single track no worries.


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## john l

No biggie, as I said you have quite the corner there that are more than capable of addressing little things youd like to tweak.

Hows the overall tone of the amp with without the diodes? Brightish?


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## DirtySteve

It's not any brighter, it's just less gain. It sounds good in all 3 modes. It sounds really great clean (and cleanish)


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## DirtySteve

edit: rethinking what I said..


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## rmroza

Yeah, as you said Steve, you can hit with a pedal to when adjusting knobs accordingly. Did you try to max the master at "10" and turn the gain(s) to taste?? Plexi heaven and absolutely slammable with pedals and to color!  

Yeah, one-track recording as indicated above uses very, very little resources. make sure allyour TSR (Terminate and Stay Resident) items are turned off to free up resources. No need for a complete PC. What are you running an Pentium 100 or Cyrix?!?!? lol Whatever you have, I'm sure it has MORE than enough power and if you're able to do CAD and multi-layers and possibly renderings.


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## DirtySteve

With the volume maxed (or not) and the gains around 10 or 11 o'clock it's beautiful. btw I can hit it with a OD or my xotic BB preamp with the gains maxed and it doesn't muddy up or anything. I'm in the market for a reverb, a wah and a good fuzz.


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## rmroza

awesome! sounds good steve. enjoy!


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## JEB

I like it Steve! Good job!


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## JC@69G

Wow what a thread!!!! I just spent the better part of a few hours reading it off and on in between a couple movies and running to krispy kreme for chocolate frosted filled with custard. epic ups and downs into a winner of an amp it sounds like! Good for your Steve!! 

Wow!


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## DirtySteve

Thanks JC! You just can't make this stuff up.  Last year was crazy and one I'll never forget. So far I feel like I'm on vacation this year, lol!


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## JC@69G

yeah reading this thread and searching out info about the original builder just unreal. Glad you made it through the journey.


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## Micky

You missed most of the shitstorm concerning BB, he was quite the character.

Every once in a while he shows back up, and it is almost always entertaining when he does...


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## MrDowntown

I have also just made it through this thread and I'm happy you got your amp sorted out, it sounds awesome btw...and thank god there are good folks around (here) to help a brother out!

Did you ever get your recording down to a science?

Md


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## DirtySteve

Haha, no! I even bought an interface and a laptop to use it with, but I haven't even loaded it yet. I just have so much going on right now and I know I'm going to have to dedicate some serious time to learn how to use it and I just haven't been in the right state of mind to want to take that on yet. Soon, I hope.

Thanks man!


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## bulldozer1984

It doesn't take much time at all Steve ! Plug in the interface/ mics, set your levels, setup your DAW VST inputs, add an audio track and press record !


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## Micky




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## bulldozer1984

I just re-read this entire thread. What a ride ! Can't believe this was 9 yrs ago.


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